Your teambuilding process (DPP)

Shadow_Sneak

Approved by Jellicent

Alright so I am making this thread to hopefully help newer players when it comes to building in DPP OU and the other dpp tiers. I am asking for seasoned veterans and even "the new generation" players to share their team building process. This process can be for certain types of builds such as Stall, Baton Pass, Balance, Weather etc. Nobody should be judged for their favorite style of play and the more playstyle processes we can get, the more helpful this will be to newer players and to even some potential veterans. While I usually preface this with my own style of building in the tier, I am not the most experienced player in DPP when it comes to building. Also a side note to those of you who like playing the other tiers in dpp NU, UU, Ubers etc. Teambuilding processes those tiers would be apprieciated as well as I want to try to make this as a good resource as possible for tiers in DPP, not just OU. I need the help of those of you in the community out there, so hopefully we can make this work.
 
I'm from the 'new generations of players' but if i can help :

I usually start building around an late game sweeper and cover him imo is the best way

I always using pastebin from SOMALIA with lgs/lead list and viabranking/speedtiers, and i making my own check/counter list to the pokemon i would like to build around him

For an exemple i would like to build around an agility subpetaya empoleon,for a goodteammate i choose infernape because he can beat celebi/shaymin/blissey and for exemple tyranitar to check zapdos who is really annoying and after i need ground resistence/immunity i can choose rotom maybe scarf rotom ?

I always using a scarfer (if i use thing like scizor scarf i need another faster mon like aero/jolteon/starmie)but i can use double scarfer but its really rare and steel type to check outrage spam and to check a lot of mon because steel in 4G/5G/3G are op

To build around thing very common like SD bulky scizor/lucario its take me 20-30 min to get a very good build and hard thing like Sd weavile(not really good but not bad at all )take me more than 30 min
 
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I would put myself into the category 'above average nub in DPP'. I'm fairly new to it and I find it one of the hardest metagames to get into. Yet, I find it a very enjoyable metagane. Because I still don't really know what I'm doing I use a lot of resources to build a team. The problem I kinda have is that I have too many ideas and that I often try to make a team do too many things. As for my process it usually goes like this:

1. I pick a Pokémon or an archetype:

I've heard many ways to teambuild. 'Pick a sweeper and build around it.' 'Pick a good defensive core and build a team that benefits from that core'. However, I find most of these ways to start of teambuilding restricting.

If you pick a 'sweeper', specifically a sweeper. You're already restricting yourself from using a stall playstyle. Sweepers usually don't fit in this archetype and I wouldn't categorize Scarftar under 'Sweeper'. In the same way picking a core of Pokémon from the get go can lock yourself into a Balance playstyle or Bulky Offense quite easily.

That's why I usually don't start with a core in mind. I start of with a single Pokémon that I like, or would be interested in using. I don't determine my playstyle from step 1 this way, although you could argue that, that is what you should already have in mind when building a team. The exception is if I know what archetype I want to use clear cut, for example; CM Spam.

2. Picking a core

When I know which Pokémon I want to build my team around I start picking 1-2 Pokémon that pair well with it. These Pokémon must cover each others' weaknesses well and also be able somewhat deal with a large portion of the DPP top threats. In stead of looking at a list of Pokémon I usually think of what typing/ability/movepool would synergize well with the Pokémon I want to build around. Sometimes it happens that the Pokémon I picked doesn't even become the main star of the team, this is more often the case with bulkier Pokémon than sweepers.

3. Picking movesets and spreads for the core

In stead of finishing my team up with six Pokémon and going from there I start putting EV spreads and movesets on the first 2-3 Pokémon I already have. It is here where I kind of deteminre in which way I want this team to play out.

4. Devising 'Gameplan A' + revising movesets

When I have my core fleshed out I start thinking of what kind of gameplan would be best suited for this core. Do I want to setup with x, while y should take out counter 1 or 2? The other way around maybe? They can both be a win condition? This is what I would call 'gameplan A', the gameplan I initially want to execute with the team before going into a match.

After I decide what I want to do, I'll look back at what moves/spreads I picked for my core and think if this is optimal for achieving my gameplan. If needed I'll change a few things or write notes to try out different things.

5. Picking a lead (if the lead isn't in the core)

This speaks for itself. After I picked my core and devised my main strategy I want to pick a lead that does well with what I want to achieve and also synergizes well with the team. Of course if I have a solid lead in my core (like Swampert) I could skip this step.

6. Picking the rest of the team

After all of this I finally pick the last 3-4 Pokémon in my squad. This is usually a fast process where I throw in some Pokémon I think will do well with the team. The thing that I try to keep in mind is not using Pokémon that would work against my main gameplan and also bring Pokémon that will both act as backup gameplans and support the main gameplan.

7. Testing

This is the part where I usually start slacking but is actually the most important part of all of the steps, in my opinion. You have to test the team on the ladder (lol) and try getting games in with DPP players, be it in Old Gens or Tour nights. I've always used the ladder and that's why I'm usually a slacker here. Because ladder is ded. But recently I found out about the Old Gens room and also that there are weekly RoA tour nights. So I'm hoping to improve my teams from there. I guess you shouldn't be afraid to ask feedback about your team as well!

With testing you should aim for improving your team by noticing flaws in your team. Be it by team picks or movesets/items. I usually don't want to change the composition of my team too much. If you change too much, it isn't the team that you wanted to make anymore. That's why as a rule of the thumb I restrict myself mostly to only changing 1 Pokémon. The rest of the changes should be subtle but help your team cover their weakness a bit better. Bit weak to Earthquake? Put a Shuca on something rather than switching a Pokémon for a Levitater or w/e. Got problems with fast poke x? Well maybe reconsider which Poké you're giving a Choice Scarf.

If you notice that your team falls a part. Or your core isn't working as intended and you have to change too much then that is where I scrap the team completely and start over.

This is the way I'm doing it for now. Hope I could help. I think I'll make a new team after my exam period is over and go over the steps I took etc and post that here as well.
 
But building an simple team in DPP metagame is really easy and you don't really need testing because imo metagame quite balanced and we can handle all threats or the majority of them in a team not look like ORAS lol

Yeah ladder is dead is shit there are not few guys and atm guys in smogtours wait just wcup match this is why atm its really hard to test team but its not really a problem for me
 
VentusAwakening said:
But building an simple team in DPP metagame is really easy and you don't really need testing because imo metagame quite balanced and we can handle all threats or the majority of them in a team not look like ORAS lol
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I would argue that it's harder to build a really good team in a balanced metagame. Sure, you're able to cover most of the metagame with one team, unlike ORAS. But so does your opponent's team. In ORAS, it's not too hard to build a team, even if you lose you can blame it on matchups. Can't do that in DPP though, sure match ups are still a thing if you are talking HO vs Stall or something but there is always a chance you can win with your team no matter the match up in DPP. To build a team to maximize that chance is, I think, what makes it challenging for me and what is the key to good DPP teams that survived through the ages.

Just my opinion.
 
The challenge for me was to build in 1-2h to get an 'good team' in ORAS can cover a lot of threat of the metagame without always using the same same core this is why DPP metagame is really fun and easy for me

Yeah there are always match-up in pokemon ofc but in ORAS/BW(weather) and maybe other metagame the match up is much more present than in the DPP metagame
 
ThinkNice said:
I would argue that it's harder to build a really good team in a balanced metagame. Sure, you're able to cover most of the metagame with one team, unlike ORAS. But so does your opponent's team. In ORAS, it's not too hard to build a team, even if you lose you can blame it on matchups. Can't do that in DPP though, sure match ups are still a thing if you are talking HO vs Stall or something but there is always a chance you can win with your team no matter the match up in DPP. To build a team to maximize that chance is, I think, what makes it challenging for me and what is the key to good DPP teams that survived through the ages.

Just my opinion.
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What DPP teams have survived through the ages? Are people still using KG stall >_<
 
I have already made a comment but I would like to redo more detailed one seen than before I did not know a lot too much

I start building around a core or a late game sweeper and after patching some weakness so there are thing to estimate my build :

Have fire/water/grass/ground/fighting resistences,electric check and steel type
Have at least 2 checks to ape and have way to deal with shaymin/suicune ect (for exemple its not because breloom is a grass type it mean it can counter him since he is outspeed and take like 70-80 from ice beam)
Being able to handle all threat of the tier and handle late game sweeper or thing like rain dance kingdra/agility empoleon

For exemple pursuit bait + lucario/zapdos+breloom ect work well as good cores

After test the team on smogtours or with fren and have external opinons
 
Shadow_Sneak said:
This process can be for certain types of builds such as Stall, Baton Pass, Balance, Weather etc. Nobody should be judged for their favorite style of play and the more playstyle processes we can get, the more helpful this will be to newer players and to even some potential veterans.
Click to expand...
Lellers, nice utopia kiddo.

To add some substance to the post: Sand + Gliscor + Magnezone, add 3 fillers.

Common building practice these days is Skarm+Pert/Hippo+Ttar. Gives you full hazard support with two Starmie bait setters -> trap Starmie with Tyranitar and then go to town with the rest of the team. Some people add a ghost for safety, some don't. You then have 2-3 "free" spots for team preferences (Starmie if you like Spinning, Breloom for sleep + hazard abuse, Jirachi because it can do everything and it likes hazards too, etc).
 
I try to stay away from "frameworks" and similar things these days because I think the best teams all have something unique about them, but I don't mind sharing some of the things I do when I build teams!

I think I'm better at building defensive teams so I'll start with that.

1) usually I start with either an offensive Pokemon that fits well on a defensive team (like Zapdos, Clefable, or Aerodactyl to abuse the Spikes) or a defensive Pokemon that shuts down teams once certain things die (like SpDef Heatran, SpDef Abomasnow, or SpDef Jirachi)

2) on a defensive team, I think it's important to have a resist for every type in the game. It's a lot harder to avoid switching into stuff by pressuring the opponent so you'll need to be ready for everything. Common "forgotten" resistances include Rock, Ghost, Dark, Fighting, Electric (Tyranitar is not a very good Electric resist for a defensive team considering how hard Specs Zapdos dunks on it), and Water.

3) Depending on what support your focal point needs, build the team in consequence. Usually it'll be Spikes so Skarm/Forry/Rosie + Ghost/ScarfTar (or both!) will make it often. Just make it so your whole team works towards the same objective

4) I don't really believe in "defensive cores" but some pokes just work really well together, for example, Water + Ground + Steel provides a nice defensive backbone. Hippo + Skarm + Starmie is a common one, especially on hazard stacks.

5) Your lead is really the last thing that should be decided, and it shouldn't be a new member. It's hard to find a solid lead for those teams sometimes. Leading with a defensive Ground shuts down some common leads (Zapdos) but will give you very bad matchups against others (Azelf...). Tyranitar is an unpredictable lead but needs some kind of Machamp switch-in. If you have a Zapdos then you should probably lead with it

I'll add more about how I make offensive teams later o.o
 
How I team build in DPP:

1) Think about the style. Do you want to build an offensive team that will try to break opposing teams? Do you want a balanced team that can allow you to have more control of the game while being more passive? Do you want a stall team that will be focused on stopping other teams while relying on passive damage to slowly win?

2) Think about a main strategy you will use for your team. This can be a pokemon (for example, a team based around Sub SD Gliscor), a combination of pokemons (for example a pokemon based around a steel set upper such as Agility Metagross and a dragon like DD Dragonite), or just a general strategy (for example a RD team or a team based around TS)

3) Supporting your main strategy. What support do I need? What can stop that main strategy? How can you lure its counters? What can I do? In the Sub SD Gliscor example, you could probably support it with some hazards to help vs bulky waters such as Swampert, it will need sand to be more effective (Sand Veil), so maybe ScarfTar (who can also trap and kill Starm, which is one of its main counters) is a good idea. This is basically some brainstorming about how you can make that general strategy work better.

4) Covering weakness. After you have decided your main strategy and you have thought about some ideas to support it, then the next step is covering the weakness. This is where you can use the common cores (such as FWG, or Steel + Ground + Water, or Steel + Dragon, etc) that can help you covering, weakness, while using some ideas you thought about in point 3.
Some example of common cores: Heatran/Infernape + Celebi/Breloom/Shaymin/Roserade + Starmie/Suicune/Gyarados/Kingdra/Swampert/Empoleon, Skarmory + Swampert/Hippowdon + Tyranitar + Gengar/Rotom-A, Flygon/Kingdra/Dragonite + Scizor/Bronzong, Flygon/Dragonite + Metagross/Jirachi/Lucario, Gliscor + Swampert + Water resist, Tyranitar + Rotom-A + Water Resist, Magnezone + Dragonite/Flygon, etc

In my experience, teams with standard mons that work well together, but with some weird sets to lure other mons (for example, a shuca berry jirachi with icy wind, or a haban berry DD dnite to beat scarfgon), or teams that look standard but with a surprise sweeper or scarfer that is revealed last are the teams that work the best.

5) Choosing your lead and your SRer. The lead game is important in DPP. Starting well in DPP can make you get more information early about your opponent, or even killing something early. This depends on the metagame trends and on what leads are more common. Roserade, Machamp, Dragonite, Heatran, Zapdos, Azelf, Aerodactyl, Jirachi, Metagross, Empoleon, Swampert, Hippowdon, Gliscor, etc are some examples of common leads. It is also important choosing who will have Stealth Rock, since SR is just so good and should be used in every team.

6) Finishing the team. Generally you will end with a team of 4 or 5 members and you will have to choose the last members. You should make sure that you have at least 1 resist to the most common types, and that you have at least 1 answer to the most common threats. Having at least a scarf mon to RK set uppers is usually recommended. Think about what can give you problems and what can help you beating that.

7) Test the team, learn about what gives you trouble, change things, etc. Some teams look very good in theory but then they are not effective in practice.


So basically, my advice when team building: think about a general strategy and how you can support it, and then use solid cores with some innovative or surprise sets that can help you in your general strategy and giving you the upper hand while covering your weakness and trying not to be weak to the common strategies used.
"standard mons weird sets" is what works best in my experience
 
oh i really like this thread!
im used to build just lookin around. since i always had a great creativity, i use it to build teams. what do i mean?
every material things i see i can build a team around it; if i see scissors i can think -> scissor = scizor, im gonna build a team around zor. i know dpp like my pockets so i can use all my creativity for my teams. this might be funny, but its true, no lies.
my main "secret" is givin a look to all the movepool that pokemon could have. its not all about common sets, im pretty sure lots of pokemon have hidden potentialities that a great % of players ignore, and this is my secret to succes.
one of the best secret to win in dpp is the lead. if you start good, you have a great % to win the battle, thats why i always take care of the lead. i totally agree with m dragon when talks about -> 5) Choosing your lead and your SRer. The lead game is important in DPP. Starting well in DPP can make you get more information early about your opponent, or even killing something early. This depends on the metagame trends and on what leads are more common. Roserade, Machamp, Dragonite, Heatran, Zapdos, Azelf, Aerodactyl, Jirachi, Metagross, Empoleon, Swampert, Hippowdon, Gliscor, etc are some examples of common leads. It is also important choosing who will have Stealth Rock, since SR is just so good and should be used in every team.

here there are some leads that i created

Machamp @ Lum Berry
Ability: Guts
EVs: 252 HP / 240 Atk / 16 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Dynamic Punch
- Counter
- Bullet Punch
- Payback/Stone Edge

i really like this set, i generally use it to play against offensive players. this type of machamp has no fear of metagross/jirachi/machamp etc etc. if you see a machamp lead you will never think "oh, i have metagross i can mmash it since my lead can tank it". you can destroy ur opp since round1 and make the battle urs coz u have a great match-up

Machamp @ Lum Berry
Ability: Guts
EVs: 240 HP / 240 Atk / 28 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dynamic Punch
- Focus Punch
- Stone Edge
- Payback

this lead works perfectly against stall team, for example againts hippo/swampert and some other tanks. confusion + fpunch work together and sedge/payback complete the coverage.

these are some some variants of lead, and my suggest is giving a complete look to all the movepool that a pokemon has. i always give a look to usages of course, and im used to make some uncommon core to beat my opp.
an other important factor is the "momentum".
its a sort of "i fucked you, i play with ur brain". its hard to explain, but its like "i control ur moves"
test a lot the teams, make a good team needs patience
 
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