Metagame Flipped

[Canned Furs]

Was gonna bring up the Deoxys thing but it appears that's already been discussed. So I'll share a couple sets instead.

Latias @ Soul Dew
Ability: Levitate
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Outrage
- Zen Headbutt
- Earthquake
130 Atk+Adamant+Soul Dew makes Outrage go brrrrrr

Cyclizar @ Assault Vest
Ability: Regenerator
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 HP/ 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- U-turn
- Knock Off
- Rapid Spin
- Dragon Tail
A slower pivot with the flip allows it to more safely take care of its team.

Cobalion @ Leftovers
Ability: Justified
Tera Type: Flying
EVs: 4 Def/ 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Aura Sphere
- Flash Cannon
- Air Slash
Higher special attack with still good bulk allows it to be a solid set up sweeper.

Chansey (F) @ Choice Band
Ability: Serene Grace
Tera Type: Normal
EVs: 252 SpA / 8 SpD / 248 Spe
Timid Nature
- Body Slam
- Earthquake
- Thunder Punch
- Zen Headbutt
Despite the only okay attack, its blazing speed makes it pretty valuable. Able to outpace some boosting threats or after a drop of its own like from webs.

 

[ZarbyXar]

Was gonna bring up the Deoxys thing but it appears that's already been discussed. So I'll share a couple sets instead.

Latias @ Soul Dew
Ability: Levitate
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Outrage
- Zen Headbutt
- Earthquake
130 Atk+Adamant+Soul Dew makes Outrage go brrrrrr

Cyclizar @ Assault Vest
Ability: Regenerator
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 HP/ 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- U-turn
- Knock Off
- Rapid Spin
- Dragon Tail
A slower pivot with the flip allows it to more safely take care of its team.

Cobalion @ Leftovers
Ability: Justified
Tera Type: Flying
EVs: 4 Def/ 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Aura Sphere
- Flash Cannon
- Air Slash
Higher special attack with still good bulk allows it to be a solid set up sweeper.

Chansey (F) @ Choice Band
Ability: Serene Grace
Tera Type: Normal
EVs: 252 SpA / 8 SpD / 248 Spe
Timid Nature
- Body Slam
- Earthquake
- Thunder Punch
- Zen Headbutt
Despite the only okay attack, its blazing speed makes it pretty valuable. Able to outpace some boosting threats or after a drop of its own like from webs.

Bro Your physical chansey has special evs

 

[Canned Furs]

Bro Your physical chansey has special evs

Apologies. I have this horrid affliction commonly referred to as being an oblivious idiot.

 

[shadowpea]

REAL post now that ive played more than five games of this tier

Gholdengo @ Leftovers
Ability: Good as Gold
Tera Type: Flying / Fairy / Water
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Thunder Wave / Nasty Plot
- Hex / Shadow Ball
- Make It Rain
- Recover

such a ridiculous mon. defensive typing is broken, physdef is amazing, gag is broken. you spinblock people who try to use cyclizar as mono removal (dont do that). sdef is a weakness but otherwise this mon is very good and between twave and np not many phys guys can take it on.

Deoxys-Defense @ Choice Band
Ability: Pressure
Tera Type: Normal
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Naughty Nature
- Extreme Speed
- Psycho Boost / idk
- Superpower
- Knock Off

band 160 atk espeed is drugs. chansey might be the more flexible revenge killer but deo bypasses opposing priority and also is a very dangerous breaker in its own right. it can also just fire off a psycho boost on the zapdos or fluttermane or smth.


UT @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Flame Body
Tera Type: Dragon / Water
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpA
Bold Nature
- Defog
- Roost
- U-turn
- Flamethrower

it checks sylveon and can defog

Araquanid @ Choice Band
Ability: Water Bubble
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Liquidation
- Poison Jab
- Leech Life
- Sticky Web

this thing has four moves but if youre not clicking liquidation somethings wrong. anyway yea 132 atk wabble is ridiculous damage. naturally worthless vs offense unless you somehow give it room to click webs but shreds fat like absolutely nothing else.

Chansey (F) @ Choice Band
Ability: Natural Cure
Tera Type: Ground
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Body Slam
- Earthquake
- Fire Punch / Rock Slide
- Healing Wish

best revenge killer in the tier probably and also contains a cheat button that lets you play with 7 mons! chansey can be a pretty valuable mon to give up tho and even at 1hp its still useful (and its not like its hp matters much anyway), so hwish carefully.

mons i would not be opposed to being banned
literally just a fish. limited by chansey/priority but can randomly win games sometimes. drum is so stupid.
yeah
160 spa with np and pretty good properties (recover, useful defensive presence, very annoying to approach stabs) plus poison puppeteer bullshittery makes this mon a chore to handle. scarf sets are also good.
why does this guy get all the utility moves. its taunt bait but it can also switch into anything without taunt, easily tank any hit, click tp and give you all the momentum. if you kill this theres still deoxys-s but that is less bulky by a pretty good margin which might make it ok. might.
(theres also the demon cp/sp/meteorbeam/rest set. cant wait for someone to pull that out.)
not entirely sure if this is a healthy thing to have. monopolizes speed control (even ada band outspeeds every real scarfer unless ur running scarf tinglu/hands fsr) and while natcure is the better ability being cheesed by grace body slam+rockslide feels awful sometimes.

anyway

these teams all have problems use at own risk


first team and not very good because mono cyclizar removal is just asking to be spinblocked. still araquanid can just rip apart those fatter hstacks and tinglu can be very annoying so its not undoable. if it gets chipped down vs fat just healing wish it.


team does not support rbolt very well but at least we have hazards + dual removal. if ghold paralyzes the right guy bolt can just run away with the game with a bit of yellow magic. deod shreds offense into pieces. think bolt is a pretty nice subcm guy in general tho compared to the next guy...


iron valiant. this dude can just autowin games sometimes. just dont get it knocked, trading hits is ok since again we have the chansey. i think gimlaf was running resttalk booster which is uhh, also incredibly demonic

im not even sure if tera ground is even worth for sylveon. unless u run into like, heatran/imoth you can just have 4 fairy moves. body slam is paralysis, double edge for nuclear power, facade so talonflame/volc is no longer a check lol. and ofcourse this frees up tera fairy which is just kinda unfair.


pecharunt is broooken as fuck. hex is probably better but i keep running into iron treads (in retrospect hex is probably still better cause tera flying is cheating but i forgot). treads is an alright spinner. volcarona is this team's sylveon copium. wisp and uturn are pretty excellent assets. not being able to leverage flame body against regenvest might seem bad but pecharunt wanna toxic em anyway so its fine.

 

[Unmasked]

Chansey @ Focus Sash
Ability: Serene Grace
Tera Type: Normal
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Zen Headbutt
- Earthquake
- Body Slam
- Endeavor

If your Focus Sash breaks and you feel like you can't OHKO the next Pokemon, you can always use Endeavor to leave your opponent on the brink of death. Body Slam's 60% of Paralyzing and Zen Headbutt's 40% flinch chanse are also pretty funny to mess with if the RNG gods bless you.

 

[flying moose]

Why are Kyurem-White and Kyurem-Black allowed?

Ah damnit. Another mistake on my part. So sorry Kris.

I have checked the banlist again and THIS TIME everything should be correctly accounted for...

We will have a ban slate that the council will be voting on soon. Community feedback is appreciated for any mons that seem concerning. So far I have heard the following mentioned (won't necessarily be on the slate though):
Things that I have concerns about that I have not seen mentioned and would like to hear thoughts:Terastalization
Other things that elicited concerns or were on my previous watchlist that seem fine?:

Finally, I am very pleased to announce that kenn will be joining the council! Welcome kenn!

 

[InkyDarkBird]

Stall is absolutely broken in this tier. The stall Pokemon themselves are often so bulky that they can afford to use Rest and be unable to be OHKOed by anything that is not using setup moves. Even when setup is used, it still takes an entire 2HKO to defeat them.

The main stall Pokemon I have seen:
Definitely getting banned for being a monstrous wall.
This is the most annoying Pokemon I have played against. This Pokemon can Thunder Cage your Pokemon to chip them down all while getting off free Rapid Spins to remove hazards or use Thunder Wave to cripple your offensive Pokemon. You want to Nasty Plot on it? Too bad, because it gets Eerie Impulse.
This is the second most annoying Pokemon that can Knock Off and U-Turn and survive a 252 Atk Regice Ice Spinner. Have fun trying to OHKO it while it freely chips you down.
This is the third most annoying Pokemon that can Knock Off and U-Turn and Roar away your setup sweepers as well as serving as an annoying Rapid Spin Pokemon.
This Pokemon can Will-O-Wisp and Foul Play your physical attackers. It can easily sleep on you as well because Dark Pokemon simply do not exist.
Ironically, Gholdengo might be the most balanced Pokemon here. Although it blocks Rapid Spin, it loses to Iron Treads and Regieleki and can't really deal damage against Cyclizar, unlike what someone said earlier. Because of its low speed, it prefers to run a Thunder Wave Hex set since it is not fast enough to use Make It Rain.

Salazzle's Corrosion is useless due to Regen pivoting, Resting, and Gholdengo.
Gengar's Perishtrapping is useless due to relying on a surprise factor and being practically useless once you eliminate one Pokemon.
Pecharunt simply gets Knocked Off and U-Turned by Cyclizar or Tornadus-Therian into a faster check such as Rhyperior or Iron Treads.
Diancie loses to a ton of HO Pokemon and absolutely needs Agility.
Araquanid is slow and easily dies.
Avalugg-Hisui and Rhyperior lose to specially defensive Deoxys-Defense, even moreso with Terastalization.

Manaphy and Ursaluna-Bloodmoon are probably the best counters to stall, which is only 2 Pokemon.

The game that broke me:
https://play.pokemonshowdown.com/battle-gen9flipped-2172994933-90t669m2p2xy6tvg8xg71x5w1ked5h0pw

+6 252+ Atk Snorlax Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Zoroark-Hisui: 262-309 (61.7 - 72.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Even the most broken setup Pokemon in the tier cannot OHKO stall Pokemon.
And you know, a different moveset using Crunch doesn't even matter, because Snorlax is highly likely getting banned.

Ban Deoxys, Snorlax, and Regieleki.

 

[InkyDarkBird]

Honestly, I don't get the hype over Chansey. It is the most overrated Pokemon in the tier.
Sure, it's fast, but it cannot hit Deoxys or Deoxys-Speed at all and dies to almost any attack. Because it doesn't use Natural Cure in favor of Serene Grace, Chansey can be paralyzed as well, crippling it against offensive Pokemon.

 

[quagsirefan888]

why was deoxys ever legal, 150/150/150 bulk with a huge movepool is ridiculous

 

[Dorsia]

I'd like to use Diancie with max HP/SpA but I'm not what kind of spread I should use in Flipped: max HP/SpA or max Spe/Def?

 

[KaenSoul]

I'd like to use Diancie with max HP/SpA but I'm not what kind of spread I should use in Flipped: max HP/SpA or max Spe/Def?

You put them in HP/SpA, dont think too hard about it, it still goes to the final stat you want.

 

[JangMoo-Moo]

Things that I have concerns about that I have not seen mentioned and would like to hear thoughts:Terastalization

So i was playing this meta and i struggled sometimes with this thing. Its ridiculously powerfull with double edge stab boosted. I tried to run -between other phys def mons-

(base stats: 90HP - 125Def w/flame body and or access to wisp, runned with low def evs aiming to burn taking special attacks) in order to tank its hits but it gets wrecked +50 health with double edge even resisting. Had to force investing def evs. 130 base atk with a stab of 144 bp is ridicolously strong, not counting that it can even run facade if it gets burned to literally laugh (168BP with status) against your attempts to handle it.

but even all i dont think the problem is the pokemon: yeah, 130 base attack is great, but having acces to normal-now-fairy strong stab moves is what blows it up. Ill think banning pixilate is a right call: it will only have play rough and trailblaze for coverage, it will become more manageable.
The same goes for

, pointing the fact of banning water bubble: 132 base attack its great for this mon. It can be quite nice against some sticky web teams or trick room. But having an ability that doubles the power of water moves and makes the mon immume to burn is the unhealthy thing.

Stall is absolutely broken in this tier. The stall Pokemon themselves are often so bulky that they can afford to use Rest and be unable to be OHKOed by anything that is not using setup moves. Even when setup is used, it still takes an entire 2HKO to defeat them.

And finally I agree with this.

should be gone: 150 both defenses and hp are ridiculous. its too difficult to break trough this thing, having also acces to t-wave, recover, teleport, taunt, knock off, night shade, spikes and rocks, or even calm mind boosting if neccesary. The fact that they have pressure is annoying as well because you cant rely on its pasivity because you will run out of pps. With the proper support deoxys become unbreakable. And I consider annoying as well tornadus-t and regieleki, but i didnt faced them that much to argue solidly.

 

[InkyDarkBird]

but even all i dont think the problem is the pokemon: yeah, 130 base attack is great, but having acces to normal-now-fairy strong stab moves is what blows it up. Ill think banning pixilate is a right call: it will only have play rough and trailblaze for coverage, it will become more manageable.

Only banning the ability would go against tiering policy in the case of Sylveon, since it is the only Pokemon to get Pixilate.
I honestly think Terastalization is the main enabler for Sylveon. Sylveon needs Tera Ground in order to hit Gholdengo, Pecharunt, and other Steel/Poison/Fire types, yet it still cannot do anything against Moltres. Furthermore, it easily loses to Deoxys-Defense with Extreme Speed (whose usage is low only because Deoxys is way better).

Terastalization in general is honestly more bannable for me because your opponent can easily Terastalize out of a weakness and completely counter your wallbreaker (rip Manaphy). I used Tera Water Deoxys and it absolutely wrecked any Araquanids hoping to pick up KOs in my games since if Araquanid isn't OHKOing or 2HKOing anything while its on the field, it is a sitting duck.

 

[kenn]

Newly minted council member kenn here to bring you the latest and greatest news from the Flipped council. We voted on a handful of things and here are the results:

	flying moose	kenn	shnowshner	RESULT
	BAN	BAN	BAN	3-0 BAN
	BAN	ABS	DNB	1-1-1 DNB
	ABS	ABS	DNB	0-1-2 DNB
	DNB	BAN	DNB	1-2-0 DNB
	DNB	BAN	DNB	1-2-0 DNB
	DNB	DNB	DNB	0-3-0 DNB
	DNB	DNB	DNB	0-3-0 DNB
	BAN	DNB	DNB	1-2-0 DNB

Deoxys-Base is BANNED in Flipped!

We all know just how bulky this thing is and not only did it have great 150 bulk across the board, it has an expansive support movepool to make it nearly impossible to KO and could even run a Stored Power set that would just 6-0 teams because nothing could break it.

As for everything else on the slate, the council is just not sure enough to warrant action as losing Deoxys-Base is gonna be a huge change in and of itself. That being said, we will be revisiting these mons in the coming days and potentially other problems that may arise.

Lastly, as you may have noticed, SBPC hasn't voted this slate and that is because they have stepped away from council and we appreciate all they have done for the OM and we are looking for potential council members so if anyone wants to help, feel free to dm flying moose, myself, or join the Discord and discuss it there!
​

Tagging dhelmise to implement! <3

 

[InkyDarkBird]

I have severely underestimated the power of Sylveon. Sylveon doesn’t even need Tera Blast to deal with resists as it can simply bait in a status move and use Facade. With the low number of Steel and Poison types in the tier coupled with the annoying RegenVest core of Mienshao, Cyclizar, and/or Tornadus-Therian, Sylveon cannot be reliably walled and can easily switch out to the RegenVest pivots and re-enter easily. The aforementioned Facade strategy easily chips down Gholdengo, which usually runs Thunder Wave Hex (Make It Rain is horrible against RegenVest) or Moltres/Talonflame, which use Will-O-Wisp.

I have also overestimated Gholdengo’s capabilities due to how prevalent Cyclizar is. Cyclizar does not care at all if it gets paralyzed; it in fact benefits from a slower U-Turn. Even with paralysis, Gholdengo does nearly no damage to Mienshao.

Don’t even get me started on Araquanid. With Deoxys gone, any team that just so happens to encounter it needs to have a Water Absorb Pokemon or a Dragon (loses to Sylveon) to try and wall it (Grass sucks and gets Leech Lifed too). If your team cannot resist Araquanid, one Pokemon will always be OHKOed whenever Araquanid is on the field.

You can always make the argument of using two Pokemon to individually counter Sylveon and Araquanid, but this strategy is clearly unhealthy as it limits teambuilding options. This limit is compounded by the fact that most Flipped that do have high bulk have no recovery besides Rest.

 

[HiZo]

kenn told me to post my team so https://pokepast.es/51bd1b8aa4011357

Built stall bc I have heard that its very good rn and I wanted to be a problem.

First spinner and thing that chips stuff down with Thunder Cage, can waste opposing PP and HP with protect, which also helps with its recovery since it has to rely on rest lol. I think this mon is probably balanced bc it cant do much outside of click rapid spin and thunder cage E: I have realized the error of my ways and this mon for sure need to get banned.

Annoying hazard stacker with knock and psychic noise. Probably a major cornerstone of stall given its stats and utility. Not as hard to break as the other deoxys's but still a pain

since stall has to rely on a lot of rest for recovery this forces players to not click the setup moves unless they wanna get swept by this thing.

second spinner that has a great defensive profile vs mons like Regieleki and Pecharunt. Its not passive given its 120 spa and i think its neat.

wanted a spinblocker and a way to annoy physical attackers so went with wisphex pult, also annoys other setup sweepers with dragon tail.

haha regen go brrrr.

ok enjoyyyyyy

 

[kenn]

Hello there everyone! It has not been but a short minute since the Deoxys-Base ban but the council has had some more time to play and observe the meta and we have another round of voting so here are the results!

	kenn	InkyDarkBird	flying moose	Results
	BAN	BAN	BAN	3-0-0 BAN
	BAN	BAN	BAN	3-0-0 BAN
	ABS	BAN	BAN	2-0-1 BAN
	BAN	DNB	DNB	1-2-0 DO NOT BAN
	BAN	BAN	BAN	3-0-0 BAN
	BAN	BAN	BAN	3-0-0 BAN
	BAN	BAN	ABS	2-0-1 BAN
	DNB	DNB	BAN	1-2-0 DO NOT BAN

And with that...

Araquanid, Snorlax, Sylveon, Cyclizar, Regieleki, and Tornadus-Therian are all BANNED from Flipped!​

Man what a doozy of a slate, but with 6 mons gone now, Flipped is bound to be a whole new OM. All of these were necessary evils to tone down the effectiveness of stall and also to scale back the offensive breakers that can overrun the meta as-is and would dominate even further with the bulkier bans being implemented. You may have also notice, we have a new council member so make sure to give a warm welcome to InkyDarkBird! Also shnowshner opted out of this vote as they have been fairly busy behind the scenes with other things and hasn't had much playtime and didn't wanna give an uninformed vote.

I don't have anything else to really say about these bans as it feels like these were a long time coming, but hopefully y'all get to enjoy the new era of Flipped and we can continue strong throughout this month! Feel free to post thoughts on anything else you deem is really good (or maybe too good) as council would love to hear as much as we can from the community <3

 

[InkyDarkBird]

Pinging dhelmise for implementing the changes.

 

[ljsdnlsdln]

with the recent bans and lack of reliable hazard removal, I believe deo-S currently warps the meta and should be looked at. It has absurd defenses, as shown below:

252 SpA Pecharunt Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Deoxys-Speed: 252-296 (44.6 - 52.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
pecha fails to even 2hko it from full

252 SpA Pecharunt Hex (130 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Deoxys-Speed: 408-480 (72.3 - 85.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery and poison damage
hex doesnt ohko it even after rocks

252+ Atk Life Orb Hoopa-Unbound Hyperspace Fury vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Deoxys-Speed: 382-452 (67.7 - 80.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
adamant lo hoopa U fails to ohko it after rocks.

252+ Atk Choice Band Hoopa-Unbound Hyperspace Fury vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Deoxys-Speed: 440-518 (78 - 91.8%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
even banded adamant hoopaU is more likely to not ohko it after rocks

(I even forgot to add beneficial natures for deo s in the above calcs)

these are supereffective attacks from the best attackers in the meta. This bulk, alon with its insane movepool make it really hard to deal with. It gets both hazards, and with hazard removal being limited to mainly treads and talonflame, it has no problem setting them up. It gets knock for both treads and talon, which literally becoms half a pokemon at this point. Neither can they afford to stay in on it, as its ability automatically wins all pp wars. If paired with a bulky ghost like pult, or ghost tera, it can become impossible to spin away hazards throughout the game.

I feel were going to see the meta warp around dealing with deo - s following the bans. Already a lot of mons are running rest as it allows you to save pp by doing nothing, which rn is literally the best counterplay against deo-S rn for slower teams.
.

 

[kenn]

It has been about a week since the last wave of bans, but as the meta has had time to develop, the council has been discussing what else is seen as too much for Flipped so we present to you the slate!

	flying moose	kenn	shnowshner	InkyDarkBird	Results
	BAN	BAN	BAN	BAN	4-0-0 BAN
	BAN	BAN	BAN	DNB	3-1-0 BAN
	BAN	ABS	ABS	BAN	2-0-2 BAN

Hoopa-Unbound, Deoxys-Speed, and Mienshao are now BANNED from Flipped!
​

Hoopa-Unbound kinda comes as no surprise since it is super bulky and has a great attacking stat. While having no real resistances, the 4x Bug weakness wasn't common enough to keep it around and even then it would take a strong Bug move to even make a dent.

Deoxys-Speed unfortunately followed suit with Deoxys-Attack and Deoxys by being just generally annoying and have an expansive support movepool to abuse its new bulk to the point that it would just never be KOed.

As you can tell, this ban was a little more apprehensive, but it does what the other Regenerator mons that have been banned before it (Torn-T and Cyclizar) by just pivoting around to keep itself healthy and annoying things via Knock Off or Poison Jab for inducing status.

I hope y'all have enjoyed the month so far (we are halfway through already damn) and continue playing Flipped! <3

Tagging dhelmise to implement changes!
look I remembered this time

 

[InkyDarkBird]

End of the month voting is here.

	flying moose	kenn	shnowshner	InkyDarkBird	Results
	ABSTAIN	DNB	ABSTAIN	BAN	1-1-2 DO NOT BAN
	ABSTAIN	BAN	BAN	BAN	3-0-1 BAN

Damp Rock is now BANNED from Flipped.​

Damp Rock enabled already powerful Pokemon such as Archaludon and Manaphy as well as providing value for Rain Pokemon such as Ludicolo and Kingdra.

Archaludon just spams Electro Shot as it always does, but in Flipped, it gains a massive special defense boost. However, it is not very common outside of rain teams and has its counters, so it remains unbanned.

Pinging dhelmise to implement the changes.

 

[JangMoo-Moo]

Last day of flipped as OMotM... i really had a lot of fun building teams around this concept, testing with other accounts and trying to climb as high as i could on ladder. Now that it ends for a while, i want to share the best team i could made of, that got me to this score

Team:
https://pokepast.es/1b16606e2e5f3643

Description:

110HP and 130 Def makes this mon an excelent offensive wall, having also Magic Bounce to not care about status and bouncing hazards. With access to wish-tect it can stall most hits maintaining its hp high, and also scout moves and stall troom/rain turns. I chose yawn as another support move that fits great with it: most players switch mons in order to not fall asleep, thing that allows to click wish easily to heal yourself or another party member which could tank better the oncoming hit, and if opponent doesnt switch, you can heal easily another party member switching in comfortably. Psychic Fangs is the last move, with 95 base attack it can make some damage, and it can break trough the ocassionaly screens. Dark fits nice as Tera in order to take Ghost and Dark hits.

Gliscor functions really well as an SpDef mid-tank with a great typing, having access to Rocks. P-heal + protect is a great way to mantain gliscor with high health, and also stall T-room/rain. Earth Power is the last move: with 125 base Spa it can damage nicely using evs for bulk. Tera water is picked in order to take water and ice moves that could possibly break trough with it.

this mon is an excelent special attacker with 160 base Spa. The lack of reliable SpDef walls makes it -alongside other mons- an excelent special breaker. Timid 252 Spe Scarf overruns even Ting Lu, and it pairs really well with parting shot momentum. It doesnt have more coverage than M-chain, hex and shadow ball, so the 4th move is destiny bond: just a niche way to get rid of some threat giving a possibly good trade for the match. Tera dark is selected in order to survive oncoming ghost hits

not much to say about this one: excelent typing, with solid 116 base Atk, it doesnt need more than its Stabs to be good. I personally think priority moves are powerful at this meta, being primarina one of the best users of Aqua Jet, specially against Rhyperior and Ting Lu. I made it band so it can hit hardly enough to be scary. Also, it kinda take some hits with its 126 base Def, so the torrent boost helps her in order to make it strong. Finally, Flip turn is needed to pivoting.

the croc is amazingly good. 110 Def, 75 HP, with access to burn + slack off it can take hits nicely. Its an excelent contender for some setup sweepers, as it has Unaware. Hex fits amazing with the wisp, being the last move Torch Song, in order to passively boost and break trough the opponent. I picked tera Flying in order to dodge the ever-presence ground moves

Cott is the last pick: a prankster Encore + Seed fairy mon that can be very annoying. It has a great bulk with 116 HP, functioning really well as a locking-pivoting user with u-turn. Moonblast is nice for the high presence of dragon and dark types at this meta. I made it poison tera in order to avoid beeing toxic, maintaining the fighting resistance.

Overall i think i can summarize this team as a momentum maker, with a lot of mons pivoting in or making the way for some others party members switch in. It also tries to shut down setup-sweepers as much as they can, slowly switching back and fort until you find the perfect moment to execute the right moves. Initially I tought about to this team trying to not get crippled by hazard spamming. Flipped having a lack of reliable spinning in addition to the cyclizar and leki bans made me thinking on a team that can take hits and doesnt care that much of rockspikes, but it turned out to be very good in general. The main problems could be Rhyperior, electro shot Arch, or another special attackers, because the lack of reliable special defensive walls is real here, but with the appropriate game playing, it is possible to survive.

I spent a very fun August playing this meta. Hope it returns to ladder soon!

 

[ljsdnlsdln]

Can we atleast test mienshao on ladder, I never found it to be broken but rather almost necessary considering the number of 150+ spa attackers with three of them being 180+.

 

[AintTellingUNothing]

I haven't tried it out yet but Archaludon looks pretty good ngl. It gets better Special stats, (it's attack and sp.def swap, giving it 65 attack when it's still gonna be special and giving it 105 sp.def, letting it tank more) with it getting BARELY lower Def in exchange for 130 Sp.atk, letting it nuke a little more things. It gets faster (90 Speed instead of 85) as well so I wouldn't me surprised if it could be good in this meta

 

[VannAccessible]

Viability Rankings Explainations​

Actual footage of beginners attempting to play Flipped

A+ Rank
Sp. Def wall with Toxic and Leech Seed, Force Palm to para Espeon/Steels, and generally annoying to kill. Works on balance or stall. Vexed by Substitute and Taunt.
Calm Mind sweeper that beats Regigigas or nice Specs pivot. Vacuum Wave is a goated move either way.
Sp. Def wall and hazard layer that beats Espeon. Knock, Toxic, etc.
Crazy fast special attacker/cleaner and/or Sash hazard lead that Espeon wants nothing to do with.
Superb scarfer with a crazy 160 sp attack and Parting Shot to facilitate set up, or Nasty Plot + Trick Room or Sticky Web.
Special Meteor Beam sweeper with STAB Earth Power + Ice Beam for both Gliscor and Breloom. Nice Sp. Def and decent enough ability choices.
Very specially tanky. Works as any of an AV Mon, a special wall or and bulky win-con, and a STAB Knock Off that’s actually offensively threatening.

A Rank
Very scary sweeper/breaker. Loves Wish support to keep Sturdy active.
Choice. Band. Extreme. Speed. And a strong Knock Off too. Or can go crazy in Trick Room with mixed offenses.
Much fatter defensively, just use it like normal bulky booster Dengo. Requires Tera to reliably block Talonflame’s Defog.
Physical wall that can spread Toxic like a champ as Steels and Gliscor don’t want to tank Flare Blitz. U-Turn to Dance around Espeon.
Special tank and Spinner that repels Pecha and Dengo with STAB Earth Power.
Special scarfer and just amazing end-game win-con. Overlord works for special attacks too. Checked by Cobalion though.
Mixed wall, amazing Knock absorber, better equipped to use Scorching Sands now.
Identical stats and still super good, with multiple sets including 3 attacks Tail Glow, Bulky Scald + Take Heart + Rest Talk. Even a pivot set with U-Turn can work to lure in Ogerpon.
Thicc cat with crazy physical bulk, Knock, Foul Play, Parting Shot are dope. Needs Rest/Wish for recovery. Works on stall or balance.
Banded priority and pivot.
Has 2 very viable uses. One is Sticky Web with Bug Buzz for Espeon. The other is bulky Quiver Dance, an amazing sweeper that is very hard to stop.
Def wall and amazing role compression with Flame Body/Will o’ for burns, Defog (even better in that Gholdengo doesn’t want to switch in to Flamethrower), and pivot out with U-Turn. The only thing keeping it from A+ is its neutrality to Regice’s STAB and it being terrified of Knock Off, but Tera can fix both these issues.
Especially treatening Dragon Dancer with STABs that pierce the meta, since a lot of def walls are Fire and Psychic types. Also, a rocker that threatens Espeon. Knock and Sand and good traits too.
Faster but slightly less strong than normal, so still very good. Walled by Breloom and Ogerpon-W, among others.
Has strong competition as a Fire physical wall from Iron Moth and Talonflame, but this guy resists Ice out of the box like Moth, but has Flame Body like Talonflame. Also has Whirlwind and STAB Lunge. Good middle ground. Still hates Knock Off, oc.
Impossibly bulky mixed wall, or pivot and spinblocker the special grounds don’t want to deal with. Knock Off and Will o’ and Night Shade all do work. Relies on Rest for recovery, but if you can slot in Sleep Talk, this guy really pops off.

A- Rank
Like its Rock type brother but with Surf for Iron Treads. Not sand immune so its Sturdy breaks easier.
Crazy fast physical attacker that dies to a slight breeze.
Like the other Meteor Beamers but this one has Steam Engine, so if you Tera predict, you can nab a free speed boost. It also has Flash Fire if you want to pull a Tera into Steel or Grass. Also has Rapid Spin. Good stuff.
Bulky Superpower Contrary wincon or Calm Mind wincon.
Glimmora, but physical now! TSpikes, Mortal Spin. Wish it had Earthquake for Steels though.
Trapper and stallbreaker with Taunt and Magma Storm. Defensive set with Flame Body and BP + ID.
Another Sturdy Beam boy.
Better offenses but more or less the same, can fill all kinds of roles, wish, Stealth Rock, Boomburst. Bulk Up is the most popular but it thuds into the Fire type walls, without Tera.
Only viable Unaware mon. Can still attempt wall stuff or go for sweeps with Torch Song and Scarf/Flame Charge. The truest Cobalion counter.
Great typing, rocks through Espeon, hammers through Sturdy, Knock, gets around its Ground weakness with Balloon/Shuca. Kinda goated TBH,
Anti-set up, sub seeder and a decently strong Moonblast to vex Dark types immune to its prankster schenanigans (and Espeon).
Non-Tera dependent Sp Def tank/Rest+Talk Wall that checks special breakers like the Meteor Beamers, but struggles to force progress against bulkier teams.

B+ Rank
Same as normal, but slightly better. Thuds against all the good Ground types.
Sp Def bulky Swords Dance tank with healing from Bitter Blade and a nice defensive typing to check Cobalion.
Pretty much limited to hard stall as an archetype, but its role is almost irreplaceable. Pao is the “Blissey” of the meta. The optimal set is Snarl, Haze, Recover and Ruination. Unlike Breloom it is basically Tera dependent, but if used wisely (usually just Tera it at preview if you see Avalugg) your opponent will struggle to break you on the special end for the whole game.
Life Orb mixed cleaner w/ Psyshock, or Screens + Lunar Dance, or Trick Scarf/Specs is nice for all the bulky set up. Decent set variety.
Will o + Dragon Tail tank, spin blocker, but relies on Rest for recovery, unfort.
Multiscale and quite specially bulky. Can be a wall or a bulky DD wincon that can phaze Espeon with Dragon Tail before it can Roar it out. ExtremeSpeed for a bonus!
Sub+CM Lava Plume burns and Pressure stalls everything, and sets up in the other Fire type walls.
Really, this low? Yeah, sorry.
It’s fat and it phases stuff and Wish passes, but it’s also very passive which lets all kinds of things take advantage of it. It’s also not very good at actually keeping hazards off the field since it can’t switch into the relevant hazard setters, or they just have Mold Breaker. Its STAB is awful, and PsyFangs isn’t even good at removing screens since anyone using them is likely pairing it with a Dark type or two. It’s not a good Curse bulky wincon since its physical moves are bad, and its sp attack is utter trash.
Can be a very durible physical wall with Charm and the biggest Wish in the format. It cannot spinblock to save its life though from anything but Cryogonal, due to having a pitiful sp def. It can also serve as a Trick Room setter/sweeper that boasts a very strong Poltergeist, but unfortunately needs Tera to use a decent Fairy STAB.
A defensive hazards setter that threatens Espeon, and can chip stuff quickly with Rough Skin and Rocky Helmet.
150 base attack, strong stabs, Knock Off, and a good defensive typing.
Fire special attacker and suns greatest warrior, very hard to wall in Sun outside a Tera’d Roaring Moon or Regigigas. Burning Walwark and Morning Sun make it annoying to take down. Can technically be used outside sun, but this low because it mostly relies on Ninetales for sun support.
Fast Nasty Plot balance breaker
Do you want your Fire type wall to bring Stealth Rock and Knock Off? Here you go! Also, not being terrified of Knock Off out of the box is cool, making it less of a Tera Hog than the other Fire-walls.
Bulky Calm Mind wincon
Fattest things with both Levitate and Recover, so they both make for a good sustainable physical wall that can absorb Knock with Colbur, itemless or Tera (I prefer itemless so you also ignore Poltergeist). Latios is slightly more defensive, Latias is slightly more offensive, but also has Wish and Healing Wish. Breaking Swipe, EQ, Flip Turn, TWace and Roar are nice, you can Tera Steel it to resist Blursa/Regice and beat the Meteor Beamers. Both works as a Bulky DD wincon. Very respectable traits.
Nasty Plot + Weak Armor breaker and sweeper. Surprisingly strong Hurricane can break RMoon and Heat Wave can break Chien-Pao. The misses and rock weakness sure hurt it though.
Strongest Sucker Punch, but doesn’t like using Band because of its Rocks weakness, and can get played around.
Sp Def wall/pivot that cannot hold an item, but can Tera to also basically have an AV with recovery. Needs hazard control to not be torn up though. Not a great Spiker, as it cannot threaten Espeon.
Great bulk up win con + priority, or sp def pivot. For Band, just use Primarina.
200 attack(!) but some how still kinda underwhelming as its STAB is resisted by almost every phys def Fire, but it does also have EQ and Rock Slide.
One of the better special tanks that doesn’t fold to Blursa and Manaphy, but also is a momentum sink. Has a niche on Trick Room as a special attacker.
With higher HP and lower speed (for slow pivots) Rotom, is more min-maxed than it is in standard play. Its typing remains excellent for a defensive pivot.
Its stats got nerfed and it does not matter because Ceaseless Edge is busted and this meta struggles to clear hazards with all the fat ghosts.
Physical Shell Smash with Rock coverage can pierce the defensive cores.
Offensive SD+Spinner.
Levitate special breaker can be very hard to play around. Good coverage and it’s STABs hit Breloom and Chien-Pao for SE damage too.
Static pivot, or Sub+Pressure Stall.

B Rank
Stats more minmaxed for CM sweeps and priority. Or Trick Specs priority revenger.
Fat Sucker Puncher with Swords Dance, but its attack is weak. Bad Dreams punishing Rest is kinda funny.
Hoodra, minus the ground weakness.
Can be threatening with Ice Tera for perfect coverage, but has to rely on Focus Miss for Fighting STAB.
Fat bugger, and a Wish passer that doesn’t lose momentum because of Volt Switch. It’s a little awkward though since there are so many good Ground types. Study mons love this guy.
Bulky CM, Spikes, Magnet Rise to goob Ground types, Trick Room+Steel Beam
Serene Grace Band or Scarf with Stone Edge for physical Fire types.
Big ball of STATs that doesn’t care about the premise and infinite surprise factor
Generally outclassed by Talonflame IMO, since it doesn’t bring Defog, but it’s here.
Anchors Sun teams. Makes Gouging Fire great and all the other Proto-mons better. In a vacuum it’s slow and very below average.
A Spikes setter that scares Espeon, if you don’t want Gliscor for some type synergy reason. Pack Intimidate which is nice, and annoys Espathra to death with Toxic. Relies on Rest for Recovery unfortunately otherwise it would be up in A tier.
Rain or Specs Trick Room attacker.
Still a Shell Smash sweeper, but a physical one now. Demands Tera Blast Fairy or Fighting to hit Dark types though. Can use Sucker Punch or Strength Sap in the last slot.
Legit competition with Jolteon as a Wish passer. In exchange for a bit less bulk and meaty Wishes, you get Static, Knock Off or Nuzzle, so you can have other utility.
Sp Def pivot with priority First Impression.
Bulky CM wincon that spin blocks
Another decently strong Knock Off besides RMoon and Deoxys. Can use Growth in Sun and Trailblaze to improve its speed.
Growth Chlorophyll Sub sweeper.

B- Rank
AV Mola is still frail, but fast. Dances on Ting-Lu and Rhyperior.
Stall works and without Unaware, this is a guy. Kinda struggles against bulky boosters though.
Sp Def spinner, not being Ground weak gives it a slight niche against Treads. No Fighting STAB is unfortunate.
Sash Trick Room lead, just physical attacks now.
Unburden teams, Trick Room, Expanding Force anchor.
Mid-game Trick Room setter and Red Card enthusiast, or Ability Shield to be Tinkaton resistant. Stats are slightly more optimized for TR.
Previously the premier screener, although this role is lessened with the Light Clay ban. Still, it can set up screens at least twice a game, but sometimes even more. Pair it with Dark types so Espeon can’t eat your screens.
A physical wall, but worse than any of Persian, Zoroark. Espeon and Lati@s, but less good because it does not repel status moves like the former and hates taking Knock Off unlike the later.
Good bulky pivot to harass the Meteor Beamers and Avaluggs. Not the best spinner as it cannot beat Dengo and Zoroark, but any Spin threat is good with a pivot move for momentum.

C+ Rank
ANOTHER Fire wall, but this one has Intimidate. It’s worse at checking Cobalion than the others though since it doesn’t resist Fighting. Pretty much a downgrade from Moltres if you want Roar on your Fire wall.
Faster Band pivot than Primarina. Despite its nerfed attack, it still hits pretty hard with Adaptability.
Limited to Trick Room teams, but very strong and Sturdy is oppressive on such an offensive playstyle.
Physical Shell Smash and resists Aqua Jet revenging.
Sturdy Trick Room setter. Endeavor and Misty Explosion are nice. Just look out for Tinkaton.
More Trick Room
A spinner people seem to like that can’t spin on Dengo or Zoroark, but hey… Recover.
Kinda slow to go for sweeps with Scale Shot, but it is strong. Not super ideal for Trick Room without another Dragon STAB besides Outrage, and thuds on all kinds of walls though.
Set up sweeper that loses to Espeon outside Tera, or a Scarfer that can poison things.
Speed Booster Energy SD sweeper that thuds on Espeon and the Fire types.
Electric Surge niche sweeper.
Ground, Dark and Ghost weak Sp. Def pivot or scarfer. Lots of options, but lots of weaknesses.
Can consolidate the Spiker+anti-Manaphy/Blursa slot if you don’t want Wogerpon because you want to hold an item or something. Meow has the benefit of being a Trick Room setter resisting Dark, Ghost and Ground, and having U-Turn. It’s also a Sub Seeder immune to PsyNoise, for what that’s worth.
Slow screen setter and weather support.
Anchors Electric Terrain teams, which are solid. Pin itself is still ass, of course.
Anchors Unburden teams.
Usually paired with Pinurchin or Rillaboom for Unburden. Tera Fire (burn immunity) + SD lets it be a potent threat and Throat Chop prevents Roar phazing.
Another Unburden sweeper with Throat Chop to stop Roar. Tera Dark to turn Espeon into set up fodder.