Resource ORAS OU Viability Ranking Thread V3 - Read Post 3451 Page 139

[BlazeLatias]

Alright i wanna say a few things about mega saur after using this thing quite recently. honestly This things so good right now. With Malt everywhere its really nice to have somthing that can not only wall malt but also annoy several other threats that we have. Lando-i leaving also made this thing a bit better. It can also handle mega lop quite nice as well as weavile so thats also a plus. Can definitely see this thing moving up to A+ rank imo. I might be over exaggerating this but mega venu is the perfect combination of bulk and power and has all the tools it needs hell its got growth which i guess is somthing? Meta does alot for mega venu. Rise to A+

Last i want to go over chestnaught as ive also used him quite a bit. Honestly he can be quite underwhelming but its also true that hes a spikes setter that can be used over ferro if your team cant fit him. Hes also got pretty good defense and it works for him quite well. Not to mention he handles mega gyara like its nothing which is another cool niche. Despite all of this i do think he should drop. Hes pretty passive which can be really annoying as he can be fauder for stuff. I think it should drop. His tanking abilities and utility is nice n all but right now the metas hard on him. Drop B-

 

[PK Bash]

OK, I've used Mega Venusaur a lot recently and I'm pretty sure it's the reason I've started to win for a change definitely got all these qualities that pro-A+ people are saying it has but they are being exaggerated a little. Blanket checking half of the meta is really cool until you realise that it's recovery is really volatile (by virtue of it's PP and Sand - Rain is a bit less of an issue because you can Giga Drain huge chunks of health back, but still something to note) which means it's not the catch-all wall we'd all like to think. Realistically your opponent will have something that can switch in to it and scare it out: Talonflame, Tornadus-T, (Mega) Alakazam, Latios, Mega Metagross, Heatran, you get my drift. It's checks are more numerous than is being made out here and - here's the important bit - they're common. Some of them you can Sludge Bomb on the switch, sure, but again this is being exaggerated a little - plenty can switch into either STAB. The next thing is it's very easy to wear down. Since it's often eating Scalds it's fair to say it will be getting burnt (I know we don't take "hax" into account but this is still a very valid point - you're always aware that Scald is likely to burn and Venusaur will get burnt by Scald a lot, I can testify to that). Coupled with dodgy recovery and the fact it's going to be switching a lot, it's now in a state where it is much more manageable. You've just nulled your catch-all check/glue and that didn't take long at all. It's now considerably less effective and you've got to get rid of the status before you can even entertain the idea of using it as some kind of wall-all panacea. Even if you avoid the burn, there's no two ways about this: MVenu is prone to getting worn down quickly.

I'd also like to make the point that everything in A+ currently has it's flaws but they are all fairly self-sufficient. They basically only need one or two things taken care of to sweep or wall a team, or do whatever their job is, and everything else is a bonus to make life a little easier. Mega Venusaur makes more necessary - a cleric, a Bird check, a Sand check, teammates to cover some very exploitable weaknesses, Stealth Rock support if going offensive and an actual Fire answer (Thick Fat is cool for stomaching coverage but you can't beat Fire Types 1-on-1). An A+ mon taken in and of itself needs a few things covered, but MVenu needs more team support then everything in there currently.

However, it doesn't need excessive or niche support - to be honest it only really needs the kind of support any balance team should have and balance is quite strong at the moment - and given the right kind it is a great anti-meta mon. It's also extremely versatile. I just think it's being slightly overhyped but it is good, probably one of the best mon in A. Underrated? Definitely. Underranked? I'm on the fence a little. It could be A+ but I'm leaning towards it staying in A.

 

[Cheryl.]

I actually believe dragonite deserves to be higher but I'm not going to "hard" state it, more like I can't, without an actual argument. I'll do that once the meta settles without Lando-I. Either way, I believe DD dragonite's niche has enough strengths for it to not be outclassed by the other DD'ers. I can't say it's as good as the other DD'ers but I'd sy outclassed is an extremely harsh word to describe DDnite. Furthermore, I believe dragnet's true strengths lie in its CB set, which is incredible. As somebody already mentioned, its immediate strengths coupled with dragonite's natural pros (multiscale, bulk, extremespeed, coverage) are simply astounding (too much for B+ imho but that's another story that most people may be against). All in all, dragnet's inability to effectively deal with the fairies and SR's cheap damage hurt it but I don't believe it should be below B+.

nah, Dragonite deserves to be B+. With how common rocks are making multiscale sort of useless and it's competition as a DDancer from Charizard X and Mega Altaria, I say Dragonite is a B+ pokemon.

I would like to nominate Magnezone to go down to B rank. seeing the viability rankings, the only Steel types that Magnezone is sure fire to beat are Ferrothorn, Scizor, and Skarmory. Metagross can sometimes carry Hammer Arm or Earthquake, which destroys Magnezone, Heatran is a fire type and is immune to HP Fire and doesn't take too much by TBolt. It's slow even with a Scarf, failing to outspeed Talonflame, who can proceed to revenge kill it with Flare Blitz. It also gets walled by stuff like Hippowdon and Mamoswine with Thick fat. Sure, if you have problems with ferro, skarm, or Scizor, Magnezone is your guy, but I don't think it warrants B+ rank all too well. Magnezone for B rank

AraEdit: Don't double post

 

[Alfalfa]

nah, Dragonite deserves to be B+. With how common rocks are making multiscale sort of useless and it's competition as a DDancer from Charizard X and Mega Altaria, I say Dragonite is a B+ pokemon.

Stealth Rock really is irrelevant to Dragonite's current placement. Dragonite's Choice Band set is what pushes it as high as B+, for that is its most effective set at the moment. Dragon Dance does have some notable competition, but that is not what we are basing Dragonite on at the moment, and access to ESpeed to pick off weakened priority users is what gives merit to the Dragon Dance set for teams that have particular issues with priority.

 

[Olijolly]

nah, Dragonite deserves to be B+. With how common rocks are making multiscale sort of useless and it's competition as a DDancer from Charizard X and Mega Altaria, I say Dragonite is a B+ pokemon.

Overall, DD dragonite is indeed not as good as its DD brethren as I've said. However, the primary reason dragonite is even up in B+ is its CB set. It's an amazing set that works as a wallbreaker and a revenge killer. Getting rid of entry hazard isn't very hard....though I'm not going to say it doesn't affect dragonite's viability. Getting a turn to make multiscale useful isn't very hard and that's all you really need to utilize dragonite (CB or DD) well, or at least decently. I actually think it deserves to be in A- at least but I'll write my full reasons why later with calculations. Also, as a DDer, dragonite not needing to mega evolve is an amazing plus in terms of opportunity cost.

 

[Cheryl.]

This is a risky nomination that I've thought of, but I'm going for it dammit. Mega Medicham for A- rank. I can hear all the boos now lol. Mega Medicham hits extremely hard with Pure Power boosted attacks, even 2HKOing physically defensive Clefable with Zen Headbutt with an Adamant nature. It has decent speed, not the best, but okay. It has fake out to evolve safely and bullet punch for priority. And then it has HJK and Zen headutt that hits so friggin hard. Ice punch is also an option for lanndo t garchomp and celebi. Sure it has problems with talonflame and bad bulk, but if u play it right, mega medicham is a monster. Send this thing to A-. ( also, foresight is cool for hitting sableye)

 

[p2]

This is a risky nomination that I've thought of, but I'm going for it dammit. Mega Medicham for A- rank. I can hear all the boos now lol. Mega Medicham hits extremely hard with Pure Power boosted attacks, even 2HKOing physically defensive Clefable with Zen Headbutt with an Adamant nature. It has decent speed, not the best, but okay. It has fake out to evolve safely and bullet punch for priority. And then it has HJK and Zen headutt that hits so friggin hard. Ice punch is also an option for lanndo t garchomp and celebi. Sure it has problems with talonflame and bad bulk, but if u play it right, mega medicham is a monster. Send this thing to A-. ( also, foresight is cool for hitting sableye)

Even though Medicham is one of the hardest hitters in the tier, you've completely left out its flaws which drag it down

Its bulk is horrible and coupled with its lacking speed tier, it's pretty much forced out by anything faster. Sure it has Ice Punch and all these great coverage moves, but it can barely afford to run them, it wants double priority to keep up with the meta and pick off faster mons like Latis. MDiancie or MLopunny. And as a Stallbreaker it has a pretty shitty time because Sableye is still the most popular Stall mega, which completely ruins MMedi. It can't even get around MSableye with Foresight because of Magic Bounce and Mega Slowbro is another mon that walls it, even Thunder Punch variants, and TankChomp is still everywhere, so you're not getting past that without taking a ton of residual damage. I can't disagree that it's a great mon and all, but it has some pretty big glaring flaws and Lando has just been banned, give the meta a couple of weeks to develop before pushing something up that much.

 

[Kye]

I understand CBNite is great. But is it enough for a promotion? Is this single set truly potent enough to boost Dragonite as a whole to A- for instance? Personally, I don't. While dragonite can run various sets due to having a large move pool, people only ever expect two sets: DD and CB. Furthermore, nowadays, I don't think people ever expect to see anything but CB when they see a dragonite on their opponents' teams as it is the only powerful dnite set that isn't outclassed and/or unviable. As for the notion of dragonite moving up to A-, I simply don't believe dragonite should be in the same viability tier as the likes of mega slowbrow, raikou, politoad, mega pinsir, volcarona, or serperior. Last but not least, I'd like to let people know that I am not trying to offend anyone but simply have a strong opinion about dragonite moving up from B+.

Dragonite should not move up to A-.

 

[Assaltwaffle]

Slowking B- > B+ : Its really good mon he can counter alot of thing like gross and with regenerator/scald/leftovers he is very good atm
Raikou A- > A : He is very good mon with 361 speed can using AV/Choice specs and spam volt-switch really good pivots
Venusaur(mega) A > A- :He go just 8 PP heal and in stall team we got thing like sableye they are more usefull than venusaur

And Alakazam(mega) should be move A+

Though I love Raikou, it is not fit to be A. It does not have the fantastic coverage and ability that Mega Manectric does, thus always remaining one sub tier below it.
Mega Venusaur is currently nommed to A+. While I do not think it is justified to rise, it is even less justified to fall. Venusaur is a blanket check to a large portion of the meta even with its limited recovery. Also, stall usually does not use Venusaur because, as you said, it has Mega Sableye and many other better stall mons; Megasaur generally finds its home on balance or bulky offense.
Mega Alakazam also should not rise. Though boasting one of the best unboosted speed stats in the tier, it is EXTREMELY fragile. Though it can shut out a lot of mons once in, it does not hit hard enough to make up for its massive problem with switching in. It takes a large portion even from resisted attacks as well as being 2HKOed by basically all viable priority. Its high special attack is somewhat lack luster in practice, bar tracing Sheer Force (and with Landorus-I gone that is far less likely). As a whole it is a great mon that can perform a fair number of tasks well, though it is not close to the incredible threats in A+ such as Gengar, Latios, Talonflame, and more.

 

[IronGrahn]

Seeing my boy Scolipede is risking a rise, I must support him.
I've been playing around with the Quickpass set with Iron Defense, and oh my potato it's effective!
Passing both Spe and Def boost to a set-up sweeper is very effective!
After achieving one Speed Boost through Protect Scolipede can set up ID against many common physical attackers.

Some bulky Scoli calcs:
252 Atk Landorus-T Stone Edge vs. +2 248 HP / 0 Def Scolipede: 132-156 (40.8 - 48.2%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252+ Atk Landorus-T Stone Edge vs. +2 248 HP / 0 Def Scolipede: 144-170 (44.5 - 52.6%) -- 19.9% chance to 2HKO
252+ Atk Landorus-T Stone Edge vs. +4 248 HP / 0 Def Scolipede: 96-114 (29.7 - 35.2%) -- 16.6% chance to 3HKO
+2 252+ Atk Bisharp Iron Head vs. +2 248 HP / 0 Def Scolipede: 154-183 (47.6 - 56.6%) -- 85.9% chance to 2HKO
+2 252+ Atk Bisharp Iron Head vs. +4 248 HP / 0 Def Scolipede: 103-123 (31.8 - 38%) -- 94.1% chance to 3HKO
+2 252+ Atk Technician Mega Scizor Bullet Punch vs. +2 248 HP / 0 Def Scolipede: 133-157 (41.1 - 48.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
+1 252+ Atk Mega Altaria Earthquake vs. +2 248 HP / 0 Def Scolipede: 89-105 (27.5 - 32.5%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
252 Atk Mega Lopunny Return vs. +2 248 HP / 0 Def Scolipede: 96-114 (29.7 - 35.2%) -- 17.1% chance to 3HKO
252+ Atk Life Orb Excadrill Rock Slide vs. +2 248 HP / 0 Def Scolipede: 133-159 (41.1 - 49.2%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

He can even set up on some walls who can't touch him.
Some grateful receivers are SubCM Keldeo, CM M-Latias, MG+CM Clefable, CS Sylveon and Serperior, making them next to impossible to revenge kill:
252+ Atk Choice Band Talonflame Brave Bird vs. +4 0 HP / 0 Def Serperior: 164-194 (56.3 - 66.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Talonflame Brave Bird vs. +4 0 HP / 0 Def Keldeo: 170-204 (52.6 - 63.1%) -- 99.6% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
And in M-Latias case, the power of Stored Power is POWER!:
+4 0 SpA Mega Latias Stored Power (340 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Blissey: 570-672 (79.8 - 94.1%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
0 SpA Mega Latias Stored Power (340 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Unaware Clefable: 376-444 (95.4 - 112.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+4 0 SpA Mega Latias Stored Power (340 BP) vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Keldeo: 3182-3746 (985.1 - 1159.7%) -- total obliteration.

However, he still suffers from Taunt bait (if not running Poison Jab>Sub), Talon and powerful special sweepers such as Latios and ZardY. And not to forget the nasty SR weakness.

Quickpass may be cancer in some's opinion, but it's still very effective nonetheless.
Send the speedy little bug to B+.

 

[DarkNostalgia]

Scolipede should definitely go to B+. Great hazard setter, especially with Endeavor and Toxic Spikes, which is an extremely big niche over other leads, say, Skarmory and Azelf, because Toxic Spikes is just good in this meta, chipping away at potent sweepers, and Endeavor is self-explanatory. Life Orb sets are quite underrated but decently effective as well. It's definitely on par with Mega Gallade lol, so it deserves B+.

Amoonguss needs to drop to B-. What does it even do lol, metagame is chock full of Mega Charizard X, Weavile, and Tornadus-T, and it has lackluster offensive presence. Not even a reliable answer to Mega Altaria when Fire Blast does a shit ton, and it still loses to Belly Drum Azumarill. Basically most of the games I've faced it is it pivoting in, Sporing something, getting out, dying. Might be missing something lol, but Amoonguss is definitely is on the level of Mega Houndoom.

 

[SketchUp]

Just wanted to correct something.
252+ SpA Altaria Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 120 SpD Amoonguss: 184-218 (42.5 - 50.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Black Sludge recovery

That's a modest First Blast and Amoongus still doesn't get 2HKOed by it.

That's not Mega Altaria
252+ SpA Mega Altaria Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 120 SpD Amoonguss: 246-290 (56.9 - 67.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Black Sludge recovery

Btw Amoonguss deserves to stay B. I agreed with dropping it from B+ -> B before but Regenerator, Spore and Clear Smog are enough reasons to justify Amoonguss over Mega Venusaur while it is still a great check to threatening pokemon such as Clefable, DD Altaria, Diancie, Azumarill and Keldeo. It is not completely deadweight after something is turned to sleep especially if you consider that a pokemon that is put to sleep is even less useful than Amoonguss. Amoonguss can still pivot with Regenerator and put heavy pressure on many fairies. Pokemon like Tornadus-T take 55-60% from Foul Play + rocks and Regenerator means you stay healthy throughout the match. You now have the momentum (unless U-Turn torn-t) a healthy Amoonguss, a Tornadus-T that lost 25% of its health even with Regenerator and somewhere on the field a sleeping pokemon. I don't think I have to show calcs to prove it has no problems switching in against pokemon like Azumarill (bar BD Knock Off) Keldeo and Mega Diancie and annoy the incoming switchin. Keep it B please

 

[Taliheim]

Charizard X: A+ > S - Agree. I've been noticing way too many teams recently that are straight-up 6-0'd by this thing.
MegaSaur A > A+ - Agree. Despite being easily pressured, it blanket checks a ridiculous amount of things right now, and is one of the few true hard counters to Mega Altaria. (HP Flying Malt, anyone?)
Amoonguss: B > B- - Disagree. This thing gives stall a lot of momentum throughout a match, by forcing easily predictable switches by threatening Spore, hitting Spore itself to generate several free turns and incapacitate an opposing Pokemon, and being much harder to pressure into a bad situation due to Regenerator (also frees up a moveslot otherwise used for healing). Enough to keep it B imo.
Chesnaught: B > B- - Disagree. While bad on paper, it works with Stall's current aggressive playstyle, and 100% stops BDAzu with the right EVs, unlike Ferrothorn, who gets bopped by a potential Superpower.
Nidoking: Unranked > D - Disagree. Simply put, doesn't hit harder that queen enough to warrant a ranking.
Nidoqueen: Unranked > D - Agree. While having subpar bulk, still functions as a great utility check and hazard setter.
Reuniclus: B > B+ - Agree. Basically an alakazam that trades speed for bulk, should be one rank lower than zam IMO
Quagsire: B > B- - Agree. Simply too passive for today's stall.
Kabutops B+ > B - Disagree. It's the premier Spinner of Rain teams, has priority to function outside of Rain, and is the only non-Mega physical Rain sweeper.
Mandibuzz: B- > C+ - Agree. This thing's time is gone, but still usable. C+ looks good for it.

 

[North Gate]

Charizard X to S: Abstain I don't really feel like arguing about it as I am extremely on the fence about it.
Mega Venu to A+: Hell Yeah! I fucking love this thing, it may get worn down easily but it can blanket check a lot of stuff and has a lot of versatility in a few of it's moves, I like Knock Off and Leech Seed, for instance.
Nidoking/Queen to D: Agree while the whole gist of their ranking is basically 'lando's gone next best one lolxd' I kinda knew these would get nommed literally right after the banning and I'm pairing them together because of their similarities but they do have some differences, although I like Toxic Spikes utility and a good typing. STAB Sludge Wave is like flipping off all the fairies with SF.
Chesnaught to B-: Agree haven't used enough to really warrant much of an argument but I'm leaning towards B- because of it on paper, but I haven't used it much in practice.
Reuniclus to B+: Agree This thing is honestly pretty cool and a good alternative to CM MG Clef and it having Regenerator is a plus as well, I really like this 'mon and it definitely deserves it.
Amoonguss to B-: Disagree As the guy writing Amoonguss' analysis, I think it's still good and a great pivot for stall and can fare decently on balance, probably stalls next best check to Azumarill with BD tbh.
Quagsire to B-: Agree Yeah sure it's passive and stuff but tbh I really didn't think it was fitting up there
Mandibuzz to C+: Agree This thing is basically dead and while it is quite versatile it's mostly just outclassed and weak and I honestly don't like it as a check to physical attackers, it's also a bad MMetagross check tbh.
Kabutops to B: Disagree Honestly being the only full physical rain sweeper that isn't Mega Swampert, (which I hate mswamp on rain teams cuz there are good megas to check stuff in rain) it deserves to stay there and honestly is still pretty effective, being a good spinenr for rain and a good sweeper with SD, something MSwamp himself lacks.
Scolipede to B+: Agree It's good outside of the cancerous passing strats and is a solid suicide lead while being a good sweeper too.

 

[DaKakz]

Nidoking: Unranked > D - Disagree. Simply put, doesn't hit harder that queen enough to warrant a ranking.
Nidoqueen: Unranked > D - Agree. While having subpar bulk, still functions as a great utility check and hazard setter.

Nidoking is considered better than queen in OU not because of power but because of speed, King outspeeds important stuff like Mega Altaria, Heatran, SpDef Talonflame, HelmetChomp , Gliscor and Diggersby

Not to mention the power difference is so small it is negligible:

252 SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Nidoking Sludge Wave vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mew: 199-234 (58.3 - 68.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252+ SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Nidoqueen Sludge Wave vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mew: 200-238 (58.6 - 69.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

 

[Karxrida]

Nidoking is considered better than queen in OU not because of power but because of speed, King outspeeds important stuff like Mega Altaria, Heatran, SpDef Talonflame, HelmetChomp , Gliscor and Diggersby

Not to mention the power difference is so small it is negligible:

252 SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Nidoking Sludge Wave vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mew: 199-234 (58.3 - 68.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252+ SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Nidoqueen Sludge Wave vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mew: 200-238 (58.6 - 69.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

That's not true at all, especially since we're still debating if they merit a ranking. Nidoqueen's extra bulk makes it better at setting Toxic Spikes and SR while still having passable damage output, which is arguably more valuable than another glass cannon that gets shit on by offense because it's slow.

Sorry this is short, but phone posting is a bitch.

 

[DaKakz]

I don't buy into Nidoqueen's supposed bulk since more than half of the S to A- mons can OHKO (some after a single spike or SR), I prefer using something which has the same strength while outspeeding important stuff like Mega Altaria, Heatran, stallbreaker talon, defensive chomp etc...

 

[Karxrida]

I don't buy into Nidoqueen's supposed bulk since more than half of the S to A- mons can OHKO (some after a single spike or SR), I prefer using something which has the same strength while outspeeding important stuff like Mega Altaria, Heatran, stallbreaker talon, defensive chomp etc...

Nidoking needs to be Scarf to consistently check all Mega Altaria, as otherwise you're dying to a boosted DD variant's Earthquake. Scarf also has major issues with the fact that all of its moves have common resists or immunities that other Mons can use for free switches or setup, plus there's the damage drop-off from not using Life Orb.

Outspeeding Stallbreaker Talonflame means shit when it has priority and can 2HKO you after Rocks with it. Plus how the fuck are you getting Nidoking in safely? Just switch it in and hope doesn't Wisp you or fire off a Brave Bird?

You're not switching into Garchomp like ever, and a random encounter with an offensive variant means you're dead.

You can beat Heatran, but you're not switching into it safely either.

 

[bludz]

Zard X A+ -> S

The number of things that actually counter it are very slim especially when you consider it can lure many of the DD counters with the Will-O-Wisp set similar to Talonflame. Hippowdon, Altaria, Quagsire and Rhyperior all hate the burn minus Heal Bell Altaria, while it limits Slowbro's effectiveness as well. Heatran beats non EQ sets but is bopped by those. Pokemon like Clefable need Thunder Wave to actually check Zard X and other widely used mons like Rotom-Wash and Mega Scizor are setup fodder. This is not to mention that Outrage actually totally obliterates Quagsire, Slowbro and Hippowdon meaning that a SD set or even DD Outrage just rips fat teams a new one. Against offense we all know how deadly Dragon Dance is once it gets to +1 and it sets up on a decent number of things. I mean there's really no doubt that this pokemon is an absolute monster, and I see it going to S rank in the near future. If anything is holding it back right now it's that not enough people are realizing the potential for versatility and just going with cookie cutter DD FB DClaw Roost sets. Yes it requires more hazard support and is worn down more easily than the other S rank threats, but it also offers more immediate power and has the best offensive typing out of anything in A+ and above bar potentially Azumarill. I would also argue that while Mega Altaria sets up a DD more easily and is harder to revenge kill (though not by too much since its actually hit super effective by priority), Zard X is almost definitely going to do more damage before it goes down which means it's a more potent threat as a wallbreaker which supports the team.

Anyway, might not be the perfect time for it to move up to S as the metagame is still settling in after the Landorus ban, but unless trends emerge that hurt its effectiveness, I think it will move up soon.

 

[Lord Wallace]

Yeah Zard-X can run a lot of things but honestly Jolly 3 Attacks DD Zard-X is the set that will push Zard X into S, if at all.
This thing just devours a lot of the current metagame trends where other DD sweepers like Altaria may need a bit more support to break through, while also pairing well offensively with the two best spinners in the tier, making it's hazard weakness surprisingly simple to accommodate for when building.
Unlike Altaria, Zard X has no fear of bulky steel types in the tier, nor does it fear being burned by Scald when setting up, is generally more powerful, and it's extra 20 base speed make it harder to revenge kill at +1 with Scarfers or just stupid fast Pokemon like Mega Alakazam. I have no problems recognizing Zard-X as a DD sweeper on par with Altaria at this point, but I don't have a strong opinion about it.

I also agree with Scolipede in B+, it's one of the most reliable Spikes setters in the tier and right now so many offensive things (such as the aforementioned Mega Zam) really love their Spikes and not every offensive team has room for a Ferrothorn or Klefki to bog them down for the sake of having access to Spikes, not to mention Scolipede itself has pretty decent offensive presence thanks to Speed Boost and high powered STAB plus Endeavor, making it one of the few suicide hazard leads that may be worth saving for later to use as something other than death fodder, unlike, say, Custap Skarm.

 

[Martin]

I don't buy into Nidoqueen's supposed bulk since more than half of the S to A- mons can OHKO (some after a single spike or SR), I prefer using something which has the same strength while outspeeding important stuff like Mega Altaria, Heatran, stallbreaker talon, defensive chomp etc...

The speed tier really doesn't mean sh*t when you can't even beat a lot of the stuff you are trying to outpace in the first place - especially considering that everything you listed either OHKOs or 2HKOs you on switch-in anyway:

• 0 Atk Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Nidoking: 135-159 (44.5 - 52.4%) -- 76.6% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock (not even Sharp Beak, guaranteed after 2 SR switch-ins)
• 252+ Atk Mega Altaria Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Nidoking: 262-310 (86.4 - 102.3%) -- 50% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock (assuming it doesn't set up) - even base Altaria OHKOs with a boost
• 0 SpA Heatran Lava Plume vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Nidoking: 136-162 (44.8 - 53.4%) -- 87.5% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock, meanwhile Nidoking a: risks the burn and b: gets switched in on by something that isn't weak to Earth Power. Also this is assuming it isn't a: running Earth Power and b: you don't have an offensive Heatran - which guarantees an OHKO after about 25% prior damage (which isn't hard) - with a max roll KOing without rocks from 89.1%. Oh: also BalloonTran is immune to all of your attacks barring Ice Beam unless you forgo either Fire Blast (Flamethrower can't OHKO SpD Skarm) or Ice Beam for Superpower, which completely cripples your ability to beat either Landorus-T/Garchomp or Skarmory.
  
• Its kinda obvious that you can't come in on TankChomp, but you shouldn't be trying to beat it with Nidoking in the first place anyway - and you are also assuming that the Garchomp isn't creeping, which means that it isn't as easy to just scout for TankChomp as it seems and it means that you also get f*cked over by offensive variants anyway.

You say that Nidoqueen's bulk doesn't do anything for it, but it actually lets it come in on a few hits (namely, it allows it to come in on SpD Heatran reliably - unlike Nidoking - but it also allows it to take an unboosted EQ from Altaria if it needs to, it can come in on uninvested Talonflame consistently etc.). Also, while the lower speed tier seems like a deterrent at a glance, it actually gives it the luxury of running a variety of spreads instead of being forced into just one spread (for example, it can run a spread of 132 HP / 252 SpA / 124 Spe with a timid nature to outpace adamant Bisharp to allow it to play around its Sucker Punch with T-Spikes/Stealth Rock and outpace when you correctly predict a Knock Off, or you could run max speed and a timid nature to oupace adamant Excadrill to prevent it spinning away your hazards - just a few examples, but there are also a lot of other benchmarks you could go for including jolly Tyranitar, Azumarill etc.) and the fact that it isn't focused around wallbreaking means that it has the luxury to not run four attacks - allowing it to provide actual utility to its team.

The idea that Nidoking>Nidoqueen is one of the many misconceptions within the competitive Pokémon community, sharing its place with those who say that Trevenant>Gourgeist-XL, Vaporeon>Alomomola, Dusclops>Dusknoir, Jolteon>Raikou and Donphan>Hippowdon - among others. It is one of those things that is just plain false, and it is something that we want to try to stomp out of competitive play. However, that will never happen; therefore, we get stupid placements like Trevenant being in UU and Hitmonchan, Ambipom and Cinccino being in RU despite being either virtually or completely inviable in their respective tiers. Whether Nidoqueen should be ranked or not is debatable in itself (although personally I am one of the pro-rank party), so Nidoking being ranked is really out of the question simply due to it being worse than Nidoqueen in OU.

 

[AM]

The idea that Nidoking>Nidoqueen is one of the many misconceptions within the competitive Pokémon community, sharing its place with those who say that Trevenant>Gourgeist-XL, Vaporeon>Alomomola, Dusclops>Dusknoir, Jolteon>Raikou and Donphan>Hippowdon - among others. It is one of those things that is just plain false, and it is something that we want to try to stomp out of competitive play. However, that will never happen; therefore, we get stupid placements like Trevenant being in UU and Hitmonchan, Ambipom and Cinccino being in RU despite being either virtually or completely inviable in their respective tiers. Whether Nidoqueen should be ranked or not is debatable in itself (although I am one of the pro-rank party), so Nidoking being ranked is really out of the question simply due to it being worse than Nidoqueen in OU.

You guys spent like 3+ pages talking about Nidoking and Nidoqueen ranking lol. I think misconception goes out the window when you guys are so hungry for a Lando-I replacement that you'll use the Nidos. It's a small ranking the only people that care is some people here, team cause we have to, and after that nobody cares lol. Relax not even a big deal.

 

[Kurona]

You know guys, there's this thing called using replays to show in which scenarios Nidoqueen > Nidoking or Nidoking > Nidoqueen worked for you rather than theorymonning about it

 

[MANNAT]

I'm gonna quickly make a nom that I think is a long time coming and quite well deserved. I think that Mega Slowbro deserves a rise up one, maybe two ranking spots. He can function well vs basically any play style given minimal team support. He can do well vs offense basically by himself if offensive grass/electric types are gone, and bulky offense/balance and similar. Iron Defense allows its defense to skyrocket from its already gargantuan defense stat so that it is essentially impervious to all forms of physical damage. Calm mind allows it to patch up its subpar base 80 special defense while boosting its impressive 130 special attack to monstorous levels. These moves in tandem with each other can make slowbro into a deadly sweeper that can run through teams like a knife through hot butter. The most powerful physical sweepers in the tier can barely touch slowbro and he can set up on so many mons that its not even funny. There are probably a lot more reasons why this thing should rise, and I might not be the best person to explain it, but megabro is definetely good enough to rise up to A rank, especially with lando gone whom Megabro couldn't switch into safely at all.
Mega Slowbro for A or A+

Replays:

Replays

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-239763489
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-239764701
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-239769067
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-239773123

Edit: Replays will be updated regularly until i feel that I have provided enough quality replays.

 

[MikeDawg]

I'm gonna quickly make a nom that I think is a long time coming and quite well deserved. I think that Mega Slowbro deserves a rise up one, maybe two ranking spots. He can function well vs basically any play style given minimal team support. He can do well vs offense basically by himself if offensive grass/electric types are gone, and bulky offense/balance and similar. Iron Defense allows its defense to skyrocket from its already gargantuan defense stat so that it is essentially impervious to all forms of physical damage. Calm mind allows it to patch up its subpar base 80 special defense while boosting its impressive 130 special attack to monstorous levels. These moves in tandem with each other can make slowbro into a deadly sweeper that can run through teams like a knife through hot butter. The most powerful physical sweepers in the tier can barely touch slowbro and he can set up on so many mons that its not even funny. There are probably a lot more reasons why this thing should rise, and I might not be the best person to explain it, but megabro is definetely good enough to rise up to A rank, especially with lando gone whom Megabro couldn't switch into safely at all.
Mega Slowbro for A or A+

Replays:

Replays

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-239763489
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-239764701
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-239769067
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-239773123

Edit: Replays will be updated regularly until i feel that I have provided enough quality replays.

The first two replays were against awful players (like using trick on slowbro... Bravebirding, etc.)

Neither team was very suited to deal with it either. This doesn't mean that slowbro is impossible to prepare for, it means that you were on the low ladder against players that didnt have that intuition.

The fourth replay featured more iffy plays on both sides, and again, his team had no way to touch slowbro to begin with.

The 3rd one is fun given how iron defense let it beat breloom, but his poor team construction (an inability to handle common cores) and iffy plays proved to be the real issues.

I think slowbro is find where it is, personal. Its sets are quite matchup reliant (rest bets status, iron defense loses to status, etc.), and it is typically relegated to a late game sweep (which many mons can do effectively). Perhaps one rank boost is feasable, but after the "lolbanbro" hype died down, it became clear that while a good pokemon, it isn't as absurdly powerful as first anticipated.