Metagame Dual Wielding

I don't think Mail can even be used from gen 6 onwards.
Oh awk.

Anyways, another mechanic that needs to be looked at is Z moves + Mega Evolution. Right now any pokemon can mega turn 1, and z move turn 2.
If this is the intended interaction, I suggest changing it. In-game mechanics, Mega Rayquaza can't use a Z move and a Rayquaza with a Z Crystal and Dragon Ascent can't mega evolve. This is because lore-wise the player's key stone and z crystal occupy the same spot on the bracelet so the player can't use both. If we want to be at least some what consistent with game mechanics, this should be changed.
 
Knock Off used against pokemon with 2 knock off-able items will have a 2.25x boost and knock off both items.
No, just 1.5× boost.
Knock Off used against a pokemon with a Mega Stone and 1 knock off-able item will have a 1.5x boost and knock of the knock off-able item.
Knock Off used against a pokemon with a Z Crystal and 1 knock off-able item will have a 1.5x boost and won't knock off the item.
This is the current mechanic, yes.
Mail is unreleased but can be knocked off anyway.
Right now any pokemon can mega turn 1, and z move turn 2.
My understanding is that if you play Balanced Hackmons then your pre-mega formes can use Z moves too. The only known exception other than Mega Rayquaza is that Ditto or Mew can't use a Z move if Transformed into a mega or primal forme.
 
No, just 1.5× boost.

This is the current mechanic, yes.

Mail is unreleased but can be knocked off anyway.

My understanding is that if you play Balanced Hackmons then your pre-mega formes can use Z moves too. The only known exception other than Mega Rayquaza is that Ditto or Mew can't use a Z move if Transformed into a mega or primal forme.
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-615518262 they can in fact actually i remember someone when testing the same thing on cartridge it works the same way too, ill link it when i find it

Edit: apparently on cartridge it doesnt work that way, here a person tested it and it didnt work
(timestamp 3:36)
 
Yeah two of the same items are usable at the moment
[replay]gen7dualwielding-656117289[/replay]

2 Eviolite Porygon2 is annoying Unleash 2 Band Archeops
Great to have the meta back

Here's that Zygarde10 set :p

Zygarde-10% @ Focus Sash
Ability: liechiberry
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Outrage
- Thousand Arrows
- Extreme Speed
 
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Is this gonna be fixed eventually? Double items are really broken right now

Especially double choice and double eviolite

Double Eviolite: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7dualwielding-656114940

What its supposed to do: 252 Atk Lopunny-Mega High Jump Kick vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 582-686 (82.7 - 97.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

What it does against double evio: 252 Atk Lopunny-Mega High Jump Kick vs. +1 248 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 390-458 (55.4 - 65.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Double leftovers (turn 9) and double choice band (turn 24/25): http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7dualwielding-655944411

Whats liquidation supposed to do: 252+ Atk Choice Band Golisopod Liquidation vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Scizor-Mega: 127-150 (37 - 43.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

What double cb does: +1 252+ Atk Choice Band Golisopod Liquidation vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Scizor-Mega: 189-223 (55.1 - 65%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
 
Sorry about the item duplication bug; this was an oversight from when the code was changed to allow virtual console transfers. I've been too busy to be able to fix it myself and although other contributors have had a go nobody has come up with a working fix yet.

Edit: Fix has been live for some time, I just never got around to mentioning it before.
 
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Edit: yea I’ve been sniped on both of these topics, and tentacruel may be better than toxapex becuz it can get spin but tpex does get recover tho...


So I’ve been experimenting with some sets, and here’s what I’ve come up with.

Porygon2 @ Eviolite
Ability: normaliumz
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Thunderbolt
- Ice Beam
- Recover
- Conversion

Normally, Porygon2’s role is just to soak up attacks and heal it all back up. Here, my p2 takes on a more offensive role, and given the interactions with knock off and a held z crystal, p2 can never lose its Eviolite (unless I’m missing something; trick & knock off don’t work on it as far as I know). This is immensely powerful as it sets up very, very easily with the amazing bulk it gets & with z conversion, gets even more bulk! For comparison, after a z conversion + changing to electric typing + having max/max defense (which I will explain later), banded zygarde’s tarrows does less than 50%.

252+ Atk Choice Band Zygarde Thousand Arrows vs. +1 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Porygon2: 140-168 (37.4 - 44.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO (I changed p2’s typing to electric in the calc).

Now I chose electric typing, not only because of boltbeam coverage, but also it has the benefit of losing a fighting weakness and exchanging it for a ground weakness, in which you have ice beam for grounds! It also has the benefit of resisting specs LO tbolt (after conversion) from strong special electric attackers, if your team needs that.
As for why I chose max/max defensive bulk, it’s because 1) it helps it soak powerful knock off’s early/midgame, and 2) I noticed that revenge killing counterplay after p2 has setup usually takes in the form of strong physical moves/swords dance sweepers (ie Hoopa-U & SD M-Gallade). Investing in max/max def reduces the chance that my enemy can employ these methods successfully.

With all this raw bulk & a midgame/endgame setup opportunity (not that hard to find if you play properly), p2 sweeps with ease. Of course, z conversion p2 does come with flaws, as toxic, haze, and phazing completely stop setup (but then you still eviolite!).
*Sidenote: I did my testing on ladder, which can be argued as not be the most reliable source to be tested a set, but I’ld say I have played enough games to merit a decent analysis of this set.



I also wanted to point out the power of black sludge + leftovers on a bulky poison type. Essentially, one can heal 12% every turn (given that you are not burned nor stuck in partial trapping). A set highlighting this is ...

Toxapex @ Black Sludge
Ability: leftovers
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Toxic Spikes
- Haze
- Recover
Pretty self explanatory what it does imo. It loses regenerator but it can be justified by the double lefties it gains per turn.
 
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It loses regenerator but it can be justified by the double lefties it gains per turn.
The recovery from Regenerator is worth more than five turns of Leftovers recovery ([1/3]/[1/16] = 5+1/3). So, how often do you expect Toxapex to sit in on something for five turns? If the answer's less than 'most of the times it comes in', then Regen is better. Toxapex is too passive to scare the opponent into staying in with something that can't break it, so it's switching in and out a lot, in my experience, even if it doesn't have regen.

If you want to run Lefties+Sludge, your best bets are Gengar and Tentacruel, because they have nothing better to do with their ability slot -- Gengar can probably run Sub+Taunt to accomplish... something idk, whereas with Tentacruel it's just making it that much easier to switch into hazards and spin.
 
I am unsure if this is intentional or not, but if a Pokémon has a Z Crystal in one item slot, you can't knock off the second item with Knock Off, which is very annoying. It doesn't appear to be the same for megas (as in the item DOES get knocked off) but the only megas I've seen are gallade and heracross, who I end up attacking with a different move that deals far more damage, anyways, so I can't rightly say.
 
I was messing around with defensive clamper set, and it survived a leaf storm for a specs mega sceptile:
252 SpA Choice Specs Sceptile-Mega Leaf Storm vs. +1 252 HP / 252+ SpD Deep Sea Scale Clamperl: 236-282 (86.1 - 102.9%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO
+1 clamperl because eviolite boost, which I think works. And I assumed opponent was specs because of the damage.
 
Trickeroo is bugged in Dual Wielding, the items in the ability slots are gone after a switch: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7dualwielding-657670656
My Gengar tricked Sticky Barb + Black Sludge onto the opposing Mandibuzz, so that it takes 25% damage per turn and received Leftovers + Rocky Helmet in return. When the Mandibuzz switched out and back in, its Black Sludge, which was in the ability slot, was gone, so that it only lost 12.5% of HP per turn. Same happened with my Gengar's leftovers, which were gone too when it came back in later.
 
Question : Why does the Keldeo in the OP have Scarf/Orb ? Unless I'm missing something, which I probably am, Scarf/Specs would be more powerful, have no recoil, and no downside over scarf/orb because you were already using scarf.
 
Here's a tricky little set I've been having fun with...

Minior @ Focus Sash
Ability: Weakness Policy
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Shell Smash
- Acrobatics
- Earthquake
- Power Gem

Basically get rid of hazards and priority users, then bring this guy in on a turn/switch or faint, set up and destroy! With the abundance of bolt/beam running around, the weakness policy gets activated most of the time. Tough to bring in safely, but when you do, it's game over...