Generally, I find using Magnezone to remove steels and having Latias/Salamence able to set up and sweep is really pretty effective. However, I think that when using Reflect Latias, Charm can sometimes be a better option. If Latias is out, and you expect a T-tar/Jirachi/anything that'll hit it SE on the physical side and is slower, then Charm. You'll be able to Charm again, and even CBTar has trouble with Latias if it's at -4 Atk
-
Welcome to Smogon! Take a moment to read the Introduction to Smogon for a run-down on everything Smogon, and make sure you take some time to read the global rules.
-
Congrats to the winners of the 2023 Smog Awards!
np: Latias - Don't Do the Dew! (NOTE: explanation of Skymin's fate within)
- Thread starter Jumpman16
- Start date
I've been waiting for someone to mention Charm. It seems like it would be very useful.
Charm seems like it'd help on a CM set more than on a Team Support Set. So it might be better with something like Recover.
But I'm getting into Theorymon so I should shut up. >_<
Latias is still helping out fine. A TTar's Pursuit doesn't kill if Reflect is up, let's say that. XD And TWave is very useful. Now, if only there were more Clerics, the main thing that beats my time are other TWave pokemon.
But I'm getting into Theorymon so I should shut up. >_<
Latias is still helping out fine. A TTar's Pursuit doesn't kill if Reflect is up, let's say that. XD And TWave is very useful. Now, if only there were more Clerics, the main thing that beats my time are other TWave pokemon.
On the Suspect Test ladder, the two most common leads I see are Scarf Jirachi and various Machamps (still don't really know the most common lead variant). Machamp in response to Tyranitar, and Jirachi because it functions well against Latias and makes a great revenge killer to Mence, Gyarados, Lucario, Scizor, etc with it's good type coverage. And maybe because of the RMT posted by MythTrainerInfinity? The suicide leads like Azelf and Infernape aren't seen much anymore, and the more reliable early DP leads like Bronzong and Swampert are coming back. I guess people will use the more reliable leads in a new metagame (not that it's changed much). Don't really quite get why suicide leads would die down. Latias hasn't changed offensive teams much.
Even with all the hype of Latias and it's counters centralized metagame pretty much gone, Latias is still pretty underwhelming. The hard part is finding the perfect moveset for you team, as it is always begging for another move of any kind. The cool thing is that there are A LOT of different Latias sets being used right now, which is very cool. The experimentation is cool to watch. It isn't just the Calm Minder getting eaten by the usual things.
Damn, since the game shifted so fast, I have had to change my team so many times, and it keeps failing. I made my team to take advantage of all the measures taken to stop Latias. My average rating is usually around 1450-1500 CRE, but now I just can't seem to get out of the 1200's.
Even with all the hype of Latias and it's counters centralized metagame pretty much gone, Latias is still pretty underwhelming. The hard part is finding the perfect moveset for you team, as it is always begging for another move of any kind. The cool thing is that there are A LOT of different Latias sets being used right now, which is very cool. The experimentation is cool to watch. It isn't just the Calm Minder getting eaten by the usual things.
Damn, since the game shifted so fast, I have had to change my team so many times, and it keeps failing. I made my team to take advantage of all the measures taken to stop Latias. My average rating is usually around 1450-1500 CRE, but now I just can't seem to get out of the 1200's.
Yeah Jirachi is getting to be quite a nuisance and erratic switching against it will result in eventual status from one of the elemental punches. I still don't get why people still leave their Blissey in on a 60% flinch rate Iron Head.
Well suicide leads basically mean you're going to lose a poke and if you mispredict at all with such a common lead you're down 5-6.
Jirachi also works with Latias really well. Ice resistance, potentially killing Tar, Gyarados, Scizor, and Blissey, and being able to Trick that Scarf makes it quite a good partner to Latias (and ugh excellent SR user). Not to mention if they steal the EVs from my RMT they can outrun Jolly Mamoswines :x So basically it can give huge problems to about any Latias counter (except Heatran).
I've had a lot of success with the same Jirachi in my RMT in suspect too.
Well suicide leads basically mean you're going to lose a poke and if you mispredict at all with such a common lead you're down 5-6.
Jirachi also works with Latias really well. Ice resistance, potentially killing Tar, Gyarados, Scizor, and Blissey, and being able to Trick that Scarf makes it quite a good partner to Latias (and ugh excellent SR user). Not to mention if they steal the EVs from my RMT they can outrun Jolly Mamoswines :x So basically it can give huge problems to about any Latias counter (except Heatran).
I've had a lot of success with the same Jirachi in my RMT in suspect too.
So is it possible that EITHER Latias or Latios will be placed in OU while the other is put in Ubers?
I've been using a Specs Latias and that's a hard hitter already. Latios has the sp.atk to even 2HKO Tyranitar. On paper, that seems insane, but IDK. As of right now, Latias doesn't seem too bad. I'm still leaning toward it being a pretty nice OU and the Suspect Ladder is great fun!
I've been using a Specs Latias and that's a hard hitter already. Latios has the sp.atk to even 2HKO Tyranitar. On paper, that seems insane, but IDK. As of right now, Latias doesn't seem too bad. I'm still leaning toward it being a pretty nice OU and the Suspect Ladder is great fun!
I'm starting to think Latias in OU is really, really bad. Even if "it's best answers are already in OU," that doesn't help when its best answers are pretty crappy answers.
Sure Metagross, Tyranitar, Scizor and Spiritomb can all help deal with it in different ways, but the first 3 have to go quite out of their way to be particularly good at it and the last is just not a very great pokemon. >>
Is it just me, or does having a poke who can 100% wall mix-nape seem insane.
Sure Metagross, Tyranitar, Scizor and Spiritomb can all help deal with it in different ways, but the first 3 have to go quite out of their way to be particularly good at it and the last is just not a very great pokemon. >>
Is it just me, or does having a poke who can 100% wall mix-nape seem insane.
When has this ever been grounds to consider something "really, really bad" for OU?ChouToshio said:
I'm actually having more problems with [anything else] than Latias. But then again, my own Latias is really shitty >_> Guess I should ditch her for something that can handle Salamence and friends better.
Fucking double dragon.
Fucking double dragon.
When there is a tank who can actually annoy me MORE than Vappy and Suicune, I'm going to say it's uber. >>
In my book, that's a good enough explanation.
OK, but what happened to "Latias in OU is really, really bad"? You're making it seem like preference now (which is technically fine at this point, I guess).
@Venom-- your point?
@Blamegame-- Glad you get it.
The "line" between "overpowered" and "OU" is totally underscribable anyway.
@Blamegame-- Glad you get it.
Sounds fine to me honestly
The "line" between "overpowered" and "OU" is totally underscribable anyway.
Latias has been nearly a non-factor in most of my battles and the only difference Ive made in my current team from Pre suspect to now is changing my Flygon from Adamant to Jolly. I cant see a cause to make it uber at all.
I'll try out its various sets in a week when I get back form vacation where I have very little time to battle but I dont see how it could change my mind...
I'll try out its various sets in a week when I get back form vacation where I have very little time to battle but I dont see how it could change my mind...
Going by such judgement, I could vote Jirachi Uber because it annoys me more than Togekiss or Honchkrow.
Secondly, if you bring "A" Pokemon to keep "B" Pokemon from annoying you, why is Latias excluded from that? Suicune can be brought down by Blissey, Vaporeon, Latias, Salamence, Lapras, Poliwrath, Toxicroak, Celebi and Jirachi. Latias can be brought down by Hariyama, Machamp, Weavile, Tyranitar, Blissey, Scizor, Salamence, Dragonite, Jirachi, Celebi, Rsgisteel, Gengar Lucario and Bronzong. I don't see how anyone can't use one or two of those Pokemon to combat Latias. Seeing as how "A" Pokemon can't be used to combat "C" Pokemon but can combat "B" Pokemon, I doubt that anyone could consider having to use one of those Pokemon (and possibly more) overcentralizing, especially when there's such a variety of Pokemon to combat Latias with. As with Scizor gaining Bullet Punch and Tyranitar getting a Physical Crunch and Fire Punch in D/P as well as Aqua Tail in Platinum, Latias would just be another threat to deal with on your team and as such, wouldn't be much of a pain to take out.
Go ahead if you want, I might be tempted myself.
I don't get what point you're trying to make.
I will note though that I threw pursuit on one more poke on my team tonight and started winning again. I might have over-reacted a bit, but I still got to say the little bitch is impressive.
First, I would like to refer you to my signature.
Second, did you not read the part where personal votes that have nothing to do with the competitive metagame would be thrown out for being based on terrible logic? Just because you don't want to deal with a threat doesn't mean it should be banned.
Finally, if you used actual experience instead of theorymon, you'd realize that most of the counters you ignored really are counters, and you're just being obstinate for no real reason based on theorymon you want to back up your position.
Second, did you not read the part where personal votes that have nothing to do with the competitive metagame would be thrown out for being based on terrible logic? Just because you don't want to deal with a threat doesn't mean it should be banned.
Finally, if you used actual experience instead of theorymon, you'd realize that most of the counters you ignored really are counters, and you're just being obstinate for no real reason based on theorymon you want to back up your position.
Rather than "personal reasons," it is more like the instinct/internal estimation that the enemy is overly strong, without the detailed capacity to accurately describe it. Not an uncommon problem if I must say.
-I did miss it. The Opening Post(s) of this thread have gone through so many changes, you'll have to excuse me for missing Aeolus' update.
-You think I'd say "I'm starting to think," in the middle of the test period, without having actually played? O.o Look through my posts if you want, and you'll notice TODAY'S post is the FIRST time I have ever voiced the opinion of feeling Latias is uber. I've been playing.
There is nothing wrong with posting an internal estimation. I do not have explainable reasoning for it yet, but maybe others do (and they might respond). You can bet though that by the end of the test period I certainly WILL better understand my gut reation.
. . . or be able to make that "personal opinion" sound smart and rational enough to make sense.
"Gold is at an all time high not reached since 30 years ago!"
"Gold has been stagnant forever, and is just now returning to its price of 30 years ago . . ."
These two statements are based on the same data. The facts about Latias won't change, but you can paint your opinions on it however you like and not be wrong. It's ALL about opinion.
-Have read the signature, and I agree actually. I was just being flippant-- and it also doesn't change the fact that many of those "situational" points still hold, and are still worth considering.
-I did miss it. The Opening Post(s) of this thread have gone through so many changes, you'll have to excuse me for missing Aeolus' update.
-You think I'd say "I'm starting to think," in the middle of the test period, without having actually played? O.o Look through my posts if you want, and you'll notice TODAY'S post is the FIRST time I have ever voiced the opinion of feeling Latias is uber. I've been playing.
There is nothing wrong with posting an internal estimation. I do not have explainable reasoning for it yet, but maybe others do (and they might respond). You can bet though that by the end of the test period I certainly WILL better understand my gut reation.
. . . or be able to make that "personal opinion" sound smart and rational enough to make sense.
"Gold is at an all time high not reached since 30 years ago!"
"Gold has been stagnant forever, and is just now returning to its price of 30 years ago . . ."
These two statements are based on the same data. The facts about Latias won't change, but you can paint your opinions on it however you like and not be wrong. It's ALL about opinion.
Just another day of suspect testing, and another day of the same of the following Pokes......
Gyarados, Tyranitar, Jirachi, Heatran, Magnezone, Scizor, Flygon, Salamence, Latias, Kingdra.
Although I must say it's surprisingly refreshing to see almost no Blisseys being used at all on the Suspect ladder..
p.s. will you please all shut the fuck up and keep the topic on track. seriously, no one gives a day if you think X is uber or not when X isn't up for suspect testing.
Gyarados, Tyranitar, Jirachi, Heatran, Magnezone, Scizor, Flygon, Salamence, Latias, Kingdra.
Although I must say it's surprisingly refreshing to see almost no Blisseys being used at all on the Suspect ladder..
p.s. will you please all shut the fuck up and keep the topic on track. seriously, no one gives a day if you think X is uber or not when X isn't up for suspect testing.