Fire/Electric
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What If? - Alternate Timelines (AT #10f: Smokomodo - Stats Submissions)
- Thread starter kenn
- Start date
Fire/Bug
With another close vote of 5-4...AT Smokomodo's typing will be...Fire/Electric!
So with that we are onto the ability discussion. Reminder that the original concept of this was ability-move synergy and I am curious to see what all can be utilized within these 2 types to achieve not just the concept but theoretical viability!
I will leave discussion up until Saturday-ish before we get a slate going for a vote! Have fun!
So with that we are onto the ability discussion. Reminder that the original concept of this was ability-move synergy and I am curious to see what all can be utilized within these 2 types to achieve not just the concept but theoretical viability!
I will leave discussion up until Saturday-ish before we get a slate going for a vote! Have fun!
I think Magic Guard has some real merit here, if not a little too much.
Defensively, it essentially adds on a third status immunity (Poison/Toxic) which gives AT Smokomodo incredible survivability. It removes the Fire type's Stealth Rock weakness which is a major detriment of the typing in the current meta, allowing this mon to carry an item other than HDB.
Offensively, it enables a lot of physical offensive potential. It removes the recoil and crash damage from Flare Blitz and Supercell Slam, enabling this mon to throw out powerful stab moves with significant longevity. This also pairs well with the Life Orb, providing a free boost to these moves. I think this ability is extremely well suited for this typing but may potentially be too powerful, I'd like to see what other people think.
A few lower power abilities I could see are Strong Jaw / Tough Claws since both typings have Biting or Punching moves and also opens room for strong coverage.
Defensively, it essentially adds on a third status immunity (Poison/Toxic) which gives AT Smokomodo incredible survivability. It removes the Fire type's Stealth Rock weakness which is a major detriment of the typing in the current meta, allowing this mon to carry an item other than HDB.
Offensively, it enables a lot of physical offensive potential. It removes the recoil and crash damage from Flare Blitz and Supercell Slam, enabling this mon to throw out powerful stab moves with significant longevity. This also pairs well with the Life Orb, providing a free boost to these moves. I think this ability is extremely well suited for this typing but may potentially be too powerful, I'd like to see what other people think.
A few lower power abilities I could see are Strong Jaw / Tough Claws since both typings have Biting or Punching moves and also opens room for strong coverage.
As viol mentioned, Fire/Electric has many routes it can take towards viability (sound moves, recoil, status spreader, pivot, etc).
I am a big fan of the idea of building this around pivoting (as a pivot and/or anti-pivot). Offensively, Fire can punish ground-type switch-ins to Volt Switch either through damage alone or the risk of a burn. We can double down on this threat on the damage side with something like Stakeout (which, admittedly, might be too powerful) or Analytic, or by increasing the chance of a burn/paralysis with Serene Grace (although people might be fatigued after Ram). Increasing the danger level of pivoting into/out of us would make our own Volt Switch more reliable, helping our concept of move-ability synergy. Given our own immunity to the two statuses induced by contact, it might be funny to build a contact physical build with stuff like Tough Claws.
Defensively, most abilities I can think of have already been put to good use. I like Sticky Hold to prevent our boots from being knocked off, but Shox has demonstrated this. Both Static and Flame Body seem too close to how the birds operate in OU, but are obviously viable.
I am a big fan of the idea of building this around pivoting (as a pivot and/or anti-pivot). Offensively, Fire can punish ground-type switch-ins to Volt Switch either through damage alone or the risk of a burn. We can double down on this threat on the damage side with something like Stakeout (which, admittedly, might be too powerful) or Analytic, or by increasing the chance of a burn/paralysis with Serene Grace (although people might be fatigued after Ram). Increasing the danger level of pivoting into/out of us would make our own Volt Switch more reliable, helping our concept of move-ability synergy. Given our own immunity to the two statuses induced by contact, it might be funny to build a contact physical build with stuff like Tough Claws.
Defensively, most abilities I can think of have already been put to good use. I like Sticky Hold to prevent our boots from being knocked off, but Shox has demonstrated this. Both Static and Flame Body seem too close to how the birds operate in OU, but are obviously viable.
Dropped the ball a bit so I'm getting to this later than expected. I won't go through a list of options like with our previous starter, but I'd like to highlight just a few that haven't been mentioned:
For much of the same reasons as Strong Jaw or Tough Claws (which I both like) there's also Sheer Force orIron First. Fire and Electric share a lot of similarities in their movepools, so it's no surprise there is a rich vein to mine. Other abilities like Rock Head or Punk Rock feel a bit trite.
I also like the idea of Stakeout or Analytic as laid out by guingil. Another ability that could serve a similar purpose is Download. Especially if we lean into...
Pivoting. With access to STAB Volt Switch and a means to punish the Ground types that may stop it, numerous resists, readied access to two disrupting status conditions, and a natural inclination to wear boots, this Pokemon is shaping up as a potentially strong pivot. There a quite a few abilities that could further lean into this role, namely Regenerator and Intimidate.
Edit: It was brought to my attention that Iron Fist is a strictly worse Tough Claws, so disregard that suggestion
For much of the same reasons as Strong Jaw or Tough Claws (which I both like) there's also Sheer Force or
I also like the idea of Stakeout or Analytic as laid out by guingil. Another ability that could serve a similar purpose is Download. Especially if we lean into...
Pivoting. With access to STAB Volt Switch and a means to punish the Ground types that may stop it, numerous resists, readied access to two disrupting status conditions, and a natural inclination to wear boots, this Pokemon is shaping up as a potentially strong pivot. There a quite a few abilities that could further lean into this role, namely Regenerator and Intimidate.
Edit: It was brought to my attention that Iron Fist is a strictly worse Tough Claws, so disregard that suggestion
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Okay it is time we take this to a vote on AT Smokomodo's ability! So here is the slate!
Magic Guard
Tough Claws
Sheer Force
Stakeout
Punk Rock
I really like this lineup even if a few of them will eat a good amount of the hypothetical power budget lol
I will give the slate 24 hours before we move onto defining moves! Have fun <3
Magic Guard
Tough Claws
Sheer Force
Stakeout
Punk Rock
I really like this lineup even if a few of them will eat a good amount of the hypothetical power budget lol
I will give the slate 24 hours before we move onto defining moves! Have fun <3
Stakeout
Tough Claws
Magic Guard
Magic Guard
Tough Claws
Magic Guard
Tough Claws
Another close one here but the big winner is Tough Claws!
Now we move onto defining moves for AT Smokomodo!
This should be fairly fast as this step usually is, but with having Fire and Electric as our STABs, I wanna pose the questions...
Is there anything that should be off limits whether it be for coverage or STABs? If so, why?
I am planning to move us onto stats this weekend but for now feel free to discuss!
Now we move onto defining moves for AT Smokomodo!
This should be fairly fast as this step usually is, but with having Fire and Electric as our STABs, I wanna pose the questions...
Is there anything that should be off limits whether it be for coverage or STABs? If so, why?
I am planning to move us onto stats this weekend but for now feel free to discuss!
Just a quick post to maybe get a larger discussion rolling.
Looking at current the current meta, there's only a few defensive checks to a Fire/Elec type, especially one with boosted damage thanks to Tough Claws. The most obvious are the various Dragon types (i.e. Dragapult, Chuggalong, Raging Bolt, or Garchomp). The latter especially could prove troublesome thanks to an immunity to Electric and the Rough Skin ability to punish Tough Claws. Additionally, Electric's relatively weaker contact options may give defensive Pokemon that resist Fire without an Electric weakness (i.e. Garganacl) a niche.
With that said, I think the obvious coverage options for AT10F is Ground or Fairy. Both have a viable contact move to pair with Tough Claws. But for the sake of balance, it's probably bests that we limit to one or the other. The 'mon is already going to be enough of a menace with its STAB and suitable stats.
Looking at current the current meta, there's only a few defensive checks to a Fire/Elec type, especially one with boosted damage thanks to Tough Claws. The most obvious are the various Dragon types (i.e. Dragapult, Chuggalong, Raging Bolt, or Garchomp). The latter especially could prove troublesome thanks to an immunity to Electric and the Rough Skin ability to punish Tough Claws. Additionally, Electric's relatively weaker contact options may give defensive Pokemon that resist Fire without an Electric weakness (i.e. Garganacl) a niche.
With that said, I think the obvious coverage options for AT10F is Ground or Fairy. Both have a viable contact move to pair with Tough Claws. But for the sake of balance, it's probably bests that we limit to one or the other. The 'mon is already going to be enough of a menace with its STAB and suitable stats.
Apologies for breaking up the convo, but here’s my flavor submission for AT Caribolt!
Antramber
The Resin Warden Pokemon
Grass / Rock
I based Antramber on Giant Anteaters (which have sharp claws), Amber, and the Aztecs. It’s tongue produces tree sap that hardens into Amber claws and a Macuahitl blade on its tongue.
Supporting Material:
Antramber
The Resin Warden Pokemon
Grass / Rock
I based Antramber on Giant Anteaters (which have sharp claws), Amber, and the Aztecs. It’s tongue produces tree sap that hardens into Amber claws and a Macuahitl blade on its tongue.
Supporting Material:
Tough Claws Flare Blitz CHUNKS and is our bread and butter. I think denying blitz would do a disservice to the concept. Volt Tackle and Double Shock are both contact moves, but they're signatures that are not at all needed here so I'd put them off limits.
I'm pretty convinced that Band is our item since almost nothing switches in safely. Run some calcs, it's honestly silly. Fat dragons are the only guys that sort of switch into this mon (beyond predicting the flare blitz and going into like Mola, which is a risky move for obvious reasons), and with tera fire you are potentially 2HKOing those fat dragons / OHKOing pult just with Flare Blitz. This is an extremely potent breaker.
I was going to say we shouldn't deny coverage for dragons just because you don't have much of a reason to click it in the first place since they're probably dying to banded Blitz regardless. You have little need to predict. That said, I think coverage for dragons enables non-Band sets to a greater degree, and I think that might be a bad thing in this case given how stupidly threatening Band is. Again, banded AT Smoko is not really clicking coverage much, but if you also have to fear boots sets with like Triple Axel it starts to become kind of horrific to deal with. So I'd tentatively deny coverage that specifically targets dragons. I guess something like ground coverage might be alright.
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Seems like we have a general idea for AT Smokomodo's defining moves. STABs alone are gonna be extremely threatening so I would rather lean into that than coverage choices so for this reason the BSR penalties will be based on having access to a more powerful Electric STAB and more specific hard hitting coverage. With that, here are the defining moves:
Anyways, here are the stat limits:
Gonna leave submissions up until Halloween or maybe All Hallow's Eve idk yet :shrug:
I opted for an optional move of Trick/Switcheroo as it can aid us in being annoying and dabbing some mon's Boots for itself lol.
Anyways, here are the stat limits:
Gonna leave submissions up until Halloween or maybe All Hallow's Eve idk yet :shrug: