Gen 6 Victim of the Week - ORAS Edition (Week 14 - 3 Attacks Mewtwo-Mega-X)

[Jibaku]

Reserving Xerneas as a check

EDIT:

Xerneas @ Leftovers
Trait: Fairy Aura
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 whatever
Bold Nature
- Moonblast
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Aromatherapy

Stolen from edgar's RMT.

Jolly Mega Mence Aerilate Double Edge vs 248/252+ Xerneas: 45%-53%

Most of the time this won't 2HKO (if you're really scared about it Xerneas can run a Sitrus Berry to avoid it lol).

+1 Double Edge vs 248/252+ Xerneas: 68%-80%
Survives +1 DE after SR + Spikes after Lefties recovery.

Moonblast is guaranteed to OHKO Mence at full health.

Now there are better counters than this - Cress, Porygon2, Zapdos, and Skarmory come to mind, but I'm not going that deep so someone can take those ;).

 

[DSM01]

Mega Aggron (check)

Aggron @ Aggronite
Ability: Filter
EVs: 252 HP / 16 Def / 240 SpD
Impish Nature
- Counter / Metal Burst
- Avalanche / Dragon Tail
- Low Kick / Earthquake
- Toxic / Thunder Wave

Although rarely seen in Ubers (for a good reason), Mega Aggron can utilize its surprise factor to nab KOes on unsuspecting victims. Aggron can easily tank a +1 EQ from Mence and OHKO in return with Avalanche. Other physical powerhouses such as +0 Primal Don, +2 Jolly LO EKA, and CB Ho-Oh all deal less than 60% to this beast and Counter delivers a swift KO. Metal Burst can be used instead to bop support Arceus and unboosted Xern. Mega Aggron fits best on teams that need an unreliable answer to Latias.

0 Atk Filter Mega Aggron Avalanche vs. 0 HP/0 Def Aerilate Mega Salamence: 368 - 436 (111.2 - 131.7%)
+1 252 Atk Aerilate Mega Salamence Earthquake vs. 252 HP/16+ Def Filter Mega Aggron: 115 - 136 (33.4 - 39.5%)

 

[shrang]

I would just c/p Solrock from the Stall thread, but that would be boring.

Nominating Zapdos as a check:

Zapdos @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 Spe
Nature: Bold
- Thunder / Thunderbolt
- Hidden Power Ice
- Toxic / Roar / Defog
- Roost

Not exactly that viable for Ubers, but who cares about that anyway. Like WreckDra said, this is called using a burd to check a fake burd. Zapdos resists both moves Mence's moves, and unlike Bronzong and Skarm, Zapdos has some offensive presence. It can "sort of" check Ray as well. In terms of utility, it has Defog, although you might want Toxic so you're not total P Donner bait.

Calcs:
HP Ice vs 0/0 Mence: 68.88% - 82.18% (Weak as shit, but whatevs, you're still winning)
+1 Double Edge vs 248/252+ Zapdos: 43.08% - 50.91%

 

[smlj]

Nominating the Frozen God as a check.

Ice Arceus @Icicle Plate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SAtk
Bold Nature
- Judgment
- Will-o-wisp / Toxic
- Recover
- Perish Song / Toxic / Defog

Not used often in Ubers for good reason, seeing how it is outclassed by other formes and is weak to stealth rocks. Could switch into Mega Mence with ease and OHKO it instantly with Judgment. Judgment is pretty much all you need to destroy Mega-Mence, other viable moves are listed to make a set.

0 SpA Icicle Plate Arceus-Ice Judgment vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Salamence: 660-780 (199.3 - 235.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252 Atk Aerilate Mega Salamence Double-Edge vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Arceus-Ice: 177-208 (39.9 - 46.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252 Atk Aerilate Mega Salamence Double-Edge vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Arceus-Ice: 177-208 (39.9 - 46.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
+1 252 Atk Aerilate Mega Salamence Double-Edge vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Arceus-Ice: 262-310 (59.1 - 69.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

Without rocks and boosts, Mega Mence can only 3HKO Arceus whereas He can smash it apart instantly.

 

[Gravity Wisp]

Nominating Mega Salamence as a check

Salamence @ Salamencite
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 88 HP / 168 Atk / 252 Def
Adamant Nature
- Outrage
- Dragon Dance
- Double-Edge
- Roost

Bring this in as the opposing Mence sets up, uses EQ, or Roosts. Outrage always OHKOs offensive variants.

168+ Atk Salamence Outrage vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Salamence: 354-416 (106.9 - 125.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Meanwhile, victim Mence fails to even 2HKO if they didn't set up as you switch in. If they did set up, you survive the hit comfortably, and if they already have a +1 and decide to Dragon Dance again when you switch in, you can still survive the hit without rocks.

-1 252 Atk Aerilate Salamence Double-Edge vs. 88 HP / 252 Def Salamence: 121-144 (34.2 - 40.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 Atk Aerilate Salamence Double-Edge vs. 88 HP / 252 Def Salamence: 181-214 (51.2 - 60.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+1 252 Atk Aerilate Salamence Double-Edge vs. 88 HP / 252 Def Salamence: 271-321 (76.7 - 90.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

The other non-Outrage moves seek to make this set otherwise viable as a bulky setup sweeper, not just a counter to one set on one mon. On that note, while Outrage does have the drawback of giving Fairies and Steels free switch ins, Ground spam is extremely common this gen, and Xern checks/counters have been necessary on Ubers teams for a long while now.

This set also checks most other common Salamence sets, including defensive and substitute sets.

168+ Atk Salamence Outrage vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Salamence: 266-314 (67.5 - 79.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Outdamages Roost by a large margin. As for the sub set, Outrage always breaks the sub, and after that, you're faced with the exact same situation as if you switched in to a simple Dragon Dance set. This set can beat adamant DD sets as well.

-1 252+ Atk Aerilate Salamence Double-Edge vs. 88 HP / 252 Def Salamence: 133-157 (37.6 - 44.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252+ Atk Aerilate Salamence Double-Edge vs. 88 HP / 252 Def Salamence: 199-235 (56.3 - 66.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+1 252+ Atk Aerilate Salamence Double-Edge vs. 88 HP / 252 Def Salamence: 298-352 (84.4 - 99.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

One important thing to note is that this set is destroyed by special Mega Mence, as even uninvested, neutral natured Draco Meteor OHKOs you.

0 SpA Salamence Draco Meteor vs. 88 HP / 0 SpD Salamence: 356-422 (100.8 - 119.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO

 

[Gravity Wisp]

Did the death of this thread have something to do with my post?

 

[yohoE]

Week 4: An old friend who has come back; Calm Mind Latios!

Latios (M) @ Soul Dew
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Calm Mind
- Draco Meteor
- Psyshock
- Roost​

 

[zf]

Reserving Arceus-Dark rn

Arceus-Dark @ Dread Plate
Ability: Multitype
EVs: 248 HP / 84 SpD / 176 Spe
Timid Nature
- Judgment
- Calm Mind
- Refresh
- Recover

Arceus-Dark is one of the best CM Latios counters. It can tank Draco Meteors with SR up relatively easily and is one of the few Arc formes that wins the CM war thanks to an immunity to Psyshock.

I'll make this description better later, but I have to go right now.

 

[Jibaku]

Alright time to go smth p. obvious this time. Latios has a pretty decent # of checks. But this one, is a counter.

SCIZOR

Scizor @ Scizorite
Ability: Technician
EVs: 248 HP / 28 Atk / 232 SpD
Careful Nature
- Bullet Punch
- Roost
- Pursuit
- U-turn

Scizor should be able to come in on Latios effectively - Soul Dew Draco Meteor deals <50% maximum to base Scizor, allowing it to simply Roost off the damage, while Pursuit will be guaranteed a 2HKO on a nonswitching Latios.

The EVs guarantee a checkmate onto Latios with Pursuit even if it plays perfectly, barring crits. As I am nominating Scizor as a counter, this scenario involves Scizor switching in, and thus Latios will have a free turn. Mega Scizor should be able to survive a combined +1 DM and -1 DM after Stealth Rock damage, and will survive +1 Psyshock followed by +1 Draco Meteor from full health.

For more specifics on the calc:
+1 Soul Dew Draco Meteor: 51%-60%
+1 Soul Dew Psyshock: 32%-38%
-1 Soul Dew Draco Meteor: 23%-27%
Combined Maximum Damage of +1 Psyshock and +1 Draco Meteor: 98%
Combined Maximum Damage of +1 Draco Meteor and -1 Draco Meteor: 87%

Pursuit deals just a bit above 50% minimum.

 

[Level 56]

Yveltal @ Assault Vest
Ability: Dark Aura
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Sucker Punch
- Knock Off
- Acrobatics
- U-turn

Assault vest yveltal is a VERY solid check to latios. With these evs + assault vest, draco meteor barely do 40% to yveltal and yveltal can ohko it with both sucker punch and knock off. The other two moves in yveltal's moveset are not required.

 

[haxiom]

I'll reserve tyranitar I guess

 

[jackm]

Jirachi @ Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Iron Head
- Thunder Wave
- U-turn
- Wish

This thing, while overall not being that great (Groudon-Primal eats it for breakfast, but that's not the focus here) provides a fantastic counter to Latios. It takes Psyshocks with ease and Draco Meteor can't 2HKO until Latios gets to +3, which it cannot with pressure.

252 SpA Choice Specs Latios Draco Meteor vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Jirachi: 114-135 (28.2 - 33.4%) -- 95.4% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery

+2 252 SpA Choice Specs Latios Draco Meteor vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Jirachi: 229-270 (56.8 - 66.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

+3 252 SpA Soul Dew Latios Draco Meteor vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Jirachi: 285-336 (70.7 - 83.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Meanwhile, Jirachi can switch it, use Thunder Wave, and start flinching with Iron Head for the 3HKO. Bear in mind that even if Iron Head fails to flinch/fully paralyze in its first 2 turns of use (a 9% chance) Latios will still not be able to KO and will be forced to Roost, leading to a flinch war that Jirachi is statistically certain to win. Wish and U-turn are for general utility against Lat, but U-turn is interchangeable with Protect if you don't trust Iron Head/Thunder Wave to protect you.

 

[TFL]

-

Bisharp
- Counter
- Not really viable, but is still the hardest of counters. Latios can't even touch AVBisharp without HP Fighting, which no on uses in Ubers. This set OHKOs Latios with Knock Off and Sucker Punch and also has a guaranteed KO with Pursuit if the opponent switches out.

Bisharp (M) @ Assault Vest
Ability: Defiant EVs: 156 HP / 100 Atk / 252 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Pursuit
- Knock Off
- Sucker Punch
- [Filler Move]

+1 252 SpA Soul Dew Latios Draco Meteor vs. 156 HP / 252 SpD Assault Vest Bisharp: 140-165 (45.1 - 53.2%)

followed by the SpA drop

-2 252 SpA Soul Dew Latios Draco Meteor vs. 156 HP / 252 SpD Assault Vest Bisharp: 70-83 (22.5 - 26.7%)

 

[PoweredByRevenge]

Reserving Xerneas as a CHECK.

EDIT:

Xerneas @ Leftovers
Ability: Fairy Aura
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Moonblast
- Sleep Talk
- Rest
- Roar / Aromatherapy

Defensive Xerneas is one of the best checks to Calm Mind Latios, as well as being a good wall in this metagame. Xerneas can come in on any move Latios uses pretty safely and it can then 2HKO Latios with Moonblast. Xerneas can then just rest all of the damage it took later on in the match.

Relevant calcs:

+1 252 SpA Latios Psyshock vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Xerneas: 147-174 (32.2 - 38.1%) -- 0.9% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

+2 252 SpA Latios Psyshock vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Xerneas: 195-231 (42.7 - 50.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

4 SpA Fairy Aura Xerneas Moonblast vs. +1 4 HP / 0 SpD Latios: 216-254 (71.5 - 84.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

 

[Hack]

Aegi reserve

 

[Inspirited]

Scarf Rachi pls
Edit: Check

Jirachi @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 176 HP / 152 Atk / 180 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Iron Head
- U-Turn
- Healing Wish
- Ice Punch

Choice Scarf Jirachi can come in on anything Latios throws at it, or eat a Calm Mind boosted hit after it comes in quite easily. Latios is then 2HKOed by Ice Punch despite how weak the move is. It can only switch in once reliably though, so I still consider it only a check, but a hard check at that.

 

[ApplepieFTW]

the taco bell that doesnt get twave n_n

reserving bronzong

 

[DSM01]

Ferrothorn (check)

Ferrothorn @ Leftovers
Ability: Iron Barbs
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
- Gyro Ball
- Leech Seed
- Power Whip
- Spikes / Stealth Rock

Ferro can switch in on a Calm Mind, live Psyshock followed by Draco, and 2HKO in return with Gyro Ball. If Latios attacks on the first turn you can set up hazards instead or Leech Seed a switch in. Ferrothorn can also keep hazards on the field against Defog Lati@s.

+1 252 SpA Choice Specs Latios Draco Meteor vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Ferrothorn: 155-183 (44 - 51.9%)
+1 252 SpA Choice Specs Latios Psyshock vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Ferrothorn: 116-137 (32.9 - 38.9%)
4 Atk Ferrothorn Gyro Ball (150 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Latios: 186-219 (61.7 - 72.7%)

 

[Jibaku]

PBR's calcs are wrong

+1 Psyshock does 48%-57%
Fairy Aura Moonblast to 0/0 +1 Latios: 46%-54%

Basically all Latios has to do is CM once on the switch, CM again, and Xerneas loses. Or it can just beat Xern w/ +1 Psyshock after SR.

Actually Latios can beat Xerneas 1v1 w/o crits

 

[Rarycaris]

Mega Mawile (counter)

252 Attack/132 HP/124 Speed
- Sucker Punch
- Who
- Cares
- What Else

I'm not even sure any of the EVs matter here. Latios needs rocks up to even 2HKO with unboosted Psyshock (and given that it mega evolves after the switch, I'm not sure Latios can 2HKO even then), while Mega Mawile can score an easy OHKO with Sucker Punch. Latios has to run Thunderbolt to have a hope in hell of beating this thing.

 

[benbe]

Metagross-Mega @ Metagrossite
Ability: Tough Claws
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 HP / 176 Atk / 80 SpD
Careful Nature
- Meteor Mash
- Pursuit
- Earthquake
- Bullet Punch

metagross is a cool check to cm latios, also deals incredible damage with mmash and can ko with mmash + bp also can pursuit trap it, mega-metagross is also a useful mon outside of checking lati metagross can easily live a +2 fb from xerneas (73 - 85.9%) and retaliate with mmash + bp and eq can deal good damage to primal donner if need be

calcs

140 Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Meteor Mash vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Latios: 237-280 (78.7 - 93%) -- guaranteed 2HKO, 140 Atk Tough Claws Mega Metagross Bullet Punch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Latios: 105-124 (34.8 - 41.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO, 252 SpA Soul Dew Latios Draco Meteor vs. 252 HP / 80+ SpD Metagross: 133-157 (36.5 - 43.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO, +1 252 SpA Soul Dew Latios Draco Meteor vs. 252 HP / 80+ SpD Metagross: 200-236 (54.9 - 64.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO, +1 252 SpA Soul Dew Latios Psyshock vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Metagross: 58-69 (15.9 - 18.9%) -- possible 6HKO (lol)

 

[PoweredByRevenge]

So i just did my calcs again and it gives me the same results:

Soul Dew Latios --> +1 252 SpA Latios Psyshock vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Xerneas: 147-174 (32.2 - 38.1%) -- 0.9% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

Soul Dew Latios with a Calm Mind up --> +2 252 SpA Latios Psyshock vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Xerneas: 195-231 (42.7 - 50.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

Xerneas vs Soul Dew Latios -->
4 SpA Fairy Aura Xerneas Moonblast vs. +1 4 HP / 0 SpD Latios: 216-254 (71.5 - 84.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Xerneas vs Soul Dew Latios with a Calm Mind up -->
4 SpA Fairy Aura Xerneas Moonblast vs. +2 4 HP / 0 SpD Latios: 162-192 (53.6 - 63.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

As for the Latios beating Xerneas one vs one my set has Roar so it can Roar out Latios if it tries to set up. Ty for double checking tho i could have missed something :).

 

[EmblemLord]

Jibaku's calculations are correct. Don't forget that Soul Dew increases the raw stats first, so it is multiplied by Calm Mind. Therefore, Soul Dew + Calm Mind is not equal to itemless Latios with 2 Calm Mind boosts. Here are the calculations, adjusting Latios' base SpA and SpD to match the Soul Dew bonus.

+1 252 SpA Soul Dew Latios Psyshock vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Xerneas: 220-259 (48.2 - 56.7%) -- 38.7% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery / guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

0 SpA Fairy Aura Xerneas Moonblast vs. +1 4 HP / 0 SpD Soul Dew Latios: 144-170 (48 - 56.6%) -- 87.1% chance to 2HKO

As Jibaku mentioned, going for a second Calm Mind after Xerneas switches in allows you to beat it.

+2 252 SpA Soul Dew Latios Psyshock vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Xerneas: 292-345 (64 - 75.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

0 SpA Fairy Aura Xerneas Moonblast vs. +2 4 HP / 0 SpD Soul Dew Latios: 108-128 (36 - 42.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

Edited for clarity.

 

[SparksBlade]

Don't forget that Soul Dew increases the base stats

no it doesn't increase the base stat, it is like a calm mind boost

 

[PISTOLERO]

no it doesn't increase the base stat, it is like a calm mind boost

No it is not, Soul Dew is equivalent to Choice Specs + Assault Vest.

A +1 Soul Dew Lati@s actually has 225% of its raw Special Attack stat in teambuilder, as Soul Dew is a 50% boost and Calm Mind is another 50% boost, stacking multiplicatively to give 1.5 x 1.5 = 2.25.

A +[number of Calm Mind boosts] Lati@s's Special Attack is 1.5 x (1 + (0.5 x number of Calm Mind boosts)). These calculations apply to Special Defense in exactly the same way.