1. New to the forums? Check out our Mentorship Program!
    Our mentors will answer your questions and help you become a part of the community!
  2. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.

Medallion (the Old and New)

Discussion in 'BW OU Teams' started by RoyalBlue, Aug 16, 2013.

  1. RoyalBlue

    RoyalBlue

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2013
    Messages:
    95
    Welcome to my RMT everyone! I haven't made a team that I seemed Smogon worthy enough so I held off. But finally, I've created a team based around Calm Mind Cresselia (yup) that I've been having a lot of success with. I personally don't have the patience to ladder so I didn't do so, but my ACRE got to 1700 and I've been winning around 80% percent of my battles with this team and successfully sweeping with Cresselia around 4 times in an hour of battling. My record was 7! The team also uses a couple of old sets and strategy (pseudo-stall) that I've been using, as well as new ones that I've recently created/discovered.

    Anyways, history lesson! During the big DDoS attack that shut down the Smogon site (please bear with us, really funny...), lots of people on Showdown were saying how uncreative people were getting. I personally think that is not true at all, there are plenty of teams that were quite unique that I've seen on the RMTs and on the ladder (Collide was a super cool one). I wanted to create a team that used unique sets and reintroduced a dying strategy, stall (it usually doesn't last more than 45 turns, but it annoys people which is what stall does ;)). I hope you enjoy the team and maybe drop me a rate or something.

    Okay, another quick, little history lesson. The team started with me thinking "Calm Mind and Bulk Up are terrible moves". It was not until I got swept by Toxicroak and Jirachi did I realize how threatening these moves were. I really wanted to try it out for myself so I set off to find THE best Calm Mind/Bulk Up user I could find which ended up being Cresselia! The team then developed into a hazards stalling strategy in order to weaken teams for Cresselia or Virizion to sweep late game. Here it is!

    I I ally fixed the pictures an added a few more touches!


    Team Building:
    [​IMG]
    After getting swept miserably by Toxicroak/Jirachi, I set off to find an invincible Calm Mind user. Cresselia popped into mind because of how bulky it was already. With extra defensive boosts? Come at me!
    [​IMG][​IMG]
    I knew right away that sweeping with Cresselia, right off the bat wouldn't be possible. I needed something to pressure opponents early on and do damage to everything at the same time. Ferrothorn came into mind.
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    In order to keep hazards on the field, I added a spin blocker in Jellicent. I personally felt it had the best match ups against all of the usually spinners in the meta.
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    I thought realistically, how often will get both SR and Spikes in the same game with Ferrothorn? Pretty much never once you get up on the ladder. So I added Heatran as a Stealth Rocks setter of choice and a phaser to get rid of nasty boosts while wracking up hazards damage.
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    I noticed a glaring weakness to Breloom which is terrible. I decided to add Dragonite to the mix to ease up my pseudo Fighting weakness and to provide yet another phaser.
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    Finally, with all the support done, I decided its time to add something to get rid of a terrible enemy of the team. Tyranitar. Virizion did a great job due to its fairly low profile in the OU meta and could clean up late game with its decent speed.​



    In Depth:

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    "In case you didn't know, I never die."
    Caryss (Cresselia) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 252 HP/ 252 Def/ 4 SAtk
    Bold Nature
    - Calm Mind
    - Substitute
    - Psyshock
    - Moonlight

    She was already invincible, but this set uses Cresselias great physical bulk and further boosts her special bulk. Calm Mind fills up her subpar special attack and boosts her Special defense. Substitute is key in this set, blocking statuses that will completely cripple Cresselia and blocks Critical Hits, something that happens much too often. Psyshock is a very good STAB and helps me get around Blissey that hope to take special attacks and helps me get past Terrakions Special Defense boost in Sand. Moonlight is to heal up and let's me continually set up. This is very handy if the opponent is able to consistently 2HKO my Substitutes and I need more CMs to sweep. If you haven't tried this set before, try it. Seriously. Cresselia is probably my main win condition, which basically means I need to play it incredibly carefully and can't allow it to get statused. Because of this, I usually only play Cresselia when its absolutely necessary and I always need a Sub up to avoid a fast status inducer coming in or crits.


    [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]


    [​IMG]

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    "Best Grass type? Me."
    Harvestar (Ferrothorn) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Iron Barbs
    EVs: 252 HP/ 252 Def/ 4 Atk
    Impish Nature
    - Spikes
    - Leech Seed
    - Protect
    - Gyro Ball

    Ferrothorn was a great addition alongside Cresselia. It lures in Fighting type attacks and discourages opponents from using Toxic as I switch in Cress. It's steel typing gives me a resistance against the abundant Dragons and its Grass typing gives me a resistance against Electric and Water (aka Rain teams). Spikes are extremely important on this team, getting the extra 12-25% is a chunk that Virizion and Cresselia doesn't need to worry about. Leech Seed is for Ferrothorn's recovery, and to pressure opponents into switching out. Protect is good for getting extra Leech Seed and Leftovers recovery as well as scouting what moves they are going for. Gyro Ball is to prevent Pokemon from setting up on Ferrothorn and to nail Espeons on the switch to render them almost useless.


    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]


    [​IMG]
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    "Spit balls are so old school. Taste this!!!"
    Jellousy (Jellicent) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Water Absorb
    EVs: 252 HP/ 252 SDef/ 4 SAtk
    Calm Nature
    - Scald
    - Giga Drain
    - Toxic
    - Recover
    In my opinion, the best Spin Blocker in the whole tier. Jellicent can handle pretty much handle all spinners, Forretress, Donphan, Tentacruel (kind of), Starmie (T-Bolt does 30-40 percent usually) and the very rare Hitmontop. Along with Ferrothorn and Heatran, Jellicent creates very solid wall cores that can handle almost all attacking duos. Scald is very good STAB and the burn chance is nice. Giga Drain gives me a response against Starmie and Gastrodon, which can be problematic in certain scenarios. I used to have Will-O-Wisp on Jellicent, but the accuracy was so ridiculous I changed it to Toxic. Recover is necessary on Jellicent so I can heal up and continue to wall/block. The only problem I've been seeing is Starmies on rain teams. Many of them run Thunder, which does a solid 50%+ and I've been seeing it way too often.


    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]


    [​IMG]
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    "It's getting hot in here. Do you think it's me?"
    Hephaestus (Heatran) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Flash Fire
    EVs: 244 HP/ 252 SDef/ 12 Spe
    Calm Nature
    - Lava Plume
    - Earth Power
    - Stealth Rock
    - Roar

    Heatran rounds up the Jellicent-Ferrothorn-Heatran core and serves as my teams Stealth Rocks setter. Surprisingly, Heatran has pretty good type synergy with Dragonite. Lava Plume is to hit steel types that could wall my team such as Skarmory, Ferrothorn, Forretress and Magnezone. Earth Power has decent coverage with Lava Plume and allows me to get rid of opposing Heatran. The 12 Speed EVs are put in to ensure that I outspeed standard Special Defensive Heatran. Roar is a great phasing move and helps me wrack up more hazards damage, which this team loves to do. I'm debating if I should keep Air Balloon or replace it with Leftovers. Lately, Heatran has been my main lead so the Ground immunity really helped out and allowed me to get around set up Dragons waste a turn, or more if they only have Outrage as main STAB, breaking my balloon. This gives me an opportunity to Roar/kill them off. The recovery is missed however.


    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]


    [​IMG]
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    "I retired from my dancing career."
    Diggles (Dragonite) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Multiscale
    EVs: 252 HP/ 252 Def/ 4 Atk
    Impish Nature
    - Roost
    - Substitute
    - Dragon Tail
    - Thunder Wave
    Probably the most annoying, yet the most effective set that Dragonite can run. This set abuses Dragonite's Mulitscale and his incredible move pool really well. Roost, Substitute and Multiscale is an incredible combination. If you have a Substitute while at full HP, any attacks that hit the Sub is halved, even if the Sub was hit multiple times. This pretty much gives it free, unlimited Focus Sashes! Dragonite's main job is to abuse this strategy and para shuffle the opponents team to slow them down. The full paralysis is an added bonus, but the speed drop is my main reason for running it. With Dragon Tail, Spikes and Stealth Rocks, the opposition is worn down incredibly fast. All this residual damage allows Cresselia to set up late game or Virizion to clean up and not fearing Scarfers or the opponent living with a minimal amount of HP.

    [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]


    [​IMG]
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    "I can't justify getting walled."
    Everdeen (Virizion) @ Expert Belt
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 252 Atk/ 252 Spe/ 4 SAtk
    Naive Nature
    - Close Combat
    - Giga Drain
    - X-Scissor
    - Hidden Power Ice

    Mixed Virizion is by far my favorite wall breaker in OU. It's job on the team was really important, to lure in/get rid of Dark types or any thing else that can be annoying to the team. Close Combat is a very good Fighting STAB to have in my arsenal, and effectively gets rid Dark types such as T-Tar and Hydreigon, thinking that I'm locked into another move. Giga Drain is a good Grass STAB, allowing me to recover health and trick opponents into thinking I'm special, therefore assuming that I don't run CC but the inaccurate Focus Blast instead. X-Scissor allows me to easily get rid of Celebi or other Psychic types that think they can eat up CCs. Hidden Power Ice is amazing on Virizion. It helps me get rid of Dragons like Salamence, Garchomp and Dragonite that would resist/won't take a lot if damage from the rest of my set. It also lets me get around Gliscor and Landorus-T who can be annoying with SubProtect and EdgeQuake spam respectively.
    Threats:
    [​IMG]
    Custap leads are quite annoying but very easy to handle. If the opponent has a defensive set, it becomes a very big problem. It can easily phase my team around to wrack up hazards damage with little to no consequence. Only Heatran can threaten it out but even then, the rest of their team probably has a Heatran counter.

    [​IMG]
    Banded sets can nail my team with Pursuit, Bullet Punch, Aerial Ace, U-Turns and Superpowers. My best match up against him is Heatran or Dragonite, but both get badly hurt by appropriate moves.

    [​IMG]
    This one isn't exactly a threat, but more of a pain. Heatran and Virizion can kill it but everything else doesn't like to take it on.

    [​IMG]
    Although I haven't ran into it yet, is imagine it can be a big threat. Crunch, Drain Punch and Ice Punch hits my whole entire team for super effective damage and its bulkiness allows it to live a couple of hits before going down

    [​IMG]
    It's EQ's are really strong so nothing likes taking hits and Icicle Spear can run straight through Dragonites scale. Cresselia is my best option (it can somewhat wall it) though I won't like revealing my trump card super early.

    [​IMG]
    Its able to Pursuit trap 2/6 (Its summer so I don't need to do lowest terms!!!) of my team and potentially get rid of one of my counters to one of their Pokemon. Virizion can lure it in if I'm "locked" into Giga Drain and they come in to kill me with Fire Blast.

    ---

    That's pretty much the team! I hope you liked it and drop a rate below if you can! Thanks B)
    Oh and importable is below if you want to try out the team!

    Importable:
    Code:
    Caryss (Cresselia) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 252 HP/ 252 Def/ 4 SAtk
    Bold Nature
    - Calm Mind
    - Substitute
    - Psyshock
    - Moonlight
    Harvestar (Ferrothorn) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Iron Barbs
    EVs: 244 HP/ 252 Def/ 12 Atk
    Impish Nature
    - Spikes
    - Leech Seed
    - Protect
    - Gyro Ball
    
    Jellousy (Jellicent) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Water Absorb
    EVs: 252 HP/ 252 SDef/ 4 SAtk
    Calm Nature
    - Scald
    - Giga Drain
    - Toxic
    - Recover
    
    Hephaestus (Heatran) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Flash Fire
    EVs: 244 HP/ 252 SDef/ 12 Spe
    Calm Nature
    - Lava Plume
    - Earth Power
    - Stealth Rock
    - Roar
    
    Diggles (Dragonite) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Multiscale
    EVs: 252 HP/ 252 Def/ 4 Atk
    Impish Nature
    - Roost
    - Substitute
    - Dragon Tail
    - Thunder Wave
    
    Everdeen (Virizion) @ Expert Belt
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 252 Atk/ 252 Spe/ 4 SAtk
    Naive Nature
    - Close Combat
    - Giga Drain
    - X-Scissor
    - Hidden Power Ice
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2013
    jg1198 and scotti like this.
  2. vyomov

    vyomov

    Joined:
    Apr 7, 2013
    Messages:
    868
    A thought: if you are running Mixed Virizion, I'd recommend you invest 4 EVs into SpA instead of HP.
    Also, running a Jolly nature on a mixed set is a bad idea: I'd recommend you change that to Naive.
  3. RoyalBlue

    RoyalBlue

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2013
    Messages:
    95
    Thank you, I completely forgot. I'll change it immediately.
  4. Halcyon.

    Halcyon. Come on, she's not burned; she's just gone.
    is a Contributor to Smogon

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2012
    Messages:
    1,504
    Hey RoyalBlue. Cresselia is one of my favorite Pokémon in OU at the moment, as I'm running a sun team that uses it well.

    I feel like hazards are the key to this team's success. You have a bunch of walls that should be good at shuffling your opponent around, and a wall breaker in Virizion that can remove the walls like Landorus-T and Gliscor that could prevent a physical sweep from Dragonite. I just don't see the point in running a Parashuffler Dragonite set for this team, specifically. None of your Pokémon really appreciate the paralysis support, since none of them are trying to sweep. Instead, I think you should use a Dragon Dance Dragonite over your parashuffler one. The way this team would work now is much more clearly defined with this change. The defensive core of this team would shuffle around the opponent until they were weakened, and things like Gliscor and Landorus-T that could stop your sweep are easily lured in and KO'd by Virizion as soon as you show them Close Combat. Beyond that, the only thing that Dragonite fears is faster threats. Scarfers that can KO him even at +1. That can be easily solved by simply changing your Cresselia spread.

    I don't normally support Cresselia on non-sun teams, but I know you built this team around her so I won't ask you to change it. I also know that you love your Calm Mind Cresselia, but I think that switching Cresselia to a defensive set would benefit your team more. The defensive Cresselia set can provide the paralysis support that your team now lacks (it didn't need it before because you had no sweeper, now that you do, Dragonite would appreciate it again). It can also wall things like Terrakion, Salamence, Garchomp, Latios, Keldeo, Gyarados, and more to hell and back, and paralyze them too, meaning Dragonite can KO them more easily later in the match. It still proves to be a great defensive wall, but it can further aide your team and a Dragonite sweep by using Thunder Wave on faster opponents.

    Anyway, hope I was able to help! Let me know how those suggestions work out!

    Sets (open)

    [​IMG]
    Dragonite @ Lum Berry
    Trait: Multiscale
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 SDef
    Adamant Nature
    - Outrage
    - Earthquake
    - ExtremeSpeed
    - Dragon Dance
    [​IMG]
    Cresselia (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spd
    Bold Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Psychic
    - Ice Beam
    - Moonlight
    - Thunder Wave


    Jaiho likes this.
  5. RoyalBlue

    RoyalBlue

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2013
    Messages:
    95
    Thank you Halycon, I really appreciate your rate. I'll just very quickly explain my reasoning for the set choices I made. Dragonite's Paralysis support is needed in order to stop fast Pokémon that carry Toxic from using it on Cresselia and is also needed for wallbreaking Virizion so it doesn't get outsped by scarfers or base 108+. I definitely (I still don't know how to spell it) see your point and will try out your suggestions.

    I have thought about making Cresselia Defensive (despite how well CM worked) and to make my team more offensive but I haven't really put it into action.

    Again, thank you or being a great rater and I'll be sure to test these changes out. I'm going to my cousins this week (who isn't a competitive battler) so ill show him the ropes. 2 birds one stone?
  6. RoyalBlue

    RoyalBlue

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2013
    Messages:
    95
    Okay, I'm back after my testing sessions!

    I've tried out what Halycon suggested and I have to admit, it worked out really well. Changes will be made, and Halycon, thank you again! This thread is pretty much done but ill change it anyways.
  7. Jaiho

    Jaiho haha xD !
    is a Tiering Contributor

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2013
    Messages:
    382
    Your team is kinda wrecked by sub-disable gengar, particularly when backed with rain. It outspeeds your whole team, and once it disables the appropriate move, it can nicely KO ferro, jellicent, and heatran while staying behind a sub. cress and dragonite, as mono-attackers, can literally do nothing to gengar, even though cress could set up in gengar's face, and dragonite could continuously roost. virizion only breaks the sub ~50% of the time with HP ice, and loses to gengar 1v1. to best handle this, i would suggest either DD Dragonite or possibly Scarf MoxieMence or ScarfChomp to replace the parashuffler dragonite. if paralysis support is particularly important, you could always put it on ferrothorn.

    Other than that, great team!
    The DragonKnight likes this.
  8. Ada

    Ada
    is a Tiering Contributor

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2011
    Messages:
    181
    This reminds me of Snunch's team, with NP Mew over Cresselia and Forretress over Ferrothorn. I recommend checking it out if you haven't already. Anyways, onto the rate:

    So, the first thing I noticed was Giga Drain on Jellicent. I'm guessing you haven't heard of Energy Ball Jellicent? Check http://www.smogon.com/bw/articles/bw_pokemon_dictionary (the last entry) in order to get a better understanding of how it works.

    I'd recommend changing to a stallbreaking set of Will-O-Wisp / Shadow Ball / Taunt / Recover. This does the same as what you're trying to accomplish but works better against stall teams. Shadow Ball helps beat Starmie as usual, while Taunt messes up Gastrodon, since it prevents it from using Recover or Toxic. Also, 75% chance of burn > 30% from Scald, unless you absolutely need Toxic for something idk.

    Also, rain teams with Keldeo are a big threat since it can take out everything once Jellicent is removed (say it gets Toxic'd by Politoed). You need the extra insurance; Virizion isn't the best since it can't take Secrets Swords very well with an offensive spread. Sand teams also seem troublesome, since they can wear you down pretty easily with VoltTurn + residual damage.

    For the changes, I'd probably use CM Latias instead of Cresselia. The reason why CM Cresselia isn't as effective is because rain and sand are pretty common and reduces the healing from Moonlight to 25%, not enough for survivability. Also, mono-psychic is a pretty bad attacking type and makes it easier for Tyranitar to mess with Cresselia. It also becomes set up fodder for a bunch of threatening sweepers, especially with no investment in attack.

    I hope my changes helped and good luck with the team!
  9. RoyalBlue

    RoyalBlue

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2013
    Messages:
    95
    Thanks Jaiho and Ada for your help! I honestly wasn't expecting more rates but hey, I'll take it!

    @Jaiho, I have been considering this when Halycon suggested it and Its been working out pretty good. However, this pretty much changes the whole purpose of the team so I won't be showing the change.

    @Ada, whoops! Didn't mean to copy their team. Like I said, Giga Drain allows me to deal with Starmie and Gastrodon while still giving me some recovery. The set you gave was actually one I tried before but it didn't really work out too great. WoW has terrible accuracy for me and its a move that is really inconsistent. Although it helps against physical attackers, I prefer the damage stack Toxic has. But I will try the set out. I have tried Latias and it doesn't have the surprise factor and the Dragon typing doesn't make it as effective. I will reconsider and do some more testing.

    Thank both so much!

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)