Metagame SV OU Metagame Discussion v4

In light of recent events, I'm going to share the funny Hydrapple build I was originally running (haven't used Bodypress varients yet, but)

Hydrapple @ Life Orb
Ability: Regenerator
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpA
Modest Nature
- Nasty Plot
- Earth Power
- Tera Blast
- Fickle Beam

Life Orb sounds crazy but in practice being able to either immediately threaten out something and/or predict a switch and NP up to then mash the hardest button of your life is absolutely juicy. Long as it's not Lando U-Turn you can pretty reliably sit on something coming out and/or tank a hit and return massive dmg before switching back out. while I haven't tested it just yet, a Leafstorm/Draco/EP+1 set with specs feels promising to me long as you ensure hazards aren't clogging up everything. Grassy Terrain Leafstorm might be more ballsy instead of Ficklebeam though, even if Ficklebeam is immensely more fun.

senorlopez said:
I agree with DaddyBuzzwole...
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let moments like this remind us all no matter how at odds we might be, sometimes you have more in common with your fellow poster than you might realize. Kiss.
 
Thoughts on Hawlucha in the current meta? I def feel it's fallen off but I still feel it brings a lot to the table. I feel a Hawlucha that hasn't exhausted its Terrain Seed is great at Tera Baiting the opponent or at the very least, will force a switch out. It can get free turns against lead Kyurem, Ting Lu and Specially offensive Landorus sets.

Hawlucha with the speed boost becomes even better at Tera Baiting, Luring in threats such as Great Tusk and Zamazenta. I feel it's also a great Paradox Tera bait.

In the current meta, I'm running Jolly with max speed to switch out and still outrun the 350s club (Moth, Latios/as, Wellspring) as well as an Iron Valiant who has exhausted its Booster Energy.

Hopefully it see a bit more usage. This is one of my favorite mons
 
I obviously won't claim all because that'd be stupid, but it will be funny when some of the folks who want these higher reqs because they think talking to certain folks is annoying continue to have to talk to them because they're able to get reqs too. that is to say I hope daddybuzzwole haunts folks forever because its funny.

Im running a pre-ban team rn on an alt and so far the meta seems kinda the same as i last played, but that obviously is because of ladder ranking and recency. I know we're in a "we already played this meta and know what it is", but I hope more experienced folks continue to cook something new. Despite kyurem around I still think we have some leeway for experimentation, and its not as joever as people say. imo no point in testing gliscor rn, its not going to leave with kyurem around. tera blast is both a more productive and interesting topic, even if it doesnt get banned I think it'll put us on a more stable path on where to proceed
 
SaveMeJebus said:
Thoughts on Hawlucha in the current meta? I def feel it's fallen off but I still feel it brings a lot to the table. I feel a Hawlucha that hasn't exhausted its Terrain Seed is great at Tera Baiting the opponent or at the very least, will force a switch out. It can get free turns against lead Kyurem, Ting Lu and Specially offensive Landorus sets.

Hawlucha with the speed boost becomes even better at Tera Baiting, Luring in threats such as Great Tusk and Zamazenta. I feel it's also a great Paradox Tera bait.

In the current meta, I'm running Jolly with max speed to switch out and still outrun the 350s club (Moth, Latios/as, Wellspring) as well as an Iron Valiant who has exhausted its Booster Energy.

Hopefully it see a bit more usage. This is one of my favorite mons
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Very random mon at a distance, you can run Fire Tera+Fire Punch and beat Gholdengo but you cant touch Zapdos, you can run Tera Electric+Stone Edge/Substitute but now Gholdengo is a problem, and you always want to have something vs Raging Bolt, like Tera Ground or Sub.
In other words, it has too many serious checks and cant make the necessary progress in HO teams.
 
I just want to point out that, yes, people can’t always agree on what should be banned. I know this is an old saying, but 'if we give the tier time to adjust', more broken things will come to light. For example, Pokémon like Volcarona and Gouging Fire didn’t have enough support until the tier settled down and people started noticing which Pokémon were the most oppressive.

Try to reset your mind and forget how much you hate certain Pokémon. Approach the tier with a fresh perspective. Raging about a Pokémon won’t help move the needle. If Volcarona or Gouging Fire had been suspect tested one or two months earlier, they probably wouldn’t have been banned (Gouging Fire actually went through a suspect test and wasn’t banned).

Relax a bit, just like Finch suggested when DLC2 came out and people wanted to ban Deoxys-Speed. You don’t need to be constantly looking for the next suspect test, like some of you ALWAYS are. Finch has shown himself to be a pretty objective and unbiased tier leader. If some of the Pokémon that are currently being discussed about keep crossing the line in the next few weeks/months, I'm a firm believer that it will be addressed.

The tier and the community are really heated right now. Cool down a bit!

Edit: I understand that some of you are frustrated because you want to play the current generation but don't like Tera or some of the new Pokémon. However, some people do enjoy this generation, just as others didn't enjoy Gen 8. It's normal to prefer some generations over others, but Gen 9 is still a competitive metagame. I'm not suggesting you just give up, but it’s important to accept that not every generation will be your cup of tea.
 
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Unstoppable1 said:
Very random mon at a distance, you can run Fire Tera+Fire Punch and beat Gholdengo but you cant touch Zapdos, you can run Tera Electric+Stone Edge/Substitute but now Gholdengo is a problem, and you always want to have something vs Raging Bolt, like Tera Ground or Sub.
In other words, it has too many serious checks and cant make the necessary progress in HO teams.
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I've been running Dark Tera with throat chop and ground Tera with Tera blast on Misty Terrain. Both do need support against Zapdos but both sets get a lot of free set ups on top level threats such as Raging Bolt, GlowKing, Lando and non offensive Gliscor sets (substitute)
 
We are likely to have a Gliscor suspect within the next week or so. I am not going to promise anything, but it seems to be more likely than not to me given what I have seen.

Given the new experiment with threads and reqs, I want to personally extend my hand to help anyone who needs reqs come suspect time -- no, I will not ladder for you...hope this NEVER happens again :worrywhirl: , but I am happy to help with teams or shed insight on plays. Getting better and improving understanding is an awesome practice regardless of reqs, but suspects are a good time to get going

Will probably be MIA the next day or two with a lot going on IRL, but stay tuned.
 
SaveMeJebus said:
Thoughts on Hawlucha in the current meta? I def feel it's fallen off but I still feel it brings a lot to the table. I feel a Hawlucha that hasn't exhausted its Terrain Seed is great at Tera Baiting the opponent or at the very least, will force a switch out. It can get free turns against lead Kyurem, Ting Lu and Specially offensive Landorus sets.

Hawlucha with the speed boost becomes even better at Tera Baiting, Luring in threats such as Great Tusk and Zamazenta. I feel it's also a great Paradox Tera bait.

In the current meta, I'm running Jolly with max speed to switch out and still outrun the 350s club (Moth, Latios/as, Wellspring) as well as an Iron Valiant who has exhausted its Booster Energy.

Hopefully it see a bit more usage. This is one of my favorite mons
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I don't really ever use Hawlucha, but shouldn't you be using Adamant Hawlucha? Unless you're suggesting to use Hawlucha outside of Grassy Terrain.

Tera Electric Tera Blast seems like it could be fun. Hits the Kanto Birds hard without contact, and makes you Zapdos proof + resisting Thunderclap. Not sure what the moveset would look like, but ya might wanna check it out.
 
Ok, I've had time to adjust. Suddenly having Kyu back was too much of a whiplash for me. I wanna give shout out to Tickle and Aqua Jet on Alomomola. Tickle makes it easier to wish pass even with WaterPon around, and Aqua Jet can core some sneaky KOs.
 
sims796 said:
Ok, I've had time to adjust. Suddenly having Kyu back was too much of a whiplash for me. I wanna give shout out to Tickle and Aqua Jet on Alomomola. Tickle makes it easier to wish pass even with WaterPon around, and Aqua Jet can core some sneaky KOs.
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I've been running Tera Ground Vaporeon. I didn't know until recently it got Roar

Gets destroyed by Wellspring but it kills Booster Energy sets

And as an added bonus, does surprisingly well against Rain
 
SaveMeJebus said:
I've been running Tera Ground Vaporeon. I didn't know until recently it got Roar

Gets destroyed by Wellspring but it kills Booster Energy sets

And as an added bonus, does surprisingly well against Rain
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Why tera ground specifically? For bolt? Or are you running tera blast offensive
 
Also gliscor is a broken ass mon. Defensive is unkillable and SD is cancer strong against most teams.

It is used commonly on stall though, so I'm would be awesome if it was banned.

The tinkaton nation will have to use moltres in these trying times.
 
LucaHNO said:
Why tera ground specifically? For bolt? Or are you running tera blast offensive
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It just does better against Hurricane
If you don't have a problem with that, grass could work as well

Vaporeon @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
Tera Type: Ground
EVs: 200 HP / 172 Def / 136 Spe
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Wish
- Protect
- Haze/Roar

This is the set I run. It has enough speed to Outspeed Kingambit and the rest is invested on trying to be as bulky as possible. Overall, Alomomola outclasses it, But I feel it has a niche in hazard stack teams
 
ianlazerbeem said:
Breaking my rule of don't engage to say: who cares? People get passionate, so be it. If every single post across the community was against the rules, perhaps the rules do not allow for proper expression of players' feelings. This is online I am not going to mald about decorum when someone gets a little heated or theatrical. It is also very funny seeing you, a frequent breaker of rules, getting high and mighty about people breaking the rules. Anything to posit yourself as a better man than the late great CTC i suppose
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Being passionate is not an excuse to be rude or demeaning, or insult someone's skill. I'm not really sure what you were trying to say here, especially since I doubt you'd extend that "who cares" mentality to less experienced players who were "passionate". There's plenty of ways to make civil, constructive posts whether ban or no ban on something, and there were really nicely written posts from players like SZ for no ban and Ausma for pro ban last time.

Anyways, with the possibility of a Gliscor suspect on the horizon I just hope there can be a lot of insightful, nuanced and constructive discussions from both experienced and less experienced as well as pro and anti ban sides, as that's the best way for the game to be improved.
 
This is more of a general request, but if you're going to make longer comments explaining your stance, please seperate them into seperate paragraphs. It's not even a suspect test only thing, just in general. It makes reading through longer posts so much easier on the eyes, especially for people like me who tend to get lost easily when reading.

Image unrelated
 

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While I still feel it would be poor timing to do a Gliscor suspect test soon after Kyurem's unprecedented unban, in some ways, it's a great testing ground for the dual suspect thread and other suspect changes given the polarizing nature of Gliscor's suspect. In the general thread, there's absolutely going to be people whose main DNB arguments will center on Kyurem's presence instead of what Gliscor is/does much like how many centered on Ghold's effect on hazzard stacking during the first suspect.
However, much less people in the qualified thread might fall into that trap and will have more substantial reasoning for if it should stay or go. Though the level of quality discussion isn't guaranteed as following any competitive scene will grimly teach is the ability to execute in matches isn't always proportional to the ability to elucidate the workings of a metagame (even if playing at the highest level gives one invaluable knowledge).
At minimum, I hope the second thread would allow a space for the council's less frequent posters to give their thoughts even if it goes against the grain of other council members/general public. It's certainly been a frustrating state of affairs, but we can either groove with it for the time being or just figuratively hibernate offline for 6 months now that folks hopefully got the angst out of their system.
 
Unstoppable1 said:
You need to edit it again, otherwise it looks ridiculous. Cool WL btw, i suppose this is the reason why people want to make getting reqs more difficult.

I dont support Gliscor suspect, just ez one more DNB vote (thanks to my parents im smart enough and i dont need to explain my position to random people on this forum)

And Finchinator, i need hot teams for OURLT playoffs, so if you have some cancer teams like Alolatales HO i would be grateful
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Why so? if there is a decision you want then surely why not voice it right now? People are asking rn for smth to happen... but when you ask everyone they give you a diff answer from kyurem, tera blast, kingambit, gliscor, and rarer answers are more so like tera

People cant read others mind, and sure u can voice "this isnt what i wanted" but if you want smth else why not say so "um actually i think tera blast is broken"

Even if this isnt what you wanted.. we cant go round and round with people saying "uh actually this is no good, i wanted this to happen" going in circles is going to end up nowhere so why not just say "sure gliscor suspect isnt what i wanted but for the future of the meta its the better decision to give it a boot"
 
HydreigonTheChild said:
Why so? if there is a decision you want then surely why not voice it right now? People are asking rn for smth to happen... but when you ask everyone they give you a diff answer from kyurem, tera blast, kingambit, gliscor, and rarer answers are more so like tera

People cant read others mind, and sure u can voice "this isnt what i wanted" but if you want smth else why not say so "um actually i think tera blast is broken"

Even if this isnt what you wanted.. we cant go round and round with people saying "uh actually this is no good, i wanted this to happen" going in circles is going to end up nowhere so why not just say "sure gliscor suspect isnt what i wanted but for the future of the meta its the better decision to give it a boot"
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I wrote about this a few posts ago lol, we will never get a balanced tier anyway because the council listens to people from this thread.
I believe in the reasonableness of most people, but the fact that we suspect Gliscor at all doesnt give any hope for normal suspects in the future
 
Unstoppable1 said:
I wrote about this a few posts ago lol, we will never get a balanced tier anyway because the council listens to people from this thread.
I believe in the reasonableness of most people, but the fact that we suspect Gliscor at all doesnt give any hope for normal suspects in the future
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what would a "balanced tier" look like in your opinion? you've mentioned wanting action on hydrapple, anything else you think we should be looking into right now that isn't on the radar?
 
Unstoppable1 said:
I wrote about this a few posts ago lol, we will never get a balanced tier anyway because the council listens to people from this thread.
I believe in the reasonableness of most people, but the fact that we suspect Gliscor at all doesnt give any hope for normal suspects in the future
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If you believe the tier is never gonna be balanced then may as well try smth out to see if smth sticks... the tier may not be balanced but how do we know? are you some kind of mind reader or smth

May as well try smth rather than sit here and be like "oh well guess we cant do much" it feels really dumb to just give up when we still have a long way to go till the next gen and we may as well fix it for the players who come back to look at this gen and not go "wow what a shithole"
 
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