Resource Scarlet and Violet RU Indigo Disk Viability Rankings

[unfunny meme]

B -> B+
Chesnaught needs a small rise IMO. He's the tiers premier spikes, only facing competition with gligar. Unlike gligar, Chesnaught can run leftovers or rocky helment and has recovery in synthesis. Only reason he's not higher is because his typing is very mid and conk just destroys him.

 

[LBN]

New VR update new session of me shitting all over it per usual. Just kidding, though i think dropping Mienshao and Wo-chien after okidogi LEFT is some of the craziest shit ive ever seen.

-> B-
Lets be honest here. Crawdaunt is a fine standalone pokemon, trust me it is. But why in the hell would I load this over something like guts conkeldurr in the slow nuke role. Hell, even something like Golurk can full that role quite well and offers excellent power with even more defensive utility and bulk. Sure, the small longevity bonus it has over conk is nice but this is off-set by the fact you have a dark that cant take a shadow ball before 9-1-1 is on speed dial. And why not just basculegion on either form anyways they atleast have flip turn.

-> B+
I feel like this is a fairly contested take, but Hippowdon is just way too passive and invites in stuff you don't want to invite like Mence, Zapdos-Galar, completely stuffed by all the removal besides bike and maybe conk if we count that. It's not bad it has value but forcing it out of slack offs isnt an uncommon site to see and you really feel the pain when a jirachi just u turns into a specs monster like H-Goodra or Gengar or a Basculgion and you just realize you'll never get that HP back. It just tends to be way too passive without coughing up either utility or bulk and you're investing alot of capital just to make it not flop into like 1/3rd of the tier. A rank is absolutely an overshot for its capabilities, and while B+ may be a bit too low for some people lets not act like its a paragon anymore, it hasn't been for a long time and its competition as a ground rocker is becoming more crowded as time goes on.

-> B / B-
Now speaking of ROCKERS oh my god, this pokemon just keeps getting better for me. SCL results see it at a 100% winrate (dont ask how many uses it only caught on by like week 7-8), but another PTPL game where cieleau won with golurk taking like 2.5 bodies on its own. After using Golurk offense to get reqs; that exact team to be clear, Golurk was always being a centerpiece to progress making. I've seen some people argue for tricky barb klutz; dont bother, its bait. What you can target with it is just stifled by running a spiker of some kind like Deo-D Mew or the Keys and instead of bottlenecking your utility, you can actually do your spinblocking job and not get punked by cyclizar knock off OR miss your poltergeists and stone edges! That said, Golurk does have some item variety. Custap Berry speaks for itself and Golurk is well accustomed to using it. Other type berries like Lum berry for Wisp G-Weezing to effectively remove it w 3 poltergeists, or Rindo/Passho/Kasib or whatever you desire really. It's just a fantastic pick, and I dont think it encroaches on Krookodile's job much despite the role similarity. At the least I'd say its comfortably on par with Palossand now.

-> C+/C
Frankly we need to stop kidding ourselves. When was the last time this saw use on a serious team and it didn't feel like bargain bin terrakion/Duskroc? The speed tier sucks, Stone axe is fine but the speed really lets it down and needing Boots to function is not a flattering thing. I've seen mentions of things for SD sets with trailblaze but then your forced to pick between X-Scissor for slowbros and CC for steel types not named Jirachi which isn't a flattering pick to have to make when you can just get Terrakion with better bulk utility and speed. Duskroc isn't in a fantastic position itself but atleast Accelrock utility and a faster speed lets it act as a proper side-grade to Terrakion. This is a straight downgrade, and its complete non usefulness does not help matters. Rock type offense isnt a concept doomed from the start, but we have better tools for that. As a suicide lead, use Terrakion. As an attacker, use Terrakion. It's not hopeless like it functions fine in a vacuum but again, if your a straight downgrade to something else you cant be sitting in B ranks, especially when your upgrade is only in A- and performs this little and this poorly.

-> C
An acceptable attacker from last gen bottle-necked by Cyclizar. Tera blast fairy opens some placings and with the best water being ghost weak you can honestly just abandon energy ball entirely to tera blast. When you dont run into Cyclizar or can successfully neuter it, it's one of the more effective scarfers in the tier. Flame body utility is nice for u turn bots like Slither wing, and the rewards of keeping rocks off is you have an extremely difficult ghost to switch into barring Umbreon and the aforementioned cyclizar. Any team without those is immediately forced to respect chandy, and with an SCL use and win under its belt I think its worth further inspection.


Not gonna make more suggestions since I've a habit of nomming the same shit over n over (infernape, cresselia) but just know i think they should be higher. That being said, PLEASE standardize the sprites for this and cut the shit w the memes. Seeing Amogus on the VR in big 2024 is the lamest shit and I haven't cracked a smile at the H-Zoro and ditto memes either. Also I'd consider stealing a page from PU's VR display, and doing them in the Rows horizontally with the table function, like this:

Empoleon​	Fezandipiti​	Hippowdon​
Suicune​	Volcanion​	Zapdos-Galar​

Something like this is way more compact and less miserable to scroll through. Even if you don't listen, atleast cut the memes out and use the default pictures. (Table function takes some fiddling to be sure, but its appealing visually compared to what we got right now so)

 

[seed]

-> A+
I think there’s a pretty clear case for Gapdos to be moved up to at least A+, particularly because of its Scarf set. Scarf Gapdos is a huge threat in post-Thundy/Yanmega RU and can successfully fit on a variety of team structures as evidenced by its 100% usage rate in the past 2 weeks of SCL. Very good mon.

-> B/B+
Along the same lines, Belli is a great Gapdos answer right now and general fat disruptor with Static and access to Toxic and reliable recovery. It definitely flounders in some matchups like Hoodra and Fez, but having built in punishment for contact moves is quite nice for the many U-turn users in the tier like Gapdos, Cyclizar and Jirachi.

 

[haunted paper]

-> B+ rank - Oricorio-Pom is pretty crazy as a set up sweeper considering what it can set-up on (Hippo, Cyclizar, non-ID Registeel, Slither Wing, Magnezone, Zapdos-G to an extent, etc.) and how well it takes advantage of the wrong choice locked moves (Krook w/EQ, Jirachi w/Iron Head, and Goodra-H w/Flash Cannon). Excellent late-game sweeper and can annoy dragon dancers that are starting up.

-> C+ rank - Sun gets a pretty bad rep but its honestly an okay playstyle. Torkoal's physical bulk is the best highlight for this mon yet, having the right team mates can truly make it even better. Knowing when to tank the hits and go for the spin/rocks makes it clear why its decent. Best to keep it 100% healthy at the beginning for most games. Typhlosian-H is great scarf abuser for sun for the obvious Eruptions, Fire Blasts, and Overheats. Seriously, this mon can spam powerful hits consistently against unsuspecting teams. Outspeeding scarf Krook and being immune to Conk's mach punch and Entei's e-speed is huge.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ru-2251222346-w50dusp2r6gocbdc9nr2xd5yt166cbrpw
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ru-2255042904-tpvrhna5dedpl7sb25vq58wr131aintpw

 

[LBN]

Well, we had shifts! Kinda. We just got Rhyperior but that mon is amazing and I love him and-

-> A / A-
This pokemon was only with us when we had rotom-wash and it was still fire. Now we contend with a pokemon more manageable for it; Weezing-Galar. Smack down sets can make short work of it, same w tera fire sets if your so inclined. However, Tera Dragon is probably the best one. Rhyperior can generally 1v1 the entire tier thanks to Tera, and this goes a long way for its value. Beyond EQ/Rock stab of Edge/Rock Blast/Smack Down, SR and then you have options of Megahorn, Fire Punch, Ice Punch, SD, or even Dtail & Roar. Custap is also a nice option, something Rhyperior is always built to make good use of. Personally I think it's a splendid Pokemon and it does belong on a lot of teams.

-> A
The core of H-Zoro + Zapdos-Galar killed it during SCL, and it's easy to see why. Zap-G has very particular checks, all of which explodes to H-Zoro behind the disguise. A classic setup, but effective. H-Zoro is capable even beyond that, and the ban of Thundurus definitely helped the ghosts out by not being either knock of twave bait from somebody faster. Specs H-Zoro is a nuke, and the defensive utility of the 3 immunities gives it value in the comparison to Gengar. I still believe its mostly neck n neck, but H-Zoro has shown more results and I think it's deserving of a rise.

I also agree with the Zap-G to A+ take from earlier. Idk about that belli rise tho.

-> UR

-> A- / A
This one shouldn't be too surprising. After its performance in SCL where it felt like whenever it came the game got packed up in 10 turns more often than not. Tera flying, RestoChesto, Tera Ground EQ, all of these are options and the list doesn't really end. When it shows up it steals your attention to it as something to treat with urgency, and it's coverage being mostly unresisted is massive. Sure, it's often a tera sink but who cares when it provides this much value? Each tiering change has just been Gyara getting better and better, whether banning yanmega & Thundurus, Alolan Ninetales and Bee dropping, each shift has provided more stocks to Gyarados to succeed.

-> C+
Let's be serious rain is not that good anymore. H-Goodra's drop sealed any hopes of me hyping the specs up set too hard, and while the specs set still isn't bad it's not B rank good. Because lord knows rain as an archetype isn't B rank good when was the last time it saw success akin to a B rank let me know cuz I'm not seeing it. Rain just sucks and has been overranked for awhile.

-> B-
It's dominance of Cyclizar = water resist teams, which was its best niche outside rain has been floundered by people just... not really using those often. Cyclizar is still good but its not as common as before with people building teams w Noivern or teams with no removal altogether. Slowbro sucks for it, and its defensive utility being basically null doesn't help its use prospects. B+ is just a large overshoot for it and idt thats debatable atp.

-> C+
Rhyperior isn't really a great switchin to specs boombursts, sure. You know who is? Big Golurk thats who. Between these two teams are shifting off of the ground = krookodile/gligar/hippo train and onto grounds toxt fairs far worse against. H-Goodra was never helping matters either but like Rhyp was at risk being worn down by repeated boombursts to the face. Now though, with golurk stocks on the rise especially? Yeah it's just not B- quality anymore.

-> C
How is this B-. Nono seriously i deserve an answer to this question how is froslass still this high up. Spikes Froslass lead hasn't been bad, but it also hasn't been used much at all either. It's still the best spiking lead we have, but terrakion sees so much more usage in that suicide lead role that it's not funny. I wouldn't ever really UR froslass I think we all know what it does and that what it brings is valuable, but we need to be serious when calling froslass a B- mon. That's the same rank as GALLADE.

-> C
Overqwil's pretty much ONLY value is in rain. And rain is just not it, I'm sorry Nature's Conqueror my ladder hero goat. Jokes aside yeah no Overqwil isn't even an automatic addition on rain, and its other jobs its laughably mediocore. Idk what feli sees in defensive sets but the only shit he should be seeing is an eye doctor. It doesn't check jack shit, hard walled by Bisharp and spiking isn't a good enough sales pitch to justify such a mediocore defensive piece. SD sets outside of rain... we might have something there. But that's only in theory, and Bisharp again stuffs alot of what it'd try to do. Muk-A... It already sucked because it just doesn't beat slowbro at all, and Krook/Bisharp/Rhyperior stocks make it annoying to carve out a role. Golurk being a ghost it cant beat also sucks, same w Legion-F just tell me what this shit actually checks properly please I'm still looking at the list has 1 entry and its reuniclus this isn't a B ranker.

-> C / C+
I've never seen a pokemon get completely dunked on by every subsequent tiering change quite like this thing has. Thundurus gone, Yanmega gone, Rhyperior back. Just straight L's back to back to back. Its use cases has already been cope for 2 nuts pokemon to begin with and now that they are gone we can go back to slandering it like no tommorow! Sure it might do stuff on paper but just... nobody uses it. It's not that good I'm sorry.

-> C+
We have been letting this fecal matter get away with being over ranked for far too long. If we sent MIENSHAO to B+ for lack of use we can send this filth to C+ for the same. And unlike mienshao, it actually deserves it! Yet another offensive piece but when your defensive utility begins and ends at hippowdon in the great time of december 2024 we have problems that not even miracles can solve. The fact people call Infernape potential man but not this filth is a testament because this shit doesn't even succeed in theory crafting either! This shit ranks higher than gallade and golurk LOOOOOOOOOL

-> UR

Be Serious

 

[TheFranklin]

Moving forward we are going to try a slightly different process to update the VR, instead of a full slate each time:

1. Every nom in the VR thread since the last VR update gets added to the list.

2. The VR team will discuss the list and decide which of them will be accepted to the slate, including adding our own picks.

3. The final list will be what the VR team will vote on, instead of voting on the entire slate.

We hope to put more emphasis on the right pokemon this way. We will start discussing what will be on the next slate after the weekend.

 

[FlamPoke]

Wanted to just contribute a few unranked mons that I'd like to see considered on the VR;

-> A
Don't feel like this needs much elaborating to be honest but LBN is generally right about how good this will be. Super reliable mon that can always make progress especially with Tera Dragon or Fairy.

-> B-
I understand that Chandelure competes directly with several great Ghost-types in Gengar and Hisuian Zoroark, but having Flame Body and Fire STAB is excellent in the current metagame and it can be deceptively good vs Cyclizar balance teams with Pain Split sets. I like this a lot as it forces concessions every time it hits the field and can spread burns and chip reliably. Pawmot being unranked is a crime, it has an excellent Speed tier, great STAB coverage, Knock Off, and priority with Mach Punch. Feli used it in SCL and I used it in a side PL, both went well using different concepts.

-> C+
I am a big fan of Psychic-types that have the bulk and recovery to let them use their strong STABs and Guno is a really nice one to me. I know seed likes to use FSight on it and I do like that since it has U-turn as well. Oricorio-Sensu is not much worse than the PomPom version (which should be an A- at worst mon...), if you ignore it not resisting Gapdos Brave Bird (A+ mon...). I like the Ghost typing on it as you can get a lot of free set up opportunities and threaten out stuff like Slowbro, with Tera helping break through or set up fodder Hoodra and Cyclizar notably.

-> C
Using Altaria over the many other Dragon-types can be a bit funky but it's another great burn spreader that can be really annoying for balance teams to actually break, with removal + reliable recovery. Scrafty is a great set up option and can generally make progress into most structures, especially vs bulky offense teams as it shrugs off status and can break through a lot of common cores.

 

[Heatranator]

Alright, rhyperior has dropped and yanmega has been banned, so lots of changes.

-> A-
Rhyperior my beloved, you are back. Yeah uhh, idk, pretty bulky with lots of power and can use quite a few different moves. Said above, so imma get to the different noms.

B+ -> A-/A
Both of these dropped last VR shift (for some reason...) and are even better now with yanmega leaving and rhyperior dropping. Wo chien doesn't have to worry about another mon with a 4x super effective move and has a mon which can't do too much to it with just stab moves. It can spread knock off and Leech seed pretty reliably, and has a multitude of options. Foul play, stun spore, taunt and I've even tried body press (it wasn't great). It is a bit of a tera hog, but that's really not that bad when in return you get such a great mon that can wall large swathes of the meta. Conkeldurr never should have dropped, it's one of the best fighting types in the tier (which is wild when the competition is so tough) and gets much better after the shifts. Yanmega leaving means that it doesn't have a 4x mach punch resist, and can spam it a lot easier. This means it can scare out bisharp incredibly easily/force tera, as armarouge doesn't like taking knock. It just is absolutely destructive against bulkier teams, picking up a ko most of the time it comes in. It also has a bit of variety in its sets. Flame orb is the standard, but bu sets can become great late game wincons with drain punch+lefties recovery and defog sets can be nice for offense teams as a emergency option.

B- -> B/B+
Going to have to agree with the post above, oricorio has been doing great after the yanmega ban. It slots in nicely on HO teams as the tera hog mon on these teams, as it can win against bulky teams extremely easily with qd+roost. It can also use qd+taunt to break the few bulky mons it can potentially struggle against such as umbreon. Just honestly a good overall mon that deserves to rise.

B -> B-
I love you rotom heat, but you ain't doing too well now. It could be used as a yanmega check, but that mon is ofc gone. It also struggles into rhyperior unless it has wisp, which means you can no longer do the NP split set at all, which is hugely constraining. It honestly is a bit on a downtread, but idt its too bad. In the right matchup, it still is devestating, so I think only to B- is fair.

B- -> B
And in the opposite corner, rotom mow has gotten even better now. It now doesn't have to worry about a mon that can hit it with a super effective hit, while it also hits rhyperior for big damage. It honestly just decimates bulkier teams. If you can take care of cyclizar (which still doesn't like switching into discharge due to para) then it kinda can just win on the spot. Does really well against bulky waters too, which a lot of teams rely on.

S -> A+
Alright, its finally time to drop slowbro. From the people I've spoken with, nothing is S tier in RU, and while slowbro is probably the best candidate for S tier, it still doesn't really reach the S rank criteria. A lot of the tier pressures it a lot, and while it can be great with cm, it can struggle a bit to get going as even after a boost strong special attacks still threaten it. It also is a big tera hog, and has to pick and choose its tera. Tera poison means it can actually beat the multiple toxic users in the tier, but that makes it weak to ground and opposing psychic types, which with rhyperior dropping is less appealing. Tera fairy is just a good defensive tera and stops d-tail users, but doesn't make itself immune to toxic, which means umbreon, quag (can take one hit) and fez can status it and let it ko itself eventually. I've heard the phrase "slowbro is best against opposing slowbro teams" (or something along the lines of that) and that honestly might be true. If it also commits to the sweep, then getting ko'd means the team has a big defensive hole, and are very liable to getting counterswept. Now, is slowbro bad? Hell no, its still a great mon in the tier. But its just not S rank anymore.

B- -> B
Another mon that I think was unfairly dropped last shift, porygon-z is a menace. If it gets a download boost and agility up, it can be lights out. Expert belt is the preferred item on this mon for me, as ice beam at +1 OHKO's cyclizar, and tera blast ground can heavily chunks even specially defensive hoodra. It is limited in its defensive capabilities a bit, but a ghost immunity is nice for horoark.


-> UR
Let's clean up the lower ranks. Vileplume honestly I can't see any use case for. Its free bisharp setup fodder, as it can't even strength sap it as due to defiant, it gains attack. It in general struggles into steel types and amoonguss is better in general as a defensive grass type due to regen. Every time I see this in a match (which is limited because this thing isn't used a lot due to how bad it is), it lets something in and does nothing. I've seen specially defensive mono surf empoleon beat it, which is bad. Kingdra idt has a use case over other swift swimmers. If you want a special attacking swift swimmer, hersculegion is right there. Rain already isn't very good, and it has to fit so many other abusers/mons that it can't fit this mon in there. As a standalone mon, it isn't even good. Critdra is like, fine.... but at that point you should use other wallbreakers. Abomasnow has nothing going for it. Sure, it has better offenses, but that's legit it, and even then its nothing to write home about, as its too slow and frail due to its typing to actually get up aurora veil reliably, which is the one thing its meant to do. A-tales is 100% better then it, as it has encore to actually get setup turns or can use NP to become threatening, so it even outclasses it in the one area aboma is meant to be good in lmao.

UR -> C
Three UR mons that should probably be ranked. Lycanroc midday is a decent HO lead, as its faster then most rock users (besides azelf, but rocks azelf is fake) and can do the endeavour+priority thing its dusk form can. Scream tail is a great wish passer on fat/balance teams that can use encore to stop setup sweepers in there tracks, while not being too passive if it wants due to psychic noise. Bronzong was UR'd a while ago, but honestly didn't really deserve it, and now with rhyperior in the tier, it absolutely deserves to be ranked. The zonger can do a variety of things. It can set up rocks, use id+bp to check threats while becoming a sweeper, use psychic noise to do better against walls, and use trick+toxic orb to cripple a switch in with poison. Honestly, just an overall good mon in the tier that should be ranked.

 

[colorednaem]

I just want to talk about a few underated mons currently.
-> B-/B
Altaria is a decent enough balance mon as flampoke underlined in his post, given its good movepool but the main reason i have it so high is this set on stall teams.
Altaria @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Natural Cure
Tera Type: Steel/Poison/Water/Ghost
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Careful/Calm Nature
IVs: 31/0 Atk
- Fire Spin
- Perish Song
- Earthquake/Haze/Defog/Will-O-Wisp/STAB
- Roost
Altaria is amazing on stall because it has great matchups into traditional stall breakers such as Suicune, Reun, Taunt Body Press Volcanion and Whirlpool Quag that standard structures struggle with. Along side this altaria creates a near unbreakable core on the special side of and frees up slots for each of them. For example haze altaria frees up haze on muk which lets it run protect, which in turn means you dont have to run tect on chansey and can run heal bell which then allows muk to not have to run sleep talk. With fire spin + perish song altaria is basically an insta win into most stall and a large amount of fat teams once cylizar is dead. Fire spin also lets it trap a lot of mons that can be annoying for stall to deal with over a long game such as av reuni, wishers without a pivot move and every single viable spikes setter. What altaria also does is consistently force tera ghosts against mons like chesnaught, hippo and gweez which are knock absorbers which allow muk-a, ches or whatever to force progress. Altaria also has a deep support movepool with stuff like defog, wisp and haze which are all valuble to stall. Altaria inherently competes with cyclizar for a spot on stall teams but bike is pretty much a shitmon on stall as it cant make progress against any well built stack/fat team. Altarias main flaw is its mediocre bulk, but its support and amazing breakage of fatter cores is invaluable. Its also important to mention that Altaria is very weak to hazards but if you build around that with something like ches+thief you will be fine.
replays:
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ru-2256419205-3tcfxc4sl46a7e76799fguitrcet4ulpw?p2
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ru-2255051308-pz84nj94nezjnr505va7nk0nx2af4izpw?p2
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ru-2256425908-615lz9e3vyc1sxok2p2s30hi0j3pxinpw?p2
note: i dont save replays so these are someone elses

-> C
Heatranator explained it well, I do think demon zong is the way to go tho. The mon can struggle with passivity so its more suited to fat.

-> A-
Spikes are really strong into the tier rn with a lot of top tiers hating it like slowbro, rachi and hippo. As well tera ghost is really good into a lot of offensive cores and pretty much invalidates the h-zoro/gapdos mindgame. Another great trait of ches is the item flexibility with options like fast helm to beat conk (unless jolly but thats an unset) and resist berrys to curb mus with my personal favourite being to allow you to play more aggresive in the face of gengar and beat krook better

-> B-/B
Hits like a truck, and has great coverage and typing. I do think this mon is under explored with custap being a set that sticks out to me. It does contend for a teamslot with other good grounds like krook, hippo and flygon.

-> A
Av future sight sets have been seing more usage as a sidegrade to slowbro given how strong future sight is into the tier. CM sets are still good on certain structures and have good set variety. Boots utility are very flexable with being notable as a twave user that the grounds cant switch into. Lorb OTR is very underexplored as it is amazing into basically everything as it 2hkos the whole tier other then umbreon, is great at forcing teras and is a offensive stopgap. The main problem with this set is you have to be good to use it as otherwise tr turns can get pivoted around easily.

-> B
Against bulky structures it basically claims a kill everytime it comes in and agil can be a nice late game cleaner. I dont think it should go higher as it requires a lot of support to get onto the field and competes for a slot with stuff like Conk and Gapdos.

edit: b+ was a bit high for altaria so i changed

 

[fluff!!]

Let's go from top to bottom:

S -> A+
Not much to say outside of the fact that Slowbro does not belong in its own tier, plain and simple. The only way to keep Slowbro in S would be to also rise Gapdos, Bisharp, and Krookodile to S as well, which would be correct, but also a bit too many mons in S depending on your ranking philosophy. As it stands though, Slowbro is not a better and more splashable and plain good mon than those three.

A+ -> A
I think that people underestimate the cost of running Cyclizar over another mon. Sure, it is a great special sponge when you need a horoark/gengar/basc-f switch in that can also spin, but it is threatened by all of our hazard setters, especially since Rhyperior came back home, and it very easily gets overwhelmed and end up not doing much in many games. In tournament, I feel like Cyc hangs on by a thread thanks to old meta teams that run Jirachi as their hazard setter and no real way of punishing Cyc.

A+ -> A
This mon just flubs into too many mons and isn't good enough in tournament for A+. Specs sets are lacking in reliability and are useless in certain matchups, Goodra also has huge survivability issues with Spikes being as prevalent as it is currently. It's #12 in usage for SCL, tied with Bisharp, but with a 35% WR over Bisharp's 57% WR, showing that Hoodra is just not that guy.

A+ -> A
perhaps a controversial take, but Jirachi is not that good. It is incredibly passive and wants to run too many moves in its support sets to be as reliable as it wishes it could be. imo, Jirachi being a Steel weak to Ghost is a big issue and you usually want your Steel to be able to handle Ghosts to some extent, with Registeel tanking a few moves before dropping and retaliating back, SpDef Empoleon walling them, and even Hoodra likewise tanking for a while and retaliating back hard. Running Jirachi usually means you'll also run Cyclizar to patch this up, but then you have 2 passive mons that are prone to cheese (understand Weather and random setup sweepers like Hilligant and Gyarados) and don't actually tank anything reliably? They're meant to be special sponges but also lose to our best special attackers like Hoodra if it clicks the right move, Armarouge, and Volcanion. Again, certainly not a bad mon, being a fast Steel rocker with U-turn will always be good, but I feel like it has just a bit too many flaws for A+? At least if we don't go the route of having 4 mons in S.

A+ -> A
tl;dr Priority too unreliable and too Bug type, just not on the level of Gapdos/every other A+ mon

A -> A+
Our best special breaker. Steam Eruption is stupid strong and has very limited checks and counters, usually forcing teams to run subpar mons like Milotic or Gastrodon to not autolose to it. You can put it in pmuch any team and it will bring the defensive utility of a Water Absorb water coupled with the sheer strength of 2 billion suns, also being able to just beat Chansey thanks to Taunt. It also had a great performance in SCL, being top 5 use rate and win rate.

A -> A+
very much a widely agreed upon take, this thing deserves A+ and arguably even S. s/o to Gapdos saving the tier for being a top tier super reliable breaker and speed control option that's Spikes immune.

A- -> ???
I would drop it to B+ or even B, but maybe, just maybe Rhyperior coming back will make it better since Flygon is a good check to it. Outside of that, it just pretty much completely phazed out of existence so I'm not quite sure why it deserves to stay in the A tiers.

B -> B-/C+
A relic of the Okidogi days, it is time to let go.

B -> B-/C+
very frail, no defensive utility outside of clenching your butthole everytime you switch into something that could theoretically click EQ but also could click Knock Off/Stone Edge, and very prediction reliant if trying to run its better physical scarf sets. Saw negative usage in SCL. Unfortunate.

B -> B-/C+
Rain is great against antiquated Jirachi+Cyclizar teams!

B- -> B
I am the #1 Bellibolt hater and downplayer, but also see that there's no way Bellibolt is just as good as top fraud infernape and freakin Toxtricity

B- -> B/B+
One of the best stallmons and can also participate in more balance archetypes really well. It's a better Spikes setter than Chesnaught. Water Absorb > Unaware btw.

C+ -> B-
Pretty good exotic pick for offensive teams. It at least deserves a slight raise, especially since it has a decent Rhyperior matchup.

C+ -> UR
Grookey is unironically better

New noms

UR -> A-/A
best traditional tank in the tier. SD + 3 attacks and SD/SR + 2 attacks are both super strong and it's the best (or 2nd best, bish is arguably better?) mon to trade with the help of Tera. It dumps on more passive teams that aren't Chesnaught Stall. It can even use Tera Blast to KO stuff like Quagsire/Chesnaught depending on the Tera of choice, and it will most definitely be worth it.
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ru-2255830582 Rhyperior uses Tera Water to use Feraligatr as setup bait and eventually takes 4 KOs with some Healing Wish help
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ru-2257105403-jpqwvclg6xjhpy92lgpy4ihc0clmduepw Rhyperior Tera Blast Grasses Quagsire off the face of the earth and wins against stall T3

Rhyperior does have some tough matchups though. Chesnaught hard walls it, period. Now, Chesnaught is not a good mon, but it sure is a popular mon that will see even more play because of Rhyperior's comeback. Ches can then set Spikes up, which are a huge issue for Rhyperior due to its lack of recovery and susceptibility to all hazards in this hazard dominated tier. Unaware Quag is also a big issue since it's in every single Stall team in existence. Rhyperior might be good at keeping Rocks up, but he's not good at staying alive for a while and not letting Ches set 3 layers of Spikes.

UR -> B-/C+
I haven't used it as much as other people on this thread so I'll let them talk about this mon, but I do agree that Flame Body utility = good and how it dominates teams not having Cyclizar (which it can still destroy with Tera Blast Fairy, great set)

UR -> B???
yet another suicide lead, but it's actually the better one, Not sure how to rank it based on that though.

UR -> C+
sets Rocks, completely walls stuff like Rhyperior/Salamence, IDBP. Unfortunate secondary Psychic typing however.

UR -> UR
Does not solve any issue Stall faces, being that you need your 6 slots, and you can't afford having one of these slots be the most unreliable fire spin cheese machine that doesn't actually answer anything. It can't answer Suicune either, since Perish Song only has 4 PP and Substitute prevents Fire Spin trapping. Misdreavus is a better trapper don't @ me. Just not bulky or fast or strong enough or has enough utility outside of Stall, use Noivern, it's better.

UR -> C
I do agree it probably has a niche as a fast encore fairy with Wish. It sure is 10 times better than Sylveon, which is already in contention for not being the biggest fraud of all time

 

[Ampha]

Heya, as TheFranklin has said previously, the VR format changed and with that we decided for a shorter approach with our votes, with that being said, not all mons were voted on and we decided out on what we thought was more relevant for the current slate, with that being said, the list of mons voted can be found below:

the list we voted on

Abomasnow
Among us
Articuno-Galar
Azelf
Bronzong
Chandelure
Chansey
Chesnaught
Crawdaunt
Cyclizar
Diancie
Fezandipiti
Golurk
Goodra-hisui
Gyarados
Hippowdon
Indeedee
Kleavor
Kingdra
Lycanroc-Dusk
Magnezone
Mienshao
Munkidori
Noivern
Oricorio-pompom
Politoed
Raikou
Reuniclus
Rotom-Heat
Rhyperior
Salazzle
Scream Tail
Slither Wing
Slowbro
Suicune
Toxicroak
Umbreon
Vileplume
Volcanion
Wo-Chien
Zapdos-G
Zoroark-H

Rhyperior

-> A

Rises

A -> S
A -> A+
A- -> A
C+ -> B
B+ -> A-
B- -> B+
B- -> B
(aaaaa) UR -> C

Drops

A+ -> A
A- -> B+
B -> B-
B -> C+
C+ -> C
C -> UR

 

[LBN]

New shifts, new meta. New VR noms? New gas. Let's begin.

-> A+
There should not be any contesting this one. Absolute peak breaker, solid speed tier; good ability, priority and knock utility, crazy power. Excellent abuser of tera fire; trailblaze adds some depth to its game, and its item flexibility is overstated slightly. It really wants boots; but stuff like Earth Plate, Loaded dice and Icicle plate are all excellent options too. Very hard to switch into breaker just straight quality and questionably broken.

-> B+/B
So when I was compiling the usage stats for week 4 from RUBD i saw maushold-family of four at 1 use. I was like ah someone felt like being funny with the family; how many uses has family of 3 got? Oh. Oh it hasn't been used atall. And then I kinda realized just how crusty this thing feels lately. Helmets are better than ever with Gapdos in S rank, Yanmega was its best partner and he's been banished to hell so the tidy up utility is not appreciated as much on HOs, and offensive teams struggle to juggle it with stuff like Chesnaught, G-Weezing, Registeel, Bisharp, helmet slowbros and just alot of things just stuff it entirely. It's not bad, but A- material with a staggering 1 use 1 loss in RUBD is crazy. Ya'll dropped mienshao for not getting use so lets send these rats back down.

-> B
Breloom has actually been seeing some good success lately. Poison heal sets; both offensive with SD facade and bulky with leech seed have been seeing solid usage in both circuit and RUBD, and its qualities are quite apparent. Tera Normal facade is fucking nuclear; like 80% to fezandipiti unboosted power. The status immunity is nice for status bots and the defensive typing has some merit from things like krook stabs. It's quite good, and the niche it brings is worthy of B rank

-> C
Meet budget Thundurus. People have learned from Gapdos that flying stab is very nice in the tier and Torn does that with a bolstered speed tier and solid utility. Honestly its just a rehashing of its role in SS, but with more powercreep. Rhyperior dropping is unfortunate but teching grass knot just melts it. Tera flying is an excellent way to muscle past balances and knocking steels is always a valuable role to fill. Its just budget thundurus and I think that sales pitch alone is enough to get it ranked. Give it a shot; it's good.

-> B-
Shifts have not been kind to glowbro lately. And that's good because this thing has been okidogi cope for its entire tenure in the tier so good riddance! Honestly its just not impressing me for B+. Rhyperior dropping is a kick in the ribs but Mamoswine dropping is bashing its head into the nearest sidewalk. Just use regular slowbro guys the time for coping that okidogi was actually balanced has long since past; as has its use case.

-> B
Is this a safe space? Can I call talonflame dogshit without crucifixion? Who cares I'm gonna do it anyway, Talonflame is hot steaming ass and I'm tired of pretending this thing is good hazard removal or a good check to anything. And if its not hazard removal why am I using it? It doesn't check mamoswine.. like at all, Gapdos is praying your opponent stepped under a ladder that sunday otherwise you explode and emergency wisp is not exactly something im drooling to put on my team when I can just use Noivern like normal people.
Once people lock in and start using lunar dance cress + gapdos this thing can go to B- too...

-> B+
Yknow I think i do this alot huh. Forget CM, that shit isn't horrible but it loses too many games to be that effective. Now, Lunar Dance Helmet Twave? Now we're talking. This thing is unironically the best mamoswine check in the tier, knock bounces off and icicle crash isn't a problem when your faster either, and that's just the beginning. Lunar dance + Zapdos-Galar is a combination that eyes the geneva convention like its a suggestion and the beneficiaries dont end there. Suicune, Volcanion, Bisharp. Obscenely dangerous pokemon that giving a 2nd breath of life to can be game changing. "But why not Gardevoir". Sure, but then you're giving up the defensive utility. Cress can realistically take any 1 hit from almost everything in the tier, even stuff as strong as Specs H-Zoro shadow ball tops out at 86% and zoro gets ohkod by a twave for its attempt.

DD mence gets abused, Mamoswine doesn't know what the hells going on, Gapdos kills itself on the way out and trading a cress for their gapdos is an incredible deal in most cases anyways. I know I nom cress quite often but this time its different; mamoswine's presence has made this thing noticeably more valuable as a defensive piece and twave support is always helpful. Sure its slightly passive into things like Bisharp or PomPom but god forbid pokemon have flaws. It's a consistent in and out game performer and if you listen to anything i've said in this point let it be this: Try this thing out. Support Helmet Cress, Scarf Gapdos, Specs H-zoro + 3 and watch the magic happen.


Two side notes though. 1, Kleavor is still marked as B rank despite it dropping last shift. 2. I remember when I said something along the lines of "cut the shit with the memes, or atleast standardize the PMD sprites". What I didn't say was keep the memes and then just go back to the ugliest sprites on offer. Sure amoonguss may finally be getting called its actual name but H-Zoroark is an ariados this time and I still have yet to crack a smile.

 

[MC Squared]

New shifts, new meta. New VR noms? New gas. Let's begin.

-> A+
There should not be any contesting this one. Absolute peak breaker, solid speed tier; good ability, priority and knock utility, crazy power. Excellent abuser of tera fire; trailblaze adds some depth to its game, and its item flexibility is overstated slightly. It really wants boots; but stuff like Earth Plate, Loaded dice and Icicle plate are all excellent options too. Very hard to switch into breaker just straight quality and questionably broken.

-> B+/B
So when I was compiling the usage stats for week 4 from RUBD i saw maushold-family of four at 1 use. I was like ah someone felt like being funny with the family; how many uses has family of 3 got? Oh. Oh it hasn't been used atall. And then I kinda realized just how crusty this thing feels lately. Helmets are better than ever with Gapdos in S rank, Yanmega was its best partner and he's been banished to hell so the tidy up utility is not appreciated as much on HOs, and offensive teams struggle to juggle it with stuff like Chesnaught, G-Weezing, Registeel, Bisharp, helmet slowbros and just alot of things just stuff it entirely. It's not bad, but A- material with a staggering 1 use 1 loss in RUBD is crazy. Ya'll dropped mienshao for not getting use so lets send these rats back down.

-> B
Breloom has actually been seeing some good success lately. Poison heal sets; both offensive with SD facade and bulky with leech seed have been seeing solid usage in both circuit and RUBD, and its qualities are quite apparent. Tera Normal facade is fucking nuclear; like 80% to fezandipiti unboosted power. The status immunity is nice for status bots and the defensive typing has some merit from things like krook stabs. It's quite good, and the niche it brings is worthy of B rank

-> C
Meet budget Thundurus. People have learned from Gapdos that flying stab is very nice in the tier and Torn does that with a bolstered speed tier and solid utility. Honestly its just a rehashing of its role in SS, but with more powercreep. Rhyperior dropping is unfortunate but teching grass knot just melts it. Tera flying is an excellent way to muscle past balances and knocking steels is always a valuable role to fill. Its just budget thundurus and I think that sales pitch alone is enough to get it ranked. Give it a shot; it's good.

-> B-
Shifts have not been kind to glowbro lately. And that's good because this thing has been okidogi cope for its entire tenure in the tier so good riddance! Honestly its just not impressing me for B+. Rhyperior dropping is a kick in the ribs but Mamoswine dropping is bashing its head into the nearest sidewalk. Just use regular slowbro guys the time for coping that okidogi was actually balanced has long since past; as has its use case.

-> B
Is this a safe space? Can I call talonflame dogshit without crucifixion? Who cares I'm gonna do it anyway, Talonflame is hot steaming ass and I'm tired of pretending this thing is good hazard removal or a good check to anything. And if its not hazard removal why am I using it? It doesn't check mamoswine.. like at all, Gapdos is praying your opponent stepped under a ladder that sunday otherwise you explode and emergency wisp is not exactly something im drooling to put on my team when I can just use Noivern like normal people.
Once people lock in and start using lunar dance cress + gapdos this thing can go to B- too...

-> B+
Yknow I think i do this alot huh. Forget CM, that shit isn't horrible but it loses too many games to be that effective. Now, Lunar Dance Helmet Twave? Now we're talking. This thing is unironically the best mamoswine check in the tier, knock bounces off and icicle crash isn't a problem when your faster either, and that's just the beginning. Lunar dance + Zapdos-Galar is a combination that eyes the geneva convention like its a suggestion and the beneficiaries dont end there. Suicune, Volcanion, Bisharp. Obscenely dangerous pokemon that giving a 2nd breath of life to can be game changing. "But why not Gardevoir". Sure, but then you're giving up the defensive utility. Cress can realistically take any 1 hit from almost everything in the tier, even stuff as strong as Specs H-Zoro shadow ball tops out at 86% and zoro gets ohkod by a twave for its attempt.

DD mence gets abused, Mamoswine doesn't know what the hells going on, Gapdos kills itself on the way out and trading a cress for their gapdos is an incredible deal in most cases anyways. I know I nom cress quite often but this time its different; mamoswine's presence has made this thing noticeably more valuable as a defensive piece and twave support is always helpful. Sure its slightly passive into things like Bisharp or PomPom but god forbid pokemon have flaws. It's a consistent in and out game performer and if you listen to anything i've said in this point let it be this: Try this thing out. Support Helmet Cress, Scarf Gapdos, Specs H-zoro + 3 and watch the magic happen.


Two side notes though. 1, Kleavor is still marked as B rank despite it dropping last shift. 2. I remember when I said something along the lines of "cut the shit with the memes, or atleast standardize the PMD sprites". What I didn't say was keep the memes and then just go back to the ugliest sprites on offer. Sure amoonguss may finally be getting called its actual name but H-Zoroark is an ariados this time and I still have yet to crack a smile.

So based on this it looks like Mamoswine may be on the chopping block after Yanmega

 

[Feliburn]

I don't think I've made a VR post in about 7 years, but I have some insights to share. I know people know me as the guy who preaches mons nobody uses, but I hope they realize there's an actual level of seriousness in this post.

I have never really been one to talk about Forretress much. I know people know I like the mon but last time I actively used it in builds was last year before the big DLC shifts. It's a mon with a lot of utility being able to check Bisharp & Mimikyu, and now the newly dropped Mamoswine. I've faced it a lot on ladder and it's actually really annoying to remove if you have a team with like Hippo/Krook as your rocker, since this mon gets them up vs you, and has Pain Split to trade with these mons. I didn't really care before what people thought of it but I'm seeing it in the blacklisted rank and I think this is a bit too much.

For proof, the winner of the last 2 RU circuit tours & finalist of the RU Circuit Playoffs Guille is also an avid Forre user, and he has showcased how annoying it can be when you manage to build a good team with it. I also used it in the last RUBD week but I don't think that's enough proof to get it ranked by itself. I think this mon deserves a chance to be ranked. I'm thinking C+/B- to start but I don't really care as long as it can be removed from D rank.

Another mon I think is being done dirty. This mon is similar to Regi in that it can do some IronPress stuff as a rocker, but with an added weakness to Knock Off & Ground immunity. However, Bronzong also has access to Psychic Noise, which I think can be amazing when dealing with stuff like Slowbro, Reuniclus (you can creep these to always be faster, just gotta be careful about Cloak sets) or Fighting Types in general (it was cooler back when Okidogi was in the tier) since you are no longer as passive as Registeel if you are able to prevent recovery of a free switch in once to halt any momentum the opponent might have. I also think there's value now that Mamoswine is in the tier, as you can better handle choice locked Mamoswine by being immune to EQ and resisting ice stabs. Life Orb is bad for you since it can Knock Off, but it's a good alternative if paired with like a Protect mon to scout against CB.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen9ru-810667 latest replay I got with it, nothing too crazy but it was able to Psychic Noise the Weezing to keep it low for Wo-Chien to not struggle vs it. Also could have gotten another psynoise vs zapdos but it got crit.

I know people are Slowbro pilled but I can't believe Entei is ranked lower than Slowbro-G, Ribombee & Vaporeon. Entei has been seeing more usage lately, and for a good reason. Spreading burns on Hippo/Slowbro/Rhyperior is actually huge, and you also have a strong priority in Extremespeed to serve as a revenge killer. You got coverage for Talonflame/Noivern/Volcanion and you can even run Crunch on CB sets to 2HKO Slowbro if you really need to (idk how fast ppl are going with bro but they dont run max max). It's also such a good insurance into Bisharp, Mimikyu & Armarouge since you are faster, you threaten with a super effective move (or sacred fire burn vs Mimikyu) and you still have priority to outplay tera'd sucker, or endure Arma.

I've used a lot of Entei in recent times, but I also know TheFranklin likes it, as seen by his circuit finals team with Entei.

I don't feel as strongly about other mons, but I feel like Rotom-Heat is a bit better than B- (probs more than a bit in Mamo meta but it was already better before) and Quagsire is also a mon I'd place a bit higher since I don't think it's as mid as the B- mons.

 

[MC Squared]

I don't think I've made a VR post in about 7 years, but I have some insights to share. I know people know me as the guy who preaches mons nobody uses, but I hope they realize there's an actual level of seriousness in this post.

I have never really been one to talk about Forretress much. I know people know I like the mon but last time I actively used it in builds was last year before the big DLC shifts. It's a mon with a lot of utility being able to check Bisharp & Mimikyu, and now the newly dropped Mamoswine. I've faced it a lot on ladder and it's actually really annoying to remove if you have a team with like Hippo/Krook as your rocker, since this mon gets them up vs you, and has Pain Split to trade with these mons. I didn't really care before what people thought of it but I'm seeing it in the blacklisted rank and I think this is a bit too much.

For proof, the winner of the last 2 RU circuit tours & finalist of the RU Circuit Playoffs Guille is also an avid Forre user, and he has showcased how annoying it can be when you manage to build a good team with it. I also used it in the last RUBD week but I don't think that's enough proof to get it ranked by itself. I think this mon deserves a chance to be ranked. I'm thinking C+/B- to start but I don't really care as long as it can be removed from D rank.

Another mon I think is being done dirty. This mon is similar to Regi in that it can do some IronPress stuff as a rocker, but with an added weakness to Knock Off & Ground immunity. However, Bronzong also has access to Psychic Noise, which I think can be amazing when dealing with stuff like Slowbro, Reuniclus (you can creep these to always be faster, just gotta be careful about Cloak sets) or Fighting Types in general (it was cooler back when Okidogi was in the tier) since you are no longer as passive as Registeel if you are able to prevent recovery of a free switch in once to halt any momentum the opponent might have. I also think there's value now that Mamoswine is in the tier, as you can better handle choice locked Mamoswine by being immune to EQ and resisting ice stabs. Life Orb is bad for you since it can Knock Off, but it's a good alternative if paired with like a Protect mon to scout against CB.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen9ru-810667 latest replay I got with it, nothing too crazy but it was able to Psychic Noise the Weezing to keep it low for Wo-Chien to not struggle vs it. Also could have gotten another psynoise vs zapdos but it got crit.

I know people are Slowbro pilled but I can't believe Entei is ranked lower than Slowbro-G, Ribombee & Vaporeon. Entei has been seeing more usage lately, and for a good reason. Spreading burns on Hippo/Slowbro/Rhyperior is actually huge, and you also have a strong priority in Extremespeed to serve as a revenge killer. You got coverage for Talonflame/Noivern/Volcanion and you can even run Crunch on CB sets to 2HKO Slowbro if you really need to (idk how fast ppl are going with bro but they dont run max max). It's also such a good insurance into Bisharp, Mimikyu & Armarouge since you are faster, you threaten with a super effective move (or sacred fire burn vs Mimikyu) and you still have priority to outplay tera'd sucker, or endure Arma.

I've used a lot of Entei in recent times, but I also know TheFranklin likes it, as seen by his circuit finals team with Entei.

I don't feel as strongly about other mons, but I feel like Rotom-Heat is a bit better than B- (probs more than a bit in Mamo meta but it was already better before) and Quagsire is also a mon I'd place a bit higher since I don't think it's as mid as the B- mons.

I may be tripping but you were RU leader before right

 

[Feliburn]

I may be tripping but you were RU leader before right

that's me yeah

 

[MC Squared]

that's me yeah

Run for leader again I'll vote for you lol

 

[Elec-ant1234]

A bit of a long one, so I'll try to keep some of these shorter.

Mamoswine -> A+
Fantastic breaker, with honestly a pretty wide range of at least usable items, completely unresisted stabs aside from very niche counterpicks, and the a resistance/neutrality to both fire and ice moves, allowing even more switch in opportunities. Has it's weaknesses, but overall a very well rounded Mon that does good into pretty much everything.

Lucario- C -> B- / C+
Lucario honestly does better as a mixed attacker then a physical one right now. I think that while LORB Extreme Speed on an SD set seems good on paper, in practice it's hard to actually get the set working how you want it to, like I'll be honest if I want a lategame cleaner that out speeds most things in the metagame with a good stab spammable stab combo then I'm just picking gapdos. But, all in all, +2 Tera Normal LORB kills like most things in the tier that don't outright resist or are immune to Lucario's stabs. The big issue then is preserving Lucario and not letting em be knocked a single time, but that's doable. However, I feel like a mixed set like
Lucario @ Shuca Berry
Ability: Inner Focus
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 80 Atk / 236 SpA / 192 Spe
Naive Nature
- Close Combat
- Flash Cannon
- Shadow Ball
- Nasty Plot
could be pretty good, you've got your stabs, and shadow Ball to kill the ghosts and particularly basc-F who can switch into your CCs. I chose this specifically since the idea behind this set was to kill Mamoswine in a pinch and demolish most other things in the tier. I didn't wanna go ALL in on special attack since at that point you get walked by SpD Hoodra, so CC it was, and you can boost up and force a tera on mons like Fez since Nasty Plot makes all your moves deal some pretty solid damage.
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ru-2275275044
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ru-2276721407 Vs. Feliburn, where I lose due to not calcing Lucario CC into Waterfall (which wouldn't have killed I later discovered), but the set generally does pretty well into the rest of his team, almost being able to kill the Gyarados but sadly due to my choke it was unable to. Note the fact it lived +1 EQ from gyara, does the same with unboosted mamoswine EQ too
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ru-2277716246-fdboh6rqsewjxw4o4bwy5pe485npx7kpw Lucario demolishes the opposing team, barely missing the rhyp OHKO with flash cannon, and showing another good MU into Armarogue, in which you're able to just kill em and click buttons
(+2 236 SpA Lucario Flash Cannon vs. 252 HP / 196 SpD Solid Rock Rhyperior: 432-508 (99.5 - 117%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO)

TLDR, I think that Lucario is VERY unrated right now and can serve as a pretty good offensive breaker in the meta rn, with a great stab combo, pretty good typing, and the ability to run a plethora of options to cover its weaknesses

Ditto- C+ -> B-
Not much to say here, Ditto has been picking up lately and I'd say that while I would prefer it to be a C++ Mon instead of a B- which visually looks way too high, I'd say that ditto is just kinda good as an anti-HO Mon and an anti-sweeper Mon too, and while it fits primarily on Ditto-Stall teams (as the centerpiece guy), I would think he could also fit on like very passive BO or balance teams, and maybe even HO teams to be able to have some counterplay vs. opposing HO teams. Just theorymonning though, still a very weird Mon that realistically is staying at C+ due to general nicheness and lack of tourny reps.

Gallade- B- -> B
Genuinely a goated slow-ish breaker, like with a single boost this guy is taking names, souls, and bank accounts in broad daylight, it's absolute highway robbery what this guy can get away with. I get that now 80 speed is suddenly like the thing to beat with Mamo dropping, and you do run the risk of getting murdered by Mamo, but you do have some genuinely insane calcs you can get, and with one of your stabs not even making contact with talon you have less of a risk of getting burned, this guy should be WAY higher, even if the speed thing is an issue at times. I'd go out on a limb and say that this guy is like super good vs. slower, more passive teams and should be considered for more playstyle and teams and shouldn't just be locked into the HO webs teams that people usually default Gallade to. Could this be Gallades future? Honestly not sure, but I feel like it's way better then the other guys in B-.

Palossand- B- -> C+/C
With the expansion of hazard removal from being purely Cyclizar, his importance and niche has been diminished, like you still spinblock well, and that niche is functionally the same but with Mamo dropping, Volcanion doing better, and Noivern, Geezing, and Talonflames's rises in popularity, it just doesn't have what it used to have. Still able to be a fat wall, but with way more ways for teams to take it out/invalidate it.

Espeon- B- -> C+
Espeon just kinda... Isn't that good? Like it's got a real valuable niche on weather teams for acting as your "hazard control", especially on snow teams with eject button sets... but other then that, with no real spammable stabs and no access to fast boosting options, you're kinda just outclassed by other CM sweepers, and outdamaged by faster mons of similar speed tiers.

Slowbro-Galar- B+ -> B
I'd say that Glowbro still is good in specific situations, specifically stall teams as a regen Mon with toxic, but overall is threatened by a lot of the meta, especially Mamo. Regardless an interesting sidegrade to Slowbro that isn't completely up the creek.

Porygon-Z- B -> B+
A pretty good HO Mon that I'd say has real potential to be considered on both HO teams and regular teams. Download lets you achieve absurd numbers, and agility lets you outspeed a crazy amount of mons, even gapdos.
ALSO
please for the love of god use expert belt, hdb is not that good.
With Expert Belt you can OHKO cyclizar with +1 Ice Beam, gives you a 25% chance to OHKO Necrozma with Shadow Ball, and generally lets you nuke anything you have coverage for.

+1 252+ SpA Expert Belt Porygon-Z Shadow Ball vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Prism Armor Necrozma: 293-346 (87.4 - 103.2%) -- 25% chance to OHKO
+1 252+ SpA Expert Belt Porygon-Z Ice Beam vs. 104 HP / 152 SpD Assault Vest Cyclizar: 307-362 (100 - 117.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+1 252+ SpA Expert Belt Tera Ground Porygon-Z Tera Blast (80 BP) vs. 120 HP / 56+ SpD Goodra-Hisui: 324-384 (97.8 - 116%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO

+1 252+ SpA Expert Belt Tera Ground Porygon-Z Ice Beam vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Zapdos-Galar: 434-511 (135.2 - 159.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO

(they don't even OHKO you with CC or brave bird so you could just gamble and set up agility anyways on Gapdos)
252 Atk Zapdos-Galar Brave Bird vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tera Ground Porygon-Z: 255-301 (81.9 - 96.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ SpA Expert Belt Tera Ground Porygon-Z Ice Beam vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Zapdos-Galar: 290-343 (90.3 - 106.8%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO


Porygon-Z @ Expert Belt
Ability: Download
Tera Type: Ground
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Agility
- Tera Blast
- Ice Beam
- Shadow Ball
just use this and kill everyone

like you have to think a negligible amount on who to come in on, but you can just turn off your brain and win games it's dummy simple. HDB only matters for non HO teams, and even then with good positioning and the proper gamestate you really don't need to come in more than once, cause that one time you come in you win. Use expert belt and all your dreams will come true

Slowbro- S -> A+
Not really as good as Gapdos is my reasoning. Still a great mon, with both the future sight thunder wave set and CM set both being great, but just not as good rn. Amazing physical wall, just under a lotta pressure and not up to the same stuff as Gapdos.

Talonflame- B+ -> B+
I'd argue against LBN here, I still think a defogger with access to burn is good. It is able to find defog opportunities pretty well, and the ability to cripple setup sweepers and physical attackers is great, especially in conjunction with Quagsire, like I think these two pair amazingly. You can burn say, a Terrakion on an SD, and switch out safely into Quag. It's honestly not complete dogshit like how he would have you believe, and I think that it's ability to mitigate damage for its team and punish random physical attackers is great. Unlike how LBN would have you believe, Noivern and Talon actually don't overlap as harshly as you'd expect and they occupy very different defogger spaces in my mind, with Talonflame being the more defensive and safer vs. Bisharp pick, and Noivern for the more offensive teams for when you also need to pack on a Volc counter. (also noivern also doesn't check Mamo why are you offering it like it can, at least talon can burn mamo)

Hippowdon- A -> A+
Absolutely murders the physical attackers of the tier, and has plenty of amazing matchups into the various top dogs of RU (except for the actual dogs of RU, Entei, Suicune, Raikou, the bunch.). Sandstorm helps out with passive damage into HO teams, so even while you're being hammered and staying passive you're still doing damage, NOT TO MENTION that it breaks focus sashes and blows past Armarogue Endure, so you can play more offensively into HO with Hippo, you have a great (if kinda luck reliant) MU into Bisharp, with stone edge/Rock slide being able to cover most defensive teras, loads of longevity, and the ability to take 36% from Gapdos on a BB switch-in. Genuine GOAT of a mon. Amazing into most leads too, and tera can make em stick around even longer (additional points for not being tera reliant at all times)


Terrakion- A- -> B+
Still a good HO lead, but bros kinda fallen off ngl. Cool that he's a fast offensive rocker with good stab combo and coverage but like what does he do, I genuinely haven't seen a convincing argument or showcase of the guy in like forever

Reuniclus- A- -> B+
Fallen off CM sweeper, HOWEVER there might be remaining tech in AV sets, so it might not be fully over. Might be partially over though.
Outclassed by Suicune and Slowbro, with very limited coverage, but at the very least good abilities.

Breloom- B- -> B
Ditto what LBN said, very cool Mon with the extremely unique Poison Heal ability which lets it absolutely DEMOLISH bulky / passive teams with a leechtect set. Very nice, very cool.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ru-2272709561-gnil483kxdq5pmyx7pm8xv4hbw7qa4mpw?p2
Breloom essentially 6-0's a (very suboptimal) stall team thanks to Toxic Orb + Leech Seed leading to an insane amount of healing for just one Mon, allowing you to essentially ignore hazards and passive damage, the two things stall needs to win.

Bellibolt- B- -> B
I'd say Bellibolt sadly isn't entirely there yet, but the main set I propose people try out is this...

Bellibolt @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Static
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Discharge
- Slack Off
- Muddy Water
- Toxic

For one, you have the option to essentially cheese your way outta any bad physical attacker MU, but on the other hand you also can very easily just sit on a lotta stuff, like you are still just Bellibolt, and cause of that you can very easily play for time, toxic switch-ins, and spam muddy water if you don't know what else to do to play for a miss and para-centric wincon.

The main thing this set counters is Gapdos, which is why I would like to see this guy higher up. If Palossand could get B+ before just for walling Cyclizar well and spinblocking, I'd say that Bellibolt with it's ability to cripple Gapdos, and naturally resist one of Gapdos's stronger stab options also deserves to be near that same echelon.

Forretress- D -> C-

Pretty much what Feliburn said above.
Forretress in my eyes is better used less as a jack-of-all-trades where you try to put as much on as possible, but better used as a hazard removal options with a lotta free moveslots. You don't really want to put EVERYTHING on this guy, as that just gets you a mon that's mid at everything, but instead you probably just wanna play towards it's strengths as a physically bulky rapid spinner that isn't avalugg. Like, that in an of itself is its niche. It's got every hazard and pivoting, so all you need is rapid spin, body press, pain split (so you can actually stick around) and like either volt switch or a hazard, that right there gives you all you need. You do have options with replacing pain split with like maybe t-wave, but overall I'd say that forre, along with solid usage by respected top players and the stuff said here and above, definitely deserves to be unbanned from the discussion lock and moved to the next closest spot of C-.



Also I want to say that I think that the PMD sprite or, at the moment, the regular SM sprites are fine. I think it's actually ok if we have fun with our VR, and that even if one specific guy doesn't like it, it should be kept as it not only gives our VR an identity, it also just looks fun. I did it with Gallade and Ditto, and it's not really the end of the world if sprites are used to represent mons, nor is it a crime to have little jokes with them, either.


anyways like and subscribe to the RU YouTube channel for no other reason than they cool

 

[haunted paper]

A- -> B+

At first, I was on board with this, but now I am not. Umbreon might not be B+ material. Sorry to disagree with ya council on this decision right after it has been made.
B+ -> A-/A rank - Yes, Umbreon is weak to Zapdos-G and Slither Wing while being seemingly passive. In actuality though, Umbreon can rely on tera (if available) to emergency check both mons, and is not so passive as people might think. 95/110/130 bulk is really good, allowing Umbreon to live a vast amount of attacks from and dish out foul play or toxic. Rhyperior SD sets not running max speed risk getting 2HKO'd, DD Gyarados easily gets OHKO'd after rocks but also deals only 44-53% back with waterfall or 59-70% with tera blast flying against 4 EV defense Umbreon, most special attackers (Armarouge especially) struggles against Umbreon and don't handle foul play that well.

The only 2 mons that beat Umbreon down regardless of tera would be Weezing-G and Fezandipiti.

 

[Heatranator]

I was going to delay a VR post until a suspect happened, but doesn't look like its going to be happening yet, so I'll make my post now (watch a suspect drop a few days after I make this post)

-> A/A+
Yeah, surprise, surprise, mamo is top tier. Amazing breaker that can run a variety of sets from a lead set with endeavour, to CB, to loaded dice, to LO, basically it can run any item it wants (I bet AV could even work because fuck it). Has priority too to pick off faster foes. Idt this has to be explained much, broken mon, so up high it goes.

C -> B-/B
Yeah, that's right, I think bronzong is as good as bellibolt or gastrodon. With mamoswine in the tier, physically defensive bronzong is one of the sturdier checks to it in the tier, as its not immediately threatened by it. It can even take a few knock offs if needed, and mamoswine doesn't want to stay in to take a powerful body press. From here, bronzong can set up rocks to make guarenteed progress, as both cyclizar and geezing don't really want to take it on. It also completely walls a lot of pokemon such as gastrodon, quagsire, rhyperior and dd mence. Bronzong's last moveslot is quite customisable, with trick+toxic orb crippling most threats, heavy slam doing well into fezandipiti and forcing it to tera, iron defense can make you a pretty great wincon late game, night shade can deal consistent damage to targets and future sight can set up some combos with teammates. This mon is honestly really good rn, and I think it deserves to go much higher.

B -> B+
Okay, raikou is probably one of the best electric types rn, and its not hard to see why. Its access to scald makes sure ground types don't want to block its volt switch. This means it can effectively get free volt switches, with only a few things such as amoonguss, cyclizar and kilowattrel stopping it. Its access to aura sphere means it can smack cyclizar and hoodra decently hard as well. I personally think that pivot sets are best for there ability to chip down its checks and get in other breakers safely, but subcm can also be good as it demolishes some bulkier teams that rely on status damage and pokemon such as umbreon to beat setup sweepers.

B- -> B
Gallade is probably one of the better pure wallbreakers in the tier, and probably deserves a raise. Fatter teams HATE this mon, as it simply has extremely limited counters, and usually has to dedicate tera just to try to stop it. It has two sets mainly, SD and agility. SD goes all in on the breaking power, meaning that this pokemon has no switchins at all. Agility trades its wallbreaking power for the ability to outspeed offensive threats, which can be amazing against more offensive teams. Gallade also has a decent amount of utility if you decide not to go for the setup route. Will-o-wisp can be a safe button to click that cripples pokemon such as tera bisharp who try to be funny by changing type, knock off can hit armarouge decently hard while helping it wallbreak, encore can further cripple defensive mons that try to heal and shadow sneak can pick off low health targets quite easily. Genuinely decent mon that should probably rise.

B- -> C+
When was the last time you saw these in high level play, or in fact in any level of play? Regidrago looks like it can be great (heck, when I joined the tier, I thought it was goated), but it requires way too much support to get going. Needs hazards to be off at all times, needs steel/fairy types to be dealt with and needs free switchins from teammates. That's a lot of support, and if you ain't running specs, that support isn't worth it. And if you want a good wallbreaker that needs support, just use crawdaunt or gallade. They have other things like crawdaunt having priority and gallade being able to switch in against some special threats. Not much reason to keep it in B-.
And oh boi, infernape. The potential man himself. I'm not even going to talk about physical sets because we have 5 other fighting types that do it better. So you have to go special. NP sets have big moveset constraints with wanting to fit all of fire blast, aura sphere, g-knot and vacuum wave onto the moveset, which is constraining as hell. If you don't have aura sphere, then cyclizar and hoodra can take your hits and fire back. If you don't have vacuum wave, then faster pokemon pick you off easily. And if you don't have grass knot, then lots of water types just kill you (slowbro uses you as a setup opportunity). No matter what moveset it uses though, the dragon flyings in noivern and salamence just screw it over. Specs sets are probably where infernape is the best, but still have there drawbacks. You have to use overheat to deal significant damage to things, which means something else can come in and use you as setup fodder. And of course, the choice lock is never going to be good as something is going to be setting up on you. If you aura sphere to catch a cyclizar switching in, golurk gets to click a free button. You click grass knot to catch a slowbro, and now bisharp decides to SD on your face.
Oh, also infernape gives armarouge free setup opportunities every time, so that's a really bad thing.

C -> UR

 

[szsx]

Amoonguss: b+-a/a-
Amoonguss is pretty good stall who Can use giga drain/synthesis for recovery toxic to whittle opponents down and foul play to mess up physical setup sweepers

 

[Ampha]

Hey everyone, another VR update, sorry on the unfort delay, we had some problems w votes delaying things but here it is, short one this time

the list we voted on

Breloom
Bronzong
Cresselia
Ditto
Entei
Espeon
Gallade
Hippowdon
Lucario
Mamoswine
Maushold
Palossand
Porygon Z
Reuniclus
Slowbro
Slowbro-Galar
Terrakion
Tornadus

Mamoswine

A+

rises

B-> B+
C+ -> B-
C-> C+
UR -> C

drops

B- -> C
B- -> C+
S -> A+
B+ -> B-

 

[LBN]

well I'm happy people have seen the light on cress but idk how i feel about waiting 1 and a half months for a shift w only 8/19 changes.. well, Guess It's My Turn. I been wanting to make another for about 2 weeks but thats how long the slates been going for so i waited...

-> C
Since this nom somehow got not accepted in the slate I slammed this last time, I'll be doing it again. (by the way, I think turning down stuff in the slate is fine; but if your going to cut it to size for saving time and then still push these out at a snails pace, I think you should accept as many as reasonably possible. If somebody noms Houndoom to C+ then sure skip and laugh at them but if its a reasonable enough pitch then idt you should exclude anything) This shit is not B- period. Mind you it's not bad and again I'd never UR this thing because we know what it does; its that what it does is not required on every HO to succeed. It's the defining spikes lead for HO but like... that's not a role suited for B- it a role for C rank and MAYBE C+

-> B+ / B
Another Mamoswine check I put in high regards. This thing is quite nice, and I've actually been using it on some sinful comps... Webs. Not Webs HO, but webs on bulky offenses / balances. The biggest weakness webs has as a button is how much it emboldens Bisharp to become a monster, and whats a better way to screw with that while also adding spikes utility? Big Quag. Gapdos check, Bisharp check, Mamo check, Bisharp counter, you get the picture. I think B is just a low placement for it atm and I think its better than alot of the stuff sitting in B- atm

-> C
This may be a sharp drop from its currently overranked B placement but frankly can we be serious for a minute here; what is kleavors role that's worth pursing? From what I've tried to pitch it in my own head for; its an offensive rock setup breaker that doesnt struggle vs slowbro compared to say, Terrakion. But to that I ask why thats even valuable in the first place. It already has crazy hard 4MSS. Stone axe and SD are mandatory; then you want X-scissor for Slowbro and stuff like Chesnaught, but you also need CC for steels and then you really want Trailblaze to actually win games because that speed tier is not it for a mon that just ignores the idea of having a defensive profile. It's in an awkward middle ground where no; its not slow but its also far too slow for a mon this frail and susceptible to death. And more than that, we have Terrakion, Duskroc, and Rhyperior as better rock types than this thing even if they go about things differently. B-But ma stone axe! WHO CARES. Even in the lead slot for HO; Terrakion and Dawnroc are superior. This thing is higher than gallade and that mon puts in all star performances every time it shows up can we be honest here. We sent craw to B- for being outclassed as shit we can do it for Kleavor too.

-> C+
I feel as though this thing has disappeared lately. The prevalence of knock protect H-Goodra has made the appeal of NPSplit Mowtom more cumbered; which was its main niche. As far as electrics are concerned its lower in the rung, Raikou is better as a fast electric and Aura sphere helps with both Cyclizar and H-Goodra; both of which Mowtom hates. As for actual appearances, checking RUBD usage stats saw it used.. twice with no wins. Obviously thats not a death nail; but like it proves my point that just.. nobody uses this anymore. It got ranked at its peak hype in RUPL and thats becoming more and more like a very long time ago. Time has passed and the job it does is less valuable.

-> B / B-
Speaking of niches not worth pursuing, meet mediocrity! Strictly speaking; that height of B+ was the peak of yanmega cope; its best job is forcing a PP stall stalemate vs Volcanion and Suicune when i can just load gastrodon and get layers up instead. "But wish" I hear you say. Sure, wish is valuable but I can get that elsewhere from better. Umbreon and Jirachi are both excellent mons with more coveted typings in the builder and also provide further utility like toxic or encore. If water absorb is that much of a prize, we have volcanion itself for that and the aforementioned Gastrodon.

Make the sprite blue I have no other comments blue gastrodon is abundantly clear

-> A-
I think this thing has been proving itself quite well lately as a wincon for both offense and HO. It's checks are good; but they aren't something it can't outplay or change up with some tera flexibility. Revelation Dance is a goofy ass move in being basically tera blast but better, and I've seen cool stuff like Tera Steel for Umbreon toxic's while also killing Rhyperiors and Mamoswines on 2 attack roost variants. It's surprisingly adaptable and I think its more threatening than the current B+ crop

-> UR
Fringe mon on an even more fringe playstyle with the defensive utility of a Twinkie. Who ranked this shit

 

[Ampha]

Make the sprite blue I have no other comments blue gastrodon is abundantly clear

How do I even change it?

 

[Heatranator]

How do I even change it?

: pmd/gastrodon east: (without the space at the start ofc)