5th Gen Bulky Offensive

[Maloman]

Changes in Bold

Wishmicott@ Leftovers
EV's: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
Nature: Impish [+Def, -SAtk]
Ability: Mischievous Heart
-Taunt
-Substitute
-Leech Seed
-Toxic

Overview: I just have on thing to say about Wishmicott. Cutest thing EVAR! But also with its amazing ability mischievous heart, it becomes one of the fastest anti-leads in the game and one of the fastest sub seeders to add.

EV's: The EV’s are to give this cotton sheep thing all the bulk it can get so it can shut down and set up a substitute on a lot of pokemon.

Moves: Taunt is to shut down set up sweepers like swords dance lucario and grachomp. and butterfly dance Uglamoth. Substitute + leech seed is to force a switch giving me a chance to toxic the switch in and then to stall with jirchi’s wish. I find toxic better move than encore to help with stall which all my teams hate.

Skarmory @ Shed Shell
EV's: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Nature: Relaxed [+Def, -Spe]
Ability: Iron Barbs
-Stealth Rock
-Spikes
-Brave Bird
-Roost

Overview: After putting The Legend Killer's sugggestions into place, skarmory replaced ferrothorn amd or a good reason too. Skarmory can wall a lot of pokemon on sand teams which my team hates a lot. With its extremely high defense and good defensive typing giving it only two weaknesses it can really be a pain only the fire types are gone. Plus it can pretty much wall a specs latios locked into draco meteor. Plus with reliable recovery that helps with stall.

EV's: The EV's are to give skarmory the max amount of physical defense with a careful nature so it can take neutral special hits better even without investment.

Moves: For this set I'm am using both stealth rock and spikes to make KO's easier for pokemon without offensive investment (conkeldurr and jirachi). Brave Bird is to make sure I'm not complete taunt bait while roost is for recovery and for stall.

Garchomp @ Choice Scarf
EV's: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Nature: Jolly [+Spe, -SAtk]
Ability: Overconfidence
-Outrage
-Earthquake
-Dragon Claw
-Aqua Tail

Overview: Since I didn't battle back when garchomp was OU, I never knew if e was a pain or not. But since he was made OU again in 5th Gen he is still a threat. Plus he is still the fastest dragon bar latios and latias but with a choice scarf he can ouitspeed because most latiosare specs or life orbed nowadays. Plus with a base 102 speed it can outspeed dragonite, salamence, hydeigon and I can't remember the last one.

EV's: The EV's are to make sure it can hit hard and outspeed a lot of threats like +1 uglamoth and nasty plot lucario with max speed and max attack.

Moves: The moves are simple, outrage is t take out bulkier threats with dragon claw is for frailer threats that don't resist dragon type moves. Earthquake is to take out non-baloon heatran and chandelure. Aqua tail is to take out tyranitar and that sand crab thing. With these moves and massive attack it can revenge a big chunk of the new metagame.

Conkeldurr @ Leftovers
EV's: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SDef
Nature: Adamant [+Atk, -SAtk]
Ability: Guts
-Bulk Up
-Drain Punch
-Mach Punch
-Stone Edge

Overview: When saw this new fighting type I immediately fell in love with it. Massive attack, modest HP and great abilities make this one of my favorite pokemon EVAR. Plus with bulk up and mach punch to add with it, it is amazing.

EV's: The EV’s are to maximize its special bulk so it does not get hit by a neutral STAB attack and die. With the massive HP it will have enough bulk to survive a couple hits from the special side actually.

Moves: Bulk Up is to raise conkeldurr’s attack and defense evening out its defenses. Drain Punch is to get back any lost HP from bulking up. Mach Punch is for priority for revenge kill. Stone Edge is for uglamoth and it can still take out ghosts. (thanks to jaroda).

Chanderlure @ Choice Scarf
EV's: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spe
Nature: Timid [+Spe, -Atk]
Ability: Shadow Tag
-Fire Blast
-Shadow Ball
-Hidden Power Fighting
-Energy Ball

Overview: Chandelure. One of the most unique type combinations evar but does not help. It has a weakness to stealth rock but when paired with jirachi’s wish it can last a little bit longer. It has a large special attack stat and a great dream world ability that I hope gets released soon.

EV's: The Ev’s are to make it outspeed base 90 pokeon and more with a choice scarf like lucario while maintaining good special attack.

Moves: Fire Blast is for a main STAB but I might opt out for flamethrower. Shadow ball is for another STAB that hits hard with hidden power fighting to revenge kill specs sazandora and jolly max speed Tyranitar. Energy Ball is to revenge kill bulky waters such as swampert. I don't have overheat because I want to use this almost as a scarftran instead of as a revenge killer.

Jirachi @ Leftovers
EV's: 252 HP / 224 Def / 32 Spe
Nature: Bold [+Def , -Atk]
Ability: Serene Grace
-Wish
-Calm Mind
-Thunder Bolt
-Psychic

Overview: Last generation jirachi had a place in almost every single team with its good typing and very modest stats. And now in this gen this has not changed.

EV's: The EV’s are to give jirach an large amount of physical bulk so after a few calm minds it can take a lot of new threats with the large amount of bulk it has plus access to wish. While the speed is to outspeed jolly max speed tyranitar who can check this set very easily.

Moves: Wish is or recovery along with healing other members of my team. Calm mind is so jirachi can get a lot of special bulk and wall even the strongest special attackers. Psychic is for STAB even though there is not a lot of coverage while thunderbolt is for bulky waters like vaporeon and burungeru.

 

[Maloman]

*Reserved for threat list*

 

[Jaroda]

Only three of your pokemon are really bulky, and only two of them are actual attackers. Check out my bulky offense team if you'd like some ideas. http://www.smogon.com/forums/showthread.php?t=83733

Whimsicott doesn't really need speed EVs when all of its moves have +1 priority. Pump those Spd EVs into your defenses.

Ferrothorn is alright.

Salamence doesn't seem like the best choice. Garchomp or Dragonite are likely better. Garchomp for one has two higher speed points and is a better scarfer, also resists SR if that gets set up, receives STAB on EQ and has naturally better bulk. It can't run Draco Meteor but it doesn't really need it.

Meanwhile Dragonite is by far the bulkiest thanks to Multi-Scale and access to Roost, meaning it's no longer a poor man's Salamence. Point being, based on the way you're using your Salamence, either of these two would work much better.

Replace Payback with Stone Edge on Conkeldurr. It helps you get far more important OHKOs and kills most Ghosts anyways.

There's little reason to run Fire Blast over Overheat on a choice set. The power difference is actually immense and it's even more accurate than Fire Blast.

You also have no Water or Ice moves. Sand teams will not be fun.

 

[Maloman]

*bump*

 

[ChaZanG1]

yay for getting completely owned by a 100% doryuuzu

 

[IcyMan28]

Seconding most of what Jaroda said, though Dragonite sucks as a Scarfer compared to Mence, who in turn sucks compared to Garchomp. Go with Jolly Chomp as your scarfer, and use Chandelure for something else, like a Specs set.

yay for getting completely owned by a 100% doryuuzu

Yay Conkeldurr's Mach Punch.

 

[afterburn]

Hey, got your message.

Threats

1. Butterfly Dance Volcarona

So this is a pretty cool team with some unconventional sets, and covering pretty much every threat, so props on that. However this one threat can actually be troublesome. Offensive Volcarona can force out Nattorei, Shandera locked into Energy Ball / Hidden Power Fighting and Salamence locked into Fire Blast. From here it can grab a +1 SAtk, +1 SDef, and +1 Spe boost with Butterfly Dance, and proceed to harass this team with Fire Blast / Flame Dance, Bug Buzz, and Hidden Power Rock. Your only hope against it is to win the Speed tie with Salamence and OHKO with Stone Edge (provided it hits). Volcarona also gets worn out pretty quickly with Spikes / Stealth Rock / Life Orb damage, but it's still a notable threat, especially if hazards aren't up (or have been spun away).


Solutions:

• Solution A: Choice Scarf Garchomp over Salamence

Pretty much what Icyman and Jaroda said, Garchomp performs a much better role as the revenge killer for the team than Salamence for a couple of reasons. Firstly, it does not carry a Stealth Rock weakness with it, in fact, it actually takes reduced damage from Stealth Rock, making it that much easier to switch into threats. Secondly, it has a Speed stat of 102, which means it is able to outspeed Butterfly Dance Volcarona easily and OHKO it with x 4 Super Effective Stone Edge. Additionally, you have a better way of revenge killing Calm Mind Lati@s, since Salamence's Draco Meteor aims for their boosted Special Defense (after a Calm Mind).

Optional Changes:

If you want, you could try out a Specs Chandelure or a Calm Mind variant, since two scarfers is a bit redundant, since they revenge kill the same kind of threats. A Specs or Calm Mind set would take better advantage of the hazards set-up, and also help out take bulky opponents, turning 2HKOs to OHKOs. A Specs variant can weaken out Specially Bulky opponents for Jirachi, whereas a Calm Mind set can set-up reliably alongside Jirachi, the latter taking on threats such as Gyarados, and Chandelure taking on threats such as Heatran. However, I think a Scarf set is better in the long run, since Chandelure already has a fantastic Special Attack stat, and it''s the speed where it really needs help in. Whimsicott should also have 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef, since the Speed doesn't matter at all; it's going to go first anyway thanks to Mischievous Heart, so it doesn't matter how much Speed it carries. The extra bulk helps take hits better anyway.

Movesets:

Choice Scarf Garchomp

Garchomp (F) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Sand Veil
EVs: 252 Atk/ 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly nature (+Spe, -SAtk)
- Outrage
- Earthquake
- Dragon Claw
- Aqua Tail
---

So to summarize:

• Choice Scarf Garchomp > Choice Scarf Salamence
• Change Whimsicott's Spread
• (Optional) Choice Specs / Calm Mind over Choice Scarf on Chandelure

 

[Maloman]

*Bump*

 

[Jaroda]

You know rather than just bumping, you should probably comment on our suggestions.

 

[Maloman]

@Thelegendkillers ideas work but I have no counter to sand teams. Any suggestions.

@ChaZanG1 roopushin was my main counter for that and its the entire reason I have it there.

@Jaroda are there any other changes to the EV's in acount to thelegendkillers ideas.

 

[Chou Toshio]

Is there even a point to tying with other wishmicott's? You have basically a 100% counter to them with Gyro Ball Ferrathorn. I'd say use no speed, Impish with 252 DEF instead.

Scarf Chomp > Scarf Mence sounds good-- there's really no reason to use mence over chomp.

 

[afterburn]

You're saying you have problems with Sand teams, although I don't have an absolute stop to them in mind, I think Skarmory over Ferrorthorn could work. You already have Rain teams covered pretty well between Whimsicott and CM Wish Jirachi, so I don't think you're losing much. Skarmory has reliable recovery, a mammoth Defense stat and an immunity to Ground- type moves, meaning it can take on common Physical sweepers on Sand teams such as Rock Polish Randorosu and Swords Dance Doryuuzu well. As long as Skarmory is alive these two won't be sweeping you anytime soon. Also, I know I said Specs / CM Chandelure over Scarf, but I take that back; Chandelure really wants the Speed from Choice Scarf, since base 80 is not really fast enough when compared to the threats that run rampant in the metagame. Besides, Chandelure's fantastic Special Attack stat and aid from Spikes + Stealth Rock will make the opponent cry in pain, so Specs / CM isn't required.

Skarmory (F) @ Shed Shell
Careful (+SDef, -SAtk) 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Spikes | Stealth Rock | Roost | Whirlwind or Brave Bird

GL

 

[Maloman]

@the legenkiller so physical skarmory over ferrohorn. But then I don't really have the strong electric and water resistances along with the common specs
Latios and the are carrying surf and Draco which jirachi cant take as nicely.

 

[afterburn]

Whimsicott can take Water- type attacks fine, Scarf Garchomp has an immunity to Electric-, and Specs Latios can be revenged by Garchomp (coming in on Thunderbolt) and Shandera.

 

[Maloman]

@the legendkiller okay thanks. but shouldn't skarmory be specially defensive to take hits on the special side better.

 

[Maloman]

*Bump*

 

[Maloman]

Okay so I'll use skarmory with brave bird because entry hazards are to OHKO pokemon easier unlike my Gen 4 team with relied on phazing. Plus it will also be physically defensive.

 

[SlowBroseph]

Hey, im a noob poster on here and im trying to figure out how to get sprites on. Any help?

 

[YAYtears]

^Post count=21
...

 

[Jaroda]

@the legendkiller okay thanks. but shouldn't skarmory be specially defensive to take hits on the special side better.

It still can't take special hits well though even with full investment, and it becomes a worse physical wall in the process. It's better to just use something else to take special hits. I'd recommend Jirachi if it didn't have the same special weaknesses. Brave Bird is so you're not Taunt bait, but Whirlwind is for getting rid of set up users. It's up to you,

 

[Maloman]

It still can't take special hits well though even with full investment, and it becomes a worse physical wall in the process. It's better to just use something else to take special hits. I'd recommend Jirachi if it didn't have the same special weaknesses. Brave Bird is so you're not Taunt bait, but Whirlwind is for getting rid of set up users. It's up to you,

Yeah I'm going with brave bird because of how wishmicott's taunt can shut them down because of priority.