Why we need fewer Comic Book movies or: why we need to change the system.

Kinda laughing that capefeather thinks Hollywood operates on anything remotely akin to capitalism. The Screen Actors Guild is literally communist in it's world outlook, and most of Hollywood's unions aren't that far removed. That's why you see major blockbuster budget stinkers like Gas Land, because the point isn't to market to audience tastes, it's to be an author avatar and Aesop to the rubes in the theater. It's cookie cutter plotlines with cookie cutter villains, and the bad guy is always religion/business/morality/individualism.

If Hollywood ran on a capitalistic model it would be like the iPhone: Constantly upgrading and updating to feed the needs of the market that exist - and the most valuable commodity in story telling is scarcity. Instead what Hollywood does, since it can't think in most instances think its way out of a paper bag, is try and reinvent already written content and fit it into an overarching author narrative.

Like I said, there are exceptions here and there (Disney / Pixar seems to be having a run). But by and large it's why movies have been going beyond trilogies into fourth and fifth iterations, and adapting written materials originally published several decades ago instead of generating new content. Even the more conservative leaning movies are either novel adaptations (Atlas Shrugged) or, as is to be expected, properly done renditions of superheroes (The Dark Knight, Man of Steel) because there just isn't a critical mass to appeal to the scarcity in the market of new compelling stories and characters.

As far as Superhero movies themselves, those are always a mixed bag. If you actually stay true to the character rather than making them an author avatar you end up with something closer to The Dark Knight and Man of Steel. If the character is just a device for a PC Aesop or there as a mindless face (older Hulk movies didn't utilize the character properly) it falls on its face.

The problem is industry-wide. There is not yet a critical mass of executives and staff willing to make changes in the big money culture that drives Hollywood, so you're going to see endless rehashes of Fast and Furious, Die Hard, Superhero Movies, and Aesop's (Politically Correct) Fables in the foreseeable future.
 
I don't really see the problem, if you don't like them just don't see them!

Personally, all the superhero movies I've seen lately are pretty good. Dark Knight Trilogy, Avengers, Iron Man 3, Man of Steel, all really good. I wasn't the biggest fan of the Amazing Spiderman, but hey the sequel looks much better.
 
Deck Knight is a motherfucking legend. I haven't been this excited reading a post since Logan's post in the thread about my teacher.
 
What about teen mytho-romance stories? We've seem the exact same formula used for everything except like androids and centaurs. (I would totally watch a centaur romance movie)
 
We live in the blockbuster era for movies. During the 70s, studios would make perhaps twenty $10m movies a year that individually targeted a different audience (e.g. a thriller, a romantic drama, something artsy etc.), and hope for a couple of hits. Back then, they released movies roadshow-style; a new city, state, country, territory each week, month, quarter, year.

The commercial success of Jaws and Star Wars changed all that, and the strategy moved towards investing heavily into a few high-budget productions (e.g. two $100m "sure things" in lieu of twenty $10m "maybes"), and supporting the launch with an intensive global marketing campaign for a simultaneous worldwide release.

This strategy has proven highly profitable, but it makes studios very conservative about the movies that they fund. When it was producing twenty low-budget movies a year, a studio could afford to take a chance on something that was different, because the winners would pay for the losers. However, when the game changed to funding fewer movies at enormous expense, then it's natural to be risk averse and err towards a proven entity.

tl;dr the prevalence of superhero movies is due to a strategic shift by studios away from funding numerous low-budget movies and towards fewer high-budget productions that are heavily marketed and need to be successful.

Edit: I just read this thread after my post; I'm sure that capefeather and Deck Knight both have valid points, but they make them poorly. Please be more coherent or shut the fuck up.
 
honestly i don't think you can look at a peter jackson film and know what you're getting into before actually watching it.

all i'm hearing is that deck knight has really poor taste in movies, or just thinks they're all so mind-numbingly similar and predictable that he never bothers to watch anything that hasn't been constantly advertised and suggested into his tiny world view already!

i guess we're supposed to be focusing on comic book movies? it just sounds like an uphill battle, where people are eager to see what X might look like in film, and not already knowing means that you have to make the film, if there is enough interest toward its creation. however, i feel like any time a superman movie comes out, and then a few years later ANOTHER superman movie comes out (rinse repeat for spiderman/hulk??) it's just a petty competition between directors to see who can do it better. who can have their fantasy/interpretation of a comic book hero materialize more impressively than the other?

hollywood may be a giant organism, but i still reserve belief in individual directors and aspiring screen writers and their ability to bear fruit that has not been regurgitated and spat back out to the public over and over. there are thousands of films the average person has never seen, and i think it's really, really unfair to say "blah blah blah hollywood sucks every movie ever created is boring and already been done before."
 
MV5BMTI4NzE1Nzg0MF5BMl5BanBnXkFtZTcwODczNDgxMQ@@._V1_SY317_CR6,0,214,317_.jpg
 
Twilight was the last film to end this gleaming era of cinema. I think we can all proudly hail the next era as possibly the greatest of all time.
 
Hmm, anyone who claims that Hollywood is doing it wrong.. is wrong. You are the problem not them. There are thousands of indie films and hundreds of good ones. You are just to lazy to find them.
 
Fishy is really the last person who should be talking about tiny world views. Did I insult anybody in making my points? No. Yet you chose to attack personally in an otherwise trivial movie thread.

Grow up, Fishy. I'm not your daddy, but I'll scold your bratty behavior anyway - it's clearly long overdue.

Back to movies. Let's see if we can get some objective data, so lets look at the top selling releases over the last year.

Code:
[B]Top 25:[/B]

1	The Dark Knight Rises	WB	$448,139,099	4,404	$160,887,295	4,404	7/20/12	12/13/12
2	Iron Man 3	BV	$401,606,000	4,253	$174,144,585	4,253	5/3/13	-
3	Skyfall	Sony	$304,360,277	3,526	$88,364,714	3,505	11/9/12	3/10/13
4	The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey	WB	$303,003,568	4,100	$84,617,303	4,045	12/14/12	4/25/13
5	The Twilight Saga: Breaking Dawn Part 2	LG/S	$292,324,737	4,070	$141,067,634	4,070	11/16/12	3/7/13
6	The Amazing Spider-Man	Sony	$262,030,663	4,318	$62,004,688	4,318	7/3/12	10/14/12
7	Brave	BV	$237,283,207	4,164	$66,323,594	4,164	6/22/12	1/17/13
8	Oz The Great and Powerful	BV	$234,362,431	3,912	$79,110,453	3,912	3/8/13	-
9	Fast & Furious 6	Uni.	$225,137,000	3,771	$97,375,245	3,658	5/24/13	-
10	Ted	Uni.	$218,815,487	3,303	$54,415,205	3,239	6/29/12	10/25/12
11	Star Trek Into Darkness	Par.	$214,466,000	3,907	$70,165,559	3,868	5/16/13	-
12	Wreck-It Ralph	BV	$189,422,889	3,752	$49,038,712	3,752	11/2/12	5/2/13
13	The Croods	Fox	$183,062,625	4,065	$43,639,736	4,046	3/22/13	-
14	Lincoln	BV	$182,207,973	2,293	$944,308	11	11/9/12	4/25/13
15	Man of Steel	WB	$181,491,000	4,207	$116,619,362	4,207	6/14/13	-
16	Django Unchained	Wein.	$162,805,434	3,012	$30,122,888	3,010	12/25/12	5/16/13
17	Ice Age: Continental Drift	Fox	$161,321,843	3,886	$46,629,259	3,881	7/13/12	2/7/13
18	Les Miserables (2012)	Uni.	$148,809,770	2,927	$27,281,735	2,814	12/25/12	4/4/13
19	Hotel Transylvania	Sony	$148,313,048	3,375	$42,522,194	3,349	9/28/12	2/28/13
20	The Great Gatsby (2013)	WB	$140,998,103	3,550	$50,085,185	3,535	5/10/13	-
21	Taken 2	Fox	$139,854,287	3,706	$49,514,769	3,661	10/5/12	2/21/13
22	Argo	WB	$136,024,128	3,247	$19,458,109	3,232	10/12/12	4/24/13
23	Identity Thief	Uni.	$134,506,920	3,230	$34,551,025	3,141	2/8/13	6/6/13
24	Silver Linings Playbook	Wein.	$132,092,958	2,809	$443,003	16	11/16/12	6/6/13
25	Life of Pi	Fox	$124,965,764	2,946	$22,451,514	2,927	11/21/12	-

So going down:

Super Hero Movie
Super Hero Movie
Bond Retread
Novel Adaptation
Novel Adaptation
Super Hero Movie
Disney / Pixar Original Movie (CGI)
Old Film Reboot
Sixth Iteration of Series
Original Movie (Premise: Take childhood icon and make it vulgar)
Star Trek Retread
Disney Original Movie (CGI)
Dreamworks Original Movie (CGI)
Historical Retelling
Super Hero Movie
Historical Retelling (Premise: Killing white people violently is funny)
Fourth Iteration of Series
Novel Adaptation
Sony Original Movie (CGI)
Novel Adaptation
Sequel to Original Series (Premise: Kidnapping. Hero is ex-government agent, kidnappers are ethnic Europeans [white])
Historic Retelling
Road Trip Comedy Original (Premise: Police are incompetent, business is cruel)
Dystopian Romantic Comedy Original
Novel Adaptation

So if we're looking at the trends of what's selling, about the only things that are original in any sense are CGI films. All well and good, but hardly a ringing endorsement for originality. CGI characters fortunately only need voice acting, and the environment their in doesn't require much realism - you can basically write-in the physics of their universe.

The issue isn't so much that it's entirely devoid of original content, but the overwhelming majority of it fits the same overall template. CGI is really the only area where there's anything remotely unique on a regular basis - but CGI isn't real people and whatever stories the average person can relate to are mostly allegorical.

It's not even so much that the adaptations don't tell compelling stories. It's that the re-interpretations get filtered through the same sort of prism, hoping nostalgia pumps up the viewership / sales.

Stagnant is correct that indie films are probably the best way to go if you're a high-information, dedicated movie goer. But for those of us who only have the time and dedication to access the Hollywood filtered releases and sense the general current - the general culture, message, and content of Hollywood is important. It's just another form of mass media, like network news or government-controlled communication (NPR, PBS, etc.). Act accordingly.
 
You still haven't defined this "template" aside from "not something completely original" which is extremely fucking broad. This whole thread is really just mindless complaining about something that's no more of a problem in this industry than any other.

Also, the indie film circlejerk needs to stop. Independent films are not great just because they are out of the grasp of the big bad Hollywood. If an indie film is good, that means it was written, directed, and performed well, just like every theatrical production in history. And let's just pretend you have a point about big business constricting our creative freedoms; most indie films are also made for an audience as well, just a much more specific audience that most likely isn't you or someone like you.
 
the best thing about this is that *~*~the miracle of capitalism*~*~ is in your favour here. despite how "communist" hollywood is, they, too, bow to the demands of the dollar and forge themselves around it, just like almost every human in the world. if you don't like the movies that they make, don't support them. that's a little less money that they made. if other people agree that they want to see new, original content that doesn't piggyback off of something else, hollywood will respond. why? because they are all businesses and they want money.

forgive me if this view is a little simplistic, but personally i haven't seen any evidence in this thread that's made me think otherwise. if you don't like it, don't buy it. also, even with a socialist/whatever economy, i'm sort of doubting that a government would continue to fund spiderman movies using tax dollars unless the leader happened to be one helluva marvel fan.

[and yes, in some countries you can indeed get government grants to make a movie in certain conditions dictated by those giving the grant. i believe this one was made with the help of such a grant.]

ps: more godzilla films yes plz but they have to be good or i won't see them ;n;
KIRYU OR RODAN OR ANGUIRUS WOULD BE COOL?
[kaiju need more love but i have the feeling that rodan and i are the only ones who even slightly care about them on this site sobs]
 
i'm sorry, deck knight - it is equally unfair and rude of me to lure anyone else into my tiny world view of disliking you, but clearly i am digressing!!

if everyone wants to focus on the best sellers and box office singularities, fine - but it's so silly to view those trends in that area of all recently released and produced films, and apply it everywhere else. it's really as simple as stagnant said - if you don't believe 'hollywood' is creative anymore, then you're just watching the wrongggg stuff.
 
i believe this one was made with the help of such a grant.

A romance film, talk about minimal risk and maximum profit.

ps: more godzilla films yes plz but they have to be good or i won't see them ;n;
KIRYU OR RODAN OR ANGUIRUS WOULD BE COOL?
[kaiju need more love but i have the feeling that rodan and i are the only ones who even slightly care about them on this site sobs]
We can always use more Anguirus, and I'm certain that some form of Mechagodzilla will be in one of the films.
 
Hmm, anyone who claims that Hollywood is doing it wrong.. is wrong. You are the problem not them. There are thousands of indie films and hundreds of good ones. You are just to lazy to find them.

I love independent movies. The problem is that i feel that if the Oscars didn't exist, many more would be ignored by the studio system. Also, I'm not saying I hate superhero movies, I just think that if they keep redoing the same thing over and over again, they're gonna end up making less and less money until few are very interested. Also, I'm not claiming Hollywood is wrong, I'm just saying I don't think they system is making very good movies right know. This thread was just to show my opinion and listen to others.
What about teen mytho-romance stories? We've seem the exact same formula used for everything except like androids and centaurs. (I would totally watch a centaur romance movie)

Yes, those are becoming the more and more the same as well. The reason however why I singled out Superheroes is that they are one of the main suspects. I would have made one about Teen Supernatural Romances, but I've never seen (nor will) the whole Twilight series. If you want more information, this is the article that inspired me to start this thread.

I don't really see the problem, if you don't like them just don't see them!

Personally, all the superhero movies I've seen lately are pretty good. Dark Knight Trilogy, Avengers, Iron Man 3, Man of Steel, all really good. I wasn't the biggest fan of the Amazing Spiderman, but hey the sequel looks much better.

It's not I'll just stop watching them, it's just that I'm afraid everything more or less will become the same.
 
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