Yes but it also acts as a full Rotom-W stop and one who is able to act as an offensive mon (unlike Lanturn) :D
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Project OU Theorymon [Voting: Check Post #3272]
- Thread starter bb skarm
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Yes but it also acts as a full Rotom-W stop and one who is able to act as an offensive mon (unlike Lanturn) :D
Y'know what else is a full Rotom-W stop? Goodra.
Ya know what is a penguin? Empoleon.
If you switch Empoleon on Rotom doing... anything, you get a free defog/layer of rocks/agility/knock off... you could even Feather Dance a physical attacker who thinks they can force you out if you want: you literally have that much freedom.
You literally get a free turn to outright ruin the opponent. While Empoleon can't do too much to Rotom (Grass Knot is out-damaged by Scald,) it doesn't need to as it can safely play a support mon if you need one.
As I think about it, this might sound stupid... I would probably never want to outright KILL Rotom until I no longer need to get a 100% safe Empoleon switch. The more alive it remains, the more chances I have to Knock Off items or burn switch ins, or replace SR.
If I were a player and not just an idea crafter, I can only rarely see myself without SR, Knock Off or Scald, let alone all three.
You literally get a free turn to outright ruin the opponent. While Empoleon can't do too much to Rotom (Grass Knot is out-damaged by Scald,) it doesn't need to as it can safely play a support mon if you need one.
As I think about it, this might sound stupid... I would probably never want to outright KILL Rotom until I no longer need to get a 100% safe Empoleon switch. The more alive it remains, the more chances I have to Knock Off items or burn switch ins, or replace SR.
If I were a player and not just an idea crafter, I can only rarely see myself without SR, Knock Off or Scald, let alone all three.
Well as a player AND an idea crafter, I'll say this much: Goodra will never be situational.
While I truly do like everything on the slate, I simply think Goodra will make the largest impact on the metagame, and that largely goes to how it will be a factor in every game--very similar to Greninja. That's why Goodra's getting my vote--because it'll make the single most interesting splash out of the 4 we've slated.
While I truly do like everything on the slate, I simply think Goodra will make the largest impact on the metagame, and that largely goes to how it will be a factor in every game--very similar to Greninja. That's why Goodra's getting my vote--because it'll make the single most interesting splash out of the 4 we've slated.
Protean Goodra: I'm liking this idea. With such an expansive movepool, Goodra has all the coverage that Greninja would kill for, including Focus Blast, Thunderbolt, Flamethrower, and Sludge Bomb, along with powerful physical attacks, such as Earthquake, Power Whip, Iron Tail, and Aqua Tail, so Goodra isn't running short on coverage anytime soon. The only problem here is that the opponent can take advantage of Goodra's Protean since it's slow, so they can take advantage of the type change before it attacks. Other than that, I have no complaints.
Healing Wish Klefki: This could be a life saver in a battle thanks to Prankster. With a +1 priority instant-healing move, Klefki could turn the tide of battle instantly, going from an uphill struggle to smooth sailing. Even if you don't use it to heal someone, providing a safe switch after setting up screens or Spikes could serve a huge role for the team. Loving this idea right now, and I can definitely see this one winning.
Lightning Rod Empoleon: Man, we really hate Rotom-W, don't we? First we get Mega Sceptile, which basically forces Rotom-W to run Hidden Power Ice, and now we could get this, something that doesn't care about anything Rotom-W throws its way aside from Will-O-Wisp and maybe Pain Split. This can also take on Mega Manectric and Thunderbolt Latios flawlessly now, as their Electric-type moves could threaten Empoleon previously, so countering those threats is pretty good news. Pretty solid.
Levitate Doublade: This one's actually pretty sweet. At first I thought little of it, but when I realized that this can now take on Landorus, Landorus-T, Sand Rush Excadrill, Mamoswine, and Diggersby perfectly (except for the former two, since Knock Off and stuff), some powerful hard hitters that can give stall a hard time, I saw a lot of promise for this Theorymon. Doublade is already pretty popular for stall teams, but now it performs its role even better with its new Ground immunity. Another Theorymon that I can definitely see winning.
Healing Wish Klefki: This could be a life saver in a battle thanks to Prankster. With a +1 priority instant-healing move, Klefki could turn the tide of battle instantly, going from an uphill struggle to smooth sailing. Even if you don't use it to heal someone, providing a safe switch after setting up screens or Spikes could serve a huge role for the team. Loving this idea right now, and I can definitely see this one winning.
Lightning Rod Empoleon: Man, we really hate Rotom-W, don't we? First we get Mega Sceptile, which basically forces Rotom-W to run Hidden Power Ice, and now we could get this, something that doesn't care about anything Rotom-W throws its way aside from Will-O-Wisp and maybe Pain Split. This can also take on Mega Manectric and Thunderbolt Latios flawlessly now, as their Electric-type moves could threaten Empoleon previously, so countering those threats is pretty good news. Pretty solid.
Levitate Doublade: This one's actually pretty sweet. At first I thought little of it, but when I realized that this can now take on Landorus, Landorus-T, Sand Rush Excadrill, Mamoswine, and Diggersby perfectly (except for the former two, since Knock Off and stuff), some powerful hard hitters that can give stall a hard time, I saw a lot of promise for this Theorymon. Doublade is already pretty popular for stall teams, but now it performs its role even better with its new Ground immunity. Another Theorymon that I can definitely see winning.
Alright folks, I'm posting again, so you know what that means…VOTING!
Please refer to the ballot below when you cast your votes:
Goodra + Protean
As always, I am voting for the one I believe will shake up the tier the most. Goodra, with its now ridiculous STAB coverage and bulk, will basically skullf**k its way to the top of the viability rankings.
I'd type up a campaign for Goodra, but you see--Kings don't need campaigns. They just take what is rightfully theirs.
Please refer to the ballot below when you cast your votes:
- Goodra + Protean
- Klefki + Healing Wish
- Empoleon + Lightningrod
- Doublade + Levitate
Goodra + Protean
As always, I am voting for the one I believe will shake up the tier the most. Goodra, with its now ridiculous STAB coverage and bulk, will basically skullf**k its way to the top of the viability rankings.
I'd type up a campaign for Go
Empoleon+Lightning rod
I want moderately defensive buffs, the meta is offensive enough I guess
I want moderately defensive buffs, the meta is offensive enough I guess
Goodra + Protean
Doublade + Levitate
because i miss aegislash
because i miss aegislash
Empoleon + Lightningrod
Screw Rotom wash.
Screw Rotom wash.
I can think of a ton of faster, stronger, boosting or more support capable abusers of Protean. Gengar, being a moldable ghost, would have far more impact. Blissey? Do I even need to say how changing type to suit your pink blob needs is bad?
What if we gave it to one of the genies? I'm sure these clouds of wispy smoke would love it, Tornadus especially. Faster and with more concinse coverage and still form adaptable. Or what of Mew? Mew can do ANYTHING, it should be able to BE anything.
The long and the short of it is, when people start to suggest these Proteans, you'll wonder why you even looked at Goodra to begin with other than because it's the first of its ilk... and you'll hang your head in shame.
How many steel types can you give Volt Absorb to and still let them handle or set up on Magnezone, Rotom Wash and the offensive electric types most often used and putting a decent hamper on rain teams that use Thunder, and isn't too bad against certain birdspam?
Lightningrod Empoleon is literally one of the safest ways to get rocks up because it does something no other mon can: it makes its enemies suffer because their RotomW is always a free switch in. That's right: abuse the fact that Rotom Wash must switch out! As he goes, the next target deals with spikes, knock off or Scald... and if the enemy doesn't ever switch Rotom in out of fear... is that not a way to help you win?
What if we gave it to one of the genies? I'm sure these clouds of wispy smoke would love it, Tornadus especially. Faster and with more concinse coverage and still form adaptable. Or what of Mew? Mew can do ANYTHING, it should be able to BE anything.
The long and the short of it is, when people start to suggest these Proteans, you'll wonder why you even looked at Goodra to begin with other than because it's the first of its ilk... and you'll hang your head in shame.
How many steel types can you give Volt Absorb to and still let them handle or set up on Magnezone, Rotom Wash and the offensive electric types most often used and putting a decent hamper on rain teams that use Thunder, and isn't too bad against certain birdspam?
Lightningrod Empoleon is literally one of the safest ways to get rocks up because it does something no other mon can: it makes its enemies suffer because their RotomW is always a free switch in. That's right: abuse the fact that Rotom Wash must switch out! As he goes, the next target deals with spikes, knock off or Scald... and if the enemy doesn't ever switch Rotom in out of fear... is that not a way to help you win?
Protean Goodra
And to the people voting for empoleon because they want a defensive buff, who do you think will benefit from rock setters most?
And to the people voting for empoleon because they want a defensive buff, who do you think will benefit from rock setters most?
You guys do realize how pointless it is to vote for Empoleon on the grounds of Rotom-W. If you're looking for the perfect counter to Rotom-W, give Gastrodon a try. It flat out takes zero damage. Oh wait--I forgot--countering Rotom-W is a ridiculous niche, and actually doesn't contribute that much to our metagame. As far as Defoggers that can switch in on Rotom-W, say hi to Latias.
As for Goodra not deserving Protean...um what the fuck? It literally has one of the best move pools in the game. Not to mention respectable power and decent bulk. The speed is such a non issue. When you have power and bulk you don't need it (see Mega Heracross).
So please, leave that Goodra isn't even good bullshit out of this.
As for Goodra not deserving Protean...um what the fuck? It literally has one of the best move pools in the game. Not to mention respectable power and decent bulk. The speed is such a non issue. When you have power and bulk you don't need it (see Mega Heracross).
So please, leave that Goodra isn't even good bullshit out of this.
Empoleon isn't only useful for countering Rotom-W. Sure, outside of things with immunities to both STABs, Empoleon is probably the best switch in. However, it's also an amazing switch in to so much more than that, so just because other mons are better switch ins to Rotom-w specifically, they are still so different. (Gastrodon =/= LightningrodEmp)
As for Goodra, if it weren't on the same slate as Empoleon, I would probably vote for it. I guess the main issue with Protean is that it can't quite abuse it as well as, say Greninja since it lacks the speed to scare lots of the faster dragons/flying/whatever out IMO at least. Then again, Goodra has overwhelmingly superior bulk and better defensive starting typing, providing a new way to abuse protean. It has the stats and typing to take a decently strong hit (unlike greninja) and retaliate with a very strong attack in return.
As for Goodra, if it weren't on the same slate as Empoleon, I would probably vote for it. I guess the main issue with Protean is that it can't quite abuse it as well as, say Greninja since it lacks the speed to scare lots of the faster dragons/flying/whatever out IMO at least. Then again, Goodra has overwhelmingly superior bulk and better defensive starting typing, providing a new way to abuse protean. It has the stats and typing to take a decently strong hit (unlike greninja) and retaliate with a very strong attack in return.
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I'm not saying Emp is bad. I'm saying it's very situational and team matchup based. Outside of picking up +1 boosts (or with volt absorb getting a heal and still not doing much) and Defog, it really doesn't do much. Yes--it can fish for Scald burns, but aside from that it's extremely passive.
Goodra not only has plenty of switch in opportunities, but it's always a factor in the game. Dragon typing is excellent for switching in. Not to mention how aggressive Goodra is. It simply is better than Empoleon. Hell--Doublade is better, but it's had (almost) no love this go round.
I'm not saying people can't vote for Emp, I'm saying that a lot of the reasons behind those votes are flawed.
Goodra not only has plenty of switch in opportunities, but it's always a factor in the game. Dragon typing is excellent for switching in. Not to mention how aggressive Goodra is. It simply is better than Empoleon. Hell--Doublade is better, but it's had (almost) no love this go round.
I'm not saying people can't vote for Emp, I'm saying that a lot of the reasons behind those votes are flawed.
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