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Gen 1 RBY Research Thread

Discussion in 'Ruins of Alph' started by rory, Feb 22, 2010.

  1. rory

    rory T^T
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

    Oct 13, 2007
    In the (hopefully near) future, old generations will need to be implemented in a simulator. At the moment there is not enough information to simulate these generations with 100% accuracy. Formulas exist at upokecenter.com but they really need to be confirmed / corrected before we use them. Below are some formulas that I think we should tackle first. When proving a formula I'd like to see the data and math you used to prove it, so be sure to be organized when collecting data.

    When I feel sufficient research has been done I'll be writing an article documenting all the information.

    Calculated Stat Formula:
    This formula is from the upokecenter GSC page, so we must confirm that it also applies to RBY.
    Stat = int(((A+B)*2+C)*D/100)+E
    [*]A = Pokémon's Base Stat.
    [*]B = Pokémon's Deter Value (from 0 through 15)
    [*]C = Number of Stat Points currently earned (from 0 through 63)
    [*]D = Pokémon's level.
    [*]E = Additive. When calculating a Pokémon's HP, use (Level + 10). For all other stats, use 5.
    Stat Point Formula:
    Stat Points = (SQRT(MAX(MIN(StatExp,32505),1)-1)+1)/44
    HP DV Formula:
    Also from the GSC page. I trust this formula; it doesn't really need to be tested
    HP DV = A + B + C + D
    [*]A=0. If Attack DV is odd, A=8.
    [*]B=0. If Defense DV is odd, B=4.
    [*]C=0. If Speed DV is odd, C=2.
    [*]D=0. If Special DV is odd, D=1.
    Damage Formula:
    Here is the damage formula from upokecenter. Even on the DP one from upokecenter, they don't include the mods so I'm entirely sure how accurate their damage formulas are. Everything on that page needs to be tested for accuracy.
    int(int(int(2×L ÷ 5+2)×A×P ÷ D)/50)+2
    [*]L = Attacker's Level
    [*]A = Attacker's current Attack/Special Attack value
    [*]P = Attack's base damage
    [*]D = Defender's current Defense/Special Defense
    I'll be adding to this post with more things that need to be researched.
  2. gunbladelad


    Apr 7, 2005
    If required I could send you a copy of Jolt's PKUtility, which should have all the formulas in it somewhere. It's basically just an Excel spreadsheet. IIRC it has tools for the first 3 generations.

    It used to be up on Geocities, so I'm probably one of the few that still has it.

    He may also have the formulas in his FAQ on gameFAQs, but I've not checked it for years. It's the "Strategy guide" by "R Jones" if I mind right.
  3. david stone

    david stone Fast-moving, smart, sexy and alarming.
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Smogon IRC AOp Alumnusis a Programmer Alumnusis a Super Moderator Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

    Aug 3, 2005
    The problem with relying on past research is that basically one site posts something and then all other sites copy it. We really need to confirm that this data is true independently, or else find somewhere that lists their tests / code from the game.
  4. Sarenji

    Sarenji leaf-faced
    is a Battle Server Admin Alumnusis a Programmer Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    May 16, 2005
    • How much does Burn reduce attack?
    • How much does paralysis reduce speed?
    • How long does Sleep last?
    • Other than being hit by a Fire-type move, and Haze, are there other ways to unfreeze a Pokemon?

    • If your stats go over 999, do they stay at 999, or are they looped back to 0?
      • On NetBattle, a Marowak with Thick Club would have its attack loop back to 0 when using Swords Dance unless it had a ~11 Attack DV.
    • Do stat up moves fail when you go past 999?

    RBY has strange relationships between status and Pokemon stats. For example, if you Agility while Thunder Waved, the Speed loss you suffered is negated.
    • In the aforementioned example, is your Speed back to normal, or double the normal?
    • With a stat-lowering status, how is the stat further affected when a Pokemon uses a stat-lowering move on you?
      • Corollary: how is the stat affected when a burned Pokemon uses Swords Dance, once or multiple times, after which the opponent uses Growl?
    • If you have 999 in Speed, then Thunder Waved, can you use Agility again to nullify the Speed loss?

    • Is Struggle countered?
    • Can confusion damage be countered?

    • How does Bide work?

    I will add further research questions as this goes on.
  5. eric the espeon

    eric the espeon maybe I just misunderstood
    is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a CAP Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Aug 7, 2007
  6. Lesm46

    is a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

    Dec 19, 2004
  7. cantab


    Oct 22, 2009
    Something that applies to both RBY and GSC. I already mentioned it in the Celebi thread. Correct me if I am wrong.

    Because in RBY and GSC you can neither trade Pokemon between different languages, nor battle between different languages, there are in fact different languages' rules. The differences will relate to event moves. An event move that was only available in Japan cannot be in the same battle as one only available in an Anglophone nation, not even if they're on different teams.

    I'm not actually sure to what extent this applies, or whether it will actually be bothered with. Strict adherence to cartridge behaviour demands we either include this, or pick a single language to go by. On the other hand splitting the metagame is probably undesirable.
  8. Shelcario


    Nov 25, 2007
    In the calculated stat formula what does the "int" stand for, the actual stat of your pokemon?


    I can confirm that the calculated stats formula does work for R/B/Y:

    Data Collected:

    Test Pokemon: Level 5 Bulbasaur (Just picked starter)

    Hp Stat Calculated 4 times (DVs=0-4) using the formula:

    HP Stat= (((45 + 0) x 2 + 0) x 5/100) +15 = ~19 (actual--19.5)

    As the DVs increase from 0-4 the results are 19.5 (DV 3), 19.6 (DV 1), 19.7 (DV 2), 19.8 (DV 3), and 19.9 (DV 4).

    Compare to the actual stats of a level 5 just captured Bulbasaur with an HP DV of 0-4:

    0 19 9 9 9 11 11
    1 19 10 10 9 11 11
    2 19 10 10 9 11 11
    3 19 10 10 9 11 11
    4 19 10 10 9 11 11
    5 20 10 10 10 12 12
    6 20 10 10 10 12 12
    7 20 10 10 10 12 12
    8 20 10 10 10 12 12
    9 20 10 10 10 12 12
    10 20 10 10 10 12 12
    11 20 11 11 10 12 12
    12 20 11 11 10 12 12
    13 20 11 11 10 12 12
    14 20 11 11 10 12 12
    15 21 11 11 11 13 13

    If you guys want me to test the other stats I can but, it seems that the results will be the same.
  9. gunbladelad


    Apr 7, 2005
    Int just rounds the number to an integer (i.e - a whole number) - IIRC, it's rounded down.
  10. Shelcario


    Nov 25, 2007
    Oh well that makes more sense now, because I was asking if in pokemon if when you got a decimal answer if it's rounded down or up and received the answer that it's always rounded down, thanks.
  11. Hipmonlee

    Hipmonlee Have a rice day
    is a Smogon IRC AOp Alumnusis a Super Moderator Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnusis a Past WCoP Winner

    Dec 19, 2004
    Struggle is countered. It's just a normal normal attack. It also doesnt affect ghosts.

    [edit] - honestly some of the stuff you are asking to test here is kinda ridiculous to doubt..

    Also the dude you want to talk to is Kamex. He hasnt been around for a few years but he did a lot of rby testing for smogon.. Unfortunately most of his posts are archived now, but this thread has some things in it.

    Oh his sig has a link to a .wri file with his rby research in it. I'd use that as your starting point. But he tested this stuff while at smogon. I for one trust it.

    Have a nice day.
  12. General_Norris


    Dec 8, 2009
    I wonder if you guys could contact people who make tool-assisted speed runs, given their RNG-abuse you could try to get some info of them.

    I'm not an expert by any means but thought it could come handy.
  13. badabing

    badabing hevy hangs da hood,,

    Aug 9, 2010
    Low Kick causes flinch, so fix the movedex. Someone's probably figured this out already, but the dex is still wrong. I haven't tested for a percentage yet.

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