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Clefable is BL

Discussion in 'UU' started by Banedon, Jul 21, 2011.

  1. Banedon

    Banedon

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2009
    Messages:
    903
    Since the megathread got closed ... and pardon the sensationalist title.

    I'm having some serious trouble dealing with stallbreaker Clefable. There are three sets:

    Clefable @ Life Orb
    Double Edge
    Fire Blast
    Grass Knot
    Softboiled

    And:

    Clefable @ Toxic Orb
    Facade
    Fire Blast
    Softboiled
    Trick

    And finally:

    Clefable @ Life Orb
    Calm Mind
    Thunderbolt
    Ice Beam
    Softboiled

    What beats these things? All three sets are checked by Hitmontop, although it can be worn down. Beyond that far as I can see counters get really shaky. Uragg suggested Magcargo to check the first one, which come to think of it works well, but it is only one Pokemon and a NU one at that. The Clefable analysis currently being prepared suggests SpD Spiritomb, which looks unreliable because it can be taken down quite quickly with Grass Knot (in addition to Fire Blast). It won't like getting Tricked by the 2nd set, while the third set just sets up on it. Hariyama will get worn down quickly vs. boosted Double Edge.

    For the second set I can't see any firm counters to. I guess there's Heatran, except it's OU ... otherwise all I can see is to try to get it to Trick Toxic Orb onto something that doesn't mind it that much (such as RestTalk Milo) but RestTalk Milo can be 3HKOed by Orb-boosted Facade without Leftovers, and steel types like Registeel get pwned by Fire Blast. RestTalk Spiritomb perhaps ... finally the third set breaks through stall completely except for Hitmontop (which is, as always, worn down) and potentially last-ditch TrickScarfers.

    So the list of checks are three Pokemon: Hitmontop, Spiritomb and Magcargo. Looks dangerously short to me.

    If Clefable isn't BL for crushing stall there has to be more Pokemon on this list. Help?

    PS: I blame Oglemi and SilentVerse for making me play 4th gen UU. Sheesh. :naughty:
  2. .I Wish You Well.

    .I Wish You Well.

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2010
    Messages:
    204
    Erm, edit, nvm. This is for gen 4, well as far as i know, Hitmontop was always the #1 switch to Clefable. The third set can be stopped by Steelix. First set probably can be stopped by Altaria, i'm not sure, might want to run some Double Edge calcs.
  3. Pocket

    Pocket Apo, the astronaut's best friend >:3
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2004
    Messages:
    8,580
    You really need a solid fighting move to take Clefable out. Hitmontop was popular to counter Clefable, b/c it has solid special defense with no boltbeam weakness, intimidate, and it can spin rocks.
  4. SilentVerse

    SilentVerse Into the New World
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Forum Moderatoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Smogon Media Contributoris a Past SPL Winner
    Moderator

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    Yeah, wallbreaking Clefable is annoying to beat. iirc, I used Support Mismagius before and that worked fairly well. Immunity to Double Edge, and low weight basically forces Clefable to use Fire Blast, which doesn't 2HKO and can be PP stalled eventually. It can also Taunt Calm Mind sets so they can be worn down more easily by the rest of your team, and if you run a bulkier spread, it won't be 2HKOed by a +1 Thunderbolt or Ice Beam. Out of the three sets, it only really fears being Tricked Toxic Orb, and that can be played around (or Taunted if it doesn't Trick on the switch). It's not really ludicrous to run support Missy on a stall team either since it's a decent spinblocker, and it deals with opposing stall really well.

    I think there's a few other things too though. RestTalk Uxie, Specially Defensive Arcanine, and Dusclops are pretty reasonable other options, and then there's a bunch of NU stuff that does well too (Shuckle, Torkoal, Probopass, Magcargo...). As far as Trick + Toxic Orb goes, you don't really have anything that's completely safe against it, but keep in mind that it can only use it once, unless it gets the Toxic Orb back. Also, Trick + Toxic Orb isn't really that deadly imo, since you can generally force Clefable to Trick a Pokemon with reliable recovery, and from there, you can just switch around a bunch to mitigate the effect, and keep the Pokemon's HP up with their recovery move. Calm Mind is different to beat, but Haze Milotic is a good answer to remove CM boosts and PP stall (though it dies to crits and parahax), and Perish Song and Trick to beat it if it's the last Pokemon.

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