Other The Next Best Thing - ORAS OU Edition (Discussing Gardevoir sets) Check Post #920

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firehusky said:
Kinda iffy on this one, as fire blast gyarados just doesn't sound right to me. Sure, it can lure in ferrothorn, but +1 bounce already does a huge amount of damage. Holding back on this for now.
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Tbh, I'm not too sure about it myself. Gyarados doesn't have much to work with.

However, I will say that since this a wallbreaking set rather than a Dragon Dance set, it's a better lure than Bounce. SubDD w/ Bounce is vulnerable to either being stalled out with Protect or being paralyzed by Ferrothorn, so it's really not the best solution. Life Orb Fire Blast on a wallbreaker set nearly eliminates Ferrothorn and Gyarados is never pressured to stay in because it doesn't boost on the wallbreaker set. Toxic also allows it to get past some of the non-Steel or Poison type Pokemon that Gyarados will struggle to beat like Slowbro and Unaware Clefable.

I'm not sure if this is enough to include the set, but I think it needs to be looked at from another perspective.
 
Tbh toxic sounds like a really cool option, so I'll include it.
However, it would be preferable if you could get rid of fire blast as it's kind of notorious for being a bad lure, see here.
http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/a-guide-to-lures-in-oras-ou.3527940/
Fire Blast makes you walled by pretty much every dragon not weak to earthquake, such as the lati twins, and d nite.

It would be nice if you could change the set to ice fang / waterfall / toxic / earthquake or stone edge as it still lures in stuff like slowbro and clef, while also not being entirely walled by dragons.
 
Changed it. I also put Aqua Tail over Waterfall because it grabs crucial 2HKOs that Waterfall can't get and added Taunt as an extra option for stallbreaking purposes.
 
s0me1 b0red said:
Excuse me if I'm wrong, but firehusky shouldn't voting have started by now?
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Oh yeah woops.
I forgot.
Voting shall commence now, til Tuesday. Here are the options you may vote for.
Current entries:
SketchUp's Natural Gift Lure Gyarados
Teeny Victory's Choice Scarf Gyarados
malware000's Chesto Dance Gyarados
s0me1 b0red's AV Gyarados
GnralLao's Parashuffler Gyarados
Jukain's Natural Gift Lure Gyarados
Jaguar360's Toxic Wallbreaker Gyarados

Remember to bold your vote :]
I'm voting for SketchUp's Natural Gift Lure Gyarados
 
Teeny Victory's choice scarf Gyarados

Here's a bonus set I thought up after entering:

Gyarados @ leftovers/AV
252 HP, 252 atk, 4 def
Ability: Intimidate
Adamant nature

- Whirlpool
- Waterfall
- Bounce
- Earthquake/Dragon Dance

Trapper Gyara is intended to stop things switching out on bounce turns. DD allows it to set up on trapped things that can't touch it, while Bounce + Waterfall is the main point of the set. Waterfall is it's best water STAB IMO. EQ can be used over DD to hit steels like specs Magnezone and of course electric types who love facing non EQ Gyara.
 
s0me1 b0red said:
Teeny Victory's choice scarf Gyarados

Here's a bonus set I thought up after entering:

Gyarados @ leftovers/AV
252 HP, 252 atk, 4 def
Ability: Intimidate
Adamant nature

- Whirlpool
- Waterfall
- Bounce
- Earthquake/Dragon Dance

Trapper Gyara is intended to stop things switching out on bounce turns. DD allows it to set up on trapped things that can't touch it, while Bounce + Waterfall is the main point of the set. Waterfall is it's best water STAB IMO. EQ can be used over DD to hit steels like specs Magnezone and of course electric types who love facing non EQ Gyara.
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Sorry buddy, you can only enter 1 set, and voting has already started.
 
Ok, so I kind of forgot about this thing. It's Friday, so we had 3 extra days. If I counted correctly, malware000's Chesto Dance Gyarados won! Yay congrats :]
Our next test subject shall be...
latios.gif

Latios

Current entries:
Teeny Victory's CM Draco Latios
MrAldo's Heal Block Latios
cis scum's Stallbreaker Latios
ArchPhantom's Teamplayer Latios
GnralLao's Cleaner Latios
s0me1 b0red's Whirlpool + Luster Purge Latios​
 
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lure lati
latios.gif

Latios (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 32 Atk / 224 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Earthquake
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Recover / Roost / Defog

basically the idea behind this set is that latios normally brings in steel types like ferrothorn and heatran. but with this set it punishes some of it's normal counters with a strong lo boosted se move. when a heatran normally sees an hp fire, it is tempted to come in but gets smacked by an eq same with ferro and vice versa. other than that it just has normal draco for stab and a filler for the team's needs.

Calcs:

252 SpA Life Orb Latios Hidden Power Fire vs. 252 HP / 168 SpD Ferrothorn: 265-312 (75.2 - 88.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
32 Atk Life Orb Latios Earthquake vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Heatran: 338-400 (87.7 - 103.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

​
 
Presenting CM draco latios

Latios (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Calm Mind
- Draco Meteor
- Psyshock
- Roost

This sets aim is to lure in things such as slowbro, mew etc who aim to take on draco and recover off the damage, and beat them 1v1 through sheer boosts, as even though draco drops your special attack, a +2 draco is extremely powerful, nocking out everything that isnt a blob, fairy or steel type. It also beats cm M-bro, can play more efficent mind games with bisharp, and beats chansey as well. Its overall a very under rated set that should definitely see more use.
 
hey yal said:
lure lati
latios.gif

Latios (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 32 Atk / 224 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Earthquake
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Recover / Roost / Defog

basically the idea behind this set is that latios normally brings in steel types like ferrothorn and heatran. but with this set it punishes some of it's normal counters with a strong lo boosted se move. when a heatran normally sees an hp fire, it is tempted to come in but gets smacked by an eq same with ferro and vice versa. other than that it just has normal draco for stab and a filler for the team's needs.

Calcs:

252 SpA Life Orb Latios Hidden Power Fire vs. 252 HP / 168 SpD Ferrothorn: 265-312 (75.2 - 88.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
32 Atk Life Orb Latios Earthquake vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Heatran: 338-400 (87.7 - 103.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

​
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This is kind of standard to an extent. HP Fire is a really common move on Latios, and Earthquake is also a well known lure. Holding back on this for now.
 
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firehusky said:
This is kind of standard to an extent. HP Fire is a really common move on Latios, and Earthquake is also a well known rare. Holding back on this for now.
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well the reason this is kinda new as it is packing both of these coverage moves. for example, if i revealed eq and hit smth, ferro would be tempted to switch in only to eat an hp fire because most latisonly have one coverage move instead of two. i still understand why you wont accept this.
 
You could pretty much take any Pokemon that has at least two coverage moves and say that. For example, I have a Mega Metagross with both Grass Knot and Earthquake. He has a Hippowdon, and I use Grass Knot on it. Then he would be tempted to switch in his Heatran and then eat the EQ.
 
latios.png


Latios (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 29 HP / 0 Atk
- Heal Block
- Psyshock
- Recover
- Draco Meteor

It has an extensive movepool but not much that deserves a mention... oh well, here we go.

Your standard life orb latios with a twist. Heal Block let it get through plenty of walls in the metagame that rely on their reliable recovery. Thanks to it can beat chansey easily, gives clefable a headache cause moonblast wont OHKO unless it is a +1 and beat mixed hippowdon with a combination of draco meteor + psyshock. Screwing up passive recovery like leftovers and leech seed is pretty neat as well. Double STAB for consistency sake.

Heal Block is a pretty cool move is given situations. Recover cause it sounds cooler.
 
Stallbreaker Latios

latios.png

Latios (M) @ Leftovers / Latiosite
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Refresh
- Recover
- Calm Mind
- Psyshock / Psychic / Dragon Pulse / Surf / Anything Else

This sounds like an interesting set where it can shrug off Status and recover HP while boosting to +6 Spa / +6 Sdef for a sweep

Latios' STAB coverage can be very limited as once the coverage move is revealed, it can be fairly easy to wall, since Psychic gets walled by Chansey, Mega Sableye and other Dark Types, Dragon Pulse gets walled by Fairies and other options like Surf get walled by Mega Slowbro, so it's very reliant on teammates to remove those threats before it can sweep.

Latiosite can be another option as it lets Latios break Chansey at +6, which it can't do with Leftovers, but it should only be used if you haven't used up a mega slot.

+6 8 SpA Mega Latios Psychic vs. 4 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 298-352 (46.4 - 54.8%) -- 64.5% chance to 2HKO
+6 8 SpA Latios Psychic vs. 4 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 249-294 (38.7 - 45.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO


edit: Luster Purge can also be a good option due to its 50% chance of lowering Special Defense by 1 stage
 
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TeamPlayer Latios (Tailwind + Memento)

381.gif

Latios (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 29 HP
- Tailwind
- Memento
- Draco Meteor
- Psyshock

This set is a different approach to your standard Latios. We all know that Latios gets worn down rather easily, whether it be by him taking on Zard Y and Keldeo or just by the LO recoil he takes. Also, there are those match-ups where your opponent has a Scarf TTar and there's not much you can do to get around it. This is where this set comes in to play.

Once Lati's usefulness has ended or when his death is imminent, you go for Tailwind, Memento, or a combination of both. This opens a small window for set up/sweeping opportunities, benefitting partners like Gyarados, Heracross, Garchomp, Bisharp, Landorus and so much more. Also, slower but powerful Wallbreakers such as Hydreigon will be nothing but hell to face backed by Tailwind. So yeah, it's a really cool twist on Latios that benefits offensive teams and can change the outcome of a game. :]
 
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Whirlpool + Luster Purge Latios (Best V stall)

Latios @ Grip Claw/Life Orb
EVs: 252 S.Atk, 4 S.Def, 252 Spe
Ability: Levitate
Timid Nature

- Luster Purge
- Whirlpool
- Recover
- Draco Meteor/Dragon Pulse/Refresh

What it does: Trap something that can't touch it/can't be broke by much else with Whirlpool, spams Luster Purge for the S.Def drops to the point the opposing poke can't outheal the damage (esp. considering the whirlpool passive damage), heal with recover when necesary, with the final slot open for dragon STAB or healing status. It's best late game when the opponent has nothing to switch into 7 turns of Luster Purge and come out better off. Grip Claw is preferred for the extra 3 turns of trapping. Draco Meteor is normally better than Dragon Pulse for a higher blast of damage on the final turn of whirlwind. Works extremely well with toxic spreaders/T-Spikes.
 
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