First RMT in forever, OU.

[Mach]

Okay, I'm not really active on these forums, but I like the Smogon ladder better than official. I've done pretty well with this team, but I always level off when my rating's at about 1300 and then I do badly and my rating goes down. So can someone help me figure out what's wrong here, and how I can fix it?




Forretress@Leftovers
252 HP, 176 Def, 80 Atk
Relaxed
Gyro Ball
Explosion
Stealth Rock
Rapid Spin

Okay, this is my lead and my first priority spinner. I think it's important to get SR up early, so I always use it if I don't expect Fire type attacks. Then, I either switch out or Explode. Gyro Ball is for some attacking move, so I don't have to kill myself if I get Taunted.


Gyarados@Leftovers
252 HP, 80 Atk, 176 Speed
Adamant
Dragon Dance
Waterfall
Earthquake
Substitute

BulkyGyara. I neglected the defences so I can be as fast as possible coming out of 1 DD. I don't really like outrage, because this guy is out pretty early more often than not. Normally, he's the guy I go to to take Fire attacks for Forretress. I have something with Flash Fire, but I use him late game, and I don't like to spoil the suprise with him coming in too early.


Staraptor@Choice Band
252 Atk, 252 Speed, 4 HP
Adamant
Close Combat
Brave Bird
Quick Attack
U-turn

This is my faster sweeper. Don't get me wrong, I think Gyara gets the job done a lot more, but Staraptor helps me out of many situations. I normally just switch him in for revenge kills, and U-turn out to see what they bring in to counter. Then, I bring in my counter, and the next time I bring in Staraptor, I know what to do.


Starmie@Leftovers
252 HP, 252 Spd, 4 SpAtk
Timid
Recover
Rapid Spin
Surf
Grass Knot

So this is my second spinner. A lot of the time, SR kills me, so I think it's important to get it off the field, hence the 2 spinners. I sacrificed offence to increase survivability, with Max HP and Recover.


Blissey@Leftovers
176 HP, 252 Def, 80 SpDef
Bold
Softboiled
Ice Beam
Thunder Wave
Heal Bell

TheraBliss, except with Heal Bell over Aromatherapy. They do the same thing, so I don't see a difference. Doubles as a Special wall.


Houndoom@Life Orb
252 SpAtk, 252 Speed, 4 Atk
Hasty
Sucker Punch
Flamethrower
Dark Pulse
Hidden Power (Ground)


My secret weapon. Easily my favorite member of the team. He catches teams off guard so many times that it saves the game for me more than anything else. Sucker Punch for priority, HP Ground for if I know Heatran is coming, and is trying to get a Flash Fire boost off me. Dark Pulse and Flamethrower for STAB. I'm thinking about going with Fire Blast over Flamethrower, though. With Hasty over Mild, I don't have as much power, and I can use all I can get my hands on. The accuracy thing bothers me, though, since this guy is frail and can't take a neutral hit, especially with LO recoil.

 

[Malfunction]

Hey there.

I would just like to point out a few things on your Pokemon.
First, using two spinners on the same team isn't really something good. One rapid spinner is enough, all you need is to use it effectively and not let it die quickly.

I would like to suggest you use Bronzong as a lead. Forretress is fine, but Bronzong is basically superior as a lead with greater defenses and more resistances.

---------------------------

Bronzong

Sassy @Leftovers
252 HP / 86 Atk / 80 Def / 92 SpD
-Stealth Rock
-Gyro Ball
-Hypnosis
-Earthquake / Explosion

---------------------------

This Bronzong sets up Stealth Rock, may use Hypnosis on something, and can finish of with a strong Explosion. If you don't like Hypnosis' now shaky accuracy, you can use Reflect/Light Screen instead. This Bronzong does what Forretress does and more, while only sacrificing Rapid Spin, a thing Starmie is great at doing.

On Gyarados, I would use Taunt over Substitute. Gyarados is by nature bulky, and along with Substitute, Stealth Rock and sandstorm, Gyarados' sweeping potential will be extremely lowered. Taunt helps against enemy Pokemon who want to cripple you with status, and stops others from setting up. Also, you aren't outspeeding anything particular with your EVs. Use the standard set - 156 HP / 108 Atk / 100 Def / 144 Spe - as it gives you maximum potential.

Staraptor doesn't really benefit your team. May I suggest something instead of it, like Flygon?

---------------------------

Flygon

Adamant @Choice Band
252 Atk / 80 SpA / 176 Spe
-Earthquake
-Outrage
-U-turn
-Stone Edge / Fire Blast

---------------------------

Although it has an attack lower than that of Staraptor, Flygon can basically do what Staraptor does, and even better. It is immune to ground-type moves, just like staraptor, but with the added bonus of being resistant to Stealth Rock. It is also immune to electric and rock-type moves, things that can be really troublesome for this team. It also has U-turn for scouting, and a strong stabbed Outrage that is only resisted by steels. You can also run Fire Blast here if you want to hit steel types. If that is the case, use a Lonely/Naughty nature. If you want Stone edge to hit flying enemies for super effective damage, use Adamant and throw the Sp. Att EVs into Hp. You also might want to run 216 Speed EVs to outspeed neutral nature Electivire, a Pokemon that can be troublesome for your team.

As far as Starmie is concerned, use an EV spread of 136 HP / 156 Def / 216 Spe. It gives you good bulk and speed enough to outrun +Speed Gengar and Infernape. Thunderbolt is also an option to quickly take down Gyarados before it DDs up and rampages through your team.

Blissey is fine as it is, although an EV spread of 252 Def / 40 SpA / 216 SpD can be better at taking special hits. It offers maximum defensive potential, and is recommended on standard cleric Blissey.

Either change Houndoom into a pure Sp. attacker or a mixdoom. Using Sucker Punch only and splitting its EVs isn't really worth it. Go with a Nasty Plot sweeper, or a mixdoom with Pursuit over Dark Pulse if you feel it is better. With its respectable attack, a stabbed pursuit on a switching out Pokemon like the ever-common Rotom forms can be quite useful. A Mild nature with and EV spread of 80 Atk / 212 SpA / 216 Spe is recommended.


I really hope this helped, and the best of luck to you!

Sincerely,
Yours Truly

 

[diamondfan1910]

Get rid of Forry. You need SR, I agree, but Forry isn't a good lead in today's metagame. A better choice is Metagross or Bronzong; both can deal some damage while setting up SR when you need it. A spinner is important in this team since you have 3 SR weak Pokemon, but you don't need two.

Spinner Starmie needs a bulkier spread. The standard is 136 HP/156 Defence/216 Speed with a Bold nature.

 

[Imran]

I always level off when my rating's at about 1300 and then I do badly and my rating goes down. So can someone help me figure out what's wrong here, and how I can fix it?

My first piece of advice for you based on this would be to sign up to Battling 101, Smogon's apprentice programme. They will help you to build solid teams, and is the first port of call for a beginner, the Team Rate forum is a short term team help stop, hopefully Battling 101 will give you the skills you are looking for, for life! If you have any questions about this feel free to PM some time, and I will attempt to help you with anything you might want to ask. :D

I would say that Forretress is not the best lead for you, as others have suggested. I fully support Amre92s suggestion of lead Bronzong over lead Forretress, for one Bronzong does (slightly) better than Magnezone, who is ever so common in today's metagame. If you play intelligantly with Earthquake / Hypnosis, you should be able to beat "Steel-Killer" Magenzone, in fact the only vareint you are really worried about is Specs, who IIRC can't OHKO you as you hit it hard back with Earthquake. I also support the change of Staraptor to Flygon, although I disagree with one part, I find that Choice Band Salamence is really the sort of Powerhouse that you are looking for in this team, it will break physical walls that Gyarados finds it hard to get through, with a Choice Band, Salamences attack reaches a monstrous 553.5 (with a neutral nature), as compared to Flygon's comparativly Timid 492 (with a +Atk nature), here is the set:

Salamence @ Choice Band
Naive Nature / Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 HP
~ Outrage
~ Stone Edge
~ Earthquake
~ Fire Blast / Dragon Claw

Dragon Claw is good for scouting without having to go straight into an OUtrage, which could prove costly, but I would reccomend Fire Blast so that you can beat buggers like Skarmory and Forretress who might want to spoil your fun. The other two moves are mainly fillers but you will find you don't use them much, Outrage really makes this set. The advantages that this has over Flygon are that it hits a lot harder, whilst being able to tie with other positive base 100s, and beating things like Jolly Lucario. On the other hand, Flygon has a handy Electric resistance, and isn't weak to Stealth Rock, so factor that into your thinking when you make this descision. (you also lose U-Turn)

I would suggest changing Grass Knot to Thunderbolt on Starmie, it will help you deal with Gyarados a little better, as you have a bit of a weakness to the offensive dragon Dance versions, also change the EV spread to 136 HP / 156 Def / 216 Spe, this spread (if I recall correctly) will allow you to survive a +1 Gyarados Earthquake / Stone Edge to KO back with Thunderbolt, after taking Stealth Rock damage. Also change Earthquake to Stone Edge on Gyarados, with Zapdos all over the place at the moment, it's worth it to hit it ^_^ you will also hit other gyarados hard, which is a plus. Consider Taunt over Substitute to beat things like Skarmory who you cant really hurt until you have 2/3 DDs under your belt, and who will simply Whirlwind you away. Finally change Gyarados' EV spread to 156 HP / 108 Atk / 100 Def / 144 Spe. The reasoning for this is on the analysis page, should you be interested!

I think that should be all for now! If you are having more problems, or have any questions about the tutoring programme, or team building in general, feel free to contact me and I will be happy to help out :D Best of luck to you my friend!

 

[Solidus]

Out of Forry's two current roles, which are Spinner and SR'er, Starmie is already doing the Spinner role, and Azelf would be a better replacement for Forry if you're wanting to set up SR. Or you could do what Amre suggested and use Bronzong, but if you're wanting to set up quickly, lead with Standard Azelf:

Azelf @ Focus Sash
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 4 Atk/252 SpA/252 Spe
Naive nature (+Spe, -SpD)
- Stealth Rock
- Psychic
- Explosion
- Fire Blast

I'm agreeing with Goldfan on replacing Taunt with Substitute on Gyarados, and yeah, Stone Edge is the better choice if you're wanting to hurt Zapdos. Amre and Goldfan already gave you the Bulky Gyara EV spread, which is what I was going to suggest also, so use it. Heatran would be better over Houndoom offensively, although it may be slower. Use this Heatran set:


Heatran @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 4 HP/252 SpA/252 Spe
Naive nature (+Spe, -SpD)
- Fire Blast
- Earth Power
- Hidden Power Grass
- Explosion

This does everything the Houndoom set does, but better. Hidden Power Grass for Swampert, who looks like a big trouble to your team. Grass Knot on Starmie isn't a good idea, even though it counters Swampert. Like Goldfan said, use Thunderbolt instead.

Well, that was a really quick rate, so I probably missed a lot of things, but most of the things I was going to suggest was already suggested by Goldfan. Anyways, good luck with your team. =D

 

[Mach]

Okay, thanks to everyone who took the time to look at this. I'll now go through and address everyone individually.


Amre92:

I would use Bronzong, but I feel like Forretress makes a better wall, and that's what I find myself using it for a lot of the time. It's also why I rarely use Explosion.

I don't really like *standard* sets as I normally make my own. What works for everyone else doesn't usually work for me. I've been giving thought to Taunt, though, and I do like it, but I like Substitute for being able to scout attacks to see what's coming. Taunt just forces them to attack, Substitute takes a hit for me so I can survive a T-bolt. I may use Taunt for phasers, though.

The reason that I use Staraptor over Flygon is that Staraptor has more raw power, and it has a priority. Granted, it seems like everything in the metagame resists Quick Attack sometimes, but it's priority nonetheless. Staraptor's also got 3 120 BP attacks to choose from, 2 of which are STAB. Again, Staraptor is normally fairly early in the game, so a Flygon using Outrage would mess me up.

I'll try the EV spread with Starmie, but I don't know on Thunderbolt. I would have to sacrifice recovery, STAB, or the ability to take down Swampert. And frankly, Swampert scares me more than Gyarados most of the time. I see Swampert more, regardless of what statistics say, so I'll go with what I see.

That seems like an odd spread on Blissey, it's SpDef reaches 260-something without EV's at all, doesn't it? so I'd rather max out HP to make me able to take some weak Physical moves, than be 2HKO'd by them, and take even less pittance from the special side.

Houndoom kind've is pure special attacker, just minus Nasty Plot. I thought about using Pursuit, but I figured I'd have to re-allocate EV's in order to make that work, and I'm scrambling for power enough as is.

diamondfan1910: See above.

Goldfan: Salamence over Staraptor is a maybe. I'll have to play around with it somewhat to see if I like CBMence. Stone Edge on Gyara is a good thought, too. Gyara's the newest member of my team (added in last week) so I haven't done a lot with him, yet. But the thing I like about this Gyara is that I don't use standard sets, so I'm faster than people expect me to be.

Everything else you mentioned, I responded to in Amre92's response, so I don't want to retype it.


Solidus: I don't like Suicide Azelf leads, or Scarftran. Read through the above for answers on your other comments.


And to everyone, sorry if I sounded rude, I just don't like to blindly use standard sets unless I come to that conclusion myself, which I have. I think that with so many gimmicks out there, that element of suprise is my best bet sometimes, so I go off the beaten path.

 

[blasphemy1]

Well I really don't understand why he would want a Salamence over a Flygon. First of all, Flygon has excellent resistances, most importantly, fire, electric, rock, and ground. These help him switch into and act as a "check" for Zapdos, Heatran, and Tyranitar(provided its choiced onto Stone Edge).

Not only is this true, but Flygon has a STAB Earthquake to deter powerful steels that usually stop CB Salamence, namely CB Scizor, Metagross, and Heatran. The very thought of these pokemon is going to deter you from using Outrage, while Flygon can freely Earthquake, and if any ground immunities switchin, they are likely taking 25% from Stealth Rock.

Flygon also has access to U-Turn, allowing him to OHKO Celebi, where Salamence comes short, and then becomes paralyzed. U-Turn allows Flygon to scout for other counters, such as Cresselia, allowing you to send in your Houndoom and wreak havoc.

Finally, Flygon has resistance to Stealth Rock, and immunity to both sandstorm and Thunder Wave. These give him plenty of opportunities to switchin and do some damage, where Salamence will have to take 25%, atleast, and possibly more because of the lack of useful resistances (outside of fighting and water).

I agree, lead Bronzong would fit well on this team, even more so if you replace Staraptor with Flygon, as they resist each others weaknesses nicely, and can lure in each others counters.

 

[Mach]

Okay, I'll take that into consideration. The only problem I have with Mence is the residual damage thing you mentioned. I can take the whole "Flygon has better resistances" thing, since Mence is stronger and faster.