OU

[Snypar]

*Old team is old*

Made this team ago some time ago and when it was new it worked however I stopped playing and then after a short break decided to use this team again. So far from what I've seen it don't work any more or it don't work as it use to but anyway... *Some of the descriptions may sound weird, this was meant to be posted before but I decided not to but I have brushed up on them but if they sound weird this is why.*

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252 HP / 168 DEF / 88 SP.DEF

Impish

~Leftovers~

- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Ice Fang
- Slack Off


I needed something to set up Rocks but not be a Suicude Lead, I had T-Tar lead but it didn't work for me. Had Swampert and it was the same problem, it set up SR but it didn't have a purpose or it didn't really fit in. I was going to give in and choose a Suicide lead when I met this Hippo, it SR's, sets up SS (not really a necessity but still...) and it will have something to do later on the battle. Earthquake is for STAB and Ice Fang hits Flygon but Salamence more importantly. Slack Off restores it's mighty HP.


How it helps Lucario

Hippowdon helps not only Luke but the team by setting up rocks. It also beats Mence (Not switching in Draco Meteor) and Flygon who tend to stop Luke sweeps. It creates sandstorm which many people have said is needed for a Luke sweep.

252 HP / 160 ATK / 84 DEF / 14 SP.DEF

Adamant

~Leftovers~

~No Guard~

- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Dynamic Punch
- Stone Edge

My first choice for this role has returned, after a suggestion that was given I felt that Hitmontop was a real let down, it didn't have enough power so after considering the rate that was given I felt that it would be beneficial to replace Top with this. I saw this spread somewhere (Think it was Synrals spread) so I decided to use that, with rocks a 2HKO on standard Zapdos is guaranteed where Zapdos can only manage a 3HKO on me.


How it helps Lucario

Machamp is the statues absorber. It counters T-Tar with little trouble, it also hits hard...Machamp does something Hitmontop couldn't and that was to actually dent the opposing team, this helps my other Pokes to have a easier time when looking to create a opening for a Luke sweep.

248 HP / 252 ATK / 8 SPEED

Adamant

~Choice Band~

- U-Turn
- Bullet Punch
- Pursuit
- Superpower


CB Scizor makes a return. I chose this because the things that counter Luke also counter this, Gliscor / Gyara / ScarfTran etc so this help me scout the opposing teams and generally know who they'll use to counter Luke and I can play accordingly.


How it helps Lucario

Scizor helps Lucario by luring in Magnezones, Gyarados, Mence and at times Gliscors and while I U-Turn and go to one of there counters it helps eliminate there Luke counter. Scizor is what I call the "Scouter" I often find that most of there switch in's to Scizor are Lucario counters / revenge killers so this is one of the main Pokes of this team.

104 HP/ 180 SpA/ 224 Spe

Modest

~Choice Scarf~

- Overheat
- Thunderbolt
- Shadow Ball
- Trick

One of the trickiest Pokes to use in this team, it requires a whole load of prediction as if I bring it out early I never EVER attack. To many T-Tar's just waiting to come in and Pursuit one of my main Pokes. This is the Luke counter / revenge killer, it also beats of Jirachi and Metagross leads. Against Metagross I often switch to this first, the case is when I go into Rotom expecting Explosion, I dodge then they to T-Tar and I'm dead so more times then often their Suicide leads stay alive. =( Ev spread has been tweaked to add more bulk. (Thanks to Giga Pimpact)


How it helps Lucario

Rotom helps take care of opposing Lucario and some Pokes that can survive a SD Close Combat. It also stops Gliscor in it's tracks, Gliscor don't counter Luke if it's stuck on a Scarf Stone Edge.

252 HP / 252 DEF / 4 SPEED

Bold

~Leftovers~

- Surf
- Hidden Power (Electric)
- Wish
- Protect


Vapreon, my Gyarados and Infernape counter. I went 252 / 252 since Ape can 2HKO with Rocks sets up with Close Combat with the standard spread and that was the reason I chose this over Celebi. Wish can also heal up Scizor and Rotom-H which in the long run helps. It also counters Heatran which was another factor over Celebi.


How it helps Lucario

Vaporeons job is to take care on Ape but it's main job is to keep Scizor and Rotom healthy with Wish. If Scizor or Rotom dies the battle gets difficult since both are needed to help eliminate Lucario counters.

252 ATK / 252 SPEED / 4 DEF

Adamant

~Life Orb~

- Swords Dance
- Close Combat
- Crunch
- Extreme Speed


The star of the show...SD Luke. Most players have answers for this but when the team around it is played correctly there's not much they can do.

How it helps Lucario

It's Lucario.






~Conclusion~

So yeah, constrictive rates and offer reasoning for change. :)




~Final Glance~

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[franky]

Problems:

DD Salamence (minor)
Lead slot

How to fix:

Hippowdon is a great physical wall but the sandstorm is hindering almost half of your team, but in your descriptions, it says that you want something bulky, but not suicide. I would suggest Swampert in that place, which fits right in because it checks DD Salamence nicely.

Swampert
@ Leftovers
Relaxed Nature (Def+ / Spe-)
252 HP / 252 Def / 6 SpA

- Ice Beam
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock
- Roar

This is a great addition to the team, which doesn't need the stream but still maintains the Ground-typing to wall Electric-type attacks. Ice Beam will KO Salamence after you lay down one SR and Earthquake smashes Tyranitar mainly (but thats not really a concern right now) Roar is a phazing move to blow rack up SR damage mainly. Gl, solid team.

 

[Snypar]

Thanks for the rate. I'll test our Pert over Hippo. More rates are welcomed. =]

 

[haunter]

@Franky: Hippowdon has better overall physical Defence than Swampert, and having ice fang to deal with Mence, I don't see why he should replace it with Swampert. Sandstorm may actually help his team dealing with DD Mence (bringing it faster in the BP kill range), and the only Pokemon that is really damaged by sandstom is Vaporeon due to its high HP stat. Anyway, DD Mence is not really a problem for this team considering that a CB Scizor bullet punch does 59.21% - 69.79% to it, meaning that after SR, life orb and one turn of sandstorm damage it can be easily revenge killed by Scizor, if needed. Mixmence is a little more troublesome, but that's a weakness almost every team has, considering that a sure counter for Mence does not exist.

This team is very solid, should you lose Vaporeon you would be slightly weak to mix-Ape, but even then, Lucario and Rotom can revenge kill it. Offensive Celebi with hidden power fire may be hard to handle, but you can get rid of them if you predict correctly with Scizor and Rotom. The only change I would make is switching Lucario's nature to adamant, giving it crunch over ice punch: an adamant nature is required to score some important OHKO after a SD, Pokemon like Swampert have no chance to survive a +2 close combat when using adamant, instead with a jolly nature the OHKO is not guaranteed, also you need an adamant nature to have an almost guaranteed OHKO on Latias with a +2 ES. Definitely Lucario needs a positive nature to be an effective wall breaker. Crunch is almost always better than ice punch for 2 reasons: it allows you to OHKO defensive Rotom after a SD, and since Gliscor often run a jolly nature and enough EVs to outspeed jolly Lucario, ice punch has little uses.

Good luck!

 

[franky]

@haunter

It could go both ways, the sandstorm can help take down salamence, but at the same time, Sandstorm will hinder Rotom and such. SR + Sandstorm + U-turn from Scizor or a predicted Crunch from Lucario can bring it down too fast. But it could go two ways, you could try both I guess. Swampert is still capable of walling it but without hindering his walls.

 

[Snypar]

After a little testing I find Hippo suits the team more.

@ Haunter ; I should run Adamant. Why did I run Jolly?

With the Rotom and sandstorm I find passing Wish is not that difficult so I don't find that a problem.

Thanks for rate. =)

 

[haunter]

@haunter

It could go both ways, the sandstorm can help take down salamence, but at the same time, Sandstorm will hinder Rotom and such. SR + Sandstorm + U-turn from Scizor or a predicted Crunch from Lucario can bring it down too fast. But it could go two ways, you could try both I guess. Swampert is still capable of walling it but without hindering his walls.

Yes, it can go both ways, though my point was that replacing Hippowdon with Swampert is not really necessary. By the way, Scizor is not exactly a problem for this team, cause the only Pokemon it can switch in safely is Scizor locked itno pursuit, and Hippowdon itself counters it decently. About Lucario: again, Hippowdon counters it way better than Swampert, having access to a reliable recovery move and taking "only" 85% on average by a +2 close combat from Luke (or even less if Luke is jolly), meaning that unlike Swampert it can actually surivive the hit and KO back with EQ. That's all.

The only valid point for using Swampert would be just to add a second check for scarf-Heatran, but I don't know if it's enough to replace Hippowdon on this team.

 

[Snypar]

Bumping one last time in hope of some rates. =)

 

[Snypar]

One last bump. Please rate this. =/