1. New to the forums? Check out our Mentorship Program!
    Our mentors will answer your questions and help you become a part of the community!
  2. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.

Tangela (UU Analysis)

Discussion in 'Uploaded Analyses' started by shrang, Oct 28, 2010.

  1. shrang

    shrang Reaction to Ubers ladder
    is a Contributor to Smogonis a Battle Server Moderatoris a Tiering Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2009
    Messages:
    4,276
    <Insert vine inuendos here>

    [​IMG]

    http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/tangela

    [Overview]
    <p>You may be wondering why Tangela would even be considered for use on any team when Tangrowth exists, especially since it's allowed in UU; however, Tangela's higher Speed and lower defenses make it an exceptional user of Sleep Powder and Endeavor. However, outside of that niche, Tangrowth will always be the better choice. Just don't be fooled by the innocent look of this ball of vines; if unprepared for, Tangela can leave many opponents in despair.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Sunny Day + Endeavor Lead
    move 1: Sunny Day
    move 2: Endeavor
    move 3: Sleep Powder
    move 4: Leaf Storm / Energy Ball / SolarBeam
    item: Focus Sash
    ability: Chlorophyll
    nature: Timid
    evs: 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    ivs: 0 HP / 0 Def / 0 SpD

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Tangela is one of three Pokemon who have access to Endeavor, a sleep inducing move, and a way of patching up its poor Speed, the others being Smeargle and Tangrowth. Tangela's lower defenses and higher Speed make it a better Endeavor lead than Tangrowth, and Smeargle is not allowed in UU. The idea behind this set is to incapacitate the opposing lead with Sleep Powder, and then use Endeavor to weaken the switch-in. This is done by allowing the opposing lead to critically damage Tangela while it survives with its Focus Sash, then Sleep Powder is used to put them to sleep. As most opponents will switch out their lead, Tangela can use this turn to set up Sunny Day and double its Speed, and then follow up with a fast Endeavor to bring the switch-in to very low health. When faced with leads such as Omastar and Cloyster, it is usually better to just OHKO them with Leaf Storm before they can do anything.</p>

    <p>Sunny Day, Endeavor, and Sleep Powder are obviously the crux of this set. Leaf Storm is the recommended Grass-type move, and is used to deal massive amounts of damage to Ghost-types who are immune to Endeavor, although Energy Ball can be used for reliable, consistent damage. SolarBeam is also an option, although the ability to OHKO Omastar and Cloyster without having to set up the sun is usually more appealing.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Fake Out leads such as Ambipom and Flame Orb Hariyama stop Tangela's strategy quite easily, as they can break its Focus Sash without Tangela being able to do anything. Ambipom can then KO Tangela with U-turn or Return, while Hariyama is immune to sleep thanks to its Flame Orb. Opposing sleep-inducing leads such as Venusaur and Jumpluff can also put Tangela to sleep before it can move. Leads who can Trick a Choice item onto Tangela, such as Mesprit and Uxie, will also mess it up. For these reasons, Choice Band Spiritomb is a fantastic teammate to Tangela, as it can switch into Fake Out from Ambipom and Trick from Mesprit and Uxie, and then Pursuit them as they flee; it also takes little damage from any of Hariyama's attacks. Choice Band Altaria and RestTalk Weezing also make excellent checks to Choice Scarf Venusaur or Jumpluff, as they can switch into Sleep Powder without too much trouble. Altaria can use Sleep Talk to pick a Choice Band boosted attack, while RestTalk Weezing does not mind being put to sleep at all.</p>

    <p>Since Ghost-types are immune to Endeavor, Pokemon who can take them on easily are good teammates. Mixed Houndoom can switch into virtually all Ghost-types in UU and Pursuit them as they flee, or use Crunch to KO them if they are brave enough to stay in. Defensive Drapion is a good counter to Nasty Plot and Calm Mind Mismagius who could potentially set up on Tangela.</p>

    <p>It is important to note that while Tangela is mostly using Sunny Day for itself, the weather still lasts for five turns, which is enough to be abused by yourself and your opponent alike. Houndoom and Flash Fire Arcanine are excellent teammates for this reason, as they are immune to Fire-type attacks, and receive boosted Fire-type attacks in the sun. Other Chlorophyll abusers can also take advantage of sunny weather; Shiftry, Exeggutor, Victreebel, and Tangrowth are all good examples.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>Tangela can take advantage of its decent base 100 Special Attack and Chlorophyll to run a special sweeper set in the sun. SolarBeam, Hidden Power Fire, AncientPower, and Sleep Powder make Tangela quite difficult to switch into when the weather is sunny. However, Tangrowth and other Pokemon with Chlorophyll, such as Exeggutor and Victreebel, are usually better for this role. This is also the case for Choice Specs, which is outclassed by Tangrowth, and Choice Scarf, which is better done by Venusaur. Tangela also has access to Swords Dance, but its Attack stat is way too low to pull it off efficiently.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>Tangela is difficult to counter if you do not have the right lead match-up. Ambipom and Flame Orb Hariyama defeat Tangela relatively easily, as do Choice Scarf Venusaur and TrickScarf Mesprit and Uxie. If you don't have any of these leads, however, then Ghost-types such as Mismagius and Spiritomb make good switch-ins to Tangela, as they are immune to Endeavor, although they need to avoid Leaf Storm. RestTalk Weezing and Altaria do not mind being put to sleep by Sleep Powder. Weezing can use Will-O-Wisp to break Tangela's Focus Sash, while Altaria can just set up Dragon Dance in its face.</p>
  2. SlimMan

    SlimMan

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2010
    Messages:
    1,474
    I would like to take over that anaylsis. Do I still need Overhazard's permission, or can I just do it?
  3. shrang

    shrang Reaction to Ubers ladder
    is a Contributor to Smogonis a Battle Server Moderatoris a Tiering Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2009
    Messages:
    4,276
    No, I'm doing it at the moment. I was just saying if you are currently working on it, continue writing it, otherwise I'm doing it (ROAR)
  4. SlimMan

    SlimMan

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2010
    Messages:
    1,474

    *gasp* Miscommunication! :0
    That's fine
  5. shrang

    shrang Reaction to Ubers ladder
    is a Contributor to Smogonis a Battle Server Moderatoris a Tiering Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2009
    Messages:
    4,276
    bump please
  6. Bluewind

    Bluewind My appearance, ability, and awesomeness strike fea
    is a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2009
    Messages:
    2,335
    Ok, let's get it out of QC. The Lead set works perfectly and has notable advantages over Tangrowth, so it's obviously approved; but I don't think the same about the Sunny Day set. Yeah, the extra Speed is always awesome to have, but the only things you're really outspeeding are Scarf Venusaur (who you don't OHKO), Scarf Blaziken (who you can't touch), and Scarf Rotom (valid one). As a tradeback, you miss a LOT on bulk, can't take the same amount of priority or a special attack, and can't create the doubt of special or physical attacker, which makes it much easier to counter. It isn't an awful sweeper on its own, but the other set it can use seems to be much better... I guess it's kinda the reason why Magmar doesn't get a mixed set even though it's faster than Magmortar. It might come off as if I'm rejecting this based on the fact Tangrowth does this set better, but I really think it isn't a good sweeper on its own, and something that one would never really use.

    tl;dr: remove Special Attacker and approved.
  7. uraga

    uraga Walking the streets with you in your worn-out jeans
    is a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2009
    Messages:
    949
    bluewind does all the work i just agree with him

    QC APPROVED 2/2
  8. shrang

    shrang Reaction to Ubers ladder
    is a Contributor to Smogonis a Battle Server Moderatoris a Tiering Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2009
    Messages:
    4,276
    Changes made. No-one minds that I put Solarbeam as the last option right??
  9. EonADS

    EonADS

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2010
    Messages:
    490
    Just a nitpicky thing, but make note of Tangela's access to Sleep Powder in the Overview. I mean sure, it's something Tangrowth and Venusaur have, but it's still worth a mention b/c it's one of the best goddamn moves in UU.
  10. shrang

    shrang Reaction to Ubers ladder
    is a Contributor to Smogonis a Battle Server Moderatoris a Tiering Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2009
    Messages:
    4,276
    Sorry this took a while, I'm getting really bored with Pokemon these days and haven't found the motivation to be writing. Ready for GP checks.
  11. Komodo

    Komodo
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis an Artist Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2008
    Messages:
    4,002
    GP check 1/2

    Show Hide


    Remove

    Edit

    I've added the new tags and removed Team Options for the "new" format.
    [​IMG]
  12. shrang

    shrang Reaction to Ubers ladder
    is a Contributor to Smogonis a Battle Server Moderatoris a Tiering Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2009
    Messages:
    4,276
    Thanks Komodo, changes made
  13. Fatecrashers

    Fatecrashers acta est fabula
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis an Artist Alumnusis a Super Moderator Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2007
    Messages:
    4,997
    thats using your noodle

    GP CHECK TWO: Legacy

    delete
    insert

    Show Hide
    [Overview]
    <p>You may be wondering why Tangrowth isn't used instead, especially since even though it's allowed in UU; however, Tangela's higher Speed and lower defenses make it an exceptional user of Sleep Powder and Endeavor. If unprepared for, Tangela can be surprisingly powerful leave many opponents in despair.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Sunny Day + Endeavor Lead
    move 1: Sunny Day
    move 2: Endeavor
    move 3: Sleep Powder
    move 4: Leaf Storm / Energy Ball / SolarBeam
    item: Focus Sash
    ability: Chlorophyll
    nature: Timid
    evs: 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    ivs: 0 HP / 0 Def / 0 SpD

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Tangela is one of three Pokemon who have has access to Endeavor, a sleep inducing move, and a way of patching up its poor Speed, the others being Smeargle and Tangrowth. Due to Tangela's lower defenses and higher Speed make it a better as an Endeavor lead than Tangrowth. The idea behind the this set is to incapacitate the opposing lead with Sleep Powder, while using Endeavor to break down weaken the switch-in. This is done by allowing the opposing lead to critically damage Tangela while it survives on with its Focus Sash, then Sleep Powder is used to put them to sleep. As most opponents will switch out their lead, Tangela can use this turn to set up Sunny Day and double its Speed, followed with a fast Endeavor to bring the switch-in to very low health. When faced with leads such as Omastar and Cloyster, it is usually just better to just use OHKO them with Leaf Storm before they can do anything.</p>

    <p>Sunny Day, Endeavor, and Sleep Powder are obviously the crux of the this set. Leaf Storm is used to deal massive amounts of damage to Ghost-types who are immune to Endeavor, although Energy Ball can be used for consistency reliable, consistent damage. SolarBeam is also an option, although the ability to OHKO Omastar and Cloyster without having to set up the sun is usually more appealing.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Fake Out leads such as Ambipom and Flame Orb Hariyama stop Tangela quite easily, as they can break its Focus Sash without Tangela being able to do anything. Ambipom can then KO Tangela with U-turn or Return, while Hariyama is immune to sleep thanks to its Flame Orb. Opposing sleep-inducing leads such as Venusaur and Jumpluff can also put Tangela to sleep before it can move. Leads who can Trick a Choice item onto Tangela, such as Mesprit and Uxie, will also mess it up. Choice Band Spiritomb is a fantastic teammate to Tangela, it can switch into Fake Out from Ambipom, Trick from Mesprit and Uxie, and Pursuit them as they flee; it also takes while taking little damage from any of Hariyama's attacks. Choice Band Altaria or and RestTalk Weezing also make excellent checks to Choice Scarf Venusaur or Jumpluff, as they can switch into Sleep Powder without too much trouble. Altaria can use Sleep Talk to pick a Choice Band boosted attack, while RestTalk Weezing does not mind being put to sleep at all.</p>

    <p>Since Ghost-types are immune to Endeavor, Pokemon who can take them on easily are good teammates. Mixed Houndoom can switch into virtually all Ghost-types in UU and Pursuit them as they flee, or use Crunch to KO them if they stay in. Defensive Drapion is a good counter to Nasty Plot and Calm Mind Mismagius who could potentially set up on Tangela.</p>

    <p>It is important to note that while Tangela is mostly using Sunny Day for itself, Sunny Day the weather effect still lasts for five turns, which is enough to be abused by yourself and your opponent alike. Houndoom and Flash Fire Arcanine are excellent teammates for this reason, as they are immune to Fire-type attacks, and receive boosted Fire-type attacks in the sun. Other Chlorophyll abusers can also take advantage of sunny weather; Shiftry, Exeggutor, Victreebel, and Tangrowth are all good examples.</p>

    [Other Options]
    <p>Tangela can take advantage of its decent base 100 Special Attack and Chlorophyll to run a special sweeper set in the sun. SolarBeam, Hidden Power Fire, AncientPower, and Sleep Powder make Tangela quite difficult to switch into when it is sunny. However, Tangrowth and other Pokemon with Chlorophyll, such as Exeggutor and Victreebel, are usually better for this role. This is also the case for Choice Specs, which is outclassed by Tangrowth, and Choice Scarf, which is better done by Venusaur. Tangela also has access to Swords Dance, but its Attack stat is way too low to pull it off efficiently.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]
    <p>Tangela is difficult to counter if you do not have the right lead match-up. Ambipom and Flame Orb Hariyama defeat Tangela relatively easily, as do Choice Scarf Venusaur and TrickScarf Mesprit and Uxie. If you do not have any of these leads, however, then Ghost-types such as Mismagius and Spiritomb make good switch-ins to can switch into Tangela, as they are immune to Endeavor, although they need to avoid Leaf Storm. RestTalk Weezing and Altaria do not mind being put to sleep by Sleep Powder. Weezing can use Will-O-Wisp to break Tangela's Focus Sash, while Altaria can just set up Dragon Dance in its face.</p>


    nicely done, be careful when implementing checks however!

    [​IMG]

    EDIT: what YaM has spotted has been edited in as well
  14. YaM

    YaM

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2009
    Messages:
    322
    from fatecrashers

    [Overview]

    If unprepared for, Tangela can leave many opponents in despair.</p>

    [SET COMMENTS]

    When faced with leads such as Omastar and Cloyster, it is usually better to just use OHKO them with Leaf Storm before they can do anything.</p>
  15. shrang

    shrang Reaction to Ubers ladder
    is a Contributor to Smogonis a Battle Server Moderatoris a Tiering Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2009
    Messages:
    4,276
    Thanks Fatecrashers and YaM, this is done.
  16. Oglemi

    Oglemi I ask consent before I thrash anuses.
    is a Tournament Directoris a member of the Site Staffis a Community Contributoris a Pokemon Researcheris a Smogon Media Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis an Administratoris a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
    C&C Leader

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2009
    Messages:
    8,453
    I just expanded upon the writing in a couple of places.

    Uploaded.

    Thanks for all you've done for C&C shrang! Hopefully you don't lose too much interest in Pokemon and decide to continue to contribute!

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)