ORAS UU Viability Ranking Thread M3 (READ POST #823)

[DaSpoofy]

I believe florges needs too much support to sweep but meh. I guess I should have rebuttled more but idk if it would have made a difference. Might fight against it in the future. I know not everyone is unanimous on it.

Linda is back so thats cool. Probably should go to B

Reuniclus is very good. Dont know if its S material but since I can't really agree on what rank it gets Im fine where it is.

Aboma is really good. It has flaws but not as much as other A- mons. Or maybe as much as the other mons but its place in the meta is just overpowering at times.

Overall glad for the nominations. Thanks Omfuga for updating. Im glad we arent being ignored :)

 

[Omfuga]

Correct me if I'm wrong, Omfuga, but did anyone actually explicitly agree with Reun to S? I read through all the posts and most of them were undecided, saying that while they wouldn't be surprised if Reun got moved up, they weren't saying a yes or a no. The other posts were explicit Nos.

. Overall I feel like while it may be "presumptuous" since it hasn't been a "top threat" for long, I feel like Reun deserves S rank.
for a different post :)

 

[lllg17]

Thanks for the reply, missed that one

 

[dodmen]

Definitely agree with Mega Abomasnow to A as it's a fantastic Pokemon and for sure on another level than most of the Pokemon in A-. The Swords Dance set is a hugely threatening sweeper - throwing out one early game EQ can sometimes put entire teams into sweeping range if you manage to keep rocks off your side of the field. The mixed set is also excellent for more balanced teams and honestly is my preferred set of the two because of its ability to just take huge chunks out of things, even resists like Doublade/Cobalion/Mega Aggron with Blizzard. While Ice Shard/Blizzard/Giga Drain is pretty much given (though you can run Wood Hammer > Giga if you feel comfortable with it) the last moveslot is really what defines what can truly "counter" it - Earthquake most notably hits Tentacruel, Empoleon, and kills Fire-types (other Steel-types get hit as hard/harder by Blizzard), but there's also the underrated Focus Blast which destroys any Porygon2, Snorlax, Umbreon, Cobalion, and Mega Aggron that thinks they can switch into Abomasnow. Growth is also viable and actually pretty threatening, especially with Giga Drain to help you outlast Florges/P2/other special walls. There's also HP Fire and Leech Seed but really as I see it, Focus Blast shrinks Abomasnow's list of checks the most. Anyway my point is Abomasnow has the capacity to destroy anything it'd like to and is hugely threatening to any playstyle. Not only that, but it's able to check a fair number of threats despite its many weaknesses including some of the most threatening 'mons in the tier in Feraligatr/Mega Swamp/Sharpedo/Krookodile due to its typing and bulk as well as Salamence/Mega Aero/Hydreigon/Mega Beedrill/Mega Sceptile through Ice Shard. I think the A rank fairly accounts for all its strengths while keeping its weaknesses in mind.

Can't really say much about any of the other nominations as I'm pretty neutral/undecided.

Another nomination is for Venomoth to rise from B+ to probably A-. The LO set is terrifying for balance to face (at +1 it OHKOs Salamence, Mega Aero, Entei, and 248 HP Crobat after SR) and it can find setup opportunities pretty easily because of Sleep Powder and its ability to outspeed many bulkier 'mons in the tier. The main things that hold it back are priority combined with SR weakness and certain special walls like Blissey and Snorlax who it struggles with, but this is for sure in need of a rise.

I do think there are a couple things we could clean out from the C rank though:

• Exploud, not only is hit hard to find team slots for this to work, but it's also pretty much entirely outclassed by PZ who is bulkier, faster, can set up, can go mixed, and has Trick. It's also exactly as strong as Exploud is (though I suppose PZ would rather be running Timid if it chooses to run Specs):
  • 252+ SpA Choice Specs Exploud Boomburst vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Shaymin: 294-346 (86.2 - 101.4%)
    
  • 252+ SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Porygon-Z Tri Attack vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Shaymin: 294-348 (86.2 - 102%)
    
  • 252 SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Porygon-Z Tri Attack vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Shaymin: 268-316 (78.5 - 92.6%)
• Emboar - I couldn't see this ever being viably run when the tier has Entei, Infernape, and Darmanitan. Sure, Emboar has certain attributes that are better than some of these Pokemon individually, but it doesn't make up for its extremely disappointing lack of Speed compared to these three (disappointing as fuck to have a Fire-type on your team that can't check Mamoswine), and the fact that it has to predict perfectly while killing itself to have a chance at denting fatter teams. Another thing is that no matter what it does, Salamence will shit on it whereas the other three have ways to work around or annoy Mence more. Also, it has few switchin opportunities especially due to the lack of Fairy resist.
• Flygon - I think this might have actually risen from unranked recently but really lol there's no reason to use this thing when there are far superior options in this tier.

 

[Christo]

I am really happy to see Florges at A+! As for other potential nominations, I really only have an opinion on Mandibuzz to A rank. I do think Mandibuzz should be raised to A rank solely based off the Stall Breaker Specially Defensive set. This set is Taunt / Toxic / Knock Off(I guess Foul play can work) / Roost. This set is the only A rank set in my opinion due to how much it can wall and wear down any defense wall. This set threatens every S rank Pokemon as well as countering both Suicune and Reuniclus. Other than that, it matches up well versus practically any play-style, although thrives vs bulkier teams. To put it into perspective, this set threatens every S rank pokemon, beats Florges 1v1, and beats 95% of A rank pokemon. The one flaw to Mandibuzz is the prevalence of Cobalion, whom of which gets a free switch in every time. As for the other Mandibuzz sets, I am not really a fan of them. Defog Mandibuzz gets pressured extensively by hazards and Defensive variants get outclassed by Defensive Umbreon.

I would have loved to have provided a few Replays showing Mandibuzz walling entire teams, but unfortunately the Replays are down D:

 

[Cactrune]

Everything looks pretty good, Omfuga. I'm always glad to see these major updates, it feels like progress to me every time lol.

As for my opinions, I would say that Mega Abomasnow and Mandibuzz definitely deserve ranks up. Mega Abomasnow in particular is one of my favorite 'mons in the tier at the moment, and has been for a while now. I use the SD set more often, but lately I've been working with Mixed and Growth, the latter of which is actually way better than you'd think it would be, as it allows Abomasnow to more reliably check Suicune and not be afraid of those pesky Scald Burns. Abomasnow might seem unorthodox to a lot of newer players, but I assure you it is a real terror to face and (imo) one of the most fun Pokemon to use in the tier. As for Mandibuzz, the thing is incredibly annoying, refuses to die, and is a huge thorn in the side of most team archetypes. It's got pretty decent defensive typing and the movepool to make great use of it, with the biggest issue really being its 4MSS.

Some other observations here are that our lord and savior Linda has finally been (rightfully) moved up a bit, I'm glad to see it. The other observation is the Galvantula nom, which I find myself agreeing with because the thing has such good STABs and access to Sticky Web. I don't use this thing much, but I do highly recommend less common sets, like Life Orb and Specs, which allow Galvantula to actually do stuff during a match (imagine that!) besides just setting webs and then dying, which is how most people use it. Galvantula is pretty underrated, and B+ seems fine for it.

Keep up the awesome discussion, guys!

 

[rs]

Glad to see Fletch rose, that thing is honestly a monster lmao.

As for nominations, I definitely agree with Mega Abomasnow and Mega Shark rising. Mega Snow can be one of the most threatening mons in the tier, because it can run physical, special, and mixed sets, making it pretty unpredictable. For Physical sets, it can run Swords Dance, which makes it one of the best sweepers in the tier, with access to Priority and some very strong Grass STAB moves in Wood Hammer/Seed Bomb with EQ as coverage to hit Steels and Fire-Types, which always seem to switch into it. As for Mega Shark, its probably one of the best cleaners in the tier. Strong Jaw boosted Crunch can 2HKO the majority of the tier and the extra bulk on the mega is EXTREMELY useful, here's just some simple calcs to help prove that. n_n

252+ Atk Choice Band Entei Extreme Speed vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Sharpedo: 267-315 (95 - 112%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO

252+ Atk Choice Band Entei Extreme Speed vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mega Sharpedo: 175-207 (62.2 - 73.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Although I wish Waterfall was a bit stronger, it does have that flinch chance to bail you out sometimes, which is always nice lmao (it's why Mega Swamperts tend to run Waterfall>Aqua Tail + the chance of missing I guess). But yeah, definitely agree with those rising, but no opinion/neutral on the others.

• Exploud, not only is hit hard to find team slots for this to work, but it's also pretty much entirely outclassed by PZ who is bulkier, faster, can set up, can go mixed, and has Trick. It's also exactly as strong as Exploud is (though I suppose PZ would rather be running Timid if it chooses to run Specs):
  • 252+ SpA Choice Specs Exploud Boomburst vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Shaymin: 294-346 (86.2 - 101.4%)
    
  • 252+ SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Porygon-Z Tri Attack vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Shaymin: 294-348 (86.2 - 102%)
    
  • 252 SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Porygon-Z Tri Attack vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Shaymin: 268-316 (78.5 - 92.6%)

For this, I think the only reason Exploud is in the rankings is because it has access to Scrappy and can just click Boomburst 100% of the time while Porygon-Z has to predict whether or not to click Tri-Attack or Dark Pulse on Choice Specs sets (if the opponent is using a Ghost-Type ofc). Even though I would definitely still use PZ, Exploud still has that niche and should stay C imo

 

[Schpoonman]

Keep Galvantula B. It needs Specs in order to hit as hard as it needs to, but that neuters its incredible coverage. It's not exactly a "low-ladder" Pokemon when you use its offensive sets which threaten offense like a motherfucker, but outside of Thunder it's just too damn weak.

 

[Adaam]

Galv's SpA is indeed unfortunately lower than desired, but it can get away with because of Thunder's high base power, and because a lot of the mons that resists Thunder in UU are hit for super effective by its coverage. More importantly, out of all hazard removers, only Gligar can confidently switch into it and remove Sticky Web, which is the reason why Galv should rise, not because of its wallbreaking capabilities.

 

[ehT]

Dragalge for A
​

I've been using Dragalge thing a lot on HO recently, and I'm in love with it. Simply put, this thing is strong. Insanely strong. Its unique defensive typing, huge power, and access to T-Spikes help it perform double duty in supporting its team. It can pivot into things like VolTurn and passive walls, as well as act as an extremely threatening wallbreaker with its near perfect STAB coverage. All these things taken together allow Dragalge so support a team in a unique and valuable way that fewer other 'mons can. Its typing and bulk give it plenty of opportunities to come onto the field and threaten something, simultaneously wearing down the opponent with T-Spikes as well as pressuring them to play predictably -- it forces Steel types to come in, forces Suicunes to Rest, forces Crobats to Defog, etc. If they do anything else, chances are they'll get 2HKO'd. This means a lot of momentum for you. It also has great synergy with common 'mons on offence, such as Krookodile, Lucario, Entei, and Mienshao, which all appreciate Dragalge's ability to wear down and / or smash things. It also has a degree of versatility, being able to viably run Black Sludge, a Plate, or Choice Specs, as well as Dragon Tail, a Hidden Power, or Focus Blast in its 4th moveslot. I've also heard of AV and SpDef sets for more defensive / balanced teams, but those sound kinda shaky to me, at least on paper.

That said, Dragalge is definitely not without its flaws. Its low speed and lack of recovery means it can be quickly worn down, if you're not careful. Hazard stack in particular is a pain for it. It can also be either very hard to kill or very easy, depending on match-up. It can be a liability at times versus offence, especially after you've dropped a Draco, meaning you have to play aggressively to pick up the slack. The common offensive 'mons that it likes to partner with also love to take advantage of it, even if they don't want to come straight in. While few 'mons can come in on Dragalge consistently (that's limited pretty much only to Empoleon, Blissey, Snorlax, and P2 -- Forry and Doublade take well over half from Draco), said 'mons can very easily take advantage of you and suck away your momentum.

But that said, I believe Dragalge's strengths (T-Spikes, a unique combination of resists, and insane power) outweigh its flaws enough for it to warrant a rise to A Rank. It is a wonderful asset on offence, and it fulfills a combination of roles that practically no other 'mon shares.

 

[Saria]

I love using Dragalge (for example, I used it in SPL and twice in koko's UU tour), but it's definitely not an A Pokemon. I'd say it's not even worth the A- it currently has.

It's way too slow, has a significant amount of exploitable weaknesses and its overall bulk is nothing special. As a nuke, Dragalge is really inconsistent. Too slow and not bulky enough to be massively threatening against offensive or balanced teams. Not strong enough to play around its hard counters that are commonly seen in stallish teams, and Draco Meteor's low pp and the fact Dragalge heavily relies on it against that kind of teams doesn't help. Smacking some special walls with Sludge Bomb is cool because Poison chance, but considering they beat Dragalge anyway and that Steel-types are immune, it's not particularly amazing.

Specs Dragalge competes with Kyurem and Hydreigon (and Goodra). Kyurem is significantly faster, Ice Beam is less risky than Sludge Bomb, and it can actually break through special walls with Focus Blast. Hydreigon is significantly faster, far better coverage, U-turn and way more unpredictable.

Support Dragalge sets are cool, but they are above average at best because they only work in specific teams and have tons of competitions. Ass Vest Dragalge is cringeworthy. It's a bad combination of bulky + offensive dragalge, without the raw power or the support moves.

Dragalge is not the kind of Pokemon I'd call "fantastic in the UnderUsed Metagame".

 

[DiscoDucky]

If reuniclus gets the bump to s, i think it's fair that both Doublade and Spiritomb should increase in viability (more for the latter).

 

[YABO]

I disagree, Doublade still has issues with every other s rank mon, alongside the numerous problems it has normally such as lack of recovery, poor SpD, reliance on Swords Dance, etc.

 

[Kink]

Testing spiritomb in multiple play styles as we speak, will post my insights.

 

[Omfuga]

Quick-drops and quick-rises have occured (http://www.smogon.com/forums/thread...pdate-august-2015.3545972/page-5#post-6413787)

That means Gothitelle will be moving from D to unranked.

Also, Hoopa is up for discussion as soon as it's up on the sim and some competitive sets can be ironed out. I'm really not sure about Hoopa's stance in UU or how it will compete with other things-- Mainly chandelure. I think Sub Salac is actually cooler than the choiced sets (Magician allows you to use the salac then steal the item of whatever you hit with a special move). Hoopa has really great coverage and can potentially even afford to use sub NP... However, I'm not sure if sub 2 attacks would run dual-STAB or maybe 1 STAB + focus blast.

The only other change is smeargle dropping to RU. Smeargle's viability isn't in question, and it still has a niche in UU, so it will still be ranked.

 

[Kink]

Until we can actually test Hoopa, no more speculation. This thread is for serious VR discussion only.

I had to delete some posts above. Long story short, it is VERY hard to work around the practical application of the UU metagame and its near "dark-type per team" mentality. Almost every other offensive team runs pursuit. Doublade is Amok, and this is just another reason to run it on your team.

Look, we all know Hoopa has the potential to be super dangerous... its stats, by UU standards, are offensively insane. We'll enjoy the power it brings, but we all know what a shitty speed tier does to a powerful Pokemon, Trick Room or not, so before we start shouting nonsense like OMG IT'LL BE A OR A+, let's try it first and let it settle... speculation is utterly pointless and adds nothing to the conversation, other than me telling you to stop speculating and actually form an opinion tautologically.

 

[Kink]

Until we can actually test Hoopa, no more speculation. This thread is for serious VR discussion only, for CURRENT, UP-TO-DATE (meaning it's up on the sim) UNDERUSED POKEMON.

 

[Sam]

I will infract any Hoopa discussion that takes place during the rest of that day

unless King UU beats me to it

 

[Bouff]

well uh i guess now dat im out of uu open i feel a bit more inclined to contribute haha. there's not too much i can say about the current noms barring galv, but wutevz

i still think whims is a+ material tbh. i dont think its good just cause of encore but generally because u can compress a good dragon and water check into one slot, which is a really good thing for most playstyles to have when u realize that hydrei pert gatr and mence are all ridiculously common atm. the defensive set does kinda blow in some matchups, it does provide merit as a general disruptor wit stuff like leech seed, stun spore, memento, and obviously encore. the specs set doesnt get enough usage as it should either because it gives more hyper offensive teams a pretty solid offensive check to the aformentioned mons while also not hitting like a wet paper bag. switcheroo is cool on it too to shit on fat walls like bliss n to cripple lategame sweepers that tear apart offensive teams. i think whims is good enough to be in a+ even if epeople use no speed investment / lo a lot, which i think is kind of a waste

think reg aero could use a raise, seeing as its somewhat more consistent as a suicide elead than azelf, mainly because it duznt have to worry about taunt from bat / opposing aero, even if it is kinda piss weak sedge + fblast is pretty fair game, not to mention it has access to some other neat moves, mainly tw and d-edge

agree with galv moving up, but honestly i think the only good sets are lo / specs. idk i just feel like galv needs to be somewhat self-sufficient in order to work well because sticky web by itself kinda blows, and if you're running sash galv is never rly hitting hard unless its hitting something for se damage.

not much else to say, i kind of think b+ is overcrowded, but nothing really deserves a rise / drop except maybe nidoking and glig to a- lol. i also kind of think the only s ranks should be cune and the dragons but thats fairly debatable o _ oO

 

[JuanchoTacorta]

Supporting Emboar to Unranked. Although Reckless give him a great power to break walls or revenge kill as a Scarfer, any other fire mon mentioned before (Entei, Darmanitan or Infernape) outclasses all his sets. Only thing I can think about is the electric coverage on Wild Charge + Reckless. Well, here's Arcanine:

252 Atk Choice Band Arcanine Wild Charge vs. 204 HP / 248+ Def Vaporeon: 260-306 (57.5 - 67.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Reckless Emboar Wild Charge vs. 204 HP / 248+ Def Vaporeon: 224-264 (49.5 - 58.4%) -- 66.4% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Life Orb Arcanine Wild Charge vs. 204 HP / 248+ Def Vaporeon: 224-265 (49.5 - 58.6%) -- 64.5% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Only thing Emboar really has is access to Sucker Punch, which can be very interesting, but I don't think it gets a niche to be in UU ranking

 

[Mikael]

am i the only one here who see this VR too short? me personally would change the c tier so it would have C+,C and C-

 

[Revelation]

am i the only one here who see this VR too short? me personally would change the c tier so it would have C+,C and C-

I've actually been thinking that RU's new format is pretty neat. I'd support the same change here, if it was ever on the cards.

 

[Jaguar360]

Supporting Emboar to Unranked. Although Reckless give him a great power to break walls or revenge kill as a Scarfer, any other fire mon mentioned before (Entei, Darmanitan or Infernape) outclasses all his sets. Only thing I can think about is the electric coverage on Wild Charge + Reckless. Well, here's Arcanine:

252 Atk Choice Band Arcanine Wild Charge vs. 204 HP / 248+ Def Vaporeon: 260-306 (57.5 - 67.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Reckless Emboar Wild Charge vs. 204 HP / 248+ Def Vaporeon: 224-264 (49.5 - 58.4%) -- 66.4% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Life Orb Arcanine Wild Charge vs. 204 HP / 248+ Def Vaporeon: 224-265 (49.5 - 58.6%) -- 64.5% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Only thing Emboar really has is access to Sucker Punch, which can be very interesting, but I don't think it gets a niche to be in UU ranking

Why are you calcing Scarf Emboar to Band Arcanine? If you want to calc wallbreaker to wallbreaker then at least use Expert Belt.
252+ Atk Expert Belt Reckless Emboar Wild Charge vs. 204 HP / 248+ Def Vaporeon: 295-348 (65.2 - 76.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Life Orb Reckless Emboar Wild Charge vs. 204 HP / 248+ Def Vaporeon: 320-377 (70.7 - 83.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Life Orb Emboar Superpower vs. 204 HP / 248+ Def Vaporeon: 265-313 (58.6 - 69.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Choice Band Reckless Emboar Wild Charge vs. 204 HP / 248+ Def Vaporeon: 368-434 (81.4 - 96%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

A cool thing about Emboar is that it has no safe switchins on its Life Orb or Band sets. At all. Fatmence dies to Head Smash (which can easily fit on a set consisting of Flare Blitz / Grass Knot|Superpower / Head Smash / Sucker Punch), Suicune is 2HKOed by EB Wild Charge as well as LO Wild Charge, Superpower or Grass Knot, Slowking dies to Wild Charge after SR and actually takes a ton from Flare Blitz, Dragalge is 2HKOed by Flare Blitz and OHKOed by LO Head Smash...no switchins.

Scarf isn't too good in this metagame. While it can be a decent cleaner against Offense, it is often a liability against defensively-oriented teams since it lacks Trick or U-turn. Offense is also packed with faster Scarfers and Megas (notably Mega Aero) to stop it in its tracks.

I'll try to gather some replays of the wallbreaking sets in UU, but for now I'll just that I don't support unranking Emboar. I'll also see if SubPunch works as well in this tier as it does in OU, because that could be meaningful for it.

 

[Cactrune]

My issue with Emboar is that I fail to grasp just how much better it is than other Fire and Fighting-types, most notably Infernape. You can talk about how Emboar has very few switch-ins thanks to its excellent coverage, but Infernape has an almost identical set of options. It's got the same STAB Pairing, along with access to Grass Knot, a move to hit FatMence (Hidden Power Ice), Thunder Punch, Stone Edge, and multiple other options. Infernape is also faster, which can compensate for its weaker offensive stats, since it can just hit switch-ins on bulkier teams twice. What's more, Infernape has Nasty Plot and the lesser-used Swords Dance, arguably making it the better stallbreaker anyway since it can boost on a switch in, something that Emboar can't really do.

And it's not just Infernape that competes with Emboar. If you want a Fire-type that can bust some heads, you might as well use Choice Band or Life Orb Darmanitan, which does huge damage to most switch-ins while being faster and having similar coverage as well. Entei is less useless against faster Pokemon thanks to Extreme Speed, and it can cripple switch-ins or walls with the incredible Sacred Fire.

There are, of course, better Fighting-types as well, including Mienshao, Heracross, and Cobalion. Heracross in particular gives Emboar a run for its money; it can switch in on more things and smash many walls with the right move, all while outpacing more walls.

Basically, even though Emboar is strong and has few switch-ins and whatnot, the same can be said of better Pokemon that can potentially do more than what Emboar does. It's a cool niche pick, but the tier is already overflowing with Fire and Fighting-types that make Emboar a mediocre option at best. I would unrank Emboar if I were in charge of the thread, because I've never really seen it do anything that isn't already done well by the tier's best 'mons.

 

[Jaguar360]

My issue with Emboar is that I fail to grasp just how much better it is than other Fire and Fighting-types, most notably Infernape. You can talk about how Emboar has very few switch-ins thanks to its excellent coverage, but Infernape has an almost identical set of options. It's got the same STAB Pairing, along with access to Grass Knot, a move to hit FatMence (Hidden Power Ice), Thunder Punch, Stone Edge, and multiple other options. Infernape is also faster, which can compensate for its weaker offensive stats, since it can just hit switch-ins on bulkier teams twice. What's more, Infernape has Nasty Plot and the lesser-used Swords Dance, arguably making it the better stallbreaker anyway since it can boost on a switch in, something that Emboar can't really do.

And it's not just Infernape that competes with Emboar. If you want a Fire-type that can bust some heads, you might as well use Choice Band or Life Orb Darmanitan, which does huge damage to most switch-ins while being faster and having similar coverage as well. Entei is less useless against faster Pokemon thanks to Extreme Speed, and it can cripple switch-ins or walls with the incredible Sacred Fire.

There are, of course, better Fighting-types as well, including Mienshao, Heracross, and Cobalion. Heracross in particular gives Emboar a run for its money; it can switch in on more things and smash many walls with the right move, all while outpacing more walls.

Basically, even though Emboar is strong and has few switch-ins and whatnot, the same can be said of better Pokemon that can potentially do more than what Emboar does. It's a cool niche pick, but the tier is already overflowing with Fire and Fighting-types that make Emboar a mediocre option at best. I would unrank Emboar if I were in charge of the thread, because I've never really seen it do anything that isn't already done well by the tier's best 'mons.

That's a good argument; what you said is true for the most part. Where Emboar shines however, is its raw power. In a lot of cases, it doesn't even need to predict when it can simply overpower the opponent with the sheer force of Reckless Flare Blitz and Head Smash.

For instance, in this replay, Emboar is faced vs. a Milotic. In this position I can simply Head Smash for the kill and pretty much everything on the other side would get KOed if my opponent switched. Infernape wouldn't have been able to OHKO Milotic in that situation unless it got a high roll with Grass Knot on the NP set or got a decent roll on the Band set with Close Combat. Even, then Chandelure could have came in for free.

Essentially, that and Sucker Punch to an extent are what give Emboar a niche over Infernape essentially. It, like Pangoro, is one of the few mons capable of beating all of its checks in one set, while Infernape and the other Fighting and Fire types need multiple coverage moves that they cannot fit on one set (LO FB / Grass Knot / Head Smash 2HKOs this entire tier by itself with Emboar).

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/uu-267731347
Still low-ish ladder, but another good showing from Emboar. OHKOs Swampert right off the bat, outspeeds and OHKOs defensive Rotom-H with Head Smash. Sucker Punch could have KOed Mega Beedrill on a high roll, but I decided not go for it in case Venomoth did not completely outhax the opponent and sweep.