Serious The Politics Thread

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faint said:
I am not a registered Democrat so no, I'm not on ActBlue findom mailing lists begging me to give money to candidates I don't care about. This is also true for most Americans. They don't hear about Project 2025 from the Chairman of the DNC. But they can hear about it from people they actually know about. Biden could have mentioned it in the debate or during one of his recent speeches if what you say is true, and unless I missed something, he didn't.
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This is true and why Biden’s debate was a massive failure. He did not bring up the two winning issues - Abortion and project 2025.

The press deserves a lot of shit too. Instead of reporting the damn news.. like whar the Republicans’ 900 page hunger games platform looks like (or the Democrats platform for that matter), they run 500 stories about Biden misspeaking, being forgetful, or unverified White House staff gossip. Can we get some policy information from the news? Anything?!
 
The debate was a wash on both sides honestly. Republicans just have a lower tolerance level for their candidate to spew nothingburgers (incredible term btw. we should use it more) and Biden not looking like he was aware he existed felt a lot more shocking than Trump being trump. Super funny to watch though, Trump should stop running for presidency and become a podcaster he's funnier than half of those guys and only slightly more reactionary
 
dems running on abortion feels like an interesting tactical shout given roe vs wade was bumped off during biden's term...
 
Here's a bit more insight to show exactly how awful Biden is even before the first debate

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The last 4 polls on bloody New York State only has him around 8 or 9 points. That's not even a double digit margin. Biden won the state by over 20 points in 2020. I'm not suggesting New York will flip red because it's obviously very unlikely but the fact that the margin for Biden shrunk by like over 10 points BEFORE the first debate blows my mind. The next poll will likely indicate he will only sink further down.

He HAS to man up, do the right thing and drop out man.
 
BIG ASHLEY said:
dems running on abortion feels like an interesting tactical shout given roe vs wade was bumped off during biden's term...
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Telling us you don’t know about US civics.

faint said:
It's the boy who cried wolf except they keep forgetting the wolf already attacked.
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Abortion is literally on the ballot on some states in 2024. Not as a concept, as actual ballot measure that will codify its existence or non-existence into state constitution. Since Dobbs, Democrats have overperformed by 6-12 points on average in special elections.

Ashaebi said:
Here's a bit more insight to show exactly how awful Biden is even before the first debate

View attachment 646664


The last 4 polls on bloody New York State only has him around 8 or 9 points. That's not even a double digit margin. Biden won the state by over 20 points in 2020. I'm not suggesting New York will flip red because it's obviously very unlikely but the fact that the margin for Biden shrunk by like over 10 points BEFORE the first debate blows my mind. The next poll will likely indicate he will only sink further down.

He HAS to man up, do the right thing and drop out man.
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Biden will win New York by roughly the same amount as 2020. Biden is not dropping out. Perhaps it’s best to start considering the merits of Biden vs. Trump, as no other Democrat will be the nominee. The ship has long sailed.
 
As a Progressive who wants Joe to get out of the race I strongly support both the centrist Dems calling on him to get out, and the leftist calls from AoC, Ilhan, and Bernie too if he wants to join calling for strong support of the President.

There’s no political value at all for squad members or elected progressives to firebomb Joe— they’d just make it easier for their base to fringe off harder/not vote for whoever the Dem candidate is; and simultaneously make it easier for mainstream media /donors to firebomb the left and spin them as traitors or whatever. AoC and whoever on the left have zero power to get Biden to drop OR stay in anyway— so the smart position is the better one for building left power/influence and working toward any Democratic victory possible in November whoever the candidate is.

So I’d say regardless of individual lefties opinions, getting mad at AoC or Ilhan for backing Biden would be dumb imo. I’m K-hive coconut pilled but pro Squad Riden with Biden.
 
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There’s no political value to the discussion overall. President Biden has told us fifty different ways he is not dropping out. He is the nominee. The primary has been over for weeks. Every second spent discussing fantasy candidates is time spent not discussing Project 2025 and all the radical shit the Republican crime syndicate has planned for the United States government.
 
RaikouLover said:
Biden will win New York by roughly the same amount as 2020. Biden is not dropping out. Perhaps it’s best to start considering the merits of Biden vs. Trump, as no other Democrat will be the nominee. The ship has long sailed.
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I think you need to prepare yourself for a low turnout. Everything in 2020 was inflated and we are not getting numbers like that again. COVID, stimulus checks, and promises of student loan forgiveness helped get the country to a record turnout. That's just not happening this year. For comparison, see below for 2016 vs 2020.

Clinton: 64.8m
Trump: 62.9m

Biden: 81.2m
Trump: 74.2m

That's an additional 27m votes in 2020. Just because they're the same candidates doesn't mean half the population is voting again.
 
faint said:
I think you need to prepare yourself for a low turnout. Everything in 2020 was inflated and we are not getting numbers like that again. COVID, stimulus checks, and promises of student loan forgiveness helped get the country to a record turnout. That's just not happening this year. For comparison, see below for 2016 vs 2020.

Clinton: 64.8m
Trump: 62.9m

Biden: 81.2m
Trump: 74.2m

That's an additional 27m votes in 2020. Just because they're the same candidates doesn't mean half the population is voting again.
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Respectfully, I think you need to pay attention to turnout in elections since 2022.

By the way, politico claims New York is a battleground state now (Biden won by 23 points in 2020). Democrats outnumber Republicans in New York 2 to 1 by voter registration (there are 6.5 million Democrats to 2.9 million Republicans and 3 million unaffiliated). If that doesn’t wake people up to how bullshit these “polls” are, I don’t know what will.

Politico’s source is
Two private polls conducted in a swing New York House district and reviewed by POLITICO —
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No link to the polls, of course.
 
Politico isn't worth shit anyways like all the Axel Springer Verlag owned media, no way i would ever take news from them seriously. Springer Corp. wants Donald Trump as new us-president to further the global takeover of the far-right.
 

‘Because “Get on board or shut the Fuck up”, just isn’t a compelling pro-democracy bumper sticker.’ :bat:

“4 months is forever. Britain just had an election in 2 months. France had 2 elections in 1 month, saved democracy, and still had time for an affair with Denmark. Are you telling me that these United States of America can’t do what is doable by FRANCE?” :totodiLUL:
 
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RaikouLover said:
Respectfully, I think you need to pay attention to turnout in elections since 2022.

By the way, politico claims New York is a battleground state now (Biden won by 23 points in 2020). Democrats outnumber Republicans in New York 2 to 1 by voter registration (there are 6.5 million Democrats to 2.9 million Republicans and 3 million unaffiliated). If that doesn’t wake people up to how bullshit these “polls” are, I don’t know what will.

Politico’s source is

No link to the polls, of course.
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https://www.thedailybeast.com/now-deep-blue-new-york-is-turning-into-a-battleground-state-for-biden

Even the Daily Beast is stating New York is increasingly close. What the actual fuck?

I'm not saying I find the Daily Beast the most trustworthy source but you have to be REALLY complacent as a democrat to even risk New York being on the table for the GOP.

What's going on here!?
 
Ashaebi said:
https://www.thedailybeast.com/now-deep-blue-new-york-is-turning-into-a-battleground-state-for-biden

Even the Daily Beast is stating New York is increasingly close. What the actual fuck?

I'm not saying I find the Daily Beast the most trustworthy source but you have to be REALLY complacent as a democrat to even risk New York being on the table for the GOP.

What's going on here!?
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Ask yourself that. If there are more registered Democrats than combined Republicans and "unaffiliated voters," why do you believe "polls" saying that New York is competitive? New York hasn't gone Republican since 1984. Either you buy into the Orange Jesus media hype or stick with the fundamentals. New York will again go blue by at least 20 points.

Chou Toshio said:
‘Because “Get on board or Fuck Off”, just isn’t a good campaign slogan.’ :bat:
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John Stewart, George Clooney, and these "(anonymous) Democratic donors" don't want President Biden to raise their taxes, which is what he will do if the Democrats win the Pres, House, and Senate. You would think by the press reporting it is President Biden that has the 34 felonies.
 
RaikouLover said:
Ask yourself that. If there are more registered Democrats than combined Republicans and "unaffiliated voters," why do you believe "polls" saying that New York is competitive? New York hasn't gone Republican since 1984. Either you buy into the Orange Jesus media hype or stick with the fundamentals. New York will again go blue by at least 20 points.



John Stewart, George Clooney, and these "(anonymous) Democratic donors" don't want President Biden to raise their taxes, which is what he will do if the Democrats win the Pres, House, and Senate. You would think by the press reporting it is President Biden that has the 34 felonies.
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Dude are you okay? Your brain is breaking. Genuinely worried.
 
RaikouLover said:
This is true and why Biden’s debate was a massive failure. He did not bring up the two winning issues - Abortion and project 2025.
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Biden was a stellar orator in his day but bringing up project 2025 would've been a huge mistake - there isn't any way he would've been able to properly explain what it entails/implies. Trump could've had an easy time running rings around him in that instance and as a consequence would've arguably delegitimized the threat it could impose.
 
honest question: what is the point of quoting biden's plans? We all know he's not going to do any of them, because doing them means democrats can no longer use these promises as a carrot on a stick to get people to vote. He didn't do shit in this mandate, why would he do shit in a future one? Other than support Israel lol
 
Bakugames said:
honest question: what is the point of quoting biden's plans? We all know he's not going to do any of them, because doing them means democrats can no longer use these promises as a carrot on a stick to get people to vote. He didn't do shit in this mandate, why would he do shit in a future one? Other than support Israel lol
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This does not sound like an honest question. Asking what is the point of citing a Democratic policy platform (this one is 2025 FY budget) is disingenuous because had they not have a platform the next complaint would be that the Democrats have no platform. The Democratic platform is public. President Biden's 2025 FY Budget is public.

The plan to raise taxes on the 1% and corporations requires a Democratic President, 50 Democratic Senators, and a Democratic house majority to implement through the budget reconciliation process. Likewise, a Republican plan to cut taxes on the 1% and corporation, such as the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act of 2017 required the same. If there is not a President + Congressional majority, not a goddamn fucking thing is getting passed. It has nothing to do with boogeyman Biden "not doing anything."
 
Is the 2024 platform even any different from the 2020 one? Didn't he say he would raise taxes on people making 400K+ last time?

Anyway, his campaign is utterly cooked at this point. Pelosi's comments make it clear the Dems are not confident in him. Clooney's comments are even worse, and reports are saying Schumer is talking with high profile donors regarding whether he'll stand by Biden. It's pretty clear to everyone watching this that the Democrats do not think Biden can win. Only Biden himself (and RaikouLover) seem convinced that he can. If Biden is the humble man he says he is he should put the party first and drop out.

More importantly, this news cycle has buried every other story, especially those coming out of Gaza. Israel seems to be even more offensive than usual and most recently bombed a camp for misplaced citizens, killing 25 while many watched a soccer match. They're also now forcing civilians to evacuate Gaza City, after bombing the UNRWA HQ, because who cares at this point. Our president is too busy lying to the country on a press tour focused on his ability to speak when not using a teleprompter, all while claiming one of his major accomplishments was a "peace deal that may come to fruition" despite everything just said. But at least Israel has more settlements in the West Bank now!
 
faint said:
Is the 2024 platform even any different from the 2020 one? Didn't he say he would raise taxes on people making 400K+ last time?
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He did say that. Sinema, who left the Democratic Party and is not running for re-election, blocked it. It was a 50/50 Senate. Remember?

faint said:
Anyway, his campaign is utterly cooked at this point. Pelosi's comments make it clear the Dems are not confident in him. Clooney's comments are even worse, and reports are saying Schumer is talking with high profile donors regarding whether he'll stand by Biden. It's pretty clear to everyone watching this that the Democrats do not think Biden can win. Only Biden himself (and RaikouLover) seem convinced that he can. If Biden is the humble man he says he is he should put the party first and drop out.
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Nope, this has nothing to do with me. Political scientists have repeatedly said that Biden dropping out is political suicide. Elected Democrats often get bad advice. Like running against your own Party standard bearer. Democrats did this in 2010 with Obama and lost 63 seats. Democrats were split in 2022, with some taking the old advice of distancing themselves from the President and some running with the President on protecting Roe. The result? The red wave was a puddle...

I am genuinely curious why elected Democrats think it is a good idea to run against their own brand. It only reinforces the opposition's argument that - "you suck!"

faint said:
More importantly, this news cycle has buried every other story, especially those coming out of Gaza. Israel seems to be even more offensive than usual and most recently bombed a camp for misplaced citizens, killing 25 while many watched a soccer match. They're also now forcing civilians to evacuate Gaza City, after bombing the UNRWA HQ, because who cares at this point. Our president is too busy lying to the country on a press tour focused on his ability to speak when not using a teleprompter, all while claiming one of his major accomplishments was a "peace deal that may come to fruition" despite everything just said. But at least Israel has more settlements in the West Bank now!
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The news cycle is continuing this story because elected Dems keep the anonymous leaks. It's terrible message discipline. You say nothing, or come out as a block. Guess is, there is a sizable contingent of Democrats that are privately shitting their pants, but not enough to constitute a majority of elected Democrats. It's also interesting that all of the Democrats distancing themselves from Biden are either losers (Julian Castro, Claire McCaskill, Tim Ryan, etc.), "anonymous" wealthy donors, or extremely centrist Democrats. Not one member of the CBC, or any of our black or brown elected leaders are coming out. I just heard Rep Ilhan Omar today on Progressive Radio echo the same sentiments as AOC, that President Biden is the candidate and this is a pointless conversation that is only strengthening Trump. If the wealthy donors and centrist Democrats are coming for President Biden's head, and the progressives are backing him, it should at least make anyone left of center take notice of what's going on.
 
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RaikouLover said:
If there is not a President + Congressional majority, not a goddamn fucking thing is getting passed. It has nothing to do with boogeyman Biden "not doing anything."
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Assuming this were true and not just dem copium, tell me how the 2024-2028 mandate would be any different then? I find it very hard to believe theres going to be a congressional majority at his side, so all his so called plans other than the ones that both parties can agree to, and those have been pretty in line with the republican party. God bless cop city and increase of ICE on the borders and the total support of israel I guess
 
Bakugames said:
Assuming this were true and not just dem copium, tell me how the 2024-2028 mandate would be any different then? I find it very hard to believe theres going to be a congressional majority at his side, so all his so called plans other than the ones that both parties can agree to, and those have been pretty in line with the republican party. God bless cop city and increase of ICE on the borders and the total support of israel I guess
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What is your aim here? It has nothing to do with Democrats. That’s how the US political system works at this point in time. The same goes for the Republicans. If they don’t control the House AND Senate, legislatively not a damn thing will get done.
 
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/live/2024/jul/11/biden-press-conference-nato-updates

Not a good look from your current president on the international stage to put it mildly, its obvious as hell at this point that Parkinson's deteriorating his memories and overall mental health at a alarming rate. Again even if political scientists are right at this point, its a absolute joke that Dems establishment has let it come down to this extremely dire situation with no suitable successor of 81 years old Biden to fight against the wannabe dictator from a at this point completely anti-democratic party in the first place.
 
Medeia said:
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/live/2024/jul/11/biden-press-conference-nato-updates

Not a good look from your current president on the international stage to put it mildly, its obvious as hell at this point that Parkinson's deteriorating his memories and overall mental health at a alarming rate. Again even if political scientists are right at this point, its a absolute joke that Dems establishment has let it come down to this extremely dire situation with no suitable successor of 81 years old Biden to fight against the wannabe dictator from a at this point completely anti-democratic party in the first place.
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He also referred to Harris as "Vice President Trump" during today's presser. It's not looking good.
 
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