Other OverUsed General Discussion

[alexwolf]

That's good advice. However, I believe you misunderstood my meaning- I was referring to how many people cannot switch into my own Aegislash, not asking how to counter it. I found such a thing odd, as with Aegis being as hyped as it is I was expecting more people to have some sort of preparation for it. I'm only in the 1800s on Showdown though, so perhaps I shouldn't be expecting perfect teams.

Any thoughts on Jirachi and Terrakion? Have they lost too much in the gen transition to be viable, or is the "New Toy Syndrome" still here after several months?

Terrakion is still a great Pokemon. While its wallbreaking and sweeping potential has been decreased due to the introudction of Aegislash and Azumarill (as well as other things), it's STAB combo is still very good, allowining to force many switches and find many oportunities to set up SR. With Taunt + dual STABs, you can prevent every single Defog and Rapid Spin user from getting rid of Stealth Rock, which is obviously a big advantage on itself. Also, the ability to act as a pretty good check to Genesect (as well as other Pokemon, such as Mega Charizard X and Y, BU Talonflame, Heatran, and even Kyurem-B) with some bulk + Leftovers is something that every single offensive team appreciates. Just put it on a team that discourages choiced Iron Head spamming and you are good.

All and all, SR + Lefties Terrakion is a great set in this meta and one of my constant picks on offensive teams. It does so many things (SR setter and protecter, check to dangerous offensive Pokemon, respectable offensive threat) and it does them all very well.

 

[Maestro Arena]

I'm surprised that m-t-tar usage is rather low. One of the best ou pokemon of last gen got a mega with 700 BST and no one is using it. Since no one is using suicide leads because of defog m-tyranitar seems like a perfect rock setter that go to town on psychic and ghosts with pursuit

I am surprised too and I agree. I mean, after just only one Dragon Dance this thing is almost untouchable and destroys almost the entire metagame. Still, nobody uses Mega-Tyranitar.

 

[Pyritie]

I am surprised too and I agree. I mean, after just only one Dragon Dance this thing is almost untouchable and destroys almost the entire metagame. Still, nobody uses Mega-Tyranitar.

I have one on my mono-dark team I made for a 3v3s mono tournament on another website, and it's probably my MVP. It's kinda like a jack-of-all-trades of the other jobs ttar can do: it's not as specially defensive as AV ttar but still better than a non-SpD one, it's not as fast as scarftar but faster than its base form, it's not as strong as banded/LO ttar but stronger than a normal ttar without them, and so on.

 

[NotBruceWayne]

I have one on my mono-dark team I made for a 3v3s mono tournament on another website, and it's probably my MVP. It's kinda like a jack-of-all-trades of the other jobs ttar can do: it's not as specially defensive as AV ttar but still better than a non-SpD one, it's not as fast as scarftar but faster than its base form, it's not as strong as banded/LO ttar but stronger than a normal ttar without them, and so on.

I agree with Mega Tyranitar being underrated. It's the only weather inducer not crippled by the weather nerf. Also, can I ask if a Sub-DD Mega Tyranitar is viable?

 

[aVocado]

I'm also surprised, I guess people just don't know how strong it is by looking at it's 100/100/100/100/100/100 stat.. bulky RainRest is fucking amazingly powerful. It 2HKOs Blissey and pretty much OHKOs everything else not called Kyu-b, chansey, or specially defensive megasaur. I used a 252 HP/104+ SpA/152 Spe spread, it outspeeds smeargle (i know, i tailor-made this spread to fit my team, you can change if you want), with 252 HP and the rest dumped into SpA. Modest for maximum power. Moveset was Rain/Rest/Surf/Tail Glow.

 

[effyouzion]

I am surprised too and I agree. I mean, after just only one Dragon Dance this thing is almost untouchable and destroys almost the entire metagame. Still, nobody uses Mega-Tyranitar.

He's too easily checked by bulky Lando-T and in a pinch can be burned by Rotom. Mega Gyarados is generally a better dancer because he can take out both those threats pretty easily. Both Ttar and Gyara have issues with Skarmory and getting revenge killed by Genesect though.

CharX tends to fit the meta better than both of these guys because he avoids the issues with Skarmory, Rotom and Gene, while also being able to brute force through Lando once he takes some chip damage.

 

[Jet]

I'm surprised that m-t-tar usage is rather low. One of the best ou pokemon of last gen got a mega with 700 BST and no one is using it. Since no one is using suicide leads because of defog m-tyranitar seems like a perfect rock setter that go to town on psychic and ghosts with pursuit

When I was using it, AV Tyranitar took really good hits from nearly every special attacker that I sent it into. Greninja and other special attackers could hardly touch it when sand was up. Mega Tyranitar might have better defense, but I almost never leave it out if it's a physical attacker anyway. Although, I could see Mega Tyranitar usage catching on after everything is settled. I just hate the idea of having to give up using Mega Mawile.

 

[PrincessDerpy]

He's too easily checked by bulky Lando-T

Beware the 4th moveslot, as that determines what exactly checks Mega TTar.

 

[FlyThai]

Anyone else feel as though the king of OU, Talonflame, has fallen?

I havent faced nearly as much as I used to. And when i have it has been easily dispatched. In my last 10 OU matches I probably faced Talon probably once or twice. I feel as though its not nearly effective anymore now the shock value is gone

 

[November Blue]

Anyone else feel as though the king of OU, Talonflame, has fallen?

I havent faced nearly as much as I used to. And when i have it has been easily dispatched. In my last 10 OU matches I probably faced Talon probably once or twice. I feel as though its not nearly effective anymore now the shock value is gone

I disagree. People are just trying other things. The neophilia still hasn't worn off, IMO.

The hot hawk becomes more prevalent the further up the ladder you go, from what I've seen. It's easily dispatched because people are running checks for it - you have to. If anything, usage of Talonflame and its checks will ebb and flow alternately; nobody is using Talonflame, so nobody needs to run checks for it. Then, Talonflame becomes really good, so people start to run checks, ect.

Although, some Pokemon can check Talonflame while performing other useful roles, so this is kinda moot.

Regardless, Talonflame is the sort of Pokemon that will never fall out of use. It's just too useful, and nothing gives it competition for its niche.

 

[DestinyGallade]

When I was using it, AV Tyranitar took really good hits from nearly every special attacker that I sent it into. Greninja and other special attackers could hardly touch it when sand was up. Mega Tyranitar might have better defense, but I almost never leave it out if it's a physical attacker anyway. Although, I could see Mega Tyranitar usage catching on after everything is settled. I just hate the idea of having to give up using Mega Mawile.

av t tar cant set up rocks or d dance though

 

[Ajwf]

Talonflame right now is actually being used with a second flying type to set up a sweep. Right now, you have to be very careful to have checks to pinsir-m and TF separately or keep the checks/counters in good health. It is still pretty damn deadly, you just multiply the SR weakness.

 

[ShockNSholl]

trevenant is sorta a threat still can be dangerous if you're not prepared p.s. friend codes for friend safari pm me

 

[Jayceeblaster]

Hello all. It's been a while since I've battled. The last time I was on Showdown was probably May or June. Obviously I'm a little behind on what battling is like now. Would anybody be so kind as to give me a crash course in the major changes to the metagame that Gen 6 brought about? Just a list of "need-to-know" things is what I'm looking for, I guess.

 

[zachmac]

Hello all. It's been a while since I've battled. The last time I was on Showdown was probably May or June. Obviously I'm a little behind on what battling is like now. Would anybody be so kind as to give me a crash course in the major changes to the metagame that Gen 6 brought about? Just a list of "need-to-know" things is what I'm looking for, I guess.

The meta game has turned into a more bulky-offensive type, with status and bulky attackers like Aegislash running around everywhere. Even stall has become more bulky offense-ish with the Defog buff removing hazards without being blocked.

Dragons, as everyone expected, are not dominating the meta game anymore. So it's been much easier to manage the Outrage/Draco Meteor Spam that was everywhere in gen 5. That said, though, fairies are still rare enough that they aren't dominating for any reason other then the shiny toy syndrome. Now in days it's the ghost running around, since steel no longer resist their STAB, they've been improved offensively. Just keep in mind that Dragons aren't useless, just more manageable.

Priority is all over the place, providing more motivation to use more Bulky Offense and less Hyper Offense. The best examples are Aegislash, who has 150 base attack and STAB Shadow Sneak, and Talonflame, who's hidden ability means that Brave Bird will almost always move first.

Weather starting abilities aren't seen much outside of Tyranitar and Mega Charizard Y, since they've been nerfed to only last for 5 turns. The reason these two are so different is because they are good enough to use the weather for their own benefit rather then just for supporting teammates. So no more weather wars now.

 

[Fourth Inversion]

Not sure if this is everything, but this is what immediately comes to mind.

Fairy types have nerfed Dragons, but despite their great offensive and defensive typing, they aren't a staple on teams. Dragons are still more common (and powerful) than Fairy types, although some pokemon now run Poison or Steel coverage moves, where they wouldn't have in Gen 5.

Ghost types have received a large buff, with the changes to type effectiveness and the introduction of Aegislash.

Some former Gen-5 Ubers have been put back into OU, with Genesect being the most commonly used (and imo, the most dangerous).

Mega-Evolutions are found on the majority of teams. From team preview, you should be able to guess which pokemon will Mega-Evolve. You need to have a plan for both the offensive Mega-Evolutions, many of which carry boosting moves and/or priority, and Mega-Venusaur, which walls a lot of common pokemon.

The most notable new item is Assault Vest, and has become the most viable item on a few pokemon, notably Conkeldurr. Weakness Policy is only found on a handful of pokemon who have priority/a means of boosting their speed, including Aegislash, Dragonite and Tyranitar.

Buff to defog (removes all hazards from both sides). Stealth Rock is still seen on most teams, as there are some very dangerous new pokemon (including Charizard's Mega Evolutions and Talonflame) who are weak to it but Spikes and Toxic Spikes are fairly rare. Volt-turn is more common and SR helps with that too. Sticky Web is a new hazard that drops the speed of grounded pokemon by one stage, although thankfully it's only been given to relatively weak pokemon. Sticky Web is uncommon, but it can completely screw over teams without taunt/defog.

Knock off received a major damage buff (note that Mega-Stones can't be knocked off). Dark type pokemon will often carry it as their STAB move, and many other pokemon will use it for dark-type coverage.

Hidden Power's drop to 60 base power has made types other than Fire or Ice rare.

Grass types are immune to powder moves, including Spore, which makes the common Fire/Water/Grass core stronger.

Not every team will have a choice scarf user; instead most will pack some sort of priority. Extreme Speed is particularly useful as a means of checking Talonflame at low health. Although Talonflame isn't the best pokemon in OU, it's essential to have a pokemon on your team that can take a priority CB Adamant Brave Bird and hit back.

Despite the unbanning of swift swim/drizzle, rain teams are rare, and Mega Charizard Y is fairly common, but isn't necessarily paired with other sun abusers. Sand is the most common weather, as the weather setters and abusers are both extremely powerful. Hail did receive another weather inducer, and Mega Abomasnow, but with the shortened duration of weather, hail stall/blizzard spam aren't particularly viable.

 

[Photofluid]

ADD

Dark pokemon also see a spike of usage, defensive-wise due its ability to check ghost and offensive-wise due to it now gets pass steels. The buff of Knock off is another thing, and the most powerful priority move in the game is also a dark move. The framed dark type now are mandibuzz for its amazing bulk and fight-neutrality and Bisharp for its ability to "defog-block". The later combined with Deoxys-S is the sole reason spikes are still viable in this gen. However, as dark is weak against fairies, it is still less prevalent than ghost, but not to a point of being completely screwed like the dragons as fairies are immuned to it.

Also, due to the across the board nerf of special attack, and the fact that most priority moves are physical, the meta now is heavily inclined to the physical side. This combined with the Accuracy buff of WoW means that burn is "the" status to induce, as it cripples physical users, the most reliable user now is Rotom-W. Paralyse still cripples sweepers like how it was but is now immuned by electric-type.

For this reason, status absorbers and clerics are more common these days. And as a side effect that may not be easily notice on poke outside aegislash, there are a whole lot more contact move used in this generation, this is why we are starting to see people using things like mummy cofagrigus, physical defensive Vocanloran, etc. As they all packs the ability to screw contact move users with statuses, the king's shield of Aegislash even cut their Attack half directly.

Anyway, weather teams are basically dead in this generation, sand casters are ridiculously powerful on it own so they survives. Hail casters are however buffed instead as you can pack more non-ice pokemon into the team now, and Abomasnow still spams its Blizzard like how it was. The new hail caster is better off with another ability though.

On the other hand, due to Mega being significantly more important, healing wish users are seeing more usage. The most powerful user is Latias, which also gets defog to clean the field as well.

Oh, another thing you must not forget is that you always need a Talonflame solution or it would easily sweep your entire team.

 

[Colonial]

Hello all. It's been a while since I've battled. The last time I was on Showdown was probably May or June. Obviously I'm a little behind on what battling is like now. Would anybody be so kind as to give me a crash course in the major changes to the metagame that Gen 6 brought about? Just a list of "need-to-know" things is what I'm looking for, I guess.

Since zachmac, Fourth Inversion, and Photofluid have already given pretty good overviews of the metagame on the whole (weather nerf, type changes, etc), I'll give you some "brief" descriptions of the most threatening new Pokémon from Gen 6.

First off, the possessed sword Aegislash. The others have mentioned this guy quite a bit. He's a Steel/Ghost type. Steel typing no longer resists Ghost and Dark this gen, so he's weak to Fire, Ground, Dark, and Ghost. Aegislash's gimmick is in his ability, Stance Change. This ability essentially allows Aegis to switch from Deoxys-Defense to Deoxys-Attack, depending on what move he uses. In defense forme, Aegis has base 150 in both defenses. He enters battle in this forme and can re-enter it while out if he uses "King's Shield", a version of protect that doesn't protect you from status moves but will halve your opponent's Attack if they use a contact move on the same turn. Aegis enters Attack forme just by using an attacking move. In Attack forme, Aegis has base 150 in both offenses, but base 50 defenses. He will always have base 60 HP and Speed, though. Nowadays, Aegis acts as a wallbreaker/nuke, switching in with his huge defenses and using Shadow Ball off a max-invested 150 SpAtk, with an offensive typing (Ghost) that is only resisted by dark and Normal with the Steel nerf. Typically, Aegislash's Shadow Ball will either kill the target outright, or deal a ton of damage to them and potentially put them into KO range for STAB Shadow Sneak. Aegislash is known for the mindgames he creates with King's Shield, where people have to guess whether or not Aegis will use it.

Next, the Flying/Fire Type peregrine falcon Talonflame. Talon has only one good stat: his 126 base speed. His Attack is only 81 and his Special Attack is even lower. However, with his ability Gale Wings, all Flying Type moves- Brave Bird, Roost, Tailwind- get +1 Priority. This means that Talon can invest completely in Attack with some in bulk, making his stats deceptive. Not to mention the very high Base Power of his 2 main attacks, Flare Blitz and Brave Bird, which further negate his low stats. More importantly, that Priority Brave Bird makes Talonflame the ultimate revenge killer, capable of doing astounding amounts of damage to common sweepers, especially with a Choice Band. Talonflame can also serve as a sweeper in a pinch (though revenge killing is his specialty) with Swords Dance, which instantly negates his low attack and allows him to KO most of the metagame while being unable to be revenge killed by a scarfer or slower priority user. A +2 Talonflame is a very scary thing to face. Talonflame is arguably part of the reason why many believe Gen 6 will end up a bulkier metagame- since you can't outspeed Talonflame, your sweepers need to be bulky enough to live a Brave Bird even with prior damage.

Finally, ninja frog Greninja. I haven't used this guy much, but I know what he does. Greninja is the new water starter. Much like Talonflame, he's fast (122 base speed) but doesn't hit too hard with around base 103 SpAtk. Greninja's ability, Protean, is what makes him threatening- Protean changes Gren's type to whatever move he uses before he uses them, essentially giving him STAB on every attack, so he does a lot more damage than base 103 would imply. With a Life Orb attached, he's doing around 80% more with every attack. Greninja is most famous for his ability to OHKO Multiscale Dragonite through Multiscale. Greninja has a great movepool and can make good use of Hidden Power with the STAB boost, so you can never really know what he has in store for you- or even if he's the common specially attacking variant at all! He has decent Attack as well, and a good physical attacking movepool with stuff like Shadow Sneak and Acrobatics. Greninja is most often used as a scout with U-Turn and late game cleaner. Many people have been calling this guy overhyped, something I don't really disagree with, but he's still pretty strong.

Note: If any of those descriptions are wrong/contain incorrect information, feel free to point out my stupidity.

 

[November Blue]

Hello all. It's been a while since I've battled. The last time I was on Showdown was probably May or June. Obviously I'm a little behind on what battling is like now. Would anybody be so kind as to give me a crash course in the major changes to the metagame that Gen 6 brought about? Just a list of "need-to-know" things is what I'm looking for, I guess.

There are a few Pokemon that you need answers for, otherwise they can destroy half of your team. The main ones are Mega Lucario, Talonflame, Aegislash, Bisharp, Mega Venusaur, Mega Mawile, Mega Pinsir and Mega Charizard X and Y.

A Ghost and Dark resist is important, as is a Flying resist. Defog / Rapid Spin are useful, as is a cleric. Sylveon is one of the best (don't use Florges, it's outclassed).

Mega Lucario can be either Swords Dance or Nasty Plot. It's usually Close Combat, Crunch, and Extremespeed/Bullet Punch for physical, and any three of Aura Sphere, Flash Cannon, Dark Pulse, and Vacuum Wave for special. Lucario is scary because there's no way to tell which one it is until the opponent plays it, but you can wall it; it just depends on the moveset.

Talonflame has been discussed already, but there are other sets you should watch out for too. Choice Band isn't the best, IMO. Sky Plate + Roost is good, and gives Talonflame much greater longevity. Swords Dance + Acrobatics can be hell to wall, as Talonflame takes no recoil damage from its main STAB. Bulk Up sets are specially defensive, and surprisingly tanky.

Recently, Talonflame is also being paired with Reckless Scarf Staraptor for an offensive double-dragon style offensive core. Lots of people use Rotom-W or Tyranitar to wall Talonflame, but Staraptor destroys these two with Double-Edge and Close Combat.

Bisharp is "the face of hyper offense" and hazard lead Deoxys-S' partner in crime. Defog lowers the opponent's evasiveness, which activates Bisharp's Defiant ability and gives it a free +2 Attack boost. STAB Sucker Punch, Iron Head, and Knock Off is not fun to deal with.

Knock Off was increased to 65 Base Power. The move's power is boosted by 1.5 when it knocks off an item. You'll see stuff like Assault Vest Conkeldurr making good use of this move.

Mega Venusaur is an incredibly potent tank. Its stats are 80 HP / 100 Attack / 120 Def / 123 SpA / 122 SpDef / 80 Speed. It's fast, incredibly bulky, and has great offensive stats. Giga Drain, Synthesis, and Leech Seed give it plentiful recovery, and Sludge Bomb is a great STAB for Fairies. It can also run EQ for Heatran, or Knock Off. The real kicker is Thick Fat though. MegaSaur is only weak to Flying and Psychic, and has plenty of useful resistances. Used correctly, MegaSaur is incredibly difficult to budge and some say that it's the only thing keeping Stall viable in this metagame.

Mega Mawile has base 105 Attack with Huge Power, which gives it the highest Attack stat in the game, surpassing even Choice Band Azumarill. Steel/Fairy is an excellent defensive typing, and Mawile is a slow, bulky tank that can be extremely difficult to play around. All Mawiles will have Play Rough and Sucker Punch, but the other two moves vary. Some run Swords Dance with Iron Head or Fire Fang. Some run SubSD, or SubSplit. Don't let it set up, because a +2 Sucker Punch OHKOs a frightening number of Pokemon.

Entry Hazards are slightly less prevalent this gen, mainly because of Defog; Spikes aren't worth the turns they take when the opponent can just use Defog, which can't be spinblocked. Stealth Rock and Defog are everywhere because of huge influx of SR weak mons that are worth the use and support. Main examples are Talonflame, Charizard, and Mega Pinsir.

 

[Weedong]

This is an extremely offensive meta we're in. There are high threats such as Talonflame, Aegislash, Greninja, and Mega Mawile running around and it seems that running defense nearly impossible this gen, due to the Defog buff and nerf to weather. However there is one mega I feel can be used really well defensively and offensively..

Mega Venasaur. This thing is incredible. Base 123 def and base 120 sp def makes Megasaur a tough zit to pop, and base 122 sp atk is nothing to mess around with. Thick Fat is the best thing about it though, making it only weak to flying and psychic. I'd say it's up there with some other really strong megas such as Mega Mawile and Mega Charizard X (maybe even Y).

Hell, I believe all the megas excluding Mega Banette (outclassed by sableye) can be used in OU effectively.

One mega who people seem to just shrug off is MegaCross. They say that Guts Heracross does it's job better, but I believe otherwise. People don't seem to want to make use of its ability Skill Link, which baffles me because there was already a really good Skill Link user in OU last gen. A good moveset I saw on youtube for MegaCross was Substitute/Focus Punch/Pin Missile/Bullet seed. Pin Missile is actually stronger than Megahorn and more accurate too.

Overall, so far I like this meta. I just don't like how a lot of defensive pokemon this gen aren't nearly as useful as they used to be like Ferrothorn, especially because of the defensive nerf to Steel types. I also don't like the amount of Rotom-Ws going around but it's a great counter to the ever so popular Talonflame, so I guess I can't complain.

 

[Colonial]

This is an extremely offensive meta we're in. There are high threats such as Talonflame, Aegislash, Greninja, and Mega Mawile running around and it seems that running defense nearly impossible this gen, due to the Defog buff and nerf to weather. However there is one mega I feel can be used really well defensively and offensively..

Mega Venasaur. This thing is incredible. Base 123 def and base 120 sp def makes Megasaur a tough zit to pop, and base 122 sp atk is nothing to mess around with. Thick Fat is the best thing about it though, making it only weak to flying and psychic. I'd say it's up there with some other really strong megas such as Mega Mawile and Mega Charizard X (maybe even Y).

Hell, I believe all the megas excluding Mega Banette (outclassed by sableye) can be used in OU effectively.

One mega who people seem to just shrug off is MegaCross. They say that Guts Heracross does it's job better, but I believe otherwise. People don't seem to want to make use of its ability Skill Link, which baffles me because there was already a really good Skill Link user in OU last gen. A good moveset I saw on youtube for MegaCross was Substitute/Focus Punch/Pin Missile/Bullet seed. Pin Missile is actually stronger than Megahorn and more accurate too.

Overall, so far I like this meta. I just don't like how a lot of defensive pokemon this gen aren't nearly as useful as they used to be like Ferrothorn, especially because of the defensive nerf to Steel types. I also don't like the amount of Rotom-Ws going around but it's a great counter to the ever so popular Talonflame, so I guess I can't complain.

Every meta begins super offensively. It's easier to just nuke something new to the metagame than stick around to see what sort of tricks it might have up it's sleeve (which may screw up your stall team if it's carrying an unexpected move). Once things become more "standard" and sets are more predictable, defense will, I believe, become more viable.

 

[SHUCKLE MAN]

Every meta begins super offensively. It's easier to just nuke something new to the metagame than stick around to see what sort of tricks it might have up it's sleeve (which may screw up your stall team if it's carrying an unexpected move). Once things become more "standard" and sets are more predictable, defense will, I believe, become more viable.

Not every metagame was like this. Generation IV OU started more defensively at first but was a lot more offensive by the end of the generation.

However, I agree with you that defensive play will become more common.

 

[Nysyr]

As I see it there are two successful HO type teams that are running around atm. Fly-spam and Deo-sharp. They play very differently, especially in how they work vs stall.

Deo-sharp teams abuse Defiant Bisharp to the fullest by getting up 2 or more hazards, in order to pressure the opponent into defogging so that Bisharp can grab a boost and sweep.

Fly-spam teams are different, in that they try to avoid hazards on their side of the field at all cost while they grind down Flying resists by stacking threats such as Talonflame and M-Pinsir. Typically Fly-spam teams won't carry more than SR for hazards are aren't too worried about defogs getting rid of their hazards, instead its all about getting Pinsir and Talonflame in for free without taking hazard damage.

The only two pokemon common for the most part on all HO teams are Manaphy and an Electric type (such as Raikou or Thundy-I).

 

[Ajwf]

The reason for the success of the Flying HO teams is mainly because of the differing secondary attacks of the two pokemon and the fact that only Rotom-w will counter both Pinsir-m and TF. Rotom is not sufficient enough to take care of both targets and so the whole utility allocation for rotom-w as an all purpose wall gets overloaded.

Flying, being resisted only by steel/rock/electric has diversity in the fact that the secondary attack style of both TF and Pinsir take care of these types well (esp in Pinsir's case with EQ). Pinsir's only counters come in the form of levitating/flying steel/rock/elec types (Skarm, Rotom-w/h, Thundy-i is a check) while TF needs a fire resist (so rock types in general, heatran, again rotom-w). I'm not sure any other type can claim such perfect pressure via two attacks. And Pinsir/TF are FAST, too. Rock might be the only other type to pull this off (terrakion/Aerodactyl combo perhaps?)

 

[hobo bob]

Lately I have been noticing a rapid surge of M-Pinsir users, especially higher up on the ladder. It seems like people are figuring out that even unboosted Aerilate Return deals ridiculous amounts of damage. The SD set is so powerful because it gives you every tool you would possibly need to sweep: usable priority (quick attack), powerful STAB, and nearly unresisted coverage with EQ. If the Pinsir user can grab a boost, an action which isn't difficult with all the conkledurrs to set up on, then they can easily tear through a team just by spamming Return. Talonflame is a nice check, but cannot switch in directly to any STAB moves. The only viable counters to M-Pinsir are Skarmory, Zapdos, the Rotoms, and bulky Aegislash. However, Aegislash doesn't like taking repeated earthquakes and can't OHKO unless Pinsir has taken SR damage. Rotom can also be bypassed if Pinsir opts to stay in it's normal form and use Mold Breaker EQ. M-Pinsir truly is a devastating pokemon, quite frankly I am surprised I am not seeing more usage of it.