i agree with gothic togekiss, and i also really like deck knight's
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CAP 8 CAP 8 - Part 14a - Complete Movepool Submissions
- Thread starter cyberzero
- Start date
- Status
So I fixed mine up a bit (with help from Cyzir). It now include Earthquake as a TM and Growth and Crunch as Egg moves. Growth is illegal with most others.
I love this part.
Notable omissions:
Roar - It learns Whirlwind via level-up, so no difference made.
Taunt - Cyclohm has considerable speed; shutting down walls and pseudo-hazers encourages offensive-minded sets, which I do not believe was the assumed role for it to play.
Ice Beam - I would greatly dislike this pokemon if it turned out as another BoltBeam option. Anyway, it has Hydro Pump for Ground, Fire Blast for Grass, and its own Dragon and Electric STABs for Dragon and Flying Pokemon, respectively. If you're desperate, you can run Blizzard.
Earthquake - Is an egg move (see below).
Energy Ball/Grass Knot - It can Draco Meteor against Swampert, who would be the only reason to use these (also cannot see a cloud tripping people over with grass ropes).
Stone Edge/Rock Slide - All this coverage is already provided in other options. Not very much power when unboosted.
Psychic/Shadow Ball - Both largely expendable; low base power and no important coverage.
Surf -Hydro Pump is already available as an egg move.
Moves with competitive value:
Whirlwind, Thunder Fang, Haze, (possibly) Discharge
The ability to use Recover forgoes the ability to run Earthquake or Dragon Dance. Other than this, the other moves of note are Glare, Yawn and Hydro Pump.
Signal Beam/Magnet Rise - learned by nearly all Electric-types; Signal Beam gets a far larger hit on Celebi as well as helping with Ludicolo, Magnet Rise cancels its most glaring weakness.
Outrage/Draco Meteor - Given to, I think, every Dragon.
Heat Wave - Fits both the 'weather' concept and the 'dragon' concept.
Code:
TM02 - Dragon Claw
TM03 - Water Pulse
TM06 - Toxic
TM07 - Hail
TM10 - Hidden Power
TM11 - Sunny Day
TM14 - Blizzard
TM15 - Hyper Beam
TM16 - Light Screen
TM18 - Rain Dance
TM17 - Protect
TM21 - Frustration
TM22 - SolarBeam
TM24 - Thunderbolt
TM25 - Thunder
TM27 - Return
TM32 - Double Team
TM33 - Reflect
TM34 - Shock Wave
TM35 - Flamethrower
TM37 - Sandstorm
TM38 - Fire Blast
TM40 - Aerial Ace
TM41 - Torment
TM42 - Facade
TM43 - Secret Power
TM44 - Rest
TM45 - Attract
TM46 - Thief
TM49 - Snatch
TM50 - Overheat
TM55 - Brine
TM56 - Fling
TM57 - Charge Beam
TM58 - Endure
TM59 - Dragon Pulse
TM61 - Will-o-wisp
TM62 - Silver Wind
TM63 - Embargo
TM65 - Shadow Claw
TM66 - Payback
TM67 - Recycle
TM68 - Giga Impact
TM70 - Flash
TM72 - Avalanche
TM73 - Thunder Wave
TM78 - Captivate
TM82 - Sleep Talk
TM83 - Natural Gift
TM87 - Swagger
TM88 - Pluck
TM90 - Substitute
HM04 – StrengthRoar - It learns Whirlwind via level-up, so no difference made.
Taunt - Cyclohm has considerable speed; shutting down walls and pseudo-hazers encourages offensive-minded sets, which I do not believe was the assumed role for it to play.
Ice Beam - I would greatly dislike this pokemon if it turned out as another BoltBeam option. Anyway, it has Hydro Pump for Ground, Fire Blast for Grass, and its own Dragon and Electric STABs for Dragon and Flying Pokemon, respectively. If you're desperate, you can run Blizzard.
Earthquake - Is an egg move (see below).
Energy Ball/Grass Knot - It can Draco Meteor against Swampert, who would be the only reason to use these (also cannot see a cloud tripping people over with grass ropes).
Stone Edge/Rock Slide - All this coverage is already provided in other options. Not very much power when unboosted.
Psychic/Shadow Ball - Both largely expendable; low base power and no important coverage.
Surf -Hydro Pump is already available as an egg move.
Code:
H. Tri Attack
H. Thunder Fang
H. Weather Ball
5. Dragon Rage
10. Charge
12. Dragonbreath
23. Whirlwind
29. Ancientpower
34. Haze
38. Smokescreen
46. Smog
51. Discharge
55. Mist
62. Hyper Voice
70. Zap CannonWhirlwind, Thunder Fang, Haze, (possibly) Discharge
Code:
Glare (Seviper/Arbok)
Dragon Dance (Kingdra/Salamence/Altaria/Dragonite/Gyarados/Charizard)
Detect (Sceptile)
Slam (Sceptile/Dragonite/Arbok)
Recover (Milotic)
Thrash (Gyarados/Salamence/Garchomp)
Yawn (Kingdra)
Hydro Pump (Gyarados/Milotic/Kingdra/Salamence)
Earthquake (Smeargle -----> Arbok)
Code:
Signal Beam
Outrage
Heat Wave
Draco Meteor
Magnet Rise
Twister
Vacuum Wave
Air Cutter
Icy Wind
Ominous WindOutrage/Draco Meteor - Given to, I think, every Dragon.
Heat Wave - Fits both the 'weather' concept and the 'dragon' concept.
I made a few changes to my movepool, since I wanted to put some additional moves in that I missed for flavor. Water Gun and Mist Ball replaced Growth(which replaced Stomp as an egg move) and Whirlwind. Roar and Water Pulse were added to the TMs list. The Punches were taken out of the tutors pool (again flavor, and physical is only a gimmick for Cyclohm most of the time) and replaced with Icy Wind, Snore, Uproar, and Ancientpower.
Weather Ball suits Cyclohm from a flavor perspective, and it isn't considered a "competive move," so you don't have to worry about it taking up a slot. According to the CAP guide, the only usually competitive Normal type special moves are Hyper Beam, Tri Attack, Hyper Voice and Swift. Considering that it isn't included in the Attacking Moves list for Cyclohm, it isn't competitive on Cyclohm. Someone might use Weather Ball on a gimmick set, but I don't see anyone using Double hit, so you might as well stick it on there.
Level Up Moves
The level up moveset has a lot a good moves, but nothing groundbreaking.
Notables:
Charge-Solid move, but unlikely to be used.
Stun Spore-Paralysis on Grounds ftw!
Discharge-If you want extra paralysis instead of power.
Bug Buzz-Coverage, if you like Bug type moves.
Tri-Attack and Ice Ball-Uneeded moves that are fun!
TM Moves:
Pretty Basic. Note the lack of any fire moves, but the inclusion of Surf and Roar. (More on the fire moves later)
Egg Moves: (Monster)
I haven't don the full compatable-ness yet, but Overheat and Slack Off are NOT compatable. Slowbro gives Cyclohm Slack Off, while Charizard gives Overheat to him. I originally intended to do this with Flamethrower too, but Slowbro just has to randomly learn both it and FB. Also, Yawn and Curse are included.
Tutor Moves
Not much here is competetive: only Draco Meteor, Knock Off, and Heat Wave. Heat Wave is compatable with Slack Off, so, if you really want Recovery+Fire, you can have it.
What this movepool lacks:
Flamethrower and Fire Blast-you have options for both consistant and high powered fire moves, so these were seen as uneeded, (though I really did want F-Thrower over Overheat in the egg moves)
Dragon Dance-People have an obsesion with this move. I decided to leave it out so you don't have to deal with the random DD set.
Volt Tackle-With no DD this is useless-so its not here obviously
Slack Off+Overheat-I didn't really like the prospect of these to powerful moves together, hence, they aren't. However, if you want healing, Heat Wave or Surf can take over the void Overheat left. Similarly, Overheat and Surf work together.
As for support, Cyclohm has plenty of it: Knock Off, Light Screen, T-Wave, Stun Spore, and Roar. All can work on a defensively minded Cyclohm. Reflect isn't included as, well, it doesn't really need it.
However, the most awesome move in this movepool is obviously Ice Ball. Its like rollout, except Ice-typed, and cooler. Cyclohm also learns rollout by tutor, so you could use a gimmick set like Ice Ball/ Rollout/ Curse/ Outrage. Fun stuff.
Code:
Level Up:
Lv. 1-Twister
Lv. 1-Leer
Lv. 9-Thunder Fang
Lv. 12-Peck
Lv.17-Double Hit
Lv. 25-Charge
Lv. 29-Dragonbreath
Lv. 32-Stun Spore
Lv. 38-Haze
Lv. 40-Discharge
Lv. 45-Bug Buzz
Lv. 51-Thunderbolt
Lv. 64-Ice Ball
Lv. 70-Tri-AttackNotables:
Charge-Solid move, but unlikely to be used.
Stun Spore-Paralysis on Grounds ftw!
Discharge-If you want extra paralysis instead of power.
Bug Buzz-Coverage, if you like Bug type moves.
Tri-Attack and Ice Ball-Uneeded moves that are fun!
TM Moves:
Code:
TM02 - Dragon Claw
[B]TM05 - Roar
TM06 - Toxic[/B]
TM07 - Hail
TM10 - Hidden Power
TM11 - Sunny Day
TM15 - Hyper Beam
[B]TM16 - Light Screen[/B]
TM17 - Protect
TM18 - Rain Dance
TM20 - Safeguard
TM21 - Frustration
TM22 - SolarBeam
TM23 - Iron Tail
[B]TM24 - Thunderbolt
TM25 - Thunder[/B]
TM26 - Earthquake
TM27 - Return
TM32 - Double Team
TM34 - Shock Wave
TM40 - Aerial Ace
TM42 - Facade
TM43 - Secret Power
TM44 - Rest
TM45 - Attract
TM54 - False Swipe
[B]TM57 - Charge Beam[/B]
TM58 - Endure
[B]TM59 - Dragon Pulse[/B]
TM62 - Silver Wind
TM65 - Shadow Claw
TM66 - Payback
TM67 - Recycle
TM68 - Giga Impact
TM70 - Flash
[B]TM73 - Thunder Wave[/B]
TM78 - Captivate
TM82 - Sleep Talk
TM83 - Natural Gift
TM87 - Swagger
TM88 - Pluck
TM90 - Substitute
TM91 - Flash Cannon
TM92 - Trick Room
HM01 - Cut
[B]HM03 - Surf[/B]
HM04 - Strength
HM05 – DefogEgg Moves: (Monster)
Code:
Overheat
Slack Off
Curse
Yawn
Stomp
Disable
Take Down
SnoreTutor Moves
Code:
Draco Meteor
Fury Cutter
Knock Off
Heat Wave
Icy Wind
Ominous Wind
Helping Hand
Snore
Swift
Uproar
Rollout
Outrage
Signal Beam
TwisterWhat this movepool lacks:
Flamethrower and Fire Blast-you have options for both consistant and high powered fire moves, so these were seen as uneeded, (though I really did want F-Thrower over Overheat in the egg moves)
Dragon Dance-People have an obsesion with this move. I decided to leave it out so you don't have to deal with the random DD set.
Volt Tackle-With no DD this is useless-so its not here obviously
Slack Off+Overheat-I didn't really like the prospect of these to powerful moves together, hence, they aren't. However, if you want healing, Heat Wave or Surf can take over the void Overheat left. Similarly, Overheat and Surf work together.
As for support, Cyclohm has plenty of it: Knock Off, Light Screen, T-Wave, Stun Spore, and Roar. All can work on a defensively minded Cyclohm. Reflect isn't included as, well, it doesn't really need it.
However, the most awesome move in this movepool is obviously Ice Ball. Its like rollout, except Ice-typed, and cooler. Cyclohm also learns rollout by tutor, so you could use a gimmick set like Ice Ball/ Rollout/ Curse/ Outrage. Fun stuff.
Alright first edits done and I think it's a lot better. See bottom of post for synopsis of changes.
Level-up Moves:
Competitive non-TM moves: Morning Sun, Discharge
TMs/HMs:
Egg Moves (Dragon/Monster):
Competitive Moves: Recover, Aromatherapy, Mirror Coat, Heat Wave
Legal Egg Combos (forgetting Focus Energy and Double-Edge, which are in all cases rather useless):
Heat Wave + Aqua Tail (Dragonite, Salamence)
Recover + Mirror Coat + Aqua Tail (Milotic)
Mirror Coat + Aqua Tail (Squirtle, Wartortle, Blastoise, Milotic)
Charge and Aromatherapy are both completely exclusive
Move Tutor:
Synopsis:
Also, it can now run Counter + Mirror Coat + Recover, which would make it the only pokemon in OU to run Counter and Mirror Coat, and the only pokemon outside of Ubers to run both plus recovery. Let me know if that's too overpowered.
There you have it. Let me know how I can make it better, pleez.
Level-up Moves:
Code:
H - Weather Ball
H - Morning Sun
1 - Tackle
1 - Growl
7 - Thundershock
10 - Leer
13 - Thunder Wave
15 - Twister
19 - Glare
21 - Discharge
24 - Dragon Claw
30 - Thunderbolt
38 - Power Trick
46 - Dragon Dance
56 - Dragon Pulse
68 - Volt TackleTMs/HMs:
Code:
TM02 - Dragon Claw
TM03 - Water Pulse
TM05 - Roar
TM06 - Toxic
TM07 - Hail
TM10 - Hidden Power
TM11 - Sunny Day
TM12 - Taunt
TM15 - Hyper Beam
TM16 - Light Screen
TM17 - Protect
TM18 - Rain Dance
TM20 - Safeguard
TM21 - Frustration
TM23 - Iron Tail
TM24 - Thunderbolt
TM25 - Thunder
TM26 - Earthquake
TM27 - Return
TM29 - Psychic
TM30 - Shadow Ball
TM32 - Double Team
TM33 - Reflect
TM34 - Shock Wave
TM35 - Flamethrower
TM37 - Sandstorm
TM40 - Aerial Ace
TM42 - Facade
TM43 - Secret Power
TM44 - Rest
TM45 - Attract
TM46 - Thief
TM54 - False Swipe
TM56 - Fling
TM57 - Charge Beam
TM58 - Endure
TM59 - Dragon Pulse
TM62 - Silver Wind
TM65 - Shadow Claw
TM66 - Payback
TM68 - Giga Impact
TM70 - Flash
TM73 - Thunder Wave
TM76 - Stealth Rock
TM78 - Captivate
TM82 - Sleep Talk
TM83 - Natural Gift
TM87 - Swagger
TM90 - Substitute
HM01 - Cut
HM03 - Surf
HM04 - Strength
HM05 - Defog
HM06 - Rock Smash
Code:
Heat Wave - Charmander, Charmeleon, Charizard, Dragonite, Swablu, Altaria, Salamence
Recover - Milotic
Mirror Coat - Squirtle, Wartortle, Blastoise, Milotic
Aromatherapy - Chikorita, Bayleef, Meganium
Charge - Mareep, Flaffy, Ampharos
Aqua Tail - Squirtle, Wartortle, Blastoise, Nidoqueen, Nidoking, Slowpoke, Slowbro, Lickitung, Rhyhorn, Rhydon, Kangaskhan, Gyarados, Lapras, Dratini, Dragonair, Dragonite, Totodile, Crocinaw, Feraligatr, Slowking, Tyranitar, Mudkip, Marshtomp, Swampert, Aggron, Seviper, Milotic, Salamence, Garchomp, Lickilicky, Rhyperior
Yawn - Slowpoke, Slowbro, Snorlax, Slowking, Kingdra, Squirtle, Wartortle, Blastoise
Tickle - Lapras, Turtwig, Grotle, Torterra
Focus Energy - Nidoran (m), Nidorino, Nidoking, Nidoran (f), Nidorina, Nidoqueen, Cubone, Marowak, Horsea, Seadra, Kingdra, Bagon, Shelgon, Larvitar, Pupitar, Tyranitar, Shieldon, Bastiodon, Salamence, Cranidos, Rampardos
Double-Edge - Bulbasaur, Ivysaur, Venusaur, Cubone, Marowak, Aron, Lairon, Aggron, Bagon, Shelgon, Salamence, Snorlax, Turtwig, Grotle, Torterra, Cranidos, Rampardos, Shieldon, Bastiodon, Gible, Gabite, Garchomp, Snover, AbomasnowLegal Egg Combos (forgetting Focus Energy and Double-Edge, which are in all cases rather useless):
Heat Wave + Aqua Tail (Dragonite, Salamence)
Recover + Mirror Coat + Aqua Tail (Milotic)
Mirror Coat + Aqua Tail (Squirtle, Wartortle, Blastoise, Milotic)
Charge and Aromatherapy are both completely exclusive
Move Tutor:
Code:
Counter
Metronome
Mimic
Icy Wind
Seismic Toss
Knock Off
Ominous Wind
Vacuum Wave
Swift
Magnet Rise
AncientPower
Outrage
Signal Beam
Draco Meteor- Physical attacks (for DD sets): Outrage, Shadow Claw, Facade, Return, Aerial Ace, Earthquake, Dragon Claw, Aqua Tail.
- Special attacks of potential worth: Discharge, Thunderbolt, Dragon Pulse, Thunder, Hidden Power, Shadow Ball, Psychic, Flamethrower, Heat Wave, Charge Beam, Surf, Vacuum Wave, Ancientpower, Signal Beam, Draco Meteor.
- Non-attacking moves of potential worth: Morning Sun, Thunder Wave, Glare, Roar, Toxic, Hail, Dragon Dance, Sunny Day, Taunt, Light Screen, Protect, Rain Dance, Reflect, Rest, Stealth Rock, Sleep Talk, Substitute, Recover, Aromatherapy, Mirror Coat, Charge, Counter, Knock Off, Magnet Rise, Yawn
- Sunny Day + Rain Dance + Hail + Sandstorm + Morning Sun + Weatherball for flavor.
- Morning Sun is the only form of recovery that is legal with Heat Wave, Yawn, Aromatherapy, Tickle, or Charge. All other moves are legal with Morning Sun and Recover.
- Flamethrower, Heat Wave, and Surf are the only competitive Water or Fire attacks. They offer the necessary coverage without being overpowered. Since Cyclohm should be leaning defensive anyways, I don't think the sweeper-esque high-powered attacks are necessary.
- No other pokemon in OU can run Counter + Mirror Coat. Also, it'll be the only pokemon outside of Deoxys-D to run both + Recover, giving it a little more surprise and niche value.
- No Volt Tackle. I could only put it in level-up, but the competitive moves there both outclass it, imo, and it would be a novelty otherwise.
- No Zap Cannon. 50% accuracy means no one will use it.
- Signal Beam > Bug Buzz because Bug Buzz could only be level-up and would take out one of my other competitive moves, and Signal Beam is tutorable.
Also, it can now run Counter + Mirror Coat + Recover, which would make it the only pokemon in OU to run Counter and Mirror Coat, and the only pokemon outside of Ubers to run both plus recovery. Let me know if that's too overpowered.
There you have it. Let me know how I can make it better, pleez.
What parts specifically need more fine-tuning?
Level up moves:
Dragon pulse, Thunder wave ( maybe glare), and whirlwind, spikes are all nice moves here.
Egg moves Dragon
I didn't put anything notable here, pursuit may be alright but its very gimmicky.
TMs
The bolded moves are moves I think could be used competitively. I didn't want this moveset to be a jack of all trades moveset, something more predictable. Think of this making it a special metagross.
Move tutors
Very very important moves. Draco meteor could be used for a powerful STAB. Synthesis is a usefull healing move, and trick is usefull for a choice Trick set.
I'm open to all feedback. This is my first moveset so it will probably need lots.
Code:
HS Charm
HS Glare
HS Fake out
1 Tackle
1 Growl
5 Howl
7 Thundershock
15 Thunder wave
25 Dragon rage
30 Thunder fang
35 Whirlwind
40 Spikes
45 Thunderbolt
50 Dragon pulse
60 Hyper beamEgg moves Dragon
Code:
Dragonbreath
Aqua tail
Tail whip
Body slam
Pursuit
FlailTMs
Code:
TM02 - Dragon Claw
TM03 - Water Pulse
[B]TM05 - Roar[/B]
TM06 - Toxic
TM09 - Bullet Seed
[B]TM10 - Hidden Power[/B]
TM11 - Sunny Day
TM12 - Taunt
TM15 - Hyper Beam
TM17 - Protect
TM18 - Rain Dance
TM20 - Safeguard
TM21 - Frustration
TM22 - SolarBeam
TM23 - Iron Tail
[B]TM24 - Thunderbolt
TM25 - Thunder[/B]
TM27 - Return
[B]TM30 - Shadow Ball[/B]
TM32 - Double Team
[B]TM33 - Reflect[/B]
TM34 - Shock Wave
[B]TM35 - Flamethrower
TM38 - Fire Blast[/B]
TM42 - Facade
TM43 - Secret Power
TM44 - Rest
TM45 - Attract
[B]TM51 - Roost[/B]
[B]TM55 - Brine[/B]
[B]TM57 - Charge Beam[/B]
TM58 - Endure
[B]TM59 - Dragon Pulse[/B]
[B]TM61 - Will-o-wisp[/B]
TM68 - Giga Impact
TM77 - Psych Up
TM78 - Captivate
[B]TM79 - Dark Pulse[/B]
TM80 - Rock Slide
TM82 - Sleep Talk
TM90 - Substitute
TM91 - Flash Cannon
[B]TM92 - Trick Room[/B]
HM02 - Fly
HM07 - WaterfallMove tutors
Code:
Draco meteor
Synthesis
TrickI'm open to all feedback. This is my first moveset so it will probably need lots.
Hope it helped
Ahh thanks, I forgot to bold that. I changed a few other things around too.
Edit:I forgot movetutor moves. Ill have those up in a moment.
Edit:I forgot movetutor moves. Ill have those up in a moment.
DK/tennis's is perfect and is pretty much what I invisioned
heheh Spiffy used Slack Off
heheh Spiffy used Slack Off
When did special Ice Moves become non-competitive? Ice Beam still outdamages STAB Dragon Pulse on Salamence and Flygon and hits Zapdos for SE damage.
We never approved of Ice Moves in the Attacking Moves Discussion.
Also Added Weather Ball as a Heart Scale move. Its best use is probably solely vs. Zapdos in a Sandstorm. Otherwise I'm hard-pressed to think of instances where it is superior to Thunderbolt, considering the most common OU Fire types are Infernape and Heatran, and Weavile fails to function in Sandstorm and additionally hates paralysis.
We never approved of Ice Moves in the Attacking Moves Discussion.
Also Added Weather Ball as a Heart Scale move. Its best use is probably solely vs. Zapdos in a Sandstorm. Otherwise I'm hard-pressed to think of instances where it is superior to Thunderbolt, considering the most common OU Fire types are Infernape and Heatran, and Weavile fails to function in Sandstorm and additionally hates paralysis.
Small edit made, I'll be making this my Final Submission.
Level-Up Moves
TM/HM Moves
Egg Moves (Dragon, Monster)
Move Tutor Moves
Standout Moves
Physical: Outrage, Earthquake, Dragon Claw, Return, Aqua Tail
Special: Dragon Pulse, Draco Meteor, Thunderbolt, Thunder, Discharge, Signal Beam, Vacuum Wave, Flamethrower, Fire Blast, Overheat, Tri Attack, Shadow Ball, Surf, Hydro Pump
Support: Slack Off, Thunder Wave, Whirlwind (Roar), Mirror Coat, Dragon Dance, Taunt, Light Screen, Reflect, Stealth Rock, Yawn, Curse, Counter, Knock Off
Exclusions
-Volt Tackle. It would only be even remotely viable on a Dragon Dance set, and I don't think that this should be used as a physical attacker, anyway.
-Bug Buzz. I really don't see it fitting on this Pokemon, and Signal Beam is already a decent option, though I am still torn on this one, so if enough people give good enough reasons for it, I will add it in.
Level-Up Moves
Code:
H. Tri Attack
H. Slack Off
1. Thundershock
1. Leer
5. Charge
8. Thunder Wave
14. Spark
20. Dragonbreath
25. Mist
31. Rain Dance
36. Whirlwind
43. Weather Ball
48. Mirror Coat
53. Dragon Dance
59. Dragon Pulse
67. Thunder
Code:
TM02-Dragon Claw
TM03-Water Pulse
TM05-Roar
TM06-Toxic
TM07-Hail
TM10-Hidden Power
TM11-Sunny Day
TM12-Taunt
TM15-Hyper Beam
TM16-Light Screen
TM17-Protect
TM18-Rain Dance
TM20-Safeguard
TM21-Frustration
TM23-Iron Tail
TM24-Thunderbolt
TM25-Thunder
TM26-Earthquake
TM27-Return
TM30-Shadow Ball
TM32-Double Team
TM33-Reflect
TM34-Shock Wave
TM35-Flamethrower
TM38-Fire Blast
TM41-Torment
TM42-Façade
TM43-Secret Power
TM44-Rest
TM45-Attract
TM50-Overheat
TM57-Charge Beam
TM58-Endure
TM59-Dragon Pulse
TM62-Silver Wind
TM65-Shadow Claw
TM66-Payback
TM68-Giga Impact
TM70-Flash
TM73-Thunder Wave
TM76-Stealth Rock
TM77-Psych Up
TM78-Captivate
TM82-Sleep Talk
TM83-Natural Gift
TM87-Swagger
TM90-Substitute
TM92-Trick Room
HM03-Surf
HM04-Strength
HM06-Rock Smash
Code:
Yawn (Kingdra, Slowbro, Slowking)
Scary Face (Salamence, Charizard)
Curse (Slowbro, Slowking, Torterra)
Hydro Pump (Blastoise, Gyarados, Feraligatr, Kingdra)
Fire Spin (Charizard)
Slam (Dragonite, Sceptile)
Dragon Rush (Dragonite, Garchomp)
Refresh (Altaria, Milotic)
Discharge (Ampharos)
Code:
Draco Meteor
Air Cutter
Ominous Wind
Vacuum Wave
Magnet Rise
Snore
Swift
Uproar
AncientPower
Aqua Tail
Outrage
Signal Beam
Counter
Knock OffPhysical: Outrage, Earthquake, Dragon Claw, Return, Aqua Tail
Special: Dragon Pulse, Draco Meteor, Thunderbolt, Thunder, Discharge, Signal Beam, Vacuum Wave, Flamethrower, Fire Blast, Overheat, Tri Attack, Shadow Ball, Surf, Hydro Pump
Support: Slack Off, Thunder Wave, Whirlwind (Roar), Mirror Coat, Dragon Dance, Taunt, Light Screen, Reflect, Stealth Rock, Yawn, Curse, Counter, Knock Off
Exclusions
-Volt Tackle. It would only be even remotely viable on a Dragon Dance set, and I don't think that this should be used as a physical attacker, anyway.
-Bug Buzz. I really don't see it fitting on this Pokemon, and Signal Beam is already a decent option, though I am still torn on this one, so if enough people give good enough reasons for it, I will add it in.
My turn. I'm new to this.
Level Up
Egg Moves Dragon/ Monster
TMs/ HMs
Tutor Moves
That's pretty much it.
Level Up
Code:
1. Weather Ball
5. Twister
5. Gust
12. Mist
18. Charge
21. Tailwind
27. Rain Dance
27. Sunny Day
32. ThunderBolt
38. DragonBreath
41. Heat Wave
46. Haze
52. Thunder Fang
59. Tri Attack
65. Dragon Claw
73. Thunder
Code:
Yawn
Outrage
Hydro Pump
Crunch
Reflect
Dragon
Dragon
Ice Beam
Code:
TM02 Dragon Claw
TM03 Water Pulse
TM05 Roar
TM06 Toxic
TM07 Hail
TM10 Hidden Power
TM12 Taunt
TM15 Hyper Beam
TM17 Protect
TM18 Rain Dance
TM20 Safeguard
TM21 Frustration
TM23 Iron Tail
TM24 Thunderbolt
TM25 Thunder
TM27 Return
TM29 Psychic
TM30 Shadow Ball
TM31 Brick Break
TM32 Double Team
TM34 Shock Wave
TM35 Flamethrower
TM38 Fire Blast
TM40 Aerial Ace
TM41 Torment
TM42 Facade
TM43 Secret Power
TM44 Rest
TM45 Attract
TM46 Thief
TM51 Roost
TM56 Fling
TM57 Charge Beam
TM58 Endure
TM59 Dragon Pulse
TM62 Silver Wind
TM63 Embargo
TM65 Shadow Claw
TM68 Giga Impact
TM70 Flash
TM73 Thunder Wave
TM77 Psych Up
TM78 Captivate
TM79 Dark Pulse
TM80 Rock Slide
TM82 Sleep Talk
TM83 Natural Gift
TM87 Swagger
TM88 Pluck
TM90 Substitute
TM91 Flash Cannon
HM03 Surf
HM04 Strength
HM05 Defog
HM06 Rock SmashTutor Moves
Code:
Air cutter
Icy Wind
Ominous Wind
Vacuum Wave
ThunderPunch
Zen Headbutt
Magnet Rise
Snore
Uproar
Bounce
Aqua Tail
Outrage
Signal Beam
Twister
Draco MeteorApart from my own, DK's is looking pretty nice. I have a quick comment to make on bumfacepik's movepool- since Fake Out was never approved in the Attacking(or Support?) Moves Discussion, it can't be used, which is also why nobody is using Ice Beam/Blizzard.
Honest question from a movepool n00b re: DK's movepool:
How strictly should movepool creators be following this guide? I'd like to fix up my submission a bit, and since a lot of people seem to be supporting this movepool, I was wondering if I would be able to throw some more competitive moves in the level-up and egg sections as well.
His level-up list has Gravity, Charge, Stun Spore, Discharge, Slack Off, Dragon Dance, and Volt Tackle as competitive non-TM moves.
He has Yawn, Hydro Pump, Overheat, Curse, Fire Fang, Thunder Fang, Haze, and Block as Egg moves.
He's got 15.
How strictly should movepool creators be following this guide? I'd like to fix up my submission a bit, and since a lot of people seem to be supporting this movepool, I was wondering if I would be able to throw some more competitive moves in the level-up and egg sections as well.
Yeah, 15. Nice try. You go ahead and make a reliably competitive set with Charge, Yawn, Haze, Block, or Gravity. If you can find time to use them.
Adamiral Korski, what and which moves are considered competitive depends on the current CAP Pokemon. For CAP8 Gravity, Haze, Block, Fire/Thunder Fang, and Charge would be considered non-competitive . Dragon Dance, Volt Tackle, Curse, and probably Yawn are somewhat competitive but not so much.
Edit: beaten to the punch
Edit: beaten to the punch
Was going to say that you need to fix that overload of moves within the level-up but you already fixed that. They're nothing wrong about you submission from a guideline point of view, just the lack of Discharge within you movepool which is more of a personal taste really. You could probably replace it with Thunderbolt within your level-up since it already gets it as a TM.
To expand on this, a movepool is not binary. There are generally three classes on moves: Competitive, Marginal/Gimmicky, and Useless. I tend to put on a lot of loves that fall into the Marginal/Gimmicky category. Any pokemon set is going to have a primary attack and a secondary attack, and the rest of the moves are either coverage or marginal/gimmicky moves.
Yawn for example has terrible synergy with Static, although it can work with Shield Dust. Yawn is near useless on a Static utilizing set. The opponent may attack and get paralyzed, meaning you wasted your Yawn Turn, possibly two if you tried to use it again to predict a switch.
I like DK's apart from the exclusion of Fire Blast and incompatability between Hydro Pump. Honestly, everything apart from the Choice sets will be using some form of non-attacking move, limiting the choice to one coverage move, and I don't why we can't have the option to run both fire+water on a set.
IMO the best in current form are Aero's and Stellars.
IMO the best in current form are Aero's and Stellars.
Thanks for the response, DK. I thought the guide was only referencing moves that were considered competitive on their own (like not Thundershock or Leer), not competitive based on that particular pokemon or based on possible movesets (in this case, not including DD/physical attacks), but I can see now how I read it wrong.
I see. I actually had it in there in the old list, but I took it out since I saw no reason for it. I'll put it back if any others support it though. I just rememebered that it's paralysis percentage is 30%, which is a nice number (but is it tradable for the power drop?). Even if it's just minor, whoever has anything to say on it, please give your opinion.
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