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OU Stats — January 2013

Discussion in 'BW OU' started by Harsha, Feb 1, 2013.

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  1. Lord of Bays

    Lord of Bays

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    Metagross has far better stats besides Defense and can actually stomach super effective hits. Head Smash does not a good Pokémon make; otherwise Aggron, Rampardos, and Archeops would actually be known quantities in OU. They are not, despite my deepest wishes that Archeops would get Rock Head and Brave Bird in BW2.

    Okay, I'm going to be honest and say I don't know why I replied to this post. Like, I get that Metagross is "bad" outside extreme niche conditions which he just so happens to fulfill in my team. But Aggron?

    [​IMG]
  2. MapleDoom

    MapleDoom

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    Aggron has a 4x weakness to fighting, and OU is infested with those things.
    Your argument is invalid.
  3. Bent1ey

    Bent1ey

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    I'm not even sure Aggron is exclusively bad because those pesky 4x weaknesses for Fighting and Ground... But also it's weak against the incredible common Water type!

    Most pokemon will be hardpressed not to have coverage that pwns Aggron. Unless they are oddballs like electric types or Volcarona.
  4. youngjake93

    youngjake93

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    He said he was using Choice Band Metagross in a niche situation to handle Outrage-locked dragons. Last I checked, Outrage is not a fighting type move.

    Bays, Aggron has Rock Head. So Head Smash is just like Stone Edge with an extra Choice Band boost.

    You said that Metagross is bad outside of extremely niche situations which include tanking Outrage and Hurricane. Why not use a pokemon that would perform better in those extremely niche situations if that is the only reason to use Metagross in the first place? Does it matter if it is even worse in other situations? You don't plan to use it for that anyway.

    Edit: YES I KNOW METAGROSS IS A LOT BETTER THAN AGGRON. The point is, the only reason to find a team slot for Metagross in OU is for things that Aggron can do better. Therefore, it makes sense to use Aggron for those things.
  5. Lavos Spawn

    Lavos Spawn
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    neither metagross nor aggron are good choices for ou. don't derail the thread.
  6. MapleDoom

    MapleDoom

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    Sorry, I didn't read his argument. Just caught "Aggron is better when using a Choice Band set" or something of the sort.
    After you deal with this "outrage locked dragon", Aggron is extremely easy to revenge kill due to people optimizing for head smash, which fighting resists. Not to mention, Mach Punch from a lot of pokes can easily kill. In that regard, Metagross can hit for neutral damage with Zen Heatbutt or Meteor Mash, while taking neutral damage from mach punch.

    Edit: ^^ I'm fully aware both suck in OU, but seriously. Metagross > Aggron
  7. Infernis

    Infernis

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    Even ignoring the fighting weakness, you have the fact that 199 Pokemon can learn Earthquake from TM26. Even goddamn Mantyke and Seviper get that move. And you know what? Seviper can OHKO with CB or Life Orb. Physical attacking Mantyke can easily 2HKO with a choice band. That is a serious flaw. Sure, you can run Air Balloon, but that removes your choice item from the equation, and things go from bad to worse for poor Aggron.

    (That said, Aggron looks pretty rad and is one of my favorite Gen 3 Pokemon. It's possibly based on Pulgasari, of all things.)
  8. Bent1ey

    Bent1ey

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    Aggron is as good in battling as Pulgasari is in mainstream culture.

    Anyways, I'm very happy Latias is finally getting the attention it deserved, and certainly not surprised to see Espeon so high -being the BP staple that it is-. Alakazam is overplayed without a doubt, and imo Reuniclus could stay in OU given that it has a proper niche. Haxorus almost dropping is not exactly a surprise considering the competition it gets from Kyurem-B... In UU it would get competition from Flygon, who actually outspeeds him, so it may not be a wreckball waiting to happen.
  9. Mario With Lasers

    Mario With Lasers Self-proclaimed DEAD king
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    Those ARE the "1337 stats". From now on, the stats will be all weighted.

    so welp

    (and seriously, go read that thread, your numbers are ridiculously off)
  10. G-Von

    G-Von

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    Thank you Antar for the monthly stats.

    | 13 | Keldeo| 11.48675% | 81733 | 8.598% | 61302 | 8.001% |

    Oh shit, this was probably boosted by the suspect ladder, but at least its getting usage is deserves finally.

    22 | Landorus-Therian| 8.67255% | 62606 | 6.586% | 54159 | 7.069% |

    You know, I thought this thing would have a chance at falling to UU after seeing it's low usage last month, and now its getting even more love than Thundy-T.

    28 | Latias| 7.34539% | 57202 | 6.018% | 44866 | 5.856% |

    Holy fuckballs this thing jumped in usage. Possibly because of the suspect Keldeo running rampant so I guess we will just have to wait and see how these two will do now that the spotlight isn't completely centered around using/countering Keldeo.

    30 | Infernape| 7.18132% | 75695 | 7.963% | 60746 | 7.929% |
    31 | Venusaur| 7.08539% | 66773 | 7.024% | 51400 | 6.709% |

    This sickens me. I am not an Infernape hater at all, but Venusaur's usage should be equal to Ninetales' usage. There is no reason to have a Venusaur outside of Sun and no reason to build a Sun team without V-saur.

    40 | Cloyster| 6.21587% | 76972 | 8.097% | 59463 | 7.761% |

    what. the. fuck. I guess I'm the only player who doesn't hate on this damn thing. Granted, I haven't used it in forever but god damn it...

    52 | Reuniclus| 4.25971% | 40334 | 4.243% | 31530 | 4.115% |
    53 | Haxorus| 3.89987% | 41675 | 4.384% | 31412 | 4.100% |

    [​IMG]
    ^THAT is how I feel. Seriously, how the fuck did that happen? Reuniclus's Calm Room/Trick Mind/whateverthefuckyouwannacallit pwns everything to the point where you need to simply let Trick Room run it's course. Haxorus honestly would become BL. There is no way in the kingdom of fuckdom that it can stay in UU with pokemon like Ambipom. Base 97 speed is too fast since there's a ton of Base 95 speed stats down there. I don't want it to become BL though because Charizard will probably start seeing more use than the most powerful Outrage user -_______________- (not really but with Rivalry it can be stronger).

    63 | Tornadus| 1.85984% | 15603 | 1.641% | 12073 | 1.576% |

    With it's Therian forme's banishment to Ubers, this should become OU again.

    64 | Chandelure| 1.80123% | 22906 | 2.410% | 18408 | 2.403% |

    My dream of this ever being OU will probably never happen =/ it simply fucks over so many things with that typing though.

    69 | Mew| 1.62351% | 17484 | 1.839% | 14620 | 1.908% |
    70 | Darmanitan| 1.61538% | 15896 | 1.672% | 12713 | 1.659% |

    Is it me or did these 2 just drop in usage? Mew would be lol69.

    86 | Charizard| 1.12861% | 19020 | 2.001% | 15146 | 1.977% |
    87 | Scrafty| 1.12620% | 14251 | 1.499% | 11289 | 1.473% |
    88 | Snorlax| 1.09556% | 17841 | 1.877% | 14474 | 1.889% |
    89 | Azelf| 1.07027% | 9557 | 1.005% | 8571 | 1.119% |
    90 | Sandslash| 1.01543% | 8112 | 0.853% | 5901 | 0.770% |

    Yea, um, whatthefuckbro? None of these pokemon should be lower than Charizard. I'm not the biggest fan of Scrafty but god damn this thing just went straight down in usage. It used to be OU for crying out loud. Azelf can be a threatening force with Nasty Plot and great speed, Sandslash has it's Sand Rush niche, and Snorlax can wreck shit whether its in Trick Room with or without Curse, or with a Choice Band.

    112 | Sigilyph| 0.59913% | 7528 | 0.792% | 5839 | 0.762% |

    Another personal favorite of mine, but has it's usage always been around this area? I figured it would be a lot lower than 112. I would personally love to see this thing move up a tier or 2.

    176 | Riolu| 0.19564% | 2774 | 0.292% | 2075 | 0.271% |

    Fuck all you trolls.

    188 | Mandibuzz| 0.16042% | 2178 | 0.229% | 1734 | 0.226% |

    I'm pretty sure this moved up about 30 spots! Once Q3 starts I'm gonna spam the shit out of this bulky ass vulture to feast on the remains of noobs.
  11. Bent1ey

    Bent1ey

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    That's a pretty redundant think to say, considering any pokemon that's even half OU worthy should be higher than Charizard. Unless they are Chlorophyll/Swift Swim abusers or some niche as such.
  12. Gary2346

    Gary2346 A filthy casual
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    | 52 | Reuniclus | 4.25971% | 40334 | 4.243% | 31530 | 4.115% |

    I must say WHY?? Genesect is gone, and once Scizor is out for the count, this thing is amazing! It's Trick Room set is better than it's CM set IMO because it can out speed the entire offensive part of the tier and has near perfect coverage with Psychic / Focus Blast / Shadow Ball. It's just so sad to see Reuniclus tearing apart teams with ease and not getting enough credit for it. This floating fetus needs more love. This is what everyone should be thinking:

    [​IMG]
  13. Lavos Spawn

    Lavos Spawn
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    the reason reuniclus is down so much in usage is simply that everyone in january was running sdef wish rachi to check tornadus-t. this particular rachi set walls reuniclus all day, bar several focus blast crits. also, while it's true that once scizor is gone reuniclus can sometimes clean up easily, it's also not a very likely scenario. if i see reun in team preview and i know my only decent check to the thing is my scizor, i am not going to let sciz die until reun goes down first. that's basic threat management. finally, reuniclus often finds itself in a situation where it has a window to sweep, but it isn't powerful enough to ohko some stuff, and therefore its sweep is cut short. for example, max spa life orb quiet reun's shadow ball doesn't even ko latios after rocks, meaning it lives the hit and then fires off a specs draco meteor for the ohko on reun. not a winning strategy for the tr user.

    in summation, reuniclus's day has come and gone. what once used to be an ou powerhouse can now barely function in the current metagame. sure, it has its niche uses, but they are few and far between.
  14. LucaroarkZ

    LucaroarkZ

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    Lol, my numbers being "off?" I took my numbers for rain/sand/sun/hail usage directly from this thread and rounded them to the nearest whole number to get my approximation for weather usage. My approximation for how many bad players there were may have been off, but I was exaggerating. Why is exaggeration a concept so difficult to understand? While I admit I did not know these stats were weighted at first, I went ahead and read the thread and found that from how this works, this only considers the probability that a player's rating is at a certain point, so the bad players are never fully weeded out unless you use a higher rating for the weighting. For example, from the thread:

    So yeah, they clearly still get counted, and proof of this fact that Charizard is at #86 in usage. I guarantee you that if we fully weeded them out, Charizard would be nowhere near that high because find me a competent player who actually uses Charizard. Also, for whatever reason, many of these bad players with bad teams STILL have ACRE's of around 1200-1300, and as this thread told us, there's about a 92% chance that a player's "true rating" is higher than their ACRE.

    Also, can I just say that "Don't look much different" =/= "Not at all different"? We don't know what those stats look like. For all we know, weatherless could have slightly less usage with differently weighted stats, and Scizor/Politoed could have slightly higher usage! So.... Let's not talk about stats with a different weighting when we don't know what they actually look like.
  15. alexwolf

    alexwolf King of Conquerors
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    You don't even need to prepare for Cloyster, as it is easy to check, and sometimes easy to counter as well. I mentioned many common Pokemon that prevent him from sweeping, such as Jirachi, Politoed, bulky Rotom-W, and Keldeo, while a fuckton of other Pokemon are very good checks, such as Scarf Latios, Heatran in Sun, Venusaur in Sun, Mach Punch Breloom, and even CB Scizor if Cloyster uses Life Orb. The only kind of team that can make Cloyster a bit threatening is a Dual Screen Rain team with hazards down, but this is honestly too much support, under which many other sweepers could function even better. So it has a niche, but it is very small, and imo doesn't justify such a large usage. It doesn't help that most people that i see defending Cloyster are not particularly good players or don't make convincing arguments (generally talking, don't take this personally).

    Also Lavos i really disagree with you about Reuniclus. The Trick Room set is still thretening as always, after its checks are weakened a bit, and with its great bulk and immunity to any kind of passive damage it can sweep even with a sliver of its life left. It is still a good failsafe Pokemon to use on offensive teams, as it can simply set up against too many Pokemon. It can set up on Keldeo's unboosted Hydro Pump in rain, +2 Venusaur, and Specs Tornadus's Hurricane, which shows how many setup opoortunities Reuniclus gets to clean weakened offensive and balanced teams. Not the best Pokemon in OU, but definitely not worse than Infernape, Metagross, and Donphan. 35-45 would be the best position for it. However, it is true that its former killer set, the CM set, is now almost impossible to use in this fast paced and hard hitting enviroment, where stall teams and setup opportunites are scarce.
  16. Gary2346

    Gary2346 A filthy casual
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    Yeah what you're saying is true, however there are ways to get around the 2HKOs, such as hazard support. It's definitely a shame when Reuniclus can't OHKO something that could possibly threaten it back, however with Spikes and Stealth Rocks most of the meta game can't survive any of its moves unless packing some resistance or some serious SpD. TR Reuniclus is pretty anti meta though, so if used in the right hands he can be an amazing clean up. I disagree that he's seen his days in OU since he's still perfectly viable, but I do agree that he doesn't strike fear in the hearts of many like he used to.
  17. Worldtour

    Worldtour aka Swamp-Rocket
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    It would have been at a much higher 66th if it weren't for these stats. In the end it really doesn't freaking matter with the whole 1337 stats vs these stats - when you get very high on the ladder you tend to see the same team repeatedly, as in a large majority of the teams are just cut/paste Rain teams.
  18. Charro

    Charro

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    | 4 | Jirachi | 16.99764% | 132749 | 13.965% | 109403 | 14.280% |

    Jirachi in 4th p_p, don't get me wrong, I f- love Jirachi, but the only reason why it was used so much was because of Tornadus-T, who ironically wasn't used that much, I guess people foresaw it becoming Uber and decided to not abuse it (almost every team I have seen that thing was the typical lame Latios, Rachi, Tentacruel, Thorna, Politoed staple)

    | 5 | Dragonite | 16.30085% | 152001 | 15.990% | 118567 | 15.476%

    I swear I never see this (incrediblyhandsomebestpokemonever) thing o_o

    | 6 | Heatran | 15.59981% | 128656 | 13.535% | 105070 | 13.714% |

    spD Heatran was a staple on my teams latetly, incredibly awesome thing, mine took a Surf from Starmie in rain at less than 80 % hp D:

    35 | Celebi | 6.48850% | 52288 | 5.501% | 42857 | 5.594% |

    Hope this cute onion-headed fairy get used more from now on, NP is great

    33 | Landorus | 6.93382% | 49763 | 5.235% | 38664 | 5.047% |

    This thing should be top 10, seriously, it wrecks soooo much shit, I got like 1700 cre in 1 day after two years without playing by just slapping Lando on one of my teams, it's so good.
  19. Hiphopanonymous

    Hiphopanonymous

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    1 | Scizor | 23.15972% | 191970 | 20.195% | 151871 | 19.823%

    Not surprised. Can't use Sci for shit but I think this is completely deserved.

    | 30 | Infernape | 7.18132% | 75695 | 7.963% | 60746 | 7.929%

    Brb crying.

    35 | Celebi | 6.48850% | 52288 | 5.501% | 42857 | 5.594%

    Needs moar. Love this lil onionhead.

    OH GNOZ BASE 170 ATK
    42 | Kyurem-Black | 5.71378% | 49518 | 5.209% | 37469 | 4.891%
    ^^Yup, so scared. It's pretty good, It's just...so many flaws...

    49 | Metagross | 4.43290% | 51659 | 5.435% | 42233 | 5.512%

    I love Meta, but...seriously. It's higher than Dugtrio, who is far more useful, imo.

    52 | Reuniclus | 4.25971% | 40334 | 4.243% | 31530 | 4.115%

    This thing NEVER ceases to destroy me. It's usage is kinda good for me, but it should be higher.

    60 | Weavile | 2.17637% | 23832 | 2.507% | 18614 | 2.430%

    Another thing that has low usage, yet pounds me at every given opportunity. People need to look into Weavile a little more, me thinks.

    86 | Charizard | 1.12861% | 19020 | 2.001% | 15146 | 1.977%

    .....I...I don't even...how do I oxygen?

    100 | Virizion | 0.81183% | 7433 | 0.782% | 5818 | 0.759%

    Wow. Such a fall. This saddens me. I think another "Brb crying" is in order.

    Anyways, enough of my opinions, any opinions on who actually deserved their usage?
  20. alexwolf

    alexwolf King of Conquerors
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    I don't like to reapeat myself but i have to:

    And this is not all. Tentacruel, Skarmory, Forretress with Volt Switch, and Jellicent are all very good checks/counters, in addition to the Pokemon that i already mentioned.

    All those checks and counters, in addition to the lack of any special bulk, common weaknesses to Fighting and Rock type moves, which are everywhere, and SR weaknesses really prevent Cloyster from being more than a very situational Pokemon at best. I know it can work if you pair it with SubPass Gliscor (ask Ginga about it) and it can rarely work if you put it in a rain HO team with hazard support, but as i said before many Pokemon can perform admirably and even better than Cloyster with this much support. So while Cloyster is not bad per se, it is just a niche Pokemon that has unrightfully a lot of usage compared to its usefulness. Here are some Pokemon that are overall better than Cloyster in OU, but are below him in usage: Toxicroak, Lucario, Kyurem-Black, Hydreigon, Hippowdon, Victini, Xatu, and Dugtrio.
  21. IstheCakeReallyaLie

    IstheCakeReallyaLie

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    oh god cancer is invading Smogon everybody run

    Anyway:

    All dat useful stuff below In-Fer-Rape.

    Despite using a cancer caption image, Gary is right. Reun is underrated.
  22. Wizarus

    Wizarus

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    Surprised to see Hippo at 50, it's way too low IMO. I see Tornadus is at 63, I think it might get in 50 range by the next month.
  23. Jukain

    Jukain fuck redew
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    Jirachi was not only used because of Tornadus-T. Jirachi is a monster of a Pokemon. SubCM sets up and sweeps really easily, it can pass Wishes, hax its opponents to death, check numerous threats, provide SR, revenge kill! the list goes on. Obviously not all at the same time, but Jirachi deserves its usage.

    I'm actually a little surprised Kyurem-B is so low; it's really good. Don't make fun of that Attack stat, you don't even need to invest in it for Kyurem-B to be powerful. It's really bulky too, with great defenses across the board. Don't forget its Fire neutrality, Ice neutrality, and Water resistance. The SubShuffler set in particular has been working best for me atm, as it can demolish slower teams and is overall a menace. Just slap on some hazards and you're good to go. It's almost impossible to phaze out without Roar Latias, and Dragon Tail is pretty powerful even with minimal investment.

    Celebi is also much too low, being one of the best rain checks in the market, not to mention the increasing Keldeo usage. It's got a massive niche in this metagame, and should have received a boost with the Tornadus-T banning.

    and @above on Haxorus... you do realize that Haxorus can demolish those Pokemon, right? With the exception of maybe Registeel (who is not at all good in UU) and Bronzong, CB Outrage demolishes pretty much the entire UU tier. However, I wouldn't be surprised if it dropped. Haxorus is by no means a bad Pokemon, boasting a devastating sweeping ability, but it's not what is used to be.
  24. Machi

    Machi

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    Even Bronzong becomes shakier at dealing with Hax thanks to moldbreaker EQ negating Zong's levitate. But its defenses would be what need to be considered if it does drop down to UU since that tends to be its weakness, and thank god its not Hydregion because seeing that thing in action at PO was a nightmare (that thing not only had good defenses but Levitate to boot and roost to easily mitigate hazard damage so wearing it out was not easy).
  25. Antar

    Antar That's Dr. Antar to you
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    I know Mario With Lasers already pointed this out, but I still feel the need to respond to a bit in this thread in light of:

    The main thing to note is that weatherless usage is likely to be a bit lower than before, because fewer "newbies" use weather teams.


    These ARE NOT "1337" stats--these are "no trolls and newbies" stats. For OU, especially, this should more accurately reflect the metagame you should be experiencing, since Pokemon Showdown tries not to match players with wildly different ratings.

    "1337" stats would move the bar WAAAY up, so that only exceptionally good players would have their teams counted. The fact that my test runs of "1337" stats (actually "1850" and "2200" stats, if you want to be technical) turned out just speaks to the quality of most of our OU players.
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