np: UU Stage 1 - Changes

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But, its pretty easy to spam and it's almost impossible to straight up counter, since we have seen most of the meta is almost cleanly 2HKO by MegiCham with the exception to Spiritomb, Slowking, Gligar and Doublade;
Uhm, Gligar gets destroyed by Ice Punch, which is a common choice over Bullet Punch. Im just saying, Gligar isn't a check or a counter.
 
Uhm, Gligar gets destroyed by Ice Punch, which is a common choice over Bullet Punch. Im just saying, Gligar isn't a check or a counter.
Medicham also gets Fire Punch and Thunder Punch, so lets just leave Slowking and Doubade out of it, too.

I was just talking about the Main STABs though and what can come in and tank the HJK and/or Zen Headbutt.

But still it shows how easily MegaCham can switch one move that could allow it to get around anything that can tank its main STABs.
 
While I do think MegaCham is very strong, I don't think it's broken on the level of Mega Diancie. Imo, it's speed leaves a lot to be desired, and it can be outsped and koed by many popular UU mons. It's also pretty predictable in terms of movesets. I think it has a chance of staying, and I'd personally want that.
 
I wouldn't. It's essentially got something for everything in the tier, and it can OHKO and 2HKO most of it too. It probably will be going, mostly because it's just too powerful to stay, even with a bad speed.
 

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While I do think MegaCham is very strong, I don't think it's broken on the level of Mega Diancie. Imo, it's speed leaves a lot to be desired, and it can be outsped and koed by many popular UU mons. It's also pretty predictable in terms of movesets. I think it has a chance of staying, and I'd personally want that.
When a Pokemon has access to a HJK that's more powerful than a BANDED MIENSHAO, whilst also having access to two priority moves and JUST enough bulk to be more defensively viable than Mienshao, all the while being able to change its moves as it sees fit AND retaining a decent base 100 Speed Tier...

yeah, no. anything can be "outsped and KOed" by its checks and counters. That's what a check/counter does... the point is the overcentralizing nature of MegaCham where the checks and counters aren't simply viable for OTHER portions of the UU metagame. Like Spiritomb.
 

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If being revenge KOed was an argument for keeping something in the tier, we would still have things like Victini running around. Same goes for things like Manaphy and hell Greninja would still probably be OU. Medicham just hits way too hard and its counters are just too rare in UU to justify it staying. Also, its double priority set can be pretty deadly as nothing is switching in on it regardless of the team archetype and it can pick off faster threats with Fake Out + Bullet Punch. It can decimate stall teams using just its STAB moves to kill everything but Cresselia, Doublade, Reuniclus, and Slowking, none of which are actually UU at the moment.
 
While it cant boost up like Gallade, Medi does hit way harder of the rip. From that thing being in the tier I think we all know that Psychic Fighting Stab is extremelly good and with something that has crazy high attack like Medi its really no question of it being broken. Of what Unun said, if a mon can destroy all team arch's its more than likely gonna be broke. And thats def the case with this one, lets hurry this up haha.
 
Medicham also gets Fire Punch and Thunder Punch, so lets just leave Slowking and Doubade out of it, too.

I was just talking about the Main STABs though and what can come in and tank the HJK and/or Zen Headbutt.

But still it shows how easily MegaCham can switch one move that could allow it to get around anything that can tank its main STABs.
yeah but slowking is guaranteed to live ThunderPunch and Doublade eats up Fire Punch. Ice punch Kills Gligar.
 
yeah but slowking is guaranteed to live ThunderPunch and Doublade eats up Fire Punch. Ice punch Kills Gligar.
252+ Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Thunder Punch vs. 248 HP / 76 Def Slowking: 328-388 (83.4 - 98.7%) -- 75% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
I see...
 

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252+ Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Thunder Punch vs. 248 HP / 76 Def Slowking: 328-388 (83.4 - 98.7%) -- 75% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
I see...
This is a spread made for RU, not UU, and most Medicham (from my experience) run Jolly.

252 Atk Pure Power Medicham Thunder Punch vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Slowking: 168-198 (42.7 - 50.3%) -- 46.9% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

Still the fact that it can 2HKO a would be counter with the appropriate coverage move proves that its just too strong
 
Hey, can we discuss Jirachi for a minute? I really think this guy has no business being in UU. I see it on every other team and it always gives me horrible problems. The Scarf set is a nightmare to deal with, the Paraflinch set is arguably worse, and whenever I see it I let out a groan.
 
Hey, can we discuss Jirachi for a minute? I really think this guy has no business being in UU. I see it on every other team and it always gives me horrible problems. The Scarf set is a nightmare to deal with, the Paraflinch set is arguably worse, and whenever I see it I let out a groan.
I groan when I see Jirachi, too, but it's not out-and-out broken. Jirachi suffers from common weaknesses as well as a lack immediate power. The Scarf set IS horribly obnoxious, especially when it outright relies on hax (don't even fucking pretend you would use Scarfrachi without Serene Grace Iron Head), but Jirachi can't win games on its own.
 
252+ Atk Pure Power Mega Medicham Thunder Punch vs. 248 HP / 76 Def Slowking: 328-388 (83.4 - 98.7%) -- 75% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
I see...
lol posting calcs on offensive ru spread slowking and acting like i was wrong,,, unless you predict the slowking switch it is guaranteed a turn, as TPunch + HJK fails to KO the good set, and in that free turn it can Slack Off, or TWave if it has it, effectively neutralizing medicham for at least a little while. And adamant MegaCham sucks.
 
lol posting calcs on offensive ru spread slowking and acting like i was wrong,,, unless you predict the slowking switch it is guaranteed a turn, as TPunch + HJK fails to KO the good set, and in that free turn it can Slack Off, or TWave if it has it, effectively neutralizing medicham for at least a little while. And adamant MegaCham sucks.
I was already corrected on this; no need to get all uptight about it :U
Still, as noted above, it still has a chance to 2HKO on the switch so it's not exactly safe and the fact it's doing that much to a counter is terrifying.
 
To anyone quoting ways to break Megacham's counters (elemental punches not named ice punch, for the most part) does it really matter that megacham is walled by Spiritomb, which sees no usage outside of stall teams? Does it really matter your megacham is walled by Doublade, which only sees large amounts of usage in these specific situations, where a 'mon is so horribly broken that people have to run a relatively obscure mon (doublade isn't completely obscure, sure, but it's not uu by usage, which should tell enough about its obscurity) to take its attacks. See Staraptor, when people ran doublade in large quantities like this if they wanted to have any kind of switchin. Does it really matter you're walled by Cresselia and Reuniclus (sure, an elemental punch doesn't break them) which are both also relatively obscure and have a large amount of shortcomings (cress can't really shine until Jirachi leaves, and even then it's walled to hell and back by steels. Reuniclus has to choose a coverage option and either it's kept in check by any dark type or walled by other psychic types, most notably giving free CMs to stuff like Jirachi) and wouldn't normally be considered as much as they are now on a UU team. And finally, Slowking, which isn't terrible but is really uncommon, its CM set is nice but straight beaten by dark types that don't care about Scald (see Hydreigon) and it's worn down by status and doesn't actually check the stuff it wants to check because of residual damage, U-Turn and coverage moves. Slowbro didn't have that problem because of its great defensive bulk allowing it to shrug off non-STAB super-effective moves and U-Turns with ease as long as they were physically based, yet Slowking doesn't have that luxury and in the time I've used it it doesn't actually stay healthy most of the match and easily gives switchins to a lot of powerful pokemon. I think Megacham is considered broken by nearly everyone who has used it or seen it used, and for a reason: None of the common UU pokemon can actually beat it. If you were to try and make a standard team, without Megacham considered, Megacham takes your team and tears it in half. If you consider it, and run something like Doublade or Slowking, your team struggles against teams that lack mega medicham. This is a case where a pokemon has taken a metagame and torn it to shreds. If Sableye was still in UU I might possibly be considering it to stay, just because Sableye was so good and hard-walls megacham. But without Sableye here, Mega Medicham is, in my opinion, the most broken pokemon the metagame has ever seen, and I don't think any knowledgable and experienced player of this community would consider it to be able to stay. This meta is completely ass, having struggled in it for a while now. It needs to be banned immediately. Thank you for your time, Mega Medicham, but you need to leave now.



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To anyone quoting ways to break Megacham's counters (elemental punches not named ice punch, for the most part) does it really matter that megacham is walled by Spiritomb, which sees no usage outside of stall teams? Does it really matter your megacham is walled by Doublade, which only sees large amounts of usage in these specific situations, where a 'mon is so horribly broken that people have to run a relatively obscure mon (doublade isn't completely obscure, sure, but it's not uu by usage, which should tell enough about its obscurity) to take its attacks. See Staraptor, when people ran doublade in large quantities like this if they wanted to have any kind of switchin. Does it really matter you're walled by Cresselia and Reuniclus (sure, an elemental punch doesn't break them) which are both also relatively obscure and have a large amount of shortcomings (cress can't really shine until Jirachi leaves, and even then it's walled to hell and back by steels. Reuniclus has to choose a coverage option and either it's kept in check by any dark type or walled by other psychic types, most notably giving free CMs to stuff like Jirachi) and wouldn't normally be considered as much as they are now on a UU team. And finally, Slowking, which isn't terrible but is really uncommon, its CM set is nice but straight beaten by dark types that don't care about Scald (see Hydreigon) and it's worn down by status and doesn't actually check the stuff it wants to check because of residual damage, U-Turn and coverage moves. Slowbro didn't have that problem because of its great defensive bulk allowing it to shrug off non-STAB super-effective moves and U-Turns with ease as long as they were physically based, yet Slowking doesn't have that luxury and in the time I've used it it doesn't actually stay healthy most of the match and easily gives switchins to a lot of powerful pokemon. I think Megacham is considered broken by nearly everyone who has used it or seen it used, and for a reason: None of the common UU pokemon can actually beat it. If you were to try and make a standard team, without Megacham considered, Megacham takes your team and tears it in half. If you consider it, and run something like Doublade or Slowking, your team struggles against teams that lack mega medicham. This is a case where a pokemon has taken a metagame and torn it to shreds. If Sableye was still in UU I might possibly be considering it to stay, just because Sableye was so good and hard-walls megacham. But without Sableye here, Mega Medicham is, in my opinion, the most broken pokemon the metagame has ever seen, and I don't think any knowledgable and experienced player of this community would consider it to be able to stay. This meta is completely ass, having struggled in it for a while now. It needs to be banned immediately. Thank you for your time, Mega Medicham, but you need to leave now.



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HUEHUE SPIRITOMB AND DOUBLADE GET BEAT BY FORSESIGHT HUEHUE
 
I believe Mega Medicham has ridiculous wallbreaking capacity. It can 1 or 2 HKO most of the tier with its dual STABS. If people start using things like doublade or spiritomb which are not viable, then something is wrong. It can even run fire punch for doublade. Bulky psychics that check it are taken care of by dark type teammates eg Hydreigon. Mega Medicham is completely broken in UU so ban in my opinion.
 
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I groan when I see Jirachi, too, but it's not out-and-out broken. Jirachi suffers from common weaknesses as well as a lack immediate power. The Scarf set IS horribly obnoxious, especially when it outright relies on hax (don't even fucking pretend you would use Scarfrachi without Serene Grace Iron Head), but Jirachi can't win games on its own.
Yeah, I see your point, but my main issue is that I just don't think it's terribly healthy for the metagame. Every time I see it I just have to toss out Quagsire and hope that I can get an EQ off before I die of old age. I guess I'll just have to go back to the drawing board... Inner Focus Umbreon maybe?
 
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