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XY UU Viability Ranking Thread
- Thread starter Limitless
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Porygon-Z is a great pokemon and has always been, it has an amazing ability in adaptability and great boosting moves in nasty plot and agility, it can also run extremely effective choiced sets either it's for revenging/cleaning or wallbreaking. The flaws that holds P-Z back is mainly it's typing and speed as it would love to be faster, and have maby a second typing to let it get easier set up opportunities as most set up sweepers wants to come in on something they either force out or resist, but while setting up with P-Z can be hard it's not it's best set as the best set for it is arguably the choice specs set, this set works as an excellent wallbreaker and with decent speed it actually does outspeed what it needs to as it's more off an "hit and run" than "stay and sweep" with the specs set. If we should compare P-Z to the other pokemon in the A rank, it's easy to see it's incredibly similar to the other wallbreakers either when it comes to great coverage or pure power, and a decent speed tier, I would say P-Z is fine in A rank strong pokemon which shouldn't be underestimated.
Reuniclus has always since it got intruduced in gen 5 been a huge offensive threath to stall teams and offensive teams depending on the set it runs. But in uu atm it really doesn't have the typing to abuse it's amazing power as much it wants to, psychic isn't a really good type in uu atm either, but even tho Reuniclus has it's flaws in being slow and weak to common typings it can easely cause havoc anyway. Reuniclus has amazing power, excellent coverage, decent bulk, amazing abilities while having amazing set up moves providing it to sweep with in calm mind and trick room. With reunis decent bulk it can easely come in on something set up trick room and do massive damage to the opposing team, same with the calm mind set tho this is better against more bulkier teams it can be really devastating. When comparing it to other pokemon in the A rank the only place it really falls short is in it's typing, it's just as dangerous as other A rank pokemon, also most A rank threaths struggles with their speed and reuni can easely fix that with trick room, and some off them struggles with being to weak reuni has calm mind to fix that while also having reliable recovery in recover. I will say despite it's typing and it's flaws, it has enough pros to keep it where it is, a solid A rank pokemon in my opinion.
As Reuniclus is a Pokemon that I have played with quite a bit in the past, and a bit more recently, I'd say that it has declined a bit in viability at the moment. Now I don't want to repeat people too much but I don't think that people understand how big its typing and speed flaws are. It limits its setup ability quite a bit now, and Hydreigon has not helped it. All in all I don't want to people (in fact I'd almost copy and paste what Bluwing just said above) but I think that it fits better in A- in comparison to some of the higher A ranked Pokemon.
Alright, I'm not a great player or anything, but I might as well throw my two cents in on Reuniclus.
The big blob pokemon is probably one of my favorites in UU right now, he's got a bulky calm mind set which can hit like a truck without taking any life orb damage on the attack, and has reliable recovery. In addition to his CM set, he's a reliable Trick Room setter, and his presence throughout the game can often be the decisive factor for TR teams due to his ability to set up TR and then hit the opponent like a hammer. Also, with access to the regenerator ability and recover, Reuniclus can be incredibly tough to KO if you want. For downsides, Reuniclus is slow as all hell, and he wants better defensive typing with all of the common attacks that hit him for SE damage in the tier.
Compared to pokemon in the A rank I don't think Reuniclus fits in well, I don't think he's as consistent as pokemon like Honchkrow or Nidoking in terms of causing havoc for your opponent, and Suicune is a better CM user imo if only for better typing. On the other hand I think he's better than what's in B+, as Chandelure manages to have even worse typing and Mega Mane takes up your mega slot. I think he fits snugly into A-, because similar to pokemon like Nidoqueen and Mega Blast, he can consistently perform his role well, while he's also not quite up to the level of the A rank pokemon in the tier.
The big blob pokemon is probably one of my favorites in UU right now, he's got a bulky calm mind set which can hit like a truck without taking any life orb damage on the attack, and has reliable recovery. In addition to his CM set, he's a reliable Trick Room setter, and his presence throughout the game can often be the decisive factor for TR teams due to his ability to set up TR and then hit the opponent like a hammer. Also, with access to the regenerator ability and recover, Reuniclus can be incredibly tough to KO if you want. For downsides, Reuniclus is slow as all hell, and he wants better defensive typing with all of the common attacks that hit him for SE damage in the tier.
Compared to pokemon in the A rank I don't think Reuniclus fits in well, I don't think he's as consistent as pokemon like Honchkrow or Nidoking in terms of causing havoc for your opponent, and Suicune is a better CM user imo if only for better typing. On the other hand I think he's better than what's in B+, as Chandelure manages to have even worse typing and Mega Mane takes up your mega slot. I think he fits snugly into A-, because similar to pokemon like Nidoqueen and Mega Blast, he can consistently perform his role well, while he's also not quite up to the level of the A rank pokemon in the tier.
Porygon-Z is moving down to A- rank. Though I recognize that it is very versatile (double dance, specs, scarf), it isn't nearly as dominant as say, Darmanitan. I believe it is on the upper edge of the A- rank, but I just couldn't get myself to give it A rank, though it was close.
Reuniclus was a hard Pokemon to rank, given that it sweeps so many teams. However, it's difficult to put it in a defensive core, which is where you'd want to put the Calm Mind set. Since it doesn't really wall anything in particular, it usually just sits on a team and either comes in and sweeps or doesn't. I think the Trick Room set destroys heavy offense, but against everything else, it is very easy to stall out. For this reason, it is going to move down to B rank. Much like Porygon-Z, it is on the upper edge of B rank. Though this may seem harsh, it's very difficult to fit Reuniclus on a core, which makes its use very suspect.
The next two Pokemon up for discussion are Roserade and Sharpedo.
Reuniclus was a hard Pokemon to rank, given that it sweeps so many teams. However, it's difficult to put it in a defensive core, which is where you'd want to put the Calm Mind set. Since it doesn't really wall anything in particular, it usually just sits on a team and either comes in and sweeps or doesn't. I think the Trick Room set destroys heavy offense, but against everything else, it is very easy to stall out. For this reason, it is going to move down to B rank. Much like Porygon-Z, it is on the upper edge of B rank. Though this may seem harsh, it's very difficult to fit Reuniclus on a core, which makes its use very suspect.
The next two Pokemon up for discussion are Roserade and Sharpedo.
Rade I am actually fine where she is. This gen has been kind to her giving her access to sleep powder + spikes + leafstorm combination allows hear to maintain offensive presence while being able to play defensively as she stacks spikes. I also love the fact that she is one of the few special attackers that can really threaten the Slowbro + Florges core, and uses Florges as hazard bait more or less. I haven't exactly used her offensive technician set so I can't comment on it much as I easily find just too much utility from using her as a hazard setter. Her ability to threaten bulky waters in general make her a wonderful asset to any team. Admittedly defog does put a damper on Rade's hazard stacking as those match ups tend to be unfavorable to her, but she can put them to sleep and regain some momentum if you time the switch in properly, but she is bulky enough to continually switch in and out and the +10 def certainly helps her, with Natural cure aiding in that. She is just solid all around not much to say about her.
Sharpedo is another one I feel the same in that this gen has been rather kind to him as dark attacks are more or less buffed, adding to that some prominent threats had moved up that usually gave him some trouble (i.e. Zapdos) and the drop downs of some popular psychics (Jirachi/Metagross/Reiunculus) give him more opportunities. He is also one of the few physical attackers actually capable to threatening the Florges + Slowbro as he can put pressure on the opposing team with the proper prediction. Frankly, he is a poster boy for what A rank asks for but I'd only rate him A rank as he definitely needs support much more so than A+ mons to do his job reliably.
Sharpedo is another one I feel the same in that this gen has been rather kind to him as dark attacks are more or less buffed, adding to that some prominent threats had moved up that usually gave him some trouble (i.e. Zapdos) and the drop downs of some popular psychics (Jirachi/Metagross/Reiunculus) give him more opportunities. He is also one of the few physical attackers actually capable to threatening the Florges + Slowbro as he can put pressure on the opposing team with the proper prediction. Frankly, he is a poster boy for what A rank asks for but I'd only rate him A rank as he definitely needs support much more so than A+ mons to do his job reliably.
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252 SpA Roserade Sludge Bomb vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Florges: 152-182 (42.2 - 50.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
Not quite enough damage to break but Roserade can out stall Florges, poison type makes her immune to toxic and resists moonblast and giga drain can restore most of the health lost. After looking on Serbii I saw she has Shadow ball, dazzling gleam, weather ball and extrasensory, HP gets Technician bonus, though most of these wont get used because of her support moves and semi slow speed. Leaf Storm can be used to threaten Suicune and Slowbro, 7/10 he would probably rather spam scald than his coverage and is out sped always. Even then Giga drain works just as well on them and is a reliable stab but with Leech seed and Synthesis, Energy Ball could be allowed. And of course she gets both spikes so if she could find the time and wont get hit by fire, ice, psychic or flying she can set those hazards.
Rosey has a lot of different sets changing small things with her moves. She'll always have a grass and poison attack, a way to heal, and half the time can set up spikes. Compared to the others in A, she's not very good. Foretress makes toxic spikes less threatening and walls everything she has except HP fire, Darmanitan hits harder with sheer force, Shaymin has better coverage and a huge grass bomb, and Umbreon walls her off very well. Looking in A- for things to sweep, more steel types, Mega Amp out does her, Celebi checks her, Crobat, Escavilier and Flygon beats her. B+ might be a better place, she has good support moves to mix around but a lot of A ranks aren't threatened by her unless it's like Hippowdon who have a who are slower and have a built in weakness.
Not quite enough damage to break but Roserade can out stall Florges, poison type makes her immune to toxic and resists moonblast and giga drain can restore most of the health lost. After looking on Serbii I saw she has Shadow ball, dazzling gleam, weather ball and extrasensory, HP gets Technician bonus, though most of these wont get used because of her support moves and semi slow speed. Leaf Storm can be used to threaten Suicune and Slowbro, 7/10 he would probably rather spam scald than his coverage and is out sped always. Even then Giga drain works just as well on them and is a reliable stab but with Leech seed and Synthesis, Energy Ball could be allowed. And of course she gets both spikes so if she could find the time and wont get hit by fire, ice, psychic or flying she can set those hazards.
Rosey has a lot of different sets changing small things with her moves. She'll always have a grass and poison attack, a way to heal, and half the time can set up spikes. Compared to the others in A, she's not very good. Foretress makes toxic spikes less threatening and walls everything she has except HP fire, Darmanitan hits harder with sheer force, Shaymin has better coverage and a huge grass bomb, and Umbreon walls her off very well. Looking in A- for things to sweep, more steel types, Mega Amp out does her, Celebi checks her, Crobat, Escavilier and Flygon beats her. B+ might be a better place, she has good support moves to mix around but a lot of A ranks aren't threatened by her unless it's like Hippowdon who have a who are slower and have a built in weakness.
Or you know you could just put Florges to sleep and set up spikes, overall Florges can't really do much to stop you from doing your job whereas you can apply pressure with your STAB Sludge Bomb if you so wish. Moreover, based on statistics Florges builds are actually more dispersed rather than a super majority only running 252 SpD. Chances are Florges will likely switch out being unable to really do any harm or stop Rade from setting up hazards that sleep powder is usually a good way to stop any switch ins or you could sludge bomb to hurt the wish recipient etc. I am not really looking at her from an offensive standpoint as she shines as support to me rather than an offensive mon. She has the tools to switch in and out and possibly recovery if you so opt it. Being part poison is quite a blessing since she automatically can soak up toxic spikes. Comparing her to offensive A ranks when her role is mostly support is missing the mark here. The point of her offensive prowess with Leaf storm essentially makes it so that bulky waters will be wary of her so that it provides her with a good switch in opportunity, and natural cure makes her an even better candidate as she can heal off scald, not necessarily to compare to other offensive mons on A rank just that it is relevant enough.
I've already mentioned the defoggers in general as being a bad match up for her but the same can be said with Foretress you bring up but while she may not have volt-switch she does have the utility of sleep powder for predicted switch ins, which can help regain momentum at least. Also... while the offensive typing you mentioned are not uncommon the fact that Florges is the most used Pokemon and you are likely to find a bulky water on the opposing team or at least a slower wall you can sleep powder, e.g. Umbreon, I can't say I've ever found switch in opportunities all that difficult. This is why I advocate her more as support as it is much harder to stop her from doing her job.
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Yeah, Roserade can get Spikes + Sleep Powder now, which can set up all over Florges and the like. Honestly, I think it deserves A rank, with its good SAtk, solid Speed and great support movepool.
The SDef set is much more common, so it usually isn't a 2HKO.
Advocating it for B+ is idiotic. Roserade got a huge boon in the HP nerf, as odd as it sounds, as HP Fire completely shuts down common steel-types trying to switch into on it due to Technician, mainly Forry. The fact that it also got Sleep Powder + SPikes on the same set this gen is also really great for it as it helps Rose itself and its teammates achieve certain KOs and let Rose set up Spikes (or Toxic Spikes in some cases, whichever is more better for your team). The LO set is really great as well, as it has pretty good STABs coupled with HP Fire, or Extrasensory if you like hitting Crobat on the switch (i personally prefer HP Fire but again, it really depends on the team). It also has reliable recovery in Synthesis and Leech Seed, the latter being used commonly on SpDef sets in case some teams need a way to deal with boosted Suicune.
It definitely shouldn't be A+ either, however, since there are still a lot of counters to it which kinda make its raw power go to waste in some situations, and, unlike other A+ pokes like Victini, Mega Houndoom, and Mienshao, its speed tier really isnt all that great which limits its sweeping / wallbreaking capabilities. There's also the fact that it still has pitiful physical defenses, and that it's weak to the most common, and arguably the best, offensive type in the tier. It also really suffers from the Defog buff since it's a bit difficult to re-stack Spikes midgame.
In terms of comparison, I think A- is good for it since a lot of the mons in that particular ranking have raw power or bulk, like Rose, but have fairly large flaws that prevent them have really shining (Mega Blastoise, Kyurem, Hippowdon). I wouldn't mind seeing it in A rank either, though.
It definitely shouldn't be A+ either, however, since there are still a lot of counters to it which kinda make its raw power go to waste in some situations, and, unlike other A+ pokes like Victini, Mega Houndoom, and Mienshao, its speed tier really isnt all that great which limits its sweeping / wallbreaking capabilities. There's also the fact that it still has pitiful physical defenses, and that it's weak to the most common, and arguably the best, offensive type in the tier. It also really suffers from the Defog buff since it's a bit difficult to re-stack Spikes midgame.
In terms of comparison, I think A- is good for it since a lot of the mons in that particular ranking have raw power or bulk, like Rose, but have fairly large flaws that prevent them have really shining (Mega Blastoise, Kyurem, Hippowdon). I wouldn't mind seeing it in A rank either, though.
Roserade should dip no lower than A rank.
There a couple of things I think need to be mentioned in terms of Roserade and why it is such a truly destructive threat in practice, and after that I'll move on to comparisons.
First and foremost, Roserade's coverage - and the fact that this coverage is used quite commonly - means that it truly has very few counters outside of Snorlax and Umbreon. Furthermore, claiming 4MSS is somewhat irrelevant in this case purely because of how threatening Roserade's potential to carry coverage is. In tournament and high-level play, it's just not feasible to leave a Forretress (something that would otherwise completely hard counter roserade) in without first scouting for HP fire. This tremendous lack of momentum and lack of knowledge allows roserade to completely wreak havoc on a team and perhaps even bluff coverage it doesn't have. Similarly, Roserade's access to more niche coverage moves like Extrasensory and HP (rock in sandstorm, water in rain, both are relevant) allow it to further obtain surprise kills and threaten out things that would otherwise check or counter it. This tremendous versatility is amplified in the context of Roserade's utility - even if it lacks the appropriate counter move to deal with a pokemon (say, crobat), it can still severely cripple it by use of sleep powder - which, while inaccurate, should be and is present on most every Roserade set. Roserade's access to spikes and toxic spikes (as well as her being the most viable offensive spiker) as well as the new ability to run it in conjunction with sleep powder allows it to take advantage of sleep even on threats it can't touch offensively (like umbreon or mew).
In terms of comparison, I think roserade is far better than the pokes in A- rank. For instance, Mega-Blastoise, which is even on the high end of A- rank, pales in comparison to the sheer capacity that Roserade has to wreak havoc. Both are special wallbreakers with moderate speed tiers and utility. While Mega-Blastoise's bulk is certainly enough to account for its lower speed and lack of an item, it doesn't change the fact that Blastoise, Absol, Arcanine, Crobat, Flygon, Raikou, and other offensive pokes in the A- rank have clearly defined counters to which they can do nothing more than get the fuck out, or stay in and accomplish nothing. Roserade is truly a threat to whatever comes in, which allows it to make use of its utility and support the team not only through its offensive versatility but also its team support, a combo that can only be claimed by A rank and higher pokes like Nidoking and Mega-Aerodactyl.
Perhaps the most effective comparison is between Roserade and Nidoqueen. At first glance, they seem very similar - both have moderate bulk, good defensive typing, hazards, and powerful special attacks. However, Roserade beats Nidoqueen on a number of fronts. First of all, Natural Cure / Technician over Sheer Force means that Roserade not only has a useful ability that compounds her power (which is comparable to nidoqueen's after sheer force) but also retains the secondary effects of her moves. While giga drain is an amazing stab, it also has the great side effect of incredible healing - while sludge bomb is a strong coverage move, it also has an RNG aspect that allows it to break through walls and stack up more damage. Moreoever, Roserade's access to Sleep Powder allows its utility to soar to all new levels levels comparable to Mega-Aerodactyl's access to Defog and SR.
There a couple of things I think need to be mentioned in terms of Roserade and why it is such a truly destructive threat in practice, and after that I'll move on to comparisons.
First and foremost, Roserade's coverage - and the fact that this coverage is used quite commonly - means that it truly has very few counters outside of Snorlax and Umbreon. Furthermore, claiming 4MSS is somewhat irrelevant in this case purely because of how threatening Roserade's potential to carry coverage is. In tournament and high-level play, it's just not feasible to leave a Forretress (something that would otherwise completely hard counter roserade) in without first scouting for HP fire. This tremendous lack of momentum and lack of knowledge allows roserade to completely wreak havoc on a team and perhaps even bluff coverage it doesn't have. Similarly, Roserade's access to more niche coverage moves like Extrasensory and HP (rock in sandstorm, water in rain, both are relevant) allow it to further obtain surprise kills and threaten out things that would otherwise check or counter it. This tremendous versatility is amplified in the context of Roserade's utility - even if it lacks the appropriate counter move to deal with a pokemon (say, crobat), it can still severely cripple it by use of sleep powder - which, while inaccurate, should be and is present on most every Roserade set. Roserade's access to spikes and toxic spikes (as well as her being the most viable offensive spiker) as well as the new ability to run it in conjunction with sleep powder allows it to take advantage of sleep even on threats it can't touch offensively (like umbreon or mew).
In terms of comparison, I think roserade is far better than the pokes in A- rank. For instance, Mega-Blastoise, which is even on the high end of A- rank, pales in comparison to the sheer capacity that Roserade has to wreak havoc. Both are special wallbreakers with moderate speed tiers and utility. While Mega-Blastoise's bulk is certainly enough to account for its lower speed and lack of an item, it doesn't change the fact that Blastoise, Absol, Arcanine, Crobat, Flygon, Raikou, and other offensive pokes in the A- rank have clearly defined counters to which they can do nothing more than get the fuck out, or stay in and accomplish nothing. Roserade is truly a threat to whatever comes in, which allows it to make use of its utility and support the team not only through its offensive versatility but also its team support, a combo that can only be claimed by A rank and higher pokes like Nidoking and Mega-Aerodactyl.
Perhaps the most effective comparison is between Roserade and Nidoqueen. At first glance, they seem very similar - both have moderate bulk, good defensive typing, hazards, and powerful special attacks. However, Roserade beats Nidoqueen on a number of fronts. First of all, Natural Cure / Technician over Sheer Force means that Roserade not only has a useful ability that compounds her power (which is comparable to nidoqueen's after sheer force) but also retains the secondary effects of her moves. While giga drain is an amazing stab, it also has the great side effect of incredible healing - while sludge bomb is a strong coverage move, it also has an RNG aspect that allows it to break through walls and stack up more damage. Moreoever, Roserade's access to Sleep Powder allows its utility to soar to all new levels levels comparable to Mega-Aerodactyl's access to Defog and SR.
This is particularly why I never advocated her offensive set is that she has quite mediocre speed. On the other hand I find her offensive prowess just enough just enough to actually compliment her supporting role quite well, in that it not only provides her better opportunities to actually perform her role but also allow her to net kills if needed. I can't say I have ever seen a Roserade actually sweep a team, maybe clean up but sweeping is far and beyond what I would envision it to do. It is not particularly that difficult to re-stack spikes given the imminent threat of sleep powder, and often the opposing team's reluctance to sac their bulky water with the presence of a fire type. Regardless, it is definitely disruptive enough in terms of versatility and support that I can't find any other Pokemon to really match quite as well. Frankly, it is very easy to be rewarded by playing conservatively just using Sleep Powder + Spikes/Toxic Spikes in that not only are you usually able to put the switch in to sleep but in certain cases it makes a great bait to luring out and confirming the defogger of the opposing team, and from there you can aim to whittle them down (spinners are pretty obvious but defoggers can catch you off guard at times).
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Im not going to say anything about roserade because kitten milk and bouffalant summed it up perfectly. It should stay in A.
On the other hand sharpedo is very interesting. With good attack (especially since it can go adamant) good offencive typing and an insanely good ability sharpedo is such a great late game cleaner. Once a team has been weakened sharpedo can come in, kill all and win the game. With the steel nerf sharpedo is even better and needs a check on all teams. I think sharpedo is brilliant but it loves wallbreakers and hazard layers to the point that withought them it is somewhat underwhelming. Sharpedo has the crappiest bulk ever and can never come in on a resisted hit, unless psychic (immunity). All in all sharpedo is an offencive nightmare with great stabs, great attack, good speed and an insanely good ability but the fact that it loves hazards and wall breakers so much warrants it a place in A-, though it could also fit in A.
On the other hand sharpedo is very interesting. With good attack (especially since it can go adamant) good offencive typing and an insanely good ability sharpedo is such a great late game cleaner. Once a team has been weakened sharpedo can come in, kill all and win the game. With the steel nerf sharpedo is even better and needs a check on all teams. I think sharpedo is brilliant but it loves wallbreakers and hazard layers to the point that withought them it is somewhat underwhelming. Sharpedo has the crappiest bulk ever and can never come in on a resisted hit, unless psychic (immunity). All in all sharpedo is an offencive nightmare with great stabs, great attack, good speed and an insanely good ability but the fact that it loves hazards and wall breakers so much warrants it a place in A-, though it could also fit in A.
Kitten Milk i agree with most of your points, but i'd like to point out a few things
first off, i wouldn't call roserade's bulk moderate since 65 / 60 /110 isn't /that/ great, especially when compared to queen's overall well rounded bulk in 90 / 87 / 85. there's also the fact that queen has better defensive typing with a assload of resistances / immunities, namely twave ( you can argue that ncure rose can just switch out but i'd rather not be forced unless i'm running rest which i havent really seen at all this gen)
there's also the fact that rose gets leaf storm which a lot of people seem to miss out on for offensive LO. the difference is definitely noticeable and lets rose get some key ohkos that it wouldnt get with giga drain, mainly nidoking. i think that, like i said, its based on preference since giga drain lets it stay up for longer and wont be worn down easily.
also thanks for taking muh argument which i forgot to include :^(
21:48Bouffalant hm, do you think it would be safe to say that
21:48Bouffalant sleep + spikes was a buff for it because it helps it itself deal with its counters easier
21:48Bouffalant for rose
21:49KittenUU yes sleep + spikes is def a buff
first off, i wouldn't call roserade's bulk moderate since 65 / 60 /110 isn't /that/ great, especially when compared to queen's overall well rounded bulk in 90 / 87 / 85. there's also the fact that queen has better defensive typing with a assload of resistances / immunities, namely twave ( you can argue that ncure rose can just switch out but i'd rather not be forced unless i'm running rest which i havent really seen at all this gen)
there's also the fact that rose gets leaf storm which a lot of people seem to miss out on for offensive LO. the difference is definitely noticeable and lets rose get some key ohkos that it wouldnt get with giga drain, mainly nidoking. i think that, like i said, its based on preference since giga drain lets it stay up for longer and wont be worn down easily.
also thanks for taking muh argument which i forgot to include :^(
21:48Bouffalant hm, do you think it would be safe to say that
21:48Bouffalant sleep + spikes was a buff for it because it helps it itself deal with its counters easier
21:48Bouffalant for rose
21:49KittenUU yes sleep + spikes is def a buff
Oh, one real quick thing before I call it a day. While Nidoqueen does have the lethal combination of utility and damage, it's practically forced to employ both of those as any fourth coverage move / alternate item will not be optimal. By contrast, fully supporting Roserade is absolutely viable (meru anyone), and fully offensive (even specs) roserade is completely viable as well.
Just like last gen, Roserade is still so good, as its dual STABs alone threaten even the bulkiest of special walls due to the strongth of its unique one-two hit nature. Pink Core has a hard time against it, as Sludge Bomb hits like a truck, and has that nasty Poison chance, which goes unaffected by Synchronize. Follow that up with Leaf Storm and even the fattest of Snorlax are well below half health. Just like Kitten said, Rose fits well into the other spectrum of Pokemon, capable of being tailored into a similarly unique support set due to it being one of the few hazard setters able to force out Mega-Blastoise just by virtue of its typing. Both sets are able to provide a stupid amount of versatility, shocking counters to one set with just a mere move change. This is in contrast to a lot of A- rank pokes such as Mega-Blastoise and Nidoqueen, who have sets of similar levels of potency compared to Roserade, but are unable to keep their opponents on their toes with any possibility of surprise coverage moves.
However, Rose can have the tendency to fall short offensively and defensively. It has trouble with some Defoggers, which can be frustrating to take out at times. It also has Poison-types and Steel-types that are immune to the poison chance, and resist both STABs, so it needs team support to handle threats that it concedes total set up bait to, such as Crobat and Forry/Metagross/MAggron when not running HP Fire. In addition, 95 Spe suddenly got a lot slower when Hydreigon came into the tier, something Darmanitan is also experiencing. However, it's probably the biggest F U answers to bulky waters to ever be created, and personally, is a poke that I never forget to consider while teambuilding, both whether to use it and how to handle facing it. I think it fits snugly in the A rank of this tier.
However, Rose can have the tendency to fall short offensively and defensively. It has trouble with some Defoggers, which can be frustrating to take out at times. It also has Poison-types and Steel-types that are immune to the poison chance, and resist both STABs, so it needs team support to handle threats that it concedes total set up bait to, such as Crobat and Forry/Metagross/MAggron when not running HP Fire. In addition, 95 Spe suddenly got a lot slower when Hydreigon came into the tier, something Darmanitan is also experiencing. However, it's probably the biggest F U answers to bulky waters to ever be created, and personally, is a poke that I never forget to consider while teambuilding, both whether to use it and how to handle facing it. I think it fits snugly in the A rank of this tier.
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Mega Blastoise's 252+ water pulse does around the same damage as Timid Rose's LO Sludge Bomb, without taking 10% of it's health. While it lacks the nuke of a move like Leaf Storm, it more than makes up for that with much higher bulk.
All the pokemon you mentioned can do something other than simply switching out. Whether it's spinning, defogging, volt switching/ u-turning to a counter, knocking off their item, or burning, all the pokemon in A- can do minor things to their counters like Rose can. Becuase, at the end of the day, sleep powder is minor this gen. New sleep mechanics coupled with the fact that one of the top used pokemon in the tier is a cleric means that sleep isn't that big a deal. Never mind the fact that Sleep Talk is standard on CB Crobat.
Nidoqueen has much better defensive typing (electric immunity, bug/rock resist resist, fire/flying neutrality. Really the only con is the water weakness.) and much,much better bulk. Rose's defensive bulk is abysmal; it struggles take resisted hits like CB Victini's Bolt Strike and Scarf Hera's Close Combat, let alone neutral attacks like the massive amounts of Knock Offs, U-Turns, and Stone Edges that roam the tier. Roserade technically gets hazards, but to actually run it, it either has to drop sleep powder, one of it's strongest features, or use it's abysmal 2 move coverage.
An incredibly minor pro considering it really only effects sludge bomb giving a normal poison status.
3 super effective and 6 resists can not be called amazing by any sense of the word.
Look, Roserade is good pokemon with a lot of good features, it has significant drawbacks that cannot be overlooked. A- is where it belongs.
Edit: I won't elaborate my points as other people have already done so
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A rank is fine for Roserade. Like most have already said, Sleep Powder+Spikes is good, while LO variants hit very hard. Although it does have average speed and is forced out by most Fire types (which still needs to be wary switching in on LO Variants due to Sludge Bomb and Sleep Powder), she still does her job well as an Offensive hazards setter or a somewhat wallbreaker. Technician+HP and Nat Cure are also great abilities too. Overall, she fits great in A rank, especially due to being amazing at beating bulky waters and Florges.
Both are great where they are. Offensive LO is deadly on roserade and if you choose to run spikes you can set up on anything. Roserade also makes a good suicune check. It can't beat it after a few boosts, but setting up spikes forces it out easily. Sharpedo is an excellent sweeper and is criminally underrated, and with hazard support ITT can tear through teams.
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