I think you should animate the lava lamp and apply the effects to see which one works better imo. I personally like the no glow.Um hi I've been told the flicker isn't good so I reduced it a bit idk... or should I just scrap it entirely?
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CAP 3D Modeling Project
- Thread starter QxC4eva
- Start date
I would personally say that the no glow looks best with contrast of the orange and purple. The next best to me would be the reduced flicker because it is less chaotic. I would try to play around with the glow and flicker to try and get a happy medium. It looks fantastic though[
<3 Thanks for all the feedback! Sorry for the hiccup!
Test animation don't count I guess... alright, but one blob only! Going up!
I think I know which one I like but comments are always welcome :)
Gonna put Mollux on hiatus for now (activity will depend on BushWhack).
Now onto Cyclohm, then Tomohawk!
Ahhh well spotted, I see it now! I had the glow size completely randomized on each frame, so reducing the flicker makes the random sizing more obvious and it looks more chaotic overall. Never use random for anything. Lesson learned. :|
Okay I tried changing the intensity this time!
Hm okay but BushWhack is the animator, not me :P With so many things going on I try to avoid repeat work if possible.
Test animation don't count I guess... alright, but one blob only! Going up!
Gonna put Mollux on hiatus for now (activity will depend on BushWhack).
Now onto Cyclohm, then Tomohawk!
Ooh I really like glow 50% it looks really cool, could you maybe try out 65% :J<3 Thanks for all the feedback! Sorry for the hiccup!
Ahhh well spotted, I see it now! I had the glow size completely randomized on each frame, so reducing the flicker makes the random sizing more obvious and it looks more chaotic overall. Never use random for anything. Lesson learned. :|
Okay I tried changing the intensity this time!
Hm okay but BushWhack is the animator, not me :P With so many things going on I try to avoid repeat work if possible.
Test animation don't count I guess... alright, but one blob only! Going up!
I think I know which one I like but comments are always welcome :)
Gonna put Mollux on hiatus for now (activity will depend on BushWhack).
Now onto Cyclohm, then Tomohawk!
Also I am experimenting with fidgit right now don't worry it wont take too long :P
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Okay I'm an idiot. I forgot to shink the glow size (which is a 2D effect slapped on after rendering) so it ends up spreading all over the lamp in these smaller gifs. x_x Here's the fixed versions!
I've been working on Cyclohm's crazy clouds and found myself doing a UV map, so here it is. The special effects need a bit more time as I'm still programming the shaders (and I'm excited how it's all coming along :D)
I also added in the new cloud meshes. Before they were spheres when I had no clue how we're gonna tackle the effects yet. And even now I'm not totally sure but I figure we'll need some base for the cloud shape at least, so yeah :P
The source files are here.
I've been working on Cyclohm's crazy clouds and found myself doing a UV map, so here it is. The special effects need a bit more time as I'm still programming the shaders (and I'm excited how it's all coming along :D)
I also added in the new cloud meshes. Before they were spheres when I had no clue how we're gonna tackle the effects yet. And even now I'm not totally sure but I figure we'll need some base for the cloud shape at least, so yeah :P
The source files are here.
Hey everyone, so sorry for not being here these past few weeks. Things came up (new animation job) so things have been pretty hectic. But if it's okay with y'all, I would still like to be involved, based on how much I just love Pokemon basically. If not, then I completely understand.
-BushWhack
-BushWhack
Any good insight to the projects presently being done is always welcome, and you should always feel encouraged to pick up a part of a project when available.
hOI!!!!! i'm tEMMIE!!!!
sorry I just had to do that :P
Aaanyways Fidgit update:
yeah this image is pretty big too :[
Okay so as you may notice 1. Fidgit has no arms 2. WERE ISS THEE FRRIGGGINNN DRILL WAT IS THIS UGLY POINTTT >:[ Ok ok first off calm down :| lemme explain you see I don't have arms on it because I am still experimenting and the point is actually what Fidgit should look like according to Cartoons! see here is the image:
as you can see like Golui I found the thread in which Cartoons had posted some extra art of Fidgit he asked if people liked it and they did but Cartoons never got round to editing the final artwork so we ended up with a drill he put the stinger there to make Fidgit look more like a poison type I mean Fidgit does not look poison type only the colour AND THAT IS NOT ENOUGH OK!!!! also the way Golui made the elbows is actually correct but what do you guys think stinger or no natural? elbows or no please tell meh. Also I for some reason you don't belive me then here link
Also BushWhack your fine do you know how long I took to post my first Fidgit update 3 friggin months!!! soo your ok ;)
sorry I just had to do that :P
Aaanyways Fidgit update:
yeah this image is pretty big too :[
Okay so as you may notice 1. Fidgit has no arms 2. WERE ISS THEE FRRIGGGINNN DRILL WAT IS THIS UGLY POINTTT >:[ Ok ok first off calm down :| lemme explain you see I don't have arms on it because I am still experimenting and the point is actually what Fidgit should look like according to Cartoons! see here is the image:
Also BushWhack your fine do you know how long I took to post my first Fidgit update 3 friggin months!!! soo your ok ;)
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Oh dang, huh... Fidgit... is quite a conundrum...KrazyCake said:
Well, first things first, the whole Stinger prospect is really interesting to me. Going off the "final product" image that people usually reference for Fidgit, that whole red, lower-body segment isn't even there.
In the canon image it's just a drill... But I dunno, if you can't consult Cartoons, then it's a bit up in the air I guess. I will say this though: subjectively, I do think the arm segments should have elbows, without any sort of organic connection. That is entirely opinionated and subjective, but the idea of having kid's toy-like limbs seems more purposeful, I think.
Also, one other small detail I figure should be laid out one way or another; I think one last thing that should be called into question is how Fidge-boy's leg thingeys work (all scientific terminology). By which specifically I mean, are those leg warmer looking things supposed to be actual leg-warmers, or just another building block-like segment, or even organically connected, like, muscle tissue or something? I honestly have no clue. In some of the references, they bend like they're not, rigid, I guess? But I'm pretty confused myself about what those are supposed to be. So that's... something to keep in mind, I guess.
hmm.... this fidgit thang thang is really quite weird:P also remember Cartoons! never got round to editing the artwork (please tell me if I am wrong) they just added the artwork because it back then I don't think they really cared about Final Submissions I do however agree with you on the elbow attachments. But let's see what everyone else has to say :)Oh dang, huh... Fidgit... is quite a conundrum...
Well, first things first, the whole Stinger prospect is really interesting to me. Going off the "final product" image that people usually reference for Fidgit, that whole red, lower-body segment isn't even there.
In the canon image it's just a drill... But I dunno, if you can't consult Cartoons, then it's a bit up in the air I guess. I will say this though: subjectively, I do think the arm segments should have elbows, without any sort of organic connection. That is entirely opinionated and subjective, but the idea of having kid's toy-like limbs seems more purposeful, I think.
Also, one other small detail I figure should be laid out one way or another; I think one last thing that should be called into question is how Fidge-boy's leg thingeys work (all scientific terminology). By which specifically I mean, are those leg warmer looking things supposed to be actual leg-warmers, or just another building block-like segment, or even organically connected, like, muscle tissue or something? I honestly have no clue. In some of the references, they bend like they're not, rigid, I guess? But I'm pretty confused myself about what those are supposed to be. So that's... something to keep in mind, I guess.
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You still plan on working on Mollux's animation? If not I'd be happy to take over.
You're still in don't worry!! We've all done it before :P
...except Quany, but Quany is a machine :P
KrazyCake,
Cartoons did more Fidgit art for Batcap here - http://www.ivnbvn.com/batcap/fidgit.html
He drew it without the red stuff, and I think it's better as it makes the design less cluttered. So I think you should revert it! About the elbows, I don't think they should be smooth like Golui's model. After looking at more Cartoons' art, I'm convinced that they pivot right on the part coming out of the spheres (the actual spheres don't really move much). Sorry for the pretty drawing, but something like this I think:
I'm getting the idea from these animations he posted:
http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/an-animated-battle-for-you.31333/page-6#post-1299954
http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/an-animated-battle-for-you.31333/page-6#post-1315408
Also notice the elbow spheres can grow bigger and smaller (to keep in mind for rigging), and the upper and lower arms can bend slightly as well, so we need some more edge divisions there.
Tagging Golui as well, if you're still alive. :P
Thanks for the arm skeleton :] I really do want to add the stinger though :( also that animations that you have shown have Fidgit's lower body thing. So maybe batcap has the drill. But I just like the idea of the poison stinger you see Fidgit looks more ground then poison type right now most secondary ground types usually all have the ground type implied in there design such as Garchomp, Gliscor, Nidoking and Steelix and the other types being more prominent. Also as QxC4eva said we have some creative freedom too :D but if you guys still don't like the change then I am happy the add the drill ;)You're still in don't worry!! We've all done it before :P
...except Quany, but Quany is a machine :P
KrazyCake,
Cartoons did more Fidgit art for Batcap here - http://www.ivnbvn.com/batcap/fidgit.html
He drew it without the red stuff, and I think it's better as it makes the design less cluttered. So I think you should revert it! About the elbows, I don't think they should be smooth like Golui's model. After looking at more Cartoons' art, I'm convinced that they pivot right on the part coming out of the spheres (the actual spheres don't really move much). Sorry for the pretty drawing, but something like this I think:
I'm getting the idea from these animations he posted:
http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/an-animated-battle-for-you.31333/page-6#post-1299954
http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/an-animated-battle-for-you.31333/page-6#post-1315408
Also notice the elbow spheres can grow bigger and smaller (to keep in mind for rigging), and the upper and lower arms can bend slightly as well, so we need some more edge divisions there.
Tagging Golui as well, if you're still alive. :P
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some things on arms joints
Okay, so... "Not a solid object" might not be the best way of phrasing it, but my theory is that Fidgit's Elbow balls, are some sort of "Poison Sac" that falls around the elbow joints. Hell, I'm gonna even say the elbow-balls and feet-thingeys and made of the same sort of tissue, or other material.
See how the joints inflate or deflate under certain circumstances? Like how your adam's apple moves when swallowing, it makes sense for that to be the case if the elbow joints are supposed to be some sort of gland. This, to me, is what makes the most sense anatomically. That, or it's limbs are connected inorganically, but... Like the animations show, Fidgit seems to have a pretty free range of movement, so I doubt that that's actually the case.
So uhm, yeah, just putting it forward that I think the elbow joints have a higher chance of being glands that wrap around Fidgit's arms and skeleton, rather than solid body parts. Not sure how much that affects the modeler's jobs, sorry for the crazy long post.
I wayyy retract this statement, looking back over things, this view is totally wrong, and I'll explain why in just a second.me said:
QxC4eva I agree they shouldn't be smooth, but I disagree with the why, and for once, I have some actual explanation to that. My basic reasoning is this: I do not think Fidgit's elbow balls, assuming that we're looking at them from an organic perspective, make any real-world sense at all. However, I think that they can make sense if you look at them as not a solid object. ...I uh, drew a "graph" (apologies for these sick MSPaint lines as well):QxC4eva said:
Okay, so... "Not a solid object" might not be the best way of phrasing it, but my theory is that Fidgit's Elbow balls, are some sort of "Poison Sac" that falls around the elbow joints. Hell, I'm gonna even say the elbow-balls and feet-thingeys and made of the same sort of tissue, or other material.
See how the joints inflate or deflate under certain circumstances? Like how your adam's apple moves when swallowing, it makes sense for that to be the case if the elbow joints are supposed to be some sort of gland. This, to me, is what makes the most sense anatomically. That, or it's limbs are connected inorganically, but... Like the animations show, Fidgit seems to have a pretty free range of movement, so I doubt that that's actually the case.
So uhm, yeah, just putting it forward that I think the elbow joints have a higher chance of being glands that wrap around Fidgit's arms and skeleton, rather than solid body parts. Not sure how much that affects the modeler's jobs, sorry for the crazy long post.
Wow mollux looks so good! Nice job guys!
I'm terribly sorry for my lack of activity here. I love this project, but I just can not seem to find the time to work on this.
So, with a bit of pain in my heart, I would like to give Voodoom out of my hands. (sorry I didn't do this anytime sooner, if someone already wanted to work on it further)
I don't feel like I can claim Voodoom when I can't promis that I will be working on it anytime soon. Certainly now that Mollux is getting finished.
If I find some spare time, I will certainly want to help with the rest of the project!
I'm terribly sorry for my lack of activity here. I love this project, but I just can not seem to find the time to work on this.
So, with a bit of pain in my heart, I would like to give Voodoom out of my hands. (sorry I didn't do this anytime sooner, if someone already wanted to work on it further)
I don't feel like I can claim Voodoom when I can't promis that I will be working on it anytime soon. Certainly now that Mollux is getting finished.
If I find some spare time, I will certainly want to help with the rest of the project!
Mm, right, sorry :P I wouldn't know about what it takes to turn this into a poll, but just to throw in another friendly neighborhood opinion, I also vote drill. I get the impression it's iconic enough about Fidgit that some people might be taken aback if isn't in the final model, even if nobody voices that opinion here.
One last crazy thought along this line though, do you think there's any possibility for merging the two? Like, keeping the red segment and having the stinger textured as a drill, but not as immediately obviously one? That's just a thought though, if it boils down to one or the other, my 'vote' is drill.
Fidgit has a drill, not a stinger. This has been ingrained in the lore of Fidgit for years and years, and we should definitely stick with that.
As for the general skeleton and joints on Fidgit, I think it is worth remembering the concept for Fidgit (it was the first CAP pokemon with an explicit Concept), which was "Pure Utility Pokemon". Cartoons' Fidgit design was not as driven by the idea of looking like a Ground type or a Poison type, but mostly to look like a highly configurable thing. At the time, there were many mentions that Fidgit reminded people of "Tinkertoys":
Perhaps the Tinkertoy reference may help give you a different perspective as you seek to model the bones and joints of Fidgit.
As for the general skeleton and joints on Fidgit, I think it is worth remembering the concept for Fidgit (it was the first CAP pokemon with an explicit Concept), which was "Pure Utility Pokemon". Cartoons' Fidgit design was not as driven by the idea of looking like a Ground type or a Poison type, but mostly to look like a highly configurable thing. At the time, there were many mentions that Fidgit reminded people of "Tinkertoys":
Since Tinkertoys could be connected into myriad configurations, it was the perfect reference for a pokemon that was designed to have a bunch of different uses as a supporting utility-mon. I'm NOT saying Fidgit can disconnect his "bones" from his "hinge orbs" or whatever. I'm just saying the idea that Fidgit looked like a Tinkertoy, was considered very "utility-looking" and was a much bigger driver in the design's popularity in CAP, over it looking like a "Ground/Poison Type" (with the drill and spikes as type-supporting design flourishes).
Perhaps the Tinkertoy reference may help give you a different perspective as you seek to model the bones and joints of Fidgit.
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Yes sir! :P I will definitely keep this in mind.
RIP stinger you will only be missed by me
KrazyCake you're the modeller, so I don't want you to do something you don't like. My vote is also for the drill, but you and Napkins have the right idea. =] If you really want to, you can make the red plate a separate mesh so the rendering person can choose to hide it or not (depending which one looks better) That way we'll have both designs and can alternate between them any time.
I guess it's a teeny bit more work for the rigging/texturing/UV stages but Fidgit is an easy model anyway. :P
So yeah, what I'm going for is the inorganic idea you drew. Your organic one makes sense for anatomy, but I'm wondering what happens to the sac when the elbow bends? It either gets crushed following the movement, or it stays like a ball with the arms sliding through it. That's a dead end as far as "3D logic" goes, so even if your first idea is correct we probably have to go with your second one. :| Here's a demo of what I mean:
A) elbow "collapses" to follow the movement
B) elbow does not collapse, but in return, the arm has to slide through it
... so we have a C) use the inorganic idea.
There could be other ways (maybe soft bodies >_>) but I'm out of ideas right now... any ideas?
You're sooo right the elbow is a poison gland, that explains why it's pulsing. o_o
Anyways, enjoy life, and thanks for your hard work on Stratagem :D
I guess it's a teeny bit more work for the rigging/texturing/UV stages but Fidgit is an easy model anyway. :P
Sorry I should have made it more clear! <_< By "joints" and "bones" I'm referring to 3D modeling terms (specifically the rigging) but they're not Fidgit's actual bones. These special "bones" don't render, all they do is group together parts of the model so it's easier to animate. The elbow will move as one unit so it has a bone to itself. I guess we're only interested how they behave so, not really the prettiest things if you treat them like actual bones. XDsome things onarmsjoints
I wayyy retract this statement, looking back over things, this view is totally wrong, and I'll explain why in just a second.
QxC4eva I agree they shouldn't be smooth, but I disagree with the why, and for once, I have some actual explanation to that. My basic reasoning is this: I do not think Fidgit's elbow balls, assuming that we're looking at them from an organic perspective, make any real-world sense at all. However, I think that they can make sense if you look at them as not a solid object. ...I uh, drew a "graph" (apologies for these sick MSPaint lines as well):
Okay, so... "Not a solid object" might not be the best way of phrasing it, but my theory is that Fidgit's Elbow balls, are some sort of "Poison Sac" that falls around the elbow joints. Hell, I'm gonna even say the elbow-balls and feet-thingeys and made of the same sort of tissue, or other material.
See how the joints inflate or deflate under certain circumstances? Like how your adam's apple moves when swallowing, it makes sense for that to be the case if the elbow joints are supposed to be some sort of gland. This, to me, is what makes the most sense anatomically. That, or it's limbs are connected inorganically, but... Like the animations show, Fidgit seems to have a pretty free range of movement, so I doubt that that's actually the case.
So uhm, yeah, just putting it forward that I think the elbow joints have a higher chance of being glands that wrap around Fidgit's arms and skeleton, rather than solid body parts. Not sure how much that affects the modeler's jobs, sorry for the crazy long post.
So yeah, what I'm going for is the inorganic idea you drew. Your organic one makes sense for anatomy, but I'm wondering what happens to the sac when the elbow bends? It either gets crushed following the movement, or it stays like a ball with the arms sliding through it. That's a dead end as far as "3D logic" goes, so even if your first idea is correct we probably have to go with your second one. :| Here's a demo of what I mean:
A) elbow "collapses" to follow the movement
B) elbow does not collapse, but in return, the arm has to slide through it
... so we have a C) use the inorganic idea.
There could be other ways (maybe soft bodies >_>) but I'm out of ideas right now... any ideas?
You're sooo right the elbow is a poison gland, that explains why it's pulsing. o_o
Oh okay then :( No one's interested in Voodoom yet, so if you ever feel like getting back to it you're very welcome to!
Anyways, enjoy life, and thanks for your hard work on Stratagem :D
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QxC4eva:
I really like this current style for Mollux, though I would tone down the yellow glow a bit (the 0% images look great in my opinion).
The shine on the glass lamp is also a nice touch.
Also on the Fidgit joint design post, I think the squishy gland elbow is a better design than the hard Tinker Toy version.
I'm sorry that I can't contribute more. How does one get into 3D design? I don't even know where to start.
I like the elbow collapsing to follow the movement of Fidgit's hands, but the inorganic idea of a tinkertoy could work as well. I wonder how the inorganic feel would look, though.
Quanyails Wait, is that Cawmodore? I really love how his flying pose is at a reasonable speed, unlike a lot of official XY/ORAS models of the Flying-type.
Quanyails Wait, is that Cawmodore? I really love how his flying pose is at a reasonable speed, unlike a lot of official XY/ORAS models of the Flying-type.
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I like the rigid Tinkertoys skin, as I don't see Fidgit's joints as squishy. I'd think that Cartoons! makes Fidgit's joints animate because, well, it's a sketch animation and it's made to look lively. Are there any pictures of Fidgit's joints really deforming while bending?
That being said, though, the rig can have add ribbon arms and other deformations if we want to make it Cartoons!y.
For those curious, I've been taking a 3D animation mini-course this semester, so as to more formally understand all of this. :P I won't upload any files until I finish the course, but here's a WIP preview....
(QxC4eva, is it possible to use the file listed here for general Pokemon-style rendering in Maya?)
That being said, though, the rig can have add ribbon arms and other deformations if we want to make it Cartoons!y.
For those curious, I've been taking a 3D animation mini-course this semester, so as to more formally understand all of this. :P I won't upload any files until I finish the course, but here's a WIP preview....
(QxC4eva, is it possible to use the file listed here for general Pokemon-style rendering in Maya?)