Metagame USUM Pure Hackmons

[Yourself]

Why Fur Coat Doublade is bad



Doublade is A+ as of right now. Yes I do know it is going get moved down next VR update but I just wanna make sure it's not in A or A+, plus I like talking about the game.

So, why do I think Doublade Is bad? Simply put, I don't think it's a good MMX wall at all. Being weak to fire is awful as a Fur Coat because fire usually comes in the form of Searing Shot, which is a special move so it ignores Fur Coat, and also V-Create, which is 180 BP so it 2HKOs Fur Coats weak to it (or just flat out OHKOs them if you're Choice Band MMX). One of the main draws it has as a Fur Coat is its fighting immunity, however this isn't really as big of a deal as you would think. Unless you are using your own Doublade to improof (which is honestly really rare), MMX will always run a move alongside Close Combat like Knock Off or Moongeist Beam which allows it to beat Doublade. Because of all that, most of the time you're only really walling physical coverage you're weak to that isn't like 180 BP, which is like Thousand Arrows? In my opinion Thousand Arrows isn't a good move because not only do you miss many of the Wonder Guard steels, but the stuff you can actually hit walls you with Prankster Reflect or Fur Coat most of the time. So yeah, it isn't a good MMX wall, and other then that it doesn't have that much else going for it compared to other steel types. You could probably make the argument Sturdy Doublade is better then Fur Coat because of what I have just said about Thousand Arrows, and just the fact it's more splashable, but this isn't really my point.

What's better then it then?

with Fur Coat

To be fair I don't actually think Solgaleo is that good, but I will say on paper it just seems to outclass Doublade. You get to have a 4x Photon Geyser resist meaning you are less vulnerable to being nuked by CFZs, have an easier time switching into MMX and also don't just lose to Choice Band MMX when rocks are up. Outside of that they're honestly the same, with the weaknesses and all, and you take like 30% from MMX Close Combat so it honestly doesn't really matter that it's not immune to it.

with a fire immune ability.

As I've already established, I don't think Thousand Arrows is that good. I also think that fire is the best coverage for steels that MMX can run seeing as you break through Prankster Reflect and Fur Coat whilst also hitting majority of the Wonder Guard steels (with the ones you don't hit being very rare and not even ranked right now). Following that logic, it would make sense that fire immune Doublade is better. As for whether you run Flash Fire or Primordial Sea, I would say you should run Flash Fire for the surprise factor unless you want to improof Mold Breaker Primal Groudon, seeing as opposing Mold Breaker Primal Groudon (who are already rare) will be running a ground move for you regardless. As well I have used this before (https://pokepast.es/0df44a9b67ff9c37) and it wasn't terrible at all so you can't say I'm wrong because "You can't just say a Pokémon is better on paper it actually needs to have success and usage".

with Fur Coat

In terms of MMX you wall, Fur Coat Slowbro-Mega is honestly pretty similar to fire immune Doublade. Main difference is the lack of a ground weakness, of course you wall Thousand Arrows MMX but more importantly it allows you to be a solid Groudon-Primal check. Getting to wall the vast majority of MMX and also the vast majority of Groudon-Primal (with Water Shuriken especially) is amazing in 1 slot. MMX you actually lose to are Moongeist Beam, which is pretty easily walled by teammates either with Reflect Zygarde-Complete or a Strength Sap Wonder Guard Steel, and also Choice Band sets running coverage for you (that isn't First Impression) but those are unwallable (other then Spore/SSAP Zygarde-Complete who is already a good teamate for it as I've mentioned) and also not that common as they aren't good into offense which is the best archetype so I don't think it matters that much.

 

[ZeldaFan1]

252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Fur Coat Solgaleo: 198-234 (41.4 - 48.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X V-create vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Fur Coat Solgaleo: 396-466 (82.8 - 97.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X V-create vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Fur Coat Solgaleo: 396-466 (82.8 - 97.4%) -- 25% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X Thousand Arrows vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Fur Coat Solgaleo: 198-234 (41.4 - 48.9%) -- 13.3% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Choice Band Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Fur Coat Solgaleo: 297-349 (62.1 - 73%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X Light That Burns the Sky vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Solgaleo: 163-193 (34.1 - 40.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
...
Mewtwo-Mega-X Close Combat vs. Doublade: 0-0 (0 - 0%) -- possibly the worst move ever
252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X V-create vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Fur Coat Doublade: 208-246 (64.5 - 76.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X V-create vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Fur Coat Doublade: 208-246 (64.5 - 76.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X Thousand Arrows vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Fur Coat Doublade: 104-124 (32.2 - 38.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X Light That Burns the Sky vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Doublade: 172-203 (53.4 - 63%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Uh...not sure about that one, pal. Like, at all. You can debate on Fur Coat Slowbro, sure. But Solgaleo? I don't think it is the outclass you think it is. For example, Solgaleo takes like 41% min from MMX CC, not 30%, so it does definitely matter. Also, Solgaleo gets wrecked by V-Create, and Doublade gets wrecked far less. As Well, MMX non-Banded TArrows can 2HKO Solgaleo. It cannot get anywhere close on Doublade. The main thing Solgaleo is good at VS Doublade is that it has a item slot, and that it takes LTBTS better. But saying that Solgaleo is just the improvement? No. Just no. If you want to argue that Doublade is bad, honestly I somewhat agree. But Solgaleo is not the upgrade. Rant over.

 

[Eyeos]

Sample test post ​

In total there be 9 teams submitted some bad, some good, all of it was torture. I got first on da ladder so now all teams can legally say they got first (ignore the fact that they were used alongside the other 8). Teams will be rated based on the Meloetta scale™ and then the good teams will be given to the rest of the council for their consideration. Any teams submitted after this post won’t be tested for a very VERY long time so don’t try and make me do this again.

https://pokepast.es/61618173978538e6 Team kinda mid. Stag don works fine here, it traps threats ok enough. The kart imp proof is kinda fake, sash imp proofs are trash and pdon only switches in if it’s healthy and after a sack. Gigas, dawn wings and magic guard kart all don’t break well for their own reason. Gigas doesn’t have a mold move, kart lacks a lot of immediate power and the bad imp proof makes it hard to break with it and dawn wings is walled by quite a lot of mons without rocks and ur only rocker is running defog so imp can deny this pretty easily. Aggron works fine I guess.
4 Meloettas™/10

https://pokepast.es/6ab6028212b72524 Team good into bal but offence mu suck. Firstly, why is this stag kart. Like your 2 breakers are special attackers so wtf does vcreate and power whip do? The only real reason why I used kart was for first impression against mmy (we will get to that later) and sometimes trap the occasional Melo or oddnose. But ur choice locked into first impression a lot of the time which is basically an invitation for things to setup onto you and your walls won’t be able to help since they both suck as walls (literally every single submitted team except the stall one has a mon that can setup after that and force innards or sweep ur team). Also the team as previously said sucks into most offensive structures since your walls suck (0 mmx photon checks besides innards your sunsteel wall has core enforcer as it’s only attack so good luck killing a kart and there’s not a single sash to be found so once your innards is gone there’s a lot problems that show up. The mu against bal is fine enough I guess and mmy is a pretty nice breaker but otherwise it’s not that good.

5 Meloettas™/10

I can’t find the pokepaste for the baton pass team but it doesn’t work as a sample it’s counterplay is really easy for anyone who knows what coming (which is kinda easy since the team is going to be pretty public) and is a horrible intro for any new player.

1 Meloetta™/10

https://pokepast.es/131eb2525cfeddb7 very cool team and my personal fav. I'm not too sure on the no guard set but mostly I like this a lot. However as a sample it doesn’t work very well since it’s bal that has 1 wg so no guard is a bitch. I didn’t have many troubles with piloting it. I find it pretty easy to pilot but it isn’t a really a good intro for da new guys. I would suggest you try da team if ur not new do it’s a lot of fun. I could still see a modified version to be more suitable for samples be added however. (For people who going to complain that their team was considered worse then this try the team first you coward).

7 Meloettas™/10

https://pokepast.es/3f171860f83b61f4 team soooooo slowwwwwwwww. My speed control is e speed and ice shard and that’s about it. The only mon here that’s faster than mmx is mmy who won’t fix the shitty mu into offence. Team ok into bal besides the fact that their mmx and mmy are still major threats. Also no guard is a fucking horrible mu. Still ok and does work fine I guess.

5 Meloettas™/10

https://pokepast.es/6007952853f5ef62 safety goggles Groudon? Kinda weird since you already have a kartana but ok. What do you mean there’s 2. Team has an absurd mu vs some mons like how do you force slowbro and prank zyguard out, yea you can kill them with kart after a shell smash but first you need the shell smash so you can’t actively force them out also kart needs a cfz to kill slowbro and u can’t kill zyguard after wilo/reflect. No attacks on deo s sucks the item selection sucks cus like why tf you need 3 spore immune and I haven’t used dark z once. You also have a pretty slow team but some decent prio to make up for it so it isn’t as bad as other occasions. Being this extremely rocks weak sucks (all ur sash gone and nothing is imp proofed besides innards who don’t kill now)since once deo s dies you can’t remove hazard well and a lot of common rockers can setup rocks on u (slowbro, steelix, aggron, muk on ur mmx and no guards). On the topic of no guard that mu is horrible since your only sleep immunity is safety goggles sing runs over this team and no magic coat on chansey means they can gastro u for free then get a kill. Overall it’s flaws are not all team ruining individually but the amount make it less then optimal.

5 Meloettas™/10

https://pokepast.es/314756d305b52267 overall this is the most likely to be added. The mmy is kinda nasty and works well vs most offensive structures and some balance that doesn’t carry a very solid photon absorbing wg. There’s a good amount of speed and priority so it doesn’t get run over as easily as some of the other teams given. The Yveltal does its job well as a mostly pursuit bot for scarf gengar and imp proofing mmy and good prio with sucker. The mmx is the most questionable part of the team and kinda useless for a lot of games. A different stag would probably be better overall. Deo s has some flaws as a lead since it doesn’t have taunt but it works well enough. Kart is a nice breaker for bal that isn’t prepared and forces innards on ho after a shell smash. Additionally wg has proven itself useful in actually walling some really scary mons like slacking at least temporarily.

9 Meloettas™/10

https://pokepast.es/bc7d4e1c668120ce I HATE MAGNETON I HATE MAGNETON I HATE MAGNETON I HATE MAGNETON I HATE MAGNETON I HATE MAGNETON. Team works effectively enough (we will get to the elephant in the room later) it loses to some spore shenanigans since u only have 1 spore immunity (we will get to the magneton later) and no trick switch in sucks but overall works effectively. Hoho kinda sucks in a lot of matchups but I guess it works fine besides the fact that I didn’t click light screen in a single game. Water shuriken is pretty questionable since you’re running scizor, slowbro, hoho, Meloetta™ a structure which is very strong vs pdon so having shuriken just kinda makes u shell smash mmx weak when scald would have been way better. Ok let’s get to the magneton. Firstly what the fuck does this do over heatran. Water weak almost never matters and the only move it does matter for, scald slowbro, isn’t exactly something you would want to switch in magneton since burn hurts it quite a lot, takes some notable chip it doesn’t want to have and overall isn’t worth trading your item slot for since rocks scald slowbro isn’t as bad as losing to stagdon. Speaking of stag most stags can pretty easily trap this since even just trick could probably get your magneton killed cus you don’t have any bulk. Equally a lot of tech just runs over magneton like knock off on a hazard setter or just running hazards with an attack since magneton has very little bulk and in exchange for all this you get something that can live SSS from kart if absolutely nothing else chips it which as a magic bouncer you will be inevitably be taking chip from u turns and stuff so like does it really check kart that much better then like hoho? Speaking of hoho, this team is pretty rocks weak. Hoho is obviously rocks weak, Meloetta™ can’t live +2 bug buzz from most moon users, scizor can’t live 2 photons after rocks and for previously said reasons magneton is a pretty fucking shit magic bouncer so the team being this weak to rocks and having this bad of a magic bouncer fucks with the entire team. Overall besides that thing it’s pretty effective. Third best.

8 Meloettas™ and a fucking magneton/10

https://pokepast.es/63db99e6371e40aa Team good, most straightforward team I’ve played in a while sack innards against the scary stuff gengar and diance clean house vs ho and kart is good at cleaning bal after you set a couple bombs off and Luna gets a couple kills here and there. Very straightforward shit very nice, some mu sucks a lot and considering the state of ho in Gen 7 it’s not even that bad of an intro for new players. Very nice. Second best.

9 Meloettas™/10

IM DONE NO MORE SAMPLES TALK ITS OVER I CAN GO BACK TO PLAYING TEAMS WITH 4 CHOICE ITEMS I DID IT!!!!!!!!!!!
I get 11 Meloettas™ out of 10 cus I’m just that cool

11 Meloettas™/10

 

[ZeldaFan1]

Sample test post ​

In total there be 9 teams submitted some bad, some good, all of it was torture. I got first on da ladder so now all teams can legally say they got first (ignore the fact that they were used alongside the other 8). Teams will be rated based on the Meloetta scale™ and then the good teams will be given to the rest of the council for their consideration. Any teams submitted after this post won’t be tested for a very VERY long time so don’t try and make me do this again.

https://pokepast.es/61618173978538e6 Team kinda mid. Stag don works fine here, it traps threats ok enough. The kart imp proof is kinda fake, sash imp proofs are trash and pdon only switches in if it’s healthy and after a sack. Gigas, dawn wings and magic guard kart all don’t break well for their own reason. Gigas doesn’t have a mold move, kart lacks a lot of immediate power and the bad imp proof makes it hard to break with it and dawn wings is walled by quite a lot of mons without rocks and ur only rocker is running defog so imp can deny this pretty easily. Aggron works fine I guess.
4 Meloettas™/10

https://pokepast.es/6ab6028212b72524 Team good into bal but offence mu suck. Firstly, why is this stag kart. Like your 2 breakers are special attackers so wtf does vcreate and power whip do? The only real reason why I used kart was for first impression against mmy (we will get to that later) and sometimes trap the occasional Melo or oddnose. But ur choice locked into first impression a lot of the time which is basically an invitation for things to setup onto you and your walls won’t be able to help since they both suck as walls (literally every single submitted team except the stall one has a mon that can setup after that and force innards or sweep ur team). Also the team as previously said sucks into most offensive structures since your walls suck (0 mmx photon checks besides innards your sunsteel wall has core enforcer as it’s only attack so good luck killing a kart and there’s not a single sash to be found so once your innards is gone there’s a lot problems that show up. The mu against bal is fine enough I guess and mmy is a pretty nice breaker but otherwise it’s not that good.

5 Meloettas™/10

I can’t find the pokepaste for the baton pass team but it doesn’t work as a sample it’s counterplay is really easy for anyone who knows what coming (which is kinda easy since the team is going to be pretty public) and is a horrible intro for any new player.

1 Meloetta™/10

https://pokepast.es/131eb2525cfeddb7 very cool team and my personal fav. I'm not too sure on the no guard set but mostly I like this a lot. However as a sample it doesn’t work very well since it’s bal that has 1 wg so no guard is a bitch. I didn’t have many troubles with piloting it. I find it pretty easy to pilot but it isn’t a really a good intro for da new guys. I would suggest you try da team if ur not new do it’s a lot of fun. I could still see a modified version to be more suitable for samples be added however. (For people who going to complain that their team was considered worse then this try the team first you coward).

7 Meloettas™/10

https://pokepast.es/3f171860f83b61f4 team soooooo slowwwwwwwww. My speed control is e speed and ice shard and that’s about it. The only mon here that’s faster than mmx is mmy who won’t fix the shitty mu into offence. Team ok into bal besides the fact that their mmx and mmy are still major threats. Also no guard is a fucking horrible mu. Still ok and does work fine I guess.

5 Meloettas™/10

https://pokepast.es/6007952853f5ef62 safety goggles Groudon? Kinda weird since you already have a kartana but ok. What do you mean there’s 2. Team has an absurd mu vs some mons like how do you force slowbro and prank zyguard out, yea you can kill them with kart after a shell smash but first you need the shell smash so you can’t actively force them out also kart needs a cfz to kill slowbro and u can’t kill zyguard after wilo/reflect. No attacks on deo s sucks the item selection sucks cus like why tf you need 3 spore immune and I haven’t used dark z once. You also have a pretty slow team but some decent prio to make up for it so it isn’t as bad as other occasions. Being this extremely rocks weak sucks (all ur sash gone and nothing is imp proofed besides innards who don’t kill now)since once deo s dies you can’t remove hazard well and a lot of common rockers can setup rocks on u (slowbro, steelix, aggron, muk on ur mmx and no guards). On the topic of no guard that mu is horrible since your only sleep immunity is safety goggles sing runs over this team and no magic coat on chansey means they can gastro u for free then get a kill. Overall it’s flaws are not all team ruining individually but the amount make it less then optimal.

5 Meloettas™/10

https://pokepast.es/314756d305b52267 overall this is the most likely to be added. The mmy is kinda nasty and works well vs most offensive structures and some balance that doesn’t carry a very solid photon absorbing wg. There’s a good amount of speed and priority so it doesn’t get run over as easily as some of the other teams given. The Yveltal does its job well as a mostly pursuit bot for scarf gengar and imp proofing mmy and good prio with sucker. The mmx is the most questionable part of the team and kinda useless for a lot of games. A different stag would probably be better overall. Deo s has some flaws as a lead since it doesn’t have taunt but it works well enough. Kart is a nice breaker for bal that isn’t prepared and forces innards on ho after a shell smash. Additionally wg has proven itself useful in actually walling some really scary mons like slacking at least temporarily.

9 Meloettas™/10

https://pokepast.es/bc7d4e1c668120ce I HATE MAGNETON I HATE MAGNETON I HATE MAGNETON I HATE MAGNETON I HATE MAGNETON I HATE MAGNETON. Team works effectively enough (we will get to the elephant in the room later) it loses to some spore shenanigans since u only have 1 spore immunity (we will get to the magneton later) and no trick switch in sucks but overall works effectively. Hoho kinda sucks in a lot of matchups but I guess it works fine besides the fact that I didn’t click light screen in a single game. Water shuriken is pretty questionable since you’re running scizor, slowbro, hoho, Meloetta™ a structure which is very strong vs pdon so having shuriken just kinda makes u shell smash mmx weak when scald would have been way better. Ok let’s get to the magneton. Firstly what the fuck does this do over heatran. Water weak almost never matters and the only move it does matter for, scald slowbro, isn’t exactly something you would want to switch in magneton since burn hurts it quite a lot, takes some notable chip it doesn’t want to have and overall isn’t worth trading your item slot for since rocks scald slowbro isn’t as bad as losing to stagdon. Speaking of stag most stags can pretty easily trap this since even just trick could probably get your magneton killed cus you don’t have any bulk. Equally a lot of tech just runs over magneton like knock off on a hazard setter or just running hazards with an attack since magneton has very little bulk and in exchange for all this you get something that can live SSS from kart if absolutely nothing else chips it which as a magic bouncer you will be inevitably be taking chip from u turns and stuff so like does it really check kart that much better then like hoho? Speaking of hoho, this team is pretty rocks weak. Hoho is obviously rocks weak, Meloetta™ can’t live +2 bug buzz from most moon users, scizor can’t live 2 photons after rocks and for previously said reasons magneton is a pretty fucking shit magic bouncer so the team being this weak to rocks and having this bad of a magic bouncer fucks with the entire team. Overall besides that thing it’s pretty effective. Third best.

8 Meloettas™ and a fucking magneton/10

https://pokepast.es/63db99e6371e40aa Team good, most straightforward team I’ve played in a while sack innards against the scary stuff gengar and diance clean house vs ho and kart is good at cleaning bal after you set a couple bombs off and Luna gets a couple kills here and there. Very straightforward shit very nice, some mu sucks a lot and considering the state of ho in Gen 7 it’s not even that bad of an intro for new players. Very nice. Second best.

9 Meloettas™/10

IM DONE NO MORE SAMPLES TALK ITS OVER I CAN GO BACK TO PLAYING TEAMS WITH 4 CHOICE ITEMS I DID IT!!!!!!!!!!!
I get 11 Meloettas™ out of 10 cus I’m just that cool

11 Meloettas™/10

My team isn't last place LETS FUCKING GO

Anyway, to ensure that Ransei doesn't reap this post, I would like to discuss Spore and Safety Goggles, and why Spore might make a comeback once more.

In the beginning, when all was still new, Spore ruled supreme. The nightmares would never truly end, the eternal slumber would slay even the strongest of foes. However, in Generation 6, we were granted the cure at long last. Safety Goggles. No longer was Spore the eternal nightmare it once was. There was actual fucking counterplay that could be put on almost any mon that didn't cripple you for using it. It was a gift from the heavens itself. As time has gone on, however, people have forgotten what it was they once feared. The Shed Shell has begun to take control, as the sins of Spore have been forgotten. The greed has gotten too much. To run Shed Shell is to make a sacrifice. To return to a world of Spore, in exchange for avoiding Shadow Tag. But, if you make that choice, you must be willing to face the consequences. Spore has laid much more dormant then it once was, as the dominance of Safety Goggles has kept it in check. But, as Shed Shell rises, soon, Spore will follow. Beware, stall teams. Your greed to ignore Spore shall return to bring justice. The shifting of the tides, the shifting of the metagame. A eternal tide. A tide that must be feared.

Also to reiterate my team wasn't last place LETS FUCKING GO

 

[rightclicker]

ok THIS is an actual sample submission

#5 peak

again i definitely can ladder higher but im not motivated enough and also spam is awful to play against

The Eternal Memory

synopsis: it's setup spam hyper offense. you know it, you love it. one of the main things of this HO is that the improofing scheme is surprisingly sound compared to other HOs, and things like double imposter wont fuck you up most of the time if you play well. now 3+ imposter on the other hand
every shell smasher here can potentially sweep after rocks, although some do it better than others. lead mmy and get rocks up while disrupting with sleep, or lead kyub/slaking predicting a faster hazard lead or prankster spore and instantly get on the high ground while preserving a dangerous no guarder for later. slaking and mgar provides potential outs for opposing offense, slaking and mmx provides instant burst damage, kyub prevents rocks from going up which is absolutely vital considering all the sashes, and innards is innards.

improofing scheme

: kyub blanks everything imposter does. slaking can also rk in extremely awful scenarios if you switch into a sing with lum intact.
: if it's not eviolite, slaking kills with fake out > espeed at -1. if it is, slaking takes approximately half from every +2 move and kills with sunsteel > espeed. if you run sunraze instead of sunsteel, innards can improof after you sack yourself.
: unfortunately this is a case where you have to improof with the innards or try and risk the speed tie. gengar might work but you have to really gamble for 3 turns of sleep
: kyub + lum intact slaking can kill it. see weaknesses
: mindef lets slaking kill non-evio imposter after rocks or at -1. it also lives any hit unboosted if it comes to that
note that kyub and mmx can potentially selfproof w/ sash up

weaknesses: if rocks ever go up and you cant remove them at least 3 of your mons are fucked. fortunately both the offensive pressure and the magic bouncer are good enough so they mostly cant get rocks up safely. gengar improof is quite sus, so try to remove imposter before setting up with it if possible. kyub unfortunately does pretty shit damage even after a smash so it's mostly just a lure (and a rocks/spore preventer)

other options:
sunraze > sunsteel on kyub
light that burns the sky > photon on mmx
some bounce kyuw set > kyub
either 196- def or 52- def on slaking (lets +2 mgar ssword ohko non evio imposter at -1, 196- after rocks and 52- without rocks)
also 116- def to let mmx kill -1 with photon geyser (or just lonely nature for mmx to kill -1 after rocks)
deo-s > mmy

 

[ZeldaFan1]

ok THIS is an actual sample submission

#5 peak

View attachment 742590
again i definitely can ladder higher but im not motivated enough and also spam is awful to play against

The Eternal Memory

synopsis: it's setup spam hyper offense. you know it, you love it. one of the main things of this HO is that the improofing scheme is surprisingly sound compared to other HOs, and things like double imposter wont fuck you up most of the time if you play well. now 3+ imposter on the other hand
every shell smasher here can potentially sweep after rocks, although some do it better than others. lead mmy and get rocks up while disrupting with sleep, or lead kyub/slaking predicting a faster hazard lead or prankster spore and instantly get on the high ground while preserving a dangerous no guarder for later. slaking and mgar provides potential outs for opposing offense, slaking and mmx provides instant burst damage, kyub prevents rocks from going up which is absolutely vital considering all the sashes, and innards is innards.

improofing scheme

: kyub blanks everything imposter does. slaking can also rk in extremely awful scenarios if you switch into a sing with lum intact.
: if it's not eviolite, slaking kills with fake out > espeed at -1. if it is, slaking takes approximately half from every +2 move and kills with sunsteel > espeed. if you run sunraze instead of sunsteel, innards can improof after you sack yourself.
: unfortunately this is a case where you have to improof with the innards or try and risk the speed tie. gengar might work but you have to really gamble for 3 turns of sleep
: kyub + lum intact slaking can kill it. see weaknesses
: mindef lets slaking kill non-evio imposter after rocks or at -1. it also lives any hit unboosted if it comes to that
note that kyub and mmx can potentially selfproof w/ sash up

weaknesses: if rocks ever go up and you cant remove them at least 3 of your mons are fucked. fortunately both the offensive pressure and the magic bouncer are good enough so they mostly cant get rocks up safely. gengar improof is quite sus, so try to remove imposter before setting up with it if possible. kyub unfortunately does pretty shit damage even after a smash so it's mostly just a lure (and a rocks/spore preventer)

other options:
sunraze > sunsteel on kyub
light that burns the sky > photon on mmx
some bounce kyuw set > kyub
either 196- def or 52- def on slaking (lets +2 mgar ssword ohko non evio imposter at -1, 196- after rocks and 52- without rocks)
also 116- def to let mmx kill -1 with photon geyser (or just lonely nature for mmx to kill -1 after rocks)
deo-s > mmy

So...KyuremB. Uh...the Mon with 170 Attack, running a set with two special moves, and the only physical move isn't even STAB. Why KyuremB over like KyuremW? Your complaints about a lack of power are mainly because you are using a physical Mon with only one physical move without STAB and two special moves from 120 SpA, when you could use KyuremW, which has 170 SpA to use the STAB Freeze Dry. Idk, but KyuremB feels like a random pick here.

 

[Ransei]

So...KyuremB. Uh...the Mon with 170 Attack, running a set with two special moves, and the only physical move isn't even STAB. Why KyuremB over like KyuremW? Your complaints about a lack of power are mainly because you are using a physical Mon with only one physical move without STAB and two special moves from 120 SpA, when you could use KyuremW, which has 170 SpA to use the STAB Freeze Dry. Idk, but KyuremB feels like a random pick here.

Haven't tried this team or really looked at it much yet but I believe it's because Freeze Dry and Searing Shot are moves their targets are x4 weak to (or otherwise carrying significantly lower SpD than Def like Doublade and Mega Slowbro, leaving them overall consistently effective to a considerable extent despite Black Kyurem having base 120 SpA. However, when using White Kyurem, it noticeably lacks great damage output with Sunsteel Strike, making even Mega Audino able to stomach a x2 Atk Sunsteel Strike pretty well. Mega Audino tends to be a big target for Kyurems they lack a x4 effective move for, but at least with Black Kyurem, you have a chance of OHKOing Mega Audino with x2 Atk. It's a roll and how big of a roll it is depends on whether the Mega Aud is +Def or +SpD, but it becomes much more effective against Mega Audino than any White Kyurem set is while still hitting Pokemon like Mega Scizor, Zygarde-C, and Ferrothorn incredibly effectively.

 

[ZeldaFan1]

Haven't tried this team or really looked at it much yet but I believe it's because Freeze Dry and Searing Shot are moves their targets are x4 weak to (or otherwise carrying significantly lower SpD than Def like Doublade and Mega Slowbro, leaving them overall consistently effective to a considerable extent despite Black Kyurem having base 120 SpA. However, when using White Kyurem, it noticeably lacks great damage output with Sunsteel Strike, making even Mega Audino able to stomach a x2 Atk Sunsteel Strike pretty well. Mega Audino tends to be a big target for Kyurems they lack a x4 effective move for, but at least with Black Kyurem, you have a chance of OHKOing Mega Audino with x2 Atk. It's a roll and how big of a roll it is depends on whether the Mega Aud is +Def or +SpD, but it becomes much more effective against Mega Audino than any White Kyurem set is while still hitting Pokemon like Mega Scizor, Zygarde-C, and Ferrothorn incredibly effectively.

+2 252 Atk Lucario-Mega Sunsteel Strike vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Audino-Mega: 434-512 (105.8 - 124.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252+ SpA Lucario-Mega Freeze-Dry vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Zygarde-Complete: 580-684 (91.1 - 107.5%) -- 50% chance to OHKO
+2 252+ SpA Lucario-Mega Searing Shot vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Scizor-Mega: 796-940 (231.3 - 273.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Ok I know this is probably worse, but it does meet the qualifications for the teamslot, while doing far more damage with Sunsteel Strike. I know this is probably worse in other ways, but it is funny, and it does the job.

 

[Ransei]

+2 252 Atk Lucario-Mega Sunsteel Strike vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Audino-Mega: 434-512 (105.8 - 124.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252+ SpA Lucario-Mega Freeze-Dry vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Zygarde-Complete: 580-684 (91.1 - 107.5%) -- 50% chance to OHKO
+2 252+ SpA Lucario-Mega Searing Shot vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Scizor-Mega: 796-940 (231.3 - 273.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Ok I know this is probably worse, but it does meet the qualifications for the teamslot, while doing far more damage with Sunsteel Strike. I know this is probably worse in other ways, but it is funny, and it does the job.

Kyurem's specific niche on that team is to block sheer cold while serving as an attacker and still carrying a useful ability in Magic Bounce. That's why it's being used over examples such as Mega Lucario or a Wonder Guard.

 

[WindySnivy_]

ok THIS is an actual sample submission

#5 peak

View attachment 742590
again i definitely can ladder higher but im not motivated enough and also spam is awful to play against

The Eternal Memory

synopsis: it's setup spam hyper offense. you know it, you love it. one of the main things of this HO is that the improofing scheme is surprisingly sound compared to other HOs, and things like double imposter wont fuck you up most of the time if you play well. now 3+ imposter on the other hand
every shell smasher here can potentially sweep after rocks, although some do it better than others. lead mmy and get rocks up while disrupting with sleep, or lead kyub/slaking predicting a faster hazard lead or prankster spore and instantly get on the high ground while preserving a dangerous no guarder for later. slaking and mgar provides potential outs for opposing offense, slaking and mmx provides instant burst damage, kyub prevents rocks from going up which is absolutely vital considering all the sashes, and innards is innards.

improofing scheme

: kyub blanks everything imposter does. slaking can also rk in extremely awful scenarios if you switch into a sing with lum intact.
: if it's not eviolite, slaking kills with fake out > espeed at -1. if it is, slaking takes approximately half from every +2 move and kills with sunsteel > espeed. if you run sunraze instead of sunsteel, innards can improof after you sack yourself.
: unfortunately this is a case where you have to improof with the innards or try and risk the speed tie. gengar might work but you have to really gamble for 3 turns of sleep
: kyub + lum intact slaking can kill it. see weaknesses
: mindef lets slaking kill non-evio imposter after rocks or at -1. it also lives any hit unboosted if it comes to that
note that kyub and mmx can potentially selfproof w/ sash up

weaknesses: if rocks ever go up and you cant remove them at least 3 of your mons are fucked. fortunately both the offensive pressure and the magic bouncer are good enough so they mostly cant get rocks up safely. gengar improof is quite sus, so try to remove imposter before setting up with it if possible. kyub unfortunately does pretty shit damage even after a smash so it's mostly just a lure (and a rocks/spore preventer)

other options:
sunraze > sunsteel on kyub
light that burns the sky > photon on mmx
some bounce kyuw set > kyub
either 196- def or 52- def on slaking (lets +2 mgar ssword ohko non evio imposter at -1, 196- after rocks and 52- without rocks)
also 116- def to let mmx kill -1 with photon geyser (or just lonely nature for mmx to kill -1 after rocks)
deo-s > mmy

maybe you would want to put photon on mmy? it seems like the surprise factor is the only reason for mmy on that slot anyway
but also no wonder guards seems risky... after bliss is dead and rocks are up you don't have much to stop a sweep

but at the same time most sweepers are running moldy moves so it's debatable

 

[Guysmash]

maybe you would want to put photon on mmy? it seems like the surprise factor is the only reason for mmy on that slot anyway
but also no wonder guards seems risky... after bliss is dead and rocks are up you don't have much to stop a sweep

but at the same time most sweepers are running moldy moves so it's debatable

Imo WGs are not mandatory on HOs because its main purpose is not to be sweeped by NG. Innards work well for this. You just have to hope the opponent has only 1 NG

 

[rightclicker]

maybe you would want to put photon on mmy? it seems like the surprise factor is the only reason for mmy on that slot anyway
but also no wonder guards seems risky... after bliss is dead and rocks are up you don't have much to stop a sweep

for the first point, anything works but compared to deo-s, mmy has other usable sets than just hazard lead so your opponent has to know the team to assume it is, while with deo-s on a structure like this its pretty easy to assume that's the lead and not something like mgar or mmx

for the second point, the entire point of the team is that rocks should never be going up our side from offensive pressure + the bouncer so we can utilize the 4 sashes to stopgap opposing sweepers

 

[PenultimateToast]

ok THIS is an actual sample submission

#5 peak

View attachment 742590
again i definitely can ladder higher but im not motivated enough and also spam is awful to play against

The Eternal Memory

synopsis: it's setup spam hyper offense. you know it, you love it. one of the main things of this HO is that the improofing scheme is surprisingly sound compared to other HOs, and things like double imposter wont fuck you up most of the time if you play well. now 3+ imposter on the other hand
every shell smasher here can potentially sweep after rocks, although some do it better than others. lead mmy and get rocks up while disrupting with sleep, or lead kyub/slaking predicting a faster hazard lead or prankster spore and instantly get on the high ground while preserving a dangerous no guarder for later. slaking and mgar provides potential outs for opposing offense, slaking and mmx provides instant burst damage, kyub prevents rocks from going up which is absolutely vital considering all the sashes, and innards is innards.

improofing scheme

: kyub blanks everything imposter does. slaking can also rk in extremely awful scenarios if you switch into a sing with lum intact.
: if it's not eviolite, slaking kills with fake out > espeed at -1. if it is, slaking takes approximately half from every +2 move and kills with sunsteel > espeed. if you run sunraze instead of sunsteel, innards can improof after you sack yourself.
: unfortunately this is a case where you have to improof with the innards or try and risk the speed tie. gengar might work but you have to really gamble for 3 turns of sleep
: kyub + lum intact slaking can kill it. see weaknesses
: mindef lets slaking kill non-evio imposter after rocks or at -1. it also lives any hit unboosted if it comes to that
note that kyub and mmx can potentially selfproof w/ sash up

weaknesses: if rocks ever go up and you cant remove them at least 3 of your mons are fucked. fortunately both the offensive pressure and the magic bouncer are good enough so they mostly cant get rocks up safely. gengar improof is quite sus, so try to remove imposter before setting up with it if possible. kyub unfortunately does pretty shit damage even after a smash so it's mostly just a lure (and a rocks/spore preventer)

other options:
sunraze > sunsteel on kyub
light that burns the sky > photon on mmx
some bounce kyuw set > kyub
either 196- def or 52- def on slaking (lets +2 mgar ssword ohko non evio imposter at -1, 196- after rocks and 52- without rocks)
also 116- def to let mmx kill -1 with photon geyser (or just lonely nature for mmx to kill -1 after rocks)
deo-s > mmy

cool team i like kyurem black so yippee it's on a team

anyways so this isn't a one liner here's why i think balance is the (second) worst archetype in usum ph

(btw when i say "offense" i mean both offense and ho just in case anyone's confused)

tl;dr: you have to sacrifice too much and your team ends up worse as a result

1. your defensive core can't cover everything.

a well known fact about usum ph is that you can't defensively cover everything, there's so many nigh-unwallable sets that bulkier teams are usually much worse off than offensive ones. what this means for balance is that your defensive core is usually very shaky, and struggles to actually hold out vs strong offensive threats, and once your defensive core is broken down enough, you'll just get ran over by offense.

ik this may make stall seem like the worst archetype, but stall's better imo because you have more teamslots to run niche stuff to beat the nearly unwallable mons without sacrificing as much (or just run stag to trap said unwallable mons and ko them), which balance can't do as easily due to how much it already needs to fit.

2. your offensive options are too limited.

you have to cram priority and breaking power into 2 mons, and having only 2 mons to cover all of your offense means you're very easily out-offensed by opposing offense, and if you put too much priority for the offense mu (which likely won't even help much as offense will also have priority for opposing offense) you don't have enough power to break fatter teams. you can't have one dedicated breaker and one dedicated anti-offense mon, as you'll likely just lose your breaker to innards and it'll be nearly impossible to win afterwards. you have to cram so much into just 2 mons, and you can't fit everything you need to.

all of this makes balance the second worst archetype imo, you have to sacrifice too many mus and there isn't much reward compared to just running a different archetype other than ig making it harder to cteam you (and ladder consistency but that's ladder who cares).

btw if anyone asks semistall's the worst archetype imo i'll go into it in a different post maybe

 

[Electra102]

I was planning on making a full RMT for this, but semistall kind of died, so I’m just going to post this now. This is the 9th iteration (out of 12 or so iterations) of my beloved Mold Breaker Rayquaza-Mega team.

https://pokepast.es/11c24a6340a6652d


The star of the show. This thing absolutely shreds stall and balance teams lacking Spectral Thief or a dedicated answer. Despite twelve or so versions of this team being made, this set has never changed.


An unorthodox set I made. The idea was to trick Lagging Tail onto a sweeper, with the idea of shutting it down + removing their item in one move. It was especially handy when I used Gyarados-Mega over Slowbro-Mega, since Pixie Plate sweepers were everywhere at the time


Pretty standard Audino-Mega set. Not much to say here


A bit of a weird set, but also not much to say about it


Due to having Diancie-Mega to handle Dark-type sweepers, I chose to swap out Haze for Encore on my Prankster Zygarde-Complete. It works a lot better than you would expect- I would definitely try it out again.


Probably the most important addition to the team, after Rayquaza-Mega. This is my answer to Dark-types, No Guard, sweepers I cannot wall, MMX, failing the self-improof on Rayquaza-Mega, and more. Diancie-Mega came in handy in almost every single battle, and in my opinion it is under-appreciated in the current meta.

Will I make Rayquaza-Mega into a new semistall team? Most likely, but it will likely be so different from this team that I wouldn’t be able to count it as a new version. The meta is just different now, and although my team didn’t get to shine the way I had hoped, I still had a lot of fun with it.

 

[ZeldaFan1]

I was planning on making a full RMT for this, but semistall kind of died, so I’m just going to post this now. This is the 9th iteration (out of 12 or so iterations) of my beloved Mold Breaker Rayquaza-Mega team.

https://pokepast.es/11c24a6340a6652d


The star of the show. This thing absolutely shreds stall and balance teams lacking Spectral Thief or a dedicated answer. Despite twelve or so versions of this team being made, this set has never changed.


An unorthodox set I made. The idea was to trick Lagging Tail onto a sweeper, with the idea of shutting it down + removing their item in one move. It was especially handy when I used Gyarados-Mega over Slowbro-Mega, since Pixie Plate sweepers were everywhere at the time


Pretty standard Audino-Mega set. Not much to say here


A bit of a weird set, but also not much to say about it


Due to having Diancie-Mega to handle Dark-type sweepers, I chose to swap out Haze for Encore on my Prankster Zygarde-Complete. It works a lot better than you would expect- I would definitely try it out again.


Probably the most important addition to the team, after Rayquaza-Mega. This is my answer to Dark-types, No Guard, sweepers I cannot wall, MMX, failing the self-improof on Rayquaza-Mega, and more. Diancie-Mega came in handy in almost every single battle, and in my opinion it is under-appreciated in the current meta.

Will I make Rayquaza-Mega into a new semistall team? Most likely, but it will likely be so different from this team that I wouldn’t be able to count it as a new version. The meta is just different now, and although my team didn’t get to shine the way I had hoped, I still had a lot of fun with it.

Heya! It's me, the fun police BIG SHOT here, to tell you that....uh....this team....sure is a team. So, let's begin.

Mega Ray:
Fun fact, if the Imposter clicks Quiver Dance, they can straight up 1v1 your Mega Ray, despite the fact you have Icicle Plate and they don't.

252+ SpA Icicle Plate Rayquaza-Mega Judgment vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 388-460 (55.1 - 65.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

So let's say that Chansey is at 35% on turn 2

+1 252+ SpA Chansey Oblivion Wing vs. 252 HP 30 IVs / 252 SpD Rayquaza-Mega: 217-256 (52.5 - 61.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

This heals the Chansey back to 58% with the lowest roll

252+ SpA Icicle Plate Rayquaza-Mega Judgment vs. +1 252 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 260-308 (36.9 - 43.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

With Max roll, you then leave the Chansey at 15%

The Chansey then outspeeds because of the +1 Speed and finishes the MRay off.

So, if the Chansey pressing Quiver Dance turn 1 makes you auto lose the Improofing, then why not press Taunt?

If you do, and the Chansey just pressed OWing, then you still don't Improof. 252+ SpA Chansey Oblivion Wing vs. 252 HP 30 IVs / 252 SpD Rayquaza-Mega: 145-172 (35.1 - 41.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO With 15% min recovered.

...So...not a improof, like at all, so why is Icicle Plate here? (Yes I know that Mega Diancie can kinda Improof this but it can't switch in forever and because the Diancie lacks any true power into WG it is very easy for the Imposter to just switch out and come back in later.)

Also on that note, that MRay gets walled by like every Steel type under the sun, and gets wrecked by FakeSpeed, and also is STag Food.

Anyway, I will stop dunking on MRay to attack the rest of the team, starting with:

Celesteela: I don't know what the point of the Trick stuff is. Let's take a look on how different teamstyles would deal with this Celesteela, shall we?
HO: Has enough win-cons that one being Tricked a Lagging Tail won't stop them, and Celesteela is not bulky enough to stay around.
Offence: Same as HO, but you might have slightly better luck catching something that really needs a item. Still, they have more then enough offensive threats that one being forced to go last doesn't make them that much worse.
Balance: They are probably going to go into a WG mon, and Tricking a Tail onto a MAud is more or less useless.
Semistall: Probably the best use of this....IF you can catch the one offensive Win-con. If you catch one of the WG mons, then....yeah no.
Stall: They are going last anyway.
So....unless you are fighting Semistall (Which is already not a good teamstyle), Trick Tail is kinda useless.
Also....252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X Photon Geyser vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Celesteela: 185-218 (46.4 - 54.7%) -- 62.9% chance to 2HKO
Not very bulky. Like at all. There is a reason why Zygarde is generally the defensive Magic Bounce Mon, because it can take a beating. Celesteela....kinda can't.

Mega Audino: Standard Mega Audino. I would slot in Double Barreled Shotgun over Aromatherapy, but that is a personal choice.

Mega Slowbro: I just realized that this team has zero hazard removal. Like none. At all. Slowbro needs Defog. Like badly. Or at the very least, something needs Defog. The Slowbro is probably OK, but man does Defog look good right now.

Zygarde Complete: I'm sorry, but you need Haze. I understand the thought process, that Diancie can kill the Dark type set up mons. But....what if, the Mon that is setting up....isn't a dark type? Then....uh....your only option is DBonding them? Trust me, Haze is good. Haze is extremely good. Without Haze, this team has a genuine chance of losing to Evoboost Mold Breaker Gyarados. And no good team should be losing to Evoboost Mold Breaker Gyarados. Otherwise, standard Zygarde (Other then the fact that even with minimum Attack U-Turn still OHKOs Chansey 0 Atk 0 IVs Zygarde-Complete U-turn vs. 252 HP / 0- Def 0 IVs Chansey: 789-929 (112 - 131.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO) Anyway, next up is....sadly....

Mega Diancie: I would like to pretense this with a bit of context. Back in Gen 6 Pure Hackmons, I LOVED Pixalate FakeSpeed Diancie. It was probably my favorite Mon on my old Gen 6 team, and I tried my damn best to make Pixalate Diancie good in Gen 7. But, despite my best efforts, it had one issue that it just could not deal with: It was just too weak. If it isn't hitting super-effectively, then it just doesn't do enough. The reason why I eventually switched to FakeSpeed Regigigas was because I just needed power, and Dianice just could not give me enough. As well, the ability to hit WG Dark types is far less useful then it might have been in the beginning of Gen 7 PH, because Dark type offensive WG mons have become more and more rare. WG Ash Gren has fallen off, WG HoopaU is....existent....maybe? WG MMX is a niche tech Mon that lacks power, WG MGyara are almost always defensive now, and the defensive sets have zero reason to ever stay in. And, of course, WG shuts it down brutally. "But I have Sunsteel! So I can break WG now!" ....If only.
252+ Atk Diancie-Mega Sunsteel Strike vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Audino-Mega: 172-204 (41.9 - 49.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252+ Atk Diancie-Mega Sunsteel Strike vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Meloetta: 119-140 (29.4 - 34.6%) -- 7.9% chance to 3HKO
252+ Atk Diancie-Mega Sunsteel Strike vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Muk-Alola: 133-157 (32.1 - 37.9%) -- 95% chance to 3HKO
252+ Atk Diancie-Mega Sunsteel Strike vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Slowbro-Mega: 36-43 (9.1 - 10.9%) -- possibly the worst move ever
So....I wish that Pixalate Diancie was good in Gen 7, I really do. But, I can't lie to myself. It just isn't strong enough anymore. If you really need a FakeSpeed Mon with actual power....well....do I have the Mon for you.

So. Yeah. That's the critique. It may sound like a personal attack, but I can assure you, it isn't. I'm sure you are a cool person, but this team....not so sure. Anyway, that is all. The fun has been terminated.

(Oh yeah also both offensive mons lose to almost every Steel Type)

 

[Yourself]

Mega Diancie: I would like to pretense this with a bit of context. Back in Gen 6 Pure Hackmons, I LOVED Pixalate FakeSpeed Diancie. It was probably my favorite Mon on my old Gen 6 team, and I tried my damn best to make Pixalate Diancie good in Gen 7. But, despite my best efforts, it had one issue that it just could not deal with: It was just too weak. If it isn't hitting super-effectively, then it just doesn't do enough. The reason why I eventually switched to FakeSpeed Regigigas was because I just needed power, and Dianice just could not give me enough. As well, the ability to hit WG Dark types is far less useful then it might have been in the beginning of Gen 7 PH, because Dark type offensive WG mons have become more and more rare. WG Ash Gren has fallen off, WG HoopaU is....existent....maybe? WG MMX is a niche tech Mon that lacks power, WG MGyara are almost always defensive now, and the defensive sets have zero reason to ever stay in. And, of course, WG shuts it down brutally. "But I have Sunsteel! So I can break WG now!" ....If only.
252+ Atk Diancie-Mega Sunsteel Strike vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Audino-Mega: 172-204 (41.9 - 49.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252+ Atk Diancie-Mega Sunsteel Strike vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Meloetta: 119-140 (29.4 - 34.6%) -- 7.9% chance to 3HKO
252+ Atk Diancie-Mega Sunsteel Strike vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Muk-Alola: 133-157 (32.1 - 37.9%) -- 95% chance to 3HKO
252+ Atk Diancie-Mega Sunsteel Strike vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Slowbro-Mega: 36-43 (9.1 - 10.9%) -- possibly the worst move ever
So....I wish that Pixalate Diancie was good in Gen 7, I really do. But, I can't lie to myself. It just isn't strong enough anymore. If you really need a FakeSpeed Mon with actual power....well....do I have the Mon for you.

why are you criticising diancie for being hard walled by wonder guards despite the fact that regigigas also gets walled by any team with a sunsteel resist? both get walled by any remotely bulky team so i don't see how it's a point against diancie.

edit: also noticed how you said the team has no hazard removal despite the fact there's a whole defog maud there

 

[Electra102]

Heya! It's me, the fun police BIG SHOT here, to tell you that....uh....this team....sure is a team. So, let's begin.

Mega Ray:
Fun fact, if the Imposter clicks Quiver Dance, they can straight up 1v1 your Mega Ray, despite the fact you have Icicle Plate and they don't.

252+ SpA Icicle Plate Rayquaza-Mega Judgment vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 388-460 (55.1 - 65.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

So let's say that Chansey is at 35% on turn 2

+1 252+ SpA Chansey Oblivion Wing vs. 252 HP 30 IVs / 252 SpD Rayquaza-Mega: 217-256 (52.5 - 61.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

This heals the Chansey back to 58% with the lowest roll

252+ SpA Icicle Plate Rayquaza-Mega Judgment vs. +1 252 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 260-308 (36.9 - 43.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

With Max roll, you then leave the Chansey at 15%

The Chansey then outspeeds because of the +1 Speed and finishes the MRay off.

So, if the Chansey pressing Quiver Dance turn 1 makes you auto lose the Improofing, then why not press Taunt?

If you do, and the Chansey just pressed OWing, then you still don't Improof. 252+ SpA Chansey Oblivion Wing vs. 252 HP 30 IVs / 252 SpD Rayquaza-Mega: 145-172 (35.1 - 41.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO With 15% min recovered.

...So...not a improof, like at all, so why is Icicle Plate here? (Yes I know that Mega Diancie can kinda Improof this but it can't switch in forever and because the Diancie lacks any true power into WG it is very easy for the Imposter to just switch out and come back in later.)

Also on that note, that MRay gets walled by like every Steel type under the sun, and gets wrecked by FakeSpeed, and also is STag Food.

Anyway, I will stop dunking on MRay to attack the rest of the team, starting with:

Celesteela: I don't know what the point of the Trick stuff is. Let's take a look on how different teamstyles would deal with this Celesteela, shall we?
HO: Has enough win-cons that one being Tricked a Lagging Tail won't stop them, and Celesteela is not bulky enough to stay around.
Offence: Same as HO, but you might have slightly better luck catching something that really needs a item. Still, they have more then enough offensive threats that one being forced to go last doesn't make them that much worse.
Balance: They are probably going to go into a WG mon, and Tricking a Tail onto a MAud is more or less useless.
Semistall: Probably the best use of this....IF you can catch the one offensive Win-con. If you catch one of the WG mons, then....yeah no.
Stall: They are going last anyway.
So....unless you are fighting Semistall (Which is already not a good teamstyle), Trick Tail is kinda useless.
Also....252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X Photon Geyser vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Celesteela: 185-218 (46.4 - 54.7%) -- 62.9% chance to 2HKO
Not very bulky. Like at all. There is a reason why Zygarde is generally the defensive Magic Bounce Mon, because it can take a beating. Celesteela....kinda can't.

Mega Audino: Standard Mega Audino. I would slot in Double Barreled Shotgun over Aromatherapy, but that is a personal choice.

Mega Slowbro: I just realized that this team has zero hazard removal. Like none. At all. Slowbro needs Defog. Like badly. Or at the very least, something needs Defog. The Slowbro is probably OK, but man does Defog look good right now.

Zygarde Complete: I'm sorry, but you need Haze. I understand the thought process, that Diancie can kill the Dark type set up mons. But....what if, the Mon that is setting up....isn't a dark type? Then....uh....your only option is DBonding them? Trust me, Haze is good. Haze is extremely good. Without Haze, this team has a genuine chance of losing to Evoboost Mold Breaker Gyarados. And no good team should be losing to Evoboost Mold Breaker Gyarados. Otherwise, standard Zygarde (Other then the fact that even with minimum Attack U-Turn still OHKOs Chansey 0 Atk 0 IVs Zygarde-Complete U-turn vs. 252 HP / 0- Def 0 IVs Chansey: 789-929 (112 - 131.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO) Anyway, next up is....sadly....

Mega Diancie: I would like to pretense this with a bit of context. Back in Gen 6 Pure Hackmons, I LOVED Pixalate FakeSpeed Diancie. It was probably my favorite Mon on my old Gen 6 team, and I tried my damn best to make Pixalate Diancie good in Gen 7. But, despite my best efforts, it had one issue that it just could not deal with: It was just too weak. If it isn't hitting super-effectively, then it just doesn't do enough. The reason why I eventually switched to FakeSpeed Regigigas was because I just needed power, and Dianice just could not give me enough. As well, the ability to hit WG Dark types is far less useful then it might have been in the beginning of Gen 7 PH, because Dark type offensive WG mons have become more and more rare. WG Ash Gren has fallen off, WG HoopaU is....existent....maybe? WG MMX is a niche tech Mon that lacks power, WG MGyara are almost always defensive now, and the defensive sets have zero reason to ever stay in. And, of course, WG shuts it down brutally. "But I have Sunsteel! So I can break WG now!" ....If only.
252+ Atk Diancie-Mega Sunsteel Strike vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Audino-Mega: 172-204 (41.9 - 49.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252+ Atk Diancie-Mega Sunsteel Strike vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Meloetta: 119-140 (29.4 - 34.6%) -- 7.9% chance to 3HKO
252+ Atk Diancie-Mega Sunsteel Strike vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Muk-Alola: 133-157 (32.1 - 37.9%) -- 95% chance to 3HKO
252+ Atk Diancie-Mega Sunsteel Strike vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Slowbro-Mega: 36-43 (9.1 - 10.9%) -- possibly the worst move ever
So....I wish that Pixalate Diancie was good in Gen 7, I really do. But, I can't lie to myself. It just isn't strong enough anymore. If you really need a FakeSpeed Mon with actual power....well....do I have the Mon for you.

So. Yeah. That's the critique. It may sound like a personal attack, but I can assure you, it isn't. I'm sure you are a cool person, but this team....not so sure. Anyway, that is all. The fun has been terminated.

(Oh yeah also both offensive mons lose to almost every Steel Type)

I always click Quiver Dance turn 1 vs. Imposter, and I usually would have just clicked Quiver Dance when they switch in. Imposter has only been a problem in a single game, and I ended up winning that game with a Rayquaza-Mega sweep anyways. Also, what is a Steel-type going to do? Wall me? Good luck doing that without recovery, since I have Taunt.


The idea isn’t that you stop an entire team- the idea is that you tank one hit, Trick the sweeper a Lagging Tail, and then steal all of the boosts. Even if I Trick the Lagging Tail onto a Wonder Guard that doesn’t care about having it, I still get the opportunity to mess with the opponent’s items.


Audino-Mega has Defog. I don’t think anything else needs to be said here.


If a setup sweeper comes in, you are right, I do not have Haze, which logically means I cannot Haze away the boosts. I instead Encore them into spamming the setup move, forcing them to either switch out or let me steal the boosts with Celesteela.

Choosing Encore over Haze was a decision made for this specific team in the later iterations, after weighing the pros and cons of using it over Haze. Also, I have Pixilate Diancie-Mega. I should not be losing to that Gyarados set you mentioned.


Keep in mind this team was mainly used when Dark-type Wonder Guard sweepers were still prominent. Also, Diancie-Mega was never really meant to get that many KOs- it is insurance against certain threats, not the wincon. You could honestly drop Sunsteel Strike here if you wanted to.

Also, a lot of your arguments seem to mainly apply to the current meta. This is a rather old team, and I said in the introduction that this style of team is not doing that well anymore.

 

[ZeldaFan1]

I always click Quiver Dance turn 1 vs. Imposter, and I usually would have just clicked Quiver Dance when they switch in. Imposter has only been a problem in a single game, and I ended up winning that game with a Rayquaza-Mega sweep anyways. Also, what is a Steel-type going to do? Wall me? Good luck doing that without recovery, since I have Taunt.


The idea isn’t that you stop an entire team- the idea is that you tank one hit, Trick the sweeper a Lagging Tail, and then steal all of the boosts. Even if I Trick the Lagging Tail onto a Wonder Guard that doesn’t care about having it, I still get the opportunity to mess with the opponent’s items.


Audino-Mega has Defog. I don’t think anything else needs to be said here.


If a setup sweeper comes in, you are right, I do not have Haze, which logically means I cannot Haze away the boosts. I instead Encore them into spamming the setup move, forcing them to either switch out or let me steal the boosts with Celesteela.

Choosing Encore over Haze was a decision made for this specific team in the later iterations, after weighing the pros and cons of using it over Haze. Also, I have Pixilate Diancie-Mega. I should not be losing to that Gyarados set you mentioned.


Keep in mind this team was mainly used when Dark-type Wonder Guard sweepers were still prominent. Also, Diancie-Mega was never really meant to get that many KOs- it is insurance against certain threats, not the wincon. You could honestly drop Sunsteel Strike here if you wanted to.

Also, a lot of your arguments seem to mainly apply to the current meta. This is a rather old team, and I said in the introduction that this style of team is not doing that well anymore.

If you Quiver Dance VS Imposter, it still comes down to a speed tie if they also Quiver Dance. So Judgement Ice feels like a waste of a moveslot and item, because you are not realistically Improofing consistently with the Rayquaza anyway. Also, with the uptick of Core Enforcer to counter Harvest Slaking, that Ray gets fucked if it is Core Enforced because it very much needs it's ability to do literally anything to WG, which is its entire job. Also, I would once again like to say how the Ray is the ultimate STag Food, and if the Ray dies, then any semblance of offensive pressure falls off a cliff.
Oh yeah, I also forgot to mention that the teamstyle you are using also does not fare well for MRay. For a team like this, you really need to keep the breakers alive, because if they randomly die, then offensive pressure is almost completely snuffed. Now, what is a move that could be used on MRay even after it has set up and probably OHKOs it? Ice Shard. Guess what move is already quite common and a variety of random mons to hit Zygarde? Ice Shard. And what happens if the MRay randomly dies to Ice Shard? Then the team better have broken the entire WG backbone, because Diancie is not doing jack to WG mons.

If you want to mess with the opponent's items, there are better ways of doing that then Trick Lagging Tail Celesteela. Like sure, it might work sometimes, but that does not make it a better option then other ways of messing with items.

For the Audino, I am apparently fucking blind. Please ignore everything I said about Defog. I have zero idea how the hell I missed that.
The Slowbro is more or less in the same boat as the Audino.

252+ Atk Pixie Plate Pixilate Diancie-Mega Fake Out vs. +2 252 HP / 252 Def Gyarados-Mega: 92-110 (23.3 - 27.9%) -- 82.2% chance to 4HKO
252+ Atk Pixie Plate Pixilate Diancie-Mega Extreme Speed vs. +2 252 HP / 252 Def Gyarados-Mega: 182-216 (46.1 - 54.8%) -- 55.9% chance to 2HKO
Something always dies. And, if you get unlucky with the rolls, two mons have to die for Diancie Espeed to kill.

For Yourself about the Gigas vs Diancie thing: Diancie has to run Pixalate. Regigigas runs Huge Power, which means that unboosted Sunsteel can still rock non-resist WGs. On the other hand, Diancie can't even 2HKO MAud with Sunsteel.

252+ Atk Huge Power Regigigas Sunsteel Strike vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Audino-Mega: 342-404 (83.4 - 98.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Huge Power Regigigas Sunsteel Strike vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Meloetta: 237-279 (58.6 - 69%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Huge Power Regigigas Sunsteel Strike vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Muk-Alola: 242-285 (58.4 - 68.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

When the FakeSpeed Mon with Sunsteel can't even break MAud.

Tldr: I fucked up with the Defog stuff, Diancie is still not strong enough, and the Improof on the MRay is....yeah.

 

[Rain]

Sample test post ​

In total there be 9 teams submitted some bad, some good, all of it was torture. I got first on da ladder so now all teams can legally say they got first (ignore the fact that they were used alongside the other 8). Teams will be rated based on the Meloetta scale™ and then the good teams will be given to the rest of the council for their consideration. Any teams submitted after this post won’t be tested for a very VERY long time so don’t try and make me do this again.

https://pokepast.es/61618173978538e6 Team kinda mid. Stag don works fine here, it traps threats ok enough. The kart imp proof is kinda fake, sash imp proofs are trash and pdon only switches in if it’s healthy and after a sack. Gigas, dawn wings and magic guard kart all don’t break well for their own reason. Gigas doesn’t have a mold move, kart lacks a lot of immediate power and the bad imp proof makes it hard to break with it and dawn wings is walled by quite a lot of mons without rocks and ur only rocker is running defog so imp can deny this pretty easily. Aggron works fine I guess.
4 Meloettas™/10

https://pokepast.es/6ab6028212b72524 Team good into bal but offence mu suck. Firstly, why is this stag kart. Like your 2 breakers are special attackers so wtf does vcreate and power whip do? The only real reason why I used kart was for first impression against mmy (we will get to that later) and sometimes trap the occasional Melo or oddnose. But ur choice locked into first impression a lot of the time which is basically an invitation for things to setup onto you and your walls won’t be able to help since they both suck as walls (literally every single submitted team except the stall one has a mon that can setup after that and force innards or sweep ur team). Also the team as previously said sucks into most offensive structures since your walls suck (0 mmx photon checks besides innards your sunsteel wall has core enforcer as it’s only attack so good luck killing a kart and there’s not a single sash to be found so once your innards is gone there’s a lot problems that show up. The mu against bal is fine enough I guess and mmy is a pretty nice breaker but otherwise it’s not that good.

5 Meloettas™/10

I can’t find the pokepaste for the baton pass team but it doesn’t work as a sample it’s counterplay is really easy for anyone who knows what coming (which is kinda easy since the team is going to be pretty public) and is a horrible intro for any new player.

1 Meloetta™/10

https://pokepast.es/131eb2525cfeddb7 very cool team and my personal fav. I'm not too sure on the no guard set but mostly I like this a lot. However as a sample it doesn’t work very well since it’s bal that has 1 wg so no guard is a bitch. I didn’t have many troubles with piloting it. I find it pretty easy to pilot but it isn’t a really a good intro for da new guys. I would suggest you try da team if ur not new do it’s a lot of fun. I could still see a modified version to be more suitable for samples be added however. (For people who going to complain that their team was considered worse then this try the team first you coward).

7 Meloettas™/10

https://pokepast.es/3f171860f83b61f4 team soooooo slowwwwwwwww. My speed control is e speed and ice shard and that’s about it. The only mon here that’s faster than mmx is mmy who won’t fix the shitty mu into offence. Team ok into bal besides the fact that their mmx and mmy are still major threats. Also no guard is a fucking horrible mu. Still ok and does work fine I guess.

5 Meloettas™/10

https://pokepast.es/6007952853f5ef62 safety goggles Groudon? Kinda weird since you already have a kartana but ok. What do you mean there’s 2. Team has an absurd mu vs some mons like how do you force slowbro and prank zyguard out, yea you can kill them with kart after a shell smash but first you need the shell smash so you can’t actively force them out also kart needs a cfz to kill slowbro and u can’t kill zyguard after wilo/reflect. No attacks on deo s sucks the item selection sucks cus like why tf you need 3 spore immune and I haven’t used dark z once. You also have a pretty slow team but some decent prio to make up for it so it isn’t as bad as other occasions. Being this extremely rocks weak sucks (all ur sash gone and nothing is imp proofed besides innards who don’t kill now)since once deo s dies you can’t remove hazard well and a lot of common rockers can setup rocks on u (slowbro, steelix, aggron, muk on ur mmx and no guards). On the topic of no guard that mu is horrible since your only sleep immunity is safety goggles sing runs over this team and no magic coat on chansey means they can gastro u for free then get a kill. Overall it’s flaws are not all team ruining individually but the amount make it less then optimal.

5 Meloettas™/10

https://pokepast.es/314756d305b52267 overall this is the most likely to be added. The mmy is kinda nasty and works well vs most offensive structures and some balance that doesn’t carry a very solid photon absorbing wg. There’s a good amount of speed and priority so it doesn’t get run over as easily as some of the other teams given. The Yveltal does its job well as a mostly pursuit bot for scarf gengar and imp proofing mmy and good prio with sucker. The mmx is the most questionable part of the team and kinda useless for a lot of games. A different stag would probably be better overall. Deo s has some flaws as a lead since it doesn’t have taunt but it works well enough. Kart is a nice breaker for bal that isn’t prepared and forces innards on ho after a shell smash. Additionally wg has proven itself useful in actually walling some really scary mons like slacking at least temporarily.

9 Meloettas™/10

https://pokepast.es/bc7d4e1c668120ce I HATE MAGNETON I HATE MAGNETON I HATE MAGNETON I HATE MAGNETON I HATE MAGNETON I HATE MAGNETON. Team works effectively enough (we will get to the elephant in the room later) it loses to some spore shenanigans since u only have 1 spore immunity (we will get to the magneton later) and no trick switch in sucks but overall works effectively. Hoho kinda sucks in a lot of matchups but I guess it works fine besides the fact that I didn’t click light screen in a single game. Water shuriken is pretty questionable since you’re running scizor, slowbro, hoho, Meloetta™ a structure which is very strong vs pdon so having shuriken just kinda makes u shell smash mmx weak when scald would have been way better. Ok let’s get to the magneton. Firstly what the fuck does this do over heatran. Water weak almost never matters and the only move it does matter for, scald slowbro, isn’t exactly something you would want to switch in magneton since burn hurts it quite a lot, takes some notable chip it doesn’t want to have and overall isn’t worth trading your item slot for since rocks scald slowbro isn’t as bad as losing to stagdon. Speaking of stag most stags can pretty easily trap this since even just trick could probably get your magneton killed cus you don’t have any bulk. Equally a lot of tech just runs over magneton like knock off on a hazard setter or just running hazards with an attack since magneton has very little bulk and in exchange for all this you get something that can live SSS from kart if absolutely nothing else chips it which as a magic bouncer you will be inevitably be taking chip from u turns and stuff so like does it really check kart that much better then like hoho? Speaking of hoho, this team is pretty rocks weak. Hoho is obviously rocks weak, Meloetta™ can’t live +2 bug buzz from most moon users, scizor can’t live 2 photons after rocks and for previously said reasons magneton is a pretty fucking shit magic bouncer so the team being this weak to rocks and having this bad of a magic bouncer fucks with the entire team. Overall besides that thing it’s pretty effective. Third best.

8 Meloettas™ and a fucking magneton/10

https://pokepast.es/63db99e6371e40aa Team good, most straightforward team I’ve played in a while sack innards against the scary stuff gengar and diance clean house vs ho and kart is good at cleaning bal after you set a couple bombs off and Luna gets a couple kills here and there. Very straightforward shit very nice, some mu sucks a lot and considering the state of ho in Gen 7 it’s not even that bad of an intro for new players. Very nice. Second best.

9 Meloettas™/10

IM DONE NO MORE SAMPLES TALK ITS OVER I CAN GO BACK TO PLAYING TEAMS WITH 4 CHOICE ITEMS I DID IT!!!!!!!!!!!
I get 11 Meloettas™ out of 10 cus I’m just that cool

11 Meloettas™/10

Thank you for your appreciation I appreciate that, and feel free to get rid of that stag mmx I had enough of doing nothing when they dont bring the things I want them to. Pdon is right, mmx is wrong.
btw can you change that deos into a deoa with psycho boost instead of bdond if you can? I really like deoa and I want it to appear in the sample list and psycho boost is less passive against setup sweepers that want to take adventage of that and deoa is better against impostor as you can threat a kill instead of a sleep and would be easier for teammates to improof if somehow they have to do that.
Acutally mguard toxic orb yvetal will also work, providing a blob solution which is very important especially in a sample team serving the purpose of giving new players an overview of the meta game.

 

[ItzEmanBoss]

Hello all! Today I will present a team that is a bit modified from someone else’s team (if it is you who made the original or presented me to the original please state yourself) which I have made my peak elo 1609, peak GXE 84%, and peak placing on ladder 22nd with the account EmanItzBoss. So I will go in depth and original owner if I am explaining anything wrong please say something.

https://pokepast.es/8a000c65fe3eb688 Pokepaste link

PrettyPinkPrincess (Mewtwo-Mega-X) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Pure Power
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Shell Smash
- Spectral Thief
- Sacred Sword
- Photon Geyser

Standard Mewtwo set (besides sacred sword) very good, based, and ily MMx. Sacred sword is just what I got from the sample team with and I’ve been really liking it over cc because I’ve been running into to many extreme evoboost slaking and this is my most reliable counter because cc would need a crit to kill. But I don’t really improof this Mon very well and it’s mostly my innards sac. (Set is completely original to the sample)

Unemployed (Slaking) @ Lum Berry
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Sunsteel Strike
- Fake Out
- Sacred Fire
- Extreme Speed

Hp fake speed go brrrrr pretty much my only counter to ng Deo or any fast ng and no shell smash because there are 4 setup mons on this team and steel types get fucked by sacred fire and even better if they get burned. Lum to get rid of sleep burn ect and sunsteel because that’s what the sample came with. (Set is completely the same to sample)

Obama (Rayquaza-Mega) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Dazzling
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Mild Nature
- Clangorous Soulblaze
- Clanging Scales
- Shell Smash
- Sunsteel Strike

I really like this set because no one is running dazzling. And gets a lot more out of its ability then you would think improofs Slak (kinda) if you are at full health and rocks do hit this bastard for a whooping 25% but that’s why I have…(set is the same to the sample team)


PrettyPinkPrinces (Mewtwo-Mega-X) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Photon Geyser
- Close Combat
- Let's Snuggle Forever
- Shell Smash

By far my most common lead stops rocks/sleep and a lot of status moves that are not run by a mold breaker (long live Deo-s’s week long relevancy) but this lead is just kinda bad into Deo-s because to 2-Ko it you need to use let’s snuggle which you would most want to use it on a different Mon weak to fairy. But it is the most expendable to innards besides rayquaza depending on the matchup. (Set is completely original to me replaced by a m-bounce groundon)

Goku who? (Mewtwo-Mega-Y) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Parental Bond
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Moongeist Beam
- Extreme Evoboost
- Freeze-Dry
- Photon Geyser

Holy shit I love this set oh-kos anything after evoboost is isn’t like m-Steelix or m-Aggron arceus is also good into this. Against any sash Mon MMY just clicks the big pink button and kills it. Lures in zygod to prank haze SUPRISE I have freeze dry your dead (It actually 2-kos not a oh-Ko). And after a bliss/special wall dies this thing just comes in and sweeps unless it’s like hp fake speed Slak. (Set is original to the sample team)

You fat fuck (Blissey) (F) @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Innards Out
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Gentle Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Def
- Whirlwind
- Magic Coat
- Shore Up
- Defog

Self explanatory blis set whirlwind to get rid of special sweepers coat to bounce shit back Defog gets rid of hazards and recovery. (90% sure this set I made in place of something)

Thank you for your time and have a good day!

 

[Rain]

WIP
Team building Compendium
Welcome to the teambuilding compendium! If you’re looking for a Pokemon to fill a role on your team or some counterplay to a metagame defining threat this is a one stop shop! Every sprite is clickable and links to a Pokepaste containing sets that are not plug and play. Every set has been curated so any Pokemon unable to fulfill its intended role have been removed. The compendium is intended to be a quick place to grab a set to fill a role on your team, if you’re interested in more informatioa specific set, go ask about them in the pure hackmons room or ask me or idk. If there are any mistakes or suggestions about sets that should be added please don’t hesistate to message me. [1]
Support & utility [niche]
HO: (wonder guard) (magic guard)/*insert some toxic orb trick mgyara here*/ (magic guard) /*almost same as gyara*/ (innards out) [(wonder guard) (Mold Breaker) (wonder guard)]
Offense: (wonder guard) (wonder guard) (wonder guard) :(wonder guard) [(wonder guard)]
Balance:
/*I hate this part*/
Late Game Sweepers [niche]
HO: (Wonder guard) (Huge Power) (No Guard)/*mostly shell smash one*/ (Huge Power) (Harvest) (Huge Power) (Huge Power) [(Magic Guard) (Mold Breaker) (Magic Guard) (Mold Breaker) (Wonder Guard) (Dazzling) (Psychic Surge)]

NUKES [niche]
HO: (Huge Power) (Huge Power) (Huge Power)
Offense: (Huge Power) (Huge Power) (Choice Band)
/*What I call Nukes is those who can shoot an hard-to-wall shot when they got a chance. A good example is mold band don v-create. But because of the existance of the ability wonder guard there is hardly really sth that can go for a unwallable shot*/
/*Im uploading it on github here so that anyone can help with this project. I need help with the fuking support and almost all the balance and stall sets.*/

 

[Rain]

Heya! It's me, the fun police BIG SHOT here, to tell you that....uh....this team....sure is a team. So, let's begin.

Mega Ray:
Fun fact, if the Imposter clicks Quiver Dance, they can straight up 1v1 your Mega Ray, despite the fact you have Icicle Plate and they don't.

252+ SpA Icicle Plate Rayquaza-Mega Judgment vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 388-460 (55.1 - 65.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

So let's say that Chansey is at 35% on turn 2

+1 252+ SpA Chansey Oblivion Wing vs. 252 HP 30 IVs / 252 SpD Rayquaza-Mega: 217-256 (52.5 - 61.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

This heals the Chansey back to 58% with the lowest roll

252+ SpA Icicle Plate Rayquaza-Mega Judgment vs. +1 252 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey: 260-308 (36.9 - 43.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

With Max roll, you then leave the Chansey at 15%

The Chansey then outspeeds because of the +1 Speed and finishes the MRay off.

So, if the Chansey pressing Quiver Dance turn 1 makes you auto lose the Improofing, then why not press Taunt?

If you do, and the Chansey just pressed OWing, then you still don't Improof. 252+ SpA Chansey Oblivion Wing vs. 252 HP 30 IVs / 252 SpD Rayquaza-Mega: 145-172 (35.1 - 41.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO With 15% min recovered.

...So...not a improof, like at all, so why is Icicle Plate here? (Yes I know that Mega Diancie can kinda Improof this but it can't switch in forever and because the Diancie lacks any true power into WG it is very easy for the Imposter to just switch out and come back in later.)

Also on that note, that MRay gets walled by like every Steel type under the sun, and gets wrecked by FakeSpeed, and also is STag Food.

Anyway, I will stop dunking on MRay to attack the rest of the team, starting with:

Celesteela: I don't know what the point of the Trick stuff is. Let's take a look on how different teamstyles would deal with this Celesteela, shall we?
HO: Has enough win-cons that one being Tricked a Lagging Tail won't stop them, and Celesteela is not bulky enough to stay around.
Offence: Same as HO, but you might have slightly better luck catching something that really needs a item. Still, they have more then enough offensive threats that one being forced to go last doesn't make them that much worse.
Balance: They are probably going to go into a WG mon, and Tricking a Tail onto a MAud is more or less useless.
Semistall: Probably the best use of this....IF you can catch the one offensive Win-con. If you catch one of the WG mons, then....yeah no.
Stall: They are going last anyway.
So....unless you are fighting Semistall (Which is already not a good teamstyle), Trick Tail is kinda useless.
Also....252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X Photon Geyser vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Celesteela: 185-218 (46.4 - 54.7%) -- 62.9% chance to 2HKO
Not very bulky. Like at all. There is a reason why Zygarde is generally the defensive Magic Bounce Mon, because it can take a beating. Celesteela....kinda can't.

Mega Audino: Standard Mega Audino. I would slot in Double Barreled Shotgun over Aromatherapy, but that is a personal choice.

Mega Slowbro: I just realized that this team has zero hazard removal. Like none. At all. Slowbro needs Defog. Like badly. Or at the very least, something needs Defog. The Slowbro is probably OK, but man does Defog look good right now.

Zygarde Complete: I'm sorry, but you need Haze. I understand the thought process, that Diancie can kill the Dark type set up mons. But....what if, the Mon that is setting up....isn't a dark type? Then....uh....your only option is DBonding them? Trust me, Haze is good. Haze is extremely good. Without Haze, this team has a genuine chance of losing to Evoboost Mold Breaker Gyarados. And no good team should be losing to Evoboost Mold Breaker Gyarados. Otherwise, standard Zygarde (Other then the fact that even with minimum Attack U-Turn still OHKOs Chansey 0 Atk 0 IVs Zygarde-Complete U-turn vs. 252 HP / 0- Def 0 IVs Chansey: 789-929 (112 - 131.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO) Anyway, next up is....sadly....

Mega Diancie: I would like to pretense this with a bit of context. Back in Gen 6 Pure Hackmons, I LOVED Pixalate FakeSpeed Diancie. It was probably my favorite Mon on my old Gen 6 team, and I tried my damn best to make Pixalate Diancie good in Gen 7. But, despite my best efforts, it had one issue that it just could not deal with: It was just too weak. If it isn't hitting super-effectively, then it just doesn't do enough. The reason why I eventually switched to FakeSpeed Regigigas was because I just needed power, and Dianice just could not give me enough. As well, the ability to hit WG Dark types is far less useful then it might have been in the beginning of Gen 7 PH, because Dark type offensive WG mons have become more and more rare. WG Ash Gren has fallen off, WG HoopaU is....existent....maybe? WG MMX is a niche tech Mon that lacks power, WG MGyara are almost always defensive now, and the defensive sets have zero reason to ever stay in. And, of course, WG shuts it down brutally. "But I have Sunsteel! So I can break WG now!" ....If only.
252+ Atk Diancie-Mega Sunsteel Strike vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Audino-Mega: 172-204 (41.9 - 49.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252+ Atk Diancie-Mega Sunsteel Strike vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Meloetta: 119-140 (29.4 - 34.6%) -- 7.9% chance to 3HKO
252+ Atk Diancie-Mega Sunsteel Strike vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Muk-Alola: 133-157 (32.1 - 37.9%) -- 95% chance to 3HKO
252+ Atk Diancie-Mega Sunsteel Strike vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Slowbro-Mega: 36-43 (9.1 - 10.9%) -- possibly the worst move ever
So....I wish that Pixalate Diancie was good in Gen 7, I really do. But, I can't lie to myself. It just isn't strong enough anymore. If you really need a FakeSpeed Mon with actual power....well....do I have the Mon for you.

So. Yeah. That's the critique. It may sound like a personal attack, but I can assure you, it isn't. I'm sure you are a cool person, but this team....not so sure. Anyway, that is all. The fun has been terminated.

(Oh yeah also both offensive mons lose to almost every Steel Type)

Is Double Barreled Shotgun a move or sth

 

[LemonLime78]

Is Double Barreled Shotgun a move or sth

-6 0- Atk Slow Start Shuckle Double Barreled Shotgun vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowbro-Mega: 2550-3000 (647.2 - 761.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Ig I'll put an actual thing too so it's not a complete shitpost

Sweeper Mgar

Gengar-Mega @ Focus Sash
Ability: Parental Bond
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Shell Smash
- Moongeist Beam
- Sludge Wave
- Aura Sphere

Pbond mgar, everyone knows and loves it as a scarf rkiller. But tbh I think it could also work quite well as a lategame sweeper. Admittedly, it does require a lot of slots, with mg being almost necessary to remove hazards and blobs, an improof, and it doesn't mind psyterrain support. However, if it can get going, it easily sweeps through teams. I've been experimenting with it lately and it seems quite decent. I'll prob build more with it at some point. Just some food for thought.

 

[Guysmash]

How To Build Hyper Offense (with packs!)
(Yeah that's exactly what Yourself did for Balance)

If you're not aware, yourself made a post explaining and detailing how to build balance (here : https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/usum-pure-hackmons.3734057/page-13#post-10460287) and because my favorite team style is HO I'll make the same about HO, easy as that.
Small warning : this is not the only correct way to build an HO but imo it’s an efficient structure that I'll show and an easy one to play with despite being new to the meta.

How to build HO :

In order to build HO I recommend choosing a pokémon you'd like building with or any good offensive mon. For the building order I'll show you 2 different teams with for both, steps for building it.
Here are the two teams and how I build them :





(Click the sprites for pastes)

Let’s go for the first mon
In the begging you need any good offensive. Any pokémon works, you'll have to build the rest of your team around. However I decided to start both team with Sweepers/Cleaners because I think they're useful for HOs. I did not use it for my teams but recently what I would call "disruptive cleaners" as seem to emerge. One of the best of them is WG Arceus with only Shell Smash, MGeist and Judgment Fist Plate to hit (which is not a really good coverage without MBreaker) and with Taunt to disrupt the opponent’s team.

For the 1st team I started with a classic set Slaking FakeSpeed.


For the second team I started with a set I'm kinda proud of MGar MBreaker.

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2nd mon
If your 1st mon isn’t particularly fast (under 150 base Spe without Scarf (or under 120 Spe with scarf) you're too slow) (MBee is the fastest mon I don’t consider fast enough because you'll get outspeed (and mostly OHKOd) by DeoA or others) you'll need more speed control. I do not consider FakeSpeed as efficient speed control because it is blocked by one of the best Scarf user : MGar

For the first team I decided to use a counter to MGar (the most used ghost type) : Scarf PBond MMY which outspeeds Scarf MGar and OHKOs Sash MGar. For both MMY coverage and hitting steel types (which resist FakeSpeed) I run Searing Shot on MMY, BBuzz to hit dark types and Ice Beam only for Zygarde let’s be honest.


In the 2nd team I created the GangGar Mega by adding a second one with PBond and Choice Scarf to make it an effective revenge killer with speed control. Earth power hits AMuk and Sludge Bomb is for MAud, finally I'll talk about U-Turn later :P (because it’s more than just a bug coverage)

---

3rd mon
Once you've done this you'll need a powerful breaker, most breakers are Huge Power users because it gives instant power but you can also use Protean MMY which will hit hard on all of its attacks and will be really fast with 142 Spe.

For both teams I decided to go with MMX HP with Photon Geyser or Sunsteel Strike for ModlyMove, Ice Shard for priority, VCreate for steel types and Multi-Attack with memories for coverage and improof.

---

4th mon (or not)
Nowadays innards isn’t used only on HOs anymore, therefore in order not to be totally walled by a Defensive core + innards which your only mon able to make progress dies to innards you need something to pass it. For this step we will only consider classic innards such as blobs or Lunala (meaning not Exca) Either you have AT THE VERY LEAST the half of your team (3) able to kill BOTH Lunala (and Solgaleo, it’s better) and blobs and you sac a mon to innards, or you have a mon dedicated to innards. If you decide to go without mon made to kill innards you may have struggle fighting innards spam like https://pokepast.es/63db99e6371e40aa (THIS TEAM IS NOT BY ME BUT BY AIDAN AMOONGUS)
However with a pokémon dedicated to innards you'll have a hard time if the opponent has no innards (it could basically become a 5v6 depending of what you're using). Most innards counters are Magic Guarders, there are 2 types of MGs :
- Sweepers such as MGar with Secret Sword or MMX (both with Shell Smash mainly)
- Pursuit trapper, mostly Kartana or anything with correct Atk and dark STAB
Another type of innards counter, which is less efficient but can be better than others outside of killing innards is low physical damage (or False Swip if you think you're special). This is why I use U-Turn on Mega Gengar, with a total 155 Atk (Modest with 31 IVs and 28 EVs) the first hit will leave Chansey -Def at 1 HP minimum so MGar will lose minimum HP to innards. This type of innards counter only deals against Chansey because Blissey is too bulky and Lunala takes even less.

In the 1st team I decided to go the classic Kart MG Pursuit Trapper which OHKOs Chansey without switch but neither bliss nor Lunala (you'll need Sunsteel Strike or SpecThief).


Which leads us to the 2nd team where the 2nd mon already takes down chansey (most used innards afaik) and I have 3 other mons that kills Bliss and Lunala effectively (even PBond MGar kills Lunala tho)

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5th mon
Depending on how you're confident with imp MU you can skip this step : if you think you can keep pressure to avoid hazards and improof with sash or if you have mons with selfproof (or if you think you won’t face any Imposter) you won’t need improof.
If it’s not the case welcome in the beautiful land of ️Wonder Guard️ The best thing to do imo is to see what typing covers most of your team (MScizor or AMuk are really useful thanks to 2 MoldyMoves resistances/immunities and only 1 weakness) and give to one of your mon a memory or a plate of a typing that kills them (fire memory on a MMX to kill opposing MSci for example). Why using WG ? Because gl finding a typing which resists almost ALL of your mons coverage while having a decent coverage on said mons.
You can either use an offensive mon (MSci Shell Smash) to keep pressure even if it is gonna be harder to improof multiple times or for a defensive one (AMuk) which lives better but has less pressure.

For the 1st team I decided to use POgre which lives 2 MMY Photon Geyser even with PBond, fully improof MBee, and has great improof on Slak and MMX thanks to Steel resistance (MMX has an electric memory to kill opposing POgre while having a good coverage on MBro, MGyara or Ho-Oh for example).


In the 2nd one I used Scarfty :/ Hey hey !! Before leaving please listen : Scrafty is the BULKIEST mon that resists MGeist, is immune to Photon, is not weak to bug and weak to 0 OHKO move. It has only 3 weaknesses with 2 problematic : Fairy (bad) Fighting (bad) Flying (don’t stand in front of MRay and everything should be fin). And Scrafty as a correct bulk. It improof perfectly MMX and effectively MGar PBond. I use Fairy Memory on MMX to OHKO any Imposter Scrafty and hit dark types (and technically deals more damage than Ice Shard to Zyg and MRay).

---

6th mon (and almost final)
The last one is almost the pillar of an HO. It is Innards Out itself (or herself considering you'll almost have either chans or bliss). As said earlier other mons can be Innards such as MMX/Y or the SM legendary duo. However (outside of spam) you'll always have a blob (paired or not with another innards) in a good HO (I think).
Innards Out allows you to get rid of opposing breakers/sweepers effectively and can sometimes servs as an improof (both by its typing or by its ability). Smashers Innards use Photon, Sunsteel or MGeist depending of the STAB/Not having a STAB and will have at least one coverage move/another STAB and either a utility/disruptive move (Spore, MCoat, Taunt...) or a last coverage move.
For blobs innards you'll want 1 heal move, a way to force the foe out (Whirlwind or PSong) and 2 other moves of your choice.
In both teams I decided to go with Blissey because it has more HP than Chansey which allows to kill Imposter Bliss because not all mons had an effective improof.

---

Here comes the last and final step
As you see the 2nd team as only 5 mons yet, which might be the case of any team built following these steps. If you followed what I said you should have at least 4 mons : a sweeper, a breaker, a speed controller and an Innards (you also could have 3 of them because a Shell Smasher with HP can be both a Sweeper and a breaker depending of its set). Then you just add any role you want : another sweeper/breaker/speed controller/innards, a NGuarder, something to pass a precise threat like MDiancie FakeSpeed to kill dark and dragons...
For the 2nd team I finally decided to run NG Kart sweeper which has a great coverage with Fissure and Power Whip (and Sunsteel). This set beats efficiently Zygod which is not otherwise.


By now you should have 6 mons but the final step is not finished yet, indeed you will need to recheck your mon sets in order to have the most effective coverage and verify all mons go well together.

THIS IS THE END OF THE TUTORIAL
however not the end of this post, I'll explain why some teams can be really good without what I said was needed and there will be the packs !!

---

Here's 2 good teams (according to me at least) that got to #1 (even if it’s not that meaningful now) which do not fulfil all the roles I showed :
by me

by Aidan Amoongus
(Sprites also clickable)
The 1st one has no breaker but with 2 innards and MGar you can slowly kill the offensive opposing pokémons and then slaking can sweep easily (this is why it’s almost unused in HO vs HO match up). To get rid of walls this team doesn’t rely on a breaker but on Slak to slowly make the opponent waste its PPs

The 2nd has no effective way of killing an Innards blob without losing a mon or having enough mons to kill a blob with few consequences, however with 3 innards it can rapidly get rid of opposing team until one of the non-blob can sweep/clean. Even if an important mon dies to innards, the said pokemon's "targets" would die to innards probably.


Finally here we are : the PACKS !

(moves are ordered by viability for each set)
Wallbreakers : https://pokepast.es/695c954167db97e6

Offensive WG which can improof : https://pokepast.es/0c7eec5436897d32

Priorities and Speed Control :
https://pokepast.es/aa70ad1b9811edb7

Defensive WG which can improof :
https://pokepast.es/e47629b3d61df9a4

Magic Guard :
https://pokepast.es/5d9fc6f47175c77a

Sweepers (no innards):
https://pokepast.es/626aa1f25d1080bf

Innards Out :
https://pokepast.es/33b0544c1d336e27

/!\ A remainder, here I only showed types of sets that I told to use in my tutorial, in HO you can also use things like NGuard, STag, MBounce, everything is possible /!\

Thanks a lot to Yourself that gave me the idea of making this post and letting me using and revamping some of their packs.
If you don’t agree with I told here (sets or how to build HO) or if you like to add/change a set just ask me and I'll think about it :)

 

[Slothlotliscool]

Hello I just ,ade a smogon account I would like to show you guys my team! Tell me if it’s good or not and if not how should I improve
https://pokepast.es/09e5246d1a4051b5
Edit- I just realised I gave mgenger 0 spdef lol
( I have made more teams scince and realised how mid this team is lol)