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New/Creative movesets — Little Cup edition!

Discussion in 'BW LC' started by (makeup), Mar 15, 2011.

  1. Valafar123

    Valafar123

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    That's because Murkrow outclasses everything. -.-

    I'll eat my shoe in euphoria the day it gets banned. (I'll take pics too).
  2. Usatoday

    Usatoday

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    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    Vullaby @ [​IMG]
    Trait: Overcoat
    Level: 5
    EVs: 116 HP / 156 Def / 196 Spd
    Jolly Nature
    - Brave Bird
    - U-turn / Knock Off
    - Taunt
    - Roost
    Now we all know how scary scraggy can be if allowed to set up however I believe I've come up with a set to check scraggy if you can get it in at the right time. Now we all know Vullaby is a pokemon only ever used to counter fighting types and in most cases is outclassed by Murkrow due to the sheer blistering speed and mass attack of murkrow, so when looking at itself Vullaby may doubt itself having a mediocre base 55 attack stat it is a miracle it's used at all. However Vullaby is invariably bulkier than Murkrow with the advent of eviolite. The speed evs are a little weird to comprehend but those when combined with a jolly nature allow Vullaby to hit 16 speed which is enough to outspeed jolly nature Scraggy and you can then taunt it to prevent it from dragon dancing or bulking up if the case may be. Taunt also allows Vullaby to act as the Crobat of little cup. Or in other words a wall breaker in which Vullaby can troll Hippopotas, Bulky Mienfoo, Lileep lacking ancient power, and Cottonnee all of which are extremely annoying to face in the little cup metagame. Brave Bird allows for Vullaby to hurt not only scraggy but just about anything with a base 180 power after stab. Next off we have roost of course to help Vullaby stall out pokemon and to heal. Vullaby can also hurt utilize just about any move for the last slot I have found that two moves fit the best the first one was U-Turn which I absolutely loved the ability to switch out predicting a switch after taunting a wall. U-Turn fits extremely well onto a volt turn team that is in any need of a wall or defensive pivot. Knock off however allows Vullaby to act like Mienfoo in the fact that it can get rid of the opponent eviolite on bulky pokemon that like to switch in such as Porygon or Growlithe. Overcoat should be fairly evident with the amount of hail and sand teams running around and is one more reason why Vullaby outclasses the ever common Murkrow at using this set. Here's a replay to show how the set works.
  3. Valafar123

    Valafar123

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    Magnemite @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Sturdy
    Level: 5
    Stats: 19 - 9 - 13 - 20 - 12 - 14 (21)

    EVs: 240 SAtk / 236 Spd
    IVS: 31 - 30 - 31 - 30 - 31 -31
    Modest Nature (+SpA, -Atk)

    - Volt Switch
    - Hidden Power [Grass 70]
    - Flash Cannon
    - Thunderbolt

    A slightly unorthodox set. It's not the most creative set in the world stat wise, but there are some subtle differences which make me like this set.

    It's based of the standard Choice Scarf set but also takes inspiration from a UU Raikou set I saw. It's designed to be an effective pivot, Murkrow counter and scout. Like the standard Scarf set, it outspeeds any non-scarfed Pokemon and hits extremely hard.

    I chose Sturdy over Magnet Pull so that I could scout out Heat Wave on Murkrow and very possibly OHKO it in return. It does get broken often, but it's very nice to have it there and it has come in handy. I don't have anything to hit Steel types with on this set, so Magnet Pull was pointless anyway.

    Hidden Power Grass amuses me to no end. With proper prediction, you can do a lot of damage with it. People like to try and switch in Ground-types or Chinchou on this and it generally ruins their day. This normally causes a double switch on their end allowing you to predict and switch back.

    If I recall correctly, it out-speeds Snover and OHKOs with Flash Cannon. It only takes 90% from HP Fire too iirc.

    This set is best friends with Scraggy who will prevent Steel-type switch ins by threatening to set up and sweep (especially Bronzor and Ferroseed). This set appreciates a Rapid Spinner, although one is not necessary. Tentacool would make a good core with this.

    So yeah, Magnemite is fun.
  4. (makeup)

    (makeup)
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    Other than the nature, that is basically bread-and-butter scarf Magnemite. You don't outspeed Snover actually; you need to run Timid to always outspeed scarf Snover. You should probably run Timid imo since being able to switch into Snover (once) or revenge it all the time is really useful.

    Also @vullaby set: you mention it as a Scraggy check, but you can only do 63.64% - 90.91% to standard Scraggy with Brave Bird, so it can just Dragon Dance as you come in and then Hi Jump Kick you twice and kill you :/ It's a good, standard set though! Just not a solid Scraggy check

    Also, how does running Taunt help you against Mienfoo? Unless they use the extremely rare Toxic set, it doesn't "troll Mienfoo" (and they probably wouldn't stay in anyway heh).
  5. Rowan

    Rowan not a professor
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    I use HP Grass Magnemite, and it is a pretty nice move to run. It allows it to revenge stuff like weakened Staryu and Frillish without worrying about the opponent switching in a Ground type or Chinchou. It 2HKOs standard RestTalk Chinchou as long as Stealth Rock is in play so it can act as a cool lure if you want to remove Chinchou for a Murkrow sweep or something. Not the most creative thing in the world but it's something that will quite possibly catch the opponent off-guard.
  6. TailsTheeFox

    TailsTheeFox

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    <p>Eevee @ Normal Gem Trait: Adapatibility (+Speed -SpeAttack) 220 Attack/ 220 Speed/ 64 Def -Protect -Last Resort</p>Eevee is a weird pokemon, it's STAB isn't 1.5x it's 2.0x with that wonderful ability. Last Resort has a base 140 power, and it's a Normal type move so we got that STAB boost from hell, but to make the damage output much more frightening let me say what kind of damage all of this does. 1HKO's Drilbur, brings a Bulky Porygon to 10-18% health, it's literally a wall breaker. Why Normal Gem, well, Evolite won't do much as Eevee loses the power boost and with out it she still can take that one hit from whatever outspeeds her, likewise, Oran Berry doesn't boost her health up enough to take another hit. Choice items don't work due to having to use Protect, but honestly, she's fast and strong-not a wall, but a wall breaker.<p>Sadly, she's stopped by any Ghost type's and if she's outsped by a fighting type she doesn't always survive to tell the tale.</p>
  7. Shouting

    Shouting

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    If you want Vullaby to check Scraggy, just use a Choice Scarf set. It outspeeds Scraggy after a Dragon Dance and will KO it will Brave Bird. It may not be the best scarfer in terms of power, but it's decently fast. Murkrow would probably do it better unless you really want U-turn.

    The problem with HP Grass on Magnemite is that it can't do anything against Ferroseed and Bronzor with Earthquake, pokemon that magnemite is used to take out. Since you're not using magnet pull at all, why use magnemite as a scarfer? There are a ton of faster scarfers than it. Diglett, Houndour, Earth Power Omanyte, etc. all lure in and beat Chinchou a little more reliably.

    Considering Eevee has only 16 speed, and misdreavus is on almost every team, it really struggles. Not to mention after 8 attacks you are literally useless. Lileep and Aron stop you cold too. There are so many popular LC pokemon right now that beat this set so it's not really effective as it could be. I would rather use Zigzagoon who is generally a little better.
  8. Rowan

    Rowan not a professor
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    Whilst Magnemite is often used to take out Ferroseed and Bronzor it doesn't have to be used just for this purpose. Being able to revenge many threats such as Murkrow and Staryu and having a cool move in Volt Switch coming off a 20 Sp.Atk stat is why I use scarf Magnemite. But Ground types and Chinchou often ruin this, so once you lure them in and take them out with HP Grass, Magnemite is then free to come in later and Spam Volt Switch.
    If I wanted to beat Ferro+Bronzor I would probably go for the Bulky Magnet Rise set which is more effective at beating them. Also the difference between STAB Thunderbolt and Super-Effective Hidden Power isn't that much, it's still a 3HKO on Bronzor.
    As for the set posted, I still recommend Magnet Pull despite it not having too much use if you're using HP Grass. Sturdy just gets broken too easily on a Scarfer that is constantly switching out.
  9. Valafar123

    Valafar123

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    More or less. I've never seen Magnemites with HP Grass or Sturdy though. My memory fails me then. Either way, it can live the hit and retalliate with Flash Cannon.

    It's not the most creative set in the universe; I'm not pretending it is. The subtle differences do count though. :P

    I'd rather have Modest for brute force. I have a Scarfed Misdreavus to outspeed most Scarf users.
  10. Valafar123

    Valafar123

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    Might go back to Magnet Pull. Sturdy is situational granted, but I've had no use for Magnet Pull thus far.

    Thanks for the feedback everybody.
  11. TailsTheeFox

    TailsTheeFox

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    But that's the thing, Zigzagoon isn't generally better. Under the grounds that ghost type's tend to wall normal type's fairly well and that Missy has her own counters, let me state that certain pokemon are to stop her and certain ones can't. That being said, Zigzagoon has to use Belly Drum to be better than Eevee, and even then he still can't compare to the power Eevee packs. You mention Aron, and Lileep-but have you done the actual calculations on how powerful a not very effective Normal Gem boosted Adapted STAB Last Resort does on a rock type? Aron isn't very popular, and even then, it still does a good amount of damage to the runt. Eight turns is all Eevee needs, it takes somthing out right away and continues to hurt the team before eventually dieing(as although it's speed is decent, it's nothing to gush over). But, in this regard, it does as what the set is made to do-break walls or, as you always use Protect first, scout ahead. Missy/Koffing as buddies to switch in on fighting type move. Bait.
  12. Rowan

    Rowan not a professor
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    236+ Atk Normal Gem Adaptability Eevee (Move 1) vs. 228 HP / 220+ Def Eviolite Lileep: 9-11 (34.61 - 42.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

    236+ Atk Normal Gem Adaptability Eevee (Move 1) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Aron: 7-9 (33.33 - 42.85%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

    This is with an Adamant nature and a Normal Gem. Lileep will just recover the damage and Aron will simply KO it back. It's a powerful Pokemon but there is just simply too much that can wall it. It needs a lot of support to work well and even then it is lackluster in my opinion.
  13. TailsTheeFox

    TailsTheeFox

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    Fair enough, though, it can fill a small nitch in teams and it makes the most of Eevee's rather limited abilities was what I was trying to get across-it's not entirely useless and can be used... But it's not the best. A pokemon that doesn't need to be shunned, but never in the limelight, an option. Eevee has none on her page and I understand why. :P
  14. Good_Luck!

    Good_Luck!

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    I think that Eevee set is very good but requieres tons of support: kill all the priority (Sucker Punch Murkrow, Mach Punch Timburr, Vaccuum Wave Croagunk, Aqua Jet Shell Smash Tirtouga) and defeat Sand Rushers, Scarfers and anything over the 15 Speed tier... Quite a feat, y'know. I really don't know which niche it could fulfill as it's not a revenge killer and it's not a sweeper...

    Anyway, I've been having a few matches with this guy:

    [​IMG]

    Drilbur @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Mold Breaker
    Level: 5
    EVs: 236 Atk / 36 Def / 212 Spd
    Adamant Nature
    - Earthquake
    - Rock Slide
    - X-Scissor
    - Rapid Spin/Shadow Claw

    This set combines the best of Drilbur: Speed and Power from the Sand Rush set and the fantastic ability from the Spinner set. Common checks from the Sand Rush Drilbur are neutralized by this set: Scarf Snover and Scarf Trace Porygon can't outspeed it, Bronzor and Koffing can't wall and Misdreavus won't burn it. The set is all about hitting hard and fast and only needs a Flying check as partner. You won't need Hippopotas + Lileep + Snover check as this Drilbur doesn't need Sand. It still has problems with Priority (even bigger as it has pathetic defenses) but, hey, all scarfers do :D. The moves are standard. Earthquake is the STAB you want to spam once birds are gone, Rock Slide for revenge killing Birds and Bugs and X-Scissor for Grass-types, Snover is a 100% acc OHKO so this is non-negotiable as a miss from Rock Slide will defeat the purpose of the set. Rapid Spin if you REALLY need rocks out of the way. Shadow Claw is a filler but has been useful. It hits many things for neutral damage; every scarfer should have a neutral move imo.

    So~ a fun set and a very effective one.

    Edit: A classic yet innovative Drilbur Sweep against a rather unorthodox opponent.
  15. TailsTheeFox

    TailsTheeFox

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    Ah, I've ran into that Drilbur set quite a number of times as of late-or ones similar to it-and it's a real terror. The combination of speed and power is difficult to overcome-switch into something that resists/or is immune to it's locked move is the easiest way to stop it though. Priority, in the form of Aqua Jet, is great though. He has enough bulk to resist a few moves though(unless it's a super effective one) so he's not a glass cannon completely. Certain pokemon that start with M love to switch in on a locked on Earthquake, and that's obvious trouble if you mispredict-but he can come back after a switch and use either that useful rock or ghost type move. Great set. ;D
  16. dcae

    dcae naughty list

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    Hey Tails I ran into you on the LC ladder a few days ago as Galvatron, and you were using that very same set on Eevee. It caught me offguard at first, but then I realized Missy walls it completely, so I just brought her in. That Eevee set is nice first time because it catches people offguard, but with Missy and Lileep so high in usage it is too easily walled. As such, I like the idea, but the current meta is unkind to it, it needs a lot of support to remove its counters to be very effective. Maybe in a another meta, but for now I do not think it is very viable as of now.
  17. TailsTheeFox

    TailsTheeFox

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    Agreed, I'm on a small search for a better poke but the surprise factor is what I usually need. My friend was playing a bit earlier I was able to realise what small odd niche the set fills. Destroying set uppers-it simply takes advantage of people thinking that it can't hurt it and then suddenly, their dead. Again, a small niche and in this meta it's not overly useful, but it packs a punch against quite a varity of different pokes but walled by enough bulk or a ghost. :s Question, quick, wouldn't a set involving Aipom, Pickup, Normal Gem, Fake Out, Return be possibly devasting? If I'm reading it correctly then it gets the gem back after the move, which means a boosted Fake Out and a constantly boosted Return right? :s
  18. iss

    iss happily ever after
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    Pickup only picks up items dropped or Flung by other Pokemon.
  19. apt-get

    apt-get 笑っている 今が愛おしくて ひとりじゃないと思った
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    Thanks to the guys on #littlecup for making these sets

    [​IMG]
    Mienfoo @ Eviolite
    Trait: Regenerator
    Level: 5
    EVs: 156 HP / 76 Atk / 196 Def / 76 Spd
    Impish Nature
    - Drain Punch
    - Knock Off
    - U-turn
    - Reflect

    The perfect physical attacker destroyer. Reflect, Knock Off and drain punch allows you to get a lot of damage, while you're nearly not damaged at all. Reflect + U-turn is great as well, allowing you to "pass" a reflect to a teammate. Classic defensive foo EVs, and regenerator is cool too to pass reflects or beat a timburr consistently.

    [​IMG]
    Lileep @ Eviolite
    Trait: Storm Drain
    Level: 5
    EVs: 228 HP / 144 Def / 28 SAtk / 64 SDef / 16 Spd
    Bold Nature
    - Giga Drain
    - Hidden Power [Rock]
    - Recover
    - Toxic

    Simple lileep set, except HP rock is waaaay much better since you don't get PP stalled by subroost krow and it inflicts better damage. I removed some of the defense EVs since it gives you one less point that you can't recover anyway because 30IVs. Instead, I placed them in Special Attack and Speed, allowing you to reach 9 speed to speed tie with other things, and to reach 13SpA: just enough to have a 75% chance to OHKO Snover with it, as not many people know snover doesn't OHKO it with blizzard even in hail.

    [​IMG]
    Natu @ Eviolite
    Trait: Magic Bounce
    Level: 5
    EVs: 196 HP / 76 Def / 196 SAtk / 36 Spd
    Timid Nature
    - Psychic
    - Roost
    - Heat Wave
    - U-turn

    Cool set for me. Beats every single defensive poké except Lileep and Lickitung, and hits moderately hard off its near-maximised SpA. Psychic has a 80% Chance to OHKO every foo after SR, and 2HKOes every single other fighting-type. Heat Wave is a really useful move, as it 2HKOes Bronzor and OHKOes Ferroseed, two pokémon it'll commonly switch-in and that might beat it if it only ran psychic. Roost is a classic move for healing, and u-turn allows you to get a lot of momentum. Also hard-walls grass-types not named lileep if your team has problems with foongus/shroomish.
    EVs allow you to outspeed classic defensive foo with a + nature, SpA is maximised (Didn't take modest since 17SpA is a bad SpA number, doesn't have more power than 16SpA), and leftovers EVs are placed in HP and Defense.
  20. Shouting

    Shouting

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    I'm not really sure what Reflect Minefoo is trying to accomplish really - it's not like it beats any of it's counters with it, nor does it let you check Scraggy better. If I wanted a Screener to stick around I would use Bronzor, Turtwig, or even Staryu. If you want something to get it up fast just use Abra. Your set, even with Reflect is not a great answer to Timburr really. If you come in on a bulk up you will be severely weakened, and if you want to switch out to restore HP something is doing to get hit hard or get a status, etc. Not to mention it is completely vulnerable to special attacks.

    Lileep with Hidden Power Rock is not really that creative, the toss up between it and ancient power is really just personal preference and I still see a few Hidden Power Rock ones out there still.

    That Natu does not beat Porygon, nor does it beat Vullaby, Munchlax, or even Chinchou. Personally, I think Natu needs max speed, because Life Orb Mienfoo carries Stone Edge pretty much all the time so it would be pointless to switch into a HJK just to get KO'd by a following Stone Edge. With max speed you have at least a tie with Jolly Mienfoo. Therefore while running max speed I use Feather Dance over U-turn to make up for the bulk, which shuts down Murkrow, Stunky, and Munchlax which are Natu's biggest checks. With max speed and Feather Dance you have a good shot at beating Dweeble, which your set will lose to. With max speed and Feather Dance, not much can get hazards on Natu, the only thing I can think of is Anorith because it sits at 18 speed.
  21. apt-get

    apt-get 笑っている 今が愛おしくて ひとりじゃないと思った
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    For the Mienfoo set, it's not used as a screener but as a physical attacker destroyer. I'll try to put you more in the context it was used: it's a sand team using Wynaut, so it lacks a defensive backbone and sand especially has problems with physical attackers, as they can tear through these teams if Hippo is gone. It also spreads Knock Off, and can serve as an all-around counter for a lot of threats. Reflect helps it to accomplish its role, allowing it to beat some pokémon better, and I said Timburr because it can knock off, reflect and then u-turn to murkrow or another pokémon that can't switch in boosted Timburr, but with the help of reflect it can.


    That Lileep set was merely posted because it's underrated (see the thread's title, Creative and underrated sets), it's not in Lileep's analysis and it has different EVs.

    It's true that this Natu set could use more speed EVs, as I thought bulk > speed for that set. Featherdance is better than U-turn in general, but I'm using the latter as this set is used on a volt-turn team for me to volt switch or u-turn the bird into hazard setters/defensive pokémon that are weak to it. Also, it's meant to be a counter to fully defensive pokémon and hazard setters, not bulky attackers.
  22. Shouting

    Shouting

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    If I had a Sand team, I would be much more concerned with Grass, Water and Ice types than physical attackers. Since those types are mainly special in LC, having Mienfoo with Reflect is not really doing you any good. With Wynaut and Hippo, you have a good defense against stuff like Timburr already. I still fail to see what your Mienfoo does that no other Mienfoo can do. The only benefit I can see it having on a team is that Reflect might be a good move to use if you know that your Mienfoo will die / and or it it useless against the other team so you can sacrifice it and have something come in with a free reflect. This is situational at best really.

    Vullaby and Porygon are almost always defense pokemon. They might have a niche of an offensive set, like Weak Armor Nasty Plot Vullaby, or Choice Scarf Porygon (not really that good) but most porygon and vullaby will be a defensive pokemon with defensive EVs. Chinchou's best set right now is arguably the Rest talk set, which is entirely defensive. Munchlax is a bit more offensive, but no one really uses Munchlax so they can sweep a team with it.

    Also, without max speed and feather dance you won't win against every hazard setter like you said you use Natu for. Dweeble is a popular hazard setter and that Natu will always lose to it, Eviolite Archen will beat you, even Nosepass will beat you without it. Pretty much any rock type will beat this Natu, and almost all rock types have access to Stealth Rock.
  23. (makeup)

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    Reflect is absolutely useful on Mienfoo. As somebody who has used the set extensively, I can tell you that it has helped me out many times versus physical attackers. The idea of the set is not specifically to support a sand team, but to help any team destroy physical attacks basically. Knock Off + Reflect destroys physically bulky Pokemon like Drilbur, Hippo, and opposing Mienfoo. Reflect also does well against Timburr; I don't know why you'd disagree with that.

    Since most common attackers in LC are physical attackers, Reflect's situational use is a lot more helpful than you'd think. Imo, the best and most practical use is probably predicting a switch to a physical attacker (like Murkrow), taking a hit (BB does 43.48% - 56.52% with Reflect up), and U-turning to a check.

    I definitely see why you'd question the viability of Reflect because it seems horrible on paper, but try it out and I'm sure you'll find it pretty helpful!

    P.S. here is an example of Reflect's utility; it makes fighting Hippo really easy if they don't run Toxic, and it gives opposing Drilbur no chance to set up on Mienfoo.
  24. Nebuchadnezzar

    Nebuchadnezzar

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    Charmander is absolutely right. I've seen many of his battles and even battled against him, and Reflect Mienfoo always does it's job-beating physical attackers.
  25. Icicle Fissh

    Icicle Fissh

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    [​IMG]

    Munchlax @ Eviolite
    Trait: Thick Fat
    Level: 5
    EVs: 236 Atk / 236 SDef / 36 Def
    Adamant Nature
    - Substitute
    - Focus Punch
    - Ice Punch / Seed Bomb
    - Return / Body Slam


    I've used this thing a few times, and the surprise value it carries is massive! Lileep thinks it can come in and wall Munchlax? It's a bit like SubPunch Palkia in Ubers, a check comes in, only to be whomped by the power behind a super-effective 150 BP move, namely Focus Punch. Ice Punch is nice coverage, nabbing the SE hit on a lot of big LC threats and common checks to Much. Seed Bomb is for hitting Frillish, who otherwise completely walls this set. Misdreavus can take most of what this set throws at it aswell, however 19 Atk is nothing to scoff at, so it makes for a nasty surprise and nearly always nabs a kill because of this. A variation on the set that I have considered using is a Oran Berry Recycle set, perhaps with Curse, to provide some recovery, the main pitfall of this set. Obviously it is forced out by most of the Fighting types in the tier, so carrying a check to those is handy.

    Some calcs on common checks to Munchlax:

    Show Hide


    236+ Atk Munchlax Focus Punch vs. 228 HP / 220+ Def Eviolite Lileep: 16-20 (61.53 - 76.92%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    236+ Atk Munchlax Focus Punch vs. 156 HP / 36 Def Eviolite Magnemite: 20-24 (95.23 - 114.28%) -- 56.25% chance to OHKO

    236+ Atk Munchlax Ice Punch vs. 36 HP / 20 Def Eviolite Murkrow: 14-18 (60.86 - 78.26%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    236+ Atk Munchlax Ice Punch vs. 124 HP / 156+ Def Eviolite Foongus: 10-14 (40 - 56%) -- 11.33% chance to 2HKO (Providing SR this is nice. Return does same damage)


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