Project The VGC 2017 submit-a-project thread!

#26
yet to see anything regarding a core analysis thread, which is always successful in other subforums and I think would be really neat here as well. Also, an "unusual item on standard pokemon" thread could be really fun and interactive, especially as the meta begins to develop. Let me know what you guys think of these, i'd love to run either or both.
 
#27
I wanna preface this by saying I know the metagame is super fresh so a lot of this will be addressed further into its lifetime.

I'd like to see a thread with consolidated, up to date set analysis. I realize the information is out there, but honestly there isn't enough activity yet in the VGC sub to get a feel for the metagame for an outsider.

The reason for this is, as a very casual VGC player, I'm not terribly current on trends in the meta. I usually only play in online competitions, but my real enjoyment in Pokémon comes from breeding and soft resetting. I basically have no use for the Pokémon I get from this other than trading and sitting in my boxes. But it's what I really like to do, so I keep doing it. I know a good portion of the Wi-Fi community is in the same boat. A lot of the time, when looking for their next project, they just head right to the smogdex and pick the top OU set.

I used to have a project with a few other people where we'd breed mons of a certain type and just give them away, and for Gen 7 I'd hoped to do the same but specific to the VGC format. Having a singular place to glean the information from would make it SO much easier to pick projects. Like I said, I know the information is there but I know it's not exactly reasonable to expect C&C to keep up with such a trend dependent metagame.

I think this would benefit VGC players looking for information as well as giving them more options in the WiFi community to find the Pokémon they need. It would also help bridge the WiFi community with VGC which seems like a logical goal.
 
#29
I currently have a tier list put together of the 2017 meta. I'd like to start a thread that, through discussion, consistently keeps up to date on this. So we'll start with a list in the OP, and I will update it as people make arguments for why certain 'mons should be voted up or down. It'll also update after tournaments and such based on actual performance.

Tier 1 is meta-defining; These Pokemon are ones every team should consider or build around.
Tier 2 is a list of common, powerful Pokemon. These are Pokemon people can still count on seeing, but won't be the crux of any teambuilding.
Tier 3 is weaker Pokemon that see occasionally effective play in niche roles, but are generally not seen on teams.
Tier 4 is Pokemon you will see from time to time but are not impressive.
And there is also an unusable tier. This is where Corsola is.

Tier 1
Celesteela
Marowak-Alola
Oranguru

Tier 2
Gyarados
Milotic
Garchomp
Torkoal
Tapu Lele
Tapu Bulu
Tapu Koko
Pelipper
Porygon2
Porygon-Z
Arcanine
Ninetales-Alola
Lilligant
Xurkitree

Tier 3
Primarina
Nihilego
Oricorio-Sensu (Ghost)
Togedemaru
Tapu Fini
Mimikyu
Mudsdale
Wishiwashi
Whimsicott
Golem-Alola
Krookodile
Kartana
Raichu-Alola
Slowbro
Persian
Dhelmise
Muk-Alola
Toxapex
Smeargle
Weavile
Sandslash-Alola
Sableye
Araquanid
Clefable
Golisopod
Drampa
Lycanroc-Midday
Lycanrox-Midnight
Aerodactyl
Metagross
Gengar
Pheromosa
Salazzle
Gastrodon
Salamence
Oricorio-Pom-Pom (Electric)
Lurantis
Parasect
Gigalith
Scizor

Tier 4
Oricorio-P'au (Psychic)
Oricorio-Baile (Fire)
Ribombee
Bruxish
Palossand
Minior
Stoutland
Flygon
Eeveelutions
Shiinotic
Sharpedo
Absol
Cloyster
Toucannon
Vikavolt
Politoed
Snorlax
Vanillux
Golduck
Talonflame
Slowking
Alakazam
Magnezone
Hariyama
Crabominable
Mismagius
Tsareena
Guzzlord
Comfey
Crobat
Probopass
Braviary
Dugtrio-Alola
Electivire
Lanturn
Type: Null
Exeggcutor-Alola
Kommo-o
Silvally
Skarmory
Ditto
Goodra

Unplayable
Whiscash
Machamp
Poliwrath
Emolga
Pinsir
Castform
Passimian
Pyukumuku
Bewear
Relicanth
Seaking
Starmie
Rampardos
Honchkrow
Lucario
Dragonite
Bastiodon
Archeops
Carracosta
Wailord
Trevenant
Wigglytuff
Tauros
Alomomola
Lapras
Kangaskhan
Granbull
Magmortar
Miltank
Masquerain
Spinda
Tentacruel
Klefki
Lumineon
Gumshoos
Pangoro
Komala
Carbink
Raticate-Alola
Butterfree
Mandibuzz
Primeape
Delibird
Ledian
Froslass
Glalie
Ariados
Sudowoodo
Hypno
Blissey
Fearow
Chansey
Drifloon
Garbodor


The main thread will also be more decked out, with sprites and descriptions for tiers 1 and 2.
 
#30
your viability rankings could really use some work bud. when i see salamence and krookodile in the same tier as parasect it makes me wonder if you really know what you're talking about...
 
#31
That's why it'd be a community effort. I'm not the one in charge of them, I'm just facilitating them.

Also, I'd argue Salamence and Krookodile (less so Krookodile) haven't seen all that much play in VGC. They're overshadowed by other mons like Garchomp, who fills both roles that Salamence and Krookodile typically do.
 

LouisCyphre

heralds disaster.
#32
Also, I'd argue Salamence and Krookodile (less so Krookodile) haven't seen all that much play in VGC. They're overshadowed by other mons like Garchomp, who fills both roles that Salamence and Krookodile typically do.
Salamence, Krookodile compete with Gyarados and Arcanine as your source of crucial Intimidate support. Their overlap with Garchomp is a a bit moot, as Garchomp is typically Scarfed and both Mence and Krook opt for bulkier spreads that allow them to pivot. Some Salamence are seen with Specs, when someone wants bloodshed.

anyway I made a speed tier thread oops
 
#33
I'd be happy to help work on a role compendium. I've updated the list on TheMantyke's thread with more up to date information, including the new Pokemon, updates on weather setters, removal of things that are just wrong like Dark Void Smeargle and Arena Trap Dugtrio etc.

I think if one to go about making a role compendium however there are already some roles that would need to be included that aren't a category already, such as checks to certain threats that clearly are going to be very popular even at this early stage of the meta, like the Tapus and Celesteela. As it stands now the list lays out every Pokemon that has access to a particular move. I think if we were to do that we would need to put them in to categories, Solid, Shaky and FYI (or something a long those lines). The latter is basically there to say the Pokemon is only really listed so that you know the particular Pokemon has access to the move/ability or whatever and for whatever reason isn't viable in the format and therefore shouldn't be considered when teambuilding as highly as the other options. That way we wouldn't lump something like Hypno with something like Porygon 2 just because they both have access to Trick Room (granted P2 would be in solid and Hypno would be Shaky but you get the idea).

Not sure if that is the best way to go about it but its just an idea. Here's the updated lists from Mantyke's thread:
http://pastebin.com/bY7wxi5J
 
#35
Really great resource for people who aren't as familiar with what everything does. There are however a few changes to the post that I would recommend.

Firstly, I would mention that the metagame is still fairly infantile and many things that you say are subject to change. This is primarily in response to when you say things like 'Usually seen with an item like Sitrus Berry', everything you say is true now but is likely to become outdated as the meta progresses.

I would somehow separate the more viable Pokemon from the less/unviable Pokemon. Having no separation between the 4 viable Intimidators and Granbull and Masquerain may be confusing for newer players. I know that you have lumped most of the viable Pokemon together and the less viable together, but it's difficult to tell where the viable stops and the less viable starts without having prior knowledge of the format.

I would clear up that Prankster Tailwind is unaffected by Psychic terrain, and dark types for the most part aren't all that common in the current meta considering the list of truly common darks kind of ends at Muk and Krook.

Exeggcutor doesn't get chlorophyll anymore and the fact that you can't get regular Exeggcutor means the '(both)' is unnecessary.

But yeah really great work. Honestly this would be a pretty great framework for a beginners guide to the meta, though I feel some Pokemon would need to be omitted (things like Ariados and Guzzlord for example) and some things would need to be included, things like the Tapus, Garchomp, viable UBs like Kartana and Xurkitree (even if its usage is dwindling), Muk, Mudsdale, Metagross, Milotic, Magnezone, Goodra, Gengar, Drampa and probably some other viable Pokemon that aren't mentioned already.
 
#37
I'd like to see something of a checks compendium for VGC17, and I'd be happy to volunteer to host the thread.

Edit: it's been a while and no responses, is it cool if I start a thread like the OU checks compendium for this format? I've also got a google doc I'm working on anyway, link
 
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