The Offenzors [OU]

[connoisseur]

I totally revamped my old team, its weakenesses have been lessened. Unfortunately I totally had to change the entire team. I believe it is
significantly better now. Rotom-A is still a pain for some reason, I'd like help on doing something to KO him. The only new negatives are that I miss Slaking and Empoleon.

The old team was:
Heatran
Gyarados
Slaking
Salamence
Empoleon
Scizor
I removed heatran, and replaced him with Metagross, I wanted explosion to guarantee a KO on almost anything and a priority move to damage faster pokemon.
Slaking was switched for Magnezone, he is of immense use in trapping and killing scizor among others. Salamence was switched for CM Latias, she was far
too good to pass up, even though there was absolutely nothing wrong with a DDmence. Empoleon was replaced with Starmie, I really miss his sweeps, but
Starmie is mad fast and strong. Scizor and Gyra remained the same.
I've had a pretty strong positive record with this team after using it 20-ish times, so I would highly recommend trying it out.
I would appreciate it if you guys could help me improve this team even further. Thank you.

Now for the team:

Metagross @Occa Berry (would shuca do better?)
EVs: 252 HP, 236 Atk, 12 Def, 8 Speed
Adamant (+Atk -SpAtk)
Clear Body
Moves:
-Bullet Punch
-Earthquake
-Explosion
-Stealth Rock
The plan with this guy is to take out the opponent's lead with EQ or 2x Bullet Punch, then explode away a second pokemon. He really only sets up rocks
when the opposing lead is gliscor or something that cannot harm Metagross. 2x bullet punch usually destroys azelf and aero, while EQ bones Heatran and
opposing metagrosses. EQ+Explosion should do significant damage to Swampert. Against Gliscor I'll set up rocks and switch to latias or gyarados.

Latias @ Life Orb
EVs: 252 SpAtk, 252 Speed, 4 HP
Timid (+Speed -Atk)
Levitate
Moves:
-Dragon Pulse
-Surf
-Calm Mind
-Recover
If Lati can pull one or two calm minds, the opponent is in trouble unless he has a healthy scizor on the bench. With 3 or 4, it is pretty game over.
Latias is an awesome sweeper. Recover is for calm minding up against special moves which tend to do less than 50% after 1-2 calm minds and recovering
off life orb damage if needed. Also, Dragon Pulse and Surf have pretty good coverage together.

Magnezone @ Choice Scarf
EVs: 252 SpAtk, 232 Speed, 26 HP
Timid (+Speed -Atk) [Should I make it modest?]
Magnet Pull
Moves:
-Flash Cannon
-Thunderbolt
-HP Fire
-Explosion
This guy takes care of everything no-one else on my team really likes. With Timid and scarf he reaches 358 Speed, while with modest and scarf he reaches
327 Speed. He rapes scizor quite easily with HP, and is a very reliable way to severely dent SD Lucario, a threat which plagued my old team. He also
efficiently takes care of stuff like vaporeon and tentacruel if Scizor does not show his face. Generally I like to keep this guy a secret until scizor
or Lucario show up. If absolutely necessary this guy can tank a thunderbolt to help out gyra and starmie. I don't use flash cannon much, I would like a
suggestion on what to change it to if it is a good idea to do so.

Scizor @ Choice Band
EVs: 244 HP, 252 Atk, 12 Speed
Adamant (+Atk -SpAtk)
Technician
Moves:
-Bullet Punch
-U-Turn
-Superpower
-Pursuit
I believe everyone has seen this thing before. 12 Speed is to outrun other Adamant Scizors by 1, If taking the 4 EVs out of HP is disatrous, please
enlighten as to why. Scizor really does not need much of an explanation. Bullet Punch is outrageously overpowered, even though I superpower with this
guy as much as I bullet bunch. He is good at finishing off things like SD Lucario if it survives a hit from Magnezone's T-Bolt.

Starmie @ Life Orb
EVs: 252 SpAtk, 252 Speed, 6 HP
Timid (+Speed -Atk)
Natural Cure
Moves:
-Hydro Pump
-Thunderbolt
-Ice Beam
-Recover
This is the best pokemon on my team. Recently it swept an entire team for me once metagross did his job. Hydro Pump is much more powerful than
Surf,something which I was really aiming for, and it isn't as unreliable as thunder, while Surf is too weak to OHKO things it is neutral against. I
concentrate on dealing as much damage as possible with Starmie. At 361 Speed, it outspeeds everything it needs to bar Jolteon and Ninjask. T-Bolt and
Ice Beam provide superb coverage in combination with Hydro Pump. I got the idea to use this dangerous beast when it consistently owned me in the past.
It fulfills its role very very well.

Gyarados @ Leftovers
EVs: 252 Atk, 252 Speed, 4 Def
Adamant (+Atk -SpAtk)
Intimidate
Moves:
-Waterfall
-Earthquake
-Stone Edge
-Dragon Dance
This is the traditional DD Gyarados. If it gets a DD it becomes insanely strong, and if it gets 3 or more, you ain't gonna stop this thing. Earthquake
was the move I chose in order to hit electrics hard, obviously after a DD due to speed issues, as no-one else, save metagross who usually has a kill 1st
poke+explode strategy, can crush with them. Without DD Gyarados is still insanely strong and can OHKO many pokemon with super effective moves.

Synergy:
Magnezone synergizes very well with Gyarados and starmie, tanking the thunderbolt aimed at them while also serving latias well by countering scizor.
Gyarados and Latias can switch into the EQs aimed at magnezone or metagross and sweep the offenders away. Starmie takes care of faster threats that the
team can't reliably beat such as Gengar (nonscarfed), Lucario (if Magnezone dies), enemy Starmie, latias, infernape, flygon and nonDD Salamence. Latias
can take a blow for starmie if needed as well.

Well that is my team. Feel free to rate, comment, and suggest improvements.

Threats:
Bold = problematic
Azelf – Leadzelf = koed by bullet punch x 2 if I am so inclined, against DS azelf I stealth rock then explode/stall out the screens with metagross
Blissey – Magnesplosion tends to work. Metagross is not usually alive to explode it, but scizor and gyarados can deal with it
Breloom – Let it sleep something not important(gyarados/scizor) and own it with latias or even starmie
Skarmory – Magnezone
Bronzong – Set up rocks with meta+EQ, if it is levitating then send in something else, maybe scizor
Celebi – Scizor gets a free pursuit ko
Cresellia – Starmie can possibly outpower it as it did in a battle I just played (Hydropump on switchin for 56%, finish with another Hydropump) otherwise scizor does nicely
Crobat – not a threat, anything can take it really, starmie can t-bolt
Donphan – lol waterfall/surf/hydropump or icebeam from gyra/latias/starmie
Drapion – Gyarados's EQ etc...
Dugtrio – latias rapes it, starmie can rape it
Dusknoir – once it is low on health, scizor can pursuit it
Electivire – just dont let it get motor drive.
Empoleon – Starmie can t-bolt it, gyara can EQ
Flygon – lol, I make it reveal its scarfed move choice and act accordingly, if not scarfed starmie can outspeed + KO
Foretress – magnezone = utter rape
Gengar – starmie outspeeds and rapes, scarfgar is dealt with by scizor
Gliscor – starmie hydropumps his ass, gyarados can DD in his face and use waterfall (waterfallx2 is also good), latias can handle it with surf
Gyarados – BIG ISSUE if it DD's. Usually switching in gyarados to intimidate repeatedly is the only way
Hariyama – gyarados sets up, latias sets up etc...
Heatran – gyarados/latias/metagross
Heracross – if scarfed I let it lock into something and then send in latias/gyarados/scizor/magnezone
Hippowdon – surf from latias, starmie in general
Infernape – this guy utterly fails vs latias/gyarados/starmie
Jirachi – Metagross can EQ it, magnezone can utterly embarass it if it is a choice scarf iron head variant as well.
Kingdra – Latias works well, if it is raining I'll need to stall it out with latias or gyarados or lure it to outrage
Latias – scizor, hp fire variants could catch me off guard but then they usually wont have t-bolt and gyara can come in
Lucario – magnezone barely fails to KO, and if gyra is not alive it is gg
Ludicolo – If it is not raining, I am not particularly worried. Otherwise latias can own it.
Machamp – Ouch, I have no idea what to do to him. Generally i can explode on it with magnezone or something
Magnezone – EQ deals with him nicely as does Superpower. My Magnezone can embarass another that is scarfed into tbolt or flash cannon
Mamoswine – latias doesn't have issues with it, neither does gyarados
Metagross – CB gross is dealt with by locking it into EQ and bringing out gyarados. Against leads, EQ+switch to latias/gyarados works well. If it lacks explosion gyarados is an excellent switch
Milotic – starmie can t-bolt, latias can probably get to +6 against it
Miltank – brute force it
Ninjask – set up rocks turn 1, then bullet punch/EQ/switch
Porygon2 – not fun to deal with, starmie can maybe outpower it. Latias can probably get to +6 against it.
PorygonZ – hit it hard with starmie/latias
Regirock – latias can deal with it. Roaring is no problem, most pokemon that I have have a good special move
Registeel – EQ
Rhyperior – starmie/latias crushes it with water moves
Roserade – Stupid statusing leads give me problems. I have no problems actually destroying it after I wake up though.
Rotom-A – I have problems with him. Helpz0rz
Salamence – Clever intimidate switching... yes that means it is a major problem.
Scizor – lol another case of statuatory magnezone rape
Slaking – set up on it while it is down/switches
Snorlax – scizor's superpower, various explosions etc...
Spiritomb – outpower it with starmie/metagross/gyarados
Starmie – its all on the speed tie with my own...JK latias can beat it I think.
Suicune – bring in latias and set up along side it. Having recover>>>having to rest.
Swampert – it roars around so I just use the most powerful move on my pokemon
Tentacruel – EQ/starmie's t-bolt
Togekiss – Thunderbolt/icebeam from starmie works, scizor can beat it up
Tyranitar – Scizor, if it is a DD babiri tar then I'd have some issues...stupid 1 speed more than starmie
Umbreon – let it trap like metagross because it can explode
Vaporeon – thunderbolt it from starmie
Walrein – god damn stallrein, luckily it is rare. before the gay stallrein sequence starmie destroys it.
Weavile – not particularly threatening. Scizor rapes it.
Zapdos – Latias could care less what it does, starmie can kill if low on health

 

[connoisseur]

I believe a bump is in order. I completely overhauled it and believe it is much much better now.

Please do rate, comment, and suggest improvements. Thank you.

 

[Seargeant Chilli]

Wow, some people really don't like your thread...

Anyway, there's not much I can really say, as there are no problems with synergy, items, or anything I can really think of, as it seems well thought out and put together.

All I'm going to do is tell you that no, Shuca Beryy would not be better on Metagross, as the main leads that use Earthquake, which is physical and therefore Metagross can handle it, whereas alot of leads carry Fire- type special moves, and Voila! Occa comes in to play.

Also Timid is most likely the favourable nature for Magnezone, as the whole point of him is to revenge against Steels, and with the nature, EVs and scarf, he outspeeds every Steel outside of Ubers, but with Modest, he can't, and so it will be easier for say, SD Luke or Scizor to hit you before you hit them.

Otherwise, well done, and good luck.

 

[connoisseur]

Wow, some people really don't like your thread...

Anyway, there's not much I can really say, as there are no problems with synergy, items, or anything I can really think of, as it seems well thought out and put together.

All I'm going to do is tell you that no, Shuca Beryy would not be better on Metagross, as the main leads that use Earthquake, which is physical and therefore Metagross can handle it, whereas alot of leads carry Fire- type special moves, and Voila! Occa comes in to play.

Also Timid is most likely the favourable nature for Magnezone, as the whole point of him is to revenge against Steels, and with the nature, EVs and scarf, he outspeeds every Steel outside of Ubers, but with Modest, he can't, and so it will be easier for say, SD Luke or Scizor to hit you before you hit them.

Otherwise, well done, and good luck.

Yeah, I was thinking people hated my thread too or thought my team was crappy.

Thanks for the feedback, I'll keep occa on gross. I guess the question now becomes whether to use Meteor Mash or EQ... Also, when I plugged the numbers into the shoddy battle team builder, Modest Scarf Magnezone at 327 speed sat higher than jolly 252 speed lucario at 306 speed and jolly 252 speed scizor at 251 speed. Are there any other pokemon that it absolutely needs to outrun that it couldnt with modest (timid = 358 speed)? With modest it reaches 393 SpAtk compared to timid's 358 SpAtk which is quite a boost in my opinion.

And thanks, good luck to you too.

 

[derangedyoshi15]

I have two suggestions for your team, which seems very good.

1. For Magnezone's speed, use Hasty/Naive and 228 Speed EVs. The nature will not subtract Attack, making your Explosion stronger, and the EVs let you outrun +Speed natured base 110s (e.g. Timid Latias). The spare EVs can go in HP.
2. I run a DD Gyarados with the following EVs:
Jolly; 88 HP/252 Atk/168 Spe
The extra HP can make it easier to get more DDs, but it's just filler. The Attack is obvious. The speed, with Jolly, means that you outrun Timid Jolteon after a DD and kill it with EQ. Whether or not it's competitively viable, it's really satisfying, since Jolteon users always assume that it's Adamant.

 

[connoisseur]

I implemented the magenzone changes a while back, didn't seem to do any harm so I'll keep it.
I'm not sure about gyarados though. adamant -> jolly is a pretty big loss of power.

Also, I have played my team more and more and have noticed a few glaring problems:

Rotom-A : This dude rapes me most of the time... I have nothing to kill it.
DD Kingdra: This thing rips apart my team reasonably easily if it can come in on scizor's BP.

Are there any ways to change this team to have it deal with those threats better?

 

[connoisseur]

Major Change:
Added a threatlist

Please help me deal with the bolded threats.

 

[WoOoShoOo!!]

Rotom-A : This dude rapes me most of the time... I have nothing to kill it.
DD Kingdra: This thing rips apart my team reasonably easily if it can come in on scizor's BP.

Rotom-A : If that's the case then use CurseLax. Snorlax has a High Special defense, Curse to boost your defense and attack, and Rest to heal status ailments and damage taken. Still be weary of HP[Fighting] as it hurts..

Kindra: Are you kidding me? you can use Latias as a bait to trap it in Outrage, and switch to either Magnezone or Metagross. If Magnezone, you can Thunderbolt if you want to save 'em for later, or Explode!(use Naive Nature, it would strengthen your Explosion). If Metagross, EQ, BP or just Explode..

Salamence: lol, Latias outspeeds and OHKO's

Roserade: That's why you have Natural Cure.

Machamp: You can just Explode on it's face.

Gyarados: Use Latias. Latias has high defensive stats and a recovery move. You can just set up on it, Ice fang? Gyara nowadays carry Stone Edge in order to hit the opposing Gyarados. Or if that doesn't solve the problem, use defensive Starmie. It's good..

You have a good team..

 

[connoisseur]

The DDers are not dangerous until they switch in on scizor or something forcing me to switch and give them a free DD. I have no idea what to do then other than clever intimidate switching. Before their boost starmie kills them all easily. And wouldnt a defensive starmie lose shitloads of power?

for roserade the person will probably know that starmie has the natural cure and keep spamming sleep powder until a non-starmie comes out. Also I believe roserade can leaf storm/Grass Knot starmie to death anyway.

Curselax? There has to be a better way to counter Rotom-A... and besides, who would be replaced by him?

For Machamp, it is quite difficult to get magnezone in on him without sacrficing something and metagross is dead more often than not.

 

[Deccy]

Rotom-A : If that's the case then use CurseLax. Snorlax has a High Special defense, Curse to boost your defense and attack, and Rest to heal status ailments and damage taken. Still be weary of HP[Fighting] as it hurts..

Kindra: Are you kidding me? you can use Latias as a bait to trap it in Outrage, and switch to either Magnezone or Metagross. If Magnezone, you can Thunderbolt if you want to save 'em for later, or Explode!(use Naive Nature, it would strengthen your Explosion). If Metagross, EQ, BP or just Explode..

Salamence: lol, Latias outspeeds and OHKO's

Roserade: That's why you have Natural Cure.

Machamp: You can just Explode on it's face.

Gyarados: Use Latias. Latias has high defensive stats and a recovery move. You can just set up on it, Ice fang? Gyara nowadays carry Stone Edge in order to hit the opposing Gyarados. Or if that doesn't solve the problem, use defensive Starmie. It's good..


You have a good team..

ehhhhh... none of his pokemon have natural cure and are able to switch in to Roserade( I wouldn't send out a Starmie against a Roserade ), sending a Metagross out in front of a Machamp isn't what I'd call "smart and Latias doesn't really have good defence.

On the team I would give your Metagross a Lum berry to avoid status and to 2HKO some Roserades with Earthquake and Bullet Punch. I would then replace Magnezone with Rotom-H with a Choce Scarf with max speed and sp. attack. This deals with most of the same threats as Magnezone and outspeeds Gyara after a DD.

Hope I helped....

 

[WoOoShoOo!!]

The DDers are not dangerous until they switch in on scizor or something forcing me to switch and give them a free DD. I have no idea what to do then other than clever intimidate switching. Before their boost starmie kills them all easily. And wouldnt a defensive starmie lose shitloads of power?

for roserade the person will probably know that starmie has the natural cure and keep spamming sleep powder until a non-starmie comes out. Also I believe roserade can leaf storm/Grass Knot starmie to death anyway.

Curselax? There has to be a better way to counter Rotom-A... and besides, who would be replaced by him?

For Machamp, it is quite difficult to get magnezone in on him without sacrficing something and metagross is dead more often than not.

Alright, this will really solve your problems. Porygon2, Trace copies Gyara's Intimidate, and has Tbolt. Solved..

Rotom-A, hmm...Blissey is another counter, but with Snorlax you can also counter Roserade. Rest the damage..

Machamp. Use Magnezone as bait for Dynamicpunch then switch to Gyara to get an Intimidate then switch in Latias again then finish it off. If it still bothers you, I suggest a pokemon. Dusknoir. What Payback? Dusknoir is slower therefore Payback's power is only 50, I'm pretty sure Dusknoir will survive it, burn 'em!! Solved?

 

[1337R34P3R]

All I'm going to do is tell you that no, Shuca Beryy would not be better on Metagross, as the main leads that use Earthquake, which is physical and therefore Metagross can handle it, whereas alot of leads carry Fire- type special moves, and Voila! Occa comes in to play.

Actually, shuca berry is the logical choice. The only lead I've seen with a special fire-type attack is Leadakiss, which is still rather rare. However, the two primary earthquake users are Mamoswine and the immensly popular Hippowdon. Both of these Pokémon gain STAB boosts from earthquake, both have more than respectable attack stats, and i know for a fact that they will both OHKO with earthquake if you don't have the proper EV investment.

 

[symphonyx64]

Actually, shuca berry is the logical choice. The only lead I've seen with a special fire-type attack is Leadakiss, which is still rather rare. However, the two primary earthquake users are Mamoswine and the immensly popular Hippowdon. Both of these Pokémon gain STAB boosts from earthquake, both have more than respectable attack stats, and i know for a fact that they will both OHKO with earthquake if you don't have the proper EV investment.

So, let me get this straight, Infernapes, Azelfs, Roserades, and Heatrans do not constitute as leads?

Anyways, in response to your (this RMT creator) contemplation between berries:

When I run a berry-based leadGross, I always choose Occa Berry. You can survive physical Earthquakes no problem, as stated above. To be quite honest, the amount of physical Earthquake leads is rather diminutive, compared to the leads that pack some sort of Fire based moves that are special.

 

[WoOoShoOo!!]

sending a Metagross out in front of a Machamp isn't what I'd call "smart and Latias doesn't really have good defense.

Well what would you expect? Metagross has the highest Defensive Stat in his team. At least Metagross would do some damage, and live a bit unlike his other pokemons. Latias doesn't really have good defense? Well yeah, 90 seems pretty low, but with recover it's pretty good.

Yo, the only thing that I can suggest to this team, is a Defensive STARMIE. Trust me, even if, "even if" Gyarados scored 2 DD's(Still I'm pretty sure that won't happen) Starmie still survives from it's Stone Edge / Earthquake(w/o LO). "AND" OHKO back with Tbolt. Use this EV spread 136 HP / 156 Def / 216 Spe..Good Luck!!

 

[Kumar628]

Read the Bolded text outside the quotes to avoid my rude comments.

Bold = problematic
Azelf – Leadzelf = koed by bullet punch x 2 if I am so inclined, against DS azelf I stealth rock then explode/stall out the screens with metagross

I don't understand...How exactly can you stall out screens with Metagross? You're just saying "I'll let them switch in their DD Gyarados that for some reason gives me problems to get maybe 2 DDs in." Also, how exactly can you get up Stealth Rock if he taunts you first?

Blissey – Magnesplosion tends to work. Metagross is not usually alive to explode it, but scizor and gyarados can deal with it

Scizor checks Blisseys PERIOD. No need for anything else at all. Twaves don't hurt him too much.

Bronzong – Set up rocks with meta+EQ, if it is levitating then send in something else, maybe scizor

Lol, "if it is levitating" is just fun to read sometimes. However, I like your security, as some people do try mindgamesing people into thinking "who the heck would use Earthquake on Bronzong?" and basically give them full resistances. But I wouldn't take my chances. By the way, have you forgotten about Magnezone? His Gyro Ball and Explosion do absolutely nothing to Magnezone. You can just kill it with Thunderbolt and you're done. Don't risk Scizor unless Magnezone is dead.

Celebi – Scizor gets a free pursuit ko

You seem to forget a lot. Scizor has STAB U-Turn which also happens to do 400% damage on Celebi. Remember?

Cresellia – Starmie can possibly outpower it as it did in a battle I just played (Hydropump on switchin for 56%, finish with another Hydropump) otherwise scizor does nicely

Or, a better strategy would be Scizor to U-Turn out to Starmie to finish her off. Even with reflect up, it'll help the KO with Starmie.

Dugtrio – latias rapes it, starmie can rape it

Dugtrio can trap and Sucker Punch/Night Slash Starmie as well as Latias, though they will live through it, Latias risks Pursuit.

Dusknoir – once it is low on health, scizor can pursuit it

How do you get it to low health? That's my only problem with this.

Foretress – magnezone = utter rape

Shed Shell Forretress swiitch out on Magnezone? If it is so, Starmie can KO(?) with Hydro PAWNCH!! But fears Payback if I'm wrong about the OHKO.

Gengar – starmie outspeeds and rapes, scarfgar is dealt with by scizor

MysticGar can be problematic in terms of messing with your plans with Scizor. But, yes, Starmie is a good counter.

Gliscor – starmie hydropumps his ass, gyarados can DD in his face and use waterfall (waterfallx2 is also good), latias can handle it with surf

Who can DD on Gliscor? Not Gyarados. Gliscors usually carry the Earthquake + Stone Edge combo.

Heatran – gyarados/latias/metagross

Take out Latias and Metagross. Latias fears Dragon Pulse and Metagross is KOd by Earth Power or Fire Blast if Occa is used.

Heracross – if scarfed I let it lock into something and then send in latias/gyarados/scizor/magnezone

What about Life Orb, Flame Orb, or Swords Dance? Maybe Swarm?

Jirachi – Metagross can EQ it, magnezone can utterly embarass it if it is a choice scarf iron head variant as well.

I think you mean ONLY Metagross can handle it. Any Scarf Jirachi is either a lead Tricker or a Tricker somewhere else.

Ludicolo – If it is not raining, I am not particularly worried. Otherwise latias can own it.

Do you know who Scizor is? He can U-Turn for super-effective damage, right?

Mamoswine – latias doesn't have issues with it, neither does gyarados

Latias does have some issues. Ice Fangs can dent, and Ice Shards can revenge her if she's weakened. Gyarados is decimated by Stone Edge period.

Metagross – CB gross is dealt with by locking it into EQ and bringing out gyarados. Against leads, EQ+switch to latias/gyarados works well. If it lacks explosion gyarados is an excellent switch

I would really like analysis of AgiliGross. He's more potent of a threat and I want to know how you deal with the standard set.

Ninjask – set up rocks turn 1, then bullet punch/EQ/switch

I'm sorry, are you suggesting Ninjask is not Bug-Flying? The first thing you should do is Bullet Punch to make it switch. If it Protects, then keep Bullet Punching! Weaken it before it leaves, so when it switches back in, it's dead.

Porygon2 – not fun to deal with, starmie can maybe outpower it. Latias can probably get to +6 against it.

Sure, Latias can come in and set up while being Toxic'd or Thunder Wave'd. Good luck sweeping while dead/slower than everything. Starmie suffers the exact same fate.

Registeel – EQ

Magnezone, too, right?

Roserade

– Stupid statusing leads give me problems. I have no problems actually destroying it after I wake up though.

By which time the rest of your team is susceptable to Toxic while you don't have Stealth Rock up.

Rotom-A

– I have problems with him. Helpz0rz

Nothing really can switch into it. You'd better hope it's lacking Shadow Ball, in which case Latias can switch in and boost or KO to make sure it never comes back to haunt your team.

Salamence

– Clever intimidate switching... yes that means it is a major problem.

Latias outspeeds and KOs after Stealth Rock?

Snorlax – scizor's superpower, various explosions etc...

When it gets a Curse up, it survives Magnezone's explosion. Not sure about Scizor Superpower...

Swampert – it roars around so I just use the most powerful move on my pokemon

Which means Gyarados is almost dead next time it's switches in.

Tyranitar – Scizor, if it is a DD babiri tar then I'd have some issues...stupid 1 speed more than starmie

If it's an Adamant DD Babiri, it's eaten alive by Starmie and Latias after a DD, for they both outspeed and KO with Hydro Pump and Surf, respectively. Jolly gives you problems, however...

Walrein – god damn stallrein, luckily it is rare. before the gay stallrein sequence starmie destroys it.

I can tell you were rushing this like you were hyper and drunk both at once. Scizor has Bullet Punch AND Superpower. What more do you need?

Weavile – not particularly threatening. Scizor rapes it.

Since it's usually a revenge killer, when Latias kills something, she's in a terrible position. Pursuit will maim if you switch, Ice Punch OR Night Slash will hurt if she stays and it's guaranteed a hit: 100 accuracy + outspeed. Same with Starmie, but only Night Slash and Pursuit hurt.


Sorry to sound rude on most of these, I just think "it's so obvious and I want to help" but I go about it the wrong way. Also, the bolded things outside the quotes are not necessarily threats, they just refer to important words; the jist of what I intended.


Alright, so, from what I can tell from strolling patiently through your threat list, Starmie + Latias = shared weaknesses. Sure, the Ice-weakness is covered for Latias, and the Grass- and Electric-weakness is covered for Starmie, but remember that their secondary type, Psychic, doesn't have ANY weaknesses covered by their other typing. Water- and Dragon-type both just ADD weaknesses to Psychic, and Psychic already has 3 weaknesses to very common attacks by very common OU pokemon. I suggest changing Latias, as Starmie's outspeeding is more key rather than Latias merely having a nice STAB resisted by only Steels (which are common in OU, by the way) and boosting. Those two things seem appealing, but they're unneeded on your current team. Gyarados is your booster, who resists common attacks in OU (Latias does, too, but to a slightly lesser extent in terms of type- usage. Plus, Dragon is almost omnipresent in OU), and Starmie your coverage sweeper who also can recover. Latias having them both seems appealing, but these two pokemon being sparate is excellent with the rest of your team (or, to me it seems), so I suggest replacing Latias with something else. Maybe a Gengar? MysticGar or SubGar are both nice choices. Gengar lures in Scizor and other Steels (such as Lucario who SDs on switch because he assumes you assume he has Crunch) for Magnezone to trap and kill. Scizor and Lucario are both owned by HP Fire, and, because you're Scarfed, Lucario can't hit you unless he magically predicts a Close Combat on the switch instead of an SD. Extremespeed will only poke Magnezone. MysticGar is especially for Scizor: Protect to scout the move. If he Pursuits, HP Fire him with Gengar; if he Bullet Punches, change to Magnezone; if he Superpowers fearing a switch to Magnezone, HP Fire. This doesn't really deal with SD Lucario. SubGar, on the other hand, deals with them both (and others) if they switch into a Sub. You can just HP Fire and voila! If they have Heatran to take the HP Fire, he's OHKO'd(?) by Focus Blast anyways as he breaks the sub. Gengar essentially saves your team from taking hits (and residual damage of Stealth Rock, which is AWESOME) by countering his counters by himself and Magnezone. Maybe another replacement for Latias could be Tyranitar for more physical power. Or, if you prefer, Tyraniboah can also be fierce on this team. Again, between him and Magnezone (and Scizor for reasons I'm about to explain), your team is safe from Stealth Rock and the other hazards. The basic and most common scenario is Scizor is locked into Bullet Punch. Something with a Fire-type attack comes in. OH NOES! Tyranitar. This works excellently if they're choiced, as Tyranitar (boah) can sub up on the switch, and use whatever move he pleases. But wait! Your sub is broken and Scizor comes in! OH NOES x2! Doesn't matter if he Pursuits you, Magnezone should always come in if this is this case. Wreak havoc with these three.

That's all I can add. Essentially, if it's tl;dr, then what I'm saying is Tyraniboah > Latias OR MysticGar/SubGar > Latias because of the horrible weakness sharing and inability to counter those weaknesses by themselves. Sure, they can rely on their teammates, but sacrificing another teammates HP (namely, Gyarados; Stealth Rock, eh?) and losing boosts (Latias gets a CM, Bulky TTar comes in. Another bad position.) is not worth it, IMO. So, I hope this helped, I spent 2 hours with this post because of reading and re-reading your OP and editing this post itself.

Good Luck!

 

[connoisseur]

Kumar:

Metagross is sturdy. It will take at the very least 2 turns to KO it. If gyarados tries to DD or something, simply explode on it since I believe explosion calculates damage with half the opponent's defense which allows a KO. Metagross can stall out the screens partly because nothing is OHKOing it anytime soon.

Mystic gar = not scarfed = handled by starmie



Latias does not fear heatran's dragon pulse. It manages 50%~ on it while surf OHKOs all of the time(from experience). Heatrans never ever Earth Power meta, they are usually shocked when FB fails to KO and EQ kicks heatran's ass.

The other forms of heracross are nowhere near as scary imo because if I can outspeed it, sacrificing latias (if needed) while damaging it and having starmie KO it should work, but I've only faced scarfers before.

Dusknoir is simply weakened by using powerful attacks from almost any pokemon. Usually Metagross can get at least 1 EQ off when the opponent switches in Dusknoir. Also a hydropump from starmie or a Dragon Pulse from latias is not an ideal situation for Dusky either. Dragon Pulse will 2hko Dusknoir with SR which I get down 50%~ of the time while hydropump does it without questions asked.

Agiligross = problem. the one I met was lacking thunderpunch apparently, so gyra killed it. If worst comes to worst, latias will survive a blow and so will starmie (I think) to retailate.

For the most part you're right about the other discrepancies in my threat list.

I like latias there though, he walls special moves well and is the go to pokemon if there is nonscizor related trouble. He also provides a levitate to switch in on EQ, because Gyarados prefers not to switch in and out.

While your idea of gengar on my team seems good I would disagree as I already have a fast special sweeper that doesn't particularly like scizor in starmie. Scizor is not threatening to my team at all unless it is in on latias. Tyrantitar seems like a good idea though.

 

[1337R34P3R]

So, let me get this straight, Infernapes, Azelfs, Roserades, and Heatrans do not constitute as leads?

Okay, i'll admit you have me on Azelf (forgot about flamethrower), but the other three examples you gave (Infernape, Heatran, Roserade) are not nearly as common as mamoswine and hippowdon, and assuming the damage calculator linked in the signature of one of the earlier posters so kindly confirmed, an earthquake from either of them will OHKO, contrary to what you say. Infernape and Heatran leads are few and far between on the Smogon server, and the only time i see Roserade with a fire-type move is hidden power fire. In my experience, HP fire will not OHKO Metagross, because a base power of for the move is just too weak.

 

[symphonyx64]

Okay, i'll admit you have me on Azelf (forgot about flamethrower), but the other three examples you gave (Infernape, Heatran, Roserade) are not nearly as common as mamoswine and hippowdon, and assuming the damage calculator linked in the signature of one of the earlier posters so kindly confirmed, an earthquake from either of them will OHKO, contrary to what you say. Infernape and Heatran leads are few and far between on the Smogon server, and the only time i see Roserade with a fire-type move is hidden power fire. In my experience, HP fire will not OHKO Metagross, because a base power of for the move is just too weak.

Really? They are so uncommon?

Well sir, taken directly from the Shoddy Battle usage statistics (leads) of October, 2009:

Azelf: #1
Infernape: #6
Roserade: #7
Hippowdon: #8
Heatran: #14
...And Mamoswine, all the way down at: #19

Time for some simple damage calculations, Metagross will have the standard lead spread of: 252 HP / 236 Atk / 12 Def / 8 Spe and factoring in no berries.

Mamoswine's Earthquake - Adamant, 252 Attack EVs:79-93%
Mamoswine's Earthquake - Jolly, 252 Attack : 72-85%
Hippowdon's Earthquake - Impish, 0 Attack: 53-62%
Infernape's FireBlast - Naive, 252 Special Attack: 101-119%
Azelf's FireBlast - Naive, 252 Special Attack: 79-90%
Heatran's FireBlast - Naive, 252 Special Attack: 118-139%
Heatran's Flamethrower - Naive, 252 Special Attack: 94-110%
Roserade's Hidden Power Fire (Base power 70) - Timid, 252 Special Attack: 45-53%, still a chance to kill it in two hits.

What's this? Even one of the most powerful Earthquakes in the Standard Metagame fails to taken down Metagross in one hit. Hopefully combined with the aforementioned usage statistics and damage calculations, you'll see Occa Berry is clearly the smarter choice.

Sources: This damage calculator.

 

[Bad Ass]

Cool team, without a really glaring weakness for the most part. My main concern would be Gyarados, because as others already pointed out he has ample opportunities to set up, and once he does you have a rough time stopping him. First, changing up Latias a bit would help out. Calm Mind Latias with LO is just really awkward. It takes an extra turn to hit as hard as LO Draco Meteor, but it still doesn't OHKO stuff like Tyranitar and Scizor after a Calm Mind. A different version of LO Latias would help you out a lot more with Gyarados, and it's pretty much better in general. You lose the ability to do stuff like CM alongside CroCune, but the trade off is worth it. An added bonus is Thunderbolt, and Latias can take anyone of +1 Gyarados' attacks, except something absurd like Life Orb +1 Bounce.

Latias | Life Orb | Timid
252 Spe | 252 SAtk | 4 Hp
Thunderbolt | Draco Meteor | Surf | Recover

That alone is not going to clear up your Gyarados weakness, so I come with another suggestion. While Magnezone does seem important, how often does he really trap and kill Scizor? Most of the time, they U Turn first time out, and if they see Magnezone, I guarantee they'll play their steels carefully. I think a Scarf Rotom-h would do Magnezone's job way better. He not only provides a really solid check to Gyarados, but he can do a lot of other things better as well. He gives you another fighting and ground resist. He can Trick away the scarf and cripple a lot of things, even something like DD Babiri Tyranitar. In fact, Scarf Rotom-h covers pretty much EVERYTHING that gave your team major troubles before, and still provides you with a better revenge killer than Magnezone. CB Tar is the worst problem you have now, but most of your team can either OHKO or 2hko it.

Instead of the standard max speed / max special attack Rotom-h, I think a more defensive Scarf Rotom would do you a better service. He'll need to be tanking some attacks, and it would really help you to max out his Hp stat. Magnezone was really bulky, and with Rotom's added resistances plus the Hp evs, he should fit the bill as well. It should come out looking like this

Rotom-h | Choice Scarf | Timid
252 Spe | 252 Hp | 4 SAtk
Thunderbolt | Shadow Ball | Overheat | Trick

Anyway, nice team! Please try out my changes, and I hope they help!

 

[Itsuki]

Hey connoisseur, cool team you have here. By looking at your threat list I feel that a Choice Scarf Latias would help out a lot. Starmie can OHKO or significantly weaken Scizor (Starmie can OHKO some versions) and Scizor and Gyarados can threaten non Babiri Berry DD Tyranitar.

Latias @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid nature (+Spe, -Atk)
- Draco Meteor
- Surf
- Thunderbolt
- Trick

Choice Scarf Latias provides a decent check against DD Gyarados and DD Salamence outspeeding both if they are at +1 and even outspeeding +2 Adamant Gyarados. Latias can also Trick Choice Scarf onto Tyranitar locking him Crunch which then he becomes vulnerable to Scizor and Magnezone, Stone Edge which Metagross and Magnezone can come in on, or Fire Punch which can help your Gyarados set up. Although my second suggestion will help against Tyranitar without resorting to this.

Also stall seems to be problematic. So Gliscor can be used over Magnezone. Although it seems to slightly clash with the offensive theme.

Gliscor @ Lefovers
Ability: Sand Veil
EVs: 208 HP / 80 Atk / 220 Spe or 252 HP / 36 Def / 220 Spe
Jolly nature (+Atk, -SpA)
- Earthquake
- Taunt
- U-turn/Toxic/Stone Edge
- Roost

Gliscor is probably the best counter to Lucario. With Taunt it becomes a stall breaker and helps a lot against Rotom with Thunderbolt/Will-O-Wisp/Rest/Sleep Talk and Scarf Rotom can be taken care of by Scizor (switch in on Shadow Ball or Trick), Thunderbolt (Gliscor and Latias). The third move is a matter of preference. With U-turn you can scout out switches, Toxic is great in conjunction with Taunt as most stall Pokemon rely on recovery and you pretty much stop them as they do nothing back, and Stone Edge is here to help keep the offensive nature of the team. The EVs are, as well, a matter of preference. 80 Atk ensures you 2HKO lead Metagross and Tyranitar as well 2HKO Celebi and Azelf with U-turn, whilst the second EV spread is more defensive.

Also if you have problems against Roserade Lum Berry Metagross can work. I don't see the reason why you are running Occa Berry with no Meteor Mash. As Occa Berry tends to be used with Meteor Mash to take down Azelf and Roserade. Heatran usually run Shuca Berry and Infernape can be taken care of by Latias, Gyarados, and Starmie. The same goes for Heatran.

Metagross @ Lum Berry
Abilty: Clear Body
EVs: 200 HP / 232 Atk / 32 Spd / 44 SpD
Adamant nature (+Atk, -SpA)
- Meteor Mash
- Earthquake
- Bullet Punch
- Stealth Rock

You beat non DS Azelf leads as you survive Fire Blast and Meteor Mash + Bullet Punch takes it out. Be aware that if they do go for the Fire Blast they don't get Stealth Rock up. Also the EV spread helps out a lot against other lead Metagross as you'll most likely Earthquake first.

As for Machamp in your threat list Metagross with Lum still intact can 2HKO, Gliscor can help a bit, and Gyarados can take a DynamicPunch. However confusion is indeed annoying.

Hope this helped!

 

[Bloo]

You've stated that you're having problems against sleep inducing leads such as Roserade in your threat list. There's a really simply fix to remedy this problem and that is using Lum Berry over Occa Berry on your Metagross. With Lum Berry attached to Metagross, you'll absorb Sleep Powder from the aforementioned Roserade, allowing you Earthquake it down to low health and proceed to dispose of it with Bullet Punch. Occa Berry is mainly used for Fire-type leads such as Shuca Heatran and Lead Infernape. You have a Latias, Starmie, and a Gyarados, all of which can take a Fire Blast well and threaten with the proper move. I also recommend changing Metagross' EV spread to the following: 200 HP / 232 Atk / 32 Spe / 44 SpD. With the given Speed EVs, you'll be able to outpace most opposing Metagross leads, allowing you to hit them first with Earthquake and set up Stealth Rock on the second turn.

Ok, in your threat list, you also stated that once Gyarados fires off a Dragon Dance, you're in a world of hurt, which is true. After a Dragon Dance, LO Adamant Gyarados will outrun every member on this team and proceed to leave a decent sized dent with Waterfall / Stone Edge / Earthquake.

• + 1 DD Adamant Gyarados' LO Stone Edge vs your Latias: (82.12% - 96.69%) - Good chance to KO after Stealth Rock.
• + 1 DD Adamant Gyarados' LO Stone Edge vs your Starmie: (99.24% - 116.79%) - KO after SR.
• +1 DD Adamant Gyarados' LO Stone Edge vs your Gyarados with Intimidate factored in: 383 Atk vs 194 Def & 332 HP (100 Base Power): 368 - 434 (110.84% - 130.72%)

The rest of your Pokemon, like Magnezone is KOed by Earthquake, Scizor cannot take a Waterfall, and Metagross will either be dead, and if it's alive, it will be unable to take a boosted Earthquake. So, the moral of the story is that LO Gyarados can pose a serious threat to your team. Speaking of Gyarados, it can easily set up a DD on a locked Bullet Punch from Scizor and altough a bit extreme, it can set up on a locked HP Fire or Flash Cannon from Magnezone. Since Magnezone revenges Scizor with HP Fire and Gyarados is paired up commonly with said Scizor, a player can assume you're Choice Scarfed since they won't see Leftovers recovery, then com in and set up a DD, and hit your entire team like a maniac. Without changing any Pokemon on your team, the easiest fix would be to go the slightly defensive route with your Starmie so it can take on the aforesaid Gyarados thanks to increased durability. I recommend this Starmie who still hits hard and can take a couple of attacks while defending itself against Gyarados:

Starmie @ Life Orb
Timid | 44 HP | 80 Def | 252 Spe | 132 SpA
Surf | Thunderbolt | Rapid Spin | Recover

I decided to suggest a defensively Starmie with some offense since you liked the ability to hit your opponents hard. With the added HP + Defense EVs, Starmie will be able to take Gyarados on effectively, while being able to switch-in on the likes of Infernape / Heatran better as well. With Rapid Spin, you are able to dispose of Stealth Rock, meaning your Gyarados will have an easier time coming in repeatedly without having to worry about losing 25% of its health every time it comes in. Surf is for STAB and provides nice coverage alongside Thunderbolt. Thunderbolt allows Starmie to strike the Water-types that resist Surf, such as Gyarados, Vaporeon, and Suicune. Lastly, Recover allows you to replenish your health, meaning Starmie will last for a longer period of time.

Ok, so, Gyarados is now handled by Starmie and sleep inducing leads such as Roserade are handled by Lum Berry Metagross. That's two of your biggest concerns which you mentioned in your threat list out of the way. The only thing left to fix now is the problem you stated you have with Machamp / Rotom formes. We could try a Gliscor over Magnezone to help with the aforementioned Machamp / Rotom formes. Here are the main things Magnezone does for your team: Magnezone makes sure SD Lucario doesn't tear a hole on this team since you can outrun with Choice Scarf and KO with Thunderbolt after a Special Defense drop. It kills Scizor with HP Fire (I don't see the need for this since you can take the time to DD with Gyarados on a locked Bullet Punch. Latias also 2HKOes Scizor with an LO Surf after SR. Well, Gliscor gives you a better switch-into U-turns from Scizor, especially with Roost to heal damage, while keeping Lucario at bay. With that in mind, I'd like to recommend Gliscor:

Gliscor @ Leftovers
Jolly | 252 HP / 40 Atk / 216 Spe
Earthquake | Taunt | Toxic | Roost

Thanks to Gliscor's resistance to Fighting-type moves, it will be able to take Fighting-type moves from the likes of Machamp / Lucario well. Taunt + Toxic + Roost allows Gliscor to beat Rotom-A. With Taunt, you prevent them from healing with Rest or status you with Will-O-Wisp. You then Toxic them to chip away their health as they suffer without the ability to heal thanks to Taunt. Roost allows you to recover any damage taken from Shadow Ball and allows you to stick around for a long duration of time. EQ is for STAB and hits Pokemon like Lucario and Heatran for super effective damage. Gliscor's usefulness doesn't end there; With Taunt in conjunction with Toxic + Roost, you'll be able to handle stall teams more effectively. Taunt prevents the common Pokemon found on stall teams from healing, meaning you can proceed to take their health away with Toxic and recovering yourself with Roost.

EDIT: Well, looks like Itsuki stated most of what I said before I posted!