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Butterfree [QC 3/4] [GP 0/2]

Discussion in 'Locked / Outdated Analyses' started by Dell, Jun 6, 2013.

  1. Dell

    Dell Hi there!
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    Couldn't find a good time towards posting this notably earlier due to DDoS issues.


    [​IMG] [​IMG]
    [Overview]

    <p>Butterfree's claim to fame is its access to Quiver Dance like several other Bug-types. However, what sets Butterfree apart are it's two abilities: Tinted Lens and Compoundeyes. Tinted Lens allows Butterfree to disregard coverage moves on a sweeping set, while Compoundeyes makes Butterfree's support options more accurate. Unfortunately, the poor bug is plagued by the typical early-Bug-type syndrome: poor typing, and even more poor defenses. While Butterfree may be versatile, the prevalence of Stealth Rock cuts down significantly on its survivability and effectiveness in the NU metagame.</p>


    [SET]
    name: Quiver Dance
    move1: Quiver Dance
    move2: Sleep Powder
    move3: Bug Buzz
    move4: Substitute / Roost
    item: Leftovers / Life Orb
    ability: Tinted Lens
    nature: Timid / Modest
    evs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>With Quiver Dance, Butterfree functions as a capable setup sweeper, while being able to incapacitate a slew of slower Pokemon with Sleep Powder before or after a boost when necessary. The presence of Sleep Powder is one of the set's most important features, since Butterfree has the capability of forcing out and gaining setup opportunities on a myriad of defensive Pokemon, such as Musharna, Tangela, or Alomomola, as well as Choice-locked Fighting or Ground-types like Sawk or Golurk. Bug Buzz is the only attacking move that Butterfree needs on this set, since Tinted Lens boosts the power of resisted moves by 2x. Substitute allows Butterfree to both avoid status from Pokemon such as Musharna or Mandibuzz and avoid revenge killing by Pokemon such as Choice Scarf Primeape or Jynx. Roost is an interesting choice that allows Butterfree to heal off damage taken from Stealth Rock or weak attacks such as Giga Drain from Roselia or Foul Play from Mandibuzz.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The EV spread is self-explanatory: Butterfree needs all of the speed and power it can get since its base stats are somewhat lacking in that department. Even though it may seem attractive, a defensive EV spread is better left to Pokemon with "actual defenses". Max speed with a Timid nature allows Butterfree to outspeed Swellow after a Quiver Dance Boost, and tie with positive-natured Ludicolo in the rain after two boosts. However, if outspending those threats isn't a big deal, using a Modest nature gives Butterfree more power and still allows it to outspeed max speed Serperior after a boost. As for the item, Insect Plate or Bug Gem are suitable replacements. Insect Plate gives a flat 20% boost in power to Bug Buzz, while Bug Gem allows Butterfree to KO Charizard at +1 SpA after Stealth Rock.</p>

    <p>Stealth Rock support is extremely helpful, as it allows Butterfree to cleanly OHKO Scolipede and Primeape after a Quiver Dance boost with no boosting item, while getting the OHKO on Sawk and Braviary with a boost and Life Orb. In general, many of Butterfree's checks tend to be Stealth Rock weak, such as Regice, Charizard, and Rotom-S. Golem tends to be a good partner to Butterfree like many Rock- and Ground-types, since it only shares Butterfree's weakness to Ice-type attacks, and it resists every other one of Butterfree's weaknesses, while Butterfree 4x resists Fighting and Grass, and is immune to Ground. Other good options include Golurk, Piloswine, or Seismitoad. Probopass is also worth mentioning, since it can trap opposing Steel-types that resist Bug Buzz, and gain momentum with a slow Volt Switch. Butterfree also appreciates Rapid Spin support; Wartortle is the best of the bunch in NU. It resists Ice and can use the combination of Foresight and Rapid Spin to assure hazards leave your side of the field. Offensively, Butterfree has trouble breaking through dedicated special walls, such as Regice, Audino, and Lickilicky. Choice Band Sawk (and to a lesser extent Gurdurr and Primeape) is a good partner, as it can KO all of those Pokemon with ease. Choice Band Sawk also functions as a good anti-lead, as it can OHKO most Stealth Rock setters through Sturdy with Mold Breaker.</p>


    [SET]
    name: Dual Powder
    move1: Sleep Powder
    move2: Stun Spore
    move3: U-turn
    move4: Tailwind
    item: Focus Sash
    ability: Compoundeyes
    nature: Jolly
    evs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Butterfree's accurate status moves are its best options to support the team, it being capable of crippling a good portion of the opposing team. Compoundeyes increase the accuracy of its moves, upgrading the accuracy of Butterfree's status moves to 97.5%. Sleep Powder is the main move as it is basically able to temporarily remove an opposing Pokemon from the battle. This notably allows it to stop hazard setters, and even neutralize a problematic Pokemon for your team. Stun Spore is an auxiliary move that can allow Butterfree to catch something that the opponent switches in after the Pokemon is put to sleep. It's also a nice alternative for hitting Primeape on the switch, as well as being usable when Sleep Clause is active. Stun Spore is also a very effective move to use when you are unwilling to waste Sleep Powder on a Pokemon that doesn't significantly threaten your team. U-turn is an integral move as it helps ease prediction after one of your opponent's Pokemon has been put to sleep, as it allows Butterfree to get something in for free regardless of what they do. Tailwind is mostly filler, but doubling your team's Speed can be useful if you are low on health but still want to support the team.</p>


    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The EV spread allows Butterfree to outspeed as many Pokemon as possible and status them. A spread with maximum Special Attack and Speed with a Timid nature and Bug Buzz instead of Tailwind can be worth considering to prevent Butterfree from being forced out by Sap Sipper Pokemon; it has Focus Sash anyways, so the extra bulk rarely comes into play as Butterfree is 2HKOed by most moderately powerful attacks. This set doesn't particularly mind Stealth Rock on its side nearly as much, as it is meant to simply inflict as much status as possible and then bring in a teammate safely. Thanks to Butterfree's ability to cripple a significant portion of teams, Pokemon that take advantage of free turns or outspeeding more Pokemon, such as various wallbreakers or setup sweepers, are good teamamtes. Good options include Sawk, Fraxure, Carracosta, or Marowak, all of which who appreciate the safe switches and outspeeding the opposition. Pokemon that can beat Sap Sipper users that wall Butterfree are also good teammates, with Gurdurr being a very effective option. Toxic is a viable option to use over Tailwind, as it allows Butterfree to cripple defensive Pokemon that doesn't particularly mind being paralyzed after Sleep Clause is active.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>Rain Dance with Damp Rock or Sunny Day with Heat Rock are viable support sets, as Butterfree is able to setup weather reliably with the help of Sleep Powder and it can provide a free switch in for a weather sweeper with U-turn. Hidder Power Ground and Rock are possible options, as the former threatens Bastiodon and Probopass while the latter deals with Charizard. Giga Drain and Psychic are attacking options that can be used on the Quiver Dance set, with the former hitting Ground-, Rock-, and Water-types while while the latter threatening Scolipede and Fighting-types. Neither moves provide notable coverage otherwise, and Tinted Lens reduces the need for such coverage. Whirlwind may seem enticing to scout your opponent's team, but Butterfree generally has better things to do and it doesn't help Butterfree in any significant way.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>It is difficult to counter Butterfree as Sleep Powder can practically cripple any counter and turn it into a set up opportunity, while U-turn allows it to escape from any threat. The single most reliable way of crippling it is Stealth Rock, as even with Roost it drastically detracts from Butterfree's ability to sweep or disrupt its opponents consistently. However, Sleep Powder prevents many common Stealth Rock users from setting up. As for countering Butterfree directly, Sleep Talk users such as Regice or Munchlax are some of the best counters, as they don't mind absorbing status and can easily shrug off even boosted attacks due to their excellent Special Defense. In return, they can immediately threaten Butterfree with their respective STAB moves, or even phaze it out with Whirlwind in Munchlax's case. Pokemon that are immune to sleep with their abilities, such as Vital Spirit Electabuzz or Primeape and Sap Sipper Miltank, can take advantage of Butterfree's mediocre initial power and proceed to dispatch it. </p>

    <p>If you do not have an actual way of stopping Butterfree from putting a Pokemon to sleep, sacrificing a Pokemon to Sleep Powder is a viable option; once Sleep Clause is active, Butterfree is much easier to deal with. Even after a Quiver Dance boost, many bulky Pokemon can still tank a hit and wear Butterfree down considerably if they are not weak to its STAB move. Bastiodon is a solid counter against Butterfree, as it can tank the Quiver Dance set very well, does not care about paralysis, and can either Roar away its Quiver Dance boosts or bounce back Sleep Powder with Magic Coat. Most specially defensive Pokemon, such as Camerupt, Lickilicky, Audino, Altaria, or Probopass, can easily wall Butterfree and phaze it out or outright beat it. Fast Substitute users, particularly Articuno, Driftblim, or Charizard, can use Butterfree as setup fodder, especially the Dual Powder set. Butterfree is not particularly difficult to revenge kill; most Choice Scarf Pokemon such as Rotom-S, Charizard, or Braviary can outspeed and easily pick off Butterfree. This also includes most priority users, as Butterfree is quite frail on the physical side and only resists Mach Punch. While Butterfree can somewhat mitigate this problem with Substitute, it's generally hard to keep its Substitute up due to its frailty. Pokemon that have Rock Blast can generally break Butterfree's frail Substitutes and hit her for massive damage, such as Golem, Piloswine, and Garbodor. The best way to defeat Butterfree is to take advantage of the fact that its neither especially powerful nor fast and have a method for dealing with Sleep Powder.</p>

    Skeleton (open)
    [Overview]
    • Often referenced alongside many other forgotten Pokemon of its typing as initially some of the worst Pokemon in the game until its movepool advancement for B/W in its case, of which it receives an excellent boosting move in Quiver Dance.

    • Quiver Dance, alongside Butterfree's gifted ability within Tinted Lens and the ability to incapacitate a target in the form of sleep, allows it to function as a dangerous special sweeper.

    • Its support movepool with the addition of Compoundeyes allows it to serve a role as an effective status spreader if one chooses to become more of a team player rather than an outright sweeper.

    • Mediocre stats that can often play its part upon its frailty and difficulty to achieve a position of which it would get solid opportunities of posing as a significant threat in various cases.

    • Serves as a solid example of an effective late game sweeper or a status spreader that can find opportunities to disrupt opponents throughout the course of the battle, both of which serves a good case of its versatility.


    [SET]
    name: Quiver Dance
    move1: Quiver Dance
    move2: Sleep Powder
    move3: Bug Buzz
    move4: Substitute / Roost
    item: Leftovers / Life Orb
    ability: Tinted Lens
    nature: Timid / Modest
    evs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]
    • Functions as a setup sweeper that has the capabilities of forcing out and gaining setup opportunities on a myriad of defensive Pokemon such as Misdreavus, Musharna, Tangela, Alomomola, Seismitoed, Weezing as well as Choice-locked Fighting or Ground types such as Primeape, Sawk, or Golurk.

    • The presence of Sleep Powder helps aid its ability to setup, which can be used to either incapacitate either a counter, gain you a free opportunity to setup as the opponent switches out in attempts of avoiding having an important Pokemon being put to sleep, or capitalizing on anything that's naturally slower than Butterfree so it can obtain a free opportunity of setting up.

    • Faces a lot of competition with Jynx overall as a mono attacking sweeper that can sleep the opponent, but separates from the addition of Tinted Lens and the ability to boost Speed.

    • Tinted Lens is an excellent ability for this set as it helps save the need of running additional coverage moves just to gain a stronger hit on certain threats such as Swellow, Scolipede, or Primeape that would otherwise not mind taking a hit from its primary STAB move, thus making Butterfree significantly harder to wall.

    • Bug Buzz serves as its main STAB move that is capable of deliverage solid dents though a majority of Pokemon that doesn't resist the move after a boost or two.

    • Substitute is important on this set as it not only further complements its opportunities of setting up, but it also aids upon mitigating advantage of the nature of its frailty, leaving it less prone of becoming revenge killed if it can maintain one with the help of disabling a foe with Sleep or easing prediction with its tendency of forcing a lot of switches.

    • Life Orb increases Butterfree's overall damage output by an enticing amount, which is important to consider when utilizing a Pokemon that wants as much power as it can obtain with as few turns as possible. This option, however, is not recommended when using Substitute, as it becomes significantly easier to detract Butterfree's health over the course of the battle. This problem especially becomes relevant when factoring its major weakness to Stealth Rock.

    • Roost is an interesting choice that takes the utmost advantage of Life Orb, as it gets the option of alleviating the residual damage that Butterfree will be accumulating from Stealth Rock and Life Orb recoil. It can find various opportunties when factoring its ability to force switches a lot and taking advantage of the free turns it gains after putting threats to sleep.

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
    • The EV's are essentially self-explanatory and are mandatory for the initial role of this set.

    • Contrary to how attractive this would theoretically seem, investing in bulk in attempts of further taking advantage of its ability to setup multiple Quiver Dance boosts is simply not worth the change since it isn't going to make any notable differents in terms of taking significant neutral hits, and Butterfree typically can't afford to go any slower as it likes to incapacitate as much as it can so it can setup safely.

    • A Timid nature is the most optimal way to ge in terms of a suitable nature as it allows Butterfree to outspeed everything up to Swellow after a boost, but a Modest nature is also a well-suiting option to give it a useful cushion of power if you don't mind missing out of Swellow. Butterfree still obtains the ability to outspeed everything up to positive-natured Serperior after a boost, which is one of the fastest Pokemon that you'll typically see outside of a Choice Scarf user. This does come at the drawback of missing out on tying other positive-natured 70 base Speed Pokemon such as Ludicolo.

    • Courtesy to its dismay of the presence of Stealth Rock, the support of it is always highly recommended recommended for this set to properly function. It helps achieve various OHKOs and cripples the amount of switch-in opportunities that Butterfree's checks and counters can have and thus helps eventually push them into KO range.

    • Most Stealth Rock users share solid synergy with Butterfree, with their general capabilities of covering the resistances of Rock-, Fire-, Flying-, or Electric-types moves commonly aimed at it and performs a good job of checking most fast threats that otherwise threaten it.

    • Likewise, Butterfree would also greatly appreciate teammates that perform well in terms of keeping its debilitating weakness of Stealth Rock away from the field. Rapid Spin supporters are typically the most reliable options for this role, thus being the most recommended teammates. Acceptable servants of this particular role includes Armaldo, Torkoal, or Wartortle. If a more offensive approach is necessary, for the team good examples include Mold Breaker Sawk, Taunt Samurott, or Shell Smash Torkoal, as they all perform a good job of breaking through most specially defensive Pokemon that can be bothersome for Butterfree.

    • In terms of its appreciation regarding momentum, Pokemon like Primeape serves as a solid option as it is able to outpace and revenge kill a wide variety of faster or Choice Scarf Pokemon that can otherwise pose as annoyances as they are able to hinder Butterfree's ability to perform a sweep. Primeape also threatens troublesome Pokemon such as Lickilicky, Bastiodon, or Regice, targets that Butterfree really appreciates the removal of (not to mention being able to wear lure Garbodor a notch with Earthquake). In return, Primape also appreciates providing momentum with U-turn that it gives Butterfree free opportunities for it to easily take advantage of and setup on Primeape's common switch-ins, such as Misdreavus, Musharna, Tangela, Alomomola or Weezing.

    • Other good momentum grabbers include Eelektross and Mixed Luxray with use of their slow Volt Switches (especially the former). Both do a good job of luring and threatening specific threats that troubles Butterfree, with the former functioning as a very effective lure against Lickilicky or Regice with Superpower and being able to check and threaten a myriad of the Stealth Rock users with Giga Drain and the latter doing essentially the same role, while it's particularly better at luring Stealth Rock users.

    • Appreciates the support of entry hazards in general to help punish switching and grounded foes. Garbodor's synergy with Butterfree is pretty decent in comparison to the rest of the users, which includes choices of Scolipede, Roselia, or Cacturne.


    [SET]
    name: Dual Powder
    move1: Sleep Powder
    move2: Stun Spore
    move3: U-turn
    move4: Tailwind
    item: Focus Sash
    ability: Compoundeyes
    nature: Jolly
    evs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]
    • This set's primary goal is to support the team with the aid of spreading status with Sleep Powder or Stun Spore with the addition aid of providing momentum.

    • Excels at finding opportunities if you can bring it in on something slower that doesn't particularly threaten Butterfree, such as Tangela, Misdreavus, or Cacturne.

    • Compoudeyes further extends the reliability that is much appreciated for this set to effectively function, as it provides a substantial accuracy upgrade of 97.5% of Butterfree's status moves on this set.

    • Sleep Powder is the move with the highest reward value upon initiation in this set, and thus should be used in more important situations in relation to the team's needs on the threat management category such as sleeping a troublesome threat. In a way, this also gives it a unique niche of being an effective way of disabling Stealth Rock users with Sleep Powder, preventing them from having them up.

    • Stun Spore is the secondary move that works wonders in terms of crippling because the threat of the Quiver Dance set alone is enough to force a lot of switches after it has incapacitated something in the form of sleep, allowing to cripple common switch-ins with paralysis on the follow-up.

    • U-turn shares many integral values on this set as it helps eases prediction on how the opponent reacts after they have been put to sleep and does a nice job of drawing momentum towards getting something in for free after sleeping the opponent or if the opponent attempts to switch into their already statused Pokemon or Sap Sipper user.

    • The last slot are primarily filler options, with Tailwind further providing support for the team with free opportunities with the help of sleep and Focus Sash. It can also be useful in clutch situations if you're willing to sacrifice Butterfree to a Choice Scarf switch-in such as Primeape or Rotom-A and cripple them with Stun Spore before they are able to move, assuming that Sleep Clause has been activated.

    • Roost increases longevity, allowing it to buy more opporutnities to spread status.


    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
    • EVs are enlisted to maintain bulk, while investing as much speed as possible so it can disrupt as much as it desires to do so.

    • Rain Dance with Damp Rock or Sunny Day with Heat rock can be considered for fillers.

    • Pokemon that takes advantage of status well such as wall-breakers or setup sweepers appreciates the ability to either give them more free turns or better opportunities of setting up.

    • This set doesn't mind the presence of Stealth Rock on its side nearly as much, as it's mainly supporting the team as opposing to trying to setup an outright sweep.

    • Pokemon that can reliably threaten Sap Sippers, particularly Miltank, are good partners.


    [Other Options]
    • Choice Scarf can be used to immedately increase the amount of Pokemon that it can incapacitate, but locking yourself into a non-attacking move is often very situational and the set otherwise doesn't accomplish much of anything that the Dual Powder set does already.

    • Giga Drain and Psychic can be unique options of additional moves to make use of in the Quiver Dance set, with the former gaining additional health upon use of it and hitting Rock-, Ground- and Water- types super effectively while the latter can hit Scolipede and Gardevoir or additional damage, but neither moves provide much addition coverage otherwise.

    • Whirlwind can be used to phaze and scout if the opponent will stay in or not after being put to sleep, but otherwise makes poor use of this move and has better things to do.
      Not much else otherwise.

    [Checks and Counters]
    • The main obstacles that inhibits a daunting and controversal task in the context of countering Butterfree has to do with the presence of Sleep Powder, Tinten Lens, and ultimately deciphering what set it is running. It also should be taken into account that Sleep Powder is Butterfree's most influential move, so the tendency of incapacitating a counter or a slower foe in the form of sleep is a factor that is to not be underestimated for when facing Butterfree.

    • Much to Butterfree's dismay, the single best and most reliable way of crippling it in any manner is activating the omni-present Stealth Rock; this is a major detriment for Butterfree, as even with Roost it drastically detracts its ability to successfully attempt a sweep or disrupt its opponents with consistent status. Keep in mind, however, that Butterfree does have a tendency of targeting Stealth Rock users as sleep fodder as a means of disabling you from doing so.

    • Rest-Talk users such as Regice or Munchlax are perhaps the best examples of counters, as they don't mind taking advantage of having to absorb sleep, shrugs off boosted hits with laughable ease, and either immediately threating out with their STAB moves or for the case of the latter, phaze it out with Whirlwind.

    • Pokemon that can avoid sleep by virtue of their abilities while also threatening and being able to switch in at least once or twice are other good ways of keeping it in check. Options include Vital Spirit Electabuzz, Magmar, or Primeape.

    • Fast Substitute users, particularly Articuno, or Driftblim, or Charizard has the capabilities of using Butterfree as setup fodder on especially the Dual Powder set and the fact that they force it out anyways.

    • To a lesser extent, Sap Sippers completely disrupt Butterfree's ability to spread status and can come in and punish Butterfree's use of Sleep Powder.

    • After sleep clause is activated, the list extends to a much more manageable path.
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2013
  2. FLCL

    FLCL
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    • add faster substitute users to counters section especially for the dual powder set since they turn butterfree into setup fodder.
    • i would remove roost from the second set since it's meant to disrupt the opponent as much as possible and get out. living longer just means the opponent can have more opportunities to set up on your weak attacks. leftovers is also a bad idea on that set for the same reason. you will often find butterfree dying to any attack without doing much.
    • mention how jynx gives it huge competition as a mono attacking sweeper that can sleep the opponent.

    [qc]1/3[/qc]
  3. WhiteDMist

    WhiteDMist PU! We don't stink though!
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    For the QD set, I'm not sure that a Modest nature should be slashed in instead of being in AC. Does it get any notable KOs after a QD that make it worth losing out on outspeeding Swellow and SS Ludicolo? Mention Compoundeyes can be used for the QD set as well, but that without Tinted Lens Butterfree has pretty awful coverage and becomes significantly easier to wall. Also, you might as well add in Tailwind as another possiblity in OO, since Butterfree doesn't have much else otherwise; it also is a decent enough user thanks to Sleep Powder. As a nitpick, you get a bit wordy in your bullets, and the general point comes out a bit confusing to newer players. Try keeping it a bit simple, and to the point. This would probably mean more for your write up rather than this, but still...
  4. Dell

    Dell Hi there!
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    Updated.

    As already mentioned in this analysis, Modest outpace everything up to Serperior after a boost, which is fine if your team is fine upon dealing with Swellow. This is especially considerable seeing that most Pokemon that steps slightly ahead of that speed tier (Floatzel, Sneasel, Swoobat) aren't very common anyways unless they're Choice Scarf users. Ludicolo is in slight decline of usage, and most variants don't really run Timid all as much as you're implying anymore seeing as it was only used to speed tie positive-natured Samurott, of whom the Pokemon itself has declined in usage on its own and most good players prefer investing in bulk nowadays anyways. Butterfree often wants as much power as it can get in few turns as possible, so I think that with all of these taken into account that it still deserves a secondary slash.

    Also, I'm not sure why you even bothered to pick on how I format my skeleton... it's hardly relevant for new players to fully understand everything this early upon the writing process since the analysis itself is not necessarily designed for them to explicitly understand it the way you want them to until it's officially written past the skeleton process and thus are probably not going to look at this until that process has arose towards getting finalized.
  5. ebeast

    ebeast she's probably sexting nprtprt
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    • Remove the first sentence of the Overview, you already talk about it using Quiver Dance in the next line and there is no need for fluff.

    • Mention what KOes it gains with Stealth Rock. You can mention that Golurk has the best synergy with Butterfree as a Stealth Rock user as it can switch into threats like Regirock and threaten them out. If Stealth Rock is useful for weakening counters as they come in, you can also mention Spikes. Garbodor is the best partner for this.

    • When talking about Rapid Spinners in QD's AC, specifically mention how Wartortle is the best Rapid Spin Pokemon to pair up with Butterfree because it can get off easier Rapid Spins with Foresight and switch into Rock-type Pokemon who trouble Butterfree.

    • In Dual Powder's AC mention why you have Focus Sash as the item of choice.

    • Add Hidden Power Ground in Other Options.

    • Remove Choice Scarf from OO. It's so bad that it doesn't even deserve to be mentioned.

    [qc]2/3[/qc]
  6. Dell

    Dell Hi there!
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    Finished the analysis; awaiting for 3rd QC.
  7. WhiteDMist

    WhiteDMist PU! We don't stink though!
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    Some nitpicks about wording and content.
    I think you mean "That aside", but if not, reword it please.

    That bolded part doesn't make sense, you might want to reword this so that it transitions between sentences.

    Mention HP Ground and HP Rock in OO. Ground hits Bastiodon and Probopass harder than anything else, while Rock hits Charizard (and I guess Drifblim too lol) hard. In Checks and Counters, you can mention that after SP is used, Rock Blast users like Golem and Armaldo can deal with Butterfree even if it is behind a sub, as well as set up Rocks. For the Double Powder set, mention a 252 SpA / 252 Spe Timid spread with Bug Buzz or Psychic over Tailwind as an option that prevents Butterfree from losing to Sap Sipper mons; you are using Focus Sash anyways, so the extra bulk rarely comes into play since Butterfree is 2HKOed at best either way (or hit with Rock Blast I guess). You already mentioned on IRC that you would put Toxic in AC too, so that's set.

    [qc]3/3[/qc]
  8. Dell

    Dell Hi there!
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    Done. Ready for GP process now.
  9. Rohail

    Rohail Vaporeon <3
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    Please change the tag to Copyediting, I might amcheck GP check this later :)
  10. tehy

    tehy

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    So, just looking at this, 2 things

    Firstly since when is Butterfree iconic for Quiver Dance?

    Secondly it's way too long and i'm not sure why, maybe slice it down a bit yes?

    How is butterfree versatile? It's got two sets and they both mostly rely on the same move, Sleep Powder, and attack solely with Bug Stab

    Edit: Except saying iconic in this situation is completely untrue, it's really not except to the hardest of the hardcore pokemon players-name me 3 people who think butterfree is A:iconic or B:known for quiver dance or C:both. Plus, both sets cripple something with Sleep Powder, except one sets up and one Stun Spores. They're different, yeah, but when I hear versatile I think 3+ sets, none of which hinge on the Exact Same Move(Sleep Powder)Since you mention OU Landorus, that's the perfect example of versatility. The RP set and the scarf set are special/physical, run different items, have different purposes, run a few different coverage moves, etc, etc. Then of course Lando can run stuff like Double Dance and Gravity sets. Oh and finally, Butterfree's two sets can only attack with bug-type moves too.
  11. Hollywood

    Hollywood le toucan has arrived
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    The first point is an issue of semantics, and not something I'm overly concerned about. The last one is irrelevant, since while no, it does have the same amount of sets as say, OU Landorus does, both of its sets do something completely different. If you think the Dual Powder set, for instance, "attacks" solely with Bug STAB, then you are making a major oversight: Butterfree doesn't really "attack" at all. It statuses things and then U-turns out to gain initiative.

    Your middle point, however, I can agree with. Usually even the most prominent Pokemon only need one or two paragraphs for things like AC. While I appreciate thoroughness, you want it to be concise enough that the people who visit the analysis in the future actually want to READ it. It would be really helpful for GP if you could trim the fat a little bit!
  12. tennisace

    tennisace another eggnog, please
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    BUMP, is this being worked on at all?
  13. Dell

    Dell Hi there!
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    Yeah I trimmed it up a bit, and it's ready to get GP'd.
  14. tennisace

    tennisace another eggnog, please
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    It's still really long and wordy imo. A lot of that comes from your writing style, which is very very fluffy. Something like: "Contrary to how attractive it would theoretically seem, investing in bulk to further enhance Butterfree's chances of boosting is simply not worth it, as it isn't going to make any notable difference when it comes to taking significant neutral hits." could be shortened to: "Even though it may seem attractive, investing in bulk is not worth it, as Butterfree is still too frail to take strong neutral attacks." I'm gonna suggest you work with a GP member if you can find one to help you trim out all the fluffy phrasing.

    edit: this should probably get a 4th QC stamp before moving to GP
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  15. Namso

    Namso
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    I can try to help you shorten this if you'd like, Agent Dell.
  16. ebeast

    ebeast she's probably sexting nprtprt
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  17. tennisace

    tennisace another eggnog, please
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    Dell said I could take over the polishing part, I'll have it edited by tomorrow.
  18. tennisace

    tennisace another eggnog, please
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    About halfway through, this is late but w/e needs to get done.

  19. WhiteDMist

    WhiteDMist PU! We don't stink though!
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    Polished second half since tennisace didn't mind (and he was johning hard :mad:). This needs a 4th QC check.

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    [Overview]

    <p>Butterfree's claim to fame is its access to Quiver Dance like several other Bug-types. However, what sets Butterfree apart are it's two abilities: Tinted Lens and Compoundeyes. Tinted Lens allows Butterfree to disregard coverage moves on a sweeping set, while Compoundeyes makes Butterfree's support options more accurate. Unfortunately, the poor bug is plagued by the typical early-Bug-type syndrome: poor typing, and even more poor defenses. While Butterfree may be versatile, the prevalence of Stealth Rock cuts down significantly on its survivability and effectiveness in the NU metagame.</p>


    [SET]
    name: Quiver Dance
    move1: Quiver Dance
    move2: Sleep Powder
    move3: Bug Buzz
    move4: Substitute / Roost
    item: Leftovers / Life Orb
    ability: Tinted Lens
    nature: Timid / Modest
    evs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>With Quiver Dance, Butterfree functions as a capable setup sweeper, while being able to incapacitate a slew of slower Pokemon with Sleep Powder before or after a boost when necessary. The presence of Sleep Powder is one of the set's most important features, since Butterfree has the capability of forcing out and gaining setup opportunities on a myriad of defensive Pokemon, such as Musharna, Tangela, or Alomomola, as well as Choice-locked Fighting or Ground-types like Sawk or Golurk. Bug Buzz is the only attacking move that Butterfree needs on this set, since Tinted Lens boosts the power of resisted moves by 2x. Substitute allows Butterfree to both avoid status from Pokemon such as Musharna or Mandibuzz and avoid revenge killing by Pokemon such as Choice Scarf Primeape or Jynx. Roost is an interesting choice that allows Butterfree to heal off damage taken from Stealth Rock or weak attacks such as Giga Drain from Roselia or Foul Play from Mandibuzz.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The EV spread is self-explanatory: Butterfree needs all of the speed and power it can get since its base stats are somewhat lacking in that department. Even though it may seem attractive, a defensive EV spread is better left to Pokemon with "actual defenses". Max speed with a Timid nature allows Butterfree to outspeed Swellow after a Quiver Dance Boost, and tie with positive-natured Ludicolo in the rain after two boosts. However, if outspending those threats isn't a big deal, using a Modest nature gives Butterfree more power and still allows it to outspeed max speed Serperior after a boost. As for the item, Insect Plate or Bug Gem are suitable replacements. Insect Plate gives a flat 20% boost in power to Bug Buzz, while Bug Gem allows Butterfree to KO Charizard at +1 SpA after Stealth Rock.</p>

    <p>Stealth Rock support is extremely helpful, as it allows Butterfree to cleanly OHKO Scolipede and Primeape after a Quiver Dance boost with no boosting item, while getting the OHKO on Sawk and Braviary with a boost and Life Orb. In general, many of Butterfree's checks tend to be Stealth Rock weak, such as Regice, Charizard, and Rotom-S. Golem tends to be a good partner to Butterfree like many Rock- and Ground-types, since it only shares Butterfree's weakness to Ice-type attacks, and it resists every other one of Butterfree's weaknesses, while Butterfree 4x resists Fighting and Grass, and is immune to Ground. Other good options include Golurk, Piloswine, or Seismitoad. Probopass is also worth mentioning, since it can trap opposing Steel-types that resist Bug Buzz, and gain momentum with a slow Volt Switch. Butterfree also appreciates Rapid Spin support; Wartortle is the best of the bunch in NU. It resists Ice and can use the combination of Foresight and Rapid Spin to assure hazards leave your side of the field. Offensively, Butterfree has trouble breaking through dedicated special walls, such as Regice, Audino, and Lickilicky. Choice Band Sawk (and to a lesser extent Gurdurr and Primeape) is a good partner, as it can KO all of those Pokemon with ease. Choice Band Sawk also functions as a good anti-lead, as it can OHKO most Stealth Rock setters through Sturdy with Mold Breaker.</p>


    [SET]
    name: Dual Powder
    move1: Sleep Powder
    move2: Stun Spore
    move3: U-turn
    move4: Tailwind
    item: Focus Sash
    ability: Compoundeyes
    nature: Jolly
    evs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Butterfree's accurate status moves are its best options to support the team, it being capable of crippling a good portion of the opposing team. Compoundeyes increase the accuracy of its moves, upgrading the accuracy of Butterfree's status moves to 97.5%. Sleep Powder is the main move as it is basically able to temporarily remove an opposing Pokemon from the battle. This notably allows it to stop hazard setters, and even neutralize a problematic Pokemon for your team. Stun Spore is an auxiliary move that can allow Butterfree to catch something that the opponent switches in after the Pokemon is put to sleep. It's also a nice alternative for hitting Primeape on the switch, as well as being usable when Sleep Clause is active. Stun Spore is also a very effective move to use when you are unwilling to waste Sleep Powder on a Pokemon that doesn't significantly threaten your team. U-turn is an integral move as it helps ease prediction after one of your opponent's Pokemon has been put to sleep, as it allows Butterfree to get something in for free regardless of what they do. Tailwind is mostly filler, but doubling your team's Speed can be useful if you are low on health but still want to support the team.</p>


    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The EV spread allows Butterfree to outspeed as many Pokemon as possible and status them. A spread with maximum Special Attack and Speed with a Timid nature and Bug Buzz instead of Tailwind can be worth considering to prevent Butterfree from being forced out by Sap Sipper Pokemon; it has Focus Sash anyways, so the extra bulk rarely comes into play as Butterfree is 2HKOed by most moderately powerful attacks. This set doesn't particularly mind Stealth Rock on its side nearly as much, as it is meant to simply inflict as much status as possible and then bring in a teammate safely. Thanks to Butterfree's ability to cripple a significant portion of teams, Pokemon that take advantage of free turns or outspeeding more Pokemon, such as various wallbreakers or setup sweepers, are good teamamtes. Good options include Sawk, Fraxure, Carracosta, or Marowak, all of which who appreciate the safe switches and outspeeding the opposition. Pokemon that can beat Sap Sipper users that wall Butterfree are also good teammates, with Gurdurr being a very effective option. Toxic is a viable option to use over Tailwind, as it allows Butterfree to cripple defensive Pokemon that doesn't particularly mind being paralyzed after Sleep Clause is active.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>Rain Dance with Damp Rock or Sunny Day with Heat Rock are viable support sets, as Butterfree is able to setup weather reliably with the help of Sleep Powder and it can provide a free switch in for a weather sweeper with U-turn. Hidder Power Ground and Rock are possible options, as the former threatens Bastiodon and Probopass while the latter deals with Charizard. Giga Drain and Psychic are attacking options that can be used on the Quiver Dance set, with the former hitting Ground-, Rock-, and Water-types while while the latter threatening Scolipede and Fighting-types. Neither moves provide notable coverage otherwise, and Tinted Lens reduces the need for such coverage. Whirlwind may seem enticing to scout your opponent's team, but Butterfree generally has better things to do and it doesn't help Butterfree in any significant way.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>It is difficult to counter Butterfree as Sleep Powder can practically cripple any counter and turn it into a set up opportunity, while U-turn allows it to escape from any threat. The single most reliable way of crippling it is Stealth Rock, as even with Roost it drastically detracts from Butterfree's ability to sweep or disrupt its opponents consistently. However, Sleep Powder prevents many common Stealth Rock users from setting up. As for countering Butterfree directly, Sleep Talk users such as Regice or Munchlax are some of the best counters, as they don't mind absorbing status and can easily shrug off even boosted attacks due to their excellent Special Defense. In return, they can immediately threaten Butterfree with their respective STAB moves, or even phaze it out with Whirlwind in Munchlax's case. Pokemon that are immune to sleep with their abilities, such as Vital Spirit Electabuzz or Primeape and Sap Sipper Miltank, can take advantage of Butterfree's mediocre initial power and proceed to dispatch it. </p>

    <p>If you do not have an actual way of stopping Butterfree from putting a Pokemon to sleep, sacrificing a Pokemon to Sleep Powder is a viable option; once Sleep Clause is active, Butterfree is much easier to deal with. Even after a Quiver Dance boost, many bulky Pokemon can still tank a hit and wear Butterfree down considerably if they are not weak to its STAB move. Bastiodon is a solid counter against Butterfree, as it can tank the Quiver Dance set very well, does not care about paralysis, and can either Roar away its Quiver Dance boosts or bounce back Sleep Powder with Magic Coat. Most specially defensive Pokemon, such as Camerupt, Lickilicky, Audino, Altaria, or Probopass, can easily wall Butterfree and phaze it out or outright beat it. Fast Substitute users, particularly Articuno, Driftblim, or Charizard, can use Butterfree as setup fodder, especially the Dual Powder set. Butterfree is not particularly difficult to revenge kill; most Choice Scarf Pokemon such as Rotom-S, Charizard, or Braviary can outspeed and easily pick off Butterfree. This also includes most priority users, as Butterfree is quite frail on the physical side and only resists Mach Punch. While Butterfree can somewhat mitigate this problem with Substitute, it's generally hard to keep its Substitute up due to its frailty. Pokemon that have Rock Blast can generally break Butterfree's frail Substitutes and hit her for massive damage, such as Golem, Piloswine, and Garbodor. The best way to defeat Butterfree is to take advantage of the fact that its neither especially powerful nor fast and have a method for dealing with Sleep Powder.</p>
  20. Dell

    Dell Hi there!
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    I pasted the changes to the OP.
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  21. Dat Blast

    Dat Blast formerly Brawlfest
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    [Overview]
    • Mention how Butterfree also gets Sleep Powder to set it apart from other Bugs and helps it set up.
    [SET] (QD)
    • Personally, I'd rather put Roost in AC. I've never seen anyone use it and Sub is just too good to pass up imo. You should probably make the only item Lefties too.
    • Make the only nature Timid. Modest doesn't get any extra KOs that I'm aware of and outspeeding Swellow is a really big deal.
    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS] (QD)
    • Get rid of the first two sentences. There's no point in talking about EV spreads when it's just standard 252 / 252.
    • Mention Roost and LO here. Say how the protection from Sub is better though.
    • When mentioning Probopass, don't say how Steels "resist" Bug Buzz because they don't thanks to Tinted Lens. Just say how they're bulky enough to take a hit or two and threaten Butterfree out.
    [SET] (Dual Powder)
    • Make the EV spread max Attack. I think it lets Butterfree break Golem's Sturdy with U-turn to the point where Lefties won't bring it back to full (or something like that, idrk).
    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS] (Dual Powder)
    • Again, don't bother talking about EV spreads when they're 252 / 252.
    Make these changes Agent Ranger Detective Dell , and I'll stamp later.
  22. Raseri

    Raseri here to help
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  23. Dell

    Dell Hi there!
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    I'm here, sorry for holding this up. I've decided to let WhiteDMist finished up to this point, as I've had a lot on my plate recently and I've talked to him about how this analysis should properly work as far the set goes from here on out.

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