charizard is actualy quite great IMO but quite horrible too seeing the fact that the best rappid spinner we've seen so far and provide a huge niche in a team hate sun *forry star Doryuzuu come into mind) thats the biggest downfall of a Droughttales team that uses zard not to mention 1 t-bolt from starmie = insta kill unless you use scarf on zard. As of Venusaur i somehow smell he become OU(finally) and as an special attacker its outclassed or tie with Jaroda in term of pure power(leaf storm spam is just too much) but venus selling point is his versatility after all so many sets will be viable in all level of play.
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Venusaur
- Thread starter Raseri
- Start date
Actually, Forretress Enjoys the Sun, as he already gets OHKO'd by fire attacks anyways. The Sun Gives Forretress a Water- Type resist, which is very helpful.
funny how charizard gets mentions in a venusaur thread. Either way I plan on using both myself and like the idea of growth on venusaur for mixed sweeping.
Venu will rip up UU with Ninetails by it's side!
So what's the preliminary veredict on Venusaur? I think it will make a very solid UU this Gen, especially with Ninetales/Vulpix support.
If Ninetales makes it to OU, I can actually see Saur following her. He's arguably one of the best sun abusers in the game with Chlorophyll.
I am, of course, assuming Groudon and Kyogre will be banned again. I highly doubt they'll stick around for long.
If Ninetales makes it to OU, I can actually see Saur following her. He's arguably one of the best sun abusers in the game with Chlorophyll.
I am, of course, assuming Groudon and Kyogre will be banned again. I highly doubt they'll stick around for long.
why not char and vena been bro's since r/b/g/y
SD chlorophyll venasaur sounds sexy I wanna pair dis kid up Tangrowth.
On the flip, won't venasaur also work in a rain dance team, since it removes his fire weakness?
And it can use Sludge Bomb to take out the Grass types that plague rain teams while also resisting their STAB.
Yea I've been using a similar set on the Pokemon Online alpha testing for gen 5, and it worked very well.
More specifically, I had:
Adamant @ leftovers,
Swords Dance/Sleep Powder/Earthquake/Seed Bomb
Paired with Ninetails obv.
Gave it just enough speed to outspeed choice scarf garchomp in the sun, and put the rest into attack and HP.
What's great about venusaur is that it can power up with SD, start firing off eq's and seed bombs, and then use sleep powder when a supposed 'counter' is switched in, lol.
Also, it fits beautifully onto sun teams. The reason being that my sun team had three fire types (Ninetails, Urugamosu, and Victini) so opponents were often likely to switch in a water pokemon. In that case, Venusaur was a natural switch for me, and then i could start setting up.
Also, sun teams in BW need an answer for when the opponent brings in politoed, and venusaur is a natural answer - hes great because he works in both weather conditions.
Try OU. Venusaur and Ninetails are going to be legit OU pokemon this generation.
It depends if they end up in the same usage tier. If Ninetales does end up in a tier above Venusaur, there's still Vulpix though, who might be worth using.
breh
強いだね
Sorry for bumping; I was just looking through the Roserade thread and was thinking about the pity that it didn't have Chlorophyll... then it struck me.
[SET]
name: Dedicated Growth
move 1: Growth
move 2: Power Whip / Petal Dance
move 3: Earthquake
move 4: HP Fire
item: Life Orb
ability: Chlorophyll
nature: Hasty
EVs: 124 Atk / 252 Sp.Atk / 132 Spe (With Petal Dance)
EVs: 252 Atk / 124 Sp.Atk / 132 Spe (With Power Whip) (thanks for pointing that out Ech0ez)
Growth boosts by two levels in the sun, making Venusaur a deadly sun sweeper with it. Basically, in one turn, you get the equivalent of one SD and one NP with no disadvantages, which is ridiculous.
Power Whip vs. Petal Dance is something that vastly affects the set. If Petal Dance is chosen, Venusaur will be hitting off of its greater offense. However, Petal Dance is still an unreliable move with an unpleasant side-effect. For this reason, Power Whip is also usable, as it does not lock Venusaur in. Unfortunately, it has less than great accuracy and runs off of the weaker attacking stat.
The small bit of speed is run to outspeed most relevant Scarf Pokemon; specifically, this Venusaur will outspeed Garchomp and all slower Scarfers in the sun.
[SET]
name: Dedicated Growth
move 1: Growth
move 2: Power Whip / Petal Dance
move 3: Earthquake
move 4: HP Fire
item: Life Orb
ability: Chlorophyll
nature: Hasty
EVs: 124 Atk / 252 Sp.Atk / 132 Spe (With Petal Dance)
EVs: 252 Atk / 124 Sp.Atk / 132 Spe (With Power Whip) (thanks for pointing that out Ech0ez)
Growth boosts by two levels in the sun, making Venusaur a deadly sun sweeper with it. Basically, in one turn, you get the equivalent of one SD and one NP with no disadvantages, which is ridiculous.
Power Whip vs. Petal Dance is something that vastly affects the set. If Petal Dance is chosen, Venusaur will be hitting off of its greater offense. However, Petal Dance is still an unreliable move with an unpleasant side-effect. For this reason, Power Whip is also usable, as it does not lock Venusaur in. Unfortunately, it has less than great accuracy and runs off of the weaker attacking stat.
The small bit of speed is run to outspeed most relevant Scarf Pokemon; specifically, this Venusaur will outspeed Garchomp and all slower Scarfers in the sun.
...How is Nattorei set up bait and not Bronzong? In fact, Nattorei's Gyro ball is stronger than Zong's due to higher Atk and lower Speed. Since Venusaur has no defensive investment and is extremely fast due to the sun, it should be an easy 2HKO. (unless Chloropyll's speed boost doesn't effect Gyro Ball)
breh
強いだね
Because I am extremely stupid, that's why. Lol I'd forgotten that it commonly runs Gyro Ball (I have yet to play a match, sadly) so that was a stupid thing to think on my part.
Though most of them (I presume) would switch from nervousness; nearly every Sunny Day pokemon uses some sort of Fire-type move so it's a danger to it. But otherwise yeah you are right.
Here is a set I have been running with relative success.
Venusaur (M) @ Life Orb Trait: Chlorophyll
EVs: 56 HP / 252 SAtk / 200 Spd
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Synthesis
- Sleep Powder
- SolarBeam
- Sludge Bomb
Pretty basic really. Switch in on something you resist, sleep powder the counter that comes in then sweep. Synthesis makes sure that Venusaur stays around for a while, especially under the sun and when the opponent is asleep 75% of the time. The EV investments are actually just me trying out what works, and those seem to work well enough for me. If someone has a better suggestion I am definitely open to it.
Venusaur (M) @ Life Orb Trait: Chlorophyll
EVs: 56 HP / 252 SAtk / 200 Spd
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Synthesis
- Sleep Powder
- SolarBeam
- Sludge Bomb
Pretty basic really. Switch in on something you resist, sleep powder the counter that comes in then sweep. Synthesis makes sure that Venusaur stays around for a while, especially under the sun and when the opponent is asleep 75% of the time. The EV investments are actually just me trying out what works, and those seem to work well enough for me. If someone has a better suggestion I am definitely open to it.
I imagine most people would be more afraid of letting Vensaur set-up unless they had a solid counter/revenger. That being said there's still a decent enough amount of set-up fodder around for him so it shouldn't be terribly difficult to get a Growth up.
Here's a helpful thread you might enjoy reading.
132 Speed with Hasty and a 30 Speed IV lets you hit 500 in the Sun which beats ScarfChomp whom is pretty much the fastest scarfer you're going to see at the moment besides Ditto which will outspeed you regardless of what you run. You can always invest more in Speed if you're worried about other Chlorophyll users, but at worst they can revenge you since they're all torn apart by HP Fire.
On the Petal Dance set there's not much need to invest in Atk since the Petal Dance/HP Fire combination destroys most things in the game (Most variants of Blissey are 2HKOed by Petal Dance after Stealth Rock) and Earthquake still takes out just about every Fire type you'll run into (Most of which you probably won't). You can adjust the EVs if you wish to (Maybe lower the attack investment or something) and then put into Speed or your HP but you already outspeed pretty much everything and resist most priority besides Ice Shard which will screw you over regardless with LO recoil.
On the Power Whip set you can adjust the Sp.Atk investment based on what you want to hit, I simply reversed the EVs since I'm lazy. With Stealth Rock you OHKO the "Tank" Bronzong set in the analysis with HP Fire, but bulkier Bronzong can live and hit you back with Gyro Ball so you can drop some Attack EVs in favour of a bit more Special offense although eventually you get to the point where you may as well just run the Petal Dance set. For the most part HP Fire clears out any bulkier Grass and Steels that might potentially wall you.
The only things you really have to worry about are;
Balloon Heatran
Bronzong (Max HP/Max Sp.Def against the PD set, doesn't need as much against the PW variant.)
Charizard
Chlorophyll users with higher Speed
Ditto
Moltres
Ice Shard
If you want to place faith in the incomplete 5th gen simulator over the actual game itself, that's your call. PO is missing a variety of mechanic changes so I certainly wouldn't cite it as evidence for anything. If it hasn't got said mechanic implemented yet, it will at some point.
Now that shiftry has Earthquake through the form of Nature Power, the only thing Venesaur has over Shiftry is its bulk and better defensive typing, allowing it to sweep without fear of Mach Punch or Vacume Wavce priority. Shiftry does have Sucker Punch, but that's just more reason to use Lucario against Shiftry.
Of course, the change to Nature Power also allows Venesaur to run this very silly gimick set:
Venesaur@ Leftovers
Rest
Sleep talk
Nature Power
Earthquake
Of course, the change to Nature Power also allows Venesaur to run this very silly gimick set:
Venesaur@ Leftovers
Rest
Sleep talk
Nature Power
Earthquake
breh
強いだね
Err... I don't get it. Venusaur gets walled by flying pokemon?
breh
強いだね
That seems to be done better by a plethora of other pokemon; Jaroda and Erufuun are just 2 examples I can pull up.
for teams using Saur for a sunny day team it has many problems. relying on a solarbeam sludgebomb combo of atks is not a great choice being its walled off by basically anything with a steel typing. not to mention other teams that run weather afeecters like Ttar,abamasnow, and even politoad. if this happens venasaurs solar beam is already nerfed. this is why it most likely will reamin UU.