Other 6th Gen Pokemon UU Candidate Speculation Thread

[bobbyvaporeon]

I feel Exploud will be in UU due to the sheer power of Specs Boomburst and Phenomenal coverage. It has Focus Blast for Rock and Steel Types, Overheat for Doublade, and other moves like Surf, Ice Beam, and Shadow Ball. No real boosting move hurts it, but as a wallbreaker it is really good.
Also, what about Donphan falling? With it's niche as a Physically Defensive rapid spinner that can kill Dragons lost to Avalugg, who has Recover, i could see it in UU where it can be a top spinner.

 

[Magnemite]

I feel Exploud will be in UU due to the sheer power of Specs Boomburst and Phenomenal coverage. It has Focus Blast for Rock and Steel Types, Overheat for Doublade, and other moves like Surf, Ice Beam, and Shadow Ball. No real boosting move hurts it, but as a wallbreaker it is really good.
Also, what about Donphan falling? With it's niche as a Physically Defensive rapid spinner that can kill Dragons lost to Avalugg, who has Recover, i could see it in UU where it can be a top spinner.

Why would you ever use Exploud in UU when Porygon-Z is much faster, much more powerful, and has Nasty Plot and Agility? Using Exploud in UU is just silly. Also, Donphan will likely drop, but certainly not because of Avalugg (which is pretty awful, by the way). Excadrill outclasses Donphan entirely. The only advantages Donphan has over it are no Fighting and Ground weaknesses and a pathetically weak uninvested non-stab Ice Shard. That's it. Donphan will be very good in UU, though. In early BW1, it topped the UU usage stats by a wide margin. It's about time that it dropped, because BW UU desperately needed more spinners.

 

[Thorhammer]

Exploud's Boomburst hits for an effective 210 BP, while Porygon-Z's Tri-Attack hits for 160, making Exploud's a 31% increase. Meanwhile, Porygon-Z has 405 max SpA as opposed to Exploud's 309, which... is also a 31% increase. So their STABs hit exactly as hard, while Porygon-Z hits way harder with its other attacks and is faster, on top of various movepool advantages. Exploud is not going to be worthwhile in UU at all. If Porygon-Z can stay UU, which it didn't stay throughout the entire lower-powered Gen 5 metagame, Exploud might be able to crack RU, but that's the extent of its potential outside NU.

As for Rapid Spin, UU should get Mega Blastoise in addition to Donphan, judging by its frequency in appearing in OU so far. Unless UU loses Blastoise entirely, but even if that happens, it'll have expanded options with Defog, especially when Pokebank opens in just a month now.

 

[Pipotchi]

Exploud's Boomburst hits for an effective 210 BP, while Porygon-Z's Tri-Attack hits for 160, making Exploud's a 31% increase. Meanwhile, Porygon-Z has 405 max SpA as opposed to Exploud's 309, which... is also a 31% increase. So their STABs hit exactly as hard, while Porygon-Z hits way harder with its other attacks and is faster, on top of various movepool advantages. Exploud is not going to be worthwhile in UU at all. If Porygon-Z can stay UU, which it didn't stay throughout the entire lower-powered Gen 5 metagame, Exploud might be able to crack RU, but that's the extent of its potential outside NU.

As for Rapid Spin, UU should get Mega Blastoise in addition to Donphan, judging by its frequency in appearing in OU so far. Unless UU loses Blastoise entirely, but even if that happens, it'll have expanded options with Defog, especially when Pokebank opens in just a month now.

Isnt the whole point of Exploud's viability the fact that it can go specs and use its STAB with less fear of ghosts due to scrappy? Im not saying he is or isnt though, since I havent used him or seen him in action.
Honestly though I do agree Exploud has such a small niche and is so predictable he will probably be RU. Im not entirely sure how well he even performs his niche too with his speed being so rubbish.

 

[MagicMissingno]

I think Avalugg might fit here. He's got awesome attack, MONSTER physical bulk, Recover + Rapid Spin, and good coverage with Avalanche + EQ. The only problems that push him down to UU are the fact that he has the worst solo type in the game and he has next to no special defense.

 

[Magnemite]

I think Avalugg might fit here. He's got awesome attack, MONSTER physical bulk, Recover + Rapid Spin, and good coverage with Avalanche + EQ. The only problems that push him down to UU are the fact that he has the worst solo type in the game and he has next to no special defense.

What can Avalugg do to spinblockers? It's even slower than non Trick Room Cofagrigus, and its special defense is absolute crap, so ther'es no way it's ever getting past Cofagrigus, or any other UU spinblocker for that matter. It's also forced out by almost every single special attacker in the game, so its spinning opportunities will be infrequent. Not to mention, there's no good reason to run it over Donphan, Blastoise, Hitmontop, or a defog user. All of that combined with the fact that it has the worst defensive typing in the game gives little reason to justify using Avalugg in UU.

 

[Squishyfrog]

I'm not a really good competitive player, so it's not like my opinion matters and I may be all wrong with what I'm saying, but the way I see it Exploud is a better wallbreaker than Porygon-Z simply because Boomburst hits through subs and he has access to Scrappy, so even Ghosts can be hit hard. To add on to that, some Specs P-Z run Timid to outspeed things such as neutral base 100s, but Exploud can always run Modest because he doesn't care about outspeeding most things, considering he sits at a very poor base 68. He also has slightly better bulk than P-Z, for however much it matters.

So, at least in my opinion, Exploud will not replace Porygon-Z as a sweeper or revenge killer, but as a wallbreaker he has a certain niche over our favorite spaztastic cyber duck.

 

[fenyxofshadows]

I'm thinking Shuckle might rise from NU to UU this gen. It got a few new toys to play with, being the only bulky user of Sticky Web, getting a much better version of Wrap in Infestation, using Bulldoze to lower Speed to aid allies or force switches into his Stealth Rocks, being able to control opponents with the usual Taunt, Encore, Power Split, and other control moves, and the return of the better Rest mechanics.

Whether he or Galvantula are the prime users of Sticky Web in OU depends on how the meta plays (Shuckle would enjoy a bulky meta in general since he simply cannot be OHKOed, while Galvantula is a somewhat powerful suicide lead), but Galvantula seems much more popular, so Shuckle would be lower in usage and therefore UU.

 

[AOPSUser]

I'm thinking Shuckle might rise from NU to UU this gen. It got a few new toys to play with, being the only bulky user of Sticky Web, getting a much better version of Wrap in Infestation, using Bulldoze to lower Speed to aid allies or force switches into his Stealth Rocks, being able to control opponents with the usual Taunt, Encore, Power Split, and other control moves, and the return of the better Rest mechanics.

Whether he or Galvantula are the prime users of Sticky Web in OU depends on how the meta plays (Shuckle would enjoy a bulky meta in general since he simply cannot be OHKOed, while Galvantula is a somewhat powerful suicide lead), but Galvantula seems much more popular, so Shuckle would be lower in usage and therefore UU.

Shuckle is also completely outclassed by Dusclops (lol), is a giant "Taunt me" sign, is SR-weak, and Galvantula looks to be UU at this point in the meta. Sticky Web is something that requires that your whole team be able to use it or else it ends up being a wasted move and a wasted mon.

UU already has shit like Dusclops that shouldn't be UU. Please don't try to use Shuckle in UU.

 

[MagicMissingno]

Shuckle is also completely outclassed by Dusclops (lol)

Um, I don't think Dusclops gets SR or Sticky Web. Does outclassing something mean you do the same thing something else does only better?

 

[AOPSUser]

Um, I don't think Dusclops gets SR or Sticky Web. Does outclassing something mean you do the same thing something else does only better?

It's bulkier, does Infestation better, and there are better SRers in UU, and if Galvantula ends up UU, which is really likely considering the current OU meta, Shuckle will be overshadowed in everything.

Also I never said Dusclops is any good in UU.

And Sticky Web is not something you blindly throw out. It's not for every team. You have to build your team around Sticky Web. So Galvantula might be UU, or maybe not.

 

[ScraftyIsTheBest]

Shuckle is still terrible in general because it has absolutely no offensive presence whatsoever, so it's a massive sitting duck that doesn't do any form of damage to anything. It has no recovery, and it's terribly weak to hazards, Spikes+SR will make it die at a pretty moderate pace. It's also not that bulky; 20 HP really undermines those amazing defenses, so it won't wall very well. Also, yes, Dusclops and Registeel are both notably bulkier than Shuckle, not to mention both weren't very good in last gen's UU.

So yeah, Shuckle still has those bad flaws, so now you must ask yourself if Sticky Web is enough to justify its use (it's not). It's still bottom PU material.

 

[jamashawalker]

UU is gonna be a mega infested meta game. Playing OU, I'm finding talonflame is making a lot of pokemon non viable. We're gonna see a huge power creep from previous powerhouses drop down. Hydreigon anyone?. Also rapid spinning is dead lol no need to rapid spin when defog is available

 

[MagicMissingno]

rapid spinning is dead lol no need to rapid spin when defog is available

Uh, not if you want to keep your own hazards on the field. Not to mention defog doesn't have the best distribution around so Rapid Spin still has a place.

 

[jamashawalker]

Actually once poke bank gets released we will have a variety of defog users. The defog users completely outclass rapid spinners by having more than one function than just being a spinner. And in terms of keeping your own hazards it'll be too easy for your opponent with their own defog user. OU is as defensive as this meta game is gonna get, with talonflame keeping the offensive ones in check. Hence sending them down to UU

 

[Velits]

If I would use a Pokemon with Defog I would not use any hazards. I rather opens up a few slots for more coverage or other support moves. I've never been fond of laying down hazards but always felt it was a must.

 

[Magnemite]

Actually once poke bank gets released we will have a variety of defog users. The defog users completely outclass rapid spinners by having more than one function than just being a spinner. And in terms of keeping your own hazards it'll be too easy for your opponent with their own defog user. OU is as defensive as this meta game is gonna get, with talonflame keeping the offensive ones in check. Hence sending them down to UU

List of UU viable Pokemon that get Defog:
Mandibuzz
Crobat
Venomoth (Which doesn't have room for Defog in its moveset anyway)
Flygon (Usually choiced)
Yanmega (lol good luck removing SR with this thing)
Empoleon
Aerodactyl (Could work alongside SR, would be a bit pressed for moveslots though)
Honchcrow (doesn't have the bulk or Speed to use Defog consistently, and has much better things to be doing)
Gligar
Xatu
Zapdos
Mew

Of all of these, I think only Crobat, Mandibuzz, Gligar, Xatu, Zapdos, Mew, Empoleon, and maybe Flygon make good Defog users.

Meanwhile, for Spinners you have the massively buffed Blastoise and the now UU Donphan, plus Hitmontop if you really want to still use it for whatever reason. I'd say they're about even in terms of viablility, depending on your team archetype. Obviously, if you have Froslass or something you wouldn't use Defog instead of Rapid Spin, but bulkier hazard setters such as Qwilfish or Roserade pair nicely with it.

Also, any mentions of Pokebank vs non-Pokebank in this thread are pointless since XY UU won't be formed or even playable until after Pokebank is released.

 

[jamashawalker]

List of UU viable Pokemon that get Defog:
Mandibuzz
Crobat
Venomoth (Which doesn't have room for Defog in its moveset anyway)
Flygon (Usually choiced)
Yanmega (lol good luck removing SR with this thing)
Empoleon
Aerodactyl (Could work alongside SR, would be a bit pressed for moveslots though)
Honchcrow (doesn't have the bulk or Speed to use Defog consistently, and has much better things to be doing)
Gligar
Xatu
Zapdos
Mew

Of all of these, I think only Crobat, Mandibuzz, Gligar, Xatu, Zapdos, Mew, Empoleon, and maybe Flygon make good Defog users.

Meanwhile, for Spinners you have the massively buffed Blastoise and the now UU Donphan, plus Hitmontop if you really want to still use it for whatever reason. I'd say they're about even in terms of viablility, depending on your team archetype. Obviously, if you have Froslass or something you wouldn't use Defog instead of Rapid Spin, but bulkier hazard setters such as Qwilfish or Roserade pair nicely with it.

Also, any mentions of Pokebank or non-Pokebank in this thread are pointless since XY UU won't be formed or even playable until after Pokebank is released.

Wait that's a condradiction to this thread then. This thread is meant to talk about the state of gen vi UU. Anyways to address the rapid spinners.

Blastoise: it's "buff" is more of a liability. No leftovers hurt it tremendously from experience. Im on the fence of blastoise's power as well. A max sp atk hits hard but then it loses a lot of bulk. It's a tough Pokemon to keep alive and have it rapid spin. Also thanks to roserades new buff!! It now has more of a reason to switch into blastoise.

Donphan: it was the premier rapid spinner before it moved up but this meta game might just be too powerful for Donphan to do its job. At least it has leftover recovery. Which again is huge for a Pokemon that needs to keep switching into hazards

Hitmintop: HA he was our last resort rapid spinner because we ran low on good ones. He wasn't the worse we had. His biggest problem was that he allowed way too many Pokemon switch in on him. This meta game he will indefinitely be replaced by other spinners and defog users

Also that's a large list of defog users who have a huge advantage because of their ability to consistently switch into threats even while being SR weak. IE fighting types which dominated last UU gen. Highly doubt we will see any difference in terms of offensive presence. Megas dropping down and all.


Overall I'm looking at the meta game as a whole. And not just short term. By examining what will potentially drop down/won't be viable in OU. I'm happy to see Toxicroak drop down! Just personal even if it'll be RU or NU lol

 

[Magnemite]

Wait that's a condradiction to this thread then. This thread is meant to talk about the state of gen vi UU. Anyways to address the rapid spinners.

Blastoise: it's "buff" is more of a liability. No leftovers hurt it tremendously from experience. Im on the fence of blastoise's power as well. A max sp atk hits hard but then it loses a lot of bulk. It's a tough Pokemon to keep alive and have it rapid spin. Also thanks to roserades new buff!! It now has more of a reason to switch into blastoise.

Donphan: it was the premier rapid spinner before it moved up but this meta game might just be too powerful for Donphan to do its job. At least it has leftover recovery. Which again is huge for a Pokemon that needs to keep switching into hazards

Hitmintop: HA he was our last resort rapid spinner because we ran low on good ones. He wasn't the worse we had. His biggest problem was that he allowed way too many Pokemon switch in on him. This meta game he will indefinitely be replaced by other spinners and defog users

Also that's a large list of defog users who have a huge advantage because of their ability to consistently switch into threats even while being SR weak. IE fighting types which dominated last UU gen. Highly doubt we will see any difference in terms of offensive presence. Megas dropping down and all.


Overall I'm looking at the meta game as a whole. And not just short term. By examining what will potentially drop down/won't be viable in OU. I'm happy to see Toxicroak drop down! Just personal even if it'll be RU or NU lol

No, I meant that "non-Pokebank UU" won't ever be a thing, so there's no need to mention the distinction. I guess I could have been more clear on that.

Anyway, the main buff of Mega Blastoise IMO is Mega Launcher Dark Pulse, which allows it to actually beat spinblockers now. That more than makes up for the loss of lefties.

I think the best UU Defog users will be Gligar, Crobat, Mew, and Mandibuzz. Though they may get a bit of 4MSS (especially Mew, lol), they certainly have the bulk and general usefulness in terms of utility to clear hazards multiple times per match and find their way onto many teams, particularly more balanced ones.

I've been wondering about the impact of Defog on Froslass. It still has that fast Taunt to prevent Defog and hold onto its niche as the game's only Spiker that can spinblock (and kind of fog-block with taunt?) for itself. Will it still be broken in Gen VI UU? It's really hard to say at this point.

 

[RufflesPro]

Mandibuzz is the best Defogger of those you mention IMO, due to STAB 97 BP (who doesn't out an item?) Knock Off + Very good bulk + Defog + Roost (gligor is the same but doesn't have Knock Off IMO and if it does, it won't get STAB) + Foul Play.

 

[MagicMissingno]

Ninetails might drop this gen. Drought no longer brings endless sun so people might start running Sunny Day, and even if they use a Droughter there's Charizard Y who beats in in everything but Speed (tie) and Stealth Rocks weakness. I'm not saying it will drop, I'm just saying there's a chance it will be in UU.

 

[Professor Birch]

I haven't really been looking at all but, one pokemon that comes to mind is Zygarde. Not that great typing, meh base stats. I am actually betting on it going to RU but I can see it become UU due to Dragon Dance and Extremespeed, the only things that really make him worth using.

 

[Squishyfrog]

You really undersell Zygarde, because he has more to him than just DD and ESpeed - Dragon/Ground is a great typing both defensively and offensively, he has better physical and special bulk than Hippowdon, and decent offensive stats which can be boosted with the aforementioned Dragon Dance as well as Coil. Combine all of that with access to ESpeed and you have a very diverse and interesting Dragon unlike we've ever seen, one that is not outclassed by anything else but seemingly doesn't fill any predetermined niche.

Now it's very hard to say anything in these beginning stages of the metagame, but the only reason I can see for him to end up in UU is that people won't use him because they'll take one look at him and say "inferior Garchomp", or go a little more in-depth and say "if I want a bulky Dragon to set up with I'll use Dragonite who has Multiscale and a much better movepool", without realizing that Zygarde isn't trying to do what Garchomp does at all(and is therefore not outclassed by him), and he has certain qualities that set him apart from DNite(Coil, electricity immunity and resistance to SR come to mind). I won't say whether or not he will drop to UU or if he's too strong for it or anything, but I just can't see him ending up in RU in the slightest.

 

[noknuckles]

I'm thinking Ninetales will drop, but I've seen a few sun teams (that use CharY AND Ninetales). The few sun teams I've run into run both CharY and Ninetales, but a lot of players run a non-weather team with CharY, and basically CharY sets up sun for itself without having the rest of the team abuse it. Makes sense as it lasts for what, 4 turns?

Blastoise is gonna be an excellent spinner. Last gen it was near the top in usage (many people felt undeservedly) and it had trouble getting passed Cofag. This gen, Cofag is gonna see a decrease since it relied quite a lot on the HP Fighting coverage, and ALSO M Blastoise has a way around it now. Also, we may see some ghosts join us in UU (one of the grasses? Imagine something like Jellicent coming down...) which may end up replacing Cofag as the most competent spin blockers but M Blastoise doesn't care about that.

Froslass is gonna be fine in UU. Last gen, it was just really annoying because spin blockers (I don't consider Chandelure a spin blocker, it has terrible switch in opportunities against every spinner) could just stay in on spinners all day long, so the "guaranteed 2 layers" that suicide Lass can set down would basically never ever leave the field. Suicide Lass is gonna be so much worse with Defog, and I think Bulky Lasses will actually need to be played intelligently

I've been using Rose in OU and I believe spikes is still really good. It's harder to use now because it's so much easier to blow away, but it's still not that hard to gain an advantage with them. I think that if you go with a spiker this gen, you should stay 1 hazard "ahead" of your opponent, try to identify their defogger and predict when they wanna come in. Force them to make a decision: either I defog and something nasty happens to my defogger, or i switch out of this horrible matchup but spikes remain on the field. For example, if I've already put something to sleep, Skarm has a free switch in to Rose. If Rose is on the field trying to say.... hit Togekiss with a SE hit, Skarm is gonna feel very comfy switching in. I know he wants spikes off the field, I suspect Skarm is his defogger so I'll switch into Heatran. He now has to decide between blowing away spikes while taking a Fire Blast, or switching in a resist, but continue to take spikes damage.

I see some people overblowing how dead spikes are. Yeah, spikes takes more intelligence to play now, but it's hardly dead. If you stay 1 hazard ahead, it means both players have "used up" the same number of turns on hazard related moves. But, having a spike advantage puts heavy pressure on your opponent to blow them away and you can use that one defog turn to do something really brutal

 

[hichez]

You really undersell Zygarde, because he has more to him than just DD and ESpeed - Dragon/Ground is a great typing both defensively and offensively, he has better physical and special bulk than Hippowdon, and decent offensive stats which can be boosted with the aforementioned Dragon Dance as well as Coil. Combine all of that with access to ESpeed and you have a very diverse and interesting Dragon unlike we've ever seen, one that is not outclassed by anything else but seemingly doesn't fill any predetermined niche.

Now it's very hard to say anything in these beginning stages of the metagame, but the only reason I can see for him to end up in UU is that people won't use him because they'll take one look at him and say "inferior Garchomp", or go a little more in-depth and say "if I want a bulky Dragon to set up with I'll use Dragonite who has Multiscale and a much better movepool", without realizing that Zygarde isn't trying to do what Garchomp does at all(and is therefore not outclassed by him), and he has certain qualities that set him apart from DNite(Coil, electricity immunity and resistance to SR come to mind). I won't say whether or not he will drop to UU or if he's too strong for it or anything, but I just can't see him ending up in RU in the slightest.

zygarde in Uu would be like kyurem in uu/limbo. It is just too powerful for uu.