Milwaukee should fare quite well in the draft next year, that's for sure. But... are they going to be able to convince any of the big-name free agents next offseason to play there? Money is a great motivator, but it's not everything (see: Ron Artest taking pay cut to play in LA). It will either work great for them, with a top 3 draft pick and some big name veteran coming in next season, or it will fail miserably, they'll miss the top three picks (the lottery has a funny way of punishing teams who tank like that), and they'll be in the shed for several more seasons.
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NBA Offseason 2009
- Thread starter darkie
- Start date
Potential D-Lee to Blazers for 5 years 50 mill?
Also: Who would you choose for a 1999-2009 Dream Team completely based on star power? 15 players max.
PG:Kidd/CP3/ Billups
SG:Kobe/Wade/T-Mac
SF:Bron/Melo/Vince C
PF:Duncan/KG/CWebb
C:Shaq/Dwight H/Amare Stoudamire
Odd picks you say? Let me explain:
At the PG, id think Kidd is the best PG of these 10 years, his vision and defense are extremely good. Id take a 2003 Kidd here. Billups is clutch, no doubt, his 05' version will do well. Honestly, Chis Paul is the best PG out there at the moment, and he has plenty of room to grow.
For SG: I dont need to explain Kobe, at all. I would take the 09' Kobe, hes a leader now. D-Wade has the shot when it counts, and his 09' season is MVP caliber, so im going with that. T-Mac when healthy is probably the most dangerous scorer able to rival Kobe, the 2003 T-mac is teh winner.
SF: There is absolutely no way to go wrong with LBJ and Carmelo, not much need to elaborate there. 2009 is what ill take for both of them. I had to consider Pierce here, as hes proved to be one of the best in the biz at scoring from anywhere, destroying defenses and leading a team. His 02 year would be the best.
PF: Honestly, its impossible to go wrong with these three, both arguably the best at their position. 03' Timmy, 04' KG. Chris Webber is a great passing big that can get it done from all parts of the floor, thats why hes here. 2001 Year for him.
C: Shaq is the most dominant center the game has seen since Wilt, in terms of using power. The team assembled here is decidedly weak in some areas, which is why the scariest Shaq (2000) is the choice. There arent many great centers, but Dwight is the C of the future, 2009 is the choice. Aaand I just couldnt leave STAT off of the list.
Also: Who would you choose for a 1999-2009 Dream Team completely based on star power? 15 players max.
PG:Kidd/CP3/ Billups
SG:Kobe/Wade/T-Mac
SF:Bron/Melo/Vince C
PF:Duncan/KG/CWebb
C:Shaq/Dwight H/Amare Stoudamire
Odd picks you say? Let me explain:
At the PG, id think Kidd is the best PG of these 10 years, his vision and defense are extremely good. Id take a 2003 Kidd here. Billups is clutch, no doubt, his 05' version will do well. Honestly, Chis Paul is the best PG out there at the moment, and he has plenty of room to grow.
For SG: I dont need to explain Kobe, at all. I would take the 09' Kobe, hes a leader now. D-Wade has the shot when it counts, and his 09' season is MVP caliber, so im going with that. T-Mac when healthy is probably the most dangerous scorer able to rival Kobe, the 2003 T-mac is teh winner.
SF: There is absolutely no way to go wrong with LBJ and Carmelo, not much need to elaborate there. 2009 is what ill take for both of them. I had to consider Pierce here, as hes proved to be one of the best in the biz at scoring from anywhere, destroying defenses and leading a team. His 02 year would be the best.
PF: Honestly, its impossible to go wrong with these three, both arguably the best at their position. 03' Timmy, 04' KG. Chris Webber is a great passing big that can get it done from all parts of the floor, thats why hes here. 2001 Year for him.
C: Shaq is the most dominant center the game has seen since Wilt, in terms of using power. The team assembled here is decidedly weak in some areas, which is why the scariest Shaq (2000) is the choice. There arent many great centers, but Dwight is the C of the future, 2009 is the choice. Aaand I just couldnt leave STAT off of the list.
I know he seems pretty washed up now, but I think id put Iverson over Wade then Wade over T-Mac. If you look at it, T-Mac has really done nothing in this league. He still has not gotten out of the first round of the playoffs, and he isnt getting any younger. Iverson has won an MVP before, and led a team of virtual nobodies to a championship. His main component was his speed, which made up for his lack of height/size. You gotta look at the 76ers days when he was taking apart teams, not the Nuggets/Pistons days.
For pg, id keep Kidd at number one. I think you gotta slide Billups in at #2, and move CP3 down to 3. Its still an All Decade Team, and I gotta put Billups over CP3 just based on what Billups has been able to accomplish in the past 5-10 seasons. If CP3 makes a championship, id probably put him back at #2.
SF Looks pretty decent, except I might put Pierce at #2 and move Melo to 3. VC was good in those Toronto days, but I dont think he was better then Pierce all those years. Pierce might of had the Big 3, but VC couldnt go anywhere with Kidd/Jefferson.
PF is also pretty good. I dont think anybody really remembers the days when C Webb was killing on the Kings before he blew out his knee against the Mavs in the playoffs.
At center, I really dont think you can put Dwight/Amare in there just yet. Amare isnt even a natural center. It just makes more sense to put him at center when their 7 second shot clock offense needs a big man that can run. Plus, Dwight has really only been good for a few years. He was nothing the first 2-3 years he was in the league. On top of that, he still has no post moves. He just is much stronger/athletic then other centers to the point that he can dominate, but that little hook shot he calls a post move is how Gasol/Bynum could contain him. All they had to do was face guard him and make him try to take that hook shot. I think you almost gotta put Yao in here just based on centers. I'd probably have to go Shaq/Yao/Dwight or Amare
My list would be:
PG: Kidd/Nash/Billups - Jason Kidd has a winning pedigree, and is just a terrific all-around point guard. I think a two-time MVP (Nash) deserves a place on this list, as well, despite not winning a championship. (And let's face it... he was raped over and over again by the officials. No other superstar has to fight that hard to get fouls). Billups doesn't particularly impress me, but championships speak loud, so he edges CP3 for me. For now. I think CP3 is a better player, but he still has room to grow.
SG: Kobe/Wade/Manu - Kobe and D-Wade are obvious. I honestly had a hard time thinking of a third great shooting guard. T-Mac is the eternal "What if...?" guy, as in "What if T-Mac didn't get hurt and miss half of every single season?" I can't put that on this list, although I think he could have (should have?) been an all-time great. I thought about a few other guys, but to me, Manu Ginobili has been the most consistent, reliable, and overlooked shooting guard for the last ten years. He has helped his team win championships, and has a sixth man ever been so important to his team? Ever? I can't think of one. He's just a quiet game changer; although I dislike him a bit myself, I can't deny his resumé.
SF: LeBron/Pierce/Melo - The King. Duh. Pierce has been quietly busting his ass all decade trying to keep the Celtics in the running, and is really a great clutch player. He's a leader, and has a championship under his belt. Definitely one of the best players this decade. For the third spot, I really wanted to put Grant Hill, but I already decided I wouldn't put any "What if...?" guys in there. Just remember that he was the best at one point, and is still grossly underrated as a player in this league. I don't really think of VC as a true small forward, so I elected not to put him here. Ray Allen crossed my mind, but again, not sure if I can call him a small forward, even though he has played the position a lot. As far as true small forwards go, I had to stick with Carmelo. He's a great scorer, and if he ever "grows up," he'll be untouchable. Still has a lot of untapped upside.
PF: Duncan/Amar'e/Nowitzki - Hard not to put Ol' Reliable at #1 here. Duncan is one of the best of all time (if not THE best at the 4). Had a hard time with the other three spots, because KG/Amar'e/Dirk are all so good. It's also tricky because they don't always play the 4, because of their teams' needs. I elected to put Amar'e here because he is just a dominant player when he turns it on (and it's usually turned on whenever he's on the court and getting touches). Watch the Suns with and without Stoudemire in the lineup, and you get a feel for just how good he is. I put Dirk above KG for two reasons; 1) KG has only been on one good team the last ten years (last year is an anomaly due to his late injury). Granted, he played in basketball Hell, but Dallas wasn't any good for a few of their winning seasons either, aside from Dirk. 2) Dirk is just a unique player. KG is a great defender and post scorer, but Dirk can defend and basically play positions 1-5. He has ridiculous range, great mobility, and is just a truly different kind of PF. KG is just a little too much like every other PF to shove Nowitzki off my list. (Honorable mention to Rasheed Wallace, as well).
C: Shaq/Yao/Mutombo - Shaq is the most dominant player of his generation. Yao is still a freak among freaks, and changes games by his sheer presence. He could be truly exceptional if he weren't injured so often. For the third spot... it's hard to really pick someone out. There haven't been a lot of great true centers aside from Shaq and Yao. So, I decided to say Deke. The next ten years will be all D12, but he just hasn't shown me enough yet. Still extremely raw on the offensive end, and should have taken some lessons from Gortat on how to take charges and not foul so much on the other side. As for Mt. Mutombo, there's a reason he has a nickname like that. He's one of the most memorable, genuine players out there, and has been a presence in the paint his entire career. It's a relatively thin crop, but he stood out to me.
PG: Kidd/Nash/Billups - Jason Kidd has a winning pedigree, and is just a terrific all-around point guard. I think a two-time MVP (Nash) deserves a place on this list, as well, despite not winning a championship. (And let's face it... he was raped over and over again by the officials. No other superstar has to fight that hard to get fouls). Billups doesn't particularly impress me, but championships speak loud, so he edges CP3 for me. For now. I think CP3 is a better player, but he still has room to grow.
SG: Kobe/Wade/Manu - Kobe and D-Wade are obvious. I honestly had a hard time thinking of a third great shooting guard. T-Mac is the eternal "What if...?" guy, as in "What if T-Mac didn't get hurt and miss half of every single season?" I can't put that on this list, although I think he could have (should have?) been an all-time great. I thought about a few other guys, but to me, Manu Ginobili has been the most consistent, reliable, and overlooked shooting guard for the last ten years. He has helped his team win championships, and has a sixth man ever been so important to his team? Ever? I can't think of one. He's just a quiet game changer; although I dislike him a bit myself, I can't deny his resumé.
SF: LeBron/Pierce/Melo - The King. Duh. Pierce has been quietly busting his ass all decade trying to keep the Celtics in the running, and is really a great clutch player. He's a leader, and has a championship under his belt. Definitely one of the best players this decade. For the third spot, I really wanted to put Grant Hill, but I already decided I wouldn't put any "What if...?" guys in there. Just remember that he was the best at one point, and is still grossly underrated as a player in this league. I don't really think of VC as a true small forward, so I elected not to put him here. Ray Allen crossed my mind, but again, not sure if I can call him a small forward, even though he has played the position a lot. As far as true small forwards go, I had to stick with Carmelo. He's a great scorer, and if he ever "grows up," he'll be untouchable. Still has a lot of untapped upside.
PF: Duncan/Amar'e/Nowitzki - Hard not to put Ol' Reliable at #1 here. Duncan is one of the best of all time (if not THE best at the 4). Had a hard time with the other three spots, because KG/Amar'e/Dirk are all so good. It's also tricky because they don't always play the 4, because of their teams' needs. I elected to put Amar'e here because he is just a dominant player when he turns it on (and it's usually turned on whenever he's on the court and getting touches). Watch the Suns with and without Stoudemire in the lineup, and you get a feel for just how good he is. I put Dirk above KG for two reasons; 1) KG has only been on one good team the last ten years (last year is an anomaly due to his late injury). Granted, he played in basketball Hell, but Dallas wasn't any good for a few of their winning seasons either, aside from Dirk. 2) Dirk is just a unique player. KG is a great defender and post scorer, but Dirk can defend and basically play positions 1-5. He has ridiculous range, great mobility, and is just a truly different kind of PF. KG is just a little too much like every other PF to shove Nowitzki off my list. (Honorable mention to Rasheed Wallace, as well).
C: Shaq/Yao/Mutombo - Shaq is the most dominant player of his generation. Yao is still a freak among freaks, and changes games by his sheer presence. He could be truly exceptional if he weren't injured so often. For the third spot... it's hard to really pick someone out. There haven't been a lot of great true centers aside from Shaq and Yao. So, I decided to say Deke. The next ten years will be all D12, but he just hasn't shown me enough yet. Still extremely raw on the offensive end, and should have taken some lessons from Gortat on how to take charges and not foul so much on the other side. As for Mt. Mutombo, there's a reason he has a nickname like that. He's one of the most memorable, genuine players out there, and has been a presence in the paint his entire career. It's a relatively thin crop, but he stood out to me.
No KG at the PF? Nowitzki is a T-Mac in the form of a PF, that just happened to get past the 1st round before. The only other problem I might have is with Manu. I mean what top 3 SG comes off the bench? Plus with the depth at that spot, I think their has to be at least 2-3 better options at #3
Well, that's why they call it discussion. We each have our opinions on the subject. Manu could be a starter for most teams... that's just not the role for which SA uses him. And honestly, if I were to build a team using players from the last decade, I would take Dirk before I took KG. That's the bottom line for me.
Turkoglu to the Raps means no Marion coming back. Sure, he's a year older, but he brings that ruggedness that the Raptors needed. Unless Hedo, Bargnani and Bosh can average 50 points between the three of them, hopefully more, our team has no chance of keeping anything up. Our second unit is horrible, with nonames everywhere. Unless Ukic can learn to play the point FAST and Kris Humphries remember what it's like to be a big man, we will have no offense and merely have to survive while the starters rest. If Anthony Parker comes back, he can bring some explosions too because he's a solid 2. He'll average a good 12 points a game, but he'll have to step it up on that second unit. Being the only good shooter in the bunch will definitely help his opportunities.
Rebounding, already a problem, is even more of a problem now that the Matrix can't alleviate any of the slack on Bosh and Bargnani's shoulders'. Turkoglu is an offensive star, but can't get it done on defense or on the boards. If Hedo wanted Toronto so much, wouldn't it have been better to give him a little less so we could cash in on someone at least average with the remaining money?
Rebounding, already a problem, is even more of a problem now that the Matrix can't alleviate any of the slack on Bosh and Bargnani's shoulders'. Turkoglu is an offensive star, but can't get it done on defense or on the boards. If Hedo wanted Toronto so much, wouldn't it have been better to give him a little less so we could cash in on someone at least average with the remaining money?
He left the Magic so he could get paid. If it wasnt about the money, dont you think he wouldve stayed in Orlando?
personally i am glad that hedo has gone north of the border because now he is irrelevant. the raptors are going nowhere and fast. it also makes orlando weaker imo, can't say i've ever been a huge vince carter fan. if cleveland doesn't win the east the nba is rigged.
also, who likes the sixers as a sleeper pick in the east? they can play with the best of them day in day out (see: orlando/detroit series' the last two years) and elton should be up and running this year. i think that they can easily snag the fourth and possibly the third seed in the east.
also, my new favorite movie? jruemanji
also, who likes the sixers as a sleeper pick in the east? they can play with the best of them day in day out (see: orlando/detroit series' the last two years) and elton should be up and running this year. i think that they can easily snag the fourth and possibly the third seed in the east.
also, my new favorite movie? jruemanji
Not denying his basketball skill Brawley. The fact that not only did he leave a contender for money (frowned upon in it's own way), but his fucking huge ego means that he is willing to screw over his new team just for money (Marion is way more important to the Raps then Hedo so don't argue that). He could have gone to Portland, still made good money play for a playoff team and not screw them over but he went and fucked up the Raps just to upgrade his mansion a little more. He is a joke.
It wasn't all about the money by the way. The city has a diverse population, including a sizable Turkish community, which is believed to have played a substantial role in Turkoglu's decision. Some players actually do care about family and Turk just chose Toronto because of that.
Not with his wife breathing down his neck to a) make as much money as possible, and b) live in a city with an international, namely Turkish, population. Plus, how do we know Toronto didn't just OFFER him that money? We have no reason to believe that he told them "everything you have, or else." We have plenty of reason to believe, however, that Toronto said to Hedo: "Please, please, please come play for us. We'll give you everything!" They do have notoriously poor management skills, let's not forget.
lol nash jrich marion amare okay i'll buy nba league pass
A Nash, JRich, Clark/Barnes (dunno if he staying though) Marion, Stoudemire starting 5 would be awesome. They'd win a few more games probably, but if nothing else I'd definitely enjoy watching them.
Too bad the Suns are hellbent into going into selfdestruct mode and rebuilding, god Steve Kerr is a dreadful GM.
Too bad the Suns are hellbent into going into selfdestruct mode and rebuilding, god Steve Kerr is a dreadful GM.
I think Steve Kerr is worse than Kevin McHale... he just hasn't had enough time to demonstrate it, yet. It's sad.
Hedo could have gone to the Blazers or Magic, and instantly made them even better then they already were. Both are weak at the 3, unless the Magic move Rashard back to his original position at the 3 and find somebody to play the 4. He could have easily won a ring if he went back to the Magic, but he chose the money instead. Maybe it had something to do with living in a Turkish community, or maybe that was just a nice little add on to the money they were throwing at him. Hes really good on the offensive side of the ball, but he isnt very good on defense. Now they can either turn marion into a 6th man, or trade him to strengthen the bench a little bit