OU SPL XVI BW Discussion Thread

goldmason

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BW SPL Discussion and Hype thread!

Commencement Thread
Admin Thread
SPL XVI Hype Thread
Auction Results
Schedule

Predictions Contest

Starters (per PR Lineups):
Soulwind
Finchinator
MeEsSm
Monai
watashi
GarytheGengar
Sergio Aguero
Rewer
elodin
dice


SPL Commencement Video

Discuss away. Info will be updated here periodically.
 
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It's an absolute disgrace that some BW players are drafted while Cow is not.

Cow is excellent player and has helped me a lot during my BW tournaments, I've progressed in this tier thanks to him. He deserves much more credit and his undraft remains an absolute disgrace.
 
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It's an absolute disgrace that some BW players are drafted while Cow is not.

Cow is excellent player and has helped me a lot during my BW tournaments, I've progressed in this tier thanks to him. He deserves much more credit and his undraft remains an absolute disgrace.
i agree, who tf thought lets draft monai but we dont say that, thats rude. even monai deserves recognition at times. lets not try to bring other people down if we are praising others. good luck all. u will get them next year Cow
 
I am sad Cow did not get picked as someone who enjoys BW and wants to see tournaments like SPL move the metagame forward. Cow is a strong player and builder who has stood out to me among the crop of BW players. I respect Cow and think his future is bright in the tier. More opportunities will come and I cannot wait to see what he does with them. I also think it is admirable that Cow has not been complaining or claiming he is more deserving than others, but rather handling it on his own terms.

With this said, that doesn’t make people who were picked any less deserving. By definition, you are deserving if only one team/manager gives you a shot and there’s good reason why everyone got picked. Monai has worked hard to get his game back on track after a lackluster debut a few years back, Meessm has been grinding BW for months now while being one of the more intuitive team builders (he’s not a slouch in-battle either), Sergio just ran away with circuit despite facing stiff competition, Mars has strong showings nearly across the board to the point that multiple managers inquired with me about them, Q8 has been a beast in unofficial BW tours while being capable in RBY as well, Brine had a 6-1 BWPL while displaying good teambuilding that made them appealing support, and so on. There are a lot of passionate and talented players in the tournament. They have my respect and attention — hoping for a great season!
 
gutted im not playing but as a spectator im excited to watch. cant wait to see what direction the metagame takes this spl. goodluck all!
if it makes you feel any better, marsandnoob went undrafted in spl 14 (he'd be legit top 3 in that pool at that time imo, but nobody really knew him) and spl 15 (won gc 6 months earlier, this time it was criminal). this year, he did less and got drafted. the world spins, keep your head up oomfie.
 
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How about you stop sucking each others toes, and put in relevant enough results / reputation to get drafted?

Instead i see some people complaining why x wasnt drafted and y was.

There is no injustice if some1 isnt getting drafted. Its on you to be relevant enough, wheter you have to approach managers or not should not make a diffrence to you, and wheter thats enough isnt your buisness to decide.

Seriously "man up"
 
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The reality of the situation is: every year there's a clearly defined top 6 or so (who would actually be snubs to not get picked) and then 10+ people fighting over the remaining few slots. Who ends up in those slots depends on which managers the players have spoken to, and whether those managers get an opportunity to bid on a top 6 player, or whether they will look for you at 3-5k at the end of the draft.

I know Cow was rated very highly by several managers but sometimes they end up getting the opportunity to get an elodin, rewer, garythegengar or something. At the end of the draft the managers looking for a cheap BWer happened to favour Meessm, mars, q8, brine etc from that bracket. Thats all there is to it.

Cow = Meessm = brine = q8 = sergioaguero = wait2seconds (entirely unmentioned btw). Knowing all these guys p well I would say they are basically inseperable in skill level and picking between them is personal preference. Anyone in this bracket deserves to make it in, but if you know you're in that 7th-15th area of the BW pool then its not really in your hands. I am sure Cow and w2s will get their opportunities, either by benefitting from better fortune in the draft next time, or by stepping up and making themselves impossible to ignore.

Be annoyed about your friend not making it in, sure. But its not fair to insult the people you think undeserving just to make that point.
(Its also obviously unfair to bitterly make vague and baseless accusations about people who got drafted in an attempt to get them banned, fucking embarrassing)

----

Regardless, I am incredibly excited about this season of SPL, with tons of fresh faces in sergio aguero and meessm looking like new BW starters, then mars, q8, and brine being great bench/support options. I'm also interested to see what Finchinator can do returning to the tier after being slotted in other gens for the last couple years - when he's actively building fresh, his influence on the metagame is unrivalled so I'm excited to see what new innovations we can see brought to the table now the de facto top 3 (sw dice finch) are all competing
 
So let us go BWers,there is a word in Chinese called 内卷,means involution or intense internal competition to better enhance oneself,so i believe BW community will get more vitality and energy,and we will come back with a stronger self,me and Cow and lots of ppl,let’s go!
 
So let us go BWers,there is a word in Chinese called 内卷,means involution or intense internal competition to better enhance oneself,so i believe BW community will get more vitality and energy,and we will come back with a stronger self,me and Cow and lots of ppl,let’s go!
Mostly used for the former though :worrywhirl:
 
Week One Predicts!
GaryTheGengar vs Finchinator - i think finchinator's track record and consistency in the tier speaks for itself. gary has been away from bw for a while and finch has been actively playing bw.

Elodin vs Soulwind - i dont think this game is as clear cut as many think. i do think soulwind is clearly the favourite here but elodin is a top player and can certainly cause the "upset". soulwind's style is kind of predictable and i think elodin will have chances to exploit that in the builder and should aim too if he wants to make it happen

Monai vs Rewer - i was a quite torn when debating this mu. i dont think much really separates either of these players apart from the experience that rewer has in spl, compared to monai's quite lackluster debut. i hate using the phrase "could go either way" in predicts as duh obviously but i would not be surprised if monai came out of this matchup with a win here. definitely a sleeper match up thats one to watch.

Watashi vs Meessm - i promise im not just bolding everyone on the right side for fun. meessm debut and im confident he will do well not just this week but in this tournament too. knowing meessm pretty well, he just seems to constantly improve and i think we'll continue to see that. albeit i do think the adjustment to spl will be a bit of a shock to meessm, playing someone who he has already played and won vs in tour previously last year should help settle his nerves if he has any and im confident we'll see meessm grab a win here. i also think watashi's consistency issues will play a part in this matchup.

GaryTheGengar vs Finchinator
elodin vs Soulwind
Monai vs Rewer
Watashi vs Meessm
dice vs Sergio Aguero

Happy SPL all!
 
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GaryTheGengar vs Finchinator - Finch says he motivated to tryhard so easy bold

elodin vs Soulwind - its sw

Monai vs Rewer - both of these guys have a cat. Monai has a cat named cat which is funny. Fifi is my beloved though so i will bold Rewer for this one

Watashi vs Meessm - this one could get scrappy

dice vs Sergio Aguero - anyone would bold dice, but sergio is extremely capable on his day so an upset wouldnt mega suprise me
 
GaryTheGengar vs Finchinator - While GaryTheGengar is a creative and unpredictable player, Finchinator is known for his consistency, strong preparation, and adaptability. If Finchinator can mitigate potential surprise sets from Gary, his experience in high-pressure situations gives him the edge.

elodin vs Soulwind - Both players are highly skilled, but Soulwind has a reputation as one of the best, with consistently deep runs in individual tournaments and an excellent track record in SPL. Elodin is no slouch, but the combination of Soulwind's team-building and in-game decision-making might prove too much.

Monai vs Rewer - Monai has shown great prowess recently, particularly in creative and less predictable formats. Rewer, while solid, might struggle to keep up with Monai’s dynamic playstyle and adaptability during the match.

Watashi vs Meessm - Watashi is a powerhouse in the competitive scene, consistently delivering top-tier performances in SPL and other tournaments. Meessm is competent but is up against one of the most dependable and technically proficient players in the pool.

dice vs Sergio Aguero - Dice is a well-known player who thrives in creative team-building and unconventional strategies. Sergio Aguero is a strong contender but might struggle against dice’s unpredictability and deep understanding of the meta.
 
My predictions are based on how I see these players as a spectator.


GaryTheGengar vs Finchinator
This is a game between two solid players who are good in most aspects of the game and who play very "honestly", and I really believe that it is exactly games like this that Finchinator is very strong in. There is a saying, "boxing is a game of inches", and in head-on, honest confrontations, Finchinator's strength is consistently making better decisions with good risk/reward and long term implications to "inch out" his opponent.

elodin vs SoulWind
I don't like predictions that go "x is good but y is better" but there is not much else I can say. elodin is a very strong player, he uses no nonsense stuff, has a killer instinct, plays to win, and is a real veteran. But SoulWind in BW OU in peak form is unparalleled in playing skills, metagame knowledge, and has an iron-clad will to win. I would always lean towards favoring SoulWind in general.

Monai vs Rewer
I can't estimate where Monai's playing is currently, so I'm going with the safe, stable pick. I do think Monai is pretty creative in a good way, however.

watashi vs MeEsSm
It's hard not to favor a veteran of the game with a good grasp on unique playstyles against someone who does not have experience in this stage, but I am open to being proven wrong. I do know MeEsSm has been very active and he has a competitive streak and I think those are things that are heavily in his favor.

dice vs Sergio Aguero
Again, it's hard for me to pick a player I don't know that well against a player whom I know understands playing and the metagame deeply and who plays to win viciously.
 
BW OU: elodin vs SoulWind - A classic BW pairing. The two combine for 134 SPL BW games across 17 different campaigns (10 for SW, 7 for elodin). SoulWind has always been the top dog in BW and I think having a fresh season allows him to do a lot that may end up prepared for more later on. You have to respect bulky teams from him more than anyone arguably, but there is no saying when he could break out any of a couple different offensive styles either. elodin is at worst 40/60 against anyone in BW and a clear second tier option (at worst) in any BW pool, but he did seem more passionate about DPP last year and this sadly is the hardest opening draw in the tournament. What to watch for has to be SoulWind's team: will he fall back on the core competency with bulky teams? Feel like we have seen a few more stall/semi-stall sightings from him in modern BW, but he is a target for Magic Guard, Trick, obnoxious breakers, etc., especially if people are willing to cut some corners when building for him. I could see SoulWind starting off with something more proactive to combat this, but I definitely think elodin avoids flimsy Rain or something without durability/clear breaking. Either way, lean SoulWind and probably bolding him until I have a compelling reason not to.

BW OU: Monai vs Rewer - Conflicted here as I have gulped down the full container of Monai kool-aid at record speed pre-season, but Rewer had a strong 2024 and is the conventional favorite. Monai has done very well in smaller tournaments and showed great range in his teams. I have seen him win with everything short of stall and, while there is an emphasis on bulky-offense, he can bring out a lot of different Pokemon and cores within it all. I think he also is much better at picking teams into specific opponents and playing end-games than he was during his 2-7 debut; pair this with the support of BW veteran Raiza and, in my opinion, Monai is a dark horse of this BW field. Rewer has been fine historically and has very crafty support in Brine, but even he will admit he never popped off in SPL BW yet.

BW OU: watashi vs MeEsSm - I do not know what to make of watashi in BW. I do not think he is super passionate about the tier, I think he mainly plays it during a small handful of tournaments, and I am not positive as to how much he follows it during other times. This metagame differs from last SPL's, but it is not super hard to make up the difference at least. What I can say is watashi is a consistently good, but not quite elite, performer in officials who is capable of building his own teams and varying playstyles. This alone probably puts him at a decent record in a shaky BW pool so long as his timing and selection is not bad. I wonder if he ends up elsewhere eventually as I would honestly already rank mars similarly overall though and I think watashi can plug holes that pop up in a variety of generations. Keep your eyes open for mars to make a big impact one way or another though as I rate mars quite high. For watashi though, I think he may be running into MeEsSm at an awkward time. MeEsSm has a much smaller sample and probably a lot more motivation to find a way, especially with his debut being on a team with strong management and high expectations. mars probably knows MeEsSm decently well, but having no SPL or similar data to go off of does mean a lot. I see this as a coming out party for MeEsSm personally, who I expect will use something proactive and look to get ahead earlier on with aggressive plays unless ABR has already corrupted him (or, even worse, Excal has, in which case anything is possible). He is very active in the tier, he will come up with something suited for the occasion, and he will know how to navigate virtually any early game just from recent experience and prep. MeEsSm's resume is kind of lacking for an SPL starter, but what has convinced me has been how comfortable he is taking risks in battle, which I think will translate here. What worries me and what could stand in the way of his first victory is late games -- they have plagued MeEsSm before in invitational and the guy is probably going to feel nervous. Hopefully he stays calm and makes the right decisions, but I definitely think that will be a defininig factor in his rookie season either way. I will bank on him keeping steady and living up to my high hopes for his teambuilding with my vote of confidence here.

BW OU: dice vs Sergio Aguero - I do not know what to feel about Sergio quite yet. He had a really strong 2024 that was capped off with a circuit championship over Sergi, who was arguably the best BW player for a few months between Invitational and Circuit. Sergio's range does not feel quite as established as someone like dice, who he faces, but his plays are clearly at an SPL level. Honestly, I came into the tournament kind of low on Sergio, ranked him near the bottom, and was not sure he would sign-up or be in the field before he joined late after winning circuit, so maybe I just was not fully in the know or maybe I am a hater. But I have done some digging since and am honestly impressed. His HO game in finals against Sergi was downright dominant as he never gave up tempo and sequenced perfectly, he had a similar showing against Raiza prior, and it is hard to poke too many holes into his performance. I do not see him loading anything too bulky here and I wonder if dice will capitalize on that though or if Sergio will expand his comfort zone -- these type of adjustments fascinate me personally. As for dice, if he is in the zone, you gotta bold him here and against most. Preparing for him is nearly impossible, he is no slouch in the builder, and his style just fits the generation so well. I think dice is someone who is most likely to advance the tier with either new cores/strategies altogether or sets nobody else would even consider, so I am hyped for all of his games by default. Will be cool to see what both come up with here.
 
2) finch's azelf set : when I saw finch drop the calc I was sobbing
Azelf @ Colbur Berry
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 8 HP / 56 SpA / 192 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 2 Atk / 30 Def
- Stealth Rock
- Thunder Wave
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Grass Knot

Really cool at opening up for Volc as you force up rocks and flip early games against standard. Puts Tar into +1 Buzz range after sequence with GK, snipes LandoT trying to weaken Explosion they think I have with Intimidate, and forces status across the board. It’s floor is just being another SR + tempo lead trade and its ceiling is getting a surprise KO/chip that can be a game winner with proper sequencing.

Can easily run Fire Blast, Explosion, Thunder, or even Sunny Day in the Thunder Wave slot depending on the team. Needs every last SDef EV to chew bits ranging from Specs Keldeo, Latios Draco, LO Zam SBall, Modest ThundyT Thunder, etc.

In that game against Rain, I always lead Conk because it’s the only thing very comfortable into Scald Politoed and it’s able to put Keldeo into +2 BP range or Espeed range after Drain Punch and some other chip (Rocks helps) — line against Specs Keldeo is always to go Azelf T2 if they Surf lock as I live and can save Conk, but both Pokemon ended up getting crit. Leading Azelf into Politoed tends to never be worth it as I do not have Boom and GK does nothing to Politoed, so rather than trading SR for Politoed and letting people spin on Conk or get away without much pressure, I save Azelf as a way to scare out Keld/ThundyT/others with Boom lure threat later and set SR sometime else in first ten turns. Rain obviously isn’t the ideal matchup for this, but with enough playtesting we had it in a manageable position if it broke cleanly.

Don’t think I would try to copy this as you get diminishing returns once people know the set and also that’s part of why I posted it as it’s mostly a one-off probably. I’ll share other SPL stuff after the season of course.

Predicts later prob
 
Sergio Aguero vs elodin
elodin is the more experienced player. Both players lost their first game of the season but showed good piloting skills, keeping their games close despite rough starts. I'll favor experience in this matchup, but Sergio Aguero could make it competitive with strong piloting and a creative team build.

MeEsSm vs GaryTheGengar
MeEsSm finished strong after a nightmare start against watashi. Although I like Gary as a player, I think MeEsSm is determined to secure his first win and will grind hard to get the victory.

Rewer vs watashi
Starting 1-0 each, both players come into this game with confidence. watashi played a solid game in week one and is expected to continue his strong performance, edging out Rewer in a close match.

SoulWind vs Monai
SoulWind is one of the most dominant BW players in SPL history, with an unparalleled understanding of the metagame, which was evident in his week one win. Monai is a solid player, but coming off a loss and facing SoulWind now feels like unfortunate timing.

Finchinator vs dice
After an unfortunate loss in week one, Finchinator is eager to secure his first win of the season. Dice, however, is a formidable opponent, making this a match to watch.
 
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