Ladder STABmons (the old one)

[BLOOD TOTEM]

A couple of things that haven't got a mention that really deserve more in my opinion.
Sticky Web
I'd never really use it in OU but here in STABmons, it seems like a really viable option. A lot of the strongest offensive threats tend to revolve around a shell smash sweep and so, with sticky web, they become much easier to deal with. After a SS boost the opposing Pokemon will only reach +1 speed and that is really significant as it means that a Choice Scarf user with decent speed can switch in and KO the opponent. The best example of this I can thing of off the top of my head is something like a standard scarf Terrakion who has the benefit of resisting Normal-type priority moves, though I'm sure something can better fit the role.

Charizard Mega Y
159 Spa, Drought, Access to a 130 base power special STAB boosted by said Drought. Zard is going HAM on anything and everything.
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Blue Flare vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Rotom-W in Sun: 175-207 (57.5 - 68%)
Just an example of Zard plowing through a 'resist'. No boosting moves is a shame but access to Aeroblast or Oblivion Wing is nice to give Charizard a better flying STAB.

A set I'm interested is Shift Gear Mega Mawile, looks pretty fun.
Mawile @ Mawilite
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: ?
Adamant Nature
- Shift Gear
- Gear Grind
- Play Rough
- King's Shield

The general idea is to use Kings Shield to force a switch to give time to set up a boost with Shift Gear.It's a work in progress but it might become something cool eventually.

 

[canno]

MegaZard Y/X also get access to V-Create. X can run a set like Victini's Choice Band set (his DD set is pretty much unchanged since V-Create is meh on DD and Sacred Fire doesn't get the Tough Claws boost). Y can use V-Create to break Special Walls such as Blissey and Chansey. TTar still gives it problems though. MegaMawile looks pretty threatening too, although I'd run EQ or Rock Slide on it to wreck Fire-types that wall your dual STAB and threaten you with STAB.

In other news, DD Mega Garchomp is pretty much the DD Kyurem-B of X and Y. MegaChomp is slightly bulkier physically and more bulky specially and has better typing both offensively and defensively than Kyurem-B. However, Kyurem-B can use an item like Life Orb or Lum Berry unlike MegaChomp. It also has Ice STAB to hit Togekiss, which walls the fuck out of any Garchomp without Stone Edge. What is neat though is that Garchomp doesn't need to Megavole instantly, meaning that before it goes Mega it still has 102 speed. Still, I think that MegaChomp is a better DD user than Kyurem-B. I think this set is pretty neat.


Garchomp @ Garchompite
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 SAtk
Jolly / Naive Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Earthquake
- Outrage
- Stone Edge / Fire Blast / Sword Dance

SD can be used over Fire Blast for a Double Dance set. Stone Edge is for Togekiss. Fire Blast is for Skarm.

 

[skies]

Holy crap, Manectric become very powerful:

Manectric @ Manectite
Ability: Lightningrod
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SAtk / 4 SDef
Timid Nature
- Electrify
- Thunderbolt
- Flamethrower
- Substitute
Immune to everything you throw at him! Boost up enough to where you can Mega Evolve, get off an Intimidate and Sub, then Sweep from there. Literally broken as heck. Similarly, Raichu can use this but with Focus Blast > Thunderbolt. Mega Manectric has ok bulk, so that's what Sub is for.

 

[Pikachuun]

Holy crap, Manectric become very powerful:

Manectric @ Manectite
Ability: Lightningrod
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SAtk / 4 SDef
Timid Nature
- Electrify
- Thunderbolt
- Flamethrower
- Substitute
Immune to everything you throw at him! Boost up enough to where you can Mega Evolve, get off an Intimidate and Sub, then Sweep from there. Literally broken as heck. Similarly, Raichu can use this but with Focus Blast > Thunderbolt. Mega Manectric has ok bulk, so that's what Sub is for.

Espeed or other priority users will have a pretty fun time bypasssing Electrify. Same with Scarf users that can outspeed Manectric. But hey, when it works, it works well.

 

[EV]

New homework soon. The Reptile is eligible to send another set. Other people are close...

 

[AOPSUser]

Holy crap, Manectric become very powerful:

Manectric @ Manectite
Ability: Lightningrod
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SAtk / 4 SDef
Timid Nature
- Electrify
- Thunderbolt
- Flamethrower
- Substitute
Immune to everything you throw at him! Boost up enough to where you can Mega Evolve, get off an Intimidate and Sub, then Sweep from there. Literally broken as heck. Similarly, Raichu can use this but with Focus Blast > Thunderbolt. Mega Manectric has ok bulk, so that's what Sub is for.

Mega Manetric has Intimidate, not Lightningrod.

So much for that idea.

 

[Adonzo]

He's suggesting spamming Electrify to build up SpA BEFORE mega evolving. Still not terribly useful, as once you're evolved Electrify becomes a wasted move slot if you have to switch (although I guess the idea is not to evolve until you can sweep).

If manectric wants to run Electrify, he's better off without manectite.

 

[skies]

Mega Manetric has Intimidate, not Lightningrod.

So much for that idea.

Did you read the post?

Boost up enough to where you can Mega Evolve, get off an Intimidate and Sub, then Sweep from there.

I said to not Mega Evolve until you've gotten enough boosts.

 

[AOPSUser]

Did you read the post?


I said to not Mega Evolve until you've gotten enough boosts.

Perfect, you are now completely and utterly destroyed by anything faster, which, at your Base 105 speed, is every Scarfer, Terrakion, Keldeo, Gengar, Latios, and above. Also, any speed boosters, like Shell Smash Sylveon, fuck you over. I'd much rather use either Raichu or Jolteon for this purpose, the former because it has Speed and Agility, and the latter because of Shell Smash.

Electrify is still a bit gimmicky in STABmons simply because it's easily anticipated and the opponent will switch to their faster mon. Especially on a mon that can't boost its Speed.

 

[skies]

Perfect, you are now completely and utterly destroyed by anything faster, which, at your Base 105 speed, is every Scarfer, Terrakion, Keldeo, Gengar, Latios, and above. Also, any speed boosters, like Shell Smash Sylveon, fuck you over. I'd much rather use either Raichu or Jolteon for this purpose, the former because it has Speed and Agility, and the latter because of Shell Smash.

Electrify is still a bit gimmicky in STABmons simply because it's easily anticipated and the opponent will switch to their faster mon. Especially on a mon that can't boost its Speed.

So does every other Electrify user, with Raichu being outsped by all those as well. But really it won't be Manectric versus all those, there are teammates for a reason. And Mega Manectric has Intimidate and 135 Speed how does Terrakion "fuck it over".

 

[Adonzo]

If a Terrakion switches in on an unevolved Manectric, regardless of any previously acquired boosts, your entire Electrify strategy goes down the toilet, as it WILL outspeed and KO normal Manectric before you can Electrify it. For Manectric to beat Terrakion, it needs to Mega Evolve, Intimidate, and still take massive damage from Terrakion, who will still outspeed you on the turn you evolve.

-1 252 Atk Choice Band Terrakion Close Combat vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Mega Manectric: 235-277 (83.3 - 98.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

If practically any entry hazards were on the field, you're dead. If the opponent has a single priority user, you're dead.

EDIT: Jolteon works well as an Electrify user because 130 Speed is still extremely high and allows him to outspeed a ton of threats. Manectric's 105 Speed just isn't that impressive. Even the 5/10 point boost to Raichu/Raikou's 110/115 is a significant step up.

EDIT2: Forgot that Terrakion picks up High Jump Kick / Head Smash in this meta.

-1 252 Atk Choice Band Terrakion High Jump Kick vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Mega Manectric: 255-300 (90.4 - 106.3%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO
-1 252 Atk Choice Band Terrakion Head Smash vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Mega Manectric: 294-346 (104.2 - 122.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO

So yeah.

 

[MagicMissingno]

Would normal type moves affected by pixilate, airlerate, and refrigerate count as normal moves or fairy, flying, ice moves since the ability changes them?

 

[EV]

Would normal type moves affected by pixilate, airlerate, and refrigerate count as normal moves or fairy, flying, ice moves since the ability changes them?

In STABmons, moves are only learned by Pokemon of the same type like you would teach them a TM. Those abilities listed only affect Normal-type moves during a battle. For example, Aurorus can't learn Boomburst even though Refrigerate turns it into an Ice-type move during battle. It has to be able to learn it outside of battle.

Also, new homework up!

 

[AWailOfATail]

The_Eevee_General Dammit, I was gonna use that Shuckle. It can tank quite a bit with Heal Order, and can then outlast with Infestation/Toxic. Only thing I would have done differently was maybe Defend Order instead of Protect, but Protect's there to just stall to death. Possibly a wall's greatest nightmare, it can't switch out and it can boost its Defense if needed. Not on a computer, but will look at the other sets more when I get on one.

 

[Adonzo]

w/ Sap Sipper
Adamant, 4HP/252A/252SP, @ Life Orb
-Spore
-Belly Drum
-ExtremeSpeed
-Horn Leech

Um, did you mean Sawsbuck or Leafeon here? Gogoat can't learn the Normal movepool.

 

[EV]

Um, did you mean Sawsbuck or Leafeon here? Gogoat can't learn the Normal movepool.

>.< Yes! I was looking at Gogoat when I thought I'd revive ol' Sawsbuck. Good catch.

EC for that! ;)

 

[skies]

[Not trying to be disrespectful to the teacher, but I don't like that layout. I put into PS! Importable version for easier viewing.]

Sawsbuck @ Life Orb
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 HP
Adamant Nature
- Spore
- Belly Drum
- Extreme Speed
- Horn Leech

Sawsbuck is back! This set is identical to the one last generation, if I recall correctly. Spore & Belly Drum is lethal and I believe that only it and Leafeon get it, iirc? The sad thing is... it isn't as great any more. It can't just spam Spore on everything anymore and there is so many things that can outspeed and kill before it pulls off a Belly Drum. I mean, if it gets one off it is pretty damn hard to stop, but it has difficulty getting there. I've also been wondering, how come this thing isn't running Jolly? I mean, 100 Base Speed is pretty good, why not abuse it instead of outspeeding 81 and below. This is pretty important, considering you are now losing to the wide variety of base 100 Pokemon, such as Mega Kanga, amongst other things. Your Extreme Speed's will also be slower than anything with 83+ Speed with Adamant. Sure, you get more Power, but I am thinking the Speed is more important. Extreme Speed doesn't gurantee a first move. Horn Leech is great, as it can get back that lost health! Another reason you should run Jolly! If you can't outspeed and Horn Leech, you'll be forced to use Extreme Speed and rack up Life Orb damage. Overall, this thing has its niche, but this gen it is a little tougher for it to pull it off.

Shuckle @ Leftovers
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 4 SDef / 252 HP / 252 Def
Bold Nature
- Infestation
- Heal Order
- Toxic
- Protect

This set is ok. Simply very gimmicky. Shuckle is complete Taunt bait and isn't even that bulky considering it's HP. I mean, yeah, you could use this set, but so can every other Bug-type. Some notable Bug-Types that do this better are Volcarona and Accelgor. Volcarona can trump the Steel-types that wall this set, while also being more offensive (replacing protect with Fiery Dance). Accelgor on the other hand has a very high Speed. I don't even think Protect is worth it really on anything else besides Shuckle, who has nothing better to do anyways.

Umbreon @ Leftovers
Ability: Synchronize
EVs: 252 Def / 252 HP / 4 SDef
Impish Nature
- Topsy-turvy
- Recover
- Foul Play
- Heal Bell

Togekiss @ Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
Modest Nature
- Oblivion Wing
- Moonblast
- Fire Blast
- Nasty Plot

Aegislash @ Leftovers
Ability: Stance Change
EVs: 252 Def / 252 HP / 4 SDef
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spd
- King's Shield
- Night Shade
- Toxic
- Gyro Ball

 

[Adonzo]

w/ Serene Grace
Modest, 4HP/252SA/252SP, @ Leftovers
-Oblivion Wing
-Moonblast
-Fire Blast
-Nasty Plot

I think I'd rather run Power Herb Geomancy here. Leftovers aren't all that necessary when you have the powerful recovery of +2 STAB Oblivion Wing, and Toge would really appreciate the Speed boost.

 

[Pikachuun]

I'm going to be using Chesnaught's format because of personal preference :P

Sawsbuck @ Life Orb
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 HP
Adamant Nature
- Spore
- Belly Drum
- Extreme Speed
- Horn Leech

With the nerf of spore, this set is sort of crippled if your opponent has a Grass type (especially so for Ferro). The nature I kind of get, with E-speed and all, but I like Jolly more because I like outspeeding things I normally wouldn't with Adamant. What I used to do would work well when it did, and I think it's even more viable now: Replace Spore with Jump Kick. You may be thinking "What are you doing? Spore is broken!" It's simple why I picked this. They will immediately switch into Ferrothorn if they have one to take the oncoming Spore and proceed to wall you, or take the Spore and switch into something like Skarm or Heatran. Not if you have Jump Kick! Set up a Belly Drum and watch those guys get OHKO'd instantly (or 2HKO if Skarm). Things that would otherwise wall you are now crippled or dead, and you can continue sweeping with confidence. Win-win scenario imo.

Togekiss @ Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
Modest Nature
- Oblivion Wing
- Moonblast
- Fire Blast
- Nasty Plot

There were 2 problems with Geomancy Xerneas which aren't present on Geomancy Togekiss. 1: Recovery is an issue. With Geomancy Togekiss, that's solved with Oblivion Wing (hey look both cover legendaries' signature moves on a single set :V). 2: Steel types wall you, because all you can really do is 60 BP HP Fire them. Togekiss gets Fire Blast, so this is irrelevant too (except Heatran, obviously). Phazing still is a problem, but when you OHKO almost every steel type phazer with SR up and are immune to Dragon Tail, it isn't as big of one. Basically, Geomancy + Power Herb is the way to go.

 

[bobbyvaporeon]

I feel that Sableye is better than Umbreon, but I'll go through some pros and cons of both:
Parts Umbreon is better in:
•much better bulk, letting it live a lot more hits than the relatively frail Sableye
•Access to heal bell and Roar, neither of Which Sableye has
• can also use Wish instead of Recover, letting it be a wish passer
Parts Sableye is better at:
•A secondary ghost typing that gives it immunities to Fighting and Ghost
•prankster Topsy Turvy, letting it beat faster setup sweepers like Sawsbuck and Extremespeed-less Sylveon
•prankster healing and Destiny bond. This alone puts it ahead.
I'd rather use Sableye.

 

[canno]

Adamant, 4HP/252A/252SP, @ Life Orb
-Spore
-Belly Drum
-ExtremeSpeed
-Horn Leech

I'm going to echo Pikachuun here and say that Jump Kick > Spore, and Jolly > Adamant (after a BD its going to wreck with or without Adamant, and Jolly lets it out speed other ESpeeders). imo, Dark Void, despite it's lower accuracy, is the best sleep move in the game, since it has nothing immune to it, although Spore is very good too. Spore probably has more place on a supporter though in Gen 6. I'd personally run a Shell Smash set with Adamant and bulk EVs, since that can set-up multiple times unlike Sawsbuck. LO also seems counter intuitive, although Horn Leech gives recovery back, so I guess it's not too bad. Power Whip / Leaf Blade with Sitrus or Silk Scarf doesn't seem too bad either though. This thing doesn't like faster ESpeeders, but its pretty fast by default.

Bold, 252HP/252D/4SD, @ Leftovers
-Infestation
-Heal Order
-Toxic
-Protect

Not a big fan of this set, mainly because Shuckle really isn't that bulky due to its low HP and the fact that it's taunt bait. It also invites any Steel-type to come in for free and wreck its shit (although Shuckle in general does that), which is a problem since Steel-types can run Shift Gear and have SE STAB. If Shuckle is to be used at all, I'd run one with hazards and either lefties or a custap berry. Overall, not a big fan.

Impish, 252HP/252D/4SD, @ Leftovers
-Topsy-Turvy
-Recover
-Foul Play
-Heal Bell

This thing is a pretty cool Special Wall due to its access to a ton of moves thanks to Eevee and its great bulk. I personally wouldn't run Topsy-Turvy - that's better left to Sableye I feel, who is immune to ESpeed and has Prankster. It gets cool moves from its Normal-typing that it can use over Topsy-Turvy like Glare, Roar, and Encore. Rapid Spin is also a thing this thing gets, although that's better left to a Sylveon, whom has Pixilate Rapid Spin. Meanwhile, it's Dark typing gives it access to Dark Void and Knock Off, two moves that are pretty neat on a supporter. It even has Memento for more offensive-teams, althoguh I feel that there are better users of the move. Everything else seems fine on it though.

Modest, 4HP/252SA/252SP, @ Leftovers
-Oblivion Wing
-Moonblast
-Fire Blast
-Nasty Plot

Geomancy + White Herb with Timid is probably better as a late-game sweeper, although Nasty Plot can try and wall break due to its good bulk. Geomancy doesn't even suffer that much from Leftovers since Oblivion Wing is going to keep it very healthy. I don't think Moonblast is even necessary - a set of Geomancy / Oblivion Wing or Aeroblast / Aura Sphere / Roost gives you some sweet neutral coverage and recovery.

Relaxed, 252HP/252D/4SD, (0 Speed IVs) @ Leftovers
-King's Shield
-Night Shade
-Toxic
-Gyro Ball

This is pretty cool, but if Night Shade turns you into Blade Form, then I think Gear Grind or Shadow Ball is better over it, although idk if it does. Unfortunately it's support movepool is barren, so there's not that many option to use. Not much else to say about this set - maybe Shadow Sneak over Toxic for priority damage? Even though it's Attack isn't EV'd, it still has a base 150 attack, although going first makes you very fragile so maybe not the best idea. On an unrelated note, Doom Desire Aegislash sounds like it could be neat. Doom Desire turn 1 and then Kings Shield for damage.

 

[ellipse]

Shuckle @ Leftovers
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 4 SDef / 252 HP / 252 Def
Bold Nature
- Infestation
- Heal Order
- Toxic
- Protect

As The Reptile already said, this set is asking for a steel or any setup sweeper with sub to come in and have it's way with shuckle, and proceed to start wrecking havoc. Scizor, Metagross, excadrill, jirachi, (mega) lucario, mega mawile,sub DD kyurem-B, aegislash (although I have no clue as to whether or not it will be actually sweeping rather than walling), and stored power reuniclus (this one is less immediately threatening) all can set up on Shuckle easily and possibly cost its user the match. In addition keldeo at full health (water spout), banded azumarill (crabhammer), (Mega) aerodactyll (mega OHKOs with head smash, regular can OHKO with rocks), Greninja at full health (water spout, any prior damage), all have chances to OHKO, and nothing wants to switch in to them, not to mention various things that can 2HKO it before it can actually do anything important. On top of that, all of the things that shuckle could trap (normals, defensive mons lacking a way to heal status) can all switch away from shuckle before he can actually trap them. I agree with The Reptile about this set, he is much better off running some kind of hazard set, although even there he's outclassed by crustle, who manages to have some offensive presence.

On another note, do you guys think Furfrou could be any good? It gains access to viable recovery, stockpile, super fang, endeavor, encore, and a bunch of other good supporting moves that it lacked, so it might actually be able to do something while walling now.

 

[canno]

On another note, do you guys think Furfrou could be any good? It gains access to viable recovery, stockpile, super fang, endeavor, encore, and a bunch of other good supporting moves that it lacked, so it might actually be able to do something while walling now.

Furfro could be neat now that it gets a good recovery move, a way to actually hurt things, and multiple ways to cripple pokemon. He gets stuff like Glare, Lovely Kiss, Encore, Whirlwind, and Rapid Spin. Its low Special Defense and weakness to Fighting is still a problem, plus its lack of resistance, but Fur Coat and it's new movepool are nice, and it has really good speed.

 

[toxicroaker]

w/ Sap Sipper
Adamant, 4HP/252A/252SP, @ Life Orb
-Spore
-Belly Drum
-ExtremeSpeed
-Horn Leech

I think this set has lost most of its touch. For one spore isn't as good considering all grass types now can't be spored. Another reason is topsy-turvy. The major user of topsy-turvy is going to be sabeleye who is also immune to extremespeed and will out-prioritize horn leech. The way to improve this set though would be to give him a jolly nature. That would allow it to outspeed many threats that would normally kill it. Another thing to consider is a new item. The only better item choice I can think of is to have a sitrus berry to heal you up and giving it jump kick instead of horn leech to counter the steel types. but then you would have to give up quite a bit of power.

 

[canno]

I just thought of something - how about using Lovely Kiss over Spore on Sawsbuck? Sure, it's less accurate than Spore is, but it's as accurate as Sleep Powder, and unlike Spore it can put Grass-type and Overcoatmon to sleep. Also, Junp Kick > Horn Leech is a bad idea since then Ghost-types wall you to hell and back.