Lanturn (OU Parafusion)



Lanturn

Hi C&C. I just uploaded the rest of the OU Lanturn update and I noticed that there was no discussion anywhere about the OU Parafusion set. While it's not nearly as excellent in a random team as the OU Substitute + Charge Beam set is, it's certainly good enough to be of niche value in the tier, so I think it deserves a rewrite as well.

Status:
Copyediting (GP Checking Stage)
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[SET]
name: OU Parafusion
move 1: Thunder Wave
move 2: Confuse Ray
move 3: Thunderbolt / Discharge
move 4: Ice Beam / Surf
item: Leftovers
ability: Volt Absorb
nature: Calm
evs: 36 HP / 220 Def / 252 SpD

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>Lanturn is a relatively bulky Pokemon with a valuable niche in the OU metagame. Investing in Lanturn's bulk makes him a very effective defensive Pokemon, and his movepool further enables him to be a great staller. Thunder Wave is paired with Confuse Ray to give the opponent a mere 3/8 chance to move every turn.</p>

<p>Playing with this set is relatively simple, but still requires some forethought. On Lanturn's first turn out, he can either use Confuse Ray or Thunder Wave. Thunder Wave will catch Pokemon that are not immune to Electric-type attacks, which then allows Lanturn to outspeed them the following turn and hit them with Confuse Ray. However, as this strategy fails against Ground-type Pokemon and other Pokemon that are immune to Electric-type moves, like Electivire and Jolteon, leading with Confuse Ray also works. The problems with using Confuse Ray first are that you're missing out on the true status effect, paralysis, on the opposing Pokemon and that Lanturn isn't guaranteed to hit the opponent with Thunder Wave before being attacked in return.</p>

<p>As for attacking moves, Thunderbolt and Ice Beam are preferred to form the infamous BoltBeam coverage combo. Discharge can be used over Thunderbolt if you'd like Lanturn to have a handy chance of paralyzing opponents while doing some damage. Additionally, Lanturn's secondary STAB move, Surf, is very effective for putting down opposing Fire-types, as well as Ground-type Pokemon that are neutral to Ice-type attacks, so it may be worth considering over Ice Beam.</p>

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

<p>The EV spread is fairly straightforward for a defensive Pokemon. 36 HP EVs hit a Leftovers number, and maximizing Special Defense investment with a Calm nature is critical for switching into Starmie over the course of a match. The rest of the EVs are placed in Defense to bolster that lower defensive stat. Leftovers goes without saying on Lanturn to give it some semblance of durability. Substitute is an option over either an attacking move or Confuse Ray to scout for switch-ins and to guarantee Lanturn a free turn. If using Substitute over an attacking move, Surf becomes the recommended attack due to its great neutral coverage.</p>

<p>It's not often that you can say this about a Pokemon, but Lanturn actually pairs exceptionally well with Togekiss. Togekiss can switch into Grass- and Ground-type attacks aimed at Lanturn and abuse paralysis with Serene Grace Air Slash's flinch rate to form the paraflinch combo. In return, Lanturn will happily switch into the Ice- and Electric-type attacks that Togekiss lures, and resists all of the common moves that Starmie and other threats will throw at Togekiss. Jirachi also partners well with Lanturn thanks to Serene Grace Iron Head and its ability to effortlessly switch into Grass-type attacks. Both Lanturn and Jirachi fear Ground-type attacks, though, so other partners should cover that. Generally speaking, even teams without Togekiss or Jirachi should benefit from Lanturn's ability to check Starmie and other users of the BoltBeam attacking combo, such as some variants of Zapdos.</p>
 

Aeron Ee1

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Isn't this already on site but with 40 HP / 252 Def / 216 SpD? O_o.
http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/lanturn

Name Item Ability Nature
OU Parafusion
Leftovers Volt Absorb Calm
Moveset EVs
~ Confuse Ray
~ Thunder Wave
~ Thunderbolt
~ Ice Beam / Surf
40 HP / 216 Def / 252 SpD
If you're looking to use Lanturn in the land of OU, this set is the way to go. "Parafusion" is a strategy that includes inducing both paralysis and confusion on the opponent. This means that for 5 turns out of 8, the notion of "stop hitting yourself" will be quite valid for the opponent. This strategy is quite easy to pull off with Lanturn's unique set of resistances, allowing it to come in several times during the match and cripple the opponent. The best way to utilize the combination is to paralyze first and to then use Confuse Ray. This way, if Lanturn gets the paralysis off, it's guaranteed to get the confusion off as well. However, this is obviously not always possible due to Ground-types, Jolteon, and opposing Lanturn, so the reverse is possible too; just note that the combination will not be guaranteed in that situation.

Thunderbolt and Ice Beam are the recommended attacking moves because of their near flawless coverage, which helps Lanturn compensate for its below average Special Attack stat. Discharge is an option over Thunderbolt for an easier chance at paralysis. However, it isn't the recommended choice because Thunder Wave is already on the set, and being able to control what you paralyze is very important. For example, you don't want to accidentally paralyze something you intended to put to sleep with a different Pokemon. In addition, Thunderbolt allows Lanturn an 87% chance to OHKO a min/min Gyarados even if Stealth Rock is not up, while Discharge has no chance without Stealth Rock. Discharge also cannot guarantee an OHKO on BulkyGyara even if Stealth Rock is up, while Thunderbolt can. Ice Beam is needed so that Lanturn can beat Celebi, Gliscor, and Zapdos one-on-one while also netting OHKOs on the 4x weak Dragons, provided Stealth Rock is up. Surf is a possibility in the last slot if you find that Lanturn has a lot of trouble with Magnezone or Mamoswine, but it's less useful than Ice Beam due to the poor coverage.

The EV spread is tailored for survival in the OU metagame. The biggest difference is the large amount of Defense EVs. Defense EVs are an absolute necessity for Lanturn's survival in OU because without them, many unboosted neutral attacks can 2HKO it, and even resisted attacks take off massive chunks of damage. It should be noted that with these Defense EVs, Lanturn is easily able to survive a Life Orb MixMence's Earthquake. In addition, without any Defense EVs, Lanturn is 2HKOed by a +1 Life Orb Waterfall from Gyarados, but with them it doesn't even come close to a 2HKO. Lastly, these Defense EVs let Lanturn take next to nothing from Choice Band Scizor's Bullet Punch, making it a great switch-in to a very common move. Therefore, after maxing out Special Defense and reaching 401 HP for a Leftovers number, the rest of the EVs should be dumped into Defense. This will allow Lanturn to parafuse a much wider variety of opponents. This EV spread also works very well in UU, where it makes a great counter to Arcanine while acting as a check to Blaziken and Azumarill. It also helps Lanturn take non-STAB Earthquakes relatively well if it has no choice. Surf is recommended over Ice Beam in UU as Fire-types are much more common, as well as Steelix and other slow Ground-types.

Since Lanturn's job is to spread paralysis and confuse in the process, teammates that benefit from paralyzed opponents will greatly appreciate partnering up with it. Togekiss is the best example of this, as he and Lanturn cover each other's weaknesses extremely well while paralysis helps Togekiss hax things to death with Air Slash. Encore Supporter Togekiss is the best variation of Togekiss to use in tandem with Lanturn, because he can Encore all the Earthquakes aimed at Lanturn with ease, as well as offer Wish support for it. In addition, the two together are staples on a hax team, as they make it nearly impossible for the opponent to move. Dragonite will also greatly appreciate Lanturn's support, as it takes down the Ice Beam wielding bulky Waters with ease, with the exception of Swampert. Lanturn also enjoys their support as they have near-perfect coverage of each other's weaknesses. Teammates with strong Grass-type attacks, such as Venusaur, complement Lanturn very well, as it has a lot of trouble with Swampert, and again, they cover each other's weaknesses. Rotom-C is also helpful for defeating Swampert and covering the Ground weakness, but he also helps against Electivire, who gives Lanturn a bit of trouble. A partner that can kill Blissey is helpful, as Lanturn is helpless against her. Something such as Machamp can fill this role, while being a great partner in hax as well. Lastly, something such as Roserade or Rapid Spinners that can get rid of Toxic Spikes are very helpful to Lanturn's survival, as it becomes very difficult for it to do its job while poisoned.
 
Yes, and I specifically said in the OP that this was a rewrite of that because it is sorely outdated. I even had to still remove mentions of MixMence from it when I uploaded the rest of Lanturn's analysis
 
Discharge needs a slash / mention because it provides a higher chances of paralysis when attacking. I know you have thunderwave for that but getting the opponent paralyzed by attacking means you get an extra opportunity to confuse / attack which could definitely be useful. seeing as this lanturn isn't exactly too strong, the small power drop shouldn't be too noticable.

Looks good other than that,



Or

Approved (1/3)
 
No mention of substitute at all? It is quite useful not only for abusing parafusion, but also scouting for ground-types that cannot be paralyzed, and lanturn is so weak with those evs that is really doesn't matter much if lanturn is missing a move. I think surf should be the first attacking option for this set, or at least the primary option in the fourth slot, because ice beam has basically no use, let alone coverage that "is too important". If Dragonite gets paralyzed then there is no need at all to ice beam it, and shaymin/breloom/celebi outpace and beat lanturn more often then not, especially since two of those have natural cure and the other will be poisoned unless it hasn't switched in yet. I would even say surf is a better option over thunderbolt because thunder wave already makes gyarados completely useless, and thunderbolt cannot do much to suicune and vaporeon anyways, so paralyzing those two would be sufficient. So surf is more useful I think, also because there are many more pros of using surf too, basically hitting a lot more stuff for super effective/neutral damage.
 
doephtic said:
The current EVs add up to 512, maybe drop four off of defense?
Fixed. That was a typo on my part. Thanks!
Cost said:
No mention of substitute at all?
Playing with Substitute is something that is really better left to a boosting set. Once behind a Substitute, parafusion Lanturn can't really do much, especially since it had to sacrifice either an important coverage move or one of its supporting moves to go under in the first place. Substitute + Thunder Wave lacks the flinch support that something like Jirachi or Togekiss have to abuse, Substitute + Confuse Ray is pretty pointless, and Substitute + Confuse Ray + Thunder Wave + one attack leaves you very vulnerable to Taunt and setup threats, such as Gyarados. (And if you don't run Surf / Ice Beam, you have massive issues with actually posing a threat once parafusion is set up). I really think that keeping Substitute on the Substitute + Charge beam set is the way to go and sticking with what I have in the OP here is the way to go for parafusion.

I welcome further QC and non-QC input on the matter, though.
 
Maybe not a slash or anything, but I agree that Substitute should get a mention in AC somewhere for the Surf/Ice Beam slot. I know it is lame to be walled completely by Ground-types, but it's really damn annoying if you don't have an immunity to Electric-type attacks to finally be able to move, only to break a Substitute. I don't feel strongly about this suggestion or anything, but IMO it is worth a mention. Other than that, I approve. I'll wait to hear your response before stamping though.
 
I still feel that if you're thinking of using Substitute Lanturn, you should always use Substitute + Charge Beam, but if you really think that it deserves an AC mention I'll put it there.
 
just reminding you that if sub is used, you'll have one attack, so the attack should probably be surf. definitely not thunderbolt or discharge because one of the reasons you would use sub would be to scout for ground types and there is little use scouting them if you confuse ray is your best and only move

edit: and you never addressed my thoughts about ice beam, i still think surf is the better option for reasons stated above
 

Chou Toshio

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Or maybe it could be Careful and use Waterfall to be an even bigger bitch (ok, only 20% chance of Flinch, but it is still funny).
 
Cost said:
edit: and you never addressed my thoughts about ice beam, i still think surf is the better option for reasons stated above
Everytime I ran Surf + Ice Beam, I hated being walled by bulky Water-type Pokemon. It was even worse when Substitute Kingdra could set up on Lanturn and not have its Substitute broken by either move, where had I ran Thunderbolt that wouldn't have been an issue. Ice Beam and Thunderbolt together are pretty much the best 2-move set of attacking moves he can possibly run. If he's going to run a mono-attack, though, I already mentioned in AC that it should be Surf because Water alone gets the best neutral coverage of his STABs.
 

AccidentalGreed

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I slightly second Cost's Ice Beam suggestion due to teammates and Thunder Wave. I like taking out random Infernapes without having to resort to a large chunk of my health. However, I believe that Water + Electric is the better coverage, not Water + Ice as Dusk has tested out. Better coverage in the long run.

ChouToshio said:
Or maybe it cold be Careful and use Waterfall to be an even bigger bitch (ok, only 20% chance of Flinch, but it is still funny).
I know that isn't a serious suggestion, lol. Togekiss is there to help you.
 

Super Mario Bro

All we ever look for
Ya, Surf is probably better than Ice Beam because Dragonite can OHKO you with EQ, and Ice Beam does not do enough to Celebi/Shaymin. Ice Beam's only purpose is to deter a switch from these guys, but Surf has better overall utility. At best, Ice Beam should be slashed to the right of Surf.
 
Surf + Thunderbolt invites in Pokemon with STAB on one of the only two types Lanturn is weak to. What's worse is that most of these Pokemon don't even care about Thunder Wave because they have Natural Cure. I agree that hitting shit like Infernape and Heatran super effectively is great, but these Pokemon lack super effective STABs to use against Lanturn, whereas those Grass-types maim you. I think that Thunderbolt + Ice Beam is absolutely the best primary option, with Thunderbolt + Surf a close second. I also hate the idea of Roserade setting up freely against Lanturn.
 

Super Mario Bro

All we ever look for
Surf + Thunderbolt invites in Pokemon with STAB on one of the only two types Lanturn is weak to. What's worse is that most of these Pokemon don't even care about Thunder Wave because they have Natural Cure. I agree that hitting shit like Infernape and Heatran super effectively is great, but these Pokemon lack super effective STABs to use against Lanturn, whereas those Grass-types maim you. I think that Thunderbolt + Ice Beam is absolutely the best primary option, with Thunderbolt + Surf a close second. I also hate the idea of Roserade setting up freely against Lanturn.
Without SpA EVs, Ice Beam isn't hitting super effective targets for much damage at all.

Vs. 252 HP/136 SpD Calm Roserade: 25.9% - 30.9%

Lanturn is still set-up bait because Roserade can Rest off the damage and/or hit Lanturn hard with STAB Energy Ball/Leaf Storm. I wouldn't sacrifice a perfectly good STAB move for hitting grass types on the switch for mediocre damage.
 
you are right r_d, grass-types do like to switch in, and you are also right about them not caring about twave, but ice beam does not help at all, which you should have figured out by now when you tested ice beam. as i said before, grass-types don't mind ice beams as smb's calc helps show, and they all outpace you to begin with so it doesn't even matter. the reason why surf is a better option is not because it hits stuff super effectively, but because it hits a lot of stuff neutrally, which isn't amazing or anything but it is much more practical than ice beam. you keep saying tbolt+ice beam is so good together, but it just isn't in lanturn's case.

also, naive heatran's earth power is a 2hko about half the time with stealth rock damage, so surf is helpeful
 
Hrm.. Yes, I see your point. I ran some calcs and then battled some on PL using Surf + Thunderbolt over Ice Beam + Thunderbolt. Lanturn had particular issues with the 2 4x Ice-weak OU Dragons, but I definitely did fare better against Heatran with Surf. I think it really depends on the team, but maybe you guys are right.
 
dragonite should be handled by paralyzing it on the switch (from there you don't even need ice beam to beat it), and it is much, much harder to actually predict dragonite coming in and ice beaming because it will rarely be coming in anyways fearing twave, and when it comes in after something dies, not paralyzed, it'll ohko lanturn. same goes for flygon except you can't even paralyze it (it is easier to predict coming in but that's not reliable at all)
 
I know how to predict, yes. If not running Substitute, it's always safer to Confuse Ray on the switch for hitting the Thunder Wave-immune Pokemon that switch in. After that, you can either attack if you maim the target, Thunder Wave if it's a problem Pokemon, or switch out if it's really bad. When I ran Ice Beam on Lanturn, nailing Flygon and Dragonite as they attempted to do anything was generally very successful.
 
you mean nail them as you hope for confusion or what? cause that's not reliable and dragonite/flygon is eqing every time. or u-turn
 

panamaxis

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Lanturn annoys the hell out of me.



But that doesn't mean it can't be good
I don't think substitute is worth it on this set, you'd be losing a coverage move then which you can't really afford to do and if you're going to drop confuse ray you might and have sub + 2 attacks you might as well use more offensive EVs imo.
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