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CAP 13 CAP 2 - Part 12 - Movepool Submissions

Discussion in 'CAP Process Archive' started by Rising_Dusk, Jan 14, 2012.

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  1. bugmaniacbob

    bugmaniacbob Floats like a Butterfree, stings like a Metapod
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    [​IMG][​IMG]

    The Ground egg group is a mis-match regardless.

    More to the point, there's nothing stopping you from using two egg groups. Not sure what the problem is here.
  2. srk1214

    srk1214 The Wuthering Heights of Billionaire Gay Dinosaur Fiction
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    Isn't HSOWA more proof that Egg Groups are silly and illogical? I'd rather not use something so imperfect to be central to the entire concept of Necturna.

    Also, BMB, my point was not to be inflammatory and completely discredit anyone who disagrees with me, unlike your earlier rant. All I wanted to do is point out the horrible hypocrisy of suggesting that Egg Groups are somehow more elegant than an in-game event/tutor.

    If you are going to continue to insist that you are right, you're going to have to defend yourself logically. That is all.
  3. Rising_Dusk

    Rising_Dusk
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    It's fine to have an opinion, and I am one to always endorse discussion topics (which is why I ended up not deleting your post), but you need to remember that what is posted here may have a lot of impact on others submitting movepools morally and stylistically, especially if it is the opinion of a respected community member. Saying such lines as "... there is a special circle of hell reserved for anybody who commits the horrible flavour faux pas of making Sketch a Tutor, Event, or any other such unfortunate category of move." has the potential to drastically change the way movepools are created and for no good reason other than "bugmaniacbob has a big stick up his ass about event moves". As the TL, I am not okay with that, and consider that I haven't infracted you for trolling as a result very generous of me. If you want to talk about whether an event move is cool or not, you must be respectful of other opinions in doing so. Your post was rife with offensive comments toward those using event moves with inadequate reasoning at every turn. Not berating you for it would be a terrible injustice as moderator. Let this be a very firm and equally on-the-record warning to you and others that might do the same thing that it is not okay to pull what you did.

    Now let the 'debacle' drop; it's in your best interests.

    ---

    As I said, I think it's fine however people want to include Sketch into the movepool. Be mindful that this 'discussion' is crazily subjective and potentially derailing of the discussion of successes and failures of the thus-far posted movepools. I would much rather discussion be put toward tempering the WIP movepools into better creations than talking back and forth about "well Skitty can mate with Wailord so your argument is invalid" in response to "well ground egg group makes no sense with a ghost so your argument is invalid".

    I will be watching this closely.
  4. Deck Knight

    Deck Knight Photorealistic Seagull (PSG)
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    I think it's time for another cool Final Submission.

    Legend (open)

    * = Competitive VGM
    (*) = Repeat Competitive VGM
    ? = Non-Competitive/Flavor VGM
    (?) = Repeat Non-Competitive/Flavor VGM)

    Totals for VGM will include both Competitive and Non-Competitve VGMs.


    Level-Up (14/10) (open)
    Level-Up:
    0 Thunder Fang *
    0 Poison Fang
    0 Super Fang *
    0 Leer
    0 Vine Whip
    7 Ominous Wind
    13 Shadow Sneak *
    19 Toxic Spikes *
    19 Will-O-Wisp *
    25 Hex *
    31 Horn Leech *
    40 Pain Split *
    50 Shadow Ball *
    60 Power Whip *

    Moves: 14
    VGM: 10


    Flavorwise I thought it would be amusing to pull an "Elemental Fangs at L0" kind of move, only I switched the types around a bit. Thunder, Poison, and Super Fang are an esoteric bunch considered together, but I like the overall effect. Otherwise the movepool snakes up in power with physical Grass moves and special Ghost moves for the most part. Necturna is a physically biased Pokemon despite her looks, so her movepool largely reflects that.

    Egg (10/6) (open)

    Egg:
    Egg Group: Plant / Ground

    Curse
    Giga Drain *
    Gravity *
    Future Sight
    Ingrain *
    Leaf Blade *
    Leaf Storm *
    Natural Gift
    Nightmare
    Sketch *

    Moves: 10
    VGM: 6


    Egg Moves are a mixture of a few helpful Grass STABs and some Ghost flavor moves. I've chosen Plant/Ground since I'd rather not conjure up an Event from nowhere or a Tutor or anything else that would cause shenanigans. It is what it is. Prepare for Necturna on Wailord action.

    TM/HM (30/11) (open)
    TM:
    04 Calm Mind *
    06 Toxic *
    10 Hidden Power *
    11 Sunny Day
    15 Hyper Beam
    17 Protect *
    19 Telekinesis
    21 Frustration ?
    22 SolarBeam
    27 Return (?)
    29 Psychic *
    30 Shadow Ball (*)
    32 Double Team
    41 Torment
    42 Façade ?
    44 Rest *
    45 Attract
    46 Thief
    48 Round
    53 Energy Ball *
    61 Will-O-Wisp (*)
    65 Shadow Claw *
    66 Payback ?
    68 Giga Impact
    70 Flash
    71 Stone Edge *
    77 Psych Up
    85 Dream Eater
    86 Grass Knot *
    87 Swagger
    90 Substitute *
    H1 Cut

    Moves: 32 (2 repeats) [30]
    VGM: 17 (3 repeats) [14] {4 NC VGMs}


    My TM choice has multiple flavor elements, only a few of which are competitive. The biggest move to note is Torment. Although Disable was voted as disallowed, Torment is not technically a VGM (despite use on TormenTran) and I thought it added a unique flavor and competitive niche. For canonical support, there is actually a Pokemon line that learns Torment but not Taunt: Munna/Musharna. I've also tried to make the movepool as close to real Pokemon movepools as possible, including every standard TM (which in BW is Toxic/Protect/Frustration/Return/Double Team/Facade/Rest/Attract/Round/Swagger/Substitute) and the vast majority of allowed Type-Moves for Ghosts and Grass types (e.g. Telekinesis/Will-O-Wisp, Flash/SolarBeam, etc.) When developing movepools I always ask myself "if I were looking this Pokemon up on Veekun or Serebii, would it look like a real Pokemon?" and if I can answer affirmatively within the limits, I'm done.

    Analysis (54/27) (open)

    Coverage Analysis:

    Physical:
    Horn Leech / Leaf Blade / Power Whip
    Shadow Sneak / Shadow Claw
    Stone Edge
    Thunder Fang
    Natural Gift (w Berry)
    Payback
    Poison Fang

    Special:
    Grass Knot / Giga Drain / Energy Ball / SolarBeam / Leaf Storm
    Hex / Ominous Wind / Shadow Ball
    Psychic / Dream Eater
    Hidden Power

    Notable Support:
    Calm Mind
    Gravity
    Ingrain
    Pain Split
    Protect
    Torment
    Toxic
    Toxic Spikes
    Substitute
    Sunny Day
    Super Fang
    Will-O-Wisp

    Recovery Attacks:
    Giga Drain
    Horn Leech
    Ingrain
    Pain Split

    Final Count:
    Total Moves: 54
    Total VGM: 30 [27] {3 NC VGMs}


    This Necturna movepool provides her with everything she needs to use offensive and support sets effectively. Stone Edge and Thunder Fang can be alternated on a few sets to get the drop on counters for the other move (ex. Belly Drum/Horn Leech/Shadow Sneak with Thunder Fang gets the drop on Skarmory but falls to Jirachi, Dnite, and Heatran) and both have imperfect accuracy. X-Scissor hits Hydreigon and provides acceptable coverage with Grass/Rock. Basically this Necturna movepool is based on fulfilling all varieties of Bulky Offense competently by giving a coverage move for Dark types to go with Grass STAB alone with Stone Edge / Thunder Fang for neutral attacks.

    For support sets Gravity, Pain Split, Protect, Torment, Toxic/ Spikes, Substitute, Super Fang, and Will-O-Wisp provide a backbone that can either be augmented by Sketch (perhaps with a 50% Recovery move) or used alone according to your team's needs to weaken and frustrate opponents.

    Finally, for options that work with Sketched Baton Pass you have Ingrain and Calm Mind, and if you're a real basketcase, Swagger + Psych Up I guess. Basically Necturna has at least one or two moves that can be combined effectively with any given Sketch.

    Potential Sets (open)


    Belly Drum:
    Belly Drum
    Horn Leech
    Shadow Sneak
    Stone Edge / Thunder Fang

    Shift Gear:
    Shift Gear
    Leaf Blade
    Stone Edge
    Shadow Claw

    Coil:
    Coil
    Power Whip
    Stone Edge
    Horn Leech / Thunder Fang / Will-O-Wisp

    Tail Glow:
    Tail Glow
    Leaf Storm / Energy Ball
    Shadow Ball
    Hidden Power Fighting

    Quiver Dance:
    Quiver Dance
    Giga Drain
    Shadow Ball
    Hidden Power Fighting

    Toxic Spikes:
    Toxic Spikes
    Substitute / Spore (Sketch)
    Horn Leech
    Shadow Claw

    Sub/Torment:
    Substitute
    Torment
    Horn Leech
    Shadow Force (Sketch)

    Gravity:
    Gravity
    Power Whip
    Stone Edge
    Sacred Fire / Magma Storm (Sketch)

    Support:
    Substitute
    Super Fang
    Will-O-Wisp
    Dragon Tail (Sketch)

    Baton Pass:
    Baton Pass
    Substitute / Calm Mind
    Ingrain
    Ominous Wind

    Stored Power:
    Stored Power
    Calm Mind
    Ominous Wind
    Giga Drain

    Sleep Gimmick:
    Spore (Sketch)
    Dream Eater
    Nightmare
    Hex



    Notes on Natural Gift and Sketch:

    An interesting experiment I think my movepool would illuminate is how Sketch would interact with Natural Gift. Up until Generation V, every Pokemon has had access to Natural Gift (bar a few gimmick/weakmons), and the only Pokemon with Sketch was Smeargle, whose attack is... shall we say, not up to snuff? In considering the concept "A Pokemon that learns Sketch, once, and everything that goes along with that." I think this would be an excellent chance to plumb information. Natural Gift is basically adding a one-time, one-attack coverage at the expense of your Item. It is perhaps the perfect concept to test out what Sketch can truly do.
  5. Spork

    Spork

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    What berries are actually legal in Gen V? I haven't kept up to date. I mean, you couldn't use Salac Berry, for example, which has one of the more worthwhile natural gifts.

    Not really sure if Natural Gift would really be interacting with Sketch very much.
  6. Juicy

    Juicy

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    Final Submission

    Level Up Movepool
    Show Hide
    Code:
    -Poison Fang (Heart Scale)
    -Super Fang (Heart Scale)
    -Poison Sting
    -Ingrain
    -Wrap
    -Spite
    6: Charm
    11: Vine Whip
    11: Shadow Sneak
    17: Night Shade
    22: Sweet Scent
    28: Toxic Spikes
    33: Captivate
    39: Future Sight
    44: Pain Split
    50: Wring Out
    66: Power Whip
    


    TM & HM
    Show Hide
    Code:
    TM 04: Calm Mind
    TM 06: Toxic
    TM 10: Hidden Power
    TM 11: Sunny Day
    TM 12: Taunt
    TM 15: Hyper Beam
    TM 17: Protect
    TM 19: Telekinesis 
    TM 21: Frustration
    TM 22: Solar Beam
    TM 27: Return
    TM 29: Psychic
    TM 30: Shadow Ball
    TM 32: Double Team
    TM 41: Torment
    TM 42: Facade
    TM 44: Rest
    TM 45: Attract
    TM 48: Round
    TM 49: Echoed Voice
    TM 53: Energy Ball
    TM 61: Will-O-Wisp 
    TM 65: Shadow Claw
    TM 68: Giga Impact
    TM 71: Stone Edge
    TM 77: Psych Up
    TM 86: Grass Knot
    TM 87: Swagger
    TM 90: Substitute 
    HM 01: Cut
    


    By Breeding
    Show Hide

    (Ground/Grass Egg Group)

    Code:
    
    Giga Drain (Lilligant etc)
    Gravity (Stantler)
    Horn Leech (Sawsbuck etc)
    Imprison (Stantler)
    Natural Gift (Sawsbuck)
    Petal Dance (Lilligant etc)
    Pursuit (Raticate etc)
    Sketch* (Smeargle)
    
    *Must breed with a male Smeargle holding Odd Incense


    Summary
    Show Hide

    30/55 VGM

    Alphabetically:
    Code:
    1.Attract
    2.[B]Calm Mind[/B]
    3.Captivate
    4.Charm
    5.Cut
    6.Double Team
    7.Echoed Voice
    8.[B]Energy Ball[/B]
    9.[B]Facade[/B]
    10.[B]Frustration[/B]
    11.Future Sight
    12.[B]Giga Drain[/B]
    13.Giga Impact
    14.[B]Grass Knot[/B]
    15.[B]Gravity[/B]
    16.[B]Horn Leech[/B]
    17.[B]Hidden Power[/B]
    18.Hyper Beam
    19.Imprison 
    20.[B]Ingrain[/B]
    21.Natural Gift
    22.[B]Night Shade[/B]
    23.[B]Pain Split[/B]
    24.[B]Petal Dance[/B]
    25.[B]Power Whip[/B]
    26.Poison Fang
    27.Posion Sting
    28.[B]Protect[/B]
    29.[B]Psychic[/B]
    30.Psych Up
    31.[B]Pursuit[/B]
    32.[B]Rest[/B]
    33.[B]Return[/B]
    34.Round
    35.[B]Shadow Ball[/B]
    36.[B]Shadow Claw[/B]
    37.[B]Shadow Sneak[/B]
    38.[B]Sketch[/B]
    39.Solar Beam
    40.Spite
    41.[B]Stone Edge[/B]
    42.[B]Substitute [/B]
    43.Sunny Day
    44.[B]Super Fang[/B]
    45.Swagger
    46.Sweet Scent
    47.[B]Taunt[/B]
    48.Telekinesis 
    49.Torment
    50.[B]Toxic[/B]
    51.[B]Toxic Spikes[/B]
    52.Vine Whip
    53.[B]Will-O-Wisp[/B]
    54.Wrap
    55.Wring Out
    
    VGM in bold.



    Justification
    Show Hide

    Learns sketch through smeargle holding an Odd Incense to provide a way of making Sketch a channeling method as shown in Yilx's artwork. Odd incense being a hold item that boosts psychic moves by 20% and used in breeding a Mime Jr (artistic pokemon). It also does not over complicate things while providing flavour.

    Psychic attacks to underline further how Necturna learns sketch, namely future sight in her level up movepool.

    Learns sweet scent naturally to highlight its flytrap origin and to Necturna's name.

    Lots of shrine maiden references in charm, petal dance, attract and captivate.

    Power whip, vine whip, horn leech, wrap and wring out etc in reference to that almighty vine, which I believe to be one of her main attacking tools in battle. Necturna being the most powerful user of power whip I had her learn it in the later levels.

    No boosting moves (outside of calm mind) to force a sketcher to choose between boosting/reliable recovery/coverage moves. Calm mind is there for flavour and any baton pass sets.

    Night shade/toxic spikes for bulky sets along with ingrain for the sketched baton pass. Wrap/pursuit could also benefit this as psuedo-trapping moves.

    Shadow sneak to make up for the sub-par speed.

    Stone edge for coverage that goes well with sketched sacred fire etc.

    I feel I have had to fill the entire allowance in moves to fit in the flavour and competitive use. I do not go to these limits lightly, but with the restrictions placed and necessity for Necturna to function competently builds up to a lot of move slots.

    Rising_Dusk
    Bluemon
    Rising_Dusk
    bugmaniacbob
    Purple Cant
  7. zyrefredric

    zyrefredric

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    made a few edits here and there...^^

    This is a Final Submission for Necturna's movepool. However, it's rather big as it is, so I'm looking for suggestions on how to make it smaller before I make it final.^^

    Level-Up; Total Moves: 16; Total VGMs: 4 (open)
    -- Vine Whip
    -- Magical Leaf
    05 Bite
    08 Spite
    15 Meditate
    18 Grudge
    25 Mind Reader
    28 Hex
    35 Extrasensory
    38 Curse
    45 Ominous Wind
    48 Pain Split
    55 Future Sight
    58 Crunch
    65 Power Whip
    65 Leaf Storm

    Necturna's grass-typing is reflected by Vine Whip/Magical Leaf and Power Whip/Leaf Storm, which are learned the earliest and latest respectively. Her skirt looks like a monster with a huge gaping mouth lined with fangs, so that justifies Bite and Crunch. The rest of her movepool is primarily based on flavor. Necturna is a shrine maiden, so her psychic and prophetic skills are shown through Meditate>Mind Reader>Extrasensory>Ominous Wind>Future Sight. After that, I initially planned on portraying her as a kind and lovable maiden (Charm, Flatter, Captivate, etc), but as I look at her, she really just looks creepy. Which explains the other half of her flavor movepool. To show that she is a sinister and dark figure, she gets Spite>Grudge>Hex>Curse>Pain Split.

    TM/HM; Total Moves: 25; Total VGMs: 16 (open)
    TM 04 - Calm Mind
    TM 06 - Toxic
    TM 10 - Hidden Power
    TM 12 - Taunt
    TM 15 - Hyper Beam
    TM 17 - Protect
    TM 21 - Frustration
    TM 22 - SolarBeam
    TM 27 - Return (same as Frustration)
    TM 30 - Shadow Ball
    TM 32 - Double Team
    TM 42 - Facade
    TM 44 - Rest
    TM 45 - Attract
    TM 48 - Round
    TM 53 - Energy Ball
    TM 61 - Will-O-Wisp
    TM 65 - Shadow Claw
    TM 68 - Giga Impact
    TM 71 - Stone Edge
    TM 83 - Work Up
    TM 85 - Dream Eater
    TM 87 - Swagger
    TM 90 - Substitute
    TM 92 - Trick Room

    One thing you'd notice from this submission is the complete absence of Fire, Water, Electric, Ice, Fighting, Ground, Bug and Dragon attacking moves. These allow Necturna to hit one or more of her counters super-effectively, so I decided not to include any of them. The TM list simply contains STAB moves, support moves, and the required TMs. It's still big though, and if this submission needs to be trimmed, this is where it will be done.

    Ground/Human-Like Egg Group; Total Moves: 11; Total VGMs: 10 (open)
    Giga Drain
    Grass Whistle
    Gravity
    Horn Leech
    Ingrain

    Leaf Blade
    Night Shade
    Perish Song
    Shadow Sneak
    Sketch
    Toxic Spikes

    Any important moves that I can't fit into the level-up and TM moves goes here. That includes Sketch itself.

    SUMMARY; 52 moves (open)
    Physical Attack Moves
    Power Whip
    Leaf Blade
    Horn Leech
    Shadow Claw
    Shadow Sneak
    Stone Edge
    Frustration
    Crunch

    Special Attack Moves
    Leaf Storm
    Energy Ball
    Giga Drain
    Shadow Ball
    Night Shade
    Hidden Power

    Status/Support Moves
    Toxic
    Will-o-Wisp
    Grass Whistle
    Calm Mind
    Work Up
    Ingrain
    Substitute
    Protect
    Taunt
    Toxic Spikes
    Gravity
    Trick Room
    Pain Split
    Perish Song
  8. Purple Cant

    Purple Cant

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    Messages:
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    I have no movepool to submit, but I just want to throw in that movepool submitters shouldn't be afraid of adding a move simply because the move's type corresponds with a type that hits a counter of Necturna's super-effectively. We already took pains in the attacking moves section to determine whether or not she should have the moves which are allowed; Ice-type moves, for example, which are allowed were allowed after a lot of consideration, and would not be allowed if we all thought it was too powerful.

    Another thing I just want to harmlessly say is that I would like to see Gravity and Trick Room on some of these movepools. They wouldn't classify as VGMs from my perspective, and I honestly believe that, at least for the case of Gravity, if we gave that move a cool user of it like Necturna, then Gravity teams might have more of a chance of coming out of the "gimmick" section of team strategies.

    (Forgive me for the multitude of commas in that previous paragraph. It makes my eyes hurt every time I reread it)

    PS - Substitute counts as a VGM, imo. Just saying.
  9. Rising_Dusk

    Rising_Dusk
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  10. srk1214

    srk1214 The Wuthering Heights of Billionaire Gay Dinosaur Fiction
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    R_D, I have changed my mind on several moves since my original WIP, which obviously was a WIP. Looking through the spreadsheet, the only move I changed my mind on that actually was competitive enough to make the list was Perish Song, which I have now included. If you could please change Perish Song under my name to reflect it's inclusion in my movepool, that would be much appreciated.

    Also, I am getting close to finalizing all of my reasoning. I will post a Final Submission soon.
  11. Scoopapa

    Scoopapa

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    Hey that's a really good idea, allowing for custom in-game events based on ribbons and such :D
  12. jumpluff

    jumpluff princess
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    Moderator

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    Thank you for the spreadsheet! It's very convenient. Might I suggest that you freeze the top row though, RD, so when we scroll down we can still see people's names on top of everything? (Select Row 1 from the number column on the left side, View > Freeze rows)
  13. Juicy

    Juicy

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    Thank you RD, my movepool has been improved whilst confuse ray and teeter dance have been edited out.

    @Purple Cant
    Nice idea, it has been included.

    @Capefeather.
    Wow! I love the story to get sketch!
  14. srk1214

    srk1214 The Wuthering Heights of Billionaire Gay Dinosaur Fiction
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    FINAL SUBMISSION

    Obviously, consider competitive aspects first and foremost. But please take the time to read my flavor-reasoning, as I put a lot of consideration into how I structured Necturna's movepool.

    COMPETITIVE OVERVIEW

    VGMs (open)

    Calm Mind
    Energy Ball
    Extrasensory
    Facade
    Frustration
    Giga Drain
    Grass Knot
    Haze
    Hidden Power
    Moonlight
    Night Shade
    Night Slash
    Perish Song
    Power Whip
    Protect
    Rest
    Return
    Seed Bomb
    Shadow Ball
    Shadow Claw
    Shadow Sneak
    Sketch
    Stone Edge
    Substitute
    Super Fang
    Switcheroo
    Toxic
    Toxic Spikes
    Will-O-Wisp

    29 VGMs - (26 competitive on Necturna leaving out Return/Frustration and Night Slash)

    NCMs (open)

    Attract
    Bite
    Captivate
    Curse
    Double Team
    Dream Eater
    Follow Me
    Future Sight
    Giga Impact
    Grasswhistle
    Gravity
    Hyper Beam
    Leer
    Round
    Scary Face
    Screech
    Solarbeam
    Spite
    Strength
    Swagger
    Sweet Scent
    Torment
    Vine Whip

    Total 23 NCMs

    52 Moves in total

    This is overall much more bloated than I wanted this movepool to be. But I am fairly unwilling to remove flavor, and there are no competitive moves I feel comfortable dropping. Keep in mind that, by my count, at least 20 of these moves were either required or virtually required by Pokemon Standards and a few more have been required/suggested by R_D. Almost the entirety of the rest of my movepool serves to add as much flavor as I could. Still, I do wish I were not quite so close to the Max limit.

    BREAKDOWN

    Level-up moves (open)

    -Vine Whip
    -Leer
    8. Sweet Scent
    11. Night Shade
    15. Future Sight
    19. Follow Me
    22. Shadow Sneak
    25. Super Fang
    31. Night Slash
    36. Scary Face
    36. Screech
    42. Giga Drain
    45. Haze
    49. Seed Bomb
    57. Moonlight
    66. Power Whip
    75. Perish Song
    100. Gravity


    TMs/HMs (open)
    TM04 Calm Mind
    TM06 Toxic
    TM10 Hidden Power
    TM15 Hyper Beam
    TM17 Protect
    TM21 Frustration
    TM22 Solarbeam
    TM27 Return (counts same as Frustration)
    TM30 Shadow Ball
    TM32 Double Team
    TM41 Torment
    TM42 Facade
    TM44 Rest
    TM45 Attract
    TM48 Round
    TM53 Energy Ball
    TM61 Will-O-Wisp
    TM65 Shadow Claw
    TM68 Giga Impact
    TM86 Grass Knot
    TM87 Swagger
    TM90 Substitute
    HM04 Strength


    Egg moves - Grass group (open)

    Bite - Carnivine, Torterra
    Captivate - Serperior
    Curse - Exeggutor, Ferrothorn, Sunflora, Torterra, Tropius, Venusaur
    Dream Eater - Exeggutor, Lilligant, Whimsicott
    Extrasensory - Roserade, Shiftry
    Grasswhistle - Abomasnow, Cacturne, Carnivine, Cherrim, Lilligant, Maractus, Meganium, Roserade, Sceptile, Sunflora, Venusaur, Whimsicott
    Spite - Cacturne, Shiftry
    Stone Edge - Breloom, Torterra
    Switcheroo - Cacturne, Whimsicott
    Toxic Spikes - Roserade

    Legal combos:
    If both moves are even vaguely competitively viable, the combo will be underlined.

    Bite + Curse (Torterra learns both by level-up, so Torterra can pass both down together.)

    Bite + Grasswhistle (Carnivine can be bred to know Grasswhistle and learns Bite by level-up, so Carnivine can pass both down together.)

    Bite + Stone Edge (Torterra learns Bite by level-up and Stone Edge by TM, so Torterra can pass both down together.)

    Curse + Dream Eater (Exeggutor can be bred to know Curse and learns Dream Eater by TM in Gen V, so Exeggutor can pass both down together.)

    Curse + Grasswhistle (Sunflora can be bred to know Curse and learns Grasswhistle by level-up, so Sunflora can pass both down together.)

    Curse + Stone Edge (Torterra learns Curse by level-up and Stone Edge by TM, so Torterra can pass both down together.)

    Dream Eater + Grasswhistle (Whimsicott and Lilligant can both be bred to know Grasswhistle and both learn Dream Eater by TM, so both can pass both down together.)

    Dream Eater + Switcheroo (Whimsicott can be bred to know Switcheroo and learns Dream Eater by TM, so Whimsicott can pass both down together.)

    Extrasensory + Grasswhistle (Roselia can be bred to have Extrasensory and leans Grasswhistle by level-up, so Roserade can pass both down together.)

    Extrasensory + Spite (Nuzleaf learns Extrasensory by level-up in Gen IV, where it also can be tutored Spite. Then Shiftry can be traded to Gen V, so Shiftry can pass both down together.)

    Extrasensory + Toxic Spikes (Roselia can be bred to know Extrasensory and learns Toxic Spikes by level-up, so Roserade can pass both down together.)

    Grasswhistle + Spite (Cacturne can be bred to know Grasswhistle in Gen IV, where it can also be tutored Spite. That Cacturne can then be traded to Gen V, so Cacturne can pass both down together.)

    Grasswhistle + Toxic Spikes (Roselia learns both by level-up, so Roserade can pass both down together.)

    Illegalities:
    Grasswhistle + Switcheroo (Cacturne and Whimsicott are the only ones to get both, but both get the two moves from separate parents, so both cannot be passed down together.)

    Spite + Switcheroo (Cacturne gets both, but it only learns Spite by a Gen IV tutor and only learns Switcheroo by breeding from Hypno in Gen V, so both cannot be passed down together.)

    Feel free to correct me if any thing I believe to be legal is in fact illegal.


    And obviously since it wasn't in the Egg group...
    Tutor/In-Game Event (open)
    Sketch

    My idea is this: Bring Necturna to a tutor, a painter who only appears at night in the First Floor of the Relic Castle. If Necturna has Night Shade (pun. See what I did there?) in its movepool, the painter will offer to teach Necturna Sketch. The tutor will then also attach a Ribbon to Necturna. This Ribbon will prevent Necturna from learning Sketch again.

    (Full scenario in Overall Flavor section)


    COMPETITIVE MOVES' REASONING
    Mostly Competitive with some Flavor (open)

    There are currently 11 movepools on the spreadsheet. For any competitive move that appears on the spreadsheet, in which the split is 6-5, 7-4, or 8-3, (and for Haze, where I am in a 2-9 minority) I will explain my reasoning.

    YES Perish Song: After a good period of thought, I changed my mind and decided to include Perish Song. I was previously concerned about perish-trapping and felt that strategy would distract from the concept. However, upon further thinking, I realized perish-trapping should not be broken on Necturna, nor should it distract from the overall concept. Gen IV Mismagius is a good example of what changed my thinking. After deciding not to exclude Perish Song on competitive grounds, I decided to include it on flavor grounds that will be discussed later in the Overall Flavor section.

    YES Moonlight: For a long time I wavered on Solarbeam, worrying that Solarbeam would make Necturna Sun-biased. However, I included Solarbeam, because every fully-evolved Grass-type learns Solarbeam (except for Rotom-C.) That inclusion of Solarbeam made me even more scared about including Moonlight. Moonlight, as you know, in Sun recovers 66% of max HP, making it even better than the standard (and disallowed) Recover. However, I have decided to not exclude Moonlight as I don't think that even a Quiver Dance / Giga Drain/Solarbeam / HP Fire / Moonlight would be used on Sun teams as it appears to be outclassed by Growth Venusaur. After deciding not to exclude Moonlight on competitive grounds, I decided to include it on flavor grounds that will be discussed later in the Overall Flavor section.

    YES Switcheroo: Switcheroo/Trick is a move that I don't believe should be feared on Necturna. I see no reason not to include one of the two. Of the two, I elected to include Switcheroo, since Switcheroo is Dark-type and that fits with the flavor of Necturna better than the Psychic-type Trick.

    YES Super Fang: Necturna, lacking reliable recovery in her natural movepool (unless on a Sun team,) needs all the help she can get on defensive sets. Still, with a MASSIVE 120 Base Attack, I question if Necturna would even use Super Fang very often at all, even on defensive sets. I saw no reason not to include it, and it encourages alternatives to offensive-boosting, so it is in.

    YES Haze: Here, I am in a hefty minority I think caused more by people trying to trim down movepools than actual fear of Haze. The only notable booster in OU that defensive Necturna would be stopping is Conkeldurr, who Necturna should be beating anyway. (Reuniclus is better dealt with by just attacking with a STAB Shadow Claw.) Furthermore, as Smogon writes in its analysis of the move, "While Haze is one of the most effective ways to remove stat boosts, it has bad distribution. It is mostly outclassed by Roar and Whirlwind due to their also picking up entry hazard damage into the bargain, should you have lain them down." There really are no OU Hazers, so I think experimenting with Haze Necturna may have some merit. Therefore, I have included it, since I had the room to do so.

    YES Psychic or Extrasensory or Psyshock: Without one of these moves, Specially oriented Necturna would be beaten by Conkeldurr with Payback. Conkeldurr is not intended to be a check/counter to Necturna at all, so at least one of these is necessary to include. I chose to include Extrasensory only for flavor reasons based on the name and descriptions of the moves. Psychic is described as attacking the foe telekinetically, something not previously attributed to Necturna. Similarly Psyshock is described as an odd psychic wave. Furthermore, the only Grass or Ghost Pokemon capable of learning Psyshock is Exeggutor, who is dual-typed Psychic. Extrasensory is the vaguest in description, described as an odd, unseeable power (not specifically psychic, though), and has a good pre-existing condition for Necturna being able to learn it: it used to be a Shiftry (grass-type) exclusive.

    NO Leaf Blade: As Spork so concisely put it: "I really think too many variations on STAB are giving Necturna too many options, and Leaf Blade is kinda the epitome of that, imo. The power/reliability dynamic still exists, just in a more extreme reality, between Power Whip and Horn Leech." As we saw in some calcs previously in attacking moves discussion, Power Whip does NOT affect too many calculations, and as a result, I, like Spork, believe that Power Whip alone suffices for offensive sets.

    YES Seed Bomb: However, I am allowing Seed Bomb strictly as an alternative Physical Grass STAB to satisfy R_D's requirements. I personally feel that Power Whip alone suffices, but I don't see Seed Bomb as harmful, so I have included it.

    NO Horn Leech: That being said, I disagree on Horn Leech. Horn Leech is an equivalent move to Drain Punch. And we all know aggravating Bulk Up Drain Punch Conkeldurr can be sometimes. I don't particularly want to introduce the possibility of something along the lines of Horn Leech / Shadow Sneak / Grasswhistle /Coil . I don't think this set would be game breaking, but I do think at some point there is such a thing as too much variety. Also, for God's sake! Horn Leech is Sawsbuck EXCLUSIVE!! Why would we give this to a CAP if exclusive moves are generally left alone?! I could understand it if that move was essential to the concept (like Sketch,) but not for Horn Leech.

    NO Leaf Storm: Not included for one simple reason: does not fit Bulky Offense at all. Leaf Storm basically would force Necturna to switch out on the next turn, defeating the purpose of bulkiness.

    YES Stone Edge: What I had said before: "Stone Edge is not something I see as vital to the concept. Indeed with Stone Edge, there would be a chance of sketchboosting Necturna beating Heatran, Skarmory, Hydreigon, and Dragonite, rather than having to rely on sketching coverage moves to defeat them. Therefore, I see Stone Edge as unnecessary, and with the Hax and possibility of breaking counters, detrimental to the concept." I don't actually think it provides much meaningful coverage either... Still, R_D has all but required Stone Edge, and I am not going to not be slated after all the work I put into this...

    YES Toxic Spikes: What I had said before: "While I am not adamantly convinced that Toxic Spikes would make Necturna into an unreasonably good hazard-layer/spin-blocker combination. I do think that is a possibility. Necturna would be able to lay Toxic Spikes, block their being spun, while also threatening the best Toxic Spikes absorber in OU, Tentacruel, with Power Whip. I may have theorymonned myself into an unintelligent conclusion, but even if I am wrong, Toxic Spikes is hardly central to the concept of Bulky Offense, so it remains excluded." I saw that R_D has all but required Toxic Spikes, and it made me try to un-theorymon myself from the corner. With R_D's insistence, I have managed to do so and have basically completely discarded my fears that Necturna would be the best Toxic Spikes user in the game. Toxic Spikes is now allowed.

    NO Taunt: Taunt has been excluded despite several similar reasons to Haze's inclusion. Taunt is not the solution to stopping Reuniclus. As I said in the section on Haze, Shadow Claw is a better option. However, Taunt does not only stop slow boosters. Taunt would also make Necturna one of the best options to stop Ferrothorn, being able to Taunt to stop Stealth Rock/Spikes/Thunder Wave, Power Whip being resisted, and Gyro Ball not being particularly threatening due to Necturna's modest 81 Base Speed. That is not necessarily bad, but it was not what I envisioned for Necturna. Furthermore, Taunt, a move that supposedly enrages the foe, doesn't fit the flavor of Necturna very well, in my opinion.

    NO Destiny Bond: This move in truth scares me. One example: Many teams rely strongly on Banded Scizor to revenge kill and scare off Terrakion. But what happens when LO Necturna comes in on Stealth Rock and starts Quiver Dancing (or Dragon Dancing, etc)? Scizor is a very natural switch-in, as once you have seen the boosting move, you know that Necturna has not sketched Sacred Fire, and almost certainly does not carry Will-O-Wisp. Confident that Necturna has nothing to hurt Scizor, the opponent selects U-turn, which does 70-82% to uninvested 4 HP Necturna (good chance to KO after previous Rocks damage and 1 turn of LO damage,) expecting a switch. To their horror, Necturna has used Destiny Bond and the Scizor is taken down with Necturna. Again, I may have theorymonned myself into a corner, but I see no set in which Destiny Bond would every be used UNLESS it were broken, so I've excluded it.

    NO Pain Split: 64 Base HP is just too low for Necturna to get Pain Split, in my opinion. We all know how annoying Sub/Split Gengar was in Gen IV. I have no desire to see a resurgence of Sub/Split now in Gen V. I could see some stupid set like Sub / Split / Sacred Fire / Giga Drain annoying for a VERY long time with proper team support.


    NONCOMPETITIVE MOVES' REASONING
    Purely Flavor (open)

    These moves are either noncompetitive for reasons of being bad support moves, or simply outclassed offensive moves. I'll explain my reasoning for inclusion or exclusion of each move.

    YES Crunch or Night Slash: Both serve as redundant with the STAB Shadow Claw. Therefore, neither is necessary. I elected to include Night Slash for flavor reasons that will be further discussed in the Overall Flavor section. Crunch was excluded therefore, as double-redundancy in Dark-type offensive moves seemed a waste of movepool space.

    YES Night Shade: Night Shade is not entirely noncompetitive, as some would argue, but with 120 Base Attack, like Super Fang, I think most sets would opt for Power Whip over Night Shade anyways. Night Shade was therefore not excluded and was included due to flavor reasons.

    YES Grasswhistle or Sing: I feel that a sleep move as inaccurate as roughly a coin-toss is hardly broken, especially when you consider 4MSS and the availability of sketching Spore. Still the possibility of Coil + Sleep move sets is intriguing. I elected to include Grasswhistle over Sing due to their move descriptions. Grasswhistle, learned by a wide variety of Grass-types, is said to lull targets into deep sleep, while Sing, learned mostly by cutemons, is described as a soothing lullaby.

    NO Sunny Day: It's called NeCTURNa, based on Nocturnal. Not DIURNa. Even though I kept Solarbeam due to every fully evolved Grass type getting Solarbeam, Sunny Day is out because of one saving grace that does not learn Sunny Day. Abomasnow is a fully evolved Grass-type and Abomasnow does not receive Sunny Day, due to its Snow Warning Ability. This is similar enough to my belief that Necturna should not get Sunny Day, due to being based on the word Nocturnal. (Yes I know that Sunny Day is Clear Skies in Japanese. My response... we're not giving Necturna any information in Japanese, so I think we should stick to considering only how Necturna interacts with flavor in English.)

    NO Hex: Hex is hardly necessary, as Shadow Ball is preferred on all offensive sets, and defensive sets will not be using either special Ghost move. Also, flavorwise, Hex makes Necturna feel like a Witch, which I don't think to be true. I see her more as a vengeful former lover, or something like that.

    NO Ingrain: No. No. No. Please. I don't want to give Ingrain / Calm Mind / Substitute / Baton Pass to Baton Pass teams. I don't know if it would be good or not, but I really don't feel like finding out.


    OVERALL FLAVOR
    Explanation of Movepool as a whole (open)

    Level-up movepool:
    Having two start moves is reasonable and typical if Necturna were to be the kind of Pokemon catchable in the early routes of the game. Interestingly, though, if Necturna were to be catchable only later in the game, (or hatched from an Egg made by Ditto-breeding by a mother with 4 moves,) then Necturna would not receive any Physical Grass STAB until level 49. Necturna is intended to be weak and "sweet" early on, but become more malevolent later, like a jilted girlfriend might be. Necturna learns Future Sight at Level 15, at which point she learns of her fate to be alone, presumably she thinks because her companion will leave her. She then learns Follow Me at Level 19 in order to lure her companion away from the public. Every move learned after that is used to preemptively attack her companion before she can be rejected. Little does she know that the Future she envisioned would not have happened if she had not made it come true. Perish Song, learned at Level 75, signifies the death of the last shreds of goodness left in Necturna's heart. Finally, at level 100, Necturna has gained all the experience she can, and she finally understands the Gravity of her situation. But it is too late for her to fix the past. As for total count, mine stands at 18 moves which was the very max I was willing to include in Level-up. That is quite large, tbh, and is probably too large, but this is what fits the flavor best.

    TMs/HMs:
    The most important thing for me to do here was to establish consistency with the game. I am a stickler for Flavor fitting what GF would actually be likely to do. Therefore, Toxic, Hidden Power, Protect, Frustration, Return, Attract, Solarbeam, Shadow Ball, Shadow Claw, Facade, Rest, Double Team, Hyper Beam, Giga Impact, Substitute, and Round are all musts for inclusion in my books. And I will have a very hard time voting for any movepool that does not include all of these moves. Yes we are operating with a cap on total number of moves, but these all should make every list, even above extraneous personal flavor inclusions if necessary. Beyond those, Calm Mind, Energy Ball, Will-O-Wisp, Grass Knot, and Strength all feel like fairly obvious inclusions, that I think all movepools should contain, but I could look past if they were not. The only personal flavor TMs/HMs I've included are Swagger and Torment. I think that Necturna's design has lots of swag, and I can't imagine someone reading over my description of the Level-up movepool and disagreeing with my inclusion of Torment.

    Egg Moves:
    I placed Necturna in the Grass Egg Group, where I think she would actually be placed by GF. On a pure flavor level, Necturna belongs in that Egg Group, where she breeds with her OBVIOUS relative Carnivine (a la Luvdisc and Alomomola or Tauros and Bouffalant.) I could have placed Necturna in both the Grass Group and the Field Group, in order to get Sketch by Egg Move and avoid all illegalities, but that didn't feel right to me as the Field Group is mostly mammalian and there is not a single Ghost-type in the entire group. True, this caused some difficulty in Egg Move combinations, but it also accomplished more than making things tricky. It actually forced me to learn about breeding and egg groups, a subject I found confusing. Through the Egg Moves, I have complemented Necturna's movepool with a lot of flavor (Bite, Captivate, Dream Eater, Spite,) and some potentially competitive moves (Stone Edge, Toxic Spikes, Switcheroo, Gravity, Grasswhistle, Extrasensory, Curse.) Despite the difficulties of breeding outside of the Field group, Necturna still only has two combinations that appear legal at first sight that are in fact illegal, neither of which is competitively viable anyway. EDIT: Toxic Spikes has been added to the Egg Movepool, since that is the most logical method for Necturna to get T-Spikes. Stone Edge was made an Egg Move too, since no Female-only Pokemon has ever been able to learn Stone Edge, so breeding seemed to be the least intrusive method to give Necturna Stone Edge.

    General Flavor:
    We are working with a CAP named Necturna. Based on the word Nocturnal. Therefore I found it important to include any night-based move I could find (with the exception of Night Daze, a Zoroark Exclusive.) That amounted to Night Shade, Night Slash, and Moonlight. But one piece of information that people may not know is that it could also be based on a Nocturne, which is "a short composition of a romantic or dreamy character suggestive of night, typically for piano," or, in short, music. Therefore aside from the required Round, I tried to include several other sound-based moves. Screech, Grasswhistle, and especially Perish Song fit that flavor perfectly. Additional flavor considerations went to moves that fit a female-only Pokemon well, namely Attract, Captivate, and Sweet Scent. (and to a lesser degree Spite, don't hate me female Smogonites!) Strength was included as having a Pokemon with 120 Base Attack that doesn't learn Strength seemed odd to me. The abilities Forewarn and Telepathy dictated Calm Mind, Captivate, Dream Eater, Extrasensory and Future Sight. Finally, the remainder of the flavor was based on the physical depiction of Necturna in the design. The teeth-stitch things lent themselves to Bite and Super Fang, the fake eyes to Leer and Scary Face, etc.

    SKETCH SCENARIO:
    As I said above, at night, go to the First Floor of the Relic Castle with a Necturna with Night Shade in your party.
    The painter is facing the wall with only one blank space in between. His focus is steely. You cannot try to talk to him. You must deliberately walk between him and the wall carvings he is painting. If you do not have a Necturna with Night Shade in your party, he will simply yell at you, "Watch where you're walking! I'm painting here!" If you do have a Necturna with Night Shade in your party, he will instead ask you, "Are you interested in what I'm painting?" You will be prompted to answer Yes or No. If you answer No, he will then tell you, "Then kindly leave me alone to my painting." If you answer Yes, he will happily say, "Good. Very few youngsters are interested in art. Do you know how to paint?" You will be prompted to answer Yes or No. If you answer Yes, he will say, "Oh. Well then I guess there's nothing for me to teach you." If you answer No, he will ask you, "Would you like to learn?" You will be prompted to answer Yes or No. If you answer No, he will disgustedly ask you, "How can you be interested in art but not want to learn?! Kids! grumble..." If you answer Yes, he will say, "Great! Here's the trick. Have your Pokemon sketch everything for you. Then all you have to do is color it in. I actually don't have any artistic talent! My Smeargle is the real artist. Do you have any Pokemon that can learn to Sketch?" Displays your Pokemon with "Not Able" for all other Pokemon and "Able" for Smeargle (if you have one) and Necturna, which you have to have. If you select Smeargle, he will say, "But you've been lying! Smeargle already knows how to Sketch." (even if it doesn't have Sketch itself at that moment) If you select Necturna, he will say, "Perfect, your Necturna looks like she has a lot of natural artistic ability!" Goes to the "which move should be forgotten sequence." The painter says, "Here. Take this Ribbon too. This ribbon will show everyone just how much you love your Necturna." Attaches Classic Ribbon, which prevents trading. "If you actually want to learn how to paint, you should go talk to Burgh in Castelia city. I heard he actually paints without the help of a Pokemon Sketcher!"
    If you try to come back and get the same Necturna taught Sketch, (after going through the same steps above up until the Select Pokemon screen with already-learned-sketch Necturna still listed as Able,) he will say, "But I've already taught your Necturna Sketch! I remember giving her that Ribbon!" Other Necturna will still be tutorable.


    EXTRAS
    Full Alphabetical List (open)

    Attract
    Bite
    Calm Mind
    Captivate
    Curse
    Double Team
    Dream Eater
    Energy Ball
    Extrasensory
    Facade
    Follow Me
    Frustration
    Future Sight
    Giga Drain
    Giga Impact
    Grass Knot
    Grasswhistle
    Gravity
    Haze
    Hidden Power
    Hyper Beam
    Leer
    Moonlight
    Night Shade
    Night Slash
    Perish Song
    Power Whip
    Protect
    Rest
    Return
    Round
    Scary Face
    Screech
    Seed Bomb
    Shadow Ball
    Shadow Claw
    Shadow Sneak
    Sketch
    Solarbeam
    Spite
    Stone Edge
    Strength
    Substitute
    Super Fang
    Swagger
    Sweet Scent
    Switcheroo
    Torment
    Toxic
    Toxic Spikes
    Vine Whip
    Will-O-Wisp

    Classifications (open)

    Physical Attacking
    Grass STAB: Power Whip, Seed Bomb
    Ghost STAB: Shadow Claw, Shadow Sneak
    Coverage: Stone Edge

    Special Attacking
    Grass STAB: Energy Ball, Giga Drain, Grass Knot,
    Ghost STAB: Shadow Ball
    Coverage: Extrasensory, Hidden Power

    Noncompetitive Attacks
    Bite, Dream Eater, Facade, Frustration, Future Sight, Giga Impact, Hyper Beam, Night Shade, Night Slash, Return, Round, Solarbeam, Strength, Vine Whip

    Team Support
    Toxic Spikes, Gravity

    Personal Defensive Support
    Calm Mind, Haze, Moonlight, Perish Song, Protect, Rest, Super Fang, Torment, Toxic, Will-O-Wisp

    Personal Offensive Support
    Calm Mind, Substitute, Switcheroo

    Noncompetitive Support
    Attract, Captivate, Curse, Double Team, Follow Me, Grasswhistle, Leer, Scary Face, Screech, Spite, Swagger, Sweet Scent

    Potential Sets (open)

    Taking some of the obvious ones from Spork, altered for my movepool. Also adding a few... Updated with new movepool per R_D's requirements.

    name: Shift Gear
    move 1: Shift Gear
    move 2: Power Whip
    move 3: Shadow Claw
    move 4: Substitute / Stone Edge
    item: Life Orb
    nature: Jolly
    EVs: 84 HP / 252 Atk / 168 Spe

    name: Shell Smash
    move 1: Shell Smash
    move 2: Power Whip
    move 3: Shadow Claw
    move 4: Hidden Power Fire
    item: Life Orb / White Herb
    nature: Jolly / Hasty
    EVs: 252 Atk / 84 SpA / 168 Spe

    name: Offensive Quiver Dance
    move 1: Quiver Dance
    move 2: Shadow Ball
    move 3: Hidden Power Fighting / Hidden Power Fire
    move 4: Giga Drain
    item: Life Orb / Leftovers
    nature: Timid / Modest
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

    name: Offensive Belly Drum
    move 1: Belly Drum
    move 2: Power Whip
    move 3: Shadow Sneak
    move 4: Stone Edge
    item: Sitrus Berry
    nature: Jolly
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

    name: Offensive Tail Glow
    move 1: Tail Glow
    move 2: Giga Drain
    move 3: Shadow Ball
    move 4: Hidden Power Fighting / Substitute
    item: Leftovers / Life Orb
    nature: Timid
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

    name: Choice (Physical)
    move 1: Power Whip
    move 2: V-Create / Close Combat / Sacred Fire
    move 3: Shadow Sneak / Shadow Claw
    move 4: Switcheroo / Stone Edge
    item: Choice Band / Choice Scarf
    nature: Jolly
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

    name: Sub 3 Attacks
    move 1: Substitute
    move 2: Power Whip
    move 3: V-Create / Close Combat / Sacred Fire
    move 4: Stone Edge
    item: Leftovers
    nature: Jolly
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

    name: Choice (Special)
    move 1: Blue Flare / Seed Flare
    move 2: Shadow Ball
    move 3: Hidden Power Fighting / Hidden Power Fire / Energy Ball
    move 4: Switcheroo
    item: Choice Specs
    nature: Timid
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

    name: Offensive Calm Mind
    move 1: Calm Mind
    move 2: Shadow Ball
    move 3: Aura Sphere / Blue Flare / Spore
    move 4: Giga Drain
    item: Life Orb / Leftovers
    nature: Timid
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

    name: Defensive (Defensive in Sun)
    move 1: Power Whip
    move 2: Will-O-Wisp / Sacred Fire
    move 3: Recover / Moonlight
    move 4: Protect
    item: Leftovers
    nature: Careful
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD

    name: Sun Sweeper
    move 1: Quiver Dance
    move 2: Giga Drain / Solarbeam
    move 3: Hidden Power Fire
    move 4: Moonlight
    item: Leftovers
    nature: Careful
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

    name: Baton Pass
    move 1: Calm Mind
    move 2: Substitute
    move 3: Giga Drain
    move 4: Baton Pass
    item: Leftovers
    nature: Bold
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe

    name: Tormenturna
    move 1: Torment
    move 2: Substitute
    move 3: Protect
    move 4: Sacred Fire
    item: Leftovers
    nature: Careful
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Spe

    name: Coil
    move 1: Coil
    move 2: Power Whip
    move 3: Shadow Sneak / Shadow Claw / Stone Edge
    move 4: Grasswhistle / Stone Edge
    item: Leftovers
    nature: Jolly
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

    name: Perish Trapper
    move 1: Perish Song
    move 2: Spider Web (most PP)
    move 3: Protect
    move 4: Moonlight
    item: Leftovers
    nature: Careful
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe

    name: Toxic Spikes
    move 1: Toxic Spikes
    move 2: Spikes / Stealth Rock / Rapid Spin
    move 3: Power Whip
    move 4: Shadow Claw
    item: Leftovers
    nature: Jolly
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

    name: Graviturna
    move 1: Gravity
    move 2: Power Whip
    move 3: Earthquake
    move 4: Will-O-Wisp / Grasswhistle
    item: Leftovers
    nature: Jolly
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
  15. Rising_Dusk

    Rising_Dusk
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Battle Server Admin Alumnusis a Programmer Alumnusis a Super Moderator Alumnusis a CAP Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus

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    Ah, good call with the row freezing, pluff. I had forgotten that google docs could do that, and have done so. Cheers.

    I'll update the spreadsheet with srk's update tomorrow morning, and will also post some information about the sort of moves I expect to see on movepools to give authors some more direction should they need more.
  16. Deck Knight

    Deck Knight Photorealistic Seagull (PSG)
    is a Forum Moderatoris a CAP Contributoris a Smogon Media Contributor
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    Minor notes on my movepool: I swapped out Spite for Ingrain, so it has one more VGM than previous, and the same number of total moves. Ingrain is one of the moves that makes Baton Pass a uniquely useful Sketch (there are other CM passers), and I decided to go with it.
  17. capefeather

    capefeather no shit
    is a Forum Moderatoris a CAP Contributoris a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus
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    Just a note: Perish Song is not in my movepool (though it was). I know part of the mistake is my fault for not summarizing my competitive moves in a list, so I'm sorry about that, but in any case...
  18. eriXtone

    eriXtone

    Joined:
    Jul 25, 2011
    Messages:
    48
    Amateur Movepool Submission, made largely to convey my idea for learning Sketch.

    VGM: *

    Vision (open)

    Necturna is born with Sketch if hatched at night in the Celestial Tower. Sketch cannot be obtained via any other method, barring an Event. If hatched with Sketch, starting set will always consist of Sketch over Absorb. Sketch takes precedent over all other inherited moves.


    Total Moves: 38 / VGM: 27

    Level Up (open)

    Start: Toxic Spikes*
    Start: Ingrain*
    Start: Shadow Sneak*
    9: Night Shade*
    13: Ominous Wind
    17: Perish Song*
    26: Leaf Blade*
    34: Psybeam
    48: Moonlight*
    55: Spite
    63: Giga Drain*
    66: Power Whip*

    Egg (Grass/Ground) (open)

    Gravity*
    Imprison
    Pursuit*
    Worry Seed
    Captivate
    Switcheroo*
    Sketch*
    Seed Bomb*

    TM/HM (open)

    TM04 Calm Mind*
    TM06 Toxic*
    TM10 Hidden Power*
    TM11 Sunny Day
    TM15 Hyper Beam
    TM17 Protect*
    TM19 Telekinesis
    TM21 Frustration*
    TM22 Solarbeam
    TM30 Shadow Ball*
    TM32 Double Team
    TM44 Rest*
    TM45 Attract
    TM53 Energy Ball*
    TM61 Will-O-Wisp*
    TM65 Shadow Claw*
    TM71 Stone Edge*
    TM86 Grass Knot*
    TM90 Substitute*
  19. Rising_Dusk

    Rising_Dusk
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Battle Server Admin Alumnusis a Programmer Alumnusis a Super Moderator Alumnusis a CAP Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus

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    I had no idea how difficult it would be to update the spreadsheet once made, haha. If you make any changes to your submissions, please be sure to post a bump to this thread to simultaneously inform others and myself of what needs to be changed on the spreadsheet.
  20. Juicy

    Juicy

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2011
    Messages:
    123
    ha! :)
    It's a brilliant idea though.

    My edits are:
    The inclusion of super fang, poison fang, energy ball and gravity.
    The striking of astonish and confuse ray.

    Hope I helped.
  21. Rising_Dusk

    Rising_Dusk
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Battle Server Admin Alumnusis a Programmer Alumnusis a Super Moderator Alumnusis a CAP Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus

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    P.S. eriXtone, your movepool is automatically illegal because you made Sketch a level-up move. I specifically said that I wasn't allowing that because it requires we do weird alterations to the move re-learner. (fwiw, your explanation would simultaneously exclude Pokemon like Chandelure from using the re-learner)

    I'm okay with the way you described getting it, even though your actual movepool disagrees (Why is that, by the way? Maybe you just mislabeled it a level-up move?). It's okay to do the "Pikachu learns Volt Tackle" method since technically it is then a special egg move and not a level-up move, and thus is excluded from the move re-learner.

    P.S. I updated the spreadsheet and included a link to it in the OP.

    P.P.S. I am pretty sure that this will be open for another 2 days or so even though I said it'd initially only be open for 3 days. This is because there's still active development going on and in a good and productive way, so it deserves more time.
  22. eriXtone

    eriXtone

    Joined:
    Jul 25, 2011
    Messages:
    48
    I have updated my movepool submission. Nothing has really changed, just where I listed the move, since that did violate your terms. In my defense, I was thinking of it as similar to the Pichu you mentioned - fully aware of the level-up stipulation - just listed it in the wrong place. Sorry about that.
  23. srk1214

    srk1214 The Wuthering Heights of Billionaire Gay Dinosaur Fiction
    is a CAP Contributoris a Tiering Contributor

    Joined:
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    Messages:
    2,408
    As I mentioned above, I have decided to include Perish Song. All other changes to my original WIP are pure flavor that do not affect the spreadsheet.

    It stinks that the spreadsheet is tricky to edit, but nevertheless, please update it to reflect my inclusion of Perish Song.
  24. Korski

    Korski Distilled, 80 proof
    is a Forum Moderatoris a CAP Contributor
    Moderator

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    Alright I think I'm comfortable enough to make a Final Submission. I've added Pain Split to the movepool as an Egg move, which is the only spreadsheet-worthy update. Mostly I've edited in more reasoning to each of the sections to better explain what I'm trying to achieve with the movepool. I expect only minor updates, if anything, between now and when when Dusk chooses his slate.
  25. capefeather

    capefeather no shit
    is a Forum Moderatoris a CAP Contributoris a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus
    Moderator

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    I marked my submission as final a while ago, but I've just been cleaning up some stuff. No more trolly flavour :P I'm not sure I could really even explain some of the stuff (especially Explosion lol) and then I had a class, so...

    I apologize to anyone who got worried because I kept making major changes to the flavour.
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