Whaling and Censorship

[Phantom_IV]

So, reading on Yahoo news, I stumbled on an interesting article.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100610/ap_on_en_mo/as_japan_dolphin_hunt_movie_2

To summarize, The Cove is a documentary about whaling by the Oceanic Preservation Society. It won the 2009 award for best documentary. On the other hand, it features a rather graphic slaughter of dolphins as well as portraying Japanese fishermen as thugs.

Out of fear of protests, theaters in Japan have reversed their decisions to show the documentary, causing cheers from nationalists and complaints from rights activists and such.

The Japanese constitution protects freedom of expression, though it's the theaters that individually decided not to show the film. I can only speak for Americans, but we generally view whaling as a horrible act. On the other hand, it's no different from hunting deer or tuna. Americans slaughter billions of livestock annually, including pigs, which are quite smart. Plus the Japanese have a long history of whaling and are hardly the only whaling nation.

Smogon Community, I'd like to hear your opinions about whaling, eating different foods, and the choice not to show The Cove.

 

[bleed4m3]

The difference between deer hunting and whaling is that whales are going extinct.

Just thought I'd throw that out there.

 

[Precognition]

I'm a vegetarian, so my opinion on this will probably be obvious.

However, it should be said that the Japanese are no worst than Westerners, same type of unnecessary murder against beautiful creatures.

 

[Adm. Empoleon]

I'd like to hear your opinions about whaling...

Eh, its fine to shoot and kill animals for food. Not for fun. Whaling is done mainly for food, but since we (human beings) overkill and overhunt, the overall population of whales has dwindled to the point that it's an endangered species.

Final opinion: Its OK as long as we don't hunt during their mating seasons so that next year we can hunt for some more. And as long as we use them for food. Not for fun.

eating different foods...
As long as its not a bug, and I know the ingredients, then its going down my belly. For sure.

the choice not to show The Cove...
I don't know about that, but I think that the nationalists shouldn't watch it if they don't like it.

 

[mtr]

Lol, Americans and Europeans have been slaughtering all kinds of animals, but also whales for centuries (I mean, Moby Dick is about a friggin' whale), and no one has ever batted an eyelash until the recent decades.

Targeting the Japanese (and other whaling nations) for whaling is racist. In fact, I would say that the environmentalists are exploiting a racism that dates back to WW2 by portraying Japanese whalers as 'thugs' to advance their point.

I don't see any difference between killing cows in an assembly line and hunting whale. Sure, you might argue that whales are going extinct, but if that was the case, commercial whaling operations would completely shut down due to the economic inefficiency of the whole ordeal.

 

[Bad Ass]

totally agreeing; in fact, if you have ever seen a video of what they do to cows for any of the fast food businesses, it makes you want to cry. cows aren't the most intelligent animals, but fuck. whaling isn't bad at all compared to that.

 

[Myzozoa]

The japanese government does some pretty funny things. One of the funny things they like to do is claim that whaling is part of traditional japanese cultural which it never was/has been. Im generally against the continued hunting of an endangered species including whales. its sort of stupid that they wont show the movie, but this is the same country where pearl harbor has been edited out of text books so its not surprising.

 

[ginganinja]

Well I am a New Zealander and this topic is very close to my heart.
Actually we had New Zealander named Peter Belume who jumped onto a whaling boat after the whaling boat fired water cannons onto the conservationists boat and then rammed it, sinking the ship. he has now been charged in a Japanese court and can face up to 15 years in Prision.

I feel very strongly about this issue especially since comercial whaling is banned and the Japan is claiming that it is whaling for "Scientific reasons". However Greenpeace and most famous "the Tokyo Two" claimed that whale meat was being taken from whales killed in the name of science and accused Japan for using scientific whaling as a coverup for comercial whaling.
Not to meantion whales are protected in New Zealand waters and still Japan hunts whales there, ramming our protest boats and such like.

I also understand that Australia is taking Japan to court over whaling in the Southern Ocean.

Anyway I showen I do care deeply about this issue and that scientific lethal whaling should be stopped.

Also to all those who think that "its not so different to killing cows for their products' then remember that comeercial whaling is illegal, killing cow (as far as I know) is legal.

EDIT: 550th post


Fun fact

Hide

After whales beached themselves on a South Island (New Zealand) beach the people of the nearby township rushed out and endevered to push the whales out to sea. they succeeded and the whales were saved. The very next day and angry boy wrote a letter to the townshipps paper: "Dear editor, I resent the fact that people are putting beached whales back to sea. I believe that the whales are trying to evolve by beaching themselves so that they can walk, please refrain from putting beached whales back into the ocean".
Yes this is a TRUE story.

 

[MrIndigo]

The difference between deer hunting and whaling is that whales are going extinct.

Just thought I'd throw that out there.

Thread was over since this post.

 

[Electrode]

I don't think that Japanese fisherman should be fishing in the waters of other countries.

 

[Ferrouswheel]

Thread was over since this post.

I'll put it out there that I'm against whaling because I believe that we shouldn't kill things that are highly intelligent, I don't believe that simply because something is endangered makes killing it any more or less a crime. Under that interpretation it would be worse to murder an Alaskan then it would be to murder a Texan as there are less Alaskans then there are Texans.

ginganinja, I think the fun fact is great, and if Japan is violating the Law of the Sea, they should be punished for it, but I'm afraid to say that I doubt they will be. New Zealand was pretty much ignored after the events of July 10, 1985, and I doubt this time will be any different.

 

[Aura Guardian]

The difference between deer hunting and whaling is that whales are going extinct.

Just thought I'd throw that out there.

And deer can overpopulate dangerously for their environment, iirc.

 

[Raj]

I've always wanted to be an eco-terrorist and kill whalers and baby seal hunters

 

[ginganinja]

ginganinja, I think the fun fact is great, and if Japan is violating the Law of the Sea, they should be punished for it, but I'm afraid to say that I doubt they will be. New Zealand was pretty much ignored after the events of July 10, 1985, and I doubt this time will be any different.

Yeah I don't think NZ will be listened too either, still, Australia is currently taking Japan to the international court over the issue. The main reason NZ has not already done this to Japan is that it still hants to keep its trading ties with Japan.

 

[Drakhun]

I've always wanted to be an eco-terrorist and kill whalers and baby seal hunters

And I've always wanted to be part of anti-terrorist law enforcement who sprays the guts of people like you onto the snow.

-----

Back on topic:

From what I understand the tactics used by these groups are not exactly non-hostile, and to use force when force is used upon you is perfectly justifiable. Feel free to correct me if I am wrong though.

As for whaling itself, I have no qualms with any sort of hunting that is done responsibly. I do not know enough about the situation to say if the Japanese whaling is done responsibly, but because they are involved in the treaty that prohibits whaling, so some course of action should be taken.

 

[gvmgvm40]

There are 17 times more cattle in the world than humans, while most whale species are endangered. Yes, this doesn't make murdering cattle less terrible. However, whales going extinct could have a huge impact in their habitat. On the other hand, the slaughter of a few million pigs/cattle has negligible ill effects on the nature.

 

[Precognition]

There are 17 times more cattle in the world than humans, while most whale species are endangered. Yes, this doesn't make murdering cattle less terrible. However, whales going extinct could have a huge impact in their habitat. On the other hand, the slaughter of a few million pigs/cattle has negligible ill effects on the nature.

Wrong, the population of cattle in the world is 1.3 billion, which is equivalent to a quarter of the human population.

I know what you're going to say, that's still a lot, but it should be said that overpopulation of cattle(which is the result of the huge capitalistic demand for them) is just as dangerous and unhealthy to the global Eco-system as endangerment of whales, if not more.

 

[Son of Disaster]

i love beef. And unless they evolve to stop me from eating them i'm going to continue to love eating them. And i bet that even if things stay the way they are we are going to be just fine eating cattle even if they are overpopulated. I can't agree with vegetarians. It's just too much effort to try and dislike meat.

As for whales i understand the concern. However i really don't agree in the slightest with the sea shepherd and the harassment of the whalers. The Japanese say it's for scientific research and that's there call. Whether it's there way of getting around the system who can really say. They primarily hunt minke whales which are the most populous of the whales they hunt. So it seems they have a little bit of preservation in mind somewhere.

I don't know why some people have said that Japan doesn't have a tradition of whaling...they have whaling evidence dating back to the 12th century.

 

[anti404]

I don't understand the argument that because it is a Japanese tradition, it should continue to be allowed; should we continue to hunt bison as much as we had back in the 19th century? I mean, it is tradition, right?

also, it's not "their call"; if they are not actually conducting scientific research on the whales, then they should not be allowed to slaughter them and sell the meat. also, the supposed scientific research, if legitimate, is really just a means to reopen commercial whaling by population research; this is not exactly a negative thing, but it's doubtful that it is necessary to catch and slaughter 700+ whales per year to extrapolate population totals. *shrug*

 

[Alan]

Just posting to say its not "murdering" cattle. We aren't killing them for the sake of killing them. We are killing them for food for survival. There is a difference. Most murderers don't eat their victims.

 

[vonFiedler]

Hey guys I'm a Libertarian so I have a compromise. We allow the Japanese to keep whaling but instead of catching whales they catch censors. Then everybody wins.

I'm also gonna side with the omnivores in this thread. Which according to first grade science class should be everyone, but I guess it isn't. Funny world we live in.

 

[Precognition]

Just posting to say its not "murdering" cattle. We aren't killing them for the sake of killing them. We are killing them for food for survival. There is a difference. Most murderers don't eat their victims.

For survival?

You realize that unless you're from a 3rd world country, you can still have a nutritionally-secure diet without eating meat? And it's financially reasonable too considering how expensive meat is.

Let me also tell you that it's the same rational as killing and eating small children.

Cannibalism is a taboo because you can find something less cognitive to eat so children wouldn't suffer, but can't the same thing be said about meat?

You can still attain protein, vitamin B12 and iron from mushrooms, beans, strawberries and soy.

Meat is wrong, good night.

 

[Dr. Attack]

Meat is wrong, good night.

If meat is wrong I don't wanna be right.

 

[Son of Disaster]

I never said because it's a tradition it should continue i just said that it has been a tradition because some people have been saying it wasn't which is false. I'm for restricting the whaling. It's not a necessary thing and it's endangering some whale species. However i think it's up to Japan whether they want or not. I'd agree that the number of whales they use for research seems like overkill....(ha punny)

I'm sorry but i'd rather not eat a whole ton of vegetables to get my different strains of protein when i could just eat meat. Fish is great for your body. Love those omega fatty acids. Not to mention it's delicious and our bodies are supposed to eat it. I think i have plenty of fiber in my body right now. I'd rather not have the runs constantly. Vegetarianism would just suck Especially if i can't drink milk or eat eggs. Then i'm just screwed. Milk is one the best foods in the world for you. Covers practically all of your dietary requirements. Somehow i don't see cannibalism on the same level as eating meat.

Vegetarianism is stupid. Good morning.

 

[vonFiedler]

You realize that unless you're from a 3rd world country, you can still have a nutritionally-secure diet without eating meat? And it's financially reasonable too considering how expensive meat is.

And what if you were living in a 3rd world country? Do you know what Bhudda had to say about vegetarianism? You know, the guy who made the religion where killing animals is bad? Well, he couldn't justify meat eating as a sin because, fancy this, vegetarianism was a luxury, and Bhuddism involves forgoing luxury. And if he permitted his followers to eat meat when they were out begging for food, he had to do it, cause he didn't see himself as being morally superior to anyone else.

So basically modern vegetarians are douchebags.