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Discussion in 'Global Battle Union' started by dragonboy52, Aug 27, 2011.

  1. dragonboy52

    is a Contributor Alumnus

    Sep 21, 2009
    HP 75
    Attack 125
    Defense 70
    Special Attack 125
    Sp.Defense 70
    Speed 115
    Singles set
    Azelf@Choice Band/Choice ScarfAdamant/Jolly
    -Zen Headbutt
    -Ice Punch
    -Fire Punch

    • Azelf isn't capable of taking many hits, but is much capable of hitting many pokemon due to it's high attack stats.
    • Zen Headbutt is a powerful STAB move to hit Ghost and Fighting types.
    • Ice Punch to hit the common Dragon and Flying types.
    • Fire Punch to hit Grass and Bug types and to provide Azelf with good move coverage.
    • Trick is to cripple opponent's pokemon buy giving them a choice items. Trick works better in 5th Gen because of the new item, Evolite.

  2. Ashenlock


    Aug 17, 2007
    I've wondered sometimes why Azelf never took off in GBU Double Battles, at least as far as I've seen. It's understandable in Singles; few resistances mean it can't switch in to many attacks safely, and it's revenge-killed easily, being practically the defining victim of Pursuit.

    I only ever used Azelf last generation to beat the ingame PBR teams, but it seems like it would have been one of the premier forces in the game. The rare access to a simultaneously fast AND powerful Explosion is the most immediate thing, not to mention having a viable movepool on either side of the spectrum as of Platinum, which combine with very good sweeper stats to make a monster out of it. That's my 4th Gen impression of it, although it's been long enough that I can't remember whether I saw it in any of my opponents' teams.

    Azelf lost much of its threat with the nerfing of Explosion, but that shouldn't neuter it as it seems to have. It still has the same movepool, and it practically doesn't need to fear Pursuit at all in Doubles. Perhaps part of it lies in the fact that the latest that Azelf was obtainable was in Platinum, way back in 2009, so people who got it likely got it without RNGing, or before they had a "current" team in mind. Also, while most people who want to capture a Latios have a very limited number of natures that will be useful in almost any situation, Azelf requires some forethought. "Should I make it mixed? Naive might be good for that... But what if I decide to go only physical?" Short of hacking or buying a new cart and soft-resetting or RNGing for it, most people won't have access to great Azelfs.
  3. tennisace

    tennisace /me dabs
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Smogon Social Media Contributoris a Community Contributoris a Pokemon Researcheris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Smogon Media Contributoris an Administratoris a CAP Contributor Alumnus
    C&C Chief

    Dec 16, 2007
    I've been toying with this set in doubles:

    Azelf@Mental Herb
    max hp/speed
    timid/jolly doesnt matter
    trick room
    taunt/stealth rock/some attack here

    on paper it seems really cool to use as it shuts down trick room users and makes them unable to protect... but i haven't been able to test it in practice.
  4. cosmicexplorer

    cosmicexplorer pewpewpew
    is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    May 25, 2010
    While that set certainly seems usable if only for the utility of TR + Imprison, Trick Room teams are few and far apart in the current doubles metagame, reducing the effectiveness of such a set. In addition, Azelf's defenses are mediocre at best, even with maximum HP, and since Imprison is only active as long as the user is alive on the field, even if it can get a surprise Imprison up the first turn, it won't be the best selection to continue to make Trick Room unusable, and due to the extreme bulk of many Trick Room users, such as Cresselia or Eviolite Dusclops, Trick Room users can easily stay in the match for the couple of turns or so that Azelf will stay alive, and then set up TR, especially as they won't have to worry about attacks from two Pokemon at once, since that set is geared toward a supporting role and deals little damage.

    While the concept may be sound, I feel it's outclassed by Imprison Chandelure, which, despite its greater number of weaknesses, is far bulkier than Azelf, and most importantly, can use its STAB Shadow Ball to hit common Trick Room users quite hard, 2HKOing the vast majority of them. It also has the ever-useful Heat Wave. So while the set is a good and useful idea, in practice it's not going to make an excellent doubles partner, even for the precise niche it does possess. That's not to say the idea is itself useless, and in fact I can see an offensive set with Imprison + TR and two attacks retaining some of Azelf's utility as an attacker while also preserving that niche as a "surprise" TR stopper, but it will have the same issues with frailty as the first set, and having only two attacking options somewhat limits its coverage.

    As for why Azelf receives such little usage in Double Battles, I think it's really because most of what it can do is outclassed by something else. If you need a fast and powerful physical attacker, Garchomp exists, and its spread damaging EQ and huge bulk make it rather more useful than Azelf. Thundurus outclasses it as a special attacker, with better coverage and access to Prankster to abuse Substitute, Taunt, or Thunder Wave. If you just need something fast, Choice Scarf users, weather attackers, and Pokemon such as Weavile do that better due to their superior Speed, and in many cases power as well. In doubles, I don't really know if Azelf has a specific niche that nothing else can do better, which is why it's not used very much.
  5. Solace

    Solace cheap thrills
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Super Moderator Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

    Nov 4, 2009
    I think Azelf is alright in singles, albeit pursuit weak. It hits like a truck and is fairly versatile, although things with a little more staying power could probably work better.

    I certainly hope you're not done writing this though because there's a lot Azelf can do!
  6. soul_survivor


    Sep 12, 2010
    Well on the subject of double battling. I've been using a metagross with a normal gem+ explosion and ohko's so many pokemon, so this should work:

    azelf@normal gem
    252 atk/ 252 spe
    -zen headbutt
    -fire punch/ice punch

    Well Alot like the 1st set,But the niche this set got is firepunch can deal with steels that resist explosion. I used to run a mixed set if i can find the ev's but it was basically this set. Ice punch can ko dragons, and grass. This set works best when with gengar. Not only is it ghost it helps cover azelfs counters as focus blast ohko's ttar.
  7. cosmicexplorer

    cosmicexplorer pewpewpew
    is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    May 25, 2010
    That's a very useful set, as an unexpected very fast Explosion, and boosted by Normal Gem too, can be incredibly useful. However, two changes that I believe should be made are Fire Blast over Fire Punch, with a Naive nature over Jolly, as that hits Steel-types such as Metagross much harder, even with 0 investment, although the accuracy is always an issue.

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