Yes, and Substitute would be more effective over Refresh. And hence we're back to our ultimate, destroyer-of-worlds standard set.
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Pokémon Salamence
- Thread starter sunny004
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rhyperior 2hkos with ice punch right after you use rest. imo neither this set or sub, dd mence seem very viable because most of the time, you are trying to stall trying not to die instead of actually doing any damage. the wallbreaker set is the most viable.
Refresh has its advantages over substitute, too. You can switch Mega Salamence in more freely on scalds without fear, for example.
True then just use refresh when their status inflicted isdeadd
Sooooo....now that mega mence is dead, are we back to scarfmence? Are there any other decent sets?
Nope! Let it suffer once more :D
I don't think we need this thread anymore because Mega Salamence is dead and normal Salamence is awful in OU so there is really no point in this thread anymore lol.
I dont really think we should close this thread because Mence is still viable in OU, just not godly like his mega or even top tier. I've been having decent success with a special attacking set of Draco Meteor, Fire Blast, Hydro Pump, and Iron Tail to lure in common answers to Salamence and take them out. Outside of this set only the scarf set seems viable because the dd sets seem too outclassed.
Pretty much, I wouldn't recommend it tough, I prefer the synergy Lo hydreygon can give to some teams.
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rip megamence. The only set that could be a ~~little~~ viable is ScarfMence, which is not really good because the lacking of a good STAB, once again. Though, it can run Outrage/Earthquake/Iron Tail/Fire Blast . Outrage STAB, EQ good coverage, Iron Tail beats 2hkoes most fairies on switches in and fire blast beats up thorn/skarm that'd otherwise wall you. Yet this set needs cleric support and preferably the cleaning of Defog.
RIP? More like good riddance. This thread needs locked, even if we're going to pretend Scarfmence will be a thing, this thread's got too much mega mence.
Such a shame that salamence was knocked down thanks to the banning of mega mence. Hopefully salamence will eventually get a reliable stab so he is less walled by fairies.
Yo Salamence is definitely not horrible.. a lot of people don't expect it and it can still do some serious damage. I think it still has a unique, niche role as a Moxie sweeper, even without the bulk and better stab that the Mega version provides:
Salamence Life Orb
Naive; Moxie
252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 Satk
~Dragon Dance
~Outrage
~Earthquake
~Fire Blast
Yeah, it's walled by fairies and all that, but this thing only needs 1 DD and a kill to mar almost an entire team. If you set up your team correctly, you can dimish the fairy weakness and still use your mega.
Salamence Life Orb
Naive; Moxie
252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 Satk
~Dragon Dance
~Outrage
~Earthquake
~Fire Blast
Yeah, it's walled by fairies and all that, but this thing only needs 1 DD and a kill to mar almost an entire team. If you set up your team correctly, you can dimish the fairy weakness and still use your mega.
Thing is Salamence is mostly outclassed by Dragonite as a set up DD sweeper. Dragonite gets Multiscale and can basically get a guaranteed boost without SR on the field.
The things that Salamence have over Dragonite is that it's not relying on SR not being up, being able to hold a life orb, and going mixed.
Haha, I never thought I'd hear the day when people said Nite outclasses Mence, it always used to be the opposite. But you're right - DDNite does have some things over DD Mence.
I still think Moxie sets it apart and gives it something unique. Sure, the greater bulk and Multiscale ability offered by Dragonite facilitate easier set-ups and greater longevity, but that's not really what Salamence should be trying to replicate anymore. I don't think it's completely fair to compare them becasue they've adopted different play styles with the advent of DW/Hidden Abilities. Right now, Salamence can still work as a much more Offensive counterpart to Nite, especially with Moxie ramping him up with each iteration.
Just give it a try; you might be surprised how much damage it can do.
No-one's denying it can do damage; just as no-one's denying Florges is a great fairy wall. The problem with both of these are that they're outclassed by other Pokémon which generally do the same thing better -- now granted, unlike Florges Salamence does have Moxie and decent mixed attacking capabilities which makes it a bit more dubious than Florges, but I can't think of many cases where I'd prefer to use it over Dragonite or even Zygarde or Haxorus.
I suppose it depends on your team. Salamence is faster than Nite (granted he has ES) , Zygarde and Haxorus and has the ability to speed tie other invested B100's. Like you've mentioned Salamence is by far the obvious best choice for running a semi-mixed set, which can be altered depending on what your team has trouble with. Mence is no longer the immediate best option for a DD Sweeper like it used to be in previous generations - there's no way I'll try to argue that. I just think Mence has a few things separating it from other options that affords it a unique niche.
Another set I've tried recently:
Salamence @ Life Orb
Jolly; Moxie
252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 HP
~Dragon Dance
~Outrage/Dragon Claw
~Earthquake
~Iron Tail
This set somewhat remedies the massive fairy weakness regular Salamence sets have. Additionally, Mence is one of the few dragons that can learn Iron Tail and use it successfully in a set.
Salamence @ Life Orb
Jolly; Moxie
252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 HP
~Dragon Dance
~Outrage/Dragon Claw
~Earthquake
~Iron Tail
This set somewhat remedies the massive fairy weakness regular Salamence sets have. Additionally, Mence is one of the few dragons that can learn Iron Tail and use it successfully in a set.
I have a friend who runs Sash Mence but he won't listen when I say its bad...
TBH, if ur going to run DD Mence you kinda have to run Intimidate as Mence simply lacks the bulk to reliably set up DDs, and Sash sets just fall to the same problems as DDnite. If you REALLY want to use Mence for DD (here's a tip: don't) you should only really use the Sub DD set:
Salamence @ Lum Berry
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 96 HP / 252 Atk / 160 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Substitute
- Dragon Claw
- Roost / Fire Blast / Iron Tail
The EVs outpace Jolly Excadrill before a boost (and Jolly ScarfDrill after one), and the 4th move comes down to what your team needs. Generally Roost is best, but if you lack Magnezone support, run Fire Blast and if you lack a reliable way of beating Fairies, run Iron Tail. Lum Berry stops fast 'Wisp users (e.g. Talonflame) from burning you or Thundurus from paralyzing you before you can get up a sub.
This is the only DD-Mence set which it isn't outclassed by Dnite and Char-X, but even then I don't recommend running it. The reason that you would use this over Dragonite is because it can use Sub without sacrificing Multiscale, and the reason that you'd use it over Char-X is because Intimidate makes it easier to set up Substitutes.
But for god sake: don't use this. There is literally zero reason to run Mence if you aren't giving it a Choice Scarf, as even WITH this set it is still outclassed by Dragonite and CharX. The most useful thing that Mence outclasses as a DD user in OU is Scrafty (which says a lot on its own), but even then it only outclasses Intimidate DD Scrafty (because Scrafty gets Shed Skin, meaning it can't be reliably burned and that it doesn't need to sacrifice its item slot to Lum Berry), which really shows how mediocre Mence is as a DD user.
TBH, if ur going to run DD Mence you kinda have to run Intimidate as Mence simply lacks the bulk to reliably set up DDs, and Sash sets just fall to the same problems as DDnite. If you REALLY want to use Mence for DD (here's a tip: don't) you should only really use the Sub DD set:
Salamence @ Lum Berry
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 96 HP / 252 Atk / 160 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Substitute
- Dragon Claw
- Roost / Fire Blast / Iron Tail
The EVs outpace Jolly Excadrill before a boost (and Jolly ScarfDrill after one), and the 4th move comes down to what your team needs. Generally Roost is best, but if you lack Magnezone support, run Fire Blast and if you lack a reliable way of beating Fairies, run Iron Tail. Lum Berry stops fast 'Wisp users (e.g. Talonflame) from burning you or Thundurus from paralyzing you before you can get up a sub.
This is the only DD-Mence set which it isn't outclassed by Dnite and Char-X, but even then I don't recommend running it. The reason that you would use this over Dragonite is because it can use Sub without sacrificing Multiscale, and the reason that you'd use it over Char-X is because Intimidate makes it easier to set up Substitutes.
But for god sake: don't use this. There is literally zero reason to run Mence if you aren't giving it a Choice Scarf, as even WITH this set it is still outclassed by Dragonite and CharX. The most useful thing that Mence outclasses as a DD user in OU is Scrafty (which says a lot on its own), but even then it only outclasses Intimidate DD Scrafty (because Scrafty gets Shed Skin, meaning it can't be reliably burned and that it doesn't need to sacrifice its item slot to Lum Berry), which really shows how mediocre Mence is as a DD user.
You've still got a lot of stuff about Mega Mence in the overview, mentioning it's stats and giving note of moves that are only good for it's mega (eg return, hyper voice).
Scarf Mence is the only thing that could possible be considered viable.
I agree. Unfortunately, Salamence is outclassed in every other role it could run.
Kyurem-B hits harder, Dragonite is bulkier, and Garchomp is faster.
So if you must use Salamence, Choice Scarf + Moxie is the way to go.
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