Bug Arceus (Analysis) [QC 0/2]

Bug Arceus

[OVERVIEW]
<p>Although Bug Arceus has the often looked down upon Stealth Rock weakness, it is hardly a Pokemon to overlook. With base 120 stats down the board, even with no investment, Bug Arceus takes hits incredibly well. With the phenomenal coverage that Bug STAB brings in Ubers, being resisted by only six Pokemon in the tier (factoring in other types of Arceus), Bug Arceus is a phenomenal asset to any team. You might laugh at it as it takes 25% from Stealth Rock switching in, but you won't be laughing when it sweeps your entire team if you are unprepared.</p>

[SET]
Name: Calm Mind
move 1: Calm Mind
move 2: Judgement
move 3: Ice Beam
move 4: Recover
item: Insect Plate
evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
nature: Timid
[SET COMMENTS]
<p>The classic Arceus Calm Mind set from fourth generation returns with a new twist, the lack of a restriction on Effort Values. With this, Arceus is no longer forced to cap at 331 Speed and 301 Special Attack. Bug Arceus can now run 252 in any Effort Value, allowing Timid Bug Arceus to reach 372 Speed and 339 special attack, which allows Bug Arceus to maximize its offensive potential. After a single Calm Mind, Bug Arceus has a Special Attack of 508 and a Special Defense of 414. Bug-Typed Judgement is a phenomenal asset, being able to hit most of the Ubers tier neutrally, and hitting Pokemon like Latios, Latias and Mewtwo super-effectively. Bug also hits most of the tier for neutral damage, with notable exceptions being Giratina, Dialga and Rayquaza. That is where your second move choice comes in. Ice Beam does 49.3% - 58.4% to Wall Giratina after a Calm Mind as well, which is a guarenteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock. Rayquaza is OHKO'd by Ice Beam. </p>

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
<p>Focus Blast gives you coverage on Steel and Rock types, but the 70% accuracy is fairly unreliable. You can run a bulky set, eschewing immediate power to allow the ability to gain more Calm Minds. If you wish to use this, then a Calm nature is recommended, with 252 HP / 4 SpA /252 Spe. A Bold nature is also acceptable in this case. </p>



[Set]
name: Swords Dance
move 1: Swords Dance
move 2: X-Scissor
move 3: Stone Edge
move 4: Earthquake/Recover
item: Insect Plate
evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
nature: Jolly / Adamant

<p>Another classic Arceus set, the ability to maximize Effort Values in stats allows Bug Arceus to fully take advantage of its massive base stats. After a single Swords Dance, Bug Arceus reaches a massive Attack of 678, which allows it to easilly smash any unprepared opponent. X-Scissor is the obligitory STAB attack, getting great coverage on most of the Uber tier. Stone Edge allows you to hit the flying dragons of the ubers tier for super effective damage, as well as Ho-Oh, while Earthquake adds coverage for Dialga and other steel types. Recover can be used as a reliable recovery move.</p>


[Other Options]
<p>Bug Arceus has a massive movepool, but many of the moves it receives are not the most competitively viable moves. Bug Arceus can use Cosmic Power, which boosts both its Defense and Special Defense to attempt to run a wall set, however, other Arceus forms are more adept at performing this. If you have rain support, Thunder is an option on the Calm Mind set. Earth Power and Fire Blast are good coverage moves to use, however, you lose coverage against flying types if you give up Ice Beam to fit one of them in. Substitute can be used to block status from Blissey. </p>

[Checks and Counters]
<p>Ho-Oh can easilly eliminate Bug Arceus with its massive Attack stat and either of its STABs. If it's raining, Ho-Oh can just simply OHKO with Brave Bird. Chansey and Blissey can easily handle the Calm Mind set, although if Bug Arceus is able to set up multiple Calm Minds, the end result for Blissey will not be positive. Groudon can eliminate the Swords Dancer set, able to essentially double Bug Arceus's Fire weakness and deal a massive amount of damage with Fire Punch or Stone Edge. Skarmory is another useful counter for the Swords Dance set, as it takes neutral damage from Stone Edge and can Whirlwind Bug Arceus away, or simply KO with Brave Bird. Choice Scarf Terakion can handle both sets, provided it does not switch in on an Earthquake or Focus Blast Dragon types can take advantage of the sun that Groudon brings, being able to fire off boosted Fire Blasts, while Reshirom can brutalize Bug Arceus with Blue Fire. Heatran can perform similarly, blasting Bug Arceus with its STAB. Other Arceus forms, namely Steel and Fire Arceus can set up along side Bug Arceus and hit it with their STAB move of choice. Bulk Up Dialga can defeat the Calm Mind set one-on-one due to its typing and general bulk, however, watch out for the rare Earth Power or Focus Blast. Giratina can come in on the Swords Dance set and cripple Bug Arceus with Will-o-Wisp.</p>

[DREAM WORLD]
<p>Arceus does not receive a Dream World ability, but it hardly needs one, considering the versatility that Multitype allows him to have. Shadow Tag Chandelure can trap Bug Arceus and deal a massive amount of damage with STAB Fire Blast. </p>

Alrighty, that should be everything. Feel free to comment now

I notice that the overview largely refers to Arceus as itself, and hardly at all on the perks of the Bug typing itself. I'd suggest elaborating a bit on the virtues of being such a strong Bug-typed thing in Ubers, that is, why players should use Bug Arceus instead of just going with one of the other forms.

It felt pretty redundant to keep using Bug in front of it all the time, but on second thought, yeah.

Nice set! Hi JRP

jonathanrp said:

It felt pretty redundant to keep using Bug in front of it all the time, but on second thought, yeah.

Click to expand...

If you didn't have it in the previous overview, you might as well have been describing regular Arceus. :P I think what you have right now is good, but some elaboration couldn't hurt...

I was wondering, are there any specific resistances that Bug grants which are exceptionally useful in Ubers? I know Dark, Ghost and Ground, which are pretty good, but not the most widespread types in Ubers far as I know... still pretty good... I was kind of wondering if a more defensive set would be warranted, but it sounds like offense is where it's at with Bug Arceus.

EDIT: Ho-oh is pretty much the bane of this Arceus' existence with both its STABs, it should be the first counter mentioned in that section, IMO. :O Also, you mention Mewtwo twice in the set comments for Cm when you talk about the things it can hit supereffectively, LOL.

Bug is not a good defensive typing in Ubers, tbh, taking neutral or super-effective damage from most attacks.

Ho-Oh should be listed as the first counter to either set, as it can KO with Brave Bird regardless of the weather. CM Bug Arceus is also highly susceptible to Toxic Spikes if you feel that deserves mention.

The second set is missing an item.

jonathanrp said:

Bug-Typed Judgement is a phenomenal asset, being able to hit most of the Ubers tier neutrally, and hitting Pokemon like Mewtwo, Latios, Latios and Mewtwo super-effectively. Bug also hits most of the tier for neutral damage, with notable exceptions being Giratina, Dialga and the incredibly defensive Nattorei.

Click to expand...

Latios is listed twice, and nattorei takes neutral damage from bug judgment.

Looks good!

Alright, fixed all the repeats and moved the comments on Nattorei. How on earth did I forget about Ho-Oh? Ho-Oh is listed as the main counter.

its probably safe to take Groudon off the counters list as Fire Punch is a gen 4-only move (http://www.serebii.net/pokedex-bw/383.shtml, scroll to the bottom), and only Scarfed variants should be outspeeding Arceus. I've seen a few sets running around that have replaced it with Overheat but I don't see those becoming commonplace. I would make a mention of the sun it brings however and that it can make many Dragon types more viable counters/checks with their un-STABed Fire attacks.

Changed to overheat, added tidbit about dragons, mentioned (how did I forget Reshirom) in the counters.

I love this verison of arecues. Bug in ubers is a monster.

Thanks for the move set on the cm but why not have thunder on him instead of focus blast. Then you can anti kyogre as well.

ak_Archangel said:

I love this verison of arecues. Bug in ubers is a monster.

Thanks for the move set on the cm but why not have thunder on him instead of focus blast. Then you can anti kyogre as well.

Click to expand...

Thunder is listed as an option with rain support

Sphyxius said:

its probably safe to take Groudon off the counters list as Fire Punch is a gen 4-only move (http://www.serebii.net/pokedex-bw/383.shtml, scroll to the bottom), and only Scarfed variants should be outspeeding Arceus. I've seen a few sets running around that have replaced it with Overheat but I don't see those becoming commonplace. I would make a mention of the sun it brings however and that it can make many Dragon types more viable counters/checks with their un-STABed Fire attacks.

Click to expand...

No. For one, Fire Punch is still available on Groudon as you can simply transfer it over with the move.

Second, Groudon is still a counter to Bug Arceus. 4 Atk Impish Groudon still 2HKOs with Stone Edge and can paralyze or phaze Bug Arceus, crippling it. Paradancer Groudon can paralyze and follow up with a Stone Edge, and CB Groudon does use sun-boosted Fire Punch.

what was I thinking, yeah, you can transfer moves

so yeah, if any one has anything else to say comment wise, or suggestions, that'd be great

So, I am just wondering if there are any big advantages to using Arceus-Bug over the other Arceus types, particularly Arceus-Dark, other than dealing with Darkrai (and maybe Mewtwo?) slightly better. I have found Bug to be a rather poor defensive type, with key weaknesses to Fire and Rock, while only resisting one notable STAB type: Ground. Even then, you are demolished by the common coverage types Rock and Fire. Am I missing anything major?

Ground and Fighting resistances are cool, and being able to hit both Psychic's and Darks is nice.

That said...

-Too many slashes on the Calm Mind set:

[SET]
Name: Calm Mind
move 1: Calm Mind
move 2: Judgement
move 3: Ice Beam
move 4: Recover
item: Insect Plate
evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
nature: Timid

Timid should be the only acceptable nature as you need the Speed. Focus Blast is more useful than Fire Blast due to covering both Steel-types and Rock-types, and Bug Arceus isn't the best at using Substitute due to its SR weakness, so take that off.

Mention that bulkier spread in the AC. (252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Spe)

-Swords Dance:

[Set]
name: Swords Dance
move 1: Swords Dance
move 2: X-Scissor
move 3: Stone Edge
move 4: Earthquake/Recover
item: Insect Plate
evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
nature: Jolly / Adamant

You NEED Stone Edge to do anything to Ho-Oh or the Flying Dragons, so that should be the only option in the third slot. Took off Extremespeed since you shouldn't be trying to play Extremekiller here. (It can still be mentioned in the Additional Comments)

-Optional Changes

Put in Earth Power, Fire Blast, and Substitute (all the moves I removed from earlier sets)

-Counters

Choice Scarf Terakion will destroy you if it comes in on anything but Focus Blast or Earthquake.

-Add Heatran as well.

Dream World

-Mention that Chandelure is a huge threat to Bug Arceus because of Shadow Tag and STAB Fire Blast.

You should also expand the comments and add in teammates and counters to each set, not just the Team Options part. Entry hazard support from stuff like Dialga should also be mentioned in Team Options.

Make these changes and I will approve.

Quick heads up: on the swords dance set, you stated that Bug Arceus reaches up to 778 Attack when you Swords Dance, but its attack only goes up to 678 (Adamant versions go up to 744). Just a nitpick.

[Set]
name: Swords Dance
move 1: Swords Dance
move 2: X-Scissor
move 3: Stone Edge/Extremespeed/Substitute
move 4: Earthquake/Recover
item: Insect Plate
evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
nature: Jolly/Adamant

<p>Another classic Arceus set, the ability to maximize Effort Values in stats allows Bug Arceus to fully take advantage of its massive base stats. After a single Swords Dance, Bug Arceus reaches a massive Attack of 678, which allows it to easilly smash any unprepared opponent. X-Scissor is the obligitory STAB attack, getting great coverage on most of the Uber tier. For the second slot, you have a choice of Stone Edge to OHKO Flying types who try to switch in to you, or Extremespeed to take out pesky Darkrai who might try to Dark Void you. Substitute allows you to block status, which is handy in case of an untimely burn. Earthquake allows you to hit Dialga super-effectively, while Recover is a reliable healing move.<p>

Click to expand...

Other than the changes Fireburn mentioned,

Put in Giratina as a counter to Swords Dance Bug Arceus. It can just burn and stall out Arceus.

Add in Chansey as the Calm Mind set counter. She functions exactly like Blissey.

Include Fire Arceus as counter because it can easily beat the Calm Mind set with it's own Calm Mind set. Dialga can take most attacks and roast Arceus with Fire Blast or Dragon Tail / Roar it out when Arceus gets greedy with Calm Mind boosts.

Bulk Up Dialga can defeant Calm Mind Bug Arceus one-on-one thanks to the resistance and bulk. Skarmory should be mentioned as a great counter to Swords Dance Bug Arceus.

Steel Arceus can easily set up alongside Calm Mind Bug Arceus and eventually beat it down with Judgment due to the typing advantage.

alright, added the changes

Bug Arceus is really rare in Ubers unfortunately.

The analysis looks fine.


QC APPROVED (1/2)

<Nexus> hi I need your mod powers, I PMed jonathanro about his analyses 4 days ago but he refuses to respond so I'm taking them away, can you move his threads to L&O?
<Nexus> and he's been on the whole time

moving for inactivity.