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Retrofit (New pokes, RBY Mechanics Theorymon thread)

Discussion in 'Orange Islands' started by Chou Toshio, Jul 28, 2012.

  1. Chou Toshio

    Chou Toshio @Fighting Necktie
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    So from IRC subjects, I know I am not the only one who enjoys random "what if" theorymon'ing that is ultimately utterly pointless to think about in terms of competitive Pokemon-- but this is Orange Island. We should indulge Pokemon discussion that's fun.

    This thread is dedicated to an angle of theorymoning that I have been enjoying as of late-- imagining newer pokes, fitted to the RBY mechanics.

    RBY was so unique (or flawed, depending on how you think about it) in terms of mechanics. Endless wraps, Critical Hit function differences, combined Special stats, Hyper Beam, and on and on. Not to mention the utter lack of Dark / Steel types.

    This thread will be dedicated to Pokemon of newer generations that would be awesome (or awful) if they had existed in RBY. Discussing Pokemon that did exist, but with their current movepools is also cool! (Amnesia Venusaur)

    Let's lay down some ground rules:

    1) No new moves, you can only theorymon about moves that existed in RBY (no discussion of Quiver Dance, Charge Beam, Outage, etc.)

    2) Pure Steel / Dark Pokemon cannot be discussed, because they can't exist.

    3) Steel and Dark Pokemon that have a secondary type can be discussed, but lose their Steel / Dark type (Tyranitar and Heatran are pure Rock and Fire types respectively).

    4) Let's not talk about what 'would be uber' or what 'would be banned'. Let's say that unless it's a cover legendary, it's fair game to discuss in context of RBY OU. Of course, discussing an RBY Ubers game with retrofitted Ho-Oh and Kyurem-W is welcome!

    5) When combining Special stats, always pick the lower stat UNLESS one of the two happens to be the Pokemon's highest stat. Examples: Volcarona and Uxie get 135 and 130 Special stats respectively, where as Salamence and Garchomp get 80 Special.

    6) Common sense with TMs. If a Poke has Giga Drain, it should probably be allowed to use the Mega Drain TM. Universal TMs like Mimic can be assumed.




    So, I'll kick us off with some examples of low-tier Pokemon that would be stupidly good retrofitted for RBY.


    Regice
    HP: 80
    ATK: 50
    DEF: 100
    SPC: 200
    SPE: 50

    -Amnesia
    -Blizzard (Ice Beam?)
    -Thunderbolt / Thunder
    -Rest

    Pretty simple here, we got pretty awesome 80 / 100 / 200 defensive stats to take on pretty much anything, especially on the special side. Offensively, 200 Special is stupid strong, especially with Amnesia, which with RBY mechanics basically doubles as a Nasty Plot, combined with Thunerbolt/Thunder and STAB Blizzard. In terms of Pokemon that are actually OU in RBY, very few can touch Regice. Rhydon and Golem are both slower than Regice and OHKOed by Blizzard. There are no OU Pokemon with STAB Fighting attacks (or any Fighting-type attacks), and of course Steel-type does not exist. Fire-types are basically unworthy of OU, and even if you did try them... 200 Special and Amnesia... you'll basically end up praying for a critical hit with your Tauros or Exploding your Cloyster to take it down.


    Slaking
    HP: 150
    ATK: 160
    DEF: 100
    SPC: 65
    SPE: 100

    -Slash
    -Hyper Beam
    -Earthquake
    -Blizzard

    Ok, so it's pretty obvious that without Truant, Slaking would be a beast in any generation, but RBY is even crazier since Normal is one of the best types in the game (barely any Fighting Pokemon, no Steel types, Rock and Ghosts all hit for super effective damage by EQ). On top of that, Slacking gets 2 of the best moves in the game, with STAB. Slash gets critical hits 100 percent of the time, making it a 140 base power STAB attacks. Hyper Beam has no recharge when it hits for the kill... actually considering Slash's 140 base power, maybe you don't need the 150 base power Hyper Beam, but hey, Persian runs both. Besides, there's not a whole lot else you would need to run.

    Earthquake destroys Gengar and hits Rhydon/Golem reasonably hard. Blizzard easily deals with Rhydon/Golem too, 2HKO. Otherwise, there's not a whole lot of other moves worth mentioning (or that you'd need...), but you could try Thunderbolt, Body Slam, Amnesia (!), Toxic, Substitute, Rest, Rock Slide, Flamethrower, or something... eh, just use the above.

    So, following the examples above, try taking a look for cool stuff yourself. :D
  2. M. Rock

    M. Rock

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    You made a typo, I think you mean Regice for the first one.

    This looks fun, imma come back later and do Landorus

    EDIT: Landorus (Ground/Flying)
    HP: 89
    Atk: 125
    Def: 90
    Spc: 80
    Spe: 101

    SET: All-Out Attacker (I don't have a lot of knowledge about competetive RBY so be gentle)
    - Earthquake
    - Rock Slide
    - Explosion
    - Rest/Psychic
    So Landorus is pretty beastly. His flying-type is pretty useless, and does nothing for him except give him a gaping weakness to Ice. Regardless, he is the fastest ground-type in RBY, with a high-powered STAB that hits the common Rock/Ground types for SE damage, and has a decent chance to score a crit. Rock Slide is for coverage, mostly so he can hit Gyarados. Explosion is an awesome move in RBY, and having a fast exploder with such a big attack score is more than anyone could ask for at the time!
    The last move is mostly filler. Rest if you want him to be bulky, but considering that he can't attack on the same turn he wakes up, it may not be that useful. Thus, Psychic gives him some power on the other side of the spectrum, and comes off of a usable base 80 Special stat. Yes, EQ hits poison types much harder, making it sort of pointless, but remember, nothing resists Psychic.

    In other words, he would be a pretty significant offensive threat in RBY
  3. Hemp Man

    Hemp Man

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    Poor Gyarados, 60 base Special?

    At least he'll have Earthquake and Thunder Wave now.
  4. JSND

    JSND

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    Question !

    - Does the RBY Registeel(or really, pure dark/steel) become Normal Type ?
    - Some poke actually gained moves in later gens that they couldnt learn in previous gens(ex. Tauros and Macnetric). And yes, some of those "learnable in the future" moves actualy exist in RBY. What move standard are used ?

    Okay time to go mad :

    Deoxys -D :
    HP : 50
    Atk : 70
    Def : 160
    SPC : 160
    Spe : 90
    Amnesia
    Psychic
    Recover
    Filler ?

    Okay, i started with Deoxys-D, that i believe is the best of Deo brothers in this mechanic(or maybe its Deo-O, who has better speed and higher SPC). Psychic Types are awesome in RBY, and we have a Psychic Type who can set up Amnesia, has Recover, and has stupidly good Defense as well.

    Essentialy its Slowbro, but even more insane
  5. Zacchaeus

    Zacchaeus
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    Most of my questions were answered in the OP but nonetheless I have a few things I want to verify:
    • Are Skarmory and Honchkrow pure Flying?
    • Does Shedinja retain 1 HP or can it gain base 1 HP because no longer has Wonder Guard?
    • If a Pokémon was introduced after generation 1, is it now able to learn generation 1 TMs?
  6. Chou Toshio

    Chou Toshio @Fighting Necktie
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    No, Pokemon that already have RBY stats should use those stats...

    The OP says "no pure dark or steel types", because making them normal would just change them completely. Especially when you think about STAB hyper beam / normal moves, which are really good in RBY.

    The OP also mentions discussing Pokemon that have improved movepools compared to the original game (I specifically mentioned Amnesia Venusaur as an example). So yeah, Rock Slide / EQ Aero would be cool too.

    Yeah, I'd guess Deo-D would be the best form.

    Originally, I thought about Deo-S considering its incredible Speed and ability to use Amnesia and Reflect at max Speed, but in a match between good players in RBY, all these Speedy Psychic types (Starmie, Alakazam), just end up getting Paralyzed most of the time, so the Speed is just kind of pointless. I bet Deo-S has a stupidly high critical hit ratio though, not going to calc right now.

    The filler move could be a number of things, but probably Blizzard or Thunder Wave. Reflect would seem pretty unnecessary with 160 Def


    -Yeah Honch and Skarm are pure Flying. Let's just follow the precedent set by Magneton, it's not like RBY has Roost or anything.

    -Let's not make up new base stats, so Shedinja is indeed stuck with its 1 HP.

    -I don't really want to turn this into an 'I think this Pokemon should get this as a TM move because of flavor' game, but maybe we can talk about some common sense ones. Example: Volcarona gets Giga Drain, it should be allowed to use the Mega Drain TM for instance. Unless the RBY TM is like a direct extention of one of its current moves (Giga Drain -> Mega Drain), let's try to avoid this.
  7. Afti

    Afti

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    (I'm going to assume we're allowed to take reasonable assumptions re: RBY TMs, yes? This being the universal ones like Mimic.)

    Chandelure
    HP: 60
    ATK: 55
    DEF: 90
    SPC: 145
    SPE: 80

    -Fire Blast
    -Psychic
    -Substitute
    -Mimic

    Far from perfect; its movepool leaves a lot to be desired. But it takes Special hits like a champ and retaliates with a horrifyingly powerful Fire Blast. Very effective in endgame; it can pick off paralyzed Pokémon with ease. 80 Speed is enough to work with once the opposing team is paralyzed, and nothing that isn't named Chansey can take a Fire Blast without feeling it.

    Regigigas
    HP: 110
    ATK: 160
    DEF: 110
    SPC: 80
    SPE: 100

    -Body Slam
    -Hyper Beam
    -Earthquake
    -Ice Punch

    Plays a lot like Tauros, but trading a bit of Speed (doesn't tie with Gengar anymore, ties with Zapdos instead of outrunning it) for slightly better Special, insane Attack, and a noticeable improvement in physical bulk. Body Slam everything you can, Earthquake things with weaknesses to it, Hyper Beam for KOs, and Ice Punch Golem/Rhydon. Basically, it's like Tauros if its BST were near enough to that of Mewtwo. Slaking is probably better overall- but the real terror would be in a team that ran both; whatever few checks could be managed would be worn down and wiped out by the time the other 160 Attack Normal came out.

    Probopass
    HP: 60
    ATK: 55
    DEF: 145
    SPC: 150
    SPE: 40

    -Thunderbolt
    -Thunder Wave
    -Rest
    -Selfdestruct

    Grounds wall you, but you're pretty much invincible. Even without STAB, Thunderbolt can do a number on anything you'll encounter due to Probopass's crazy Special; that same stat makes Probopass obscenely durable. It's taking a pittance from anything that isn't super-effective; Starmie can't KO with its STAB Surf and loses about 66% from Thunderbolt. That being said, even with its ludicrous Special, Probopass shouldn't be taking Surfs if it can be helped! It's great at soaking up Psychic, Blizzard, and Thunderbolt; letting it eat a Surf is a waste. Normal attacks bounce right off; Snorlax can't do decent damage with Body Slam. Thunder Wave is an invaluable utility; Probopass isn't being 1HKO'd by much of anything (well, barring boosts), meaning that it can paralyze whatever it's out against, if needed. Rest isn't very good, but Probopass has a barren movepool, so the recovery is usable; Probopass can endure the hits, but there's a risk of letting something set up on you. Selfdestruct isn't going to do all that much from Probopass's limited Attack stat, but it's still relatively decent, and can wipe out something like Alakazam or Chansey if it's been softened up. It's not much, but Probopass's movepool really is awful, so work with what you have.
  8. Hemp Man

    Hemp Man

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    Gyarados could probably pull off a Thunder Wave/Earthquake/Blizzard/Hyper Beam set, as could Dragonite.

    Charizard would now have ThunderPunch

    I'm assuming the Physical/Special split is undone?
  9. Chou Toshio

    Chou Toshio @Fighting Necktie
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    Gyarados and Dragonite wouldn't be any different :|

    @Charizard / Chandelure-- Fire is still a crap attacking type with no Steel Types in the game...
  10. Hemp Man

    Hemp Man

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    I guess the decision between those two comes down wherever you would rather die to Thunderbolt, or Blizzard.

    Oh yeah, Fire isn't good in RBY. And since there are no Dragon moves (Dragon Rage doesnt count!) in this metagame, no need for Fire coverage. I guess its worth noting Fire Blast would go back to 30% burn chance.
  11. Afti

    Afti

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    Fair enough; neutral coverage isn't terrible, but there are better.

    Kyurem
    HP: 125
    ATK: 130
    DEF: 90
    SPC: 130
    SPE: 95

    -Blizzard
    -Slash
    -Reflect
    -Hyper Beam/Psychic

    I'll admit I'm not sure whether or not stock Kyurem is fair game. But it's an obscene threat in RBY mechanics- terrific bulk, good Speed, and a pair of immense offensive stats. Dragon/Ice is a much better type in RBY; it gets a STAB Blizzard, and its only weaknesses are Rock and Fighting. Ice cancels out Dragon's Ice weakness, letting Kyurem enjoy a nice set of resistances courtesy of its typing. Blizzard does an absolutely stupid amount of damage to anything without a similarly gargantuan Special stat; Slash is a powerful physical move running off of its every-bit-as-good Attack. This is RBY, so nothing can take both Blizzard and Slash from Kyurem. Reflect lets Kyurem patch up the one hole in its stat spread, making its physical bulk as good as its special. The last moveslot is filler; Hyper Beam packs slightly more power than Slash, and can net you KOs. Psychic lets you hit a few Pokémon with high Defense and Ice resists, like Cloyster, without wasting Blizzard PP. Kyurem doesn't have many more options, but the set it CAN run is good enough on its own.
  12. breh

    breh
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    A brief summary:

    Everything here becomes godly.

    Everything with high SpD and shitty SpA becomes good.

    Ice-types become good.

    And, as you showed in the OP, Regice becomes an Uber to rival Mewtwo as a result of all 3.

    Wrap clones are everywhere (Deoxys has Wrap, Gorebyss is like Omastar but with Clamp, Amnesia, and Agility > Rock-type, Volcarona has Fire Spin, Cryogonal learns Bind for some reason but shouldn't use it (Regice is still outclassing it, though)).
  13. TM13IceBeam

    TM13IceBeam

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    well technically shuckle has the highest special in the entire game but doesn't have anything to use it :(

    Scrafty
    HP: 65
    ATK: 90
    DEF: 115
    SPC: 115
    SPD: 58

    Amnesia
    Ice Punch
    Thunderpunch
    Hyper Beam

    I'm not exactly that familiar with RBY meta, but Amnesia Scrafty seems really interesting with Boltbeam coverage. Hyper Beam is filler really (you could probably stick mimic/hjk in there), but it's still not that bad with 90 Attack behind it.
  14. Afti

    Afti

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    ...Yeah, I didn't even think about Wrap Deoxys-S, but that thing would be horrific.

    DEOXYS used WRAP!
    Its attack continues!
    Its attack continues!
    Its attack continues!
    DEOXYS used WRAP!
    Its attack continues!

    ad infinitum

    Escavalier gets a small niche in having Twineedle and offensive stats that make it an actual danger, but it'd still suck; it'd never survive a hit from one of the Psychics it's supposed to be punishing, and only a bad player would switch Alakazam in on it.

    Landorus is decent enough; huge Attack, great Speed, and nice Special. Only Special attack it gets is Psychic, but it can take hits like a champ, at least, while throwing around incredibly strong STAB Earthquakes. Ice weakness hurts it a lot, though.

    Archeops is suddenly terrifying! Rock Slide/Earthquake/Hyper Beam/Quick Attack lets it tear holes in teams without Defeatist.

    Jellicent is a great bulky Water (100 HP/70 Defense/105 Special are fun, like a mini-Chansey that happens to have passable Defense) that can soak hits, hit hard in return, and use its Ghost typing to switch in on the omnipresent Normal attacks. Surf/Blizzard/Recover/Acid Armor could work; Acid Armor patches up its Defense, letting it soak hits on both sides of the spectrum all day long in tandem with Recover. Switch in on a special attacker and force it out, Acid Armor, and tank. Phazing isn't a thing in RBY, and no one uses Haze, so Jellicent's going to be hard to force out with a boost. And, like Chansey, it loves paralysis.
  15. JSND

    JSND

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    Sorry if this is offensive but cant help to troll... maybe

    "everything here is godly"

    That list includes some Poison types and some others who i believe wont be really godly

    "Ice Types become good"

    It was.... the strongest offensive power in Gen 1 is Articuno after all...., but there might be some exception. Many might think "ohh gen 1 is broken because Special is the only thing that matters." Its not totally like that, when Body Slam and Hyper Beam are around...

    Also speaking of Special

    Blissey suffers from not getting DAT SPD

    Some stuff

    Uxie
    Hp : 75
    Atk : 75
    Def : 130
    SPC : 130
    Spe : 95

    Amnesia
    Psychic
    Recover
    Filler

    Mini Deoxys D, now with 5 extra speed and slightly better HP !

    Volcarona
    HP : 85
    Atk : 60
    Def : 65
    Spc : 135
    Spe : 100

    Psychic
    Mega Drain(if allowed, not like it helped much)/Fire Spin(much better)
    Amnesia
    Fire Blast

    A pretty fun, if gimmicky set. But really, 100 speed and 65 def is a huge problem and i believe wont be good for OU

    Cryogonal

    HP : 70
    Atk : 50
    Def : 30
    SPC : 130
    Spe : 105


    Blizzard
    Recover
    Whatever

    One trick pony at its max. Blizzard from fast poke with high speed ? why not. It can learn Dual Screen if you want too(not that its helpful because it didnt pass like) in future generations. oh and Maybe use Ice Beam because 5 PP

    Lanturn
    Stats : Not much different.... 76 SPC(not like it didnt have it before)

    Amnesia
    Blizzard
    T Bolt
    T Wave

    We present you, Starmie + Slowbro/2. No seriously, thats the best way to explain this set. Boltbeam = perfect coverage. And it has 125 HP and 58 Def which is still solid. 76 SPC is offset by Amnesia, and it has T Wave, a move that is "arguably" one of the most important move in the whole game.
    Beware of EQ though


    Something tells me that with the influx of high Special mon...

    You know where im going

    Yes, Mewtwo MIGHT not be the brokeness it was before. Now we began, THE Uber Discussion

    Arceus
    Do i really need to list its stats ?

    Body Slam
    Hyper Beam
    EQ
    Blizzard

    AKA THE Tauros Set up

    Face it, Mewtwo while its still might be an insanity like before and a Top level threat DID NOT come close to its former dominance with this around(Amnesia or whatever, but really even Deoxys can challenge Mewtwo's position). Ever. It has a crazy offensive power(for the sake of reference remember that back then Articuno was the King of Immediate Power). Normal is simply amazing STAB if not, the best(In my Opinion). And Arceus has everything to cover its resistor

    Coupled with that insane Critical rate, and you got God. Safe to say, if Plates is allowed in this discussion, Arceus is going to become even more versatile(but you already have Normal Type Monster so....)

    Palkia
    HP : 100
    Atk : 120
    Def : 90
    SPC : 150
    Spe : 100

    Blizzard
    Thunderbolt
    Hydro Pump
    Thunder Wave

    Oh yeah baby, im finally going to say that line

    Palkia

    Is

    NO WEAAKKKKKK !!!


    Seriously though Palkia is so good, its not even funny. Its still the important pokemon that it is known for, having good STAB(not like it matters when many might choose BoltZard combo) and all around solid stats. It can even fit Slash somewhere for Chan/Blissey. Basically, its Starmie again, only Slower, NO WEAAK and can troll the Pink Egg Fairy.
  16. Spork

    Spork

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    Torterra
    Grass/Ground
    HP: 95
    ATK: 109
    DEF: 105
    SPC: 75
    SPE: 56

    Torterra just generally has some really cool moves. STAB Earthquake, Razor Leaf and Mega Drain, Amnesia, Swords Dance, and Rock Slide are some seriously powerful moves with excellent coverage and make it one of the few RBY pokes that can actually be hard to predict. With its typing and DEF it's the best Golem/Rhydon counter in the game. Struggles for a team slot against Exeggutor because of Sleep Powder, but Amnesia makes up for it. It has bad speed and a nasty 4x ice weakness tho that limits what it can switch into.

    Set:
    -Amnesia/Swords Dance
    -Razor Leaf
    -Earthquake
    -Rock Slide

    Mamoswine
    Ground/Ice
    HP: 110
    ATK: 130
    DEF: 80
    SPC: 60
    SPE: 80

    Really powerful, with great offensive STABs in Blizzard and Earthquake as well as a powerful boosting move in Amnesia. Great defenses, augmented by Amnesia, makes it hard to kill, and it is one of the only pokemon with a Thunderbolt immunity that is not hit hard by Ice.. The only Amnesia pokemon to get STAB Blizzard outside of Regice.

    Set:
    -Amnesia
    -Blizzard
    -Earthquake
    -Rock Slide/Reflect/Hyper Beam

    Drifblim
    Ghost/Flying
    HP: 150
    ATK: 80
    DEF: 44
    SPC: 54
    SPE: 80

    Very flawed, but very interesting. That double immunity to Normal and Ground is excellent, and 150 HP is great, but he suffers from low defensive stats and an Ice/Thunder weakness, which basically every pokemon carries. He still has one of the most interesting and adaptable movesets in the game, with Explosion, Hypnosis, Thunder Wave, Amnesia, Psychic, Thunderbolt, and a more powerful Explosion than Gengar. Amnesia and Thunder Wave are the reasons to use him over Gengar.

    Set:
    -Amnesia
    -Explosion
    -Thunderbolt
    -Thunder Wave/Psychic/Hypnosis
  17. Antihaxxer

    Antihaxxer

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    Any good Ghost with Nice Special would be very amazing against plethora of normal type, no dark type, no good ghost type attack and no steel pokemon
  18. TM13IceBeam

    TM13IceBeam

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    and suffering from lack of usable stab at the same time

    gengar is still the standard to beat and the rest are just kind of meh-ish (except chandelure/giratina)
  19. DTC

    DTC ˢᵉʳᶦᵒᵘˢ
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    Chou, Deoxys only has Ice Beam.

    Cryogonal would be pretty cool in RBY but it faces a lot of competition from Articuno. I'd definitely use Ice Beam on it with Blizzard for more PP.

    Anyways, here is one of the Pokemon that have gone under the radar in this thread so far:

    [​IMG]
    Archeops
    75 / 140 / 65 / 65 / 110
    - Rock Slide
    - Earthquake
    - Hyper Beam
    - Agility

    Archeops abuses the mechanics of RBY well with the lack of Defeatiest, its increased critical hit rate of 21.48%, and Hyper Beam actually being good. It may not be able to use special attacks effectively, but it doesn't need them! Archeops would be one of the best late-game cleaners and it's also a decent check to the various Normal-types with its resistance to Normal and Ground. It outspeeds 11 / 16 Pokemon in OU and ties with 2 of them, so it's only outsped by Alakazam, Persian, and Starmie, which it can outspeed after Agility. Agility is only a filler, but I imagine it can be useful in some matches.

    Anyways, this is a fantastic topic Chou. I love the discussion so far.
  20. Zacchaeus

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    Shuckle
    HP: 20
    Atk: 10
    Def: 230
    Spc: 230 (230 over 10)
    Spe: 5

    -Toxic
    -Rest
    -Earthquake
    -Rock Slide/Substitute

    Sadly, Shuckle learns no special attacks so it must function as a wall. Toxic becomes quite threatening when combined with Earthquake to hit Poison-type Pokémon. Rock Slide is to hit Golbat and otherwise serve as a coverage attack. Substitute can be used to tank a Seismic Toss and get a Toxic off before switching out

    Golurk (Compare to Rhydon's 105-130-120-45-40 or Golem's 80-110-130-55-45)
    HP: 89
    Atk: 124
    Def: 80
    Spc: 55 (55 over 80)
    Spe: 55

    -Earthquake
    -Rock Slide
    -Hyper Beam
    -Ice Beam/Thunderbolt

    Having Ghost typing in RBY has advantages that go without saying, and the only disadvantage is missing out on STAB. By the powers of Rock and Ground combined, there isn't much that Golurk can't threaten. Golurk sports better Speed than Golem or Rhydon, better Special than Rhydon, and better special bulk than Golem. Ice Beam is not common from a Ground-type and hits other Ground-types along with Grass-types. Thunderbolt can be substituted to hit Water-types instead

    Edit @ R_N: It only learns Bug, Normal, Rock, Poison, and Ground attacks for use in RBY. In GSC it would get Hidden Power, in RSE it would get Knock Off. So in summary - :(
  21. R_N

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    Poor shuckle. Absolutely amazing Special and absolutely nothing to use with it
  22. StallMandibuzz

    StallMandibuzz

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    This is extremely interesting, to be certain. :p And Shuckle's gettin' trolled here, the one time it can dominate with Special Attacks, it doesn't learn a one. :o
  23. The Reptile

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    Goddamned Psychic for practically having no weaknesses, it makes Kingdra sad. :(

    Kingdra
    HP: 75
    Atk: 95
    Def: 95
    Spc: 95 (95 over 95)
    Spe: 85

    Blizzard
    Hydro Pump
    Agility
    Hyper Beam

    Since Dragon Dance doesn't exist, Kingdra has no way of boosting his offenses, thus, it must rely on Agility to potentially crit something. It's typing is a double edge sword. While it does give him no weakness, Ice-type attacks are now neutral, meaning Kingdra looses to most Water-types. His move pool is also garbage, but his mixed offenses allow him to use a set like this. Probably not a top tier threat, but an interesting pokemon if you want to have a poke with no weaknesses (btw, would bug-type moves be viable now, since we have stronger bugs?) that's allowed in OU (since Palkia is a cover legendary, I'm assuming it's Uber)

    EDIT: Also, Scolipede.

    Scolipede
    HP: 60
    Atk: 90
    Def: 89
    Spc: 55 (55 over 69)
    Spe: 112

    Twin Needle / Pin Missle
    Earthquake
    Rock Slide
    Hyper Beam

    This is pretty much a better Beedrill. While he is still weak to Psychic-type attacks, it doesn't matter since in theory Scolipede should outspeed most of them and hit them with a Twin Needle or a Pin Missle. Thanks to his 112 speed (3 points below Persian), he has a decent crit chance. Sadly, he doesn't have access to Slash (or any high crit ratio moves) to abuse it, but he still has decent crit chance, which is good due to his eh speed. His move pool is pretty bad. This is pretty much a list of his viable moves he learns. Definitely not a top-tier threat, but maybe an anti-meta weapon? Honestly, if I were to use a Poison- or a Bug-type pokemon in RBY, it would be Scolipede. Paralysis is a bitch though. :(

    EDIT2: Also, by typing alone, Toxicroak is the worst, as it has the 2 worst typings of RBY put together.
    EDIT3: Holy shit Latias, you're scary.

    Latios / Latias
    HP: 80
    Atk: 80 / 90
    Def: 90 / 80
    Spc: 130 (130 over 110 in both cases)
    Spe: 110

    Thunderbolt
    Blizzard / Ice Beam
    Psychic
    Mimic / Recover

    Lati@s is essentially a better Starmie. It's 5 points slower, but has better bulk overall. If mimic is chosen, Latios is better because of it's decent base 90 attack letting it use whatever it gets from mimic. Otherwise, Latias is better, but only slightly. The difference is barely noticeable though due to how the Special Stat works. It's typing gives it one relevant weakness to Ice, while adding tons and tons of resistances. Sadly, he can't use his other STAB move, but that fine since Psychic is all you need. Recover heals you, while Mimic is to try and steal a potential Amnesia. If Latios is chosen, you can opt for a physical move in the last slot or over one of the boltbeam coverage if you want in order to hit other Psychics harder.


    Also, to Deoxys-S, I think either Normal Deo or Attack Deo is better, since the only thing that Deo-S outspeeds the others don't is Ninjask. Meanwhile, they pack huge Special (150 and 180) and huge Attack (150 and 180). The defense is off setting, but I don't think much can hit it before getting destroyed.
  24. Spork

    Spork

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2011
    Messages:
    409
    Rotom forms are kinda interesting when retrofitted.

    Rotom
    Electric/Ghost
    HP: 50
    ATK: 50
    DEF: 77
    SPC: 95
    SPE: 91

    This typing is really amazing defensively, resisting Electric and nullifying Normal, and Rotom has enough speed and special to act as sweeper, with a great STAB. Unfortunately its movepool is terrible, its stats are pretty average compared to Zapdos and Gengar and Ground types destroy him...

    Set:
    -Thunderbolt
    -Thunder Wave
    -Mimic
    -Reflect

    Rotom-F
    Electric/Ice
    HP: 50
    ATK: 65
    DEF: 107
    SPC: 107
    SPE: 86

    Rotom F is really good. Its typing not only gives it the two best STABs anyone could have, resulting with not only the most powerful BoltZard in the game, but a resistance to BoltZard itself, making it an excellent switch-in to stuff like Starmie.

    Set:
    -Thunderbolt
    -Blizzard
    -Thunder Wave
    -Reflect/Mimic

    Rotom-W
    Electric/Water
    HP: 50
    ATK: 65
    DEF: 107
    SPC: 107
    SPE: 86

    Probably outclassed by the water types that have higher special and access to Ice moves, but STAB Electric/Water is really good and Rotom-W has a significantly more powerful Thunderbolt than any other Water type, as well as being a better special tank with its resistances and neutralities.

    Set:
    -Thunderbolt
    -Hydro Pump
    -Thunder Wave
    -Reflect/Mimic
  25. Burn Jack

    Burn Jack

    Joined:
    May 29, 2007
    Messages:
    175
    I would have thought egg moves are a no-go, since there's no breeding in RBY.

    It gets Blizzard by TM. ?_?

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