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Discussion in 'Dragonspiral Tower' started by leingodf8, Nov 1, 2010.

  1. leingodf8


    Oct 1, 2010
    Name: Kangaskhan
    Type: Normal
    Ablities: Early Bird: Pokemon will wake up in half the time.
    Scrappy: A ghost-type foe can be hit by normal and fighting attacks.
    Inner Focus: This pokemon will not flinch. (dream world)
    HP: 105
    Att: 95
    Def: 80
    SpA: 40
    SpD: 80
    Spe: 90
    Level Up Moves
    1. Comet Punch
    1. Leer
    7. Fake OUt
    10. Tail Whip
    13. Bite
    19. Double Hit
    22. Rage
    25. Mega Punch
    31. Little by Little
    34. Dizzy Punch
    37. Crunch
    43. Endure
    46. Outrage
    49. Sucker Punch
    55. Reversal
    TM05 Roar
    TM06 Toxic
    TM07 Hail
    TM10 Hidden Power
    TM11 Sunny Day
    TM13 Ice Beam
    TM14 Blizzard
    TM15 Hyper Beam
    TM17 Protect
    TM18 Rain Dance
    TM20 Safeguard
    TM21 Frustration
    TM22 Solarbeam
    TM24 Thunderbolt
    TM25 Thunder
    TM26 Earthquake
    TM27 Return
    TM28 Dig
    TM30 Shadow Ball
    TM31 Brick Break
    TM32 Double Team 
    TM35 Flame Thrower
    TM37 Sandstorm
    TM38 Fire Blast
    TM39 Rock Tomb
    TM40 Aerial Ace
    TM42 Facade
    TM44 Rest
    TM46 Attract
    TM48 Sing A Round
    TM52 Focus Blast
    TM56 Fling
    TM59 Incinerate
    TM65 Shadow Claw
    TM67 Vengeance
    TM68 Giga Impact
    TM78 Level Ground
    TM80 Cheer Up
    TM87 Swagger
    TM90 Substitute
    TM94 Rock Smash
    HM01 Cut
    HM03 Surf
    HM04 Strength
    Egg Moves
    Focus Energy
    Crush Claw
    Hammer Arm
    Focus Punch
    Trump Card
    Overhead Throw
    Well here she is, the Mongolian kangaroo is back for another round in the ring. Only now she's found that her average stats and lack of a great movepool are hurting her standings even more. Yes its a grim new world for Kanga, while some of her compatriots got new and improved abilities... she got inner focus, which while possibly ok on a lead set, isn't very effective. She still suffers from having an extensive special movepool, that extends on for pages, but can't abuse it for crap with that 40 SpA. Still, Kanga did get a few unique selling points, and while it most likely will not upgrade her status at all, it still gives her a bit of a niche in the lower tiers.

    Wall of Sorts
    Kangaskhan @ Leftovers
    252 HP / 200 Def / 56 Att

    Overhead Throw
    Toxic / Rest / Sucker punch

    Kanga is one of the few pokemon with access to the interesting move overhead throw, which lets her be a somewhat decent phaser. Her main selling points for this are her decent bulk, and her ability scrappy. She is one of 2 pokemon who can abuse a scrappy overhead throw (the other being the considerably less bulky exploud). The plan is simple, set up a sub, and toss opponents around, and hopefully you'll have a couple layers of entry hazards kicking around to make her job that much easier. The last slot is filler, stall heal or a somewhat ok priority move... The elemental punches, focus punch, and wish are all illegal with overhead throw unfortunately. This set is hampered however, by the fact that plenty of other pokemon got the equally useful move dragon tail, which isn't nullified by anything. But still, she gets the tools to do it right. Another option it has, which it had last gen as well, is to just throw roar on their instead. This lets it run wish or focus punch, but leaves it vulnerable to taunters.

    Don't be sad, Cheer Up
    Kangashkan @ Life Orb
    252 Att, 252 Spe, 4 HP

    Cheer Up
    Return / Double Edge
    Fire Punch / Sucker Punch

    So ya, kanga got a somewhat ok stat up move this gen. Now it can use its decent bulk, speed, and attack, to try to maybe sweep. Scrappy is still probably the best option, as it lets you hit ghosts and retain the elemental punches. So you got your stab, and your coverage options. One may be tempted to use fire blast, as with a neutral nature and no investment at +1, you can 2HKO 252/0 skarmory most of the time, and usually OHKO 252/0 scizor... but really its still pathetic damage even then. Scizor is still OHKO'd by fire punch after a boost anyways. 40 SpA, just don't cut it.

    Lead on Momma
    Kangaskhan @ Leftovers / Life Orb / Focus Sash
    252 Att, 252 Spe, 4 HP
    Jolly / Hasty
    Inner Focus / Scrappy

    Fake Out
    Return / Counter
    Sucker Punch / Endeavor
    Earthquake / Sucker Punch

    Kanga was a decent enough lead back in the lower tiers of gen 4, and inner focus helps somewhat to beat fake out leads that don't expect it. I kind of merged 2 sets into one here, so for the first one it could just be an all out attacking lead to try to get some damage done, the other is a more situational lead, that trys to destroy one opponent with counter + sash + fake out, and then cripple another hopefully with endeavor. Both sets aren't great, but I was just trying to point out a possible use for inner focus.

    So that's about it for the godzilla like mother. It looks to be yet another pokemon that will never see the light of day aside from novelty or if there is a potential NU tier. Like most cool pokemon, it'll live on in our hearts, but not on our teams.
  2. NTT


    Apr 4, 2010
    I'm pretty sure Wish and Overhead Throw is an illegal combination on Kangaskhan, since one is an egg move and the other is an event move. Also, Dragon Tail does not force a switch if the Pokemon is behind a sub, just as the secondary effects of Flamethrower, Ice Beam etc cannot bypass substitutes. Given Dragon Tail's negative priority, Kangaskhan should have no problem resetting its sub before it can be PHazed out.
  3. leingodf8


    Oct 1, 2010
    LoL.. doi that was kinda stupid on my part, I just went oooo wish fun fun. Thats been changed

    And the point i was making is not that dragon tail will phaze her out per say... but more that there is a lot more competition in the phasing strategy, as walls like blastoise, meganium, and nidoqueen can phase in a similar fashion, with arguably better movepools / defensive stats to pull it off. Also, i believe it will force a switch if it breaks the sub (not 100% sure) although im pretty sure most dragon tails wont be breaking Kanga's sub anytime soon
  4. Don Honchkrorleone

    Don Honchkrorleone

    Aug 8, 2010
    Illegal with Focus Punch too.

    Quite disappointed with Kangaskhan, as she only won Overhead Throw, with is illegal with Wish and the Elemental Punches.
  5. leingodf8


    Oct 1, 2010
    Nah, if ya notice, she got Focus punch as an egg move this gen.
  6. CanadiEntei


    Oct 1, 2010
    Kangaskhan got Sing from purify in Pokemon XD. Which sounds better than it is...
  7. Ubermensch


    May 26, 2010
    Here's a good support set for the lower tiers:

    252 HP/252 Def/4 Atk
    Early Bird
  8. Darkamber8828


    Dec 28, 2009
    Kanga faces competition in Exploud, who has Cheer Up, only 4 less base points of attack, and a viable special movepool and stat.

    Kanga has more bulk and Wish. It should be using that.
  9. CanadiEntei


    Oct 1, 2010
    Would it want a Special set or mixed if plans are to use a Kangaskhan in Wonder Room?
  10. monkymeet


    Jun 22, 2008
    Wonderoom only switches the defenses, if I recall correctly.

    Could there be a speed phasing set? Something like Rest/SleepTalk/Roar/OverheadThrow?

    Early Bird is nice for a set with Rest, but with so many hard hitters this gen, I think it will only work in the lower tiers.
  11. KevlarX290


    Dec 23, 2006
    And who can possibly pass both?
  12. breh

    breh 強いだね

    Feb 6, 2010


    Have you ever honestly used Exploud? The only thing that it has over Kanga is decent SpA; even with this, I've always found Exploud to be a weakling more or less; 92 base attacking stats aren't that great and combine with its poor speed to cause a big problem: which choice item to attack. With Specs/Band, Exploud is slow. And I mean really slow. With Scarf, it's just got underwhelmind power.

    Really sucks that it didn't get encourage; hell it was probably one of the best candidates for it in general besides Nidoking...

    Anyway, what Kanga should be focusing on is perfect two-move coverage, combined with the sheer power of Double Edge. A Band or LO set is certainly viable with Scrappy, which allows it to hit every pokemon for neutral damage with Double Edge and Drain Punch. In fact, Drain Punch is a major boon to Kanga, giving it a way to recover its health while attacking with a moderately strong move that rounds out coverage. Add EQ and Sucker Punch and you've got a powerful pokemon.

    Again, although this isn't particularly innovative, Early Bird Rest also works quite well. I recall running something like Double Edge / EQ / Sucker Punch on my pre-Heracross UU team; it worked well there.

    Honestly there's not much that Kanga can do this gen that's different from the last. It's had Roar since 3rd gen IIRC (and what idiot taunts a Kangashkan? That's just asking for Double Edge in the face) and Cheer Up is really a lackluster setup move in general. Inner Focus is (while incredibly ironic) more or less useless to Kangashkan in OU, but may have use in UU as an... anti-anti lead? lol

    Disable may deserve mention when used as a wall.

    Gen 4 Poliwrath. Irrelevant though. herp derp nvm
  13. KevlarX290


    Dec 23, 2006
    Poliwrath isn't compatible with Kangaskhan.
  14. leingodf8


    Oct 1, 2010
    Sigh, point taken, dunno what I was thinking. Yet another thing to strip from kanga's potential.
  15. Molk

    Molk Godlike Usmash
    is a Tutoris a member of the Site Staffis a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Live Chat Contributor Alumnus
    RU Co-Leader

    Jul 27, 2011
    what about a subpuncher?
    kangaskahan W/leftovers/lifeorb scrappy
    evs 212 hp 252atck 44spe
    focus punch
    sucker punch/drain punch/work up
    return/double edge
    evs allow kangaskhan to make 101 subs have max power and outspeed some slower pokemon Stab return is more powerful than focus punch just to note. this set allows kangaskhan to combine subsucker and subpunch together to make a potent combo. you can run drain punch or work up over sucker punch if you dont think you need priority.

    or an attacker?
    kangaskhan W/life orb
    evs:4hp 252atck 252spe
    double edge
    drain punch
    sucker punch/work up
    this set is just the gen 4 attacker set with drain punch over hammer arm, double-edge and drain punch have good synergy and together get perfect coverage. earthquake is to hit steels that take neutral damage from drain punch work up is to boost stats while sucker punch is to get the jump on faster pokemon.

    overall i think kangaskhan is definatly viable this gen it can take a hit and hit back a set utilizing counter could also work and i will post one later if i can.
  16. tehy

    tehy Banned deucer.

    Aug 16, 2010
    I'd run double edge over return with life orb, or lefties with return, and obviously scrappy, but that's an awesome set.

    Also, what about a sub/work up/focus punch/return set? That way, if they switch out, you could get a work up and a sub.
  17. Molk

    Molk Godlike Usmash
    is a Tutoris a member of the Site Staffis a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Live Chat Contributor Alumnus
    RU Co-Leader

    Jul 27, 2011
    good ideas but i think sucker punch is still a good follow-up/revenge kill attack
  18. Forsety


    Oct 31, 2006
    Its a crying shame really Overhead Throw + Knock Off is illegal together.
  19. Molk

    Molk Godlike Usmash
    is a Tutoris a member of the Site Staffis a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Live Chat Contributor Alumnus
    RU Co-Leader

    Jul 27, 2011
    Also double edge and drain punch have good synergy together ,having perfect coverage due to scrappy while drain punch heals off double-edge/lifeorb recoil.
  20. kniteowl


    Aug 12, 2010
    How about a RU set?

    name: Sub Disable
    move 1: Substitute
    move 2: Disable
    move 3: Chip Away / Frustration\Return
    move 4: (Filler) Drain Punch / Roar / Toxic
    item: leftovers
    ability: Scrappy
    nature: Jolly
    evs: 212 HP / 120 Att / 176 Spe

    The set works a lot like gengar's set in OU, although Kangaskhan doesn't have as many immunities as Gengar, it only has one weakness (fighting) and in RU there aren't many fighting types, heck I don't think there are any fighting types that out speed Kangaskhan in the tier, except maybe Speed Boost Combusken.

    Pretty easy to use really, set up a substitute as your opponent attacks you with a fighting move then disable it, it's unlikely they'll carry more then one more fighting move, then proceed to either attack or use another support move like Roar or Toxic.

    The Nature and EVs allow you to outspeed positive base 80 pokemon, mainly Gallade.

    Disable works through substitute if your worried about pokemon that you substitute + focus punch like Golurk.

    if you op for drain punch, it gives Kangaskhan perfect coverage combined with scrappy allowing you to hit ghost, it also has the nice secondary effect of recovering your HP allowing to set up more substitutes.

    Kangaskhan can set up 101 HP substitutes blocking pokemon like clefable using seismic toss.
  21. Molk

    Molk Godlike Usmash
    is a Tutoris a member of the Site Staffis a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Live Chat Contributor Alumnus
    RU Co-Leader

    Jul 27, 2011
    Why not go for subpunch while your at it? otherwise amazing set ,Deserves credit:toast:.
  22. shinyskarmory


    Jul 12, 2011
    ^^I agree, a friend of mine who only likes 1st Gen pokemon was using a subpunch Kangaskhan to great effect. I believe he ran this set:

    Kangaskhan @ Life Orb/Leftovers
    Nature: Adamant (+Atk, -SpA)
    Ability: Scrappy
    EVs: 252 Atk/252 Spe/6 HP
    >Focus Punch
    >Chip Away
    >Drain Punch

    This set is a great set that works pretty much the same as other subpunchers: Switch in, use Substitute on the switch, and then Focus Punch away. This set has a lot of surprise factor and packs some serious punch.
  23. min min

    min min

    Jun 26, 2010
    Chip Away has rather limited usefulness, since it doesn't do much damage in general unless the opponent is Curse Umbreon or something of that sort. Even then, it still can't do as much.

    EDIT: 998 posts oh gosh
  24. Molk

    Molk Godlike Usmash
    is a Tutoris a member of the Site Staffis a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Live Chat Contributor Alumnus
    RU Co-Leader

    Jul 27, 2011

    212 hp evs gives it 101 subs so seismic toss takes two turns to break a sub, just some advice.
  25. Imaginary Numbers

    Imaginary Numbers

    Aug 23, 2011
    Out of all Early Bird pokemkon Khan pulls the rest combo off best. Most life, highest defense, and second highest special defense (Ledian being first... Fail). On a baton pass stall team, a passed ingrain and a focus sash can lead to a very strong wall. And Khan has Reversal....

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