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CAP 3 CAP 3 - Part 3 (New Evolution/New Pokemon Discussion)
- Thread starter Gothic Togekiss
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Evolution of an existing Species. I mean, sure, we could end up having Nintendo do our work for us with the Evo concept, but seriously, do you see Nintendo ever taking note Carnivine, Sunflora, or Torkoal again.
And Besides, even if Nintendo did that, it would be a whole new meta-game.
And Besides, even if Nintendo did that, it would be a whole new meta-game.
Evolution of an existing Species!
To many times are there new Pokemon that are just horrible, or get put in an UU catagory. I'd like to see some old species get into the OU or Uber statues. The Sunflora evoultion with a fire stone I think is a great idea. I'm also tired of seeing new species that can't ever be used because of lack of STAB or movepool. For an example, when Sneasel came out, he looked so cool a lot of people would have used it, if it's typing wasn't bad. He had an okay movepool, but not the greatest. I understand the point of having a "NEW" Pokemon for a new generation, but evolving old Pokemon into new ones is like having a species. Look at the Nido's, they went from Poison to Poison/Ground. That's a great concept, it gain more weaknesses, but it also game better moves to help it.
To many times are there new Pokemon that are just horrible, or get put in an UU catagory. I'd like to see some old species get into the OU or Uber statues. The Sunflora evoultion with a fire stone I think is a great idea. I'm also tired of seeing new species that can't ever be used because of lack of STAB or movepool. For an example, when Sneasel came out, he looked so cool a lot of people would have used it, if it's typing wasn't bad. He had an okay movepool, but not the greatest. I understand the point of having a "NEW" Pokemon for a new generation, but evolving old Pokemon into new ones is like having a species. Look at the Nido's, they went from Poison to Poison/Ground. That's a great concept, it gain more weaknesses, but it also game better moves to help it.
New Species
As much as I'd like a Carnivine evo (levitating fiery-flytrap-muppet monster? Yes!), a new pokemon has infinitely more room for creativity (especially with regards to level-up/egg moves)
As much as I'd like a Carnivine evo (levitating fiery-flytrap-muppet monster? Yes!), a new pokemon has infinitely more room for creativity (especially with regards to level-up/egg moves)
Evolution of an existing Species.
Evolution of Sunflora fuck call it Sunflare.
Evolution of Sunflora fuck call it Sunflare.
I'm going to have to vote evolution of an existing pokemon, for the reason that we've never done that before. And if the CaP is going to be a huge process to create a large amount of pokemon (weren't we going for 40 or something?), we can't just have new pokemon, regardless of how many evolutions they have. Plus, if we're trying to mix up the metagame here, couldn't we make some kind of Sunkern alternate-evo that gives Sunny Day? Dare to be different with a new evo.
After thinking about it, I think I'll vote for evolution of an existing Pokemon. While I originally went the "new Pokemon leaves more creativity" route, now I think that I'd like to see how we do with extensively reworking an existing one. It's not like they have to look very much the same (see: Magikarp->Gyarados/Dragonair->Dragonite) and thinking within restrictions can be just as interesting as not.
I could go either way, but I have to say evolution of an existing pokemon because it haven't been done yet. I didn't look at the typnig page before this lol.
And sunflora is the only I can think for that.
And sunflora is the only I can think for that.
NEW SPECIES, if we make an evolution, we limit ourselves to the pre-evolutions' movepool. If the pre evo had, say, encore, and encore was too powerful on the design we planned, then what? We either ditch our old plans, or worse, change the pre-evo for he sake of discussion. New species will not run the risk of stifling such creativity.
Except that won't be made, because this Pokemon is Fire/Grass.
I know :(
I believe that it would have to be a New Species altogether, if you do take a look at the list of Fire and Grass types, nothing seems to jump out and have you say "This pokemon so needs a new evo".
After thinking a while about this and looking over the fire and grass and even the normal list, im going to vote New Pokemon. I like the panda idea. Just by looking at a panda, i can see strong attack, good defences, and probably a mid to high hp. This thing should be special based, because you have a ton of amazing STAB moves. For special, you have Flamethrower, Fire Blast, Grass Knot, Energy Ball, and Any HP you want. For physical, you have Fire Punch, Flare Blitz and i guess Seed Bomb. See the difference? The typing SCREAMS special.
I think we'd be less limited if this poll was asked before the 1st and 2nd typing.
It'd be nice though to have an evolution of an existing species for a change.
It'd be nice though to have an evolution of an existing species for a change.
New Species
Creating a competitive pokemon is hard enough, without having to make the pokemon "fit" with some pre-existing species evolutionary line.
One of the hardest problems with polling in the CAP project is handling soft issues that relate to the supposed "intent" of the game of pokemon. It's almost impossible to discuss or debate comments like:
If we decide to evolve an existing pokemon, I see even more soft issues in our future.
Creating a competitive pokemon is hard enough, without having to make the pokemon "fit" with some pre-existing species evolutionary line.
One of the hardest problems with polling in the CAP project is handling soft issues that relate to the supposed "intent" of the game of pokemon. It's almost impossible to discuss or debate comments like:
These statements imply the existence of some rulebook that defines the game maker's intentions. While there may be some Pokemon Creation Rulebook floating around the halls of Nintendo or Gamefreak, we don't have one here. So, when issues like that are discussed, they really don't go anywhere.
If we decide to evolve an existing pokemon, I see even more soft issues in our future.
These questions cannot be answered. We have no idea what "rules" the gamemakers follow when they make an evo. We all have opinions on this stuff, but we can't really back up our opinions with evidence gathered from competitive play. I can only imagine the arguments that will ensue, if we go down the new evolution path. Arguments like that don't accomplish much, other than distract us from creating a good competitive pokemon.
I don't think the typing screams special, STAB Flare Blitz and Wood Hammer is just as nasty as STAB Fire Blast and Grass Knot
at 34-20 with new species in the advantage...I have to unfortunately drop my "underdog mentality" and go with new species
Just to tell you, the whole "primary type has to be evolved" so we have to find a Fire Pokemon to evolve into the Fire / Grass and not a Grass for Grass / Fire is COMPLETELY wrong. Earthworm, Aki and the like are forgetting about Onix -> Steelix. Onix's primary typing is Rock, and Steelix's primary typing is Steel. Also, note the eeveelutions; just because they are mono-type does NOT mean the primary type was not changed. Please do not spread false information.
I am voting new species however because I feel like for this particular typing, I want it to be more fleshed out from the beginning with the ability to set up our own moveset, as opposed to being somewhat limited by Sunflora / Cherrim / Carnivine.
I'm also hoping the purpose for this Fire / Grass will be more diverse than is generally accepted.
Just to tell you, the whole "primary type has to be evolved" so we have to find a Fire Pokemon to evolve into the Fire / Grass and not a Grass for Grass / Fire is COMPLETELY wrong. Earthworm, Aki and the like are forgetting about Onix -> Steelix. Onix's primary typing is Rock, and Steelix's primary typing is Steel. Also, note the eeveelutions; just because they are mono-type does NOT mean the primary type was not changed. Please do not spread false information.
I am voting new species however because I feel like for this particular typing, I want it to be more fleshed out from the beginning with the ability to set up our own moveset, as opposed to being somewhat limited by Sunflora / Cherrim / Carnivine.
I'm also hoping the purpose for this Fire / Grass will be more diverse than is generally accepted.
OK looks like its gonna be a new species, i just hope its gonna be special based or its a tremendous waste of a very good offensive typing. Its gonna be difficult to make something that has a stealth rock weakness a tank.
Personally i believe we should be going for something that is primarly special offensive based, but also has the spe def/hp to take a few weaker special hits.
Basically Gardevoir with a little more hp, less speed and hopefully clorophyll/solar power.
Personally i believe we should be going for something that is primarly special offensive based, but also has the spe def/hp to take a few weaker special hits.
Basically Gardevoir with a little more hp, less speed and hopefully clorophyll/solar power.
I actually like the idea of this guy being offensively balanced. I would really love to see a flare blitz/wood hammer set.
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