1. Welcome to Smogon! Check out the Smogon Starters Hangout for everything you need to know about starting out in the community. Don't forget to introduce yourself in the Introduction and Hangout Thread, too!
  2. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.

Magnezone (OU Choice Specs)

Discussion in 'Uploaded Analyses' started by Lord of Bays, Dec 7, 2011.

  1. Lord of Bays

    Lord of Bays

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2010
    Messages:
    1,238
    [​IMG]

    ‘Ey. ‘EY! Rotom-W! Fuck you.

    [SET]
    name: OU Choice Specs
    move 1: Volt Switch
    move 2: Hidden Power Fire
    move 3: Thunderbolt
    move 4: Flash Cannon
    item: Choice Specs
    nature: Modest
    evs: 148 HP / 252 SpA / 108 Spe

    [Set Comments]
    <p>Meet the closest thing to a special Choice Band Scizor there is. Volt Switch is the crux of this set, like U-Turn is for Choice Band Scizor, for its scouting ability as well as its raw power. What this set boasts over others is the immediate power offered by Choice Specs. Most Magnezone are Timid to get the jump on Adamant Scizor; however, using a Modest nature makes for an incredibly powerful special attacker, OHKOing standard Ferrothorn 100% of the time outside of rain, and almost always 2HKOing in rain. Other Magnezone struggle to damage the steel durian and even risk being stalled out with Leech Seed and Protect if they lack Substitute.</p>

    <p>Thunderbolt and Flash Cannon are almost afterthoughts. The former is extremely powerful and will make short work of almost anything that doesn’t resist it, but you’ll be mostly using Volt Switch and Hidden Power Fire. Flash Cannon is a moderately powerful STAB move that hits most of the Ground-types that block Volt Switch and Thunderbolt. 252 EVs are placed into Special Attack, as Magnezone needs all the power it can get, and 108 Speed EVs are used to outrun most variants of Skarmory, netting the 2HKO with virtually anything but Flash Cannon if Sturdy hasn’t been broken. The rest go into HP for extra bulk.</p>

    [Additional Comments]
    <p>An alternate EV spread of 200 HP / 252 SpA / 56 Spe is usable, outrunning 8 Speed EV Scizor, as well as almost always surviving two turns of Choice Band Dragonite’s Outrage. In the same vein, a Timid nature and max Speed can be used, but you lose out on a significant amount of power; most importantly, Magnezone can't achieve the ever-important Ferrothorn KOs with a Timid nature. If you have a better answer to Ferrothorn than this set, then you can run Hidden Power Grass, Ice, or Ground instead of Fire. However, as the near-guaranteed removal of Ferrothorn is one of this set’s main draws, Fire is still the best option.</p>

    <p>If this Magnezone is used on a rain team, Thunder becomes the preferred option over Thunderbolt thanks to higher Base Power, higher paralysis chance, and perfect accuracy. In fact, Magnezone’s Thunder boasts similar power to Specs Latios’ Draco Meteor, 2HKOing specially defensive Jirachi and Heatran, two steels that Magnezone typically has trouble with. While the 2HKO on Heatran is nice, staying or switching in is not recommended, as Heatran 2HKOs with Fire Blast in the rain and always OHKOs with Earth Power.</p>
  2. Omicron

    Omicron
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2010
    Messages:
    3,042
    This set looks decent. I know that Magnezone's main niche is in trapping and killing Steels, but perhaps a mention of Analytic in the AC, as it'll often be going last.
  3. AccidentalGreed

    AccidentalGreed "Smogon friends" is an oxymoron.
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Contributor to Smogon
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2009
    Messages:
    2,684
    [​IMG]

    Seeing as this Magnezone is the most immediately dangerous out of all its sets, I don't really have any complaints, except give mention to a speedier nature/spread. The usual Timid/Modest nature with maximized Speed works fairly well, and Magnezone only needs a significant amount (but not maximized!) of EVs invested in Special Attack.
  4. Lord of Bays

    Lord of Bays

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2010
    Messages:
    1,238
    Updated. I did a few damage calcs, and I'll run more and add them to the skeleton, but I've got a busy week, followed by finals next week. Once the semester is over I'll really dig into this.
  5. Bartman101

    Bartman101 Banned deucer.

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2010
    Messages:
    1,058
    Most steel type users don't even bothered attempting to switch out of MZone, automatically assuming it has Magnet Pull. Therefore Analytic could be very useful indeed.
  6. Seth Vilo

    Seth Vilo

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2009
    Messages:
    685
    That's in the lower rankings, bart. If you know what you're doing against Zone, you ALWAYS check for Magnet Pull, so while a mention might be appropriate, no more than half a sentence is needed at all since Magnet Pull is really Magnezone's selling point.
  7. AccidentalGreed

    AccidentalGreed "Smogon friends" is an oxymoron.
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Contributor to Smogon
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2009
    Messages:
    2,684
    In Pokemon Showdown, your log will always indicate whether your Steel-type can escape from battle (mainly Magnet Pull users) or not. An opponent being shown that his Steel-type can escape is just asking for trouble. Just say no to other abilities.
  8. Lord of Bays

    Lord of Bays

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2010
    Messages:
    1,238
    I was thinking the same thing, but this is my first analysis and I didn't want to shoot down suggestions just because I didn't like them.
  9. Delta 2777

    Delta 2777 Machampion
    is a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis the Smogon Tour Season 10 Champion

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2009
    Messages:
    1,241
    Run 108 Speed EVs on Magnezone. This allows you to hit Skarmory before it sets up another layer of spikes, and more importantly, ensures you outrun 99% of Scizor, Vaporeon, and some Jellicent since a lot of them will run more than 8 Spe EVs.

    Mention Rotom-H as a counter even though its uncommon.

    If you make the above changes then its QC Approved (1/3)
  10. Lord of Bays

    Lord of Bays

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2010
    Messages:
    1,238
    Done and done.
  11. wilson46

    wilson46
    is a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2010
    Messages:
    709
    QC APPROVED (2/3)
  12. Bloo

    Bloo
    is a Tutoris a Tournament Directoris a member of the Site Staffis an official Team Rateris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis an Administratoris Smogon Frontier's Pike Queenis a Past WCoP Winnerdefeated the Smogon Frontier
    Head TD

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2009
    Messages:
    1,833
    Approved. I've used this before - it's pretty good!

    Feel free to get started on the write-up.
  13. Lord of Bays

    Lord of Bays

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2010
    Messages:
    1,238
    The write-up is up. I realize putting counters in the set is redundant, but I wanted to emphasize just how dangerous they are for Choice Specs Magnezone.
  14. Lord of Bays

    Lord of Bays

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2010
    Messages:
    1,238
    Oh god. Be gentle. It's my first time, fufufufufufufufufu.
  15. Terrador

    Terrador

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2009
    Messages:
    3,079
    Le Cheque (open)
    Additions/caps in blue
    Deletions/uncaps in red
    Comments in green

    [SET]
    name: OU Choice Specs
    move 1: Volt Switch
    move 2: Hidden Power Fire
    move 3: Thunderbolt
    move 4: Flash Cannon
    item: Choice Specs
    nature: Modest
    evs: 148 HP / 252 SpA / 108 Spe

    [Set Comments]
    <p>Meet the closest analogy thing to a special Choice Band Scizor there is. Volt Switch is the crux of this set, like it U-turn is for Choice Band Scizor, for its scouting ability as well as hitting like a big steel truck its raw power. What this set boasts over others is the immediate power offered by Choice Specs. Most Magnezones are Timid to get the jump on Adamant Scizor; however,. using a Modest nature makes for an incredibly powerful special attacker, OHKOing standard Ferrothorn 100% of the time outside of rain, and almost always 2HKOing in rain. Other Magnezones struggle to do the same feat damage the steel durian, and even risk being stalled out with Leech Seed and Protect if they lack Substitute.</p>

    <p>Thunderbolt and Flash Cannon are almost afterthoughts. Thunderbolt is enormously powerful and will make short work of almost anything that doesn’t resist it or is a special wall doesn't resist it, but you’ll be mostly using Volt Switch and Hidden Power Fire. Flash Cannon is a moderately powerful STAB move that hits most of the Ground-types that block Volt Switch and Thunderbolt.</p>

    <p>252 Special Attack EVs and a Modest nature are used for maximum power, which this Magnezone needs, as being Choice-locked and slow is incredibly risky. 108 Speed EVs outruns most common variants of Skarmory, netting the 2HKO (with what? Thunderbolt, Volt Switch, HP Fire, D. All of the Above?) if Sturdy hasn’t been broken. The rest go into HP for extra bulk.</p>

    <p>What this set makes in power it lacks in safety While this set offers great power, it is incredibly risky. Using anything but Flash Cannon as Dugtrio switches in results in losing Magnezone, as Dugtrio is immune to Thunderbolt and Volt Switch and will never be OHKO’d by Hidden Power Fire if it is at full health. Anything with Volt Absorb, Lightning Rod, or Motor Drive are is also a threats, blocking Volt Switch while immediately forcing Magnezone out and getting a free turn to boot. Finally, as you’ll be running Hidden Power Fire almost exclusively, Water/Ground-types also Gastrodon, Quasire, and Swampert completely wall this set.</p>

    [Additional Comments]
    <p>An alternate EV spread of 200 HP / 252 SpA / 56 Spe is usable, outrunning 2 Speed Scizor What? Are you referring to 8 Spe EV Scizor there?, as well as almost always surviving 2 turns of Choice Band Dragonite’s Outrage. In the same vein, a Timid nature and max Speed can be used, but you lose out on a significant amount of power; most importantly, Magnezone can't achieve the ever-important Ferrothorn KOs with a Timid nature, as well as those magical KOs on Ferrothorn, one of the main draws of this set.</p>

    <p>If this Magnezone is used on a Rain team, Thunder becomes the preferred option over Thunderbolt thanks to perfect accuracy. It also becomes a more attractive attack in general, boasting tremendous power as well as a 30% chance to paralyze , thanks to its high Base Power, its higher paralysis chance, and perfect accuracy. If you have a better answer to Ferrothorn than this set, then you can run HP Hidden Power Grass or Ice instead of Fire. However Again, as the near-guaranteed removal of Ferrothorn is one of this set’s main draws, Fire is still by far the best option.</p>
  16. Snorlaxe

    Snorlaxe 2 kawaii 4 u
    is a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2009
    Messages:
    2,230
    stampin dat shit

    [​IMG]
  17. Lord of Bays

    Lord of Bays

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2010
    Messages:
    1,238
    Does that alternate Speed, outspeeding 8 Speed EVs on Adamant Scizor qualify as speed creep? To be perfectly honest, I'm not even sure what that is.
  18. Cherub Agent

    Cherub Agent how lonely is the night without the howl of the wolf
    is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2009
    Messages:
    3,162
    Perhaps bring down the number of paragraphs? I'm pretty sure you could squeeze them together. Otherwise this looks good. Mabye mention in AC that Thunder is an option if Magnezone is used on a rain team?
  19. Lord of Bays

    Lord of Bays

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2010
    Messages:
    1,238
    I did mention Thunder (first sentence of the second paragraph of AC), and I'll start trimming the fat.

    Edit: Also, I'm going to ax that paragraph about counters. I'll do some shuffling to keep that remark about how risky this set is, but the rest of that is just fluff. Maybe if I were doing the initial analysis, but I'm not.
  20. Engineer Pikachu

    Engineer Pikachu Good morning, you bastards!
    is a Contributor to Smogon

    Joined:
    May 23, 2009
    Messages:
    1,592
    placeholder for amateur check

    add
    remove
    other (comments)
    Show Hide

    [SET]
    name: OU Choice Specs
    move 1: Volt Switch
    move 2: Hidden Power Fire
    move 3: Thunderbolt
    move 4: Flash Cannon
    item: Choice Specs
    nature: Modest
    evs: 148 HP / 252 SpA / 108 Spe

    [Set Comments]
    <p>Meet the closest thing to a special Choice Band Scizor there is. Volt Switch is the crux of this set, like U-Turn is for Choice Band Scizor, for its scouting ability as well as its raw power. What this set boasts over others is the immediate power offered by Choice Specs. Most Magnezones are Timid to get the jump on Adamant Scizor; however, using a Modest nature makes for an incredibly powerful special attacker, OHKOing standard Ferrothorn 100% of the time outside of rain, and almost always 2HKOing in rain. Other Magnezones struggle to damage the steel durian,(comma) and even risk being stalled out with Leech Seed and Protect if they lack Substitute.</p>

    <p>Thunderbolt and Flash Cannon are almost afterthoughts. Thunderbolt is enormously powerful and will make short work of almost anything that doesn’t resist it, but you’ll be mostly using Volt Switch and Hidden Power Fire. Flash Cannon is a moderately powerful STAB move that hits most of the Ground-types that block Volt Switch and Thunderbolt. This 252 EVs are placed into Special Attack, as Magnezone needs all the Special Attack it can afford power it can get (this phrase seemed kind of strange compared with the others);(semicolon),(comma) and 108 Speed EVs are used to outrun most variants of Skarmory, netting the 2HKO with virtually anything but Flash Cannon if Sturdy hasn’t been broken. The rest go into HP for extra bulk.</p>

    [Additional Comments]
    <p>An alternate EV spread of 200 HP / 252 SpA / 56 Spe is usable, outrunning 8 Speed EV Scizor, as well as almost always surviving 2 two turns of Choice Band Dragonite’s Outrage. In the same vein, a Timid nature and max Speed can be used, but you lose out on a significant amount of power; most importantly, Magnezone can't achieve the ever-important Ferrothorn KOs with a Timid nature.</p>

    <p>If this Magnezone is used on a Rain rain team, Thunder becomes the preferred option over Thunderbolt thanks to its high Base Power, its higher paralysis chance, and perfect accuracy. If you have a better answer to Ferrothorn than this set, then you can run Hidden Power Grass or Ice instead of Fire. However, as the near-guaranteed removal of Ferrothorn is one of this set’s main draws, Fire is still the best option.</p>

    alright done
  21. Lemonade.

    Lemonade. fluffy bird
    is a Smogon Social Media Contributoris an Artist Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2010
    Messages:
    2,030
    <p>Thunderbolt and Flash Cannon are almost afterthoughts. Thunderbolt The former is enormously extremely powerful and will make short work of almost anything that doesn’t resist it, but you’ll be mostly using Volt Switch and Hidden Power Fire.

    enormously isn't the right word IMO, but nice check Engineer

    [​IMG] 2/2
  22. blarajan

    blarajan holla ladies #£14000 #bling #sparkle #bitchesonmydick
    is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2010
    Messages:
    3,768
    I think it is absolutely IMPERATIVE that you expand Magnezone's use on a rain team.

    Specs Thunder 2HKOes Jirachi.
  23. Lord of Bays

    Lord of Bays

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2010
    Messages:
    1,238
    Will implement that check and will look into expanding that point on Thunder. Now that I think about it, it's more consistent than and nearly as powerful as Specs Latios Draco Meteor. Hm.
  24. Lord of Bays

    Lord of Bays

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2010
    Messages:
    1,238
    I'm not going to expand the mention of Thunder unless QC or another senior member calls for it. Adding it but keeping the set as concise as it already is would require a complete rewrite.
  25. Pocket

    Pocket Apo, the astronaut's best friend >:3
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2004
    Messages:
    8,564
    I agree with blarajan that you should elaborate on Thunder. At least mention that the power buff is significant enough to 2HKO two additional specially-Defensive Steel Types (other than Ferrothorn), Jirachi & Heatran, in the rain. Since it can even trap and kill Heatran, mention that it can run more Spe EVs to be faster than Calm Heatran (140-152 Spe EVs). For the same reason, I would also mention HP Ground as one of the alternative Hidden Power type it can use, since it does 90-106% to specially-defensive Heatran, further bolstering Magnezone's role as a Steel Killer (compared to HP Grass / HP Ice).

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)