Doubles Viability Rankings (C- Votes if u care lol)

[Darkmalice]

Sableye - Yes
Goodra - Yes
Infernape - Yes
Weavile - No. Borderline no.

Weavile. Fast and frail is not too great when neither of your STAB attacks reach over 75 BP (not counting Knock Off's power boost) 125 Speed isn't even fast anymore; I mean we have behemoths like Mega Gengar, Mega Manectric, and even Deoxys-A. Ice Shard is clutch but Mamoswine is so much better for that role. Weavile is frail as shit, too; it always has to carry a Focus Sash because it just gets OHKOd by everything. Priority messes it up too, since the thing doesn't even get Sucker Punch. Physical Dark-type offense sucks unless your name is Bisharp and you have Defiant to fuck up Fighting-type Intimidate users.

Weavile should pretty much always be running Knock Off, a 97.5 BP move that removes your opponent's item with strong neutral coverage is brilliant. It also pairs well with Low Kick and Ice Punch.

Landorus-I - Yes
Tornadus-I - Yes
Mew - Yes
Escavalier - No
Latias - Yes
Abomasnow - Yes
Pinsir - Yes

 

[Deoxymoron]

Sableye yes
Goodra yes
Infernape yes
Weavile no
Landorus-I yes
Tornadus-I yes
Mew yes
Escavalier no
Latias yes
Abomasnow yes
Pinsir no

 

[Arcticblast]

Sableye - 1 no, rest yes
Goodra - 1 no, 1 abstain, rest yes
Infernape - all yes
Weavile - 5 yes, 6 no
Landorus - 2 no, rest yes
Tornadus - 1 no, rest yes
Mew - 2 no, rest yes
Escavalier - 2 yes, rest no
Latias - all yes
Abomasnow - 3 yes, 1 abstain, 7 no
Pinsir - 5 yes, 1 abstain, 5 no
<Arcticblast> yo Pwnemon
<Pwnemon> ja?
<Arcticblast> you haven't voted in the viability ranking thread
<Arcticblast> Pinsir for B- yes or no
<Pwnemon> yes
<Pwnemon> pinsir is so bad
<Arcticblast> ok
<Pwnemon> kill it dead
Pinsir - 6 yes, 1 abstain, 5 no

Sableye, Goodra, Infernape, Landorus-I, Tornadus-I, Mew, Latias, and Pinsir will move down to B-rank.

Will post later with some rank shifts. There will be no C+ or C-.

 

[JAV1L15]

Just wondering, how come Espeon has hit dirt bottom in this list? I'm currently putting a doubles team together and Magic bounce duel screens Esp was on there pretty quickly as a support mon to bounce status conditions (it's usefulness against hazards is obviously next to nothing, as they arnt as big of a deal in doubles) and give my team some extra bulk.

Set I was Running:
Espeon @ Light Clay
Ability: Magic Bounce
Nature: Timid (+Spe, -Atk)
EV’s: 252 HP, 252 Spe, 4 Def
Moveset: Reflect/ Light Screen/ Psychic/ Protect


I'm guessing I'm making a fatal mistake, please do tell me where I'm going wrong, and what would better fill its place?

 

[Eievui-Nymphia]

Just wondering, how come Espeon has hit dirt bottom in this list? I'm currently putting a doubles team together and Magic bounce duel screens Esp was on there pretty quickly as a support mon to bounce status conditions (it's usefulness against hazards is obviously next to nothing, as they arnt as big of a deal in doubles) and give my team some extra bulk.

Set I was Running:
Espeon @ Light Clay
Ability: Magic Bounce
Nature: Timid (+Spe, -Atk)
EV’s: 252 HP, 252 Spe, 4 Def
Moveset: Reflect/ Light Screen/ Psychic/ Protect


I'm guessing I'm making a fatal mistake, please do tell me where I'm going wrong, and what would better fill its place?

Because they're way better screeners.

If you want a faster screen, use Klefki or Meowstic-M because it has priority screens.

If you want bulky screens, use Cresselia.

 

[LightningLuxray]

Alright, I'll bring up a few changes I was thinking about :]

Jirachi A to A-: I like Jirachi a lot, but I personally don't really think it fits in A all that well. Follow Me is cool, and it has some nice support options, but it struggles with a lot of weaknesses to common spread moves like Heat Wave and Earthquake. It also is hit super effectively by Knock Off, which is annoying for something that really like Sitrus recovery. Togekiss also gives it a lot of competition, as it is immune to Earthquake, resists Knock Off, takes neutral damage from Heat Wave, has a larger Special Defense and Special Attack stat, and has a few more support options than Jirachi, such as Encore and Tailwind.

Not a bad mon by any means, I just think it'd fit better in A-

Keldeo B+ to A-: Keldeo is a really really good mon that in my opinion really sticks out from the other B+ Pokemon. Keldeo sits in a really nice Speed tier that allows it to outspeed a really large portion of the tier, and speed ties with Terrakion and Infernape. Not only that, but Keldeo is extremely powerful, and will leave a dent in basically anything it attacks (a lot of time just outright OHKOing with LO.) This thing also has some cool support options such as Quick Guard and Taunt, the former helping it against Talonflame with the latter making sure Amoonguss can't Rage Powder its attack away. Another thing I like about Keldeo is it isn't effected by Intimidate, meaning it can still fire attacks at full power even when shit like Landorus-T is on the field (unlike Terrakion). I understand it does have problems with Amoonguss and it's pretty frail, but I think its great Speed and power make up for it.

Heracross B to B- (Or even C): Ok, I've never really actually seen this thing use seriously so I may make some incorrect points here, but doesn't it seem like this thing is kind of weird in B? I mean, I've never actually seen this thing used, yet its considered as viable as the like of Hydregon, Kingdra, and Weavile. Can someone enlighten me on why this thing is so high, because it seems more like a B- / C Pokemon to me considering it faces a lot of competition from Mega Mawile for a Mega slot, as it has Intimidate, a better typing, and Huge Power, and its weak to Talonflame, a Pokemon which Trick Room already kind of struggles with.

 

[JAV1L15]

Because they're way better screeners.

If you want a faster screen, use Klefki or Meowstic-M because it has priority screens.

If you want bulky screens, use Cresselia.

This does make quite a lot of sense, will probably use one of the pranksters, I can see priority being more useful.

Recommended EV split for Klefki and Meowstic-M? Speed EV's are obviously not as important with priority, but there is still the case of outspeeding opposing priority too.

 

[Dia]

Serperior: Non-existent to D rank. While it is outclassed by both klefki and cress, it does have one niche: crippling Garchomp, Landorus, and Landorus-T with glare and putting up dual screens, which is something thunder wave users can't do. Zygarde also gets glare, but doesn't get screens.

 

[Lolk]

I'm gonna leave Serperior out of this because we are still deciding on how/if we want to show Pokemon with tiny niches at all.

More stuff to vote on cause wynaut:

Tier Jumps:
Heatran falling to A.

Scrafty falling to B.

Keldeo rising to A.

Sub-Tier Jumps:

Heracross to B-.

 

[LightningLuxray]

Heatran to A: No
Scrafty to B: No
Keldeo to A: Yes
Heracross to B-: Yes

 

[realiti]

Heatran to A: No. Heatran has a great defensive typing that allows it to counter many big Doubles threats in the metagame. It can run a variety of sets, and can alternate moves so it can be used for different purposes. While it is weak to common moves such as Hydro Pump and Earthquake, I do think that Heatran it a very good Pokemon and should stay in S rank. It can usually be slapped on most teams and achieve good results.
Scrafty to B: No. Scarfty is a little underrated atm. Access to Fake Out and solid STAB moves allows Scrafty to be useful offensively and defensively. It has the ability to remove items, which is quite useful as removing Sitrus Berries and Life Orbs makes dealing with opposing Pokemon much easier. It does face competition by Hitmontop, however, and cant do much against some common Pokemon. It is also weak to Flying Types and Fighting Types which isnt really great for a defensive inclined mon. It does have some good features that allows it to perform well in the metagame, and I think it should stay in A-.
Keldeo to A: Yes. Straightforward answer. Keldeo is one of the best mons in the tier right now. It has amazing offensive presence as well as having amazing STAB moves. It can check almost the entire tier with its power and speed, as well as providing some support with Quick Guard and Taunt. Easy pick for A.
Heracross to B-: Abstain. I never used this before. While this sounds great on paper, it possibly might not be good in practice. Weakness to common moves isnt that great and I dont feel like voting without using it.

 

[Laga]

Heatran to A: ?????? how is this even questionable, it's a frickin shadow of zard y, and needs to drop to A rn lol

Scrafty to B: yes it's really weak; after one intimidate, it gives way too many free turns against all mons it can't hit super effectively.

Keldeo to A: yes

Heracross to B-: yes, it's not that good

 

[Darkmalice]

Heatran to A: yes. A+, but it's time to drop. The metagame is better suited towards handling it than it was before - it's more suited towards taking its attacks through resists and there's more bulky pokemon who can take a hit even without resisting it, whilst there's also more Pokemon who threaten it offensively

Scrafty to B: No. What U-Turn Out said

Keldeo to A: Yes. It's a great fit into the current metagame. Do I really need to explain more

Heracross to B-: no. Stupidly high attack with very high base power moves, good coverage, and good bulk too (80/115/105). Speed is easily its biggest weakness, but give it speed control (e.g. Tailwind Suicune) and it wrecks shit. It's reliant on speed control, but it makes very good use of it.

 

[Bughouse]

Heatran to A: yes. A+, but it's time to drop. The metagame is better suited towards handling it than it was before - it's more suited towards taking its attacks through resists and there's more bulky pokemon who can take a hit even without resisting it, whilst there's also more Pokemon who threaten it offensively

Scrafty to B: No. What U-Turn Out said

Keldeo to A: Yes. It's a great fit into the current metagame. Do I really need to explain more
Heracross to B-: no. Stupidly high attack with very high base power moves, good coverage, and good bulk too (80/115/105). Speed is easily its biggest weakness, but give it speed control (e.g. Tailwind Suicune) and it wrecks shit. It's reliant on speed control, but it makes very good use of it.

^yes I second all of DM's votes and reasons.

 

[Lolk]

^yes I second all of DM's votes and reasons.

i second all of srks seconds

 

[Ununhexium]

i second all of srks seconds

I second all of lolks seconds of srks seconds

 

[qsns]

Heatran to A: Yes
Scrafty to B: Yes - great on paper, underperforms in practice
Keldeo to A: Yes
Heracross to B-: Yes

 

[Fangame10]

Heatran to A: Yes: Heatran I feel while very good, is not suited for being in s rank with pokemon like Mega-Kanagskhan. like everyone else said, people are finding ways to counter it easily, including those who bring Ground types or fighting types. But it still retains its bulk and power and amazing substitute set so I'd keep it at A+ imo.
Scrafty to B: Yes: Scrafty imo, while having high bulk, is outclassed by hitmontop who learns wide guard and close combat. it can't do much damage without Hi-jump kick, which will force protects
Keldeo to A: Yes: Keldo is a good pokemon, good stats, a good typing, and a good move pool . it's quick guard stops talonflame as well, so I feel A is right for it
Heracross to B-: No: Mega Hera while being underrated is the only pokemon capable of OHKOing a Cressilia other than Escaliver. It's a great Trick room counter and will defeat most Trick room teams it faces. it's also really strong capable of taking down most threats it has. It also has a good move pool and can fit on tailwind or Trick room teams.

 

[Audiosurfer]

Heatran to A: Yes
Scrafty to B: No
Keldeo to A: Yes
Heracross to B-: Yes

 

[Idyll]

Heatran falling to A - Yes
Scrafty falling to B - NO, Scrafty is actually a really cool mon. It's really bulky (bulkier than Hitmontop which is cooll) while having some real strong staying power to annoy opps with Knock Off, Intimidate, and coverage. Unlike Hitmontop, which has no way of preserving (CC lowers defense O.o), Scrafty can be an annoying mofo by keeping itself alive using its bulk and the recovery it gets from Drain Punch. Still, Hitmontop does have cool support options, but in no way does this mean that it outclasses Scrafty when Scrafty has notable key traits that Hitmontop doesn't have.
Keldeo rising to A - YES
Heracross to B- - No

 

[GlassGlaceon]

Heatran falling to A: ye
Scrafty to b: ok no. this thing should not drop to b for a variety of reasons. It's bulkier thn top, has more overall utility with knock off, pseudo-recovery in Drain punch, doesn't lose to every ghost n psychic type in the tier, has fake out, and a typing and ability that allow it to beat threats like Deo-A which is threatening oO
Keldeo to A- no. I have never once seen this thing ever be useful in any matches I've played against it. with the rise of Char+Venu teams I've been seeing as of late I really see no real use for this thing, with it's main STABS being weakened/ineffective against both. Maybe it's cuz i run rotom-w nd other electrics, maybe it's cuz i like to run Deo-A, I don't know. I have just never seen a use for this thing even though it seems to find it's way onto a lot of teams. This is partially probably from my new overpreapredness for rain but meh I still don't like it.
Heracross to B-: yes

 

[termi]

Heatran falling to A. Yes. The meta is much better prepared for it than early on so it's not the meta-defining threat it used to be at all anymore.

Scrafty falling to B. Yes. Kinda in limbo about this, but its relatively low offensive presence and its lack of utility compared to Hitmontop makes it more of a really good B mon than a low A mon.

Keldeo rising to A. Yes. Don't rlly have to explain it just works.

Heracross to B-. No. Still incredibly frightening and hard to switch into if your name is not Landorus-T or Aegislash, with Tailwind/TR support this thing is something else entirely. Brings bulk to the table too. Only problem is that you can't use another mega, but that has never been a valid grounds to vouch against a mega anyway.

 

[Anty]

Heatran falling to A - Yes The meta has become more adapt to it (hp ground on every special attacker), the sub set is no where near as great as it was and the 3 attacks set isnt a S-rank threat

Scrafty falling to B - No I have used it a lot and i find it is always plays a part in the game. Although its a sitting duck when burnt, you shouldnt be letting it get burnt and it still can intimidate and fake out.

Keldeo rising to A - Yes It pulls its weight every game. It has nice STABs as well as a possibility of quick guard/taunt/icy wind/sub, each helping it vs certain checks (talon/sludgebomb amoo/mence/any faster threat)

Heracross to B- - No Still a major threat in tailwind, although uncommon

 

[Darkmalice]

Heracross to B-. No. Still incredibly frightening and hard to switch into if your name is not Landorus-T or Aegislash, with Tailwind/TR support this thing is something else entirely. Brings bulk to the table too. Only problem is that you can't use another mega, but that has never been a valid grounds to vouch against a mega anyway.

I agree with everything except what is underlined. The opportunity cost of taking up the Mega slot. has played a role in vouching against some of the weaker Megas like Mega Medicham and Blastoise. With such Pokemon, you have to question if their utility is worth giving up the Mega slot and denying yourself access to an overall better Mega. Some other Megas like Mega Manetric also have the issue that, whilst good Pokemon, their roles can be carried out by non-Mega Pokemon (like Thundurus-I for fast Electric-type and Landorus-T for Intimidate pivot), and using said Pokemon leaves your Mega slot free for other Pokemon. An extreme example is Mega Alakazam and Deoxys, though Alakazam would still suck anyways.

 

[Lolk]

Heatran falls to A rank

Scrafty remains in A rank.

Keldeo rises to A rank.

Heracross remains in B rank.

now that the tiers are set vote on subtiers:

Heatran for A+ or A.

Keldeo for A or A-.