Dragonair [BW2 Revamp] (GP: 2/2)

Discussion in 'Uploaded Analyses' started by Governess, Jan 3, 2013.

  1. Governess

    Governess A Beautiful Blossom Waiting to Bloom
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    Credit goes to constantinipple for the original skeleton and partial writing of this analysis.

    Code:
    [B][U]To-Do List:[/U][/B]
    [LIST]
    [*]Write out this analysis. [[B][COLOR=Blue]✓[/COLOR][/B]]
    [*]Fix any errors pertaining to the set / content. [[B][COLOR=Blue]✓[/COLOR][/B]]
    [*]Recieve the final QC Check. [[B][COLOR=Blue]✓[/COLOR][/B]]
    [*]Correct any obvious grammar-prose errors before handing it to GP. [[B][COLOR=Blue]✓[/COLOR][/B]]
    [*]Recieve two GP checks, and have this analysis on-site. [[B][COLOR=Blue]✓[/COLOR][/B]]
    [/LIST]
    
    Dragonair
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG] 3/3: | Raseri | Sweet Jesus | Treecko |
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG] 2/2: | GatoDelFuego | NixHex |


    Skeleton by Constantinipple (open)

    [Overview]
    • mediocre overall, but can justify its use on certain teams
    • can run offensive as well as defensive sets
    • is offensively somewhat outclassed by Fraxure due to low attack stat
    • reaches decent defenses coupled with Eviolite
    • has excellent defensive typing, being only weak to ice and dragon, of which dragon is uncommon and ice can be fixed with a teammate
    [SET]

    name: Bulky Dragon Dance
    move 1: Dragon Dance
    move 2: Rest
    move 3: Outrage
    move 4: Waterfall / Extremespeed
    item: Eviolite
    ability: Shed Skin
    nature: Careful
    evs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD


    [SET COMMENTS]
    • makes use of her bulk in order to set up, but succeeds most of the time when done on weaker special attackers
    • Rest for healing up damage, the sleep has a 33% chance to be cured due to Shed Skin
    • Outrage serves as primary attacking move and STAB, hitting the majority of the tier for neutral damage
    • Waterfall for more coverage, and helps with Lairon and Bastiodon who resist Outrage
    • is despite holding Eviolite still pretty vulnerable to physical attackers
    • Extremespeed can be put over Waterfall, trading priority for coverage, and can also deal some reasonable damage to revenge killers when she has boosted up

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
    • Marvel Scale over Shed Skin is an option with Sleep Talk over Waterfall or Extremespeed, which makes her rely a bit less on Shed Skin and also giving her reasonable defenses
    • can run a more physical defensive set, but it doesnt accomplish as much as the specially defensive
    • appreciates Heal Bell support to cure her sleep status since alot of physical attackers can force her out
    • Musharna comes teammate, with useful Heal Bell support. she's also able to wall alot of physical attackers
    • hazard setters, most notably Spikes Scolipede are recommended together with Dragonair as her attacks can be underwhelming sometimes, which can be somewhat helped by prior damage.
    • evs to maximize the special bulk so she can set up on weak special attackers
    • Piloswine as teammate, as he takes ice moves nicely and can hit steel types super effectively
    [SET]

    name: ResTalk
    move 1: Rest
    move 2: Sleep Talk
    move 3: Dragon Tail / Outrage
    move 4: Thunder Wave
    item: Eviolite
    ability: Marvel Scale
    nature: Careful
    evs: 244 HP / 56 Def / 208 SpD







    [SET COMMENTS]
    • reaches above average 270/375 defenses with 324 HP
    • gets a x1.5 Def boost when sleeping which grants her great defenses
    • Rest and Sleep Talk for obvious reasons
    • Dragon Tail serves as STAB to still dish out some damage while phasing out set-up sweepers at the same time
    • is capable of crippling opposing pokemon with Thunder Wave, making it easier for the rest of the team to succeed in their jobs, also completes the parashuffling set
    • Dragon Tail's weakness can be annoying when facing a subset pokemon, so using Outrage through Sleep Talk can be used in order to break these subs, or to just simply deal more damage
    • Sleep Talk picking the wrong move often leads to hazard setters having an easy time doing their jobs

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
    • evs to balance the defenses evenly when asleep, giving her very much bulk on both sides
    • if you dont necessarily need T-Wave support and still prefer the bulk, then Dragon Dance is an option in order to deal damage against offensive mons
    • can a physical set to wall physical hitters like Tauros, Primeape and Sawsbuck better
    • pairs well with CB Sawk and other wallbreakers that profit from the speed drop of Thunder Wave, he can also hit ice types super effectively
    • Musharna is also a good team option, as it counters opposing Sawk where Dragonair has problems with
    • Rotom-F as teammate to check the likes of Braviary and Golurk, though he should watch out for their secondary STABs
    • Toxic can be used to do something to ground types, but they can be phased out with Dragon Tail anyways
    • can come in and take a hit from various special attackers such as Charizard, Kadabra and Haunter (especially when they are scarfed) and cripple them with thunder wave
    • also can wall some physical attackers when asleep, like (non mold breaker) Pinsir, Rapidash and Swellow and cripple them with thunder wave

    [Other Options]
    • leftovers can be held but the bulk that eviolite grants her is really useful
    • an offensive DD set with Life Orb can be chosen for more power, but her low defenses are exaggerated even more
    • furthermore Dragonair is really limited to other options due to her mediocre stats. she already needs pretty much support already and trying to run other sets like a special offensive one will make it so hard to pull a win off that it shouldnt be seriously considered

    [Checks and Counters]
    • both sets have huge problems with Mold Breaker Sawk, as the DD set is simply too frail and the ResTalk set cant function well against him due to Mold Breaker negating Marvel Scale
    • bulky ice types like Piloswine, Regice and Rotom-F that have an easy time coming in on Dragonair can hit her super effectively.
    • taunt users like Skuntank can be used to cripple Dragonair, which can be annoying for both sets
    • also has problems with popular CB pokemon, especially pokemon such as Braviary and Golurk, annoyingly 2HKOing Dragonair with the appropriate move in most occasions
    • the DD set still struggles with common physical walls that she cant hit super-effectively, such as Musharna, Bastiodon if she runs extremespeed and soon she will struggle with Tangela, too




    [Overview]

    <p>A single glance at Dragonair's stats would usually give you the impression that she is a mediocre Pokemon. In all honestly, she is. Offensively, her stats aren't so hot, especially when there are better offensive Dragon-types such as Fraxure. As she has almost no offensive prowess&mdash;even with Dragon Dance&mdash; she finds herself as not only setup bait to many Substitute users like Golurk but also walled against most physically defensive Pokemon, such as Golem and Alomomola. If you combine that with her mediocre Speed and defensive stats, Dragonair might not even be worth using in the NU tier.</p>

    <p>However, thanks to two useful abilities in Shed Skin and Marvel Scale and Eviolite, Dragonair still finds hope to become known in NU. While her defensive stats alone aren't very promising, holding an Eviolite allows them to be utilized. Her great defensive typing gives her resistances to many common types, as well as only two weaknesses. Because of this bulk, she can make use of Dragon Dance, as she can set up much more efficiently thanks to her decent bulk. Thunder Wave and Dragon Tail are also great move selections for Dragonair, as she can cripple sweepers and rack up entry hazard damage. Overall, while Dragonair does have her perks, she is outclassed in many ways, and should be used with extreme care.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Bulky Dragon Dance
    move 1: Dragon Dance
    move 2: Rest
    move 3: Outrage
    move 4: Waterfall / ExtremeSpeed / Sleep Talk
    item: Eviolite
    ability: Shed Skin / Marvel Scale
    nature: Careful
    evs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Dragonair can function well with a bulky offensive set. She can set up Dragon Dance on special attackers such as Jynx (which can only 2HKO Dragonair with Ice Beam, but Dragonair needs +2 Speed to outspeed Jynx), by taking advantage of her decent bulk, in contrast to other frail sweepers. In spite of her defensive boost, this set isn't meant to set up on powerhouses and bulky setup sweepers, such as Sawk and Carracosta, but it is rather meant to set up on special attackers and walls, which in some cases cannot stop at least one Dragon Dance. Thanks to Dragonair's great ability options, Rest can be used with succession, giving Dragonair a recovery option.</p>

    <p>Dragon Dance is the core of this set, as it raises Dragonair's Speed and Attack to viable levels. Rest is Dragonair's only source of recovery, and while two turns asleep can hinder Dragonair's capabilities, Shed Skin and Marvel Scale can mend it. If she finds an opportunity to set up, Dragonair can break through opposing teams with her powerful STAB move, Outrage, because there aren't many Pokemon in the NU tier that can resist it. Waterfall is used for extra coverage, but unless Dragonair encounters a Steel-type, Outrage is the superior choice. ExtremeSpeed is also an option if priority is preferred, as it can be used for revenge killing weakened adversaries. Dragonair's Speed is not very good without investment, so ExtremeSpeed can be used to revenge kill Choice Scarf users that outspeed Dragonair even after two or three boosts are attained, such as Primeape, Jynx, and Zebstrika. Finally, Sleep Talk is another option in the final moveslot, as it takes advantage of Rest while working well in conjunction with Marvel Scale. Sleep Talk also allows Outrage to be used without being locked into it.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Shed Skin and Marvel Scale both have their merits, and should be used accordingly. Shed Skin gives the opportunity for Dragonair to wake up from Rest 33% of the time, which can be useful in the midst of setting up. However, Marvel Scale gives Dragonair a 50% boost in Defense when Dragonair is inflicted with status, which allows Dragonair to be even harder to defeat. Full investment in both HP and Special Defense allows Dragonair to obtain the bulk necessary to set up on her main target. With Eviolite, the given Special Defense EVs, and her great defensive typing, Dragonair doesn't have many difficulties setting up against special attackers, such as Eelektross and Charizard. A Careful nature maximizes her Special Defense. An EV spread of 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe is optional to handle physical attackers, such as Tauros and Choiced Braviary. Aqua Tail is an option over Waterfall for more power, but Waterfall is more reliable, and the flinch rate can be useful.</p>

    <p>As Dragonair's attacks are usually underwhelming, entry hazards are appreciated so that Dragonair can manage to land a KO. Scolipede, Garbodor, and Probopass are good partners for that role; the latter has good synergy with Dragonair, as it takes the Ice-type attacks aimed at her. Pokemon that can spread paralysis or burn, such as Volbeat, Liepard, or Misdreavus, can be helpful in weakening the opponent for Dragonair. Heal Bell support can be useful for Dragonair, which is recommended when Shed Skin is the chosen ability. Lickilicky and Miltank are great selections as Heal Bell partners; Lickilicky can also pass Wishes to Dragonair. Lastly, physical walls, such as Weezing, stop Dragonair in her tracks. Gorebyss and Musharna are both great special attackers to deal with them.</p>

    [SET]
    name: RestTalk
    move 1: Rest
    move 2: Dragon Tail / Outrage
    move 3: Thunder Wave
    move 4: Sleep Talk
    item: Eviolite
    ability: Marvel Scale
    nature: Careful
    evs: 244 HP / 56 Def / 208 SpD

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Dragonair's goal for this set is to spread paralysis against the opposing team, which can be achieved thanks to her access to Eviolite, recovery from Rest, and the Defense boost from Marvel Scale when Dragonair is afflicted with status. Rest is the key move in this set, as it keeps Dragonair healthy. Thunder Wave is an important move to the set because it can not only cripple the opposing sweepers, but can give an opportunity for teammates to attack. Dragon Tail in conjunction with Thunder Wave allows Dragonair to pass paralysis to the adversary, as well as stopping setup sweepers from advancing, such as Swords Dance Samurott. However, due to Dragonair's lackluster Attack stat, she is often setup bait to Substitute users, who can then set up entry hazards, Leech Seed, or power up. In such a scenario, Outrage is a solution, allowing Dragonair to have some sort of offensive presence. Sleep Talk is the final move of the set, allowing Dragonair to continue to act while she is asleep from Rest.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Marvel Scale encourages Rest to be used, as the 50% Defense boost helps maintain Dragonair's longevity, allowing her to fare well against physical attackers, such as Rapidash, non-Mold Breaker Pinser, and Swellow. The given EV spread balances her defensive stats when Marvel Scale is activated. A Careful nature enhances her Special Defense. Eviolite also increases her defenses, allowing her to survive hits much easier. If Thunder Wave isn't used, Dragon Dance can be replaced with it, giving her the chance to deal with more offensive threats. Toxic can also replace Thunder Wave to cripple bulky walls, such as Regirock and Alomomola. Pokemon that benefit from having paralyzed opponents, such as Choice Band Sawk, Butterfree, and Braviary, are great allies, as they can perform sweeps on the opposing team with fewer difficulties. Rotom-F and Jynx are great Pokemon to handle powerful physical attackers, such as Golurk and Braviary, but they must be careful of opposing Fighting-type moves. Golurk is also a good partner, as it can deal with Steel-types, Sawk, and Musharna. This variant of Dragonair is Taunt bait, which attracts Pokemon such as Liepard and Misdreavus to prevent Dragonair from using her support moves. Gurdurr and Sawk can easily deal with the former, while Charizard can take a Will-O-Wisp from the latter and proceed to KO it.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>With powerful special attacks at her arsenal, such as Draco Meteor and Dragon Pulse, Dragonair has the option of running a special attacking set. However, her mediocre Special Attack prevents this set from being successful. Leftovers can be used for any of Dragonair's sets, but she really needs the defensive boosts that Eviolite has to offer. Alternatively, an offensive Dragon Dance set can try to bring out Dragonair's offensive prowess, but her lackluster defenses are exposed even more so, making it difficult to set up. Flamethrower and Fire Blast can be used to deal with Steel-types, but Dragonair has no place for them in her movesets. Substitute can also be used in the bulky Dragon Dance set to try to set up Dragon Dance, but with a lack of reliable recovery, Dragonair would be wearing herself down.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>Even with Eviolite, Dragonair doesn't stand a chance against many of the offensive Pokemon in NU. In general, almost every Ice-type in NU, bar Jynx, can easily defeat Dragonair. Sawk with Mold Breaker can cut through Marvel Scale, making Dragonair even more vunerable to physical attacks. Dragonair still has a hard time with physical walls, even with Dragon Dance. Steel-types, specifically Bastiodon and Probopass, can easily wall Dragonair. Tangela, Regirock, Musharna, and Misdreavus can all wall Dragonair with ease. Offensively, Pokemon with Choice Band can break through the bulky Dragon Dance set, namely Braviary, Sawk, and Golurk. Taunt users, such as Skuntank and Liepard, can prey on Dragonair and render her useless. Dragonair is setup bait for many Substitute users, especially Murkrow, Golurk, and SubSeed Ludicolo. Bulky Pokemon that can lay entry hazards, such as Roselia, can also set up on her. Finding a Pokemon to handle Dragonair is a very easy task, as her mediocrity allows her to be defeated by a variety of Pokemon in the NU tier.</p>
  2. Rayquaza_

    Rayquaza_

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    You need Outrage else Dragoinar becomes setup bait for anything with Substitute.
    STAB Outrage hits decently hard and doesn't lock you into it when selected by Sleep Talk so it's very viable.

    And ice isn't exactly uncommon, in fact it's a very common offensive type in NU.
  3. Constantinipple

    Constantinipple

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    in the current metagame, all that is viable in ice typing would be Regice, Rotom-F and Piloswine, and with Snover gone these pokemon are becoming slightly less popular. i'll fix it though.

    i'll mention outrage in the OO or possibly AC, but Dragon Tail is really useful for phasing. (unless i get more feedback on this i'll keep dragon tail on the set for now)
  4. Django

    Django
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    Is this a single set or a full update? I ask because you have the single set title and yet include the Other Options and Checks and Counters sections, which are only for full updates. If this IS a full update, then I would like to see a Dragon Dance set. If not, then you can remove the Other Options, Checks and Counters and Overview.
  5. Constantinipple

    Constantinipple

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    ah true. guess i was too excited to post it hehe. ill do a full update and will include a DD set. excuse my dumbness!
  6. Constantinipple

    Constantinipple

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    excuse the double post, but im bumping this for checks
  7. alexwolf

    alexwolf King of Conquerors
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    This is complete theorymon but i remember using this set in RU to decent success:

    Dragonair @ Eviolite
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
    Nature: Careful
    Ability: Marvel Scale
    - Dragon Dance
    - Outrage / Dragon Tail
    - Rest
    - Sleep Talk

    I prefer Outrage so that Dragoniar can have some decent power and at least be able to OHKO offensive mons at +2, while also working fantastic with Sleep Talk, but D-Tail prevents phazng which is always nice for boosting tanks. When sleeping it is incredibly difficult to take down and it can keep bosting 'till it becomes threatening, while not many Pokemon can 2HKO it. Just food for thought...
  8. Constantinipple

    Constantinipple

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    seems interesting, i'll mention it somewhere in AC, and if i get more feedback on it i'll possibly slash it.

    this still needs QC checks though!
  9. Raseri

    Raseri wut
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    With a new metagame just starting, and the fact that a lot of the QC members have little experience with Dragonair, it might take a few days before they're comfortable giving QC checks. I know that I need to use it more before I can make the analysis as good as possible. We do know its here though, so dont worry :)
  10. Django

    Django
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    Not a full check yet, just a few things I've noticed in your skeleton.

    • Its not strictly outclassed by Fraxure as a Dragon Dancer, as it can actually use Rest effectively.
    • You dont need to mention the exact defensive stats, just emphasizing that they are good is sufficient.
    • EV comments go into AC, not in Set Comments.
    • Remove Facade lol
    • For the first set mention a few things that Dragonair can actually wall and start paralysing stuff on. It lost a huge niche when Magmortar left the metagame, what does it accomplish now?
    • You have slashed ExtremeSpeed, so it should be mentioned in Set Comments, not AC.
    • I would mention Marvel Scale with Rest and Sleep Talk over ES / Waterfall. Those massive defenses can be good for setting up, while not having to rely on Shed Skin activating can be beneficial. Sleep Mechanics are an asshole, but at least you're not a complete sitting duck with Sleep Talk.
    Looking good so far, I'm sure some other QC members have stuff to say about it!
  11. Constantinipple

    Constantinipple

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    Alright, I implemented most of the above.
  12. Constantinipple

    Constantinipple

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    bump, its been a while now and the meta has been running for almost 2 months also
  13. Joim

    Joim This lulling sense of purpose will destroy us rapidly
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    First set is still Taunt bait / Sub set up fodder. I'd slash Outrage on Dragon Tail and Dragon Dance on Thunder Wave, to be honest. I've used that too and it worked nicely. Liepard, Volbeat, Illumise are amongst other better paralsys spreaders, imho.
  14. Constantinipple

    Constantinipple

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    Outrage is currently in AC, though i do agree that the current set taunt bait. ill slash it if there are no objections. i'd like some more comment on the DD before i change it, because if i slash it, it will change the purpose of the set from spreading paralysis to more of an bulky offensive mon which is more like the second set, and resttalk offensive is mentioned in it.
  15. WhiteDMist

    WhiteDMist 59 more til 1k
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    Honestly, I've tried the RestTalk set, and I've really missed the power boost that Dragon Dance gives. Thunder Wave is great, until you realize that Dragon Tail is so weak that you can't properly para-shuffle anything that sets up a Sub. It's also more beneficial to Sleep Talk a Dragon Dance instead of a Thunder Wave simply because of the chance that the opposing Pokemon is already paralyzed or behind a Sub. If you slash DD, then mention that you need teammates that set up Toxic Spikes and/or spread paralysis to make up for the loss of T-wave. For teammates, mention Golurk as a very good one. It deters Poison types that don't care about T-Spikes, Steels who still wall Dragonair, and smashes Golem who is immune to Thunder Wave. It also checks Sawk and Musharna, who are both very threatening to Dragonair if it doesn't manage to get a Rest off.
  16. Constantinipple

    Constantinipple

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    alright since there are doubts on the first set, how about i change it to a Marvel Scale ResTalk DD Outrage set (which, imo is better than a Shed Skin set), and then do the parashuffler set as the second set?
  17. fire r a g e

    fire r a g e

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    I wonder why no one has QCed this yet.
  18. Governess

    Governess A Beautiful Blossom Waiting to Bloom
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    Agreed. The QC'ers have been busy with other stuff, soSo they don't have time to QC the ones in waiting.
  19. WillSO

    WillSO

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    As a tiny throw-in, I think Choice Specs should be thrown into OO. I realise it's largely outclassed, but that's why I'm dropping it in OO not creating another set. I had decent success using both SpecsNair and SpecsTaria in a team, as they broke down eachothers counters excellently.
  20. Raseri

    Raseri wut
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    I'm sorry that no one has checked this yet. I don't have a lot of experience with Dragonair but I've used it a few times.

    • I really think the bulky dragon dance set should be first, i never found the resttalk set do that much. I know its not bad, but it is ridiculously easy to beat. It is a good wall, but right now there are to many things in the meta that destroy it.
    • On the resttalk set you mention that Sawk deals with dragonair's ice weakness. This isn't true because Sawk can't switch in. I'd reword it to say that Sawk can hit Ice-types super effectively.
    • I don't understand this. If physically defensive doesn't rely on rest as much shouldn't it be the standard? Physically defensive deserves a mention, but specially defensive works better with Dragon-typing. When mentioning physically defensive, just mention a few physical hitters that it can check.
    • I'd expand the teammates on both sets, particularly the bulky DD set. When hazard support is mentioned, use Scolipede as the spiker of choice.
    • for OO I'd mention an offensive DD set with Life Orb
    • for checks and counters I'd mention Ice-types in general. Articuno, Rotom-F,Piloswine, Regice, Lapras. Jynx is the only one that can't switch in.


    [qc]1/3[/qc]
  21. Constantinipple

    Constantinipple

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    implemented the above
  22. Sweet Jesus

    Sweet Jesus Neal and Jack and me, absent lovers...

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    Maybe specify outrage should be mainly used through sleep talk because it's embarassing to lock yourself with such a weak pokemon who needs to recover every now and then.
    This kind of comes back to the previous set, but I guess you can keep it.

    For the second set, I'd add in the set comments that dragonair is very weak and therefore a complete loss of momentum, often letting the opponent set up hazards and leech seed (you mentionned sub set up, but add hazards too).

    The overview is a bit too positive imo, dragonair is really a mediocre pokemon.

    QC Approved 2/3
  23. Constantinipple

    Constantinipple

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    implemented the above. since writing an analysis on a mobile is a bit complicated, i will try to write this in about a week. thanks for the checks!
  24. Constantinipple

    Constantinipple

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    sorry for the delay, my computer got fixed later than expected. i hope the qc will give me some more time.
  25. Raseri

    Raseri wut
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