VGC's Metagame

[Chinese Dood]

Dusknoir (especially holding chesto/lum) Taunting Bronzong would counter that pretty well (assuming Dusknoir's partner can kill off Smeargle in 2 turns).

Follow Me Togekiss + any taunter would also work, as would any inner focus taunter. A faster fake out paired with a taunter also works but if Smeargle uses Follow Me instead of Fake Out, then Trick Room is still going to go through.

Double surfs for rain teams, or basically double targetting on smeargle will prevent Smeargle from Dark Voids, but obviously Bronzong will still get Trick Room down.

But yah, I think having at least one priority move in your team is almost a must for VGC.

 

[Knut LB]

What about Primeape + Honchkrow?
Both have an abilitiy to prevent sleep.
Honchkrow can use Taunt on Bronzong.
Primeape can attack Smeargle with Close Combat.

 

[POKEMONBATTLEBRAIN]

Smeargle can just Fake Out Honchkrow and prevent the Taunt. ;) Then when you Close Combat Smeargle with Primape, it survives with Focus Sash and then Bronzong will Trick Room.

 

[Knut LB]

Primeape can use Taunt too.

 

[POKEMONBATTLEBRAIN]

Then Smeargle would just use Follow me instead and draw Taunt(s) away from Bronzong and TR will still be set up.

 

[dtrain]

PBB stop ruining all the fun. Primeape Honchkrow is the new MOLF :D

 

[mattj]

PBB stop ruining all the fun. Primeape Honchkrow is the new MOLF :D

Honchape pwns YOU! XD

 

[Alex Practice]

Ive got a local tourney here in a few weeks. Looking through successful teams I really liked the AOE team (area of effect) that has Zapdos/Garchomp/Scarf Abomasnow/Metagross and I was planning on using something like that. I was wondering what match ups are like? Like "Good vs RD, can't possibly beat TR" things like that and any other tips for a newbie double battler.

 

[mattj]

Ive got a local tourney here in a few weeks. Looking through successful teams I really liked the AOE team (area of effect) that has Zapdos/Garchomp/Scarf Abomasnow/Metagross and I was planning on using something like that. I was wondering what match ups are like? Like "Good vs RD, can't possibly beat TR" things like that and any other tips for a newbie double battler.

If it's just a local doubles tourney you can probably just get away with what you listed. Dump the Meta for a Banded Aero though for a 4th powerful double target poke. Maybe Scarftran over Scafsnow too, your team though. Speedy, powerful double target attacks will probably bowl over all the noobs. Got me into Worlds! XD

 

[Alex Practice]

True enough but I know there are some people who are serious about Pokemon. I've lost to a guy who used Trick Room before thats mainly why I'm asking.

 

[LightningFusion]

True enough but I know there are some people who are serious about Pokemon. I've lost to a guy who used Trick Room before thats mainly why I'm asking.

The team you listed has no couter to a TR team at all. Most TR teams run either dusknoir and smeargle set up, or bronzong and togekiss. There is not always a way to stop them. Running a good stuff team with 1 of the last 2 pokemon of your 4 able to work in TR is a good way to counter TR. Like running snorlax as your 4th pokemon is a good option sometimes. Having a pokemon that can taunt is always a good option. Try to always have a lead with lum and a priority move.

By running taunt, when battling the dusk and smeargle leads, you can taunt dusk and if the smeargle lacks follow me, TR is prevented. But it can always fake out the taunter, so having a fake out pokemon yourself to fake out their smeargle is an option. If you fake out smeargle and taunt the dusk, the only way TR is getting set up is if smeargle runs follow me. Fake out will break the sash and taunt will force smeargle to only be able to endeavor, which means a priority move from either of your leads can finish it off.

The Follow me sets ran by both TR leads are hard to counter, and TR will always get set up. Using protect effectively to predict explosions from bronzong and to stall out TR is a good strategy to beat TR. After they get TR up, it is just a matter of stall out TR and doing a lot of damage. Your leads should do more damage then kiss and zong do to yours. Dusk and smeargle will have smeargle dead and already at a disadvantage.

Hope this helped sorta and isn't to much.

 

[Alex Practice]

Well the guy who beat me used Follow Me as I fake out'd his smeargle and taunted his dusknoir last time so I think I'll just have to try to play smarter this time around. Discharge's 30% paralysis rate, hitting both enemies twice, potential critical hits, and protect stalling is probably the best I can do against follow me.

What's the best way to beat Trick Room while also being consistent? Is there a team type that operates really well under those conditions? Should I just use a TR team of my own that can specifically counter things like Snorlax or whatever?

I'm only really worried about losing to TR so as long as my team can beat noobish teams and TR I should win :]

 

[LightningFusion]

Well the guy who beat me used Follow Me as I fake out'd his smeargle and taunted his dusknoir last time so I think I'll just have to try to play smarter this time around. Discharge's 30% paralysis rate, hitting both enemies twice, potential critical hits, and protect stalling is probably the best I can do against follow me.

What's the best way to beat Trick Room while also being consistent? Is there a team type that operates really well under those conditions? Should I just use a TR team of my own that can specifically counter things like Snorlax or whatever?

I'm only really worried about losing to TR so as long as my team can beat noobish teams and TR I should win :]

If you still want to run that main team yet still be able to counter TR, run a taunter + Garchomp. First turn, you can have garchomp rock slide, and then have a taunter, perhaps gengar or a pokemon that also has a priority move, taunt the TR pokemon, and if they follow me, next turn use the priority move to finish off smeargle since the rock slide should have broken the focus sash. Also, the rock slide may have even flinch the Trick room pokemon. Then you will have to just stall out trick room. Then your other pokemon should die first, and then you can bring in zapdos. If you fear garchomp dieing first, you can run another ground pokemon.

Another startegy could be running an imprison dusknoir. It can out speed everything on TR, and they can't stop you from imprisoning.

Another option is running a Cresselia or another pokemon that can Trick Room, yet still be a support pokemon. You can have it icy wind while not battling TR teams, and when you face TR teams, you can TR the same turn they do, canceling out trick room.

 

[Witchcraft23]

Bronzong (0 Spd IVs, Leftovers)
-Hypnosis
-Trick Room
-Gyroball
-Explosion

Smeargle (Focus Sash)
-Fake Out
-Endeavor
-Dark Void
-Protect

Pokemon with inner focus to prevent that fake out. Maybe moves that hit both of them. Lucario with rock slide and crobat with heat wave. Than again, no one uses Lucario as a lead (much less, with rock slide) and there are probably many other counters. If the person has that predictable of starters than, it should be easy to counter. If you are lucky, you can make them flinch.

 

[Alex Practice]

I like the imprison strategy. Fake out smeargle and imprison with Dusknoir and then start firing off Earthquakes and crap :D
I just have no idea how to build a team around that. Maybe something like

Levitate/Fly with higher Speed than Smeargle -> Fake Out
Dusknoir - > Imprison, Protect, Earthquake, ?

Not sure where to go from there

 

[Pokérob]

Argh, I want to find a team where Lucario works!!! D:<

Thing is lucario loses its extremespeed (well I'm not 100% sure so quote me on this if there is a way D:) due to level 51. It's probably a great life saver at the end of a game. Problem is you got Earthquake and Heat Wave plus a lot of fighting types to counter snorlax and a few other threats such as infernape plus weavile.

Argh!! Well anyways, I am hoping when SB2 comes out to see us get even better. But also with the HG/SS maybe their leveling up might give us new moves to try out for next year. Even if we're lucky we could maybe get a new tutor. :O

 

[mattj]

I like the imprison strategy. Fake out smeargle and imprison with Dusknoir and then start firing off Earthquakes and crap :D
I just have no idea how to build a team around that. Maybe something like

Levitate/Fly with higher Speed than Smeargle -> Fake Out
Dusknoir - > Imprison, Protect, Earthquake, ?

Not sure where to go from there

Crobat. Inner Focus, fast, flying, type knows, or at least can BLUFF that it knows taunt. If they know anything about Crobat it will force them into using Follow me every time. You can then Imprison or whatever you like. Imprison's a great strat if you want to avoid TR.

And if they get TR up, just protect out of it.

 

[Alex Practice]

Crobat's a bit too frail probably...Lucario's got inner focus but the typing is pretty bad. :(

I was considering a gimmicky Togekiss/Lucario team though. Follow me + Swords Dance + Extreme Speed/Earthquake <.<

 

[LightningFusion]

Most imprison teams run Dusknoir and 3 exploders. They imprison protect so they opponent cant protect themselves. You can run azelf, metagross, gengar, snorlax, those are the main ones. I like to run azelf and Dusknoir lead. You can also just run a general good stuff pokemon as your 4th.

Dusknoir@ Lum
Imprison
Protect
Trick Room
Attacking move

Azelf @ focus sash
Psychic
Flamethrower
Detect
Explosion

Gengar @ Life Orb or Choice Item
Explosion
Shadow Ball
Protect / Taunt
Explosion

 

[theamericandream38]

Imprison with a Ghost type is one of the few almost surefire ways to stop TR from being set up. Here's my Imprison/TR team that I have used to great effect against several of Smogon's finest:

Azelf @ Focus Sash
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 124 Atk / 252 Spd / 132 SAtk
Hasty Nature (+Spd, -Def)
- Energy Ball
- Explosion
- Fire Blast
- Thunderbolt
Dusknoir (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 34 Def / 12 Spd / 212 SDef
Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
- Imprison
- Protect
- Shadow Sneak
- Trick Room
Snorlax (F) @ Lum Berry
Trait: Thick Fat
EVs: 214 HP / 252 Atk / 44 SDef
Brave Nature (+Atk, -Spd)
- Fire Punch
- Protect
- Return
- Selfdestruct
Metagross @ Occa Berry
Trait: Clear Body
EVs: 196 HP / 158 Atk / 156 SDef
Brave Nature (+Atk, -Spd)
- Bullet Punch
- Earthquake
- Explosion
- Protect

(Energy Ball on Azelf is 100% necessary, otherwise an opposing Quagsire with Damp shuts you down completely)

 

[Mosquito]

If a Ghost Imprisoner comes their way, what happens if someone with a Lv. 1 Scrappy Kangaskhan comes? They'll Fake Out Dusknoir/Mismagius, and the teammate will set up Trick Room.

 

[theamericandream38]

If a Ghost Imprisoner comes their way, what happens if someone with a Lv. 1 Scrappy Kangaskhan comes? They'll Fake Out Dusknoir/Mismagius, and the teammate will set up Trick Room.

Good point, meaning that the only way you can completely stop TR is to have a Ghost Imprisoner along with a Taunt lead. That way, if they use Follow Me, you get Imprison off, and if they use Fake Out on the Ghost type, then Taunt hits the TR user (if they use Fake Out on your Taunter, Imprison goes off).

 

[POKEMONBATTLEBRAIN]

PBB stop ruining all the fun. Primeape Honchkrow is the new MOLF :D

Well sorry. :P

 

[LightningFusion]

Good point, meaning that the only way you can completely stop TR is to have a Ghost Imprisoner along with a Taunt lead. That way, if they use Follow Me, you get Imprison off, and if they use Fake Out on the Ghost type, then Taunt hits the TR user (if they use Fake Out on your Taunter, Imprison goes off).

Instead of taunt, you can have a fake out lead also to stop TR when they have a Kangaskhan. As long as you're fake outer is faster then a max speed kangaskhan, you can fake out kangaskhan before it fake outs your imprison pokemon.

 

[Alex Practice]

^^ The Taunt on TR works, but then you can't imprison against Protect too which would kinda suck.

Probably the most sure-fire way to get off Imprison and always deny Protect and Trick Room would be something that could Follow Me AND Taunt. Follow me on the severe offchance they're packing Scrappy or Taunt, and then much like follow me means you'll always get TR up, follow means you'll always get Imprison up :D

But what's fast and can taunt AND use fake out? Preferably something that levitates/flies because I'd like my Dusknoir to have EQ as an attack move :3 although that probably means nothing so maybe like, infernape + dusknoir?